So /b/, what's the point of working? Why waste 1/3 of our

>>723814284
Memes

>>723814284
Jews

>>723814284
Start you're own shit or move to another country that's 3rd world.

because people are scared and won't know what to do with their time. politicians and corporations stop automation and pride themselves on "creating jobs" for no reason other than creating jobs. universal basic income will come some day, in our lives? maybe. depends what country you live in. more progressive countries are already trialling it, but if you live in the a third-world country like america you're shit out of luck. save up some money, quit your job, enjoy your life.

>>723814284
You summed up exactly why I'm an anarcho-syndicalist.

>>723814284

You're a privileged little shit, aren't you?
The very reason you are sitting your little hedonistic minded ass posting on a cancerous image board is because of your parents work, and theirs before you in this system. I'm not saying the capitalist system is great, it fucking sucks in fact and is destructive to our environment, but to progress as a species we set tasks and systems for ourselves to keep us up and running. Living a life of short term happiness and fast gratification is not fulfilling. Which is personally why I think our cultures in advanced societies are growing pretty cancerous, we're at an age where pleasures have never been simpler or faster.

>>723814284
Idk anon

Im a neuroscientist and my work might be able to cure yall of your degeneracy, I know im doing gods work regardless of financial gains

>>723814834

Ah, yes. What a privilege! To be born in a world of wealth, and be told that someone else deserves it more than you because of their last name. What a privilege indeed, to be born in a country where autonomy is outlawed.

We need a strong worker's movement to balance the scales a bit. Manufacturing's gone overseas; the best way to make money is playing the financial sector. This doesn't contribute to the society as a whole.

I am of the school of thought that excessive wealth is theft from the workers who funneled it into their hands. I am not opposed to work. I want a better society, and I want to contribute.

People will make arguments like "Well it sure was a lot tougher before, wasn't it!" - Yeah. It was. And then we worked to make it better, and in the meantime, some how most of our nation's money went into a few select pockets.

"Well, you could be born in Africa!" - AKA the "My neighbor shot his dog for no reason, beating mine isn't that bad."-argument

>>723815291
>>723816003
replied to the wrong post

If you are not capable of sustaining yourself in a system, aka your "natural" workfree system, then you will be fuck dead in days.

Jobs have a purpose, and people do their things with a purpose. And that some cannot enjoy themselves either A, you dont care about the company either as they dont care about you.
or B. you are nowhere where your intended skill could be needed where you would enjoy.

or grow some potatoes for like 3/4 of your life instead and have even more minimal time to enjoy yourself.

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>>723815291
You're assuming I'm hedonistic-minded. And privileged. Well, I'm not. I believe in working hard to earn for yourself. And I understand that there's an ancestry tree that has provided for me. But this is more philosophical. There are no rules or laws that I have to follow in life. It's all bullshit that society made up a long time ago. All I'm saying is that working a career for the rest of your life seems a waste like of time if you only have one life to live. And I'm willing to bet that most people when old regret not spending more time with family and friends and wishing they could have done more of what they wanted to do...

>>723816227
The goal is to balance that out. Time and money, can get you far into a better life if controlled correctly.
And obviously, the other issue is being able to grow economically in all ways possible.
Hurts, Yes. But the rewards in long term are more satisfactory.

>>723816430
how the fuck do you even get a good job when nobody will hire you? how the fuck am i supposed to make money when i keep getting rejected? im very willing to work hard and make money but nobody will give me a chnce.. fuckin bullshit dude

>>723816227

I'm with you op, I've always felt this way.

Why do celebs/youtubers etc... get easy wealth and good lives yet the common man has to work twice as hard for much much less. I'd rather not work and spend time with family. Which celebs/youtubers etc... can do whenever - whereas we have a work scheduled to abide to. Yeah I could go out there and try make something out of myself but lets be honest... You're either going to be born into fame or born meant for fame... Very rare occasions I'll look at a celebrity and feel they have worked for their stardom. Most just got lucky - and the majority of people in the world are not that lucky.

And whoever replied saying 'privilaged blah blah blah' man shut the fuck up... I never asked to be on this earth. If I had a choice to not live on earth or live on earth which consisted of working the majority of it... I'd rather not... What do I benefit from it? Nothing. I feel if they put me on this earth I have the right and PRIVILEGE to have my own house from the get go. Why should I earn to have a house which will keep me alive? It's like someones just said "here you go, now work until you have a house and then you will be old but you will have survived"... It's stupid.

They should have given me a house when I was born. I live and grow up in it and get to enjoy nature...

>>723816759
Ugh ain't this the truth. I've applied to over 50 jobs online this year and have only gotten 4 responses, all rejections. I fucking hate online job applications. HATE IT. They all tell you to apply online. Getting tired of tailoring my resume the right way. And this was my New Year's resolution... still hasn't been answered yet.

>>723816798
Why are you worried about celebrities? They're only millionaires. The wealth isn't sitting with them. It's the people who inherit massive corporations or things of that nature.

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>>723816798
Glad to see I'm not alone. I agree with everything you just said. Like seriously, it's so stupid. And to all the people trying to explain how the system works... I fucking get it. I understand how it works. Screw the "privilege" shit. I didn't choose to be born into this world either, but at least I have my own consciousness and think for myself. I could even go as far as to ask about the meaning of life. What is it? Why the fuck are we here, and why do I have to be a part of this system? It really is so stupid.

>>723816759
Fucking this, literally. What's the point in trying anymore?

>>723816916
i feel ya. yea i hate goin to interviews because they just seem so fake and its like i have to act a certain way. fuck that shit. and fuck online job apps too... i heard they use computers to weed out the apps instead of actual people, what the actual fuck?

>>723817281
Them too, anyone that earns more than they need

>>723817435
>>723816798
you're both retarded and must only be 12 years old, without civilization you would be hunting, gathering, chopping wood, cleaning livestock stalls, butchering and skinning animals, building shelter, oh and that's gonna be a lot more work every single day than your 8 hours a day with weekends off to dick around on your computer, holy shit this generation is spoiled as fuck, 8 hours a day with every evening and weekend to fuck around is an amazing trade, you ungrateful idiots don't even know what you have, plenty of time for family, get off the computer.

>>723816759
>>723816916
>>723817639
Do you even know why were you rejected?

that is always a good start, also just a 'job' doesnt do enough, both knowing or investigating the company, place, studio, enterprise, etc

You dont just "work" for someone, you incorporate to their work life and it is a pretty big deal always

>>723817639
yea everyone tells me to keep trying and to try harder... I AM AND IT ISNT WORKING. and how am i supposed to get the specific experience when i don't have any? all jobs these days require some kind of experience, i have past job experience you idiots and they are on my fucking resume!

>>723818026
I'd rather do that tbh more family time cunt.

Also we aint ungrateful - how can we be when we never asked for this...If we had the choice and chose yes then yeah we'd be ungrateful but they've put us on here to be a cog in the machine of life

Bitch dont reply to me again unless you have a worthy argument because I'm not spending time replying to delinquents like you. You better make the reply good enough cos I feel so strongly against this that I'll always win the argument GUARANTEED. It's all I think about - I have a answer to all you lined up replies. so take your best one bitch and see me shoot you down.

>>723818026
op said he understands how the system works anon. i think we get this. i think he just wants to know why it has to be this way if we are only on this planet for a very short time. and i feel the same way. its called deep thinking. so shut up with your condescending "spoiled as fuck" bullshit

>>723818067
No, they don't even tell me even why they rejected me. I've been told I could have been "overqualified" for the jobs I've applied to, or since I'm a student they think I'm eventually going to quit it or move on.

