I do not care if God exists or not. I don't consider myself

I think that would lean more Atheist, but maybe that's just me.

The terms are not mutually exclusive, you are both.

But if you want to be more specific you should call yourself an apatheist, it would still make you an agnostic atheist but you wouldnt have to use those words, which seems to be a problem for a lot of people.

>>723348497
But I'm not an Atheist. God could exist I just don't care. I'm not agnostic, because I'm not saying nobody knows. I'm making a distinct statement that the entire question isn't worth asking or answering at all in the first place.

My own mind is my own church

Agnostic is more like: a person who doesnt claim to know if a god exists or not or believes we can never know for sure if there is a god or not.

but like this >>723348497 guy sayd, they are not mutually exclusive and you are both.

>>723348600
A (without) + theism (belief in a god) = without belief in a god. An atheist is one who does not believe in the existence of a god(s). Atheism is not even a category. It is the exclusion of a single category, theism. Meaning that someone who is not a theist, is an atheist. The only way to exclude yourself from atheism, is to believe in a god.

Of course if you still want to say you are not an atheist but dont believe in a god you are using the word in another way. You should make this clear every time you talk with an atheist because if you dont you might aswell be speaking another language, You need to agree on what words mean, This is how Atheists use the word atheist.

>>723348628
I'm pretty sure that an agnostic atheist means:
>I don't believe in god, and nobody can know.

I like apatheist. I've never heard that before. Apatheism states that the question is irrelevant. I believe it is separate, distinct, and exclusive to atheism and agnosticism.

>>723348600
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apatheism

Like i sayd, you are an apatheist but also an agnostic atheist because you dont claim to know either way but you dont believe.

Apatheism, as that guy said, sounds best. Using knowledge of other words (apathy, meaning not giving a shit) and theism, as described in other posts, it basically I don't really care if there is a good, doesn't really matter

>>723348886
God*

>>723348600

You don't care but you don't deny = not athiest
You don't deny = agnostic

You are agnostic.

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>>723348824
no its
>I don't believe in god, but i dont claim to know that there is no god.

Atheist = doesnt believe
Agnostic = doesnt know or claim to know
Theist = believes
Gnostic = claims to know for sure

You are an agnostic atheist but more accurately an apatheist.

>>723348853
I really don't think so. My understanding is that Atheism IS a belief. Saying you are not a theist is making a choice. I'm making an outright refusal to choose.

These are good responses. I'd like to keep this discussion going.

>>723348367
Atheist - you have a lack of belief

>>723348918
another guy who doesnt even know what atheism is. How can there be so many retards on the internet?

>>723348918
Atheism doesn't deny god, it simply lacks belief due to a lack of evidence for

>>723348367
>I choose to decline the argument entirely due to its pointlessness.


Starts this fucking thread.

Eat a dick bro.

>>723348918
Agnostic from my understanding means god might exist, god might not exist. Which is still an assertion. I choose to make no such assertion.

>>723349012
Atheism is a belief like off is a tv channel. Atheism is NOT a belief and that is all what it is, not a belief, its the definition of it.

A (without) + theism (belief in a god) = without belief in a god.
Stop making the same fucking strawman argument all the time and talk to atheists honestly you prick.

>>723348367
The part of not caring and considering the mere concept pointless is more akin to a nihilistic approach to spiritualism than anything else.

If God doesn't exist, you don't care. If He exists, you still don't care.

It's detached, uninterested, indifferent, unless it would bring some sort of point or use. That's definitely nihilistic.

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>>723349106
You misunderstand then, if you dont claim to know you are agnostic, if you dont claim to believe you are an atheist.

How many times do you have to hear it before you understand it?

>>723348367
It means you don't have a religious stance.
You're irrelgious.
...This term can be applied to a number of modern atheists as well, but it's worth noting that many atheists (such as traditional Buddhists) are religious.

It's a term you rarely hear, as it decribes very few people, many think it's not a possibility, and those who have the trait often find it extreneous.

It's a thing.
Well, it's not a thing, but it's a not thing that can be.

I'm apitheist, I believe that one day the great bumblebee that gives us light will come back down to Earth and take all of us apitheists to the Andromeda galaxy, to restart life without these fucking humans screwing with the environment

>>723349027
The number of retards on the internet is always n+1

>>723349227
Indeed, like Einstein sayd "There are only 2 things that are infinite, human stupidity and the universe and im not sure about the universe."

>>723349227
This should be a secondary splash for /b/

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>>723349318

>>723349106
You're not a denier and you're not a believer. That's what agnostic is.

If you put your head in the sand and say "I don't acknowledge the world" the world does not go away. Obviously there is a god or there isn't, so the question doesn't disappear just because you don't like it.

>>723348952
In reference to your picture, I don't follow that pattern of logic at all.

>You either believe in god or not.

I'm not suggesting that I don't believe in god. I just don't care, which is separate and distinct.

I you're telling me I can either like chocolate ice cream, or vanilla ice cream, and if I don't like chocolate then I must like vanilla. I say fuck ice cream altogether

>>723349180
I can see that, but I wouldn't say I'm nihilistic either. Although I may not be entirely clear on the definition of nihilist.

>>723349192
Referencing your opinion I refuse to jump. Why can't I just sit on the diving board, or climb down the ladder and not get in either pool.

>>723349444
>You either believe in god or not.

Dude, its a logical absolute, you cant just step outside of logic because you dont care. You dont believe, why is that so hard for you to admit? Are you afraid of the atheist label? wouldnt be the first time i see that.

And your analogy just proves your fear further, in your analogy there is a third choice and many more, you could want both or strawberry.
With belief in a god there is no third option, everything either is or isnt and your belief in a god is not.

You are an Atheist like it or not, next question.

>>723348367
Makes you an Apapatheist.
Us guys do not give a damn about a possible deity, so once a year we gather to blow soap bubbles. Wanna join ?

>>723349395
Nothing in Atheism says you deny god or the existence of, it simply means you lack belief in a higher power. Agnosticism can be a form of both Atheism and Theism.

>>723349318
>>723349289
Haha that may have been my best posts ever.

>>723349588
So you are just afraid of admitting you dont believe, you are squirming around because you cant find a way out. You cant say you believe because you dont but you cant say you dont because you are afraid of being called an atheist.

Life isnt fair, get the fuck over it and grow up.

>>723348952

I don't believe in human-described gods, but I believe it's possible that a god/gods could exist/have existed.

