Eternal HEMA General

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>>1955817

I'm currently doing mt, and I love it, but I have one regret : I'm way too old to compete.
I'm not looking down at all on HEMA, but I came here to ask : is there any kind of fencing/kendo whatever that you could get good at despites age? Of course in any sport I guess youth will have a certain advantage, but I'm guessing, maybe wrong, that this kind of sports has an easier gap to fill for someone who's nearing 40.


Other question : what are the general recommandations for a beginner? I don't even know what are the big schools, what to chose, their difference, etc.

>>1957805
The longer the weapon the higher the peak age. But unless your obsessive (like putting in multiple hours a day on your own) you will always struggle to hold your own with people who started as children/teenagers

>>1957916
But to be fair, HEMA is still pretty niche in the grand scheme of things, so there aren't that many people who started as kids.

At least in America. It's more established in Europe, so maybe there's more over there.

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>>1955817
Reposting the highlights of the saber matches from Swordfish

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>>1958228

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>>1958236

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>>1958239
And the last one.

Guys, do saber, it's fun!

>>1955817
THREAD REMINDER THAT ITALIAN A SHIT

>t. silver

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It's on the way, can't wait to read it!

Also I'm gonna scan and upload it and translate it to english some time later (unless someone's more up to the task)

>>1958342
Mate I can only get so erect.

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would a claymore (pic related, not the baskethilt broadsword) be used like a longsword? could longsword fencing be used with a claymore?

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>>1958922
figured id put this here

>>1958922
It's essentially the same yes.

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>>1958922
Silver would Dürrer me for this, but yes, it is the same.

>>1958922
We really don't know. It likely had elements of longswords and montante-ish techniques involved. But that's just a guess. It was used by both individuals and bodyguards, pointing to a similar functionality as the montante or it's German equivalent.

How well Meyer's rappier do against Bolognese sidesword?

>>1955852
>>1955867
from which manual are these from?

>>1957805
Yea we have beginners in their 40s all the time at my club and anyone can compete in HEMA.

The general recommendation is your local club. Completely worth doing.

You're average HEMA class is easier than your average MT class except maybe on the knees but you're 40 years old you know when to take it easy by now.

We have a guy in his mid 50s at our club.

>>1959431
Matt Galas, Jacques Blom, nuff said.
Some old goats are really tough.

>>1957805
how old are most competitors in Hema? most Kendo champs are in their thirties, but you still hear top people being beaten by guys twice their age in regular practice,

>>1959506
I'd say late 28-35 are probably a mans HEMA prime.

Now that people are starting their teens or even younger that might start to descend but yea age isn't much of a big deal in a fighting form that can be so varied with style.

>>1959506
same same, you peak around 30, sometimes earlier if you started out young. old guys lack stamina for tournaments, in a 1 vs. 1 they still can beat you because you don't suddenly stop being good.

If anything I think it's the motivation that goes rather than the stamina. I mean I'm early 20s and work a shitty job that lets me train all the time. Not HEMA every time but I'm on top of my fitness. Whereas the older dudes who are easily better than me I feel I keep up with them only because they have kids and spouses and careers that stop them training as much as i do.

>>1959515
>>1959513
For kendo its closer to mid thrities at least as far as tornaments go.

For longer weapons like naginata its fourties where as weapons like kusarigama the best guys are fifty or older

in regular practice however you always here stories of younger guys being dominated by elderly teachers. One kendo guy said he could win by taking cheap shots but that wouldn't impress anyone or develop his skills

>>1959156
The sword specifically or the techniques? It's hard to tell exactly where along the rapier-side sword spectrum Meyer's weapon is, but the system definitely seems closer to the latter. As in most comparisons like this, though, it would probably just come down to the skill of the fencer.

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>>1959046
>>1958284
Can someone make a better one of these please so I can troll raperists?

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BTW a friend and I have been working on Silver's sword and buckler. It's basic af but works; faster to learn than I.33, Litzeger, or Bolognaise.

Also I just realised today that Silver's "Forehand Ward" in a ducking "Medium" or "Unicorn". Mind blown.

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>>1962611
>tfw can't do Spadroon Guard or defend my inside leg with a low cut in Quarte because of wrist and elbow bone issues

Being mechanically sub optimal sucks desu farm
I'm gonna go re-draw the plates so they're a bit clearer.

>>1958242
combat, roll, seriously ? was that just a suprise thing, or something even remotely practical ?

>>1962662
he was winning so I guess he tried some fancy bullshit, not even remotely practical but fun to watch

>>1962662
>>1962679
It may have been a throwback to Ilkka's roll from 2011, or whenever.

>>1962610
I didn't realize Silver had sword and buckler stuff. I've been meaning to start doing some of that, and a simple system might be good for a beginner. Any other comments/suggestions you'd make about it?

>>1962610
Wasn't it "just use the buckler as if it was a dagger?"

i want to start learning longsword.
who/where should i start learning the guards and cuts?

>>1958342
Think I love you

>>1962786
Join a club, period.

>>1963093
speaking of which

i'll be moving to the Denver area soon, are there any anons that can speak to the local clubs?
thinking about these guys
https://kriegschool.com/

>>1958239
Do you know what cause theses sparks ? never saw theses in all my sparring.

>>1963219
Sadly no clue but there was another saber fight at Swordfish with sparks.
I'd like to know too what exactly has to be done to create sparks

>>1963236
It's just burring on the blades little flecks of metal get scraped off as they essentially saw over each other.

>>1963115
Krieg is great, we have sparred with them numerous times in tournaments in the West.

Avoid Meg Floyd though (The hambeast in the group picture). Just trust me.

Check /k/

>>1965304
my comfy sword thread died ;_;
you mean the spear thread?

>>1965318
Better start comfy sword threads on /his/, you get less mall ninja swords and more quality posts. BY and large, /k/ is for Cold Steel's main customer group.

>>1965304
>>1965318
>>1965325

Fiore's weird sword-pollaxe-thing

>>1965349
Yes, try /his/, /k/ is pleb tier.

