>Fuck you guys it's the equivalent of.passing out needles to heroine addicts it's not "okay" and I would arrest you too. >I hope you all land in jail
No. it's the equivalent of giving heroin addicts another drug, that does no harm, but is not as enjoyable as real heroin.
child abuse is a serious issue. this can help prevent child abuse.
just think about it for a second. put yourself in this situation: you feel attracted to women, but it's illegal to fuck women. you have no choice but to continue being attracted to women. PORN with women is illegal. Sex dolls of women are illegal.
How sexually frustrated do you get? Not enough?
Add tons of shame, hearing your own family talk about people who like women as if they were worse than hitler*100, talking about torture and death penalties.
Still not enough? You try to get help, and the doctor feels legally obligated to turn you to the police even though you didn't do anything illegal. That is actually illegal to do, doctor confidentially and what not, but do the police care about that? Of course not, they also viciously hate people who find women attractive. You get put on a list, you get fucked everyday.
You can't go near anywhere with women, you can't sit next to a women in a plane.
No one believe you have self control, because, if you are a monster attracted to women, then you are unable to contain your impulses and you are an assumed rapist even if you have done nothing. People talking about people like you don't even distinguish between offenders and law abiding citizens attracted to women, and consider all scum.
Now you understand how it feels to be a pedo. It's not a choice. You are born like that. It deserves no consequences.
>>549533734 Laws are about protecting rights. Fucking a doll in your home does not infringe the right of anyone else.
Fucking dolls, or being attracted to young girls is not an addiction. It's a sexual orientation. Saying a pedo will eventually rape is the same as saying a hetero that gets no pussy will eventually rape.
And by your logic fapping should be illegal. Eventually you get tired and go rape women.
Look, even if it is true that pedos will get tired of dolls and move on to real kids - which there is no proof, but then again there is also no proof is these can stop pedos from harming kids - all i see is positives.
They will eventually get tired of doll? GOOD, you just bought so time. Some children were saved from abuse thanks to the doll.
I fully agree with the OP. I am a non-practicing pedo/ephebophile. I know what my limitations are and I know that the consequences will outway any enjoyment I may get. It helps that I have a low sex drive, I suppose.
I enjoy looking at naked pictures of young girls that I find attractive, and I have obtained those through nudist sites.
I'd like to have one of these dolls just to mess around with. I don't think it would increase my urges at all, I don't really have any to begin with. I could keep it fully clothed while not in use, and in the closet.
I hate the mentality that pedophiles are all horrible creatures that need to be viciously murdered for no reason other than having a desire or believing that they are all child molesters and rapists.
>>549535338 >>549535495 I lean towards this possibility too, however, I don't remember anything happening in my childhood that would have caused me to develop this trait. I have no history of abuse, minus one instance with a drunk father that was minor and not sexual at all.
Though I do remember stumbling across some pictures of his that he printed out and they were of underage girls that were naked. I was about as young as they were, maybe younger. They looked to be about 10.
>>549535338 You could also apply that same argument to homosexuals or people with gender conflicts They aren't born that way Or it's clearly a mental illness We shouldn't cherry pick what's acceptable and whats not it just sends society back in time
>>549535338 If any incident in my childhood was what caused my attraction to children, it would be my discovery of CP when Kazaa was a thing. However, I believe that I was always attracted to children, and that it only became readily apparent after I reached an age at which I was no longer "supposed" to be attracted to them.
>>549533595 well stated but I doubt that 1 percent reading this actually believe it. It is 100% the truth. If you think about your own attractions to what ever it is and make them this illegal, you will understand at least 5% of what a pedophile faces in real life.
The shame is constant. Very hard to feel good about yourself even if you have done nothing to deserve the pain. That makes it harder to interact with real women if you are a non exclusive pedo. It makes you feel inferior and non human even if you do everything in life to help others and be respectful and be the best you can be.
We want your understanding and to allow yourselves to consider that maybe we aren't demons who want to rape your kids. Most of us don't want anything close to that. We consider it an honor to spend time with a child, we enjoy the child activities because we love how happy it makes them. Might we have some disturbing thoughts, yes. But humans of all sexual preferences do without going out and performing them. (majority)
Fear is the enemy. Make smart moves to protect your child by being in the same room or setting some ground rules without shaming your child when it comes to their body. That can do just as much if not more harm.
Get to know people. If a large portion of society starts doing this pedos will come out and admit their feelings. They want to have places where they can get help. They have no desire to harm anyone. But, society must stop hunting us down with guns and beatings. Reserve that for those who have savagely raped and forced your children against their will. People who cannot be redeemed because they like causing harm.
>>549535825 Interesting. Well might as well tell my story.
When I was 9yo, I first liked a girl younger than me, 1 year younger. Everything was fine.
When I was around 13yo I already noticed girls 2 years younger, 15yo 3 years younger, 17 4 years younger, and now 20yo I am, and I fapped to anything that as the slightest indication of adolescent. The so called mosquito bites breasts, and any girl upwards from there. I don't care so much for 8~9yo and younger.
It was a scaling process. At the same time I always found girls my age attractive, and still do, albeit less than before.
I never really liked porn because I found it disgusting and filled with old hags.
I "discovered" hentai when I was 15yo, and it was because of an intro to an anime that was fucking sexy and I fapped to it. Then I looked for more stuff. I no time I found loli.
My father was physically and verbally abusive toward me, which I believe led to my pedophilia, where I subconsciously seek to regain my lost childhood by sapping those of others'. However, I would not be surprised if pedophilia has some genetic level to it. Typically, though, it is classified as a sexual paraphilia with addictive characteristics, which lies in stark contrast to a sexual orientation such as heterosexuality or homosexuality.
As a pedophile whose number one fantasy is having sexual relations with a young child, I strongly oppose child abuse in any form and believe that although child porn and sex dolls like this can help satiate some urges, it will ultimately lead to increasingly demanding sexual impulses.
From an ethical perspective, there are only two viable solutions to the problem of pedophilia: either society is reconditioned to accept pedophilia and condone sexual conduct between children and adults, which may be theoretically possible but almost certainly impractical; or sexual conduct with children by adults is forbidden and any media or products which encourage such behavior is strictly prohibited under threat of legal penalty, thereby forcing pedophiles to suffer with something they cannot control.