If a god revealed itself, I wouldn't still disbelieve like a stubborn mule, I'd accept my new overlord as denying it would likely result in the annihilation of myself or solar system depeding on how hard blasphemers are smited; this still holds true if the god turns out to be false, but still god-like.

>>723349395
I get that. The question is still there, but I can still keep my head in the sand and be a special little snowflake if I want to, right?

>>723349735
>>72334962

>>723349712
>If a god revealed itself, I wouldn't still disbelieve like a stubborn mule
neither would i, are you saying this is what an atheis must do? you really have no clue do you.

Go educate yourself, go look up atheism, anti-theism, agnosticism, apatheism and while you are at it deism.

>>723349631

Idk who you are or why you are trying to push your definition of athiesm into this thread.


https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/atheism

>>723349606
I get what you're saying. And in binary you're either a 1 or a 0. But what about code that is never written at all? Isn't the lack of a 1 or a 0 still a valid choice?

>>723348367
You sound like an agnostic that doesn't care.

>>723349629
OK! I can get behind Apatheism. But I don't like people making the determination that Apatheism has to include agnosticism it atheism. It is separate and distinct.

>>723349837
>>723349629

Why don't you care to study spirituality. The fact life exist is mind blowing to me and just don't get how people wouldn't want to dedicate a big chunk of there life's to researching beliefs

>>723349676
But why can't that be a valid choice? Why can't I "squirm in fear" and still have it my way? Why do I have to pick a camp in the first place?

>>723349444
You're comparing apples to oranges. Not liking ice cream at all is a valid answer when someone asks if you prefer chocolate or vanilla- it's entirely possible to dislike them equally. However you can't say that you don't believe in god, but you also don't not believe in god. That makes no sense. Atheism is a lack of faith in a deity (not to be confused with faith that a deity does not exist). Theism is faith that a deity does exist. Whether you care about the question or not, you must be in one of the two groups. Even if you were ignorant to the question, meaning you've never even heard of the concept of a deity, then you still fall into the category of atheist because you can not have faith in the existence of a deity if you've never heard of the concept of a deity.

>>723349827
the very first words "a : a lack of belief "
So are you one of those faggots who insists that atheist are all certain there is no god and refuse to listen when atheists tell you that is not their position?

>>723349896
Then call yourself an apatheist, you would still be an agnostic and an atheist but if the guy you are talking to know what apatheist is he shouldnt bother you with all that.

>>723349837
See
>>723349949
For the answer to your question

>>723349827
Thankyou for proving my point.
Atheist - a lack of belief in god/higher power

Disbelief would be a Gnostic Atheist

I think deep down your scared to think about the big stuff so that's why you play the role of oh I just don't care

>>723349942
because thats how logic first, it doesnt ask your opinion. You dont have to tell which camp you are in, but you have to acknowledge that its impossible to not be either, if you dont you are not just being dishonest to other people but also yourself and that is not a good way to live.

>>723350074
why did i say first when i ment to say works?

>>723349925
Just because I don't care about the answer to this question doesn't mean I don't care about religion or spirituality. I just don't like the idea that you are either 1 thing or you're automatically the other. It makes no difference unless you're forcing that distinction.

I've read the bible, the quran, and the torah. They're all basically identical.

>>723348367
>My belief is independant from either definition.
In other words, you just made shit up on your own.

>>723350199
> I just don't like the idea that you are either 1 thing or you're automatically the other.

Well boohoo, nobody asked for your opinion on the matter and nobody can change the laws of logic so you can keep believing you are somehow special and better than atheists AND theists.

>>723350267
>Conceptual innovation has already peaked.

>>723350059
This is kind of on par with the notion of "Atheists still believe in God, they just resent him for some reason and want to rebel".
Some people genuinely don't give a shit and others find the subject interesting but haven't found any evidence to support a belief in Deities.

>>723350074
>but you have to acknowledge that its impossible to not be either, if you dont you are not just being dishonest to other people but also yourself and that is not a good way to live.

This is where I think you're wrong. I don't have to acknowledge anything I don't want to, or anything that doesn't seem worthy of acknowledgement. You're suggesting that I HAVE to make a choice at all and I really don't think that's the case in this argument.

I understand the logic behind the questions and the definitions, but this isn't simple logic, this is a more complex logical sentence, where there are more than just the two answers I've been presented with.

I'm being presented with a proposition that isn't a disjunctive syllogism, and people are forcing the problem to result in the answer for a disjunctive syllogism.

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>>723349942
What's the point in believing in gods when all it does is make people kill each other?

Atheism is a badge of honor and the first step to type-1 civilization.

>>723350284
>change the laws of logic
It's not a disjunctive syllogism.

>Either p or q, or both ; not p; therefore q

That's how people are presenting this issue. I'm either Atheist or Agnostic or Both. I'm not Atheist, therefore i'm Agnostic. However this isn't the correct way to solve this problem. I get the logic, I just don't think that this equation is a disjunctive syllogism, I think it's a different and distinct problem. Where neither p and nor q, and neither is a valid choice.

>>723350413
>This is where I think you're wrong. I don't have to acknowledge anything I don't want to
You are right you dont have to, BUT ITS FUCKING STUPID AND CHILDISH.

>You're suggesting that I HAVE to make a choice at all and I really don't think that's the case in this argument.
No, im saying you are either an atheist or a theist, regardless of your choice or opinion, everyone is and to say someone is not is straight up retarded.

There really are only 2 options, saying you dont care isnt an option, but you are free to not care, as an atheist or a theist.

Go look up logical absolutes.

>>723350514
>type-1 civilization.
The first step to a type 1 civilization is to harness all the power available to the Earth. Isms are independent of this problem.

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>>723350602
>You are right you dont have to, BUT ITS FUCKING STUPID AND CHILDISH.
But I can still do it. That's my point. You might find it pedantic hair splitting, but it's still a choice that is independent and distinct and rational.

>I'm not an atheist or a theist, so I maintain the ability to be smug and superior to both groups.

If I joined the atheist camp, then I relinquish my freedom to think you're all a bunch of ninnys and consider myself superior to everyone.

>>723350533
You really type a lot about something you claim to have 0 interest in, even started a thread about it.

Im not forcing you to admit that you are an atheist, im trying to get you to wake up and realise you cant always have your way.

Are you still an atheist is you believe in God, but just not in this universe?

What about believing that God existed but is dead?

>>723348367

Theism = Belief
Gnosticism = Knowledge

Agnostic atheists exist, in fact most atheists are. Most atheists also don't care if god exists or not, they just want theists to prove it. So Even if you do or don't care to believe, you're an atheist.