>>1965368
>>1965325
Now also on /his/

>>1965325
>>1965368
Is it though? Less mall ninjas, but it seems like a less active board and it seems to have its own fair share of plebs from what I've seen.

All the knowledgeable seem to float between /k/ and /tg/ anyways. Don't know if /his/ is included in that.

>>1958342
When was it written, btw?

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>>1962730
>Wasn't it "just use the buckler as if it was a dagger?"
It was, but we cheated a bit by using other sources like McBane and Miller.
I'd love to get my hands on Archibald MacGregor's "Lecture on the Art of Defence".

>>1962717
>I didn't realize Silver had sword and buckler stuff.
He has a whole chapter on it :P
>Any other comments/suggestions you'd make about it?
Yes. Firstly be aware that the "system" isn't as codified or intricate as other buckler sources. It's much more open to "interpretation".

Secondly, it's important to note that Silver was speaking about a baskethilted weapon, and the buckler that was common at the time were called Welsh Buckler and were (on average) over a foot wide. Picture related.

Thirdly, go here: http://www.sirwilliamhope.org/Library/Silver/SilverModern.php
Copy Chapter 7-8, "Of the short sword & dagger fight..." and "Of the short sword & dagger fight against the long sword & dagger...", into a word document.
Now replace the word "dagger" with "buckler".

And Lastly, it is important that you follow Silver's Principles and Rules (e.g. Strike and Fly Out). The biggest bit of advice I can give is this: Fight as though you held no buckler, except for when you cross/bind/ward then by all means if you can reach you opponent by leaning forward slightly you should supress/bind/strike their weapon with your buckler and attack simultaneously.

There's heaps more, but that should get you started.

>>1965349
Which one? The one that launches its head at you and ties you up like a meteor-hammer, or the one that shoots face melting acid?

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>>1962717
>>1965484
Hold your normal guard like picture related.

That is to say, with a straight but not locked arm hold out your buckler so you can see over it. Do likewise for your sword if it's light enough, but if it's heavier then bend your elbow more so as that it comes to rest on/near your hip. Place the last third or quarter of the false-edge of your sword obliquely against the buckles rim, making sure your wrist it turned outwards firmly. Incline your point somewhat toward their left eye, and allow a natural angle of comfort to happen so as that you can rest at ease. In this position we have found your entire right side is closed off.

Note that they're Right Leg (RL) forward, that's valid for some positions, passes or later Stage Gladiator stuff.
You'll however want to hold your Left Leg (LL) forward as that tend to be the "natural" way. However if you feel more at ease RL forward, do so.

>A Few More Hints:
- Don't EVER block your view of your opponent with your buckler.
- Learn to slip your leg and defend it with either true or false edge as needs be.
- Unlike other systems where the buckler MUST protect the shorthand, Silver's allows for much more separation of the two. However one can and should attack with both together when needed.

>>1965471
afaik about ~1890, I found different years when looking for "Unterricht im Säbelfechten" and "Die Fechtkunst"

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Picture for the Spear vs. Buckley dude from the last thread.
Yes technically one is a targe[t], however the principles are similar.

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Also recommend EVERYONE to do an eight week course (or 20 hours) of foil at your local fencing club.

I then did the same for a local kendo club.

Now I'm halfway through a Highland Dance and Swing course/s.

My footwork level has jumped exponentially.
>tfw hitting from the True Place where they can't hit you in a Longwood tournament.
>tfw their trippy-tappy, linear, pseudo-lunge footwork can't help them when I'm not in front of them.

>>1965538
>Also recommend EVERYONE to do an eight week course (or 20 hours) of foil at your local fencing club.
There is none ;_;
I've started watching a few basic footwork drills for sport fencing, it looks far better than anything existing in HEMA yet (obviously since sport fencing is 'older').
I guess doing actual fencing in a club would be better but maybe I'll still learn a few new things

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>>1965545
Sport fencing drills are pretty damn good.
They've definitely been codified and standardised for longer, but as far back as the 1800's people were "re-creating" Gladiator fights, Rapier and dagger, broadswords and sabre, shortstaff and bastion...

I would ask you to note though that sport fencing footwork has a direct applicability to smallsword and rapier, BUT don't get blindsided by the ease with which they do it. On a piste I've been wrecked every time, but the moment I can start circling and using either foot forward is the moment I have a great equaliser.

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>>1965545
Also try a Kendo club.
Similar footwork applicability.

Hell, even gung-Fu and tail-chi can teach you something.

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>>1965545
>>1965538
Just to step in as the HEMA defence force not all HEMA clubs start from scratch.

My club is full of and instructed by veteran sports fencers as with most of the big clubs and the footwork for sports fencing isn't 'far better than anything existing in HEMA' it's just more limited. Look at sports fencers training on rough terrain outdoors and the limitations start to become more evident. Let alone when they're presented with a Longsword.

That said the more practice and more training the better. Sports fencing footwork isn't necessarily better but their footwork, timing and distance TRAINING almost universally is but that's simply because they have (or make) time to train it while most HEMA clubs especially those on the shittier end neglect footwork and athleticism too much as their hungry for more sword action and ever more complicated techniques.

It's definitely worth doing some sport fencing for the experience but mostly for balance and lunging drills to train at home rather than direct application in Longsword. I was literally just watching this:
https://www.olympicchannel.com/en/playback/hitting-the-wall/episodes/can-buff-dude-brandon-myles-survive-enzo-leforts-fencing-workout/

...and videos like these help me alot brainstorming for more drills I can do at home or at the gym without a partner.

Alot of the feints and tactics that excel in Epee and Saber are completely useless against an opponent who can effectively defend himself and much of the aggressive footwork is suicidal.

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>>1965488
neither the one nor the other, it's some sort of panzerstecher with spikes everywhere and a weird sliding ring.
now sombebody is answering on /his/ so I suggest to go see there

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>>1965545
Also visualise success and accurate, flawless technique as you go to sleep.
I've found it's better than counting sheep and does have some effect irl.

