s/fur A notorious problem in any combat game is that accurate

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First for possibly froggos

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Stronk!

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>>724266752
Cute :3

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>>724266752
What do the bats even hang onto?

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I'm going to bed. have a nice furry friday night, guys and gals.

>>724266831
one last dragoness pic for you

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>>724266964
G'nitey

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>>724266298
I always liked how it's handled in counterstrike - the accurate weapons are limited by your movement, and players have tools that let them break lines of sight (smokes and flashes)

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>>724266964
nn bro!

Apparently Tsampikos does oddly-coloured froggos

>>724266963
These balls of steel

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>>724266298
stop making these fucking threads

FURFAGS YIFF IN HELL

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>>724267078
Yep, though CS has had a LOT of problems with aimbots and cheating over the years - I gave up on it eventually

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>>724267192
the ride never ends

>>724267192
Anon, you're becoming infected.

Run away while you still can.

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>>724267078
That's a terrible way of handling it though.
It makes snipers camp even more than they do in reasonable games, doesn't solve the problem at all (especially for aimbotters), and isn't even realistic.

Like, it's not like moving makes your aiming cone widen by several degrees, back when my father was in the army he and the person in command of him would tease the people they were training in sharpshooting by walking along behind them after finishing, while picking off every target still standing.

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Bulbosaur isn't exactly a froggo, but he's an amphibian, right?

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>>724267842

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>>724267660
The sniper role in games is usually that of an area denial tool - they lock down long open areas forcing opponents to flank

if they're able to shoot accurately while moving then there isn't any point in ever playing anything else because they have the best damage, or if they don't have the damage than there is no point in picking them over more mobile/ higher fire rate guns

I still think tf2 and cs have done it best, other games the sniper is either always overpowered or always useless

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>>724268180
hahaha oh wow

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>>724268253
>tfw nerfed AWP

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>>724268875
in cs:go?
I mostly played source and 1.6

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>>724266298
>Have any games ever demonstrated a solution for this other than making it so that long range weaponry isn't hitscan?
In World of Tanks, weapon accuracy is rendered part of strategic thinking.

Less accurate weapons tend to fire faster (at the cost of alpha damage) or have higher alpha damage (at the cost of rate of fire).

As such it gives the player the option to either get closer so as to have more shots hit more often thereby rendering the enemy tanks less combat-effective (since you can disable certain parts of their tank, which in itself is another part of strategy), or simply peekaboo around corners and minimise time exposed to the enemy, poking out only when needed to and doing massive damage in that short amount of time.

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>>724268253
I guess TF2 was better than TF, where maps literally turned into sniper team vs sniper team with one or two brave folks being scouts. I still found it pretty easy to rack up a lot of kills as a sniper, and I'm nothing special as a gamer.

>>724269164
I'm old, and played the original. I know it's still very powerful, but it used to be even more so. I seem to remember in 1.6 you could sometimes survive a hit from it.

>>724268253
I'm not even talking about the sniper role though, I'm talking about accurate weapons in general.

There just doesn't seem to be any way to have a perfectly accurate weapon in a game without making it be underpowered amongst low level players but overpowered amongst high level players and a favourite tool of cheaters too.

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>>724269402
leg hits don't one shot, which is how it should be
if you can't hit center of mass you're a scrub

cool guys used the scout anyway - those jump shots are the best

And reload times in WoT are extremely long compared to FPS games.

I remember in Soldier Front the Cheytac M200 was the slowest but most accurate and powerful weapon in the game, but I still pwned with it since it still fired about once per second so I could slaughter enemy teams very quickly.

In WoT, you usually trade between alpha damage, RoF and accuracy. Reload times can range anywhere between 7 seconds for low-damage weapons to 23 seconds for OMG-guns that take away 40% hp in one shot, leaving plenty of time for people to maneuver into a position to kill you easily even if you hit and do damage in your first shot.

>>724269212
But still, if you had a bunch of tanks with accurate weapons and players who aimed perfectly, victory would be trivial against equally skilled players using inaccurate but more lethal weapons.
Unless there was a sneaky route all the way to the long-range combatants, it would be an automatic win for the snipers.

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>>724269923
Hell yeah man - the scout is solid, and you actually feel like you've done something when you get a scout headshot. Like you say, getting a bodyshot is nothing to be proud of (even more so in TF2).

Dammit, now I feel like playing TF2. Do people even still play TF2?

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>>724269832
if a weapon is perfectly accurate all the time it needs to have low damage
if it's only accurate while standing still or scoped in (which reduces fov by a lot) then a high refire time is usually sufficient to keep it balanced

really though it usually comes down to the utility tools players have - if you can dash and teleport around or make smokescreens and shields than just accuracy is a lot less valuable
map design is also a huge factor

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>>724270359
eh it used to be my favorite game, I haven't touched it in a couple years now though
I think it still has a pretty solid player base

I tried overwatch, but it turned out to just be tf2 where everyone gets a "kill people for free" button every 30 seconds and with no good maps

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>>724270648
Gross. I've not tried it - as soon as I saw it I thought 'that looks like TF2, but without the funny.'