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>>723350753
>you cant always have your way.
Pfft fuck that i'm making you bitches my Burger King.

>>723350751
>If I joined the atheist camp,
If you don't believe in god/gods/higher powers than you're already a member

>>723350754
No that would make you a theist, what other universe do you have proof of and access to to say this?
How did he die and where is the body?

>>723350751
You can say whatever you want, doesnt make you right, honest, rational or independent, it really does make you stupid. To go against all reason and say you are something that we all know is impossible, but you can still say it.

>>723350754
>Are you still an atheist [if] you believe in God, but just not in this universe?
No idea how to even start unpacking that one.
>What about believing that God existed but is dead?
I suppose you'd be a... post theist?

>>723348367
It doesn't matter whether or not god exists but if you don't reply to this post Morgan Freeman will die in his sleep tonight.

>>723350870
post theist, that cracked me up.
Im a Transtheist myself.

>>723350754
You'd be a theist, the words predate abrahamic religions and referred to a multitude of gods, there wasn't an exclusion to which god/gods

>>723350935
I'm A/Theism fluid

The way I see it, you guys are denying the antecedent.

>If p then q
>Therefore if not p, then not q

If I believe there is a god then i'm a theist.
Therefore if I don't believe in god, then i'm not a theist.

Which would make me an atheist. Which would be a logical fallacy.

>>723350845
But belief an disbelief are irrelevant to me. I don't fit into either camp. It's not as absolute as everyone is trying to make it.

>>723351039
Nigger

>>723350991
Atheist originally meant godless or godlessness, not that you disbelieved in the existence of gods, you simply didn't follow one.

>>723351039
niiiiiiiiigggggeeeeeeeeerrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

>>723351039
If you don't believe, you are Atheist all you need is a lack of believe not a disbelief.

>>723350867
>To go against all reason and say you are something that we all know is impossible, but you can still say it.
That's the same argument you would make to a theist. So now you're not making any argument or having any discussion, you're just patronizing anyone who doesn't see things your way. I'm not falling for that one. I'm independent of your statement.

>>723350871
desu

>>723351039
Trying this hard.
No matter how irrelevant you think they are you still are a theist or an atheist and it absolutely is absolute.

Have you still not checked out logical absolutes?

>>723351060
I understand that. An atheist is the same as a non-golfer. The word itself is paradoxical, you don't ascribe an identity to someone who doesn't golf, you just don't refer to them as a golfer. My statement was about a logical fallacy that everyone seems to think is sound.

>>723351136
>No matter how irrelevant you think they are you still are a theist or an atheist and it absolutely is absolute.
Watch this...

No i'm not.

There, i'm not a theist or an atheist. Tah-dah.

>>723351186
Bad example, you can partake of golf yet not be a golfer, you can't partake in the belief of gods and not be a theist and you can't lack belief in a god and not be an atheist - it simply doesn't matter how much you don't care.

>>723351104
Not really, a theist has a burden of proof so there would be a lot to talk about, you on the other hand are an atheist like me, i was trying to get you to see that but i understand i never will, you just will always believe what you want, no matter how obvious i make it that you are wrong, you can just deny it all day long because there is nothing at stake.

I wish i could give you a situation that forces you to see it, forces you to admit that you were wrong, but i cant. Maybe someone will, maybe you will die because of being too stubborn, i will never know.

>>723351128
Faggot, we all wanted it to happen but you had to fuck things up.

>>723348367
if you admit you don't know either way, you are agnostic

>>723351224
saying that doesnt really change anything, besides im not even asking you, i already know how the situation is, its sad that you have your blinders on and cant see it with me.

>>723351333
Which had nothing to do with theism, I'm agnostic, I also have faith in exactly 0 gods.

>>723351323
>Not really, a theist has a burden of proof
Burden of proof? This isn't Night Court, this is theology and logic. Proof is irrelevant to all of this. Belief isn't something you prove. If you think theists have a burden to prove a god exists then you're not seeing that picture clearly.

>I wish i could give you a situation that forces you to see it, forces you to admit that you were wrong, but i cant.
So... maybe... you're wrong?

>>723351104
>>723351323

>That falling rock will totally stop before hitting me because i say so, i cant die, i am never wrong
>splat
yeah, i could totally see that happening to a guy that stupid.

>>723351333
I don't admit that I don't know either way. I'm not agnostic.

That omission of admission is itself an assertion. This makes me something different altogether.

>>723351388
i always thought atheism was a belief that there is no god, no i think we're on different pages here

>>723351475
it makes you an apatheist, which is an agnostic and an atheist by definition.

You can have your own definitions, but like i sayd earlier is the same as having your own language, which you might aswell have since you arent really a part of this discussion, you are having your own discussion with yourself.

>>723351369
It's not my fault for not seeing reason when you give me no rational arguments to counterpoint my line of thought.

I'm over here saying I'm not in either camp, and you're shouting at the top of your lungs that it's 1 or 0, yes or no, black or white, wrong or right. I'm telling you neither 1 nor 0, not "yes" and not "no", not black and not white, not wrong and not right.

agnostic or nihlist

>>723348367
It makes you a huge faggot OP.

My reasoning is simple. It's so pointless to you and you just don't care, and yet you are devoting an entire thread to categorize yourself. It 100% makes you a faggot

>>723351533
That would refer to someone who is gnostic, to disbelieve you have to think you know there is no god, so a gnostic atheist.
I don't believe in a god because I've yet to see any evidence there is one - show me some evidence and it may force me to believe.

>>723351533
thats anti-theism, but anti-theists are by definition also atheists so you are half right there.

>>723351457
>Falling rock
>Rock will either hit me or miss me
>I don't care about the rock.
>If it hits me it hits me, if it does not it does not.
>My belief in whether or not the rock will hit me is irrelevant to the result.

>>723351475
so you do claim to know one way or the other.. what are your beliefs then?

When people ask you about your view on religion, you can simply say that you don't give a fuck...

>>723351656
do you think you know whether the rock will hit you?

>>723351582
>it makes you an apatheist, which is an agnostic and an atheist by definition.
That's where I disagree. Apatheist makes sense and it can stand independently of agnostic and atheist.

If Atheist is the Republican ballot, and Theist is the Democratic ballot, and Agnostic is the Libertarian ballot, I'm not even at the polling booth because I'm off doing something I think is more important.

>>723351587
>It's not my fault for not seeing reason
i've given you a bunch of argument and directed you to a bunch of directions, you are refuse to understand, change your mind or even listen, there is nothing more i can do.