Also, this boss right here >>1965565

>>1965577
Looks like a pretty standard duelling sword that's been modified from a boar hunting sword for use in armoured judicial duels desu senpai

>>1965565
>>1965594
Right, I've worded it wrong.
"far better than anything existing in HEMA yet" FROM WHAT I'VE SEEN!

I'm in one of those 'Footwork, Oberhau, Unterhau done in 30 minutes now lets do the Meisterhäue' clubs, it's not bad and actually quite fun but pretty much everyone lacks in the very basics except for those who are in for 10+ years and worked it out themselves (although it's still far from perfect).
Now I'm trying to work out some of the basics to hopefully improve the others

>>1965653
How many times a week does your club train?

>>1965656
3 times
monday - sparring (but trying new techniques or cross-sparring is also ok)
wednesday - beginners
friday - advanced techniques

>>1965484
>>1965528
Thanks for the info.

>He has a whole chapter on it :P
Well, to be fair, I haven't really looked at any of his stuff before; it's later period than I'm generally interested in. The baskethilt makes sense, with that in mind, though I've seen people doing Lignitzer and I.33 with pretty big bucklers, too.

>>1965594
>>Looks like a pretty standard duelling sword that's been modified from a boar hunting sword for use in armoured judicial duels desu senpai
It actually features a ring free to slide along the blade, which is something I've never seen in any find, nor can I guess its use

>>1965538
The nearest club only do epee. I did it before HEMA but I didn't learn much, but that's because I was a kid in a kid class. Better than nothing, btw, at least I learnt the HEMA fundamentals faster than most of the other noobs of my club.

>>1965529
Thanks. That's cool.

where can i, online, find a list of translated work from Joachim Meyer's Longsword, specifically regarding the master guards and cuts?

I'm looking through the links in the OP, but they seem to all lead to dead ends.

Best feder source for Canadians?

>>1966633
http://wiktenauer.com/wiki/Joachim_Me%C3%BFer

>>1966970
This might interest you for made in canada:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nKXGnVmWds8

Bit crude aesthetically for me though.

>>1967027
Though no the prettiest, I've used Garth's trainers and they are well built and affordable.

>>1965772
Do you know it's a movable ring and not a fixed loop?
Like the kind they use on ahlspiess and poleaxe, the usually have a gap and aren't flush with the haft.

desu I think if it does indeed move, it's just so your hand doesn't run up and over the point when you halfsword (granted very widely), and so that when you mordshlag/use like poleaxe it (again) means your hand won't off or your weapon slide out.

>>1965708
Careful, dude is trolling you about the chapter. He literally spends four sentences saying >>1962730 except that a buckle is safer and more English.

>>1965665
>3 times pw
Breh, we're so pressed for time down here that we have the same format, but in 1 hour blocks on the same day.
18:30 Beginners.
19:30 Intermediate
20:30 Advanced/Experimental

>>1965919
>teaches epee straight away
>with no foundational instruction in foil
>literally the foils purpose
ishygddt

>>1967488
Well, there was a little foil before epee, but it was a crash course of a few lessons with plastic foils. Definitely not enough to really count as a foil course. In the end the club closed because it was pretty bad.

>>1967476
Fiore himself wrote the ring can slide

>>1957805
I went to SERFO last week and like 70% of the people kicking ass were over 40. You'll be fine.

>>1968322
Out of curiosity, was this just in longsword, or in other/additional weapons as well?

>Gdansk Gambeson PRO
>Axel Pettersson (the standard one)
which one is better for longsword, Messer and saber?

>>1969963
strongly depends on which one fits you better and your personal need for hard scale protection.
For many builds the AP offers better movement, is lighter and cheaper but for heavy fighting you need to add protection by lower arm /ellbow guards and either padded pants or a skirt.
Do you have the opportunity to try them in a shop?

>>1969963
I think you cant go wrong with either.
The real question here isnt what weapon you train in, but what kind of trainers you use and the way those trainers are used.
Rawlings synthetics ? Black Fencer? Steel Feders? Steel blunts?

Usually the hands are much more prone to injury than the torso, so as a tip, consider gloves even more carefully than your torso protection.

Ah damn, just saw that you listed the standard AP jacket.
If you want reasonably compare, choose the Pro version, the hard-shelled protectors make a world of difference.
From my personal experience, the standard version work for Rawlings synthetics / sparring. Either harder trainers (Black Fencer etc,) different material trainers (steel, wood) and different environments (tournament) are not safe.
That covers mostly strikes, as thrusts depend a lot more on the specific trainer you use, and less on the intensity of the thrust. It either flexes enough or it doesnt.

>>1970039
>That covers mostly strikes, as thrusts depend a lot more on the specific trainer you use, and less on the intensity of the thrust. It either flexes enough or it doesnt.
wear a plastron for steel

>>1970009
>>1970014
>>1970039
>>1970051
Thanks guys, we're using steel feders (Berbekucz) and synthetic sabers (Blackfencer).

>Do you have the opportunity to try them in a shop?
Sadly no, but I've tried the standard AP jacket and liked it but I'm not sure if it's really enough protection...

Maybe I'll actually try the AP pro, looks like a good compromise between mobility and protection! Although it's the most expensive one...

where does a man get gloves for longsword?

thinking about the Absolute Force gloves, but the reviews are negative (not that i havent liked things with bad reviews before), but the others are either ugly or expensive.

do i just suck it up and spend the sheckles? does anyone have experience with the AF gloves?

>>1966988
bless you

>>1970653
>Absolute Force gloves
They're shit. Suck it up and get the ugly/expensive ones.

>>1965594
>and does have some effect irl.

Mental imaging is an effective technique for pretty much any athletic endeavor.

If you aren't doing it in addition to you're actual physical training, you're ignoring a really good tool.

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/02/23/sports/olympics/olympians-use-imagery-as-mental-training.html?_r=0

It's something one of my fight coaches promoted a lot as a tool. And it's helped me both in wrestling and fighting. It's also something I use for Judo.

Of course by itself it's worth less than a warm pile of dog shit. But in addition to a good skill program, a good conditioning program (built around your sport, but including good general conditioning), and watching a lot of video, it's a valuable tool.