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>>723814284
>Work one more month and save every penny
>Join me and 2 friends on buying school bus
>rip seats out and replace them with couches and cots
>Spray paint it psychodelic colors
>Blast hippie music while traveling into oblivion

This could be your life if you join me and my blood brothers on this journey called life

I work for myself at a cooperatively owned vegan cafe :^)

I'm kinda drunk, so bear with me if I'm not entirely clear at some parts.
Being rich takes two kinds of work: smart work and hard work. Let's assume contributing to society is good, since it helps to benefit you as well as others. (So no anarchy counterarguments.)
The goal is to get passive income, like renting out a house, owning a business that a manager runs in your stead, etc.But if you don't inherit any of those, then you have to start out by contributing to your society in such a way that benefits you as well. I.E. being a company's bitch in exchange for some money. We've most all been there. I'm there right now.
This produces social altruism. I can't get ahead in life without working at Starbucks and making your coffee any way you want it. Once I've done that for a good few years and saved up money (instead of being wasteful with it), then I can put that money towards doing more for the community and making more money in the process. This is how you start a business: hard work to get there, smart work to start and maintain a business.
From there, you spend sleepless nights managing a business and cry every night when things go wrong, always going into the office the next day with a smile on your face. (You learn to do that from working a minimum-wage job.) You make your business work, and hire a manager once you've started making money.
Continue until you're making money from multiple different outlets, then retire and live the good life full-time. This is the old American dream, and if we would be more patient and accepting of the fact that we have to be employed on corporate's terms (for a good part of our lives, anyway) then America would still be great in the first place.
P.S. I'm young' I'm about to turn 21. Work in fast food, it builds character.

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>>723814284
Communist detected

>>723818026
Before agriculture, our ancestors actually spent less time doing anything resembling work. But it was worth the stability.

>>723818687
same here. no response after almost 2 months. give me at least a rejection and tell me why i wasn't selected!

>>723814284
buy Dash coin now for 28 USD, wait till they are 5k to 10k a piece, sell ;) good luck OP

>>723818486

>Also we aint ungrateful - how can we be when we never asked for this...If we had the choice and chose yes then yeah we'd be ungrateful but they've put us on here to be a cog in the machine of life

Well, kill yourself then.

I share the same views as you but for entirely different reasons, by the way. You don't have a logically sound argument at all other than "I never asked for this". That's not a problem inherent in the system, that's you having a shitty life philosophy. Do you even have any work ethic?

You're just a fucking idiot who wants handouts, and this is coming from a socialist.

That's why I try to do as little as possible at work.
I've been there 15 years and after watching certain ethnic people do absolutely nothing I figured I was good to slack off for the next decade.

I still do quality work, I just don't kill myself to get it done.

The funny thing is. Nobody noticed.

That brings me to my second problem. Idiots in management.

The company I work for keeps hiring these idiots for management positions and then when they realize how stupid they are the transfer them to other areas.

>>723818872
>Let's assume contributing to society is good, since it helps to benefit you as well as others. (So no anarchy counterarguments.)

...? Anarchism is believing that the state needs to be abolished, for whatever reason. Are you implying all anarchists have no interest in helping benefit society?

>>723819319
>certain ethnic people do absolutely nothing

you mean poor people? don't think it has much to do with race

>>723819133
I would but there are people I have been born into I'd selfishly hurt. Which I didn't ask for.

That's not just my argument believe me, I just have trouble getting my point across but I'd still have answers for your questions.

Life is shitty, and no I care not to work.

No hand outs, just enough to live - which I was on earth to do.

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>>723814284
I am doing whatever the hell I want and it is working out quite well.

Also if you think you go to work for others, then you have never learned to work for yourself.
You hold a very weak and dependant attitude towards human life.

Do I agree with the system and what it does to people?
Fuck no. Burn it down rather today than tomorrow.
But you can't do that, it's not yours and out of reach for your considerable weak power in life.

Still there are ways to get by without having to sit around with the mindset you are entertaining right now.

You dream big time. Not a bad thing if it itself also has a limit according to your own capabilities.
That is the fault with that kind of people.
They dream too big, bigger than they are.
They never get active because of themselfes, but because they think/feel they have to because of other people.
Are you dead inside?
You should ask yourself tbh.

>>723819381
Not necessarily, but some anarchists take an "every man, woman and child for him/herself" approach. Besides that, I can't think of a school of thought that supports building the individual at the expense of society/the state. But I'm drunk, so I might have overlooked some. Apologies for any offense.

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>>723819008
I'm not a fucking commie. I'm just an introvert and question everything in life.

>>723819133
Don't assume he wants handouts. What does it matter if you have work ethic or not? Companies really aren't going to know that from your application and resume. Getting and holding a job is what does matter. You could have a good job because you "got it from someone you know" rather than being the guy who didn't get the job but has more experience and would overall be better for the job. It really is unfair sometimes.

If nobody does anything how will anything get done?

The most unfair game in this world is called Life.

Differently from all other games, you don't start it at the same level as others.

>>723819745
machines - seems to be going that way. Also theres always cooperate shills that do work

not to mention those sucessful ones will have to do it rather than sit on their ass in the board room

>>723819008
America is communism you stupid fucking goyim kys

>>723819745
back in the day, technology advancing brought us to how we are today. but today, technology advancing is leading towards less human intervention... which i believe is bad. actually very bad. if nobody did anything right now, it wouldn't be nearly as bad as people not doing anything 100 years ago. things will get done by machines, just like that other anon said

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>>723814284
because nothing in life is free. someone has to put time in their life towards making, shipping, creating all the things that you enjoy. someone made the servers that host this site, someone maintains those servers, someone put your computer together, someone made all the parts that make up your computer, and even made the parts of parts. someone drew that frame of pikachu, someone edited it into a whole episode, someone broadcasted it, and all of those took resources and/or man hours. if everyone quit their job and no one did any work the world would instantly go to shit

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>>723814284
Read Flow by Mihaly Chiksentmihaliy.
He states that were happier at work than on vacations or during free time.

It's totally free and you won't need a credit card if it is your first time accepting an Audible book from a friend.

Get it here: http://a.co/8ibQaFb

After you accept the book, you will be prompted to download the Audible app to start listening.

Enjoy!

Another question arises.
if you dont want to deal with jobs/work and just give zero fucks about it. What are you gonna do?

live at the expense of others? live at barely minimum living condition depending your country/region? or worse?

>>723819582
That's the stupid anarcho-capitalism crap. Look into Noam Chomsky and his theories on anarchy and syndicalism. I'm an anarchist at heart, socialist in practice.

>>723819701
>What does it matter if you have work ethic or not?

It matters because you don't just get paid to exist. You used to have to build a house, farm the land, and contribute to your community if possible.


>Companies really aren't going to know that from your application and resume. Getting and holding a job is what does matter.

Are you implying most jobs don't require work ethic..? Because without work ethic, you don't fucking hold a job.

>You could have a good job because you "got it from someone you know" rather than being the guy who didn't get the job but has more experience and would overall be better for the job. It really is unfair sometimes.

yeah, I agree with that at least.

>>723820227
fuck off with your book bullshit you fuckin cunt i am happier when im not at work

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Because the system is set up to operate this way. They key is to realize your goals and use the system to reach them. Think of work and money as one of the many tools in this near limitless life.

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>>723820172
I'm scared of that too. If people laze about all day because society doesn't *need* them, then a good number of them will basically have an existential crisis. (At least, that's how it's gone with me so far.) People need a purpose to life, they need something to fight against, a goal to go towards. That's why a lot of millennials subscribe to SJW bullshit; there's no problem in life for them except for their feelings.
I'm really scared of what will happen when/if most of society's bitch work can be done by machinery and robots. I've got no clue what people will find faith in and what their "ultimate enemy" to fight against will be, but it's scary.

>>723814284
Oh, are you beginning to realize that you're a slave?

>>723820328
I hope you're young. Also I hope you're this guy:

>>723819480
I would but there are people I have been born into I'd selfishly hurt. Which I didn't ask for.

Well, you don't want to contribute to society as a whole. You want to sponge off it. You're happier when you're not working? You're broken. You're supposed to want to do something fulfilling. Besides, they selfishly created you. You're living a selfish life thus far anyways, why not just fuckin' let it all go?

>Life is shitty, and no I care not to work. No hand outs, just enough to live - which I was on earth to do.

..You have to work for that. You have to work for shelter, food, water, etc. Do you think bears just pull food and shelter out of their ass?

>>723820609
>>723820328
I hope you're young. Also I hope you're this guy:

>>723819480
>I would but there are people I have been born into I'd selfishly hurt. Which I didn't ask for.

Well, you don't want to contribute to society as a whole. You want to sponge off it. You're happier when you're not working? You're broken. You're supposed to want to do something fulfilling. Besides, they selfishly created you. You're living a selfish life thus far anyways, why not just fuckin' let it all go?

>Life is shitty, and no I care not to work. No hand outs, just enough to live - which I was on earth to do.