Call the atheist experience next sunday, i would love to hear you have this discussion with people who know a bit more about it.

I mean English isnt even my first language (a bit irrelevant) but it might be the reason why i cant convince you.

>>723351616
I'm devoting a thread to it to understand what everyone's opinion is. And see if anyone can convince me that I am one thing or another. An while I can see how Apatheism works for me, the follow up that I can only be Agnostic and Atheist in ADDITION to being Apatheist doesn't. Apatheist seems like it would be 100% independent from any other definition.

>>723351761
>Apatheist makes sense and it can stand independently of agnostic and atheist.
Nope, you have either a lack of belief, or a belief, if you don't care enough to have ever thought about it and therefore form an opinion, you are an atheist simply because you at that moment lack belief.

>>723351761
being somewhere else doesnt make the ballots go away or stop the election from happening, this is what you fail to see.

>>723351656
The thing about the rock analogy is that the situation has to be where someone has to tell you that the rock exists and it will indeed hit you; but you cannot see, hear, or smell the rock; or even feel the ground tremble as it hurdles toward you.

If none of those stimuli exist, there is little reason to believe the rock is actually there, but you can certainly take that guys word for it.

you're pretty much a theological special snowflake.
you're not special man, it's okay to share beliefs with other people.

>>723351747
I think knowing isn't important. I have no choice in the matter. The rock hits me or it doesn't. My determination that it will not hit me doesn't change the outcome in the first place. All it does is give me comfort in the fact that I made a decision. I'm choosing not to make a decision. And while I may not be comfortable with the knowledge that there's a rock that will either hit me or miss me, I'm still not betting on the outcome.

>>723348367
you know this morgan freeman pic is a drawing? in fact, made with a finger, on an ipad

proof: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uEdRLlqdgA4

>>723351656
>>My belief in whether or not the rock will hit me is irrelevant to the result.
Wrong. If you think the rock will hit you, you move out of the way.
Humans have agency.

>>723351854
>Do you think there is a god? Who cares?
>Do you think there isn't a god? WHO CARES?

>HAH! You're an atheist! I proved it with logic!

>>723351656
>Rock will either hit me or miss me
You are either a theist or an atheist
>My belief in whether or not the rock will hit me is irrelevant to the result.
Indeed it is, do you see it now, the rock doesnt ask your opinion, just like the laws of logic dont ask your opinion.

>>723351949
let me rephrase
Do you think you COULD determine if the rock will hit you or not?

if you think you can:
athiest or religious

if not:
agnostic

if you don't believe in anything (impossible unless you're inanimate):
nihilist

>>723351890
>being somewhere else doesnt make the ballots go away or stop the election from happening, this is what you fail to see.
I understand that. I don't vote, but at the end of the day someone is still getting elected. Whoever gets elected isn't important to me.

Do you know what I am saying?

>>723352043
If you don't care in the truest sense then you clearly lack belief, belief requires a level of care - this makes you an atheist.

>>723351966
>Eraser tool wiping away layers of blotches to reveal the photo.

Time to argue about another set of beliefs.

>>723352124
yes, you claim to not care, but care enought to claim that you are not an atheist while you fit the definition perfectly, you dont believe in a god.

That is all that matters, you are an atheist first and apatheist second because to be an apatheist you need an opinion, your opinion is that you dont care but to be an atheist you only need to not be a theist, which you are not.

>>723351901
I understand that, but you're adding qualifiers and facts that aren't there originally. These are the facts.

>The rock is falling
>The rock will either hit me or miss me

Does believing the rock will hit me or miss me affect the outcome?
No.
So I'm not saying it will happen one way or another.

>>723352235
this, apatheism is a subcategory of atheism, just like anti-theism.

>>723351938
>you're not special man, it's okay to share beliefs with other people.
I'll share my belief with anyone who sees the logic the same way I do. It might not be you, it might not be the pastor down the street, but I'm not the only one who doesn't pick any side on this issue, and who doesn't think that the sides matter or accurately describe everyone.

>>723349106
Agnosticism is a rejection of knowledge i.e. to be agnostic is to reject the notion that anyone can ever know whether a God exists.

>>723352272
>Does believing the rock will hit me or miss me affect the outcome?
No.
>Does believing that you can step outside logic and neither believe or not believe at the same time affect the outcome?
No.

Maybe you are like me, im a little stubborn too but i try to be honest, so i wouldnt admit i was wrong in the discussion but realise it afterwards, has happened to me before.

>>723352035
>Wrong. If you think the rock will hit you, you move out of the way.
>Humans have agency.

Assume 2 things for me.

>The rock is falling at terminal velocity
>The rock is exactly planck unit above me on the plane that is level with my head

There are two choices.

The rock is on top of me and will fall on my head.
The rock is not on top of me and will not fall on my head.

I don't have any opinion on whether or not the rock will fall on top of me.

>>723348367
ur an edgeist op

>>723352344
but you have yet to define your belief. you won't say that you have a belief either way, you won't admit that you don't know. all you've done is dodge the question, probably because you are afraid of being wrong.

the whole thing falls apart when you try to define 'god' anyway, it's an extremely subjective concept.

>>723352140
See now this is an argument!

I can see how you would equate a lack of care with a lack of belief, but I think the wordplay is throwing the argument off.

It's not necessarily that I don't care. I'm just not bothered by the question. I don't feel compelled to make an answer, because regardless of my answer the question isn't meaningful in my understanding.

If someone came up to me and said "Snickers is the red cherry alligator sword." And they expected me to answer yes or no, I could choose to not say anything, because the question is meaningless, and both answers are insufficient.

>>723348367
You're an apatheist

>>723352055
>Indeed it is, do you see it now
I can't see it. I know that it's falling. I just don't know where it is falling. It will fall on top of me. It will not fall on top of me. Those are the two choices i'm presented with, I don't have an opinion. The rock will fall where it falls.

>>723352598
But snickers would still either be the red cherry alligator sword or not be, but this is a bit irrelevant as its a question you dont understand. "Do you believe a god exists?" is a question you understand, its a simple yes or not question and you do have an answer to it (its no) but instead of being honest you cling to i dont care and demand that its a valid answer.

Well you can and are doing both, you dont believe but you dont care either.