>itt: the gradual shift of jackets suitable for blossfechten to basically suits of armour that people think are suitable for blossfechten

You guys are ducking idioms. The more protection you use (e.g. AP Pro) the more it affects your mentality towards blossfechten.

If you want to do harnischfecten then by all means buy a suit of actual armour (hell, even the AP Pro, St. Marks, et al.), but don't tell me you're doing unarmoured stuff when you're wearing the equivalent of ACL/BoTN equipment.

Goldman, it's the reason you see so much sloppiness in tournaments and training! People's hands floating out in front of them, leaving massive openings (and not in a "this is bait" sorta way), all because they're relying on their gear to protect them.

To prove a point, at a local comp we had I used armoured Longwood techniques exclusively whilst wearing (and other doing so as well) the "maximum safety" level kit. Everyone complained that I was cheating, but as I pointed out I couldn't feel their hits, nor if I did did they rattle me enough for my lizard brain to consider not diving in and stabbing them in the armpit.
And you know what? Instead of thinking "Geez, maybe I should improve my techniques" the fucking bitched about NOT HAVING ENOUGH PROTECTION. Their armpits. Not enough protection.
Jesus.

I beat everyone via submission while they mewled about "B-but m-muh points, muh hand sniping..."

I get safety is important, but IMO this progression towards Goldman exoskeletons for playing with sportified versions of the real steel versions is getting absurd.

/rant

>>1972833
>I couldn't feel their hits, nor if I did did they rattle me enough for my lizard brain to consider not diving in and stabbing them in the armpit
I'm a little confused; did you dive in and attack them after they already hit you?

And as for complaining about not having enough protection, do you object to people wearing heavy gloves, too? Are they pussies for not wanting to break their fingers if they fuck up a technique?

>>1972833
Then do alternative styles to foster the "not wanting to get hit" attitude that use other trainers.
I do Dog Brothers-esque stick fighting besides longsword. Fencing mask and gloves, t-shirt during summer and sweater during winter. Thats how I keep myself from the aforementioned attitude towards hits or double hits.

>>1972949
>Are they pussies for not wanting to break their fingers if they fuck up a technique?
Then they should train more.
When I see novices with SPES Heavy gloves training, not sparring, training I get furious.

>>1972833
Preach.

HEMAs full of gear queers in it as a shopping exercise as much as skill development.

That said it has led to some great equipment for the rest of us regardless.

The only real downside is that competition sparring is almost certainly increasingly straying far away from actual sharp sword sparring.

>>1973356
It's hard to train with broken fingers, you fucking retard. If I'm working with a beginner I'll generally want more protection, since they might do something stupid and unexpected. The only problem here seems to be people like you who refuse to acknowledge hits and rush in for afterblows.

>>1973358
>straying far away from actual sharp sword sparring
Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, but I don't think that's what tournaments are/should be for. Matches there aren't like real sword fights, and that's OK. They're opportunities to test yourself under high pressure with an opponent you can be sure isn't cooperating. This is accomplished not by simulating a real fight with sharps, but by using the tournament structure to give the matches some real weight and to make people really want to win.

>>1972833
>I get safety is important, but IMO this progression towards Goldman exoskeletons for playing with sportified versions of the real steel versions is getting absurd.

That's really just your own perception. There is an increasing market for high-level protection for beginners to use, but the trend I see is towards more and more flexible, lightweight, and uncumbersome armor that has just enough protection to prevent injury, but just not enough to prevent feedback from hits (at higher skill levels of HEMA).

Maybe it's just your group, but in mine (and most of the West coast scene) we're buying anything that claims to allow us to fight closer to Blossfechten going full-speed. I interviewed Axel Pettersson about this back in August, and he said that's the design goal of the Koenig glove, along with whatever else his company is going to produce.

>>1973568
>The only problem here seems to be people like you who refuse to acknowledge hits and rush in for after blows.

On the contrary I just train light and controlled so I can do so without gloves and jackets. If beginners are breaking peoples fingers there's something seriously wrong going on.

As a previous poster pointed out a school that make sure beginners drill in gloves is a definite red flag.

I want to learn to fence not zornhautag kendo.

>3 broken bones later
>yes, I wear hard gloves for daily practice, why?

>>1974222
>I just train light and controlled so I can do so without gloves and jackets
But doesn't that just demonstrate that the problem here isn't the equipment, it's the mindset? People don't fight like shit because they wear good equipment, they wear good equipment because they fight like shit. If you just take the equipment away, people will get hurt; if you fix the mindset first, you don't need to take the equipment away.

>>1974578
I'm not superstitious so I'm gonna go all out and say it. I don't care what any of you have to say it is not easy to break bones with a nylon longsword. The intensity required should be used for sparring or intentionally intense advanced drilling only and beginners shouldn't be going anywhere near the latter. In these circumstances OBVIOUSLY protection is required. Steel even more so but even with steels drilling with a sensible partner is perfectly safe.

Everything else, everything educational should be done lightly and without gear so that you can appreciate the subconscious actions to defend vulnerable extremities and then learn not to leave your hands vulnerable.

Of all the martial arts I've ever done that was rule 1 of weapon fighting. Protect your hands.

>My hands have been hit.
>What am I doing wrong?
Love this guy.

>My hands keep getting hit.
>Your plfug and your cuts are too high. Keep your hands low.
>No, its ok. I'll just put my spes heavies on
This was an actual conversation with a beginner I've had and this (in case there's any confusion) is what I'm talking about and no doubt >>1973356 was too.

The original fencing clubs of the early Renaissance didn't wear guantlets and helmets constantly either.

>>1974578
But it's inevitable that if you give a beginner/intermediate highly protective gloves (for example) their "mindset" does change to one that is more willing to take risks that they otherwise would never do.

Pretty sure some of the arguments here are also the ones that favour training with actual sharp weapons (slowly and after a certain experience level obviously).
>tfw Guy busts out the sharpsand you do one chain of movements, all of a sudden your stance is more alert, you're further away, your strikes into the sword a firmer and you really don't want to cock up.