..You have to work for that. You have to work for shelter, food, water, etc. Do you think bears just pull food and shelter out of their ass?

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>>723820609
>>723820669
sorry for shitting up the thread, my phone went wonky on me

>>723814681

> third world country like America

you have absolutely no idea how lucky you are to live in America you ignorant fuck

before capitalism and modern society, people spend a lot of time hunting, making shittiy houses with shitty resources, making his own clothes with animal skins, etc. and the life quality in general really sucks
what is better? work, earn money and go back in your home and enjoy the free time, or go back to the primal age?

>>723820609
>you're supposed to want to do something fulfilling

Um, no, I'm not. I'm supposed to? Who says I'm "supposed" to do something fulfilling? My parents? Nature? You? God?

>>723820609

No shit, I know this but why?

Why have they put me on earth to work for things to keep me alive and pretty much nothing else.

Given the choice before I was born I'd have rather of not been born.

These things should be a God given right. Then if people choose to do something with their life then so be it, but if people choose not to they should be able to get away with not having to work but still live and not be condemned for it.

Believe me I aint looking for handouts in a sense of how handouts are given now. I feel everyone should get a basic handout - even those that work. They choose to earn more - fair enough. Those that don't wont. Im wanting to be the one that doesnt so I can spend time with family.

>>723820328
WHY the fuck you are NOT happy at work? what set of goals do you have that work, is like a disease for you?

maybe the work isnt the problem, maybe your retarded decisions.

>>723820461
its going to be a each other. people are so quick to hate now days, and its partly because of this

>>723820461
The way I see it, society will always have room for improvement. Right now we're focusing on basics like giving people food and shelter. Given the progression of technology, we should eventually be able to focus on fulfillment. Until we're there though, it will seem like a far away and abstract concept. However, In the midst of such a world, we can begin to explore our natures better, and so frame a society that better meets our needs. Considering how varied we all are in such needs, I think society will still require a lot of work if it's going to improve.

you wanna feel shitty? The Garbage collector is more important than many of us pricks in this board.
A System that takes the garbage and shit away from us, controlled by the government, OH ALSO THE DRAIN system helping to keep water sent to us and and drain to be kept away.

if you dont like the system nor can incorporate to it, you are just failing at it.

>>723820855
>implying there's not options other than capitalism

capitalism works great for building nations, but not maintaining them. the capitalists get more of the money, which is ok with the workers until the workers stagnate while the capitalists keep growing. then the workers get pissed, and next thing you know we've voted for trump and don't know what we're actually mad at

I give it ~8 years before the word socialism comes up in american politics without a pejorative context

>>723814284
work turns me into more of a solitary hideaway than i already am. After work i have no energy for anything i turn down most opportunities with friends because im too busy catching up with sleep the sleep or solitary time i missed out on at work

>>723820936
>decisions
Is it a decision to grow up in a low income family and in a bad public school system? Is it a decision to have autism, and so never make the connections you need to move up in the world? How about to simply never encounter someone who cares?

We have a lot of choices in a lot of the world, but that doesn't make everything a choice. In other words, you can't always blame people for the condition of their lives. To do so is ignorance.

If I could go work I'd be down for anything work, Fucked up my life within the course of a year not doing it and almost an herod you pretty much have to do it

>>723821258
If the choice is not available for one individual, is it fault of the system? or just your mere luck based on choices of people before you (aka family).

obviously there are exceptions of people pushing out of low income and poverty but is gambling your luck is only option, why not take it?

>>723821407
I think we'd be better served to approach the issue from a different angle. Instead of looking for a person or a system to blame, or trying to rely on pure chance (the same thing that eliminates choices for many)...
Why not strive to improve the system in a way that minimizes these issues?

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Damn, this thread blew up.

Guys, again, I understand how this works. We have to work in order to make money and survive. I totally get this. I guess what I'm asking is, "Why?" Why do we have to do make money to survive? Why does it have to be this way? We really devote a lot of our time towards doing something we "have to do" to survive, instead of doing what we "want to do." This can all go back to questioning our existence, which is the true question I am always thinking about. I am grateful to my parents for creating me and God for creating all of us (if he exists) for being able to have my own consciousness and think about this stuff.

>>723820915
Nature. Do you know how reward centres in the brain work?

>>723820923
I agree, but I think every able-bodied citizen should be trying to find work, because taking without giving is degenerate. You don't have to work; you can be homeless, forage for food, and just have a life of subsistence. You want luxuries, though. The roof, the bed, the computer. You don't get those unless you're contributing, or unable to contribute due to circumstance.

>>723821045
>if you dont like the system nor can incorporate to it, you are just failing at it.

I make 50k a year for myself, and like 250-300k a year for my company. Fuck off with that rhetoric. The company doesn't deserve that much of my value just because they happen to have money over my head.

Fuck god

>>723821564

I am exactly like you, it intrigues me... what makes you happy?

I'll compare mine with yours upon reply.

>>723821564
You don't have to do any of this. Abandon society and go live out in the woods. Go back to human nature's roots. We work because this life is better than that, even if we are being exploited by the powerful.

It's illegal, but you won't get caught. Just go fucking do it.

>>723821551
The system might be as stupid as everybody else nearby, making the 'system' better can work if everybody can cooperate, But that is not the case.

we could make and uproar an amazing system, but you lie down at the mercy of people.

Even if we design a good and better system, new people will complain and try to override it.
Somebody will want less, somebody want more, and might not accomodate to everybody.

>>723821564
because if everyone just did what they wanted there'd be no reason to work and nothing would get done

we agreed that the system of capitalism was a good way to incentivize people to work for society in order to get what they want, instead of forcing people to do what we think they should

>>723821622
>taking without giving is degenerate
I'd argue that people, by their very nature, want to contribute to something greater than themselves. The issue arises when, for people like OP, jobs contribute to something one has no interest or respect for. How can allowing such people to give in a way that fulfills them be a bad thing?

>>723821622
well what if we want to contribute but are not given the opportunity to? is it really this fucked up where someone desperately wants to work and earn money but just doesn't get hired or doesn't get this opportunity? is it overpopulation? too many people for the amount of open jobs?

>>723821622

How do I have those luxuries without doing the work :(

>>723821564
>Guys, again, I understand how this works. We have to work in order to make money and survive. I totally get this.
Clearly you don't.
>I guess what I'm asking is, "Why?" Why do we have to do make money to survive?
Stop paying rent and try living off the land by catching squirrels in the park.. Tell me how you fare.
>Why does it have to be this way?
Because we went into agriculture and had some industrial progress over time.. After that shit just escalated.
>We really devote a lot of our time towards doing something we "have to do" to survive,
Yeah. You seem to think that this wasn't always the case, but I have it on good authority that there was a time when people literally spent 99,9% of their time trying to survive. The .1% is really just an anomaly in the math used, otherwise it'd be 100%.
>instead of doing what we "want to do."
There are roughly 6 to 7 billion people in this world, and loads and loads of them have never did 'what they wanted to do' for extended periods of time..
>This can all go back to questioning our existence, which is the true question I am always thinking about.
Ah, you're an American.. Should have said so from the start.
>I am grateful to my parents for creating me and God for creating all of us (if he exists) for being able to have my own consciousness and think about this stuff.

You're literally 13, or have a mind like a 13 year old.. The only heartfelt advice I can give you is leave this place, go outside, smell some flowers and if you can manage, smell some pussy.

>>723821853
Location
Current Needs
Titles being given
Natural resources.

OverPopulation isnt enough, but the amount of things needed and how many people can provide.

>>723821825
What your describing isn't a problem to me, it's the essence of progress. Yes, things will change over time - they should. That which stagnates perishes. Sure, changes aren't always good, but they're better than giving up.

>>723821853
Definitely. Overpopulation has a lot to do with it.

>>723817435
>>>723818486
You did choose to come here, you just don't remember

>>723821853
>is it really this fucked up where someone desperately wants to work and earn money but just doesn't get hired or doesn't get this opportunity?

You need skills people actually need to be succesful on the labormarket. 'Wanting to work' is not a valuable commodity or skill.

>>723822105
Where did we choose this?

>>723821985
(quoted person)
I agree, change is not bad, just, changes shit left and right and we acomodate, or else.

from agriculture to industrialization isnt much different, sucks both for some, maybe not for others. But will chance if you want it or not. To take it like a dick down one's throat the most pleasant possible way.