>>723352598
>I can see how you would equate a lack of care with a lack of belief, but I think the wordplay is throwing the argument off.
As I said, if you truly don't care - which is impossible in reality.
>It's not necessarily that I don't care. I'm just not bothered by the question. I don't feel compelled to make an answer, because regardless of my answer the question isn't meaningful in my understanding.
This doesn't mean you don't have one, simply that you are not presenting it to us, you are still either theist or atheist by definition but simply trying to obscure which side you fall on from the people in this thread.

>>723352075
So you're trying to trap me into a binary statement, to a question that doesn't assert a binary answer in the first place.

Do I think I could determine if the rock will hit you or not?

I choose not to determine. Even if I could argue definitively that "The rock will hit me" or "The rock will not hit me", I choose not to o either. The determination doesn't affect the outcome so it is pointless in the first place.

>>723352790
>So you're trying to trap me into a binary statement
thats just how you see it, we are trying to get an honest answer, but instead you refuse to answer.

Do you believe that a god exists?

>>723352908
he's straight-up too afraid of being wrong to have an opinion. it's retarded.

op answer me>>723351689
>>723352564

>>723352235
>to be an apatheist you need an opinion
That is wrong. Apatheists don't have an opinion.

>Atheists are of the opinion that there is not god.
>Agnostics are of the opinion that there could be a god or not.
>Apatheists has no opinion.

I don't understand why people won't let it rest right there. The three statements can be independent of each-other, and they can also be commingled.

>An Atheist Agnostic doesn't know if god exists, and doesn't think that god exists.
>An Atheist Apatheist doesn't care if god exists, and doesn't think that god exists.
>An Agnostic Apatheist doesn't care if god exists, and doesn't know if god exists.

>A pure Atheist doesn't believe that god exists.
>A pure Agnostic doesn't know if god exists.
>A pure Apatheist doesn't care if god exists.

I don't understand why people force two things that can be separate and independent into one.

>>723353038
>>Atheists are of the opinion that there is not god.
Wrong, Atheists are godless, which does not imply they think there is no god.

>>723352564
>probably because you are afraid of being wrong
It's not because I'm afraid of being wrong, it's that I don't care to be proven one way or the other. Right or wrong genuinely does not matter.

Pretty sure it just makes you autistic

>>723353147
There is no proof when it comes to belief but if you lack belief for, you are atheist.

>>723353012
I just hope he will realise it afterwards.

>>723353038
There is no "pure" agnostic or atheist, they answer different questions.
You are eitehr agnostic or gnostic, you are either theist or atheist, you either exist or you dont.

So its more like this.
>An Atheist Agnostic doesn't know if god exists, and doesn't believe that god exists.
>An Apatheist on top of all that doesnt care at all.

Like is sayd earlier, apatheism is a subcategory of atheism.
agnosticism is highly irrelevant, you should just not talk about agnosticism like ever, because the only people who are not agnostic are gnostic, in other words people who claim to know for sure and will not change their minds ever, people who you not worth having a conversation with or people with mentall illnesses.

>>723353038
>atheists are of the opinion that there is no god
>apatheists have no opinion

>you can be both a atheists and an apatheists

this thread is full of retards.

>>723352773
Yes, you can answer the question. And there is presumably a correct answer to the question. But that doesn't change the fact that I never answered the question in the first place.

>>723353038
Shouldn't "anti-theist" be where you have atheist?

There's a difference between someone who doesn't believe in god and someone who insists that one doesn't exist and everyone who believes in one is wrong.

>>723353147
you because it doesn't matter, you don't bother to form an opinion?

you are either afraid of being wrong or just a boring motherfucker. do you only have opinions on things which are directly relevant to your own life?

>>723353284
Well do you believe that Snickers is the red cherry alligator sword? i would say you dont.
Do you believe a god exists? you are saying you dont, you are an atheist.

Now that that is settled, you can also be an apatheist.

>>723352775
>This doesn't mean you don't have one, simply that you are not presenting it to us, you are still either theist or atheist by definition but simply trying to obscure which side you fall on from the people in this thread.

You would assume i'm lying to you? That I'm hiding the fact that I secretly think that god exists and that i'm in denial of that fact because the belief itself scares me?

The reality is, I don't have an opinion.

>God exists.
>God doesn't exist.
>I don't know if god exists.

Why do I have to make a choice? What force is compelling me to answer this question?

>How many points do I score on a test that I do not take?

>>723353446
>You would assume i'm lying to you?
I didn't say that
>The reality is, I don't have an opinion.
Which makes you atheist

>>723352908
>Do you believe that a god exists?

I don't have an answer!

How many points do I score on a test I didn't take?

>>723353116
Now who is splitting hairs?

>>723353491

0

0% god belief

0% theist

atheist.

>>723353526
Nothing splitting about it, I don't believe in god - this does not mean I believe god doesn't exist.

The word comes from a time when gods existence was the default position and being Atheist simply meant you didn't follow a god - you were godless.

>>723353236
That's a logical fallacy!

>If not p, then q
>Not p, therefore not q

>If you lack belief for, then you are atheist
>You lack belief for, therefore you are not atheist

It's a disjunctive syllogism!

If you don't care of God exist or not then you are not an atheist they don't believe in God. There is no maybe or no I don't care they just don't believe in him so you are not an atheist.

>>723353446
>Why do I have to make a choice?
You really dont because you have already made it, belief is not a matter of choice, you believe in things that you have good reasons for, a god is not one of them, therefor you are an atheist, like it or not.
>but im not
i dont care, i really dont care what you have to say about it at this point, you opinion is irrelevant. You are an atheist, you are an agnostic and you are an apatheist.
There are a great deal of other things that you are, Like your gender, you (most likely) are a man with XY chromosomes and your opinion on the matter is irrelevant, you can have 0 interest in your gender but it doesnt change how the rest of the world uses the words.

>>723353257
>you either exist or you dont.
How does one prove one exists?

I don't know if I exist! I have no idea! The question is irrelevant to the outcome!

>>723353611
its a logical absolute.

still havent looked them up?

>>723353446
the thing is man, everyone has a crude opinion on anything they ever hear about, formed the moment they hear about it. if you put zero thought or effort into forming an opinion, then your opinion will just be a basic, visceral mental reaction to the subject, but if you ever heard anything about god then you have some kind of opinion on it.

it's human nature. we are judgemental and we form opinions on things almost instantly. just because you are too lazy (or too smart, take your pick) to put any thought into an unsolvable problem, doesn't mean you don't have an opinion. it just means it is reactionary and ill-defined, and you are in denial about it.

>>723353611
No, it's a simple binary result, to be theist you require belief - if you lack said belief you are atheist - meaning without a chosen position the default position is Atheism.