It is unfortunate that people either develop or inherit pedophilia as a sexual disorder, but the suffering of a pedophile, even as a human being with every due right as given to any other person, does not outweigh the potentially deleterious effects that may be caused by permitting pedophiles to have their way.
...or we could realize that for all of human history men have been attracted to and wed women between 12 and 17 years of age. Generally, menstruation was the rule. Only in the relatively modern era has this become as issue.
Basically, I think its normal. ...well, down to 12 or so.
>>549536484 It would be a dream come true to entertain a loving, sexual relationship with a young prepubescent girl and strengthen our sexual bond throughout her childhood by means of raising her, but alas that will never occur. Not only that, but if it ever were to occur, the moral, ethical, legal, and social penalties I would acquire are enough to ruin my life until the day I die. Moreover, even if society were to try and change its views to be a pedophile's utopia (which will never happen), it will day CENTURIES of sociocultural reconditioning. People still condemn homosexuals for their sexuality, despite how it has been proven to be normal and even genetic on some level, after nearly a century of social and cultural reconditioning. Do you seriously think people are going to readily accept something perceived as even more vile than homosexuality ever was portrayed as being? Something medical and legal professionals still classify as a sexual disorder? Not likely.
So pretty much, my life will be suffering either way, all because of something I never chose to have, never wanted to keep, and hate every day. And you think I'm a monster?
>>549536354 Forgot to mention: I was raised a catholic. My family still is catholic. That filled me with thoughts of shame, self-harm. I had suicidal thoughts when I was 15, because I began to think I was going to become a pedophile.
I think they don't have strong suspicions of my sexuality. but I still left the church. I don't liek people who use shame and fear to manipulate others, even if it might be for a greater good.
>>549535953 I quite often compare pedophilia with homosexuality. Not the act itself, but the stages that brought the person into the mental illness. Using "I was born this way" just to create acceptance will never help us treating the affected.
>>549536354 I feel like I'm similar to you, except I've never really "fapped" or anything like that. I also don't normally enjoy anything hardcore, minus random moments of curiosity. I actually prefer non-sexual nudity.
Seeing a girl fully dressed and then in another picture, fully undressed is more appealing to me than erotic positions, masturbation, etc.
I also find girls my age and even older attractive. I just also like seeing underdeveloped girls too. Not sure what it is about it. Could be that it's so taboo that it's just that much more exciting. It's not accepted by society, therefore I must see it.
>>549536917 Very possible. Also, I think it was the first time I ever saw a female naked. I remember finding it, getting a very awkward feeling in my stomach, and just thinking to myself "So that's what they look like..."
>>549536484 I don't have a history of abuse. But I do have an unchosen fetish for young girls.
Mine isn't specifically related to age or body type. For me, it's 1) a continuation with the infatuations I had as a kid that were (and now always will be) unfulfilled. The attractions I had for girls in my youth never went away. 2) I do have a distinct fetish for developing sexuality, I.e. Early exploration and experimentation. These tend to occur in young girls, so that puts me SOL.
Fortunately I have an awesome wife, who shares with me in detail the stories of her youth.
>>549537097 >a continuation with the infatuations I had as a kid that were (and now always will be) unfulfilled. The attractions I had for girls in my youth never went away. I can relate to that so much. I still keep pictures of my old crush. Often times when I see a girl I used to crush on and see her much older I get disappointed. they don't look as pretty as they used to be.
I supposed it's not healthy to maintain these feelings, and I might get rids of the pictures...
>>549537265 >They can't. Says you. Tell me, what prevents a child from learning? The absence of information.
The reason that most children (that you know of, anyway) can't give informed consent is because people don't inform them of anything and, in the case of sexual activity, tend to go out of their way to actively prevent children from being informed.
The problem isn't that children are stupid. The problem is that adults WANT children to be stupid.
Since when is paedophilia at any level acceptable. All of you sick bastards should be castrated or killed -- your choice -- to end this disease. And after we are through you the we should do the same to gays/trans- and cisgendered/homosexuals/bisexuals whatever you call your sickness.
>>549537351 Right. She was perfect to you back then and you spent a lot of time being "in love" with her. It fixes in a young mind and cements itself in place. Then time ruins everything, and you can never go back. An you are stuck with unfulfillable longing that you can't just unmake.
>>549537265 children used to work in mines in positions where the lives of everyone in the mine depended on them, yet now children are so stupid and unable to think that they need to be given special treatment and coddled until they're 18
>>549537520 I think that Trottla dolls are very creepy looking. Especially that new model (the horse mouthed one). There are other manufacturers making these things. Like Apricot Dolls. Still have the whiff of the uncanny valley about them though. >pic related
>>549535953 There is a clear difference between homosexuality, and like sexual orientations, and a sexual disorder such as pedophilia. Pedophilia is classified as a sexual paraphilia and disorder with addictive properties. Pedophiles typically exhibit traits and characteristics in their sexual interests and conduct which are shared with drug addicts and obsessive-compulsive individuals. There is significant scientific documentation that shows how pedophiles think more about sex, obsess over sexual conduct more than people without any sexual disorder, and entertain sexual fantasies for longer periods of time (and at greater intensities) than those of sexually healthy individuals.
In contrast, homosexuality is a sexual orientation whose characteristics deviate little from those of heterosexual behavior, and most of those deviations can be attributed to cultural or social norms and vestiges of a anti-homosexual prejudice in society. The sexual conduct of homosexuals are very similar to those of heterosexuals, and sex is roughly just as important in the average homosexual as it is in a regular heterosexual individual. With pedophiles, however, undue focus is placed on sex and more time is spent fantasizing about it in those with the paraphilia.
>>549537875 Moreover, homosexuality is shown to be genetically linked and typically, homosexual traits or patterns of behavior can be spotted even before puberty. With pedophiles, the only known cause of pedophilia is a history of past childhood trauma and typically manifests only after puberty. There are few characteristics or non-sexual patterns of behavior commonly noted among pedophiles, aside from a tentative correlation between pedophilia and lower IQ scores. Whereas homosexuals tend to exhibit behavioral traits which conflict with their biological sex, such as effeminate temperaments in gay males and masculine attributes in gay females, pedophiles show few common traits. This is because pedophilia is an extrinsic, acquired sexual disorder; while homosexuality is an intrinsic, inborn sexual orientation.