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>>723822180

If you're old enough to tie your shoes, you're old enough to tie a noose.. Life becomes a choice somewhere around that phase in human life.

>>723821827
Yeah, and that's a problem inherent in the system. A good example is volunteer work; I moderate some discords, twitch chat, do food bank stuff and other shit just because I want to contribute somehow. I'm not getting paid for it, but I am contributing to society.

The question shouldn't be "Why do we work?", it should be "Why is the system broken?"

>>723821853
The problem is that we're more concerned with producing things than we are improving things. There's more money to be made by the powerful when they produce things, so those are the most common jobs. We've got more homes than people in a lot of place, but that's a good thing apparently.

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>>723821853
Society is, by definition, a social construct. So just get good at social skills. Forget reading, writing, and 'rithmetic; learn to make people smile, to make them see you're eager to contribute to society.
As Dale Carnegie famously said: "Be hearty in your approbation, and lavish in your praise."
The point is to contribute to several individuals within your society, right? Once you can make people like you, you can ace basically any job interview. The rest, with sincere effort, is easy. Practice makes perfect.

>>723821943
I believe OP is referring to work as in working for someone else, not work in general. Yes, obviously we must do SOME sort of work to survive. Whether it be working for a company or maintaining a farm. We don't HAVE to work for someone or a company to survive. It's just easier

How did humanity survive for thousands of years before working for Wal-Mart or Exxon? They took care of themselves. God (or nature, whatever floats your boat) provides everything. We just have to make it work for us.

>>723822364
>They took care of themselves

so are you collectivist or individualist?

>>723820227
>insertingjewnose.jpg

>>723822298
Resources and Money to help improving things do not come out of nowhere.
Just because one engineer can help develop towards a future doesnt mean Jim on the other side of the office REALLY needs to feed his family.

>>723822192
Chance will never be eliminated. Instead, it might be better to focus on reducing the negative effects of chance. Let's take a specific case as an example:
>I'm born with autism
>People don't like me, but I can contribute in some way
>I'm thus appointed a middle man who takes care of the social aspects of my contributions

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>>723821759
I'm still trying to figure out what makes me happy. I think it's my family and the people that are closest to me. My grandpa especially... I don't know what I'd do without him in my life. If I ever have children, they will mean the world to me. But as far as working, making money, buying shit, materialistic things... I could care less about all that stuff. My TV, Xbox, clothes... that stuff is just going to sit there after I die with no true intrinsic value.

>>723821943
I clearly do understand. I think you're just skimming the surface though. I'm trying to dig deeper, way deeper, than what you're stating. I know these "facts" that you're bringing up, but I'm not concerned about them. I 've realized that I don't think you, nor anyone else on this thread, can answer the ultimate question of "Why."

Just wait till robots take over all the manual jobs. Most people will have no form of income and economy will have to reinvent itself.

>>723822451
I meant "themselves" in general. Whether it was a single family or a collective.

>>723814284
Underage detected.
Maybe work for a company whose main product isn't fried food. There are plenty of enjoyable careers, you are just a beta fucktard who can't do better for yourself.

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>>723822307

>> you can ace basically any job interview

To be a bartender, perhaps. Out in the real world, any job that pays more than minimum wage will have a very specific set of skills that the HR people need to have quantifiable evidence of you having or demonstrating. It's a box ticking exercise. It protects the person who hired you in case you turn out to royally suck at the job.

>>723822460
I agree. This is why I am a proponent of syndicalism.

>>723818659
Clearly he doesn't, or he'd understand that money is a transferable promise*. When you work you help someone. They give money (which they got from helping someone else) to you, so that you can use it to persuade people that otherwise would not help you to help you.


* or a transferable thankyou if it makes you feel fuzzier.

>>723822690
They already have. And it's just going to get worse.

>>723822629
You just want to know why we're stuck in this system? One part chance, one part human nature.
The same principles will eventually lead to a new system.

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>>723814284
Read "Walden" by Thoreau

>>723822816
we get this anon... we get this... you're missing the point of this whole thread, and i see what op means

>>723822816
And what promise are banks making when they generate money from debt?

You are a Fisher man.
You have a sick daughter now.
You Cannot help because being a Doctor is hard.
There is a Doctor that cannot fish for food because Fishing is hard for him.
You Fish for the Doctor.
Doctor cures your daughter.
Daughter is alive.
Doctor is feed.

Cannot be more simple

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>>723822740
Lol, nice pic. Box ticking comes later in life after getting experience/education, and goes back to demonstrating skills necessary to contribute to society. I'm assuming OP is starting a bit earlier.
>>723822629
Does your grandpa have any health issues? You could always be a doctor, or even better - a researcher, finding cures for the doctors to implement.
Hell, my grandpa meant the world to me (rest his soul), and he sold houses a lot. That's why I'm saving up for a real estate license; to continue his work. There's only one of your grandpa, but you can help a lot of people like him (and prolong the happiness felt by people like you who have said similar grandpa's).

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>not living the neet life

>>723823059
I am a sick business man.
I bet that the fisherman will do poorly.
I'm right, and I make money off of it.
Cannot be more simple. Also his daughter dies.

>>723822364
>I believe OP is referring to work as in working for someone else, not work in general.
He's talking about aquiring money as a means to sustain your life, and the things you 'want to do'.. Seems to me that the question of who you work for is irrelevant in that sense. He's wondering about 'why do we endeavour to sustain ourselves', or so it seems.
>Yes, obviously we must do SOME sort of work to survive.
We don't actually.. It works out like that for most people, but it's not a general rule. There are plenty of Saudis, or western trustfund kids for that matter, that quick literally have to do fuck all to survive.
>Whether it be working for a company or maintaining a farm. We don't HAVE to work for someone or a company to survive. It's just easier
Easier than what?

>How did humanity survive for thousands of years before working for Wal-Mart or Exxon?
Did you never read a fucking book? They did so by working for the East India Company or Coca Cola.. Before that, they'd work for the local farmer or blacksmith. A little time before that, they worked as serfs for the land owners that more-or-less owned them as well. Remember that before mechanised agriculture the vast majority of people worked in, or to support fishery, agriculture and the resulting food production. Black smiths, millers, butchers, bakers, fishmongers, coopers etc etc etc etc etc.
>
They took care of themselves. God (or nature, whatever floats your boat) provides everything. We just have to make it work for us.

Is this what they teach kids in school these days? That people 'took care of themselves' in the 'good old days?'... People have always been taking care of people in groups. Smaller groups like families or tribes, or larger groups like communes, villages, towns, cities, nations. The nation state isn't that old of a concept if you look at the whole of human history, but COMMUNITY is the red line that runs through it.. (cont.)

>>723823163
your economic play is way off charts... floor.

>>723821564
Because you know how you're feeling about working to keep you alive?

Double that, and you've got how I'm feeling right now about me working to keep me alive and you alive, whilst you're sitting around not working and doing jack shit.

>>723814284
>what's the point of working?

You already know: It benefits a company. You are like a slave. If you want to be free, be free.
Look at this channel, it's a guy who lives on his property and grows his own food and shit.

https://www.youtube.com/channel/UChBsOxskMpDmBAsgJ91fKcg

>>723823256
Not necessarily. It could be that I knew there were bad fishing conditions headed our way because of a tropical storm, and I knew the fisherman already spent all his capital on his daughter. I sell my previous investment in his business to save my money. Or whatever shitty story you want to come up with - regardless, the point stands.

>>723822364
>>72382317

Concluding and adressing the final point:
>They took care of themselves. God (or nature, whatever floats your boat) provides everything. We just have to make it work for us.

Nature provided us with an extremely harsh piece of rock in space.. It was the human sense of community and creativity that, at long long last, after thousands of years, created the culture in which Westerners live today... Agriculture was a huge step in human history, but it was made thousands of years ago.. However, by FAR the biggest innovations in agriculture like mechanisation, synthetic fertilisers, genetic modification etc etc etc have all taken place in the last 100 years or so. It wasn't until these last 100 years that people like OP even had the time to wonder about these things.. Before that, all people generally worried about was food (commoners) or power (nobility and the like), and the answer to these worries has always been some kind of cooperation or community. Again: Tribes, countries or even your workplace.. They're all the product of basic human instinct and behavior.