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>>724270122
There is a very simple tactic called "Don't get shot".

The entire rule of thumb of combat in WoT is to put yourself in a position of advantage over the enemy. This usually implies choosing the rules of engagement. Don't engage or be engaged when not in a prime position to do so. Getting the jump on someone, while you yourself are in a very good location, is 80% of the battle.

That, and just because you hit doesn't mean that you do damage, especially at long range, since your shells don't penetrate armor effectively at distance, and thus do zero damage.

A typical battle that might suit your conjecture is this: A medium tank with low armor, high-accuracy and low-damage weapon engaging at long range a heavy tank with high armor, low accuracy and high damage.

The medium, despite having an accurate gun, actually does zero damage to the heavy tank at range due to the heavy's armor protection. However, the medium has low armor and is easily damaged by the heavy tank, even though the heavy has a less accurate gun.

As such, the heavy has de facto chosen the rules of the engagement and forced the medium to come closer (in which case the heavy is more likely to do damage since its target is closer) or fuck off entirely.

Medium tank with accurate gun either loses or is forced to retreat.

Maybe the way to make accurate weapons always balanced is to have them be not too powerful, but include things in the game that make them useful.
Like, if Robocraft made railgun easier to aim with but less powerful, it'd be a perfect example; you can observe and target critical points of your enemy.

Pity Robocraft was made by people who are idiots at balancing.
The damage algorithm was for damage to pass from block to block, which meant that narrow beams would take far more damage from explosions than chunky blocks, thus the best bot design was just a brick; if you had any other parts, they'd just attract a lot of damage.

>>724271302
But then what's the point of highly accurate weapons if they're useless except at ranges where less accurate weapons are better?

Or are accurate weapons extremely niche, and only useful against low-armour targets?

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>>724271302
wot was really fun
I got kinda turned off by the grind and "lol that guy has a tank three tiers above yours enjoy not being able to ever scratch his paint"

I really liked the whole scouting and artillery mechanic, made for some interesting strategy
I thought most of the maps were pretty good too

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>>724271302
>low armour
Not a tank unless you're in a game where a character can dodge like fuck

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>>724271339
I'll be honest, I played a lot of CS, and yes, you respected a team with someone who had an AWP, but well designed maps and smoke grenades, it wasn't that bad. Super important weapon that made people think, but I never felt it unbalanced the game.

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>>724271510
I hope bunnies are super-stretchy, because damn

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>>724271339
>Pity Robocraft was made by people who are idiots at balancing.
Robocraft reached its peak around the time Megabots were introduced.

It has been downhill ever since.

>>724271609
I consider accurate weapons to be niche weapons and effective against low-armor targets, yes - Perhaps only because I have an extremely aggressive playstyle and take pride in my close range combat skill.

However, accurate weapons also allow the player to more accurately shoot certain parts of enemy tanks at range to lower their combat capability. For instance, it's easier to shoot the enemy's tracks to force them to stop moving.

Accurate guns are also good when you're not engaging heavy tanks directly from the front, since the front is usually where the strong armor is. As such, it takes a bit of strategic thinking and maneuvering to get to their side or rear, where they are vulnerable, even at range. However, the heavy only has to turn its hull in order to nullify this, so it's best to do this only when the heavy is already pre-occupied with another target in front of it.

The stats of the gun matter not, but how it is used does.

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>>724271968
Yes

>>724266298
>Dude never beat Xaero on nightmare.
pleb

I think the main problem is figuring out how to prevent aimbotting, and then balance the game from there.
Which means the game would have to be as tamper-proof as possible, totally breaking if the player even attempts to change the data sent by their computer to the server.

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>>724272940
Securing data from an untrusted source is all but impossible.

>>724272940
Easy. 2 steps.
Wrap your game in privately created secure VM.
Kill OS in background.

>>724273366
>Kill OS in background.
What did he mean by this?

>>724266298

In many games, most weapons are balanced around an attribute status of 1. Where they drop in accuracy, their impact or rate of fire goes up.

0.33
0.33
0.33
If accuracy goes up, it takes a fraction from the other two. Guns can exist beyond this balanced variant and guns that start climbing up in 1.05 1.08 are when guns start becoming statistically op.

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>>724266298
you just let low skill players get utterly slaughtered for their ineptitude

>>724273515
kill/suspend the kernel.

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>>724273515
>*OJ

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>>724272940
WoT has aimbot built-in to the game.

Since aiming skill has nothing to do with how much damage you do.

Why? Because guns turn and fire so slowly anyway. Even a retard can aim well in WoT - What matters is how you prepare yourself before and after you fire.

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>>724273633
How would that work? That kernel is running the VM as a set of processes.

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>>724273621
AS THEY SHOULD BE

Seriously though, unless you want some sort of padded foam playground for snowflakes, junior players belong on their own servers.