Comparing homosexuality to pedophilia is absurd because they are two very different sexual phenomena. Don't do it. They are two entirely separate issues governed by largely independent customs and norms.
>>549537554 >>549537564 No no,it's just that their brains are not fully formed and thus,they can't make true choice. They can be influenced and such,it's much easier on a child than on anyone older.
I understand that it can go in the same category as Homosexuality but never you can make me believe that it could be acceptable in any forms. Children are unfinished humans,humans alreazy so enough bullshit by emselves when influenced,children need to be protected.
>>549533595 Extremely well written and well thought out. Good job. It's a shame that so many people will just ignore your words rather than commit a braincell or two to their implication. I just finished listening to that NPR piece posted a few threads back. Was that the inspiration?
>>549535338 What sort of incidents? Do you mean abuse? I for one was def not abused growing up. My parents were divorced but still got alone, brother and i were reasonably close, and my mother is and was amazing.
I often question if we should call the act of sexual engagement with someone around 8 be considered abuse. I dont think it is as long as there are very clear signals being sent from those involved that it isn't unwanted or hurtful. At the same time, can they process this information, especially at 8 to send these signals? I think they partly can. "Wow this feels good!" versus "No, i don't like that, i'm uncomfortable".
Children behave sexually on their own and experiment with their peers but this is "normal" and is just something kids do growing up.Does this mean though that they could not experiment with someone older then them in exactly the same way? If not, why? What is the difference? What harm is this doing? (I'm not advocating it, i'm simply posing a question)
>>549533595 well put OP. Right on the money. It's tough and there is really no solution. Then you wonder if people really know. Cause you live two lives...What happens in 20 years? 10 years? Scary thought
>>549537427 Yes, but that was due to the highly religious atmosphere among the general public in Victorian England. Overall, and throughout most societies, crimes of any sort—including sexual crimes—against children were considered more vile than crimes committed against a fellow adult or peer. That's why anti-homosexual sentiments grew when homosexuals were associated with pederasty and child molestation: pedophilia is considered much more unnatural and criminal in nature than homosexuality. Very rarely have there been exceptions to this otherwise global social norm.
>>549538046 >Was that the inspiration? I literally just blushed in real life. no homo
the inspiration was haging out in several threads like these and hearing arguments from both sides and my life experience. Thank you for the kind words. Would like it if you could point me that NPR piece
I don't believe abuse during your childhood are the only causes of pedophilia. I think minor things such as your views on other women can trigger pedophilia as well. If your views on women are generally negative, considering them overly sexual beings, lacking with innocence, your eyes will soon start to drift towards individuals who possess what you're searching for.
And who could that be? Children. We have a long journey ahead of us regarding the research on pedophilia.
>>549538174 Quite incorrect. My wife was masturbating for pleasure as young as she can remember, researching the subject shows that toddlers or younger masturbate as well. My friends daughter would lay on her back and crisscross her legs over and over until she would pant and flush (orgasm), their doctor said this was not unusual. She was about 1 at the time.
>>549533595 You know what though? You keep feeding me that pseudo-heroin shit and eventually I'm going to snap and go get the real thing. >but is not as enjoyable as real heroin. What people who have a harmful addiction whether it be heroin or pedophilia need is help.
>>549537875 >Pedophilia is classified as a sexual paraphilia and disorder with addictive properties. First of all, psychological classifications change all the time, as new information is acquired, studied, and processed. Since you used homosexuality as your opposing example, I feel obligated to remind you that, until recently, homosexuality was classified as a mental illness.
>Pedophiles typically exhibit traits and characteristics in their sexual interests and conduct which are shared with drug addicts and obsessive-compulsive individuals. There is significant scientific documentation that shows how pedophiles think more about sex, obsess over sexual conduct more than people without any sexual disorder, and entertain sexual fantasies for longer periods of time (and at greater intensities) than those of sexually healthy individuals. I'd have to see the research on that to take it for absolute truth but, just taking your word for it, it isn't too difficult to rationalize why this may be. Both activities (drug use and pedophilia) are generally outlawed and subject to severe social stigma. It's not unreasonable for someone who is regularly and consistently denied sexual gratification to obsess over it more than someone who can freely and legally satisfy his/her urges.
>>549538485 That's really it isn't it? There is so much that is not known. It's hard to study in this atmosphere due to the stigma. Hard to do research when the subjects are too scared to come forward even anonymously. Even the researchers themselves are intimidated.
>>549538386 In Ancient Greece, homosexual behavior was condoned under certain circumstances so long as it was not the exclusive source of sexual conduct in the individual. However, sexual conduct with children was frowned upon as deviant and only committed by the morally weak or sexually impotent. In many Middle Eastern cultures, especially those who practice Abrahamic religions, homosexuality was reviled as being sinful and practiced only by deviants and foreigners. Pedophilia was disapproved of, but prearranged marriages between adults and children were condoned under certain circumstances. Ancient China and Japan condoned homosexuality as a normal facet of daily life, though not much is said on pedophilic conduct.
>>549538174 Many resources suggest otherwise. Young girls have urges, they just don't know what they are. The first 30 mins of the movie "Nymphomaniac" does a fantastic portrayal of it. Fuck it after 30 mins though, sucked bad and wasted 4 hours of my life. I did get pop corn though!
>>549538425 I just explained how it is NOT a sexual orientation. Sexual orientations exhibit many common characteristics in the oriented and are present at birth or prepubescence, whereas sexual disorders like pedophilia are acquired during or after pubescence as a result of past trauma and those who suffer from it do not exhibit any common traits or patterns of behavior.
>>549538921 Question: in the absence of social mores, does pedophilia exist, or does it not? If laws and social pressure are removed or not relevant, is man by nature moved to sexual activity with minors?
>>549539021 No. My wife had her dog eat her out, humped stuffed animals, played "house" including kissing, sucking, and frotting all before first grade. When masturbating she would think about being touched or humped by a male. So sexual at an early age, yes. Any history of abuse? No. Never abused.