>>1973568
>People like you who refuse to acknowledge hits and rush in for afterglow

Did you read WHY? He wasn't rhino-hiding or being a Buffalo, he was proving a (granted retarded) point.

>>1976429
>Your plfug and your cuts are too high. Keep your hands low.
>No, its ok. I'll just put my spes heavies on
What kind of beginner shows up with SPES heavies?

>>1976429
>This was an actual conversation with a beginner I've had
Ok, that is pretty egregious, but I assume you then talked to them about why that attitude is bad and why it'd be better to take a different approach, right? I've never run into anyone who acts the way your guy did, and I think a lot of that is due to how we present the material and our objectives.

>>1977342
>their "mindset" does change to one that is more willing to take risks
Sure, but I'd argue that it doesn't - or doesn't need to, with proper instruction, as above - change significantly more than the mindset does just from being in a friendly environment, rather than a fight to the death. Even when you're using sharps, you know the other guy isn't really trying to kill you, so you can never perfectly replicate it. Given that, I think it's better to use the extra equipment and avoid injuries; even just a bad bruise can make you miss class for a week, and I think the aggregate effect of that is worse than the incremental harm to the mindset.

The fetishization of headshots in competition is responsible for the sportification and 'kendo-ization' of longsword HEMA.

>>1980238
>longsword
there's your mistake

Anyone have a link to those vids of crazy Germans fencing with sharps without protection?

>>1980636
If you're talking about sword and buckler then you're looking for Dimicator. Look for it on YouTube and Facebook.

>>1980647
Not Roland, I mean the ones where people fight bare-chested with mensur masks, get forearm wounds that need medics staples.

>>1980672
>where people fight bare-chested
>get forearm wounds that need medics staples.
wtf? why are germans that fucking crazy?

>>1980672
I've seen some pics of german people doing longsword in the woods loke that, but they were bleeding from the head. Can't remember where. No idea if they made a video too. I don't think that's the thing you're looking for, but, hell, germans are crazy.

Does anyone have recommendations for masks? My problem is I have a small face, I was thinking of getting a mask I could use with steel also, so far I've only found one on Gajardoni which would be the right size (goes down to an xs) but its very expensive

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>>1980827
whats your measure?
>you can always bend a mask into the right shape if the measure fits.

>>1980863
56 cm
Also yeah, I usually bend the back bit and try to get it somewhat tight when I tie the elastic part with velcro, but I had my fair share of lunges to tha face that ended up squishing my nose. Doesnt help that my club is full if big men, so the masks they use for training range from m to l

>>1978553
Rich ones.

>>1980759
>>1980688

There were at least two on YouTube, in the woods and in a river.

Channel might be banned now.

>>1980885
No, I meant bending the mesh a bit so it fit your head/face shape better. Put the mask on the ground and apply subtle pressure on either either side to make it wider or higher. Whatever is needed to keep your nose away from the grill.

Usually a German size 0 (Uhlman, Allstar) or S (Leon Paul) should fit, if not try to find and XS Negrini mask.

>>1981100
I didnt think about it, thanks! I will look into those recommendations, thanks again

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>>1958342
>>1958673
>>1963090
>>1965471
It's finally here, I'm gonna keep you guys updated!

>>1980426
>longsword

S&B master race here

>>1981392
Keep us posted knigga

>>1981443
Nice!
Swordfish once again showed me that every other weapon is more interesting than longsword.
S&B was really damn cool to watch!

>>1977386
Yeah, the wording was bad; meant people who normally do what he was temporarily doing. That said, I'm still not sure on the details of what he was doing. His brief explanation made it sound like he was getting hit and then rushing in for a quick afterblow, but unless they're using a real shitty ruleset, the judges should be able to score it properly. The whole thing just sounds stupid.

Also, what the fuck is rhino-hiding? No one accused him of smuggling big game.

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Praise be unto anon.

How do you train plays and techniques? Slow or full speed? Clean form or dirty form?

>>1983087
Clean form for training, always clean form. Start slow, get faster, but keep your form.

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>>1983087
'Dirty form' is lazy shoe-in in lieu of good timing.

Not to be pretentious but you can never do anything too perfectly in fencing amiright.

Every beginner who spars alot does it ofcourse but it's just lazy naive thinking and even if you land your hits you're not gonna impress anyone.

I train plays and techniques as slowly as I need to to learn them and as fast as I need to to perfect them.


Anyone have any reccomendations for Dussack trainers?

>>1981450
>b-but muh Meyer
>Muh athleticism
>M-muh week of kendo cross training

I get why it's """our weapon""" and basically the one people sign up for, but it's being pushed too hard and becoming a fucking meme.

All the other contests are getting better, Longwood I think is about to peak IMO.

>>1981875
>rhino-hiding
It's an SCA term for people who:
a) Don't acknowledge (or call "Light!") on all your hits.
b) Wear minimum protection and do the above.

>>1983589
>Dussack trainers
You mean something other than actual dussacks? Purpleheart has some synthetics, if that's what you're looking for.

>>1980238
Explain yourself.

>>1976429
>The original fencing clubs of the early Renaissance didn't wear guantlets and helmets constantly either.
False and partially false respectively, padded horsehair gauntlets for fencing practice are attested as far back as the middle ages (they appear in lists of seized or inherited estate among other things), and Renaissance fencers would 100% guaranteed have used masks if they'd had them as proven by the fact that they invented the fencing mask, as well as a ton of different kinds of head (especially face) protection before that.

I agree that a lot of beginners have shit attitudes but blaming the kit's nonsense.

Any recommendations for decent retailers in Oceania, why is it so hard to find decent non-sharp steel?

>>1985697
Just get Regenyeis shipped oversea?
That's what we do in east Asia.

What are your thoughts on the Thokk* gloves?

https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/thokk-weaponmaster-gauntlets#/

*not to be confused with the Neyman Thokk gloves

>>1985731
Looks too good to be true. Still so glad glove technology and competition is picking up so much lately.