>>723823513
That ->
>>723823179

>>723823033
They don't "generate money".

They lend you their money, and charge you a fee for doing so. Clearly you find the fee acceptable, or you wouldn't take the deal.

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holy fuck ignore this thread and check out Snapchat (z) .com as soon as you can lol

>>723823581
Who says there is a deal? You should really read up on our central banking system.

>>723814284
If everyone just did whatever they wanted there would be nobdoy maintenancing things like electricity, and not enough people producing food. etc.
We work to make the society we live in possible, which is fine by me, since I quite like having electricity and internet, etc.

>>723823705
Yeah, no, you should.

If you think "fractional reserve" means that money appears out of thin air, you simply don't understand what you're talking about.

>>723823452
Well then, if the natural conditions says "Fuck this fisherman" then what to do? Give him free money while his work industry reduces?

you cant just do that because might as well lets keep hiring people that work in aged dead industries.

>>723818486
What the fuck did you just fucking say about me, you little bitch? I’ll have you know I graduated top of my class in the Navy Seals, and I’ve been involved in numerous secret raids on Al-Quaeda, and I have over 300 confirmed kills. I am trained in gorilla warfare and I’m the top sniper in the entire US armed forces. You are nothing to me but just another target. I will wipe you the fuck out with precision the likes of which has never been seen before on this Earth, mark my fucking words. You think you can get away with saying that shit to me over the Internet? Think again, fucker. As we speak I am contacting my secret network of spies across the USA and your IP is being traced right now so you better prepare for the storm, maggot. The storm that wipes out the pathetic little thing you call your life. You’re fucking dead, kid. I can be anywhere, anytime, and I can kill you in over seven hundred ways, and that’s just with my bare hands. Not only am I extensively trained in unarmed combat, but I have access to the entire arsenal of the United States Marine Corps and I will use it to its full extent to wipe your miserable ass off the face of the continent, you little shit. If only you could have known what unholy retribution your little “clever” comment was about to bring down upon you, maybe you would have held your fucking tongue. But you couldn’t, you didn’t, and now you’re paying the price, you goddamn idiot. I will shit fury all over you and you will drown in it. You’re fucking dead, kiddo.

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>>723823448
Fuck, I second this. You could always do subsistence farming if the corporate/community scene isn't for you. Probably the purest form of "produce -> survive" that I can thing of.
Hell, grow a surplus and sell it to the community to buy yourself something nice.] if you want

>>723823448
You realize that guy probably works more every week than most people with a normal job, right?

>>723823897
IF the OP wories of not having enough time to be alive and his family.
Living of land and natural resources of his own will surely kill him like 80% of his life.

>>723823882
That's not the point. Pretending the financial system is a simple exchange of resources is.

>>723823905
here ->
>>723823905

>>723823705
>Who says there is a deal?
The person or entity borrowing, when they borrow money.
>You should really read up on our central banking system.

You probably read it and only half understood.. Yes, in a way every loan generated money in a 'have your cake and eat it' sort of way. The system works however, because after some time (typically years/decades, sometimes less and sometimes more) the cake that was 'eaten' will be returned to the bank, merging back with the cake that was kept.. That's why the system works: Because people pay back their debt. When people don't, the system fails, and you get Greece-like situations... But the system works more than it fails, meaning you can't state that every loan is a 'creation' of money in such a black and white fashion.

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>>723824034
Oh, definitely. But if that's what makes him/her happy, then OP can live his/her dream

>>723823179
1. I know that's what he meant.

2. Actually, that is the general rule because it applies to nearly EVERYBODY on this planet. Those trustfund fags or "royal" family are the exception to the rule.

3. Easier than maintaining yourselves. The majority of humanity go to work behind a cash register, sit behind a desk, turn a wrench, draw up something, etc., collect a check, go to the store, buy everything they need, pop food into a microwave and call it a day. Now ask your average joe to make a life for themselves from scratch? Build your own home, raise and grow your own food, make your own clothing, etc..? You can give me a fully equippes farm and I still wouldn't last a week. I'm not knocking those with a job, that's me as well. Just saying surviving on your own 2 hands is a lot harder.

4. Yeah but it wasn't as prevalent as now. A lot of people WAY back then had their own farms and crops and cattle, etc.

5. That's what I meant by "themselves". It includes either a single family or a collective. I was just using a general term.

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this thread is more civil than what I imagined

>>723823513
I know. That's what I meant when I said to make it work for us. We got handed a piece of clay. Now it's up to us to mold it to our benefit.

>>723823815
>>723824103
First off, yes money appears out of thin air. That's the point.The Fed monetizes the debt whenever it engages in its open market operations. The Fed has always used this tool to raise and lower interest rates. It lowers interest rates when it buys Treasuries from its member banks. You might argue that the cake is eventually eaten - but you're ignoring the source of inflation.

>>723824418
Money does not appear out of nowhere, you Need Money, You rent Money, you pay the money plus the interest. Money appears out of your need of a loan or credit. you agree to it.

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>>723823068
Yes. He just got put on dialysis for kidney failure. I like the way you're thinking, but I'm not going to believe that it's that simple. I can't just all of the sudden say "Ok, I'm going to be a doctor" and then invest the time, money, and energy to do that. I really have to consider it and wonder if that's what I want to do. But you're right, helping people like him would definitely make me happy.

>>723823714
Again, I get it.

>>723823893
This paragraph needs to be obliterated from the internet... it's always annoying to see. Too bad it can't.

>>723824531
>plus the interest
If we make x money, and we return x+interest, we're making exactly +interest out of thin air.

>>723824207
>2. Actually, that is the general rule because it applies to nearly EVERYBODY on this planet. Those trustfund fags or "royal" family are the exception to the rule.

If there are exceptions to a rule, it isn't a rule. Saudi's and people like that prove it isn't the work that sustains you. Not necessarily the money either.. You could sustain yourself by slave labor, or even be sustained because you were born as The Chosen One in a fashion akin to the Dalai-Lama.

>Just saying surviving on your own 2 hands is a lot harder.

My point is that the vast majority of people have not done this, and that it isn't human nature to survive on one's 2 hands.. If there ever was an exception to a rule, it would be peole doing absolutely everything without the help of others. Obviously it isn't easy to live contrary to typical human behavior and instinct, nor is it desirable in my opinion.

>A lot of people WAY back then had their own farms and crops and cattle, etc.

I´m not sure what timeperiod you´re referring to exactly, but people in European history often had no choice but to be farmers. They didn´t own crops and cattle so much as that they were forced to tend to them for the nobleman that actually owned them.. People often have a fairly romantic view of the ´simple´ life of the past. It was actually quite shitty, and I dare say objectively shittier than the life of the average retail employee in the West today.

>5. That's what I meant by "themselves". It includes either a single family
I imagine single families might run into trouble after short while, unless they went full-biblical in their repoductary tactics..
>or a collective.
>>723824330

It appears we agree. Could have spent my time shitposting on /pol/ to be honest, but it was fun typing this nonsense up regardless..

>>723824418
>First off, yes money appears out of thin air. That's the point.The Fed monetizes the debt whenever it engages in its open market operations. The Fed has always used this tool to raise and lower interest rates. It lowers interest rates when it buys Treasuries from its member banks. You might argue that the cake is eventually eaten - but you're ignoring the source of inflation.

You might also argue that I should have been able to pay off this appartment in tulip bulbs, but you'd be arguing in the wrong city and the wrong century.. Unfortunately.

>>723824418
You're dishonestly trying to conflate central banks (branches of government that make currencies appear) with commercial banks (businesses that make money by lending money).

They're not the same thing, they don't do the same thing.

Commercial banks don't make money appear or disappear, and they don't "generate" money. They get paid for providing credit just the same as your local coffeeshop gets paid for providing coffee.

Central banks exist solely to provide fiat currencies. That's what they do. It's their sole purpose. In some sense, fiat currencies exist separately from "money"; they're just a tangible good that some government says is worth money. The Federal Reserve creates US Dollars, but it doesn't really create "money": the money's already out there, and if the fed doubled the amount of dollars there were, all that'd happen would be that dollars became half as valuable.

Inflating a currency (creating money) is just an indirect way of the government taxing everyone that owns currency. Likewise, deflating it (deleting money) is rebating everyone. Central banks don't lend to people or businesses, and they don't "make money off debt". It was dishonest to bring them up.