>>723353665
im not asking if you exist or want you to prove it, im just stating the obvious.

>>723353297
I really don't know, but for argumentative purposes assume whichever one you're more comfortable with. I guess i've always thought anti-theists were just "militant" atheists. But are they not similar enough that you can understand the argument i'm making? A rectangle isn't a square, but it still has 4 sides and 4 edges.

>>723353353
>you because it doesn't matter, you don't bother to form an opinion?
Yes! I don't bother to form an opinion! Exactly!

>do you only have opinions on things which are directly relevant to your own life?
And sometimes I don't have opinions on things which directly impact my life!

There's a lamp sitting next to me. Do I have an opinion on it? No! It's there whether or not I form an opinion at all!

>>723353761
anti-theism is a subcategory of atheism, an atheist doesnt believe in a god, an anti-theist believes there is no god. you have to first not believe in a god before you can believe there is no god.

>>723353408
>Well do you believe that Snickers is the red cherry alligator sword? i would say you dont.
Do you believe a god exists? you are saying you dont, you are an atheist.

No. Not remotely. I'm refusing to answer the question. You're taking a test, the question is (T)rue or (F)alse. You skip the question and complete the test without answering that question.

>you can also be an apatheist.
You're telling me that I can't ONLY be an apatheist which I think is absurd.

>>723353829
being an atheist has nothing to do with opinions, its about belief or more precisely, not having one.

>>723353488
>Which makes you atheist
But atheists HAVE an opinion. Atheists don't believe in god, that's an opinion!

>Atheists have blue cars
>Agnostics have red cars
>I don't have a car

>>723353584
Haha let me fix that.

How many points do I score on a test I was never registered for?

My name's not on the roster, how can the teacher ascribe me a score?

>>723353595
>You don't believe god exists.
>You don't believe god doesn't exist.

That's Agnostic.

>>723353894
>>723353940
>>723353980
yeah i give up, i've sayd the same things too many times, maybe he will think about it when he goes to sleep and realises what an idiot he was.

Go look up logical absolutes and call to atheist experience call in show on sunday.

>>723353643
>belief is not a matter of choice

Belief: an acceptance that a statement is true or that something exists.

Acceptance is a choice! Denial is a choice! Abstention is a choice! I abstain!

>>723353829
then you are of the opinion that it exists. it is provable, it is true, but you also believe it to be true. so you do have an opinion on the lamp.

on top of that, i'm willing to bet that if i were to put a different lamp next to it, you would be able to tell me which one you liked better. you are able to do this because you form opinions on them. but you have just further proved my point that you may literally be ignorant of your own opinion, more likely in denial of the fact that you even have one because you want to be a theological snowflake.

but regardless, i'm almost certain at this point that i'm talking to a teenager with an inflated perception of their intelligence who has just dicovered 'philosophy', and is expressing their superiority through aloofness. you're doing your best to give off the impression that they you're above real, tangible conversation regarding a subject which you can't be undeniably right about.

>>723348605
that's what terrorists say

>>723353643
>Like your gender, you (most likely) are a man with XY chromosomes and your opinion on the matter is irrelevant, you can have 0 interest in your gender but it doesnt change how the rest of the world uses the words.

>I have XY chromosomes
or
>I have XX chromosomes

I don't care what chromosomes I have.

>>723354065
Yes, I'm an Agnostic Atheist, someone who believes god doesn't exist would be a Gnostic Atheist.

>>723354143
Which means you accept the default position of being Atheist.

>>723353692
An absolute is either one or the other.

>God exists
>God does not exist

I don't form an opinion either way because as an absolute truth, one must exist and my opinion doesn't change anything in the long run so forming the opinion in the first place would be illogical and a waste of time.

With me?

>>723354143
So i can choose to believe i am a god? i can choose to believe you are just a troll?
Fuck i think i just did, i realised no way is someone this stupid.

>>723353980

You never passed the class, which means you never got your theist degree, which means you are an atheist and you can never get a job in heaven.

>>723354297
So, Atheist

>>723353702
Either
>1
or
>0

What about

>

Is the above not also an option? The lack of a 1 or a 0 at all is still something.

It's the paradox, is nothing something? And physics says yes. Nothing is still something.

>>723354191
none of us do, but it doesnt change the fact that you are an stupid man.

Can i have one of your chromoses? because im starting to think you have some extra.

>>723354392
>Is the above not also an option?
No
a lack of belief is by default a 0, forming belief would be switching to 1

>>723353841
I understand the difference. It just seems to be a restatement, not a new definition. It just seems to be a more aggressive way of saying you don't believe in god. It's less a belief and more an assertion - there is no god. It still falls from the same tree. And my argument still fits.

>>723353699
>>723354155
>ignoring all these strong dubs

>>723353899
I don't have a belief about having a belief.

>>723348367
I think that makes you a nihilist

>>723348600
Yeah you have the apathy of a nihilist that's about as close as I got for you

>>723349027
Word? What are you, new here or something?

>>723354076
You simply cannot refute my points! I know you believe I am wrong, but you need to consider the fact that YOU are wrong. I consider it, I am here making the argument because every time I respond to someone I have to dig deep and figure out if the argument presented makes me wrong or not. I've had to dig deeper and deeper but I still keep affirming my same statement.

>>723354511
Being an Atheist does not classify whether you believe god exists - that's the problem with your statement, it simply indicates you do not believe in him/her/it/them.

So basically what you're saying is your agnostic but you don't identify as agnostic. What sort of religionfluid edgelord shit is this?

>>723348367
the important thing is you managed to find a way to feel superior to both, good job

>>723354262
There is no default position! This isn't a light switch it's a theological discussion lol.

>>723354760
Lol this

Sage

>>723354648
Thats how religious people stay religious, they spin the bible over and over again and reinterpret the passages to fit their current position. Its easy to keep your beliefs and find shit that you agree with, its called confirmation bias, but its hard to admit that you were wrong, which is why im not expecting you to do it here.

Like i sayd, go look up logical absolutes and call to the show, unless of course you are afraid of admitting you are wrong even to yourself, if thats the case i pity you.

>>723354262
Think of a light switch.

>The switch is on
>The switch is off
>I remove the switch from the wall.

>>723348367
do u believe god exists?

>>723354384
No, Atheists believe that god does not exist.

>>723354865
If you rip the light switch from the wall the light will still either be on or off you retard.

>>723354821
There is a default position anon, every person is an Atheist at birth because they lack the belief to be Theist, if you continue without belief in a higher power then you remain Atheist.