>>1983607
>it's being pushed too hard and becoming a fucking meme.
>Longwood I think is about to peak IMO
feelsbadman.jpg

I'm a noob so it's not that bad for me but watching longsword tournaments isn't fun anymore...
What's the most interesting weapon category to watch?

>>1985875
>What's the most interesting weapon category to watch?
If you know what to look for, probably rapier. For a noob/non-HEMA viewer it's almost certainly saber.

>>1985910
>noob/non-HEMA viewer
>saber
damn, am I a filthy casul and need to git gud when I like saber?

>>1985912
No. What he meant is that saber is full of big movements and is very easy to follow. Strikes are pretty hard so their easy to spot.

Longsword usually opens with big moves and then the point is landed by something small and it usually ends up a flustered winding mess with very little room for showmanship while in measure. Not a very good spectator sport.

It's the hardest in my opinion and also the most rewarding for me accordingly. Each their own.

>>1980636
Talkin about holmangfags?

>>1981392
gosh pdf asap, ure my hero anon

>>1985875
I think Longwood's rules in tournaments need a serious re-do, or at least alternative. I'm sick of seeing people crash-n-flail.
It's like it's become UFC level "One punch, two punch, hug it out..."
And like >>1985954 says, when I'm competing/training it's great. And I can appreciate it the finer points of top level competitors, but having done some kendo in the past this is NOT what I expected it to devolve to.

You know what, fuck it. Next tournament I enter I'm going to use only kendo techniques. If I win then I am done.

>>1985967
Working on it, only gonna pdf "Unterricht im Säbelfechten" and the saber part of "Die Fechtkunst" though (unless I get more time on my hands).

Also going to use some kind of character recognition program (OCR or something) to put it online as actual text instead of pictures (obiously I'm gonna include actual pictures).

Once that's done I'll begin translating it, luckily got a half-scotish friend who's proof-reading everything afterwards.

>>1985983
>I think Longwood's rules in tournaments need a serious re-do, or at least alternative. I'm sick of seeing people crash-n-flail.
You are now aware that there are several dozen different rulesets for longsword in Europe alone.

>>1985983
Ive never seen a long sword match that looked like kendo. the swords are just to heavy.

That said it wouldn't be surprising if kendo techniques worked. Kendo footwork and techniques are all designed to land a hit (not a cut) really quickly and from a distance.

>>1985991
I dunno. I've seen enough Vom Tag guillotine competitors doubling out or hit-afterblowing to a 1 point victory to completely agree with him.

It's especially amusing to do test cutting with any of these people and see them shy away from a sharp sword that's nowhere them.

>>1986007
I dont know that winning by double hits or after blows is kendo like, I don't believe I have ever heard a kendoka describe that as good kendo.

Their ideal is a single clean shot to the head which completely dominates the opponent on all levels.

>>1986074
I was actually describing a particularly bad Longsword tournament I was at.

Why they decided doubles scored will forever puzzle me.

>>1986074
Also proper footwork, posture, and follow through.

Another oddity about kendo is the degree to which scoring reqs vary by skill level. An ippon in low level kendo might not count in high level kendo . There's a lot of discretion.

>>1986181
kendo shiai is a kind of idealized swordsmanship. in contains a lot of the theories and even blade work similar to old kenjutsu, but the scoring system is based around landing ideal blows rather than functional blows.

As a Southern European, I get the feeling that Anglo-americans focus too much on the Longsword. Is that correct, or do you guys fence with the rapier and the saber, too?

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>>1986218
Here in Australia the back sword and broadsword dominate.
You'll be hard pressed to not find a decent backsworder if you come down here.
>Please come down here.
>Please.

>>1986181
>>1986190
Kendo is only partially about swordsmanship, it's just as much an education of discipline and character, based around a martial practice. It's a very idealist practice because it's a lot about values that are supposedly found in the techniques.
There is of course some good japanese swordsmanship 101 to find in the kata and the three first kata are fine examples of three typical attitudes of the japanese swordsmanship, but though kendo revolves around those techniques, it's only a part of the whole thing. Therefore it's somehow understandable than the scoring doesn't reflect only the practical aspect.

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I'm looking at buying my first feder

I was thinking about the A&A Fechterspiel but I was wondering if any of you have experience with it

In the mean time I just borrow feders from other people in my club

>>1986244

It would be difficult. We Southern Euros are having a bad time economically. It would be great to visit other countries and see other traditions than Verdadera Destreza and Italian fencing, but unfortunately thats not a possibility for the next 10 years :(

It sucks because I would love to explain to you guys in the Anglosphere about Verdadera Destreza. Its so autistic, yet so effective, you wouldnt believe it comes from Spain.

>>1986440

Speaking of which, why dont we bring back some of the "spiritualism" that European fencing had? As far as I am aware, treatises from the Renaissance had some moral influences from Catholicism, and the upper classes, who were often the practicioners of fencing at that time, had to follow some codes. If the kendo guys are doing fine with their traditional Japanese morale, then why cant we bring back old time European foppery?

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>>1981392
I've scanned more than half of "Unterricht im Säbelfechten" but ocr'ing it will be a pain in the ass (my fucking scanner is a tiny bit too small...)

>>1986500
>A&A Fechterspiel
Not sure if anyone here does have it, afaik those are US made and few people in Europe know them.

>>1986218
>do you guys fence with the rapier and the saber, too?
Some of us do. You've got to remember, there are a lot of us; generalizations are tricky.

That said, Longsword is definitely the most popular, followed by rapier, and then there's a bit of a gap before we get to saber, but I think more people have started doing it recently.

>>1986500
A&A's stuff if generally fine, but at that price point you might as well get an Albion.

so ive been practicing solo and teaching myself as best as i could. but i feel like im at a point where teaching myself isnt cutting it. is there anything i can do to improve?
heres a video of me practicing figgy's rule 4 composed 2nd variation. im a beginner by the way, i have no experience in anything else.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e1a6g2EA-_U&feature=youtu.be

>>1987222
Join a club.

>>1987339
theres noone in my area that teaches montante.

>>1987350
Make a club. Sometimes you just need other people to workshop with.