>>549539249 How would you even determine whether or not one is a pedophile before puberty? Before puberty, pedophilic urges would simply be attraction to people of a similar age. Does sexual attraction become a sexual disorder at a certain age?
For the record, I don't think pedophilia is a sexual orientation. There are straight pedos as well as gay and bi pedos. But I don't think it's a "disorder", either.
The real real real problem is that most pedophiles will not ask for consent, or they will lure or trick children into the situation. Children are straight up dumb and will fall for anything. It's not fair for a grown man to be able to lure a little girl into sucking his dick for candy.
>>549539418 I'd say having a responsible, caring adult introduce children to sexual activity in a safe and loving environment could be a very healthy thing to do. It could be utilized to educate children about sexual health and safety, as well as being a way to reinforce a child's positive self-image.
Keep in mind, vaginal intercourse is most definitely not the only way to enjoy sex.
>>549540241 I'm just wondering. I don't plan on owning one since they're probably really expensive. But just like an AR-15, I think people should have the right to own one if they want. I just like to know what my options are.
>>549540081 You aren't talking about pedophiles. You're talking about rapists.
It is essential for the pedophile (who wishes to practice) to establish early on in any sexual relationship the view that the physically weaker one holds the larger amount of authority. Any activity stops when the child says so, and taking advantage of ignorance or weakness should be established firmly as a despicable act.
>>549540446 they are ludicrously expensive but I agree with you, you should have the right to do so. sadly even on /b/ there's whiteknights that scream that fucking a doll will lead you to be suave enough to lure a young girl into sexual relations
>>549540206 >introduce into sexual activity The problem is in who benefits more. I'm a firm believer in early sex education with a serious dose of concequence warning and a helping of self positive tips
I, and most of society, don't want to open a whole can of worms where someone uses this guise to act out their own selfish fantasies on underage and uneducated participants.
It's the difference between "let me explain why you like touching yourself and why boys ask you to show them" and "put this in your mouth and I'll show you how to make boys feel good while I finger you."
>>549540567 It's not like all pedos are created equally. Some are happy with lolicon, some with cp. Some are happy fucking dolls. Some like getting a girls consent. Others just don't give a fuck and will force and hurt girls.
>>549538831 Of course classifications in psychology frequently change, but the field has developed significantly since the times when such classification changes were common. Psychologists are much more scientific, precise, and analytical in their research, thereby ensuring more accurate and longer lasting results. The likelihood of new research disproving current scientific findings about pedophilia is quite low, seeing how we aren't blindly guessing and experimenting anymore with biased psychologists like in mid-20th Century. And for your information, homosexuality had its mental disorder classification removed over 30 years ago, which was quite a long time ago. Not very "recent," I'd say.
By addictive behaviors, I mean behaviors which are obsessive and irrational in nature. An addictive phenomenon is more likely to influence a person to make illogical or risky decisions in order to satisfy said addiction. Just because many of these addictive behaviors or substances are prohibited, that doesn't mean its addictive properties stem from its current criminal standing. Cigarettes and alcohol are both legal and to some degree socially acceptable to the majority of the population in the United States (and many other countries), yet they are both two of the most addictive substances on Earth. It is also legal to hoard, within a certain extent, yet that hoarding behavior stems from the addictive properties inherent in the activity. In this way, pedophilia exhibits addictive traits and characteristics.
>>549541370 With addictive substances and behaviors, abstinence is the method of prevention and cure for addicts. This does not necessarily entail legal prohibition or enforcement, though those are tools that are sometimes used to ensure and encourage abstinence within a given populace. When a drug addict needs to quit their addiction, what does that person do? Remove the addiction and abstain from using it. What does an OCD sufferer do to curb their obsessions and compulsions? Exposure therapy which eventually leads to an abstinence or termination of the target obsession or compulsion. How about sex addicts? They are advised to abstain from sex and seek therapy until the addiction is resolved
A common misconception is that addiction can be managed through catharsis or controlled exposure to the addictive substance or behavior. This simply does not work. It doesn't work for drug addicts. It doesn't work for smokers. It doesn't help people fight their OCD, nor does emotional release help control one's feelings. And neither does it help satiate pedophilic urges.
>>549539742 You can't, which is a distinguishing factor that sets it apart from sexual orientations such as homosexuality and bisexuality.
Pedophilia is classified as a sexual disorder because it exhibits addictive properties which are detrimental to the sufferer and can harm [him]self or those around [him]. Less specifically, it is officially classified as a psychiatric, or mental, disorder. Sexual disorders are simply a subgroup within the overarching mental disorder category.
>>549538114 >circumcision >for the good of the child That may very rarely be the case but most circumcisions are religious in nature or a case of 'well everyone else is doing it'. The good of the child is not taken into consideration.
>>549541867 This. Im sure if pedophilia were legal they would just run around fucking everyones young children without even feeling bad. Theyd have to do it without the parents knowledge, because no parent would let a sweaty neckbeard pervert fuck their kids. Disgusting people
>>549541108 Yeah and by "boys," Greek men typically had sex with pubescent males no younger than 12, usually as a form of payment for mentoring the young man. As far as I know, there is not a single documented case or story where a man had sex with a prepubescent boy as compensation for mentoring and society condoned it.
>>549534548 >I hate the mentality that pedophiles are all horrible creatures that need to be viciously murdered for no reason other than having a desire or believing that they are all child molesters and rapists.
what if they did rape/molest, would that change your views?
>>549540178 Most women will not ask for consent when it comes to having sex with men. Our society treats consent as implied, until someone screams rape after waking up next to someone who isn't quite as attractive as they thought.
>>549541909 Use TOR and search around for more information using her name. Like i said the whole story is really interesting. Legit sick at times, but interesting, especially the adoption process. This is a case where we can use the a-word and call it abuse.
>>549542558 +1 To extend that, our society treats consent between adults as implied, and between children sexually experimenting in "house" or "doctor" as mutual and implied, but flips it's lid if you suggest an adult and child could ever mutually consent to any sexual activity.
>>549542404 I get that, but the reasoning behind it is irrelevant. It's not for the good of the child, and they may well be just as delusional as child molesters thinking they're not doing anything wrong either. In both cases it's straight up child abuse, so >>549537960's point still stands.