>>723354865
A lack of belief cannot be removed.

>>723354865
>I remove the switch from the wall.

if it was on the light remains on and if it was off the light remains off, there is no third option no matter how hard you want there to be.

>>723354442
Is nothing something?

YES. Nothing is something!

You see what i'm getting at?

>>723354905
No, they don't believe

>>723354932
Nothing is the default position

>>723354865
refute me nighole>>723354546

>>723354734
So I get the difference you're posing.
>Belief =/= exist

I understand that, but I think a majority of the population equates the two. At least from what i've seen.

>>723349444
>i Y
is not an answer to a question
>do u X?

Who are you, Jayden Smith? Gtfo with your edgy wannabe deep thinking bullshit. You are not some almighty acceptation. You just don't want a label. So you overthink it in an attempt to seem deep and contemplative with these bullshit metaphors that don't work in the real world because the real world doesn't pander to your "I wanna be unique" bullshit.

>>723354862
But religious people aren't looking for logic they're looking for meaning. Fuck meaning.

>logical absolutes
I know what they are. They're truths that have no middle ground. This isn't a situation for a logical absolute.

>>723355046
You are right, it doesn't make the interpretation any more correct.

>>723348367
I've always felt this way. It's like I just never thought of religion in its entirety as a thing.

>>723354760
That's exactly what it is lol. We're seeing the birth of the religionfluid movement right here.

>>723348367
>LITTLE BABBY SCARED OF THE EVIL WORD "ATHEIST", CUZ MOMMY SAID BEING AN ATHEIST IS EVIL AND ULL GO TO HELL

It makes you a fucking idiot.

>>723354918
FINALLY! It's been hours since i've seen another good argument!

Ok. Lack of belief cannot be removed. It can only be changed into belief, or remain lack of belief.

According to your logic at least.

>I was born, naturally atheist
>I went to church, became theist
>I became an edgelord teenager, became atheist
>I went to college, became agnostic
>I grew up got a job and a family, I no longer care.

I know you're going to assert that I returned to the default of atheist, or at least agnostic, however I still disagree. I find that what I am now is distinct and different from any of the places I used to be. I have been presented with theology, I denied theology, I realized I didn't know, and now I realize that I don't care. I'm 1 step further removed. I like Apatheist, but I truly disagree when people say Apatheists have to be atheist or agnostic. or whatever.

>>723354967
So put this in the rock is falling argument.

>The rock is falling
>The rock will hit me
>The rock will miss me

The default position would therefore be that the rock is falling, right? For some reason it doesn't translate. And I can't quite put my finger on it. Any ideas?

>>723355021
Ok I refute you

Didnt read lol

>>723355052

>>723355338
No I just think atheist are edgelord faggots who are smug and superior and there's no way i'm joining a club full of fat sweaty neckbeards who jerk each other off all day about how enlightened they are. I prefer to be even smugger and superiorer to them.

>>723355500
So it all comes down to you not understanding atheism or agnosticim, got it.

>but i understand

No, you dont, if you did you wouldnt be saying shit like " but I truly disagree when people say Apatheists have to be atheist or agnostic. or whatever."
apatheism is irrelevant to atheism but atheism is not irrelevant to apatheism.

>>723355737
SO IM RIGHT AND U R A FAGGOT
FUCKIN ATHEISTS THINKING THEY R BETTER THAN EVERY1 ELSE

>>723355744
>Atheist - doesn't believe in god.
>Me - doesn't care about the whole god debate in the first place.

I really don't expect anyone to convince me that I have to be atheist just because I don't care. I'm adamant to the fact that the apathy itself is its own distinct theological argument that remains independent of any other "ism"

>>723355617
i neither believe nor disbelieve you

>>723348367
smartest thing iver ever heard an op say.

Oh hey OP btw, i told you to call the atheist experience, i was reading the apatheism wiki page and noticed that one of the hosts is actually mentioned on the wiki page (Matt Dillahunty).
You really should call.

>>723355849
Yeah, and i'm even better than the atheists. Checkmate everybody in the world who isn't me.
Get enlightened cucklord faggots le end

File: clerk.jpg (124KB, 337x367px) Image search: [Google]

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>>723355888
mah dbl dbl trips of truth

>>723355907
U R AN ATHEIST AND U CANT DO ANYTHING ABOUT IT

>>723348367
Everyone shut the fuck up youre all wrong this guy is a fucking genius.

He's going further than just atheism, he's atheist to atheism. he doesn't even believe in atheism, he's meta atheist, he presupposes atheism by just outright not giving a fuck.

OP i'm a convert i want to join your church of not giving a fuck

>>723356011
atheism exists

>>723356011
lul you obviously give a shit if you want to join a church.

>>723348367
You are a special snowflake.

>>723355889
Nah, i'm really not bothered by some "talk show host" I assume 1 voice is no better than the 100s of voices online. While he may have a more clear and coherent argument, I expect he'll be a lot better at crafting "binary traps" where an answer is an absolute truth and has no middle ground, which I don't believe to be fair in this situation.

At this time I remain of my original position.

>I'm definitely not atheist or agnostic.
>I might be apatheist.
>I currently have no opinion on the god debate.
>I may some day decide to form an opinion, but until then I maintain my independence from the debate entirely.

I hope that satisfies some of the people who have been arguing, this has been an awesome discussion and I thank everyone who participated and I hope everyone leaves a little more understanding than when they came in.

>>723356246

>I'm definitely not atheist or agnostic.
This makes you a theist
>I might be apatheist.
starting to think you are not, you clearly care a LOT.
>I currently have no opinion on the god debate.
or so you claim.

Life isnt fair, peace out.

>>723356011
The default position is to be Atheist, if you have yet to form an opinion on the matter, you are Atheist because you lack belief in god.

>>723355500
An Apatheist is an Atheist, simply one without a shred of care on the topic.

>>723356516
>An Apatheist is an Atheist, simply one without a shred of care on the topic.

I hear what you are saying. I do.

You think i'm calling myself a square.
To which you say "A square is also a rectangle."
But I'm not even calling myself a square.

And I know you have this fascination with "default state" being atheist.
You're asserting that everyone who ever lived was an atheist at one time,
and I actually have to disagree with that now that i've put more thought into it.

In the 21st century, not believing in god has become an identity of it's own.
I would agree with you if this was 200,000 years ago.
However the determination to refute god has become an identity.
Maybe in another 200 years it will no longer be the case,
and the theist/agnostic/atheist titles will be lost to history,
but in this era they are identities.
They are defined in relation to others and their beliefs,
not independent of others and their beliefs.