>>723824761
No you're not, because the money you're lent came from other people, and they get paid the interest.

You're looking at yourself and the bank and thinking there's an open system because the amount of money the two of you have changes. But if you don't ignore the entire rest of the economy, the system is closed.

Say a shop buys a TV, then gives me a TV and I give them the price they paid for the TV, plus a profit. Am I creating money then? No. Is the TV shop creating money? No. It just looks that way if you only consider me and the TV shop and ignore the rest of the economy.

>>723825162
No they don't. At some point, someone did work, to put them in that position.

>>723823295
so? you don't have to do jack shit either, so long as your rent and bills are being paid

>>723825768
That's a ponzi scheme. Somewhere down the line, someone's going to have to pick up the tab.

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>>723824723
Man, I'm sorry to hear that. I know that health problems, dialysis and some others in in particular, are rough. I hope he does as alright as can be expected.
Nope! It's never that simple. You can either be a doctor for people like him, research kidney failure for folks like him, or provide public services for people like him. Thing is, life isn't simple. The only way to get where you want to be is to have a mindset like:
"I REFUSE to give up. I'm not going to die having done any less than this."
It takes a while to figure out what you want to do. I try to do a bit of this and a bit of that with multiple jobs and a lot of introspection, finding things I like and that motivate me. A lot of it is just trial-and-error, unfortunately. So just set your mind to finding things you want to do, and follow them to see if they're part of your life goals. Motive yields all else.

>>723815567
>yall
>neuroscience

Southern cancer detected

>>723822125
>skills
what kind of skills are we talking about? typing? writing? observation? most people have these, so just about anyone really could do any job regardless of how good they are at it. and while i agree that just "wanting to work" isn't a skill, everyone has the right to work in this country, and denying them a job because "they don't seem like a good fit" is detrimental to society. give people at least a chance, and if they fuck it up, then ill understand. but to deny someone the chance based on a piece of paper and no experience is just terrible.

>>723825162
It's possible to have a discussion without resorting to petty insults. Not all people are dicks when they disagree with you.

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>>723826394
I agree that we can't just say "nope, yu dunt hav the credentials" to anyone It's unfair, and rather mean-spirited I think. For society as a whole, that is. Most jobs for people like with no definable credentials/skills are minimum wage jobs like Kroger, Meijer or fast food. Even if a person is handicapped with a physical or mental disability, they have at least an alright chance of finding work somewhere here (assuming the area's store is hiring, thus in need of work in the first place).
However, some people are able to move up in life. Others aren't. It's the saddest thing in the world and it breaks my heart, but some people just aren't able to do much besides bag groceries. It's unfair, but so is life. Sometimes people can't do much besides work a minimum wage, basically dead-end job, but if they can't contribute to society more than that, it's not society's problem. It's cruel, almost as cruel as the animal kingdom which we escaped from at the dawn of civilization. But some people can't give much more than that. :(

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>>723825918
That's the biggest issue in my life. Motivation. I don't think I'm depressed, as some of my family thinks... I just don't have any motivation to do anything. I just see it as "Ok, if I do this, then this will happen. Ok I did it. Now what?" And to keep going into this cycle that's never-ending just seems pointless to me. But I see an ending, which is when we die. Am I really going to look back at all the stuff I did for work just before I die and give a shit about it? No, I'm going to be thinking about what is about to happen to me, if God exists, how my kids will be (if I have any), the pain I'm in (if there is any), and being comfortable. All the stuff in the past doesn't really matter. Eh, it's hard to find motivation at all because I see things for what they really are. Even if I'm a millionaire and can get anything I want, I would still be wondering about life and asking these same questions.

>>723814284
working is for people too dumb and uncreative to come up with other ways to make money

enjoy being cattle

>>723827502
>I don't think I'm depressed, I just don't have any motivation to do anything and don't see the point
That's literally the clinical definition of depression.

Go see a doctor.

>>723827502
>That's the biggest issue in my life. Motivation. I don't think I'm depressed, as some of my family thinks... I just don't have any motivation to do anything. I just see it as "Ok, if I do this, then this will happen. Ok I did it. Now what?"

that's depression, anon. I'm on meds for it.

>>723825659
>the money you lent came from other people
Unless you're the U.S. government going into debt with the fed - which is how all U.S. dollars are made.

>>723821870
You're just a lazy sack of shit, with a response like that. Grow a spine and a pair and do something to survive. Strive, you pussy faggot.

>>723814284
Well you see kid, a looooong time ago someone decided it was better to have one big farm raise food for everyone in a community instead of everyone having their own small farm. This gave people more time to do other things like fish, build stuff, write music, etc. Eventually this industrial approach spread to every facet of our tiny little lives and now we're at the point where half the people living in this country don't even need to work for the system to continue working. So whenever you feel like your job is sucking your soul dry, just remember that you could have to raise and kill your own food, in the dark, with no music.

>>723827832
>>723827829
i believe that depressed people are usually smarter than most of the people around them. intelligent people analyze everything, and usually already see an outcome way in advance. they aren't as surprised as a less intelligent person. so, ignorance might really be bliss. op seems like a smart and logical guy, and probably is depressed.

>>723827905
Aaaaaaand what exactly is your point?

Central banks make currencies exist. This is their purpose.

If you're pointing out that fiat currencies are inherently valueless, then your radical ideas have already occurred to others.

If you're suggesting that the US government prints money then spends it, then you're just wrong: Zimbabwe tried that, and had to stop when their bills couldn't pay for the paper and ink needed to print them.

Commercial banks and central banks are not the same thing, and don't do the same thing, and no-one would conflate the two unless they were ignorant or being intentionally dishonest.

>>723828252
Yeah, lots of depressed people think that.

But it's pablum.

Whether you're happy or not has nothing to do with whether you're smart or not. You can be both. Or you can be neither.

But I submit that sitting in a rut, wasting your potential, is not very smart.

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>>723827502
Same. Ultimately, there's no "objective point" to anything we do. We'll live, and we'll die. Some in more peace and comfort than others. That's part of why I want to leave a legacy.
Part of it is respect for my grandpa. The rest is more or less just boredom.
I mean, think about it. Do you want to look back on life and say "I did this. Now what?" or say "I fucking OWNED life. I beat capitalism, I was better than alcoholism, and I just generally won at things I put my mind to. If there's anything more, bring it on!"?
Frankly speaking, life is essentially hollow outside of your point of view. I'm depressed too, I get it. But why does anything outside your point of view matter? I don't know where you come from in life, but if you haven't got a goal of moving forward, why even live? That's not a rhetorical question.
Once you've found what you want to do, I just recommend trying to find a way to benefit others as an incidental effect of you benefitting yourself. I mean, you don't have to, but it's the easiest and most respectable way to go (in corporate America, anyway). It gives you a light in the darkness, and when that light is yourself it's a lot harder for it to fade, y'know?

>>723828487
My point is, and always has been, that money appears out of nowhere. Yes, it first comes from debt (accrued by the government). That debt is monetized by the fed, and in doing so, the fed produces more money than the debt created. This happens because of interest. This is what I've been talking about, I'm glad you're catching up.

>>723828760
Your point is naive and grossly ignorant.

US Dollars are just a thing the government says is worth something. Everybody knows this. You're not blowing any minds here.

You are, however, comprehensively incorrect about central banks making money off of making a currency exist. How could they? How would that even be possible? They'd have to create N dollars, yet get back N+1 dollars, even though they're the only thing that can create dollars.

That this is impossible is self-evident, yet you keep asserting that it's the case. You're confusing how central banks work with how commercial banks work, and you're simply incorrect.

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>>723814284
>>723828714
OP, I am in the same boat as you. Are we the same person? I was just thinking about this last night, right before I fell asleep. I don't have an answer to your questions. But I like what this guy is saying... I know I want to look back at my life in the end and think "I fucking OWNED my life." That sounds awesome. So I totally relate to that. But, you and I are the same OP, I have no idea what to do or how to get to that point. I'm just like you and lack motivation while pondering anything. But, where does that get us? In reality, nowhere. I guess we just have to figure it out and do something. Anything. This thread really made my day because it's nice to know that there are others out there just like me.

>>723814681
I fear that basic income would be the downfall of the human race, imagine how many people would get lost to drink and/or drug dependency.