>>1987214
I have heard that they are similar to Albion but I'm in the U.S. so A&A would be more convenient

>>1987222
The flow is good, but some details like posture and sword grip aren't. It would help if you'd imagine an opponent, connect with the strikes, hit with the thrusts, keep your guards real.

>>1986218
Saber is big among those who are tied to the UK more.

>>1987350
>theres noone in my area that teaches montante
There's hardly anyone anywhere that teaches montante. The material's sparse and the trainers are too heavy to contact spar with. If you stuck with German longsword and adapted it to the Gassenhauer along with the few deidcated techniques available for it, that would probably be the most effective way for you to learn.

I'm finally getting my club going after the previous owner left. It's really stressful, and looks like it'll cost a fair bit. Also many people probably vanished since the club went dormant. Any anons here in Southern Ontario/GTA looking for a club?

>>1988371
There's a great montante manual on Amazon. I'll see if I can find it again, might be useful for him.

>>1987222
>im a beginner by the way, i have no experience in anything else.
>choosing the Montante as your first weapon

Son, do you buy a Suzuki Hayabusa as your first bike? No, you get a nice little dinky Honda Rebel and work your way up from there.

There are many, MANY principles you need to discover and work on with wrestling, dagger, etc before you even think about picking up the biggest type of sword ever made.

>>1985508
>Explain yourself.
Weighted afterblow and the privileged headshot means the majority of longsword bouts become an exercise in head hunting without major concern for good defensive technique. Getting a headshot in but still getting thrust in the chest or struck in the arms might put you ahead on points, but its bad swordsmanship.

Change the point distribution and this style of fighting will evaporate.

>>1987394
Albion is in the US, FWIW. I'm not sure what their wait list is like right now, but most of their stuff is higher quality than AA's.

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>>1985730
No pricing on any of his single hand gear, how legit is the site? I tend not to order stuff via an email....

>>1989328
fully legit, Peter Regenyei is like the main HEMA hardware maker of Europe.

>>1986681
If I were you I'd ask a copy shop to do the dirty job. This is generally worth the couple of bucks it will cost you

>>1989703
Yeah, I'm thinking about that already but I've got a good scanner at work that I can probably use...
What I need is some good ocr software though...

>>1989763
Hey, someone sayd WAREZ?

>>1988982
but its fun and its my favorite kind of weapon.

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Gear Question: Does anybody have any experience with Age of Craft? They seem to be a Russian or Ukrainian supplier for BofN and HMB, but this gauntlet looks pretty useful for HEMA, if a tad on the heavy side.

http://ageofcraft.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=60_68&product_id=124

>>1991470
>using gauntlets
>not breaking a few fingers and learning from the experience
it's like you want to stay bad at HEMA

>>1991470
HMB guys usually care for safe gloves so I guess they should be fine.
But that's just a guess, I have no direct experience with those gloves.

>>1980636
Holmgang, those guys are fucking crazy...
>https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC7rjVFPrglW3Iz2O4xBBgTQ

>>1991040
Yes, but it is a bad choice as first weapon.

>>1991639
I'm not sure what you mean by your post. Are you saying gauntlets are bad for hand protection? I've only used Fechtschule Gdansk gloves for a few years now, but I've suffered 3 separate injuries on my hand with them and I'm looking for better protection.

>>1992735
>I'm not sure what you mean by your post.
You fight without protection and sharp swords, that's the only way to become a good fencer!

>>1992757
Hi Roland.

>>1992813
Hi!

>>1992757
Do you fence fully nude, or do you wear at least a tanga? I fully understand that it helps coordinating your movements if you feel the cold air brushing over your hairy balls it also kinda distracts me at times.
>yes, I got very sensitive balls.

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>>1992829
Pic related is my current sparring suit.

>>1992848
damn that's hot

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The pictures of Hergsell's "Die Fechtkunst" from the saber part

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>>1992861
previous one was guard, this one's Prime

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>>1992864
ah damn, 002 is high-tierce, 003 is prime, this one's seconde (if got them ordered the right way)

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>>1992871
tierce

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>>1992874
quarte and finished, sadly there aren't anymore pictures but I'm working on scanning and ocr'ing

Ok, which one of you swordswallowers just makes an idiot out of himself on /k/?

>>1992875
>>1992874
>>1992871
>>1992861
das it mane

>>1993089
thread?

>>1991826
their so bad they make hmb look good

>>1992822
Let's pretend we actually summoned Roland-senpai, just for fun!

Good evening Roland-senpai, please share some of your sharpest thoughts with us

>>1994117
>share some of your sharpest thoughts with us
You can't write 'sharp wit' without 'sharp sword'!
A broken finger a day keeps bad form away!

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Can anyone identify the sword in this pic?

>>1994130
O wise barefoot messiah, share some more knowledge with us!

>>1994117
>Good evening Roland-senpai, please share some of your sharpest thoughts with us...

Gluten arben,

Make sure you lean forward as though projecting volumous amounts of diarrhoea.

Everything is a shield if you're brave enough.

Tschuss.
>t. bucklerman

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>>1955817
An interesting article on the short-lived french fencing method (for foil, sabre and bayonet) taught to the Japanese at the Toyama military academy in the late 19th century.

When silkworms brought you frogs, but traditions and xenophobia had them go away...

http://www.kendo-world.com/wordpress/?p=2838

>>1994117
Come to the BBB and I'll tell you.

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What's the best way of getting a standard Regenyei feder? Foo i just order directly from them, going from Hungary to the States, or is there secondary sellers I need to know about?

>>1994464
Check out "HEMA Supplies" on Facebook. They import Regenyei's stuff in bulk, as well as SPES stuff.

>>1987214
>>1987394
In reviews, Albion's Lichtenauer is generally described as a blunt longsword, and not really a feder. As in, thin blunt edges and a PoB more closely reflecting a sharp. Also, their Meyer has a murderously sharp schilt. Definitely quality pieces, however.

A&A is as expensive, but if you want anything different or custom on your sword or feder, they'll do it. Different pommel, adjust the length of the blade of hilt, grip coloring, peened or threaded pommel, etc.