>>723356847
>In the 21st century, not believing in god has become an identity of it's own.
It was a long time ago too, Abrahamic religions tried to purge the world of non believers and associated non belief with evil but the Greeks coined the term in a time when the vast majority of people believed in gods.

A true believer will argue that the default state is Theism and point to early man's obsession with gods but one is physically incapable of forming belief in god at infancy and by necessity grow to form said belief becoming Theist by influence not by default.

>>723356847
If we go with "someone who doesnt believe in a god" as definition of an atheist, would you say my cat is an atheist?

>>723357415
Your cat doesn't qualify as a someone

>>723357286
>A true believer will argue that the default state is Theism and point to early man's obsession with gods but one is physically incapable of forming belief in god at infancy and by necessity grow to form said belief becoming Theist by influence not by default.

I agree with that line of thinking.

I would argue that before religion, man wasn't actually atheist like you initially asserted. I would say the original state (if we can call it that) would have ben apatheism. It's not necessarily that they lacked a belief in a god, they simply lacked the knowledge that there would ever be such a belief in the first place. It's some nebulous combination of many things, but it's certainly "pre" something.

I know you would say someone who was born before the idea of "god" would be an atheist, however atheists are defined by the belief in god. So that wouldn't actually fit in this example now would it?

>>723357415
Jury's still out on whether or not animals can form abstract thought.

>>723357538
>>723357485
You 2 are the masters of question dodging, its painfully obvious how afraid you are of the atheist label.

>>723357538
>I would argue that before religion, man wasn't actually atheist like you initially asserted. I would say the original state (if we can call it that) would have ben apatheism. It's not necessarily that they lacked a belief in a god, they simply lacked the knowledge that there would ever be such a belief in the first place. It's some nebulous combination of many things, but it's certainly "pre" something.

Ok, I'm with you there, how does one lack belief in something that has no concept

>>723357634
Eh? I'm Atheist. You asked if your cat was Atheist, your cat can neither be Atheist or Theist, it's incapable of rational thought

>>723357756
in other words incapable of forming a belief in a god, even a fucking rock can lack belief in a god, because a lack of a belief is not a belief.

>>723357698
>Ok, I'm with you there, how does one lack belief in something that has no concept

Right? That's an entirely new level to the situation. Disagreements aside, that's a really cool thought all on its own.

>>723348367
>My belief
>decline to care if God exists
Atheist.

File: sheeple.png (46KB, 376x401px) Image search: [Google]

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so you are an special snowflake?

>>723357873
>in other words incapable of forming a belief in a god, even a fucking rock can lack belief in a god, because a lack of a belief is not a belief.
In a strictly technical definition you could call a rock or a cat Atheist because it was originally defined as Godless or suffering from Godlessness but you would be retarded applying human conditions to non humans.

>>723357887
i think the question is "how does one form a belief in something that has no concept".
You lack belief in anything without a concept by definition.

>>723348367
Honestly op?
I think i just read that whole post in Morgan Freeman's voice

>>723358098
To lack belief would imply there is also the possibility of belief, how does one believe in the non existent?

>>723358177
>how does one believe in the non existent?
idk, ask christians, i've been wondering that too.

>To lack belief would imply there is also the possibility of belief
maybe, but not that the thing lacking the belief is capable of believing it.

>>723358338
>maybe, but not that the thing lacking the belief is capable of believing it.
We'll they're neither capable nor able to have that belief, not until someone (god allegedly) comes along and creates that belief

>>723358338
>idk, ask christians, i've been wondering that too.
Heh, should have included an inb4 I guess, as you probably know I didn't mean physically exists and god does exist as a thought allowing belief in his physical existence.

>maybe, but not that the thing lacking the belief is capable of believing it.
What I meant was there is no belief to lack in the first place, you cannot lack for something it is impossible to have.

>>723358552
>you cannot lack for something it is impossible to have.
just read that sentence again.
You lack everything that is impossible to have.

>>723358742
It's impossible for you to have 2 penises. Do you lack a penis?

>>723358924
First of all its not impossible, there is a dude with 2 dicks.
Secondly, i think i have enough penises, lets not compares penises to beliefs, i dont want to think about how many penises i could have.

File: Burdwingle.png (440KB, 600x480px) Image search: [Google]

440KB, 600x480px

>>723359048
Right. There's a dude with two dicks. Not you however. You barely even have one.

>>723359179
ikr! its because i lack all those hypothetical dicks.

Do you really need to ask if i dont have something that i cant have? doesnt the question kind of answer itself?

>>723348367
Posted 4 hours ago. 268/12

>>723359410
Sorry, didn't have enough pictures of god in my folder. I think I have a few of muhammad though.

>>723359472
do share.

Meanwhile tell me how i can have something that is impossible for me to have, like if i had it, it wouldnt be impossible for me to have right?

>>723348367
>I choose to decline the argument

And yet, here you are...

>the atheists believe in god's non-existance
>the religious believe in god's actual existance
>agnostics are just insecure pussies

>>723359574
If you have something, you don't lack it. If you don't have something, you lack it.

If you can't have something, you can't lack it.

Lack begets deficit. Can you have a deficit of something you are unable to possess? You can't even have 0 or -1 of this object. There's no deficit, there's no way to "lack" it.

>>723359928
we arent talking about objects here, we are talking about beliefs and there is not such thing as -1 belief, you either believe something or you dont, in other words you either believe in a god or you dont, right?

>>723360090
The concept of god didn't exist 200,000 years ago. Did those people believe in god or not? The question makes no sense. The concept was non-extant.

See>>723357698

>>723360259
the concept was non-existant and so was their beliefs in the concept. the question is not "Did those people believe in god or not?" its "how could those people believe in a god?". of course the didnt, they couldnt.

Besides its highly irrelevant, you do have the concept of a god so why even mention people 200,000 years ago? to dodge the question? because thats what it looks like.

Hey kids. There's an adult speaking.

See a long time ago people told me things like, "you must have faith in the lord anon" and "drugs are bad mmkay anon?"

If you actually read the first few pages of Genesis it's right there in fron of you. Drugs are the tree of knowledge and good and evil and shiz

If you are under the age of 21, stop reading

So I've do some seriously motherfucking strong drugs by now and rest assured there is a fucking god.

>>723348367
You sound like me. I prefer the term apathyist. I just don't care.

>>723348367
It makes you a lazy mans atheist.