>>549542319 A pedophile, strictly defined, is an individual who is sexually attracted to prepubescent humans. Pubescence typically begins between the ages of 8 and 13, though it can start as early as 6 years old (however, this is exceedingly rare); therefore, it's safe to assume that a pedophile is someone who finds children under the age of 12 and is not developing to be sexually attracted. There are different chronophilias for each age group, pedophilia being generally considered the chronophilia with the youngest age group (infantophilia, usually considered a subgroup of pedophilia, is sometimes ranked below it).
Ignore the legal definition of pedophilia, which is false and misleading. Not all pedophiles are child sex abusers and not all child sex abusers are pedophiles. Believe it or not, some people sexually abuse children while still not being pedophiles. Similarly, many pedophiles do not sexually abuse children. (There are no accurate statistics on the subject, though I suspect most do not.)
A pedophile should not be reviled. He (gender-neutral) can be pitied and his sexual attraction condemned, but he should not be mistreated for it. A child abuser? Yeah, I'd say of course. But to assume all pedophiles abuse children is false.
>>549534548 >I hate the mentality that pedophiles are all horrible creatures that need to be viciously murdered for no reason other than having a desire or believing that they are all child molesters and rapists. newsflash, motherfucker: they ARE all child molesters. that's all pedo scum like you are, and deserve nothing less than to be purged by fire. Fuck you, sincerely, the rest of humanity.
>>549542074 The good of the child may be the only thing taken into consideration. If you live in a country where the child will grow up in a society where all the other boys his age ARE circumcised, this may cause him to become an outcast, as the other cruel children make fun of his genitalia. For this, as a parent, you could very well decide that, for the good of the child, he must be circumcised.
>>549543903 >the big majority of pedos don't act on You're trying to have a rational discussion with people who think you're a pedophile if you like 17 year olds. People who don't even know what the word sexual predator means.
>>549543903 >is the same as saying all men attracted to women are rapists no, its not. being attracted to GROWN women and GROWN men, no matter the gender, but being sexually attracted to children is sick and immoral, and should be manually and removed from society, with extreme force. >the big majority of pedos don't act on again, if they dont yet, they will.
>>549542746 A sexual orientation is more than that. In vernacular use, yes the target of one's attraction is what defines one's sexual orientation or identity. However, from a more technical, psychosexual standpoint, sexual orientation the expression of one's sexual identity and their attraction to a given biological sex or gender identity; and includes certain norms of behavior and conduct which are common within a given orientation. Classifying pedophilia as a sexual orientation is misleading because pedophilia targets based on age rather than biological sex or gender identity. Moreover, pedophilia does not have any defined common behavioral traits or norms of behavior and conduct which sexual orientations typically exhibit. "Pedosexuality" is a misnomer because it implies that sexual orientation can target other demographic sets such as age or skin color (why not have Afrosexuality?).
From a terminological and linguistic perspective, the "-philia" suffix is more accurate because "-philia" derives from Greek ????? (phileo), which in the context of sexuality refers to an abnormal love or obsession for something. Pedophilia is classified as a sexual disorder due to its addictive properties; therefore, utilizing a suffix which denotes this abnormal, obsessive love for children is appropriate. Pedophilia is the accurate term, not "pedosexuality."
>>549542876 why not both? placating it's sytomps is something to be desired, as long as it doesn't retard the progress of curing the disease.
the question I pose to OP>>549533595 and others that think dolls will help is, does it really placate the symptoms, or does it fuel further desire, and/or add comfort to try it with a real kid; or anything that might cause pedos to be more likely to do it with real kids?
it's a reasonable assumption that it will satisfy the need, placate the symptoms; but it's an assumption nevertheless.
what is really lacking is research on the disease; both what helps alleviate the symptoms, and what can cure it, and what causes it; etc.
but lacking the research; I think like with all other things, in the mean time, we should take the most reasonable assumption position (which is that dolls and other outlets, probably placate the desire, and thus end up preventing child abuse).
>>549543863 That's a stereotype and a generalization. You have no evidence off which you can base this. Additionally, assuming a pedophile has, is, or will abuse a child is discriminatory and prejudicial. There is no point in assuming something so absurd.
>>549544038 How is that a stretch at all? It is the same as not giving a boy child a girl's name. The adult takes into consideration what kind of life he wants his/her child to have and makes decisions accordingly. My boy child would be circumcised for this reason... so no. Not a stretch.
>>549543617 I live in a society where all the other boys his age wear clothes. The only time I would have seen other boys' penises are when using a urinal or during communal showers, and in both cases it was tacitly accepted that you were to avoid the penis' gaze.
>>549544658 No, I get the point you're making. But if your best argument in favor of it is that there's a hypothetical society where everyone is circumcised and flaunting it and if your child is not circumcised they're going to grow up with emotional damage, you've either got a very weak gene pool full of easily damaged people or you need a new argument.
>>549544595 no. all of you pedo scum, shitstains on the glory of the Human race, the splitters of the atom, have or will abuse children, and deserve nothing less than the most painful capital punishment, period.
>>549545029 Besides, paradigms are shifting when one person goes against the grain and all of a sudden that's no longer the traditional thing anymore. Like when girls names would be used for boys for boys names for girls, eventually they become interchangeable.
>>549544543 Not that anon, but I'll field this one anyway.
No, I would not just "fuck someone's 9-year-old kid", as you put it. There are a lot of sexually-satisfying activities that don't involve penetrative intercourse at all.
As for the parents, of course I care about what they would think. It's their fucking child we're talking about here. Hypothetically, if I were in a situation where I could ask for a parent's consent without becoming an automatic pariah, I would definitely not engage in sexual conduct if the child's parents were not okay with it.
I care about a lot of things. I care about helping children to be comfortable with their bodies and their sexuality, and I care about what I want sexually (as do you, I'd bet). As long as I'm not harming my partner physically or emotionally via abusive practices, where's the harm?
I understand I might be being trolled, but what the hell. Let's do this.
Many paedophiles do not understand what it means to be a compassionate, worrying parent and a protector of others. They may never know how it feels to raise a child, to love it, to fear that child being taken away from them unjustly. They do not know the discipline and control needed to educate that child, to teach them right from wrong, to instill a sense of morals and ethics. They will not know the joys of something as simple as a smile, or an A+ on their child's report card, or their child proudly displaying their first car.
