>there's only ever been 11 Ironman matches in the WWE

HHH vs Benoit 2004 Raw

>>2829597
Rock vs. HHH at Judgment Day. Nothing else even compares. I mean come on...nothing else even compares.

>>2829605

It was the first main event I can remember seeing and it started my interest in wrestling. It was exciting but I can't help but think that an Ironman match between two technicians with a back-and-forth scoring would make for a dramatic match.

Like the heel goes 2-0 up in a squash but with 15 minutes to go the face scores a couple of surprise reversal pins while appearing to be exhausted and then wins 3-2 with a late final pin.

I'm gonna exclude the women ones, the tag ones, the 30 min submission one (fantastic as it was), and the 30 min normal one. That leaves 5, of which I've seen the first 4. This is how I rank them.

Bret-Shawn: 6*
Kurt-Brock: 4.5*
Benoit-Trips: 4*
Rock-Trips: 2.75*

I love Rock, and his and Trips's character rivalry. Great mic/personality chemistry. But I personally feel it never translated to the ring. Their matches were always a disappointment. Always less than the sum of its parts. Bad ring chemistry, the styles never meshed. Mainly because Rock rolls around in agony for 90% of most of his matches. So Trips slowly beating him up with boring punches was never very exciting. For 60 minutes, even less so.

The middle two ratings are self explanatory, I'm sure most here would give them something similar.

As for Bret-Shawn, I know many here don't like it. I can't fathom why. It was fantastic, varied wrestling for 60 minutes, and never slowed down much (all the others did).

For those who shit on the finish, I thought the same thing when I was a babby. Why have an ironman match if it ends 0-0? Later I realised why: Bret was such a mark for himself that the only way he would drop the title is if it were a draw after 60 minutes. He would lay down for Shawn in overtime, but in his mark head he could say to himself "nah, I wasn't REALLY beaten, a draw after 60 means a draw, I keep the title. The overtime timeline isn't canon :^".

Ok?, I hear you ask. But why 0-0, wouldn't a score draw have been better? Yes, but again Bret Mark wasn't gonna lay down for the first pin because that defeats his whole rationale for overtime. And it wouldn't look legit if the new babyface champ had to eat the first pin. 0-0 then overtime was clearly a compromise between Vince and Bret. Vince got to give Shawn his first run, and Bret Mark could save face in his own head.

>>2829886
Bret-Shawn

1 hour bore with no falls. 1/10th drama of Rock/HHH.

>>2829886
I'm not going to read your essay but Bret vs HBK was the most boring match I have ever seen

>Steamboat-Flair, Flash 6 (2 out of 3 falls, technically not an Ironman but it goes 55 minutes so fuck it) >Steamboat-Rude, Beach Blast (30 minutes)

>>2829893
For that match to have taken place at Mania, you couldn't tell with how bad the lighting was.

>>2829886
>As for Bret-Shawn, I know many here don't like it. I can't fathom why. It was fantastic, varied wrestling for 60 minutes, and never slowed down much (all the others did).
They are my two favorite in-ring workers ever, so watching them perform for 60+ minutes is fucking incredible, but I can see why others wouldn't enjoy it as much.

>>2829886
>Bret-Shawn: 6*

Jesus Christ man, how was that a 6*? That match seemed to completely miss the potential in an ironman match, there was no need to make people wait for 55 minutes of no pins just for the ending.

>>2829886
>Rock-Trips: 2.75*
That match is a perfect Attiude Era Ironman match. It's over the top, lots of falls, shenanigans, run ins. I love it. It's like Austin-Dude Love from Over the Edge '98 except 60 minutes. Just a really fun match. I'm shocked at the low rating.

>>2829886
>Bret was such a mark for himself that the only way he would drop the title is if it were a draw after 60 minutes.

Even if we assume this was the case, it didn't need to end 0-0, it could've ended 3-3 with the tide turning repeatedly between the two for the better part of the hour. For that reason you're probably assuming wrong.

>>2829891
>>2829893
Fair's fair. It's all subjective. But tickled my personal taste buds, and any Rock-Trips matches never did.

>>2829904
mah nigga

>>2829905
Read the post for my theory on why it was booked like that.

>>2829910
Like I said, Bret (and Shawn, I'm not defending his later antics) were marks for themselves. A score draw wouldn't work because both were marks for themselves and so in their mark heads, the first fall would be the definitive one. Bret obv didn't want to lay down for the first fall within the 60 mins, and Vince didn't want his new champ tainted with losing the first fall. It must have been a compromise. Vince gets a shiny new, legit champion. Bret keeps his pride in his own way.

Because otherwise, I'm in agreement with everyone here; what the fuck is the point of an Ironman match of its 0-0 after 60. The only way out makes sense to me is what I've been saying. It wouldn't even surprise me if Bret came up with the whole ironman match idea, not just the finish.

>>2829886
>giving fake fights star ratings
Spotted the mark.

>>2830153
>Giving fake movies star ratings
>Giving fake TV shows star ratings
>Giving fake stage plays star ratings
>Giving fake music albums star ratings
Do you see yet how retarded your logic is or should I keep going?
All creative arts can be critiqued, regardless of whether they are 'real' or not.
Please learn to form your own judgements and opinions and stop parroting shit you hear out of touch hacks and never weres regurgitate on a weekly basis begging for attention., khtxbai

>>2829933
>It wouldn't even surprise me if Bret came up with the whole ironman match idea, not just the finish.

Good job admitting you know nothing on this subject

>>2830157
What the fuck is a fake music album?

Movies shouldn't be given star ratings either, it's stupid.

>>2829886
>Bret-Shawn: 6*
Sleeperhold-fest. Like 30 minutes of it was just them rolling around on the mat. The last minute was greatness, though. 3.5*

>Kurt-Brock: 4.5*
Same

>Benoit-Trips: 4*
Great storytelling, great pacing, great working. Haitch wasn't in the best shape of his life, so you can see him getting kind of tired by the ending. 4.75*

>Rock-Trips: 2.75*
I think they had great chemistry in the ring. Haitch's ring general style worked well with Rock's showmanship style. It's also the most fast-paced iron man match and really kept me on my toes. Aside from the ending and Undertaker chokeslamming HHH after the buzzer, this was a 5* match.

An Ironman match with more than 3 falls in it completely delegitimises both workers by making them look weak, bret/Shawn and to a lesser extent Brock/Kurt are the only good examples of the match type.

In any promotion?

Tie between Haitch vs Rock and Mundo vs Puma

They were all shit

>>2830175
>What the fuck is a fake music album?
He thinks rappers don't play characters.

>>2829886
> completely missing the whole point of bret vs shawn
The whole story was that they were so evenly matched no one could break the deadlock
Come on mark

>>2829602
this

Mundo vs Puma

orton and cena you fucking plens

>>2829908
>It's like Austin-Dude Love from Over the Edge '98

Except one match has Foley/Austin and the other Rock/HHH.

>>2830157
Except those ratings are done by groups of people with prestige, not one hack who has never stepped foot inside a ring and couldn't keep their father alive.

triple h and rock
cena and randy

>>2833600
>being this mad he didn't give your fave an undeserved 5 snowflakes