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>>723821622
And here I am, a yurofag nurse, with an income of aprx 4800 euro / year aka 400 euro per month.
I'm still happy riding my motorbike with my poor gf in the free time

>>723820815
Who said he lived in america? Also, America is pretty close to a 3rd world country.

>>723829242
>How could they
By making profit from the transaction I just described. Their profit is a large source of inflation in our economy. You're right in a sense though, the money doesn't just come from nothing, it comes from the decreased value of the currency itself.

>>723829427
Howabout a sterility pension then?

It's not like we need any more humans.

>>723814284
oh my god, that retarded idea,,, i thought about that stuff, but imagine that

you dont have to work, okay, you dont have to DO ANYTHING,, but, thats it, no one has to either,, you either get what you want by yourself, or die from starvation or something

what would you do? if you dont have to work? But you expect others to get stuff for you? Like working internet etc? or if you dont, sure thing, but i doubt you will manage to get these for yourself by yourself alone...

ye,, and thats that, i could repeat that same thing over and over, but thats basically it,,, blablablabla why work blablabla.... then work in a field you like maybe... if not, then whatever, your choice

>>723829657
>by making a profit
NO NO NO NO NO.

That is not an explanation, because "making a profit" would have to somehow create more dollars, and we've already established that the only thing that can create more dollars is the central bank, and the only way it can do this is by creating them then lending them.

So where in your worldview do these "profit dollars" come from?

I'm so glad to have found this post and know that other people actually think the same way, not a day goes by where these thoughts don't run through my head

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>>723814284
Oldfag here. I'm fucking 46 years old and still don't know what I want to do with my life. All I can help you with is telling you my life experience. My wife and I felt the same way when we met, maybe that's why we're together? I don't know. The only advice I can give you is to do what you love and figure out a way to make money for it. Whether it be working for yourself, or someone else, or living in the wild... who really cares other than what others think? It's your life, live it the way you want to. I'm reading a lot of the other people's posts, and the people who think they really know what the deal is are funny. Nobody knows the true answers why we have to work and why we exist. Just stick to your guns and work on improving yourself... you'll figure it out as you go along.

>>723829701
That wouldn't really work, e.g. have 3 kids then get the sterility pension. Although I agree there is a population problem, my main point is that we would lose alot of creativity and innovation that would ultimately lead to our demise as a species

>Grr, I wish that I didn't have to exchange value to get other value!
If you think that your work ONLY benefits your employer, you're an idiot. I mean that, because it means that your work and your mind aren't valued by anyone.

>>723830096
The bank makes it's money from the debt accrued by the U.S. The profit is the money they make off of this process. It's really not a hard concept to get around. The fed printing money as requested, then essentially making money for themselves through the process of interest. This is not more money that they print, it is more money that they accrue in savings. This is what devalues the currency.

>>723829242
Idiot.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a_s6ofhyqWw

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>>723829542
Tell me how the only superpower in the world (said by Putin) is a 3rd world country.

Sure, there are shitholes in the US, but it's a fantastic country to live in. If you live in a bad part, fucking move, don't just complain.

>>723830311
This guy gets it, take what you spawn with and improve on it to live the best possible life you can (that means balancing time and money)

>>723830311
*Who really cares about what others think? Fixing my mistake

>>723822740
90% of all jobs in the US economy pay more than minimum wage.

>>723830096
the retardness is so strong that makes the deficit go down at the USA.

>>723829242
Do you have no idea what inflation is?

>>723830329
Sure it would. You just discount it by the number of kids you've had.

Hell, having three should invite a tax.

>>723814284

I know what you man man...fuck. I dunno, I work because I know I HAVE to... and that idea itself is sort of dehumanizing, but to what extent of power do I hold over this situation? It is none!... and that's the shitty part, but it's well spoken and logical enough to understand and comprehend. "A man who does not work, does not eat", and that seems pretty straight forward and fair to me. as far as human beings go, I feel like we are all just kinda scrambling around, searching for our all own personal life m8. life sucks then we die, it's ok.

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>>723822740
That's a lie.

Go to a temp agency and you'll get a job if you can stop smoking weed for 20 days. Every one I've been too has been $11+/hr. Hell, one job I got through a temp agency was $15/hr to answer a phone for a small company and that was one of my best jobs I've held.

>>723830446
You've still not explained where this "profit" can possibly come from.

From the top, once more:

1 - Every dollar that exists is made by the central bank
2 - The central bank lends out N dollars
3 - For sake of argument the central bank gets back N + X dollars
4 - remembering point 1, the place the X dollars come from is __________

Simply fill in the blank, and you'll have proven you right and me wrong.

>>723829864
oooh and thinking forward,

soo some ppl get together to get stuff for themselves, but other ppl want it, well they dont want to just give it to them,, cause why the hell?? they made it themselves, go make your own faggots

but okay, they give it to X if X gives something in return,,, hey guess what, a trade was made, eventually other groups form, as ppl alone are unable to do much alone, some wont join anyone, and just die off, some are lucky and get food and stuff from here and there, but most of them dont

there is Y who want to be a photographer, but no one give a fuck about him, he just keeps dreaming being unable to construct a basic camera for himself,, and eventually die later on, always talking to himself [being insane] how he just wanted to do what he want, cause thats how life is, like in ancient times, when humans didnt even know what electricity was [obviously]

well anyway as said groups form, they all do different stuff, there are large groups tho, that are kind of self-sufficient, they are okay, they dont have everything, but they dont need it

and there are groups who make stuff that a lot of ppl want, that dont want to bother with it and make it for themselves, but the demand is just too high and they can produce stuff fast enough, they have to get other ppl to "work" for them to help make stuff

okay, but they have to convince them somehow beside, "help us, so it will be good for us" , so they offer something in return,, say payment,,,,,

blablabla, what im getting at,,, what you are saying is basically nothing OP, why do anything then? do what you enjoy,, you dont know what it is? well , maybe you are depressed, etc etc,,

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>>723830311
>>723828714
>>723829284
Thanks guys, you 3 seem like the most relatable people on this thread that I've seen so far. You all seem very genuine and down-to-earth. It's good to know that there are others out there just like me, even at a different age. I'm going to take your advice oldfag, and work on improving myself. And anon, I'm going to look into getting a goal to move forward. I know it's going to be tough, but I gotta do it. And we have to overcome our lack of motivation Charizard. I don't know how, but we have to try. All while these thoughts and questions are still going to be in my head though until I die. But seriously, why does life have to be like this? Maybe it's a test to see if we go to heaven or hell ha or maybe we all just die and then nothing happens, just pitch black darkness and no consciousness.

>>723831429
1. Every dollar that exists is request by the U.S. government
2. The central bank lends out N
3. The central bank charges interest on N dollars + X dollars
4. Thus, X dollars (usually not printed) come into existence because of INTEREST

How much interest?
9 dollars are created for every 1 dollar printed.

>>723814284
Ok, so don't work.

What are you going to eat? Food? Well, where did the food come from?

Someone had to work to make it. In order for you to get some of it, you trade in some of your time in the form of money to compensate the farmer for their work. It's called economy, you might have heard of it and it's not only limited to food.

In the future, when nearly all work has been automatized away you can ask again but until then, we need people to work.

>>723814284
quit your complaining and make money doing something you like

>>723832739
read the whole thread and you'll realize that op already knows this

>>723814284
there is no reason but that it makes the people at the top richer

they brainwash the youth to believe that the current system is a good one

it's not

>>723832649
You're handwaving again, and your point 1 and your point 4 are in direct contradiction.

C'mon, why the prevarication?

Why the song and dance?

If you're so right, why not just fill in the blank?

>>723832840
Well no he doesn't, because he seems to think that everyone not working is sustainable, when it isn't.

Or that him not working is something that we should pay for, or that everyone that doesn't want to work not working is sustainable, even though it obviously leads to everyone not working.