Thus, many paedophiles cannot be reasoned with. They know only their selfish, sexual gratification. Instead, revel in the knowledge that what you're reading, is the truth.
To the OP and any person who defends paedophilia, I respect your right to free-speech and the right to argue what you believe are "merits" of said-practice on a forum board.
Know this, however. Were I to meet you on the street and it was conclusive that you were a paedophile who had offended in some manner, shape or form, I would shoot you. I would shoot 50 of you. It's just a fact. I harbour no hatred toward you, just the knowledge that your demise would help create a safer society for our children to explore their innocence and sexuality among themselves.
Know that I am far from a "crazed, lone wacko" in this opinion. Multitudes of rational people would do exactly the same. Live in fear, or seek help. Adapt or perish. Your choice.
>>549545240 im not trying to upset anyone, im calling you out for what you and everyone like you are. scum, and what you deserve, death by fire. >>549545425 thank you, you're doing Humanity a great service.
>>549545425 So, you're just going to ignore >>549545239? You have made a grand total of one single post in which you actually asked a question, and even that question was more of an attack than an actual inquiry. I answered those questions, if only from my point of view (unavoidable, since they were questions regarding personal opinion and conduct).
Hate all you want, but don't act like we aren't trying to be reasonable, which is more than I can say for you and +eXHubv9.
>>549545029 Not a "hypethetical" society. Kids are cruel to each other growing up. They see each other naked in the school showers. They look for things to taunt each other about and if you are different than the other kids, that difference becomes the target. As a parent I would not want my child to have to go through that at an impressionable age where this may repress him sexually or even just give him a complex. Since it is my choice, why would I choose for him to go through that when I can prevent it?
>>549545357 Wow, While i don't agree with you, you def put actual thought and time unto your post. Up until the second to last blob of text. You lost me there and confirmed to be a dickhead. YURR RIGHTS AND YURR GUNNZ.
>>549545610 I asked before, if pedophilia were legal, how would you satisfy your "urges" without going behind the parents back? No parent good or bad would ever let someone fuck their kids, unless theyre as much of a degenerate as the one who wants to have sex with the kid. Youd literally have to lure the kid away
>>549545137 Yes. I think that would be fine. If it was something that we needed to survive or function properly, I would say no, but a pinky finger? If my child was going to be the only one without one, why would I want to subject him to that. He would stand out (like a sore thumb) and this would cause him unnecesary humiliation as people would constantly stare and make comments, or worse.
>>549546010 If it were legal, society as a whole would view it differently. Perhaps the parents would be activity engaging in such activities with them and not mind sharing. Maybe such things could be purchased as services like those you can currently get from adults. There would likely be outlets that did not involve any luring or deceit of unsuspecting parents.
I mean... you could also just find children whose parent didn't want them or who were otherwise out of the picture i supposed. I mean... you COULD...
>>549546094 In the context of that post, most people consider that which they perceive to be abnormal or grotesque to be unnatural. It goes against the order of life, what is right, God's plan, etc.
In the context of pedophilia, there aren't any documented cases of pedophilia in the animal kingdom besides humans. Humans are the only species to practice sexual deviancy like pedophilia. There is no region of the brain that instinctively programs for pedophilia, no gene that causes it, nothing. Unlike homosexuality, pedophilia seems to be strictly an acquired sexual disorder.
>>549546304 That's one thing i don't quite understand to be honest. Why does it need to be fixed? Why is it shameful? If having attraction to someone or something does not hurt anyone, who gives any of the shits available or in circulation for exchange? I cannot relate to the shame or self loathing so i cant speak on this.
>>549546446 You're both assuming the child wouldn't want it on their own. In a society that allows it, it would just be a natural extension of the current children flirting with adults and trying to get their attention, they would simply take it to the next level and be able to date them. As in serious relationships.
The reason I love copypasta is because posting it makes you mad. You. Yeah, that's right. You. You're my target. Your rage fulfils me. Yes, I've posted this before, and I'm going to post it again. And there is nothing you can do to stop me.
Not only am I going to post this over and over and over again, but other anons, seeing the rage posting this produces, are also going to post this. Especially our newfriends. Right now, newfriends are realizing that this actually does make you angry. They realize, like I do, that you think of /b/ as your own private little utopia that gets ruined when the common class stumbles upon it like oblivious tourists.
Well it isn't, you pretentious fucks. This forum is open to the public. It isn't yours. You're nothing special for frequently visiting this place. No one gives a shit that you've seen this before and in fact, they laugh at your grandiose opinion of what this place is. It's just a stupid imageboard. It's not even the first. After frequently visiting Something Awful, Chris Poole consciously decided to make an English Futaba Channel without any thought of how original it might be. So basically, this entire image board is copypasta and you're just a whiny little faggot fuckwit for actually getting angry at complete strangers for failing to entertain you. Go fuck yourself. No, really. Grab a poison-tipped cactus and go fuck yourself. Then go give your mom another hug to compensate for her fat ass not getting any. It's the only way you know how to pay rent.
>>549546643 You really haven't researched before you opened your mouth have you? They said the same thing about homosexuality, that there was no examples of the animal kingdom, and it was overwhelmingly proved that yes there are. And yes there are plenty of documented examples of pedophilia in the animal kingdom.
There are, I think, some documented cases of sexual conduct between adults and children in other species, but there is no evidence that the sexual conduct occurred BECAUSE of sexual attraction toward the children of that given species. Just like some people sexually abuse children despite not being pedophiles, non-human animals can use their respective species' children as sexual tools without actually finding them sexually attractive.
Pedophilia is defined as sexual attraction toward children, not sexual conduct with them.
>>549546393 wow, I pity you that you give so much importance to what others think you should be.
besides you do need both a pinky finger and a foresking to function properly. of course it would be fine if the body part had absolutly no benifit, why not take out something that has no benifit at all if it has a detriment, right? but it does have some benifit, (don't you know that?) that's why you shouldn't take it out. besides even if it didn't have any benifit, I don't see why the parent has authoroty to make a permenant change to the body of it' child if it goes against the will of the child neither does it have any health benifits.
>>549546729 If you can counter the assertion with hard evidence, do so, instead of just saying "nice bait". I'd like to believe that pedophilia is a natural urge, but I haven't seen any data supporting that, at least not in this thread.