>>724273319
It can be made nightmarishly difficult though.
Perhaps the compiled game could be run through an algorithm that shuffles machine code in such a way that the code functions exactly the same (like swapping around a=1 and b=2, except the machine code equivalent), so that attempting to convert back to the native language with a decompiling algorithm just spits out nonsense.
Best you would be able to do is convert to assembly.

Then rather than having sensible outgoing data, you have encrypted outgoing data, which the encryption method unknown because you'd have to be a legendary hacker with eternal patience if you wanted to figure out how to encrypt the data such that the server would accept it.

>>724273775
Most modern VM can work "directly" with hardware. For now it's limited and mostly driver supported. Net adapters gpu hd.
Just overimplement this feature to be able to live without parent kernel.

>>724273366
I bet you also think the cloud is magic.

>>724274027
You're talking about obfuscation (and maybe ASLR to a lesser extent). It helps, but it's till not an end-all.

>>724274132
You comment makes zero sense in that context, retype pls.
Stop embarrassing yourself.
It's uncomfortable.

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>>724273956
indeed back when i played shitty MMOs it was always openworld pvp. you die you lose some of your shit.

>>724274447
Whoops, sorry. I meant:
I bet you also think the cloud™ is magic.

>>724274305
Isn't obfuscation usually applied to uncompiled code though?
Which would mean it could still be decompiled to the native language.

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>>724274128
I don't know enough about what you're thinking of to comment properly, but fundamentally the direct integration of VMs to the hardware layer breaks the VM model, which involves the use of a hypervisor to orchestrate multiple VMs talking to a single hardware layer. I'm curious though - more than happy to believe there's new stuff I don't know about - are you thinking of any particular implementation?

>>724274576
It depends. But at some point the code is going to have to be readable for the processor to understand it. A bit contrived, but it's like trying to hide the binary by writing it in hexadecimal.

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>>724274515
Oh god yes, PvP for newbs, poor guys. At least in WoW you had the protection of your home vs contested zones.

>>724274868
>>724274576
Yeah by the time you're at machine code obfuscation is just inefficiency.

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Hey gents.

>>724275341
Hey

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>>724275341
hello~

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>>724275341
howdy

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>>724275341
G'ewening Hotshot

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>>724275073
>dominant Gadget
Oh god my dick

>>724275395
delet this

>>724274554
Nope, still nothing.
What cloud? some technology, a company... maybe real cloud in the sky?

Ok, I get it you just tetard trolled me. Ok, you got me.

>>724274760
>particular implementation
Nah, obviously, it was just an idea.
Cure for cancer(cheating) sort to say.
hypervisor implying creating and providing for multiple VM we just need one. and ONLY one.

>Yiff in Hell
>posts Yiff

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>>724275540
Haha. Cum @ me brah.

>>724275559
THE Cloud man!

>>724275640
uh, woah

>>724274868
That's why I suggest shuffling parts of the machine code where order doesn't matter, like operations acting on two different processor number stores (whatever they're called).
I assume decompilers are written with the expectation that very specific chunks of machine code translate to particular operations, so if that machine code is written so that those operations are not only written differently but blend into each other slightly, there'd be no clear way to decompile.

time for food
see y'all in a thread or two!

</img>

>>724275535
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbg0ycJGAa0

>>724275758
See ya Sunny.

>>724275758
L8r

brb

>>724275559
>hypervisor implying creating and providing for multiple VM we just need one. and ONLY one.
At that point the easiest thing to do is create bootable media for games - saves any further debate.

That said, how does the bootable media know if it's being run on tin or in a VM? The blue pill / red pill thing has been a subject of debate for a while.

>>724275758
nn!

>>724275710
>very specific chunks of machine code translate to particular operations
Well no, at that level there's a one to one mapping of machine code to operation.
0x04ib for instance will always mean Add imm8 to AL in x86.

>>724275766
brb have to go to the bathroom

>>724275691
Yeah, dude. The carpet!
And for a second there I thought that you were capable of some intelligent conversation.
Sorry, my mistake.

>>724275947
Yes, but people won't reboot their machines to run a game.

>>724276170
nuh me no have ascended to yu intellect

>>724276000
But do you really think some chump just looking to cheat can read x86 well enough to look through a huge amount of code, find the potentially very complicated encryption formula, and figure out how it works?

>>724276461
People do it now... So ya.

So, uh... bread?

>>724276170
People reboot consoles to play games all the time - maybe PC players just need to man the fuck up.

(Seriously though, that won't ever work for PCs due to the wide range of variation in hardware.)

>>724276461
Yes

>>724276308
You and apparently your brain died from asphyxia... sad but noble death, at least you tried.

>>724276702

>>724276461
The fun thing is, that won't be done by someone with a burning desire to cheat. It'll be done by someone who wants to prove they've outwitted the developers. THEN it'll be used by the people who care about cheating.