>>723832609
ahaa,, down to earth,,, i mean sure thing,, but thinking along the lines of "why do anything thats not for your own good 100%?"... hmm,,

well unfortunately life is not a fairy tale... ye it sucks to even write this, but thats it,,

now i dont want to advertise myself but here
->>>723832031 i wrote down how stuff falls into place,, and well,, imagine if we wouldnt even have that,, like the internet..

how would you be here then?? how? you wouldnt.. thats it, ye sure it would be fun, to do whatever he fuck you want but then do something to get closer to this, like get a good paying job,, really, that would be more realistic, then magically wanting stuff to happen on its own, so you get everything

so ye, if you would have lived in the stone age, say good bye to internet, your pikachu picture etc etc...

to be honest, you just sound depressed or sad whatever.. "making a mountain out of a molehill" you dont like what you doing or something,, and then you go off talking about how you cant do whatever you want in life,,

yeaa,, " and work on improving myself" mmm ahamm, nice, about time i guess to figure this out..,,

well anyway, talk like this is going nowhere, these questions are to everyone its own, whatever you think about it... there is no answer.. ye maybe its to decide whether you go to heaven or hell

>>723833214
no man, its deeper than that. of course not working is not sustainable. i think he knows this. he even stated it in the very first original post. i think the question is why was it set up this way. why do we have to work to survive instead of just surviving... why are the resources on earth needed to survive... why do the plants grow bigger... why are there other planets... its philosophy dude and i think the same shit

>>723814284
I get you, OP. I worked for over a year on a desktop job; it was really depressing to be sitting there 9 hours every day + 2 hours trying to get home, only to get there, have some dinner and then going to sleep only to do the same exact shit the next day. I said to myself that i would never get such a depressing job ever again.
I won't stop working, tho. I also believe in hard work but I will always put my happiness and well-being first

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you guys should 100% stop what your doing & go to Snapchat z .com asap

>>723833594
well if OP think this in a philosophical way, well, sure, its strange tho,, how he talks about >>723832609 "down to earth"

thats more like up in the clouds thinking about philosophy, down to earth would be realizing why this is like that, and thats it, not caring about huge unsolvable mysteries of the world like that, like why does "ANYTHING" exist ... why?? why is there something? why not nothing? and then if there is nothing, wouldnt that be something too??

no, thats just sad meeeh talk, depressed maybe, well time to grow up

>>723819784
the worst thing in this world is the "all men are created equal" meme.
these same retards project this mentality towards things they don't even begin to understand with their "it was easy for me, so it should be for you!" bullshit.

>>723834156
i think he means it in the sense of being relatable. down-to-earth really means realistic, logical, not up in the clouds, yeah, but i use it when i think alike with someone else too. down-to-earth is concrete while up in the clouds is abstract. and, i already know the concrete stuff, im interested in the abstract stuff. so philosophy in my opinion is a good thing. it shows how deep someone can think. and don't tell people to grow up man, because all of us already are with each passing second lol (down-to-earth-wise)

grow up as in.. fantasizing about "doing only what you like".. cause aint gonna happen, unless you do your hardest to somehow achieve that,, like well most likely with money

no going along OP's line leads nowhere,, just some depressed guy, thinking about why life "sucks", and well guess i have to keep working,, oh well..

sure you can look at it that way,, and well in a way it short of like this anyway, but most likely OP feels like this, cause he don't know what he want to do,, which i guess he might even wrote down somewhere up there,, so ye, all that other talk is really just philosophy ye,, which is okay,, but its not realistic at all,

and dont look at it that depressed,,, why?? do you hate your job that much?? you have like no free time? etc etc... oh come on.. ye thats the part about growing up,, surely not that you should know exactly what the fuck you want to do with life, rather stop thinking that way...

cause even if you do... nothing will happen.. you can keep dreaming but it wont come true just like that... like replying in a "Reply to this thread and you get 1billion $" wont happen either if you reply

or i dunno, maybe if you get lucky, and for some other reason you get 1 billion

you can keep fantasizing about stuff, but that "meeh life sucks, cause its not easy mode" aha... okay,, so? anything new? guess you have to wait for re spawning into rich, nice family mode

>>723814284
Just wanted to chime in here. I've read this whole thread just now. While I don't agree with the idea of not working, in a realistic sense (because we do need to work and make money to survive if you think about it), I believe there needs to be more thinkers like OP in our world willing to express their thoughts and ideas. Philosophy is crucial to our well-being. This very post has allowed people to come together and express their opinions with each other, which is a beautiful thing. Otherwise, without sharing our thoughts to others, we are just sheep wandering about on earth just working and keeping to ourselves... very boring. These kinds of questions are fascinating to think about, and can help bring people together.

>inb4 gtfo you pacifist faggot

>>723814284
doesn't life suck man?

>>723816227
What would you do if you were "free to do what you want" 24/7? Yeah, It would be nice the first week, or month or so, but eventually you will be playing vidya and masturbating all day. Then you get depressed. Would you travel the world? You have no money, because you don't work, remember.

>b-but in my perfect world, we travel for free!

But who would build the planes for you travel? Who'll tend the hostels you'll stay at? Where and what are you gonna eat? The thing is, there's a lot of people in this world, and all have needs and to satisfy them all someone's gotta put a lot of work. It happens with fucking animals: they work for food or starve to death.

But going back to my earlier point, what are you gonna do with the free time? Create precious works of art? Make huge discoveries in physics? Well, honestIy, don't think you can. Leaving aside that you need materials to do any of those things (that someone has to work to make), I don't think you will do any of that. Some people of course will, because they can (i.e. are smart or even geniuses), but chances are you will sit down and jerk off all day. Same with 90% of people. And we all know what happens when large amounts of people get idle for too long.

I said a lot of ugly shit, so you make think "this faggot is just a conformist loser". Did I said the world can't be better? I sure didn't. Leibniz (a philosopher and mathematician) said the world was "the best possible one that could exist in a feasible way". Some other faggot said: "well, what if there was one more nice person in the world?", so basically yes, the world can always be better and you should strive for that. But the "better possible world"can't be super far away from where we are (less violence, less poverty, less evil shit that makes no sense), but it won't be a hippie eden, and you can bet going homeless helps nobody, specially not you.

>>723836518
you mean a bunch of people who aren't working at 4 in the afternoon?

>>723814284
So I caught this late but I wanted to give you my point of view. I'm american and I hate corporate greed and all that and I think it's just bullshit especially with technology improving and jobs possibly being automated and whatnot. Ideally I think there should be a living wage paid to people so that they can focus on the arts and creative pursuits that will help the world move forward in a positive way, but I don't think it's realistic. The majority of people, myself included, would just take the living wage and play games or maybe pursue a couple interests that are more difficult such as learning an instrument or trade. People like me wouldn't be bothered to try for something more difficult than that because "what's the point".
I did a lot of soul searching and I came up with a couple hard truths about myself that have helped me:
1. I'm smart, have a good memory and can do things efficiently. I learn quickly. Most people are like this; it isn't THAT unique of a trait.
2. I have some kind of stubborn mental block that holds me back, like it does many people. It's a weakness or type of stupidity (in my opinion)
3. This leads me to believe I'm not stupid in the IQ sense, but I'm definitely not smart enough to see forward enough to motivate myself in the present.

After coming to terms with this I made small goals that I knew I could do, or that were just outside of my comfort zone. After reaching these goals I realized I could probably push them a little further and try things that were harder. I succeeded at those as well with my new confidence in my ability to plan and make good on plans. I found myself. Not what I wanted to do specifically, but that I was capable of truly moving forward. It doesn't matter what I do now, I just work on doing something better and better. At this point in my life I've done more than I ever thought I would do, not by making a decision on what to do, but by making a decision on doing BETTER than where I am. Hope this helps.

>>723832609
Dude, they are just agreeing with you.

We all ask ourselves "what's the meaning of life", and yeah it sucks having no answer, but if it stops ypu from being a functioning human being (i.e. setting goals for yourself, having some form of motivation), then you have a problem. It may be that you are a teenager (not saying it as an insult) of maybe you need to talk to someone. But life shouldn't be so cryptic that you can't even live it.

>>723814284
life is like a box of chocolates. you never know what you're gonna get!

>>723840884
wrong, you always get the turd which is shaped like chocolate.

>>723829284
My sentiments exactly. OP made this same thread last night and this is chillingly similar to what I replied with. Again, it is comforting to know others feel the same.

>>723842180
Yeah man, this chain of comfort is relieving. I feel the same way. I don't know if it's a good thing in general that we feel this way, but to me, it's good that more people feel the same as I do.

>>723814284
grow the fuck up kid

>>723820950
Machines and robots will be the death of the human race, mark my words