To be honest, though, whether or not pedophilia is "natural" concerns me a lot less than whether or not it is inherently harmful. Humans do unnatural things all the time, and prosper by doing so.
>>549546643 Would you let other people engage in sexual acts with your kids if you had them? Im assuming you dont, but if you do, same question? And please dont start spewing shit about consent. Young kids cant consent because they dont have the capabilty to understand what you want to do to them. Theyll say yes to pretty much anything
I do doubt the ability to maintain a romantic relationship with a child while also be part of them "growing up". I think that they will go through their experimental phases meet other people with possible similar interests. I think there is ALOT more room for complication. I dont see how it could in the long term work but i could be totally wrong.
Do you know of any cases where this has happened? Would like to read about it.
>>549546884 And if a tyrannical dictator ran the government, I'd be executed by him for speaking out against harmful policy. That's why I learned how to protect myself from irrational people.
Your views are not based on logic. They're based on emotion. Look at 9mYEZPM1 as an example. That is what a logical, rational opinion looks like. Even if I don't fully agree with it, I can recognize the amount of thought that went into it.
Take away social pressures, law enforcement, make an isolated community that can develop it's own sense of right and wrong, and pedophilia and frank sexual culture emerges. They didn't know they were doing anything wrong for generations, until told so by an outside force. It's an awesome case study.
are you just considering going columbine on everyone from lolicon-ers to malicious fuck your daughter and or son to death serial murderer?
you act like everyone on here was raped by a methy step dad and was neglected, ignored and beaten every day as a child, causing them to act out as an adult to demonstrate their frustrations by reenacting what happened to them upon other children.
what russles my jimmies is that you're classifying doll fuckers and lolicon fans the same as those who are into hurtcore cp and might cum to the thought of killing a child
The fact that pedophilia was the norm for thousand of years, basic biology would tell you it's written in our genes. Some people just have it more expressed than others just like any trait handed down. Though also, some can be created into pedos just as you can be born one.
Do people not know basic nature/nurture biology and basic history? Same shit with homosexuality, it's been happening for thousands of years also, so yea, it's also written in our genes.
But you're absolutely right. It would be very complicated. I know from personal experience having a long-term relationship while growing up is exceedingly difficult. As you grow what you need and want changes very rapidly to the point where a long-term relationship doesn't work in most cases. You just grow to Like and want different things.
Poor argument. Adults are just as easily influenced as a child. Only difference is presentation. Ffs retard this is 4chan, never had a sheeple debate before? Bandwagon debate? Adults hardly need convincing to be persuaded, they're just as stupid as children.
>>549547805 Again, do you have any links to the study or information you're talking about on Pitcairn Islands? I'd like to read, not because i doubt what you are saying but because i find the subject interesting.
>>549533595 how about this OP if you think pedophilia is a sexual orientation you should be getting pounded in the ass anyways thats a stupid thing to think. No one is born a deviant OP you made yourself one and now you deal with the consequences
>>549546951 FFS it didn't go through, so I have to retype it.
Stop comparing homosexuality and research on it with pedophilia. They are two separate and largely independent facets of human sexuality which demand different parameters of analysis. Yes, homosexual conduct has been documented in over 188 different species of animals and in a handful of species, homosexuality can be seen as a sexual orientation, where some animals in the species prefer sexual conduct with other animals of its species of the same sex.
However, with pedophilia there is no known record of this. There is not a single documented case of any animal of any species displaying pedophilic sexual preferences, pedophilia being defined as sexual attraction toward prepubescent children of a given species. Yes, there are documented cases of sexual conduct between adults and children of multiple species, but there is no evidence that the conduct was committed because the adult was sexually attracted to the child. Just as some people sexually abuse children while still not being pedophiles, so can non-human animals in the animal kingdom. Thus far, all occurrences of sexual conduct between adults and children of a given species have been with the adult exhibiting sexual behaviors largely indiscriminate of age, or even in favor of adults of that species. In other words, every documented case of sexual conduct between an adult and a child of a given species has been with the adult displaying no significant preference toward children, and conducted sexual activities with fellow adults of the same species as well.
>>549548519 Provide me with a single case in which the adult animal showed a sexual preference for prepubescent children of the same species, which would indicate a pedophilic attraction. Any other sexual conduct between adults and children of the same species can be assumed to be simply general sexuality among the group. What matters is the preference. That's how they determined some animals were homosexual: they predominantly sought sex with same-sex animals of their species. When has there ever been a non-human animal that has displayed predominant sexual activity with children of its same species?
>>549548317 open your eyes, dude it´s barely a century ago that it was still absolutely normal to marry pre-adults, even in the socalled civilized parts of the world. and it was absolutely normal until then ... aaaaall the fucking time since mandkind exists
>>549547138 No, I wouldn't. I believe that although my child can consent to sexual conduct at any age, he or she cannot provide informed consent (legal or otherwise) until they are at least 13 years of age. I personally would discourage sex in my children until 16 or 17.
>>549548181 Not once they wake up. Once a drug is developed to "treat" an "illness" like pedophilia or homosexuality. That is all those reference books are for; make up and/or change criteria, create an "illness" and then provide a pill. Read some Thomas Szasz, his work is not easily dismissed.
>>549547163 Bonobos are a good example - each individual regularly mates with all members of its group, regardless of age or sex. This is a form of social bonding for them, helping them resolve conflicts without the need for violence. It is obviously not done for reproduction, since they mate with individuals of the same sex and those too young to breed.
In stoats, males will enter nests of newborns whilst the mother is absent and mate with all the females in the litter. Their eggs are fertilised, but do not implant and complete development until the females have grown up and left the nest. This is a way of getting a head start on breeding for a small, vulnerable animal that often does not live very long.
Many species have social systems that have evolved to prevent or at least minimize incest, as this is usually detrimental. For example, male lions leave the pride they were born into when they reach sexual maturity, and attempt to take over another, unrelated pride - this prevents them mating with their female relatives. Females remain in the pride they were born into all their lives, but the tenure of males is usually only two to three years, so by the time they reach sexual maturity their father will have been overthrown by new males, thus preventing them breeding with him.
That said, incest certainly does occur in the animal kingdom. Many animals will mate with their relatives if no other mate is available - indeed, humans commonly mate related animals for the purpose of selective breeding, where they wish to 'fix' a particular characteristic in the animals. In some species, incest is actually the normal method of reproduction - in certain species of wasp, for example, males mate with their sisters as soon as they have hatched.
See fucking google, nimrod, and go live with Man's close cousin, the Bonobos.
>>549533595 there is some evidence to show that "fake" child porn (artist rendered, cgi, animated... etc) reduces the likelihood of sexual predation because it provides a sufficient outlet for the sexual urges.
>>549547681 So, how does it feel being an obvious product of a right-winged baby-boomer and/or an actual boomer? Dipshit.
OP, you make some valid points, and no one -should- be prosecuted for being born a certain way. As a homo, I definitely wouldn't want to live somewhere that prosecutes gays. However, pesos have a pretty shitty track-record of rape, so I'm not inclined to just trust them like that, or do anything to help them fulfill their disgusting fantasies. However, the social strain of people who are born that way and will never actually harm kids does need to stop, but so does actual fucking raping. You make good points, but I'm not on-board.
>>549548286 >No you don't. well, if you think that, no wonder you think it's OK to circumsize and chop off pinky fingers just to fit in. try writing on a keyboard without your pinky fingers. and foreskin serves to protect the very sensitive gland from both external forces, and pathological microrganisms FYI.
> A baby cannot make the decision of how it wants to live it's life
a baby /= a kid going to school showers, etc. a kid that goes to school shared showers, etc can and does make decisions all the time. besides just because the kid could not make the decision doesn't make the parent automatically able either. does it ever occur to you that neither has the authority?
>this entire discussion is out of place here
true dat, so maybe just leave it? thread is almost dead anyway
>>549547657 Never in history, aside from very special occasions such as prearranged marriages which did not even evolve sexual conduct and were strictly political, has society condoned pedophilia. Sexual activity among prepubescent children, which is typically most children under the age of 10 or 12, has never been socially acceptable. Marrying pubescent adolescents was commonplace, yes, but that is far from pedophilia.
There is no known gene, nor is there any specific region of any known animal's brain, that programs for pedophilia. Thus far, pedophilia is understood as being strictly an acquired sexual disorder.
>>549533734 But it can't be compared with an addiction. No one chooses their sexuality, whereas addicts once became addicted. If pedos have an ethical outlet, such as dolls, it logically follows that fewer sex crimes are committed.
Fucking dolls is just as victimless as is playing GTA or watching movies that depict crime. If you want lolicon or dolls banned, you are essentially advocating thought crime.
>>549549215 We used to chemically castrate gays. We still chemically castrate pedos. Instead of calling people mentally ill for what they jack off to, I think society would be better off if we drop stigma and just deal with things in a mature and reasonable way. But people are functionally retarded and dealing with things in a sensible way takes a generation.
>>549549110 >Thus far, pedophilia is understood as being strictly an acquired sexual disorder.
It is acquired like homosexuality. Through genetic disposition with early childhood experiences probably triggering the inevitable. No one chooses their sexuality, discriminating someone based on who he feels attracted to is just as silly as racism. Not all pedophiles are child molesters.
what logic? I made no logical argument at all, I simply asked for the source of a statement, and said what I believed to be the true version of that statment. I made no mention of what should or shouldn't be. trigger happy much?
>>549548796 comparing being a homosexual to being a pedo is pointless because studys show it's a choice to be a homosexual it's the ones who think they were born like that that may have something wrong with them
although the chance to figure out if you're into women or men or both most gay people are given is just another ticket of proof that it's a choice
>>549549289 >but don't try to pass off you being a pedo as ok.
Being a pedo already is ok according to most cultures. No country has made being attracted to kids criminal. Punishing for thought crimes would make no sense, since fantasies alone hurt no one. Explain to me how a non-offending pedophile is hurting anybody. If they aren't, why is it not okay to be one?
Anyone think that pedophilia could come along much the same way criminality within the ranks of law enforcement/authority comes along? Just like drugs as a teen? Just like theft as a kid?
You get told all your life this is bad and thats that. And you tell your self it's bad, end of discussion. Then your mind wonders and you think, when is it right? When is it less bad? Are there cases that aren't as bad as others? Sexually frustrated preists? Poor police? Stressed military? Anti gays who have their own issues?
I think it's partly a societal thing. I used to zoom past loli threads for the longest time. Now it has me worries that I'm in there either lurking or talking to posters. I find it terrifying that I am in there and I know that it's common for people to eventually want that forbidden fruit. Really scares the piss out of me.
>>549549335 >For the last time, stop comparing homosexuality to pedophilia. They are entirely separate facets of human sexuality that are largely independent of each other demand different parameters to analyze.
Neither homosexual nor a pedophile can choose their sexuality. Also, neither sexuality harms anybody per se. Sure, child molestation is harmful, but "pedophile" doesn't mean "child molester".
If the argument for gays is that they don't harm anybody. Neither do law-abiding pedophiles. Still, they are somehow considered monsters.
Whether it's condemned or not you fckin tard is irrelevant. The lust for children was normal for males because at that time it was normal to marry them off young. Obviously I'm speaking more so 12+ had not like 6-9 dumbass but the lust which is the perception for one/child existed for thousand of years before people started to see it differently. That lust is written into the genes. Whether it's been found or not matters not kid, for the outcome will keep happening irregardless of science discovery of it. Fckin get your head in reality tard.
>>549549323 it wasn't socially acceptable. especially penetrative acts of any kind. there was a practice (i can't remember the name of it) but it involved the older male basically using the adolescent's thighs to reach orgasm. the whole context of this practice was as teacher/pupil and the relationship was referred to as "beloved" without romantic associations. there are tons of myths surrounding the practice in ancient greece but pedophilia was a huge offense as was any sort of penetrative act. they were literally supposed to be platonic relationships. the borders of "sexual behavior" were defined differently in the place and time so whatever that act was called between the teacher/pupil that involved the teacher using the pupils thighs was not considered sex but merely an act of affection. sort of like hugging...
source: focused on ancient greek philosophy in undergrad and fav prof was an expert in ancient greek history/culture.
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