If you do want a budget option, Landsknecht Emporium is there.

>>1994582
>blade of hilt
>blade OR hilt
Jesus Chris

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>>1994583
Don't be so hard on yourself. Here, have some sweet puppies to cheer you up.

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>>1994450
M-m-my scabbard ir ready to receive your sword senpai!!

>>1995208
I laughed too loudly at this.

I need to get of the chins for a while...

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Complete newswordfag, how possible is it to teach myself sword fighting? There's practically no lessons available within about 50 miles of me, and I'm very interested in learning. Is it possible to teach yourself, even basics?

>>1995682
Only the very, very basics. Like how to hold a sword, simple footwork, and proper form for guards. You need someone to spar and train with, it takes 2 to tango, anon.

Any friends of yours who might be interested?

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>>1995693
No, nothing like that. I really wish I did though, it looks really fun to be able to do. Living in a rural area fucking sucks, zero classes around here and no friends who want to try.

>>1994401
Personally I think the gunto soho of WII suited the Japanese much better than the imported saber techniques.

All the recruits already had kendo experience, but then you hand them a saber? The system they developed, now surviving in the form of toyama ryu and nakamura ryu is far more suited to what they were use to, and takes advantage of the battojutsu already highly developed in Japan .

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tdHvTegdrac

originally these were performed in combat gear

>>1995706
A big help is if you're able to record yourself going through guards and cuts and footwork.

Blood & Iron has some good videos on Youtube about knee alignment and wrist structure and such.

On the plus side, all you need in your situation is a sword-like object. No one to spar with, no need for masks, gloves, jackets, etc. No rush! Pick up a stick or dowel, and start practicing.

>>1995706
Well son, it might be time for you to pack your bags and move to the big city, just like in the movies.

>>1995798
Well the Japanese certainly thought so too considering how this attempt lasted only for 30 years before they went back to a modernized sort of japanese fencing (what is now the three successors variants originating from the Toyama-ryu base style).

However they brought the French and Germans at the same moment where kenjutsu schools were seriously diminishing in numbers, even some very famous styles like Kyoshin Meishi-ryu died at that time. It was reasonable since parts of the army were already being modernized, to change the fencing training as well. It's good for them that there was a revival of kenjutsu in the 1880's though, interestingly enough, it's indicated in the article that the French officers went to see the famous master who led the revival (Sakakibara Kenkichi of Jikishinkage-ryu). It would be great to know what they thought of this cross-training...

>All the recruits already had kendo experience
Well the article certainly says otherwise, some officers knew some kenjutsu (kendo wouldn't exist before at least 30 years), some knew pretty much nothing, and there was no unified system at all (this came to be at first in 1886 with Keishicho-ryu). But yeah, trying to have a unified practice with a western style was kinda doomed to fail.

But heh, with this and some more research we have legit HEMA for weebs now...

>>1962662
If you start something like this you're probably a huge nerd who plays Dark Souls.

>>1986601
Why so ? the thing I love from hema is that there is no bullshito attached to it.

>>1995706
Take your time.
Choose a source or a discipline, or maybe get a manual in available, and stick to it.
Start working on the structure of each guard, constantly being aware of the form.
Than add basic strikes and footwork, always paying maximun attention to the form.
When you feel confident with your form, start training with the pell. Like, for hours.
Thus you will strenghten yourself and dinamically apply the form you have trained.
If possible, start attending a hema class, maybe just once per month it's still better than nothing.
Hope this will help until you find some sparring partner or a better solution

Just a word of warning to everyone saying you can easy practice guards solo.
You can, but you need to find a way to "pressure test them". If you practice for 60 hours perfection your guards, then when it comes to sparring some Buffalo or Badger blows through it, your guard was 60 hours of rubbish.

>>1996321
>>1995926
Thanks then, looks like I have some stuff to get started on while I look for a sparring partner.

>>1996327
I'm familiar with buffalo, but what do you mean with badger?

>>1991826
Thanks mate, remembered it started with an h. Brain keeps going to Hammborg.

>>1986592
>Verdadera Destreza.
Literally weaponized autism?

>>1996105
>Well the article certainly says otherwis

That is certainly true for the early period of the article but by the end of that period kendo was not only around but was deeply associated with the far right movement

>>1996578
I never understood this swords=far right thing. It's all around the world and it seems meaningless to me.

>>1996475
It's a reference from George Silver's Paradoxes of Defence.

In brief, Vincentio Saviolo (a rapier master who taught an Iberio-Italian hybrid style) got his arse handed to him by a fellow called Austin Badger who used strong downright blows to collapse Saviolo's rapier guards.

So a guard that can be collapsed by a simple but heavy strike isn't really a good guard.

Also works if you refer to the other person as a Honey Badger which are crazy.

>>1996578
>>1997349
>taking pride in your cultural heritage or facet of your tenuous genetic lineage is Nationalism now.

For fucks sake.

>>1997349
> never understood this swords=far right thing

It was not just swords. In japan most martial arts during the early showa were closely tied into right wing politics. Many martial artists were involed in groups like the Amur river society and its later incarnations,

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Dragon_Society

And many martial artists were complicit with the Japanese imperial military, including some of its more unsavory elements. Karate instructors for example tested techniques on prisoners.

Kendo itself was used as a recruiting vehicle for the japanese military.

So while it was not every martial artist or swordsman, there were plenty who were deeply involved in the military and right wing shenanigans of WWII Japan.

In depth look at the ProGauntlet
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kTZOe6RdF8k

Thoughts?

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>>1997635
>Thoughts?

>>1997635
Ugly as sin. I hope they put some kind of exterior on the plastic.

But, they seem to work really well.

I wonder about their longevity. They won't be cheap and probably not something I'd be able to repair.

>>1997635
Well I'll be getting some.

Looks fanasic. My only concern is price.

Over 250 Euros I'll be pissed. Over 300 and I'll have to give them a miss.

After Konig Gloves 'preorders get bulky prototypes' bullshit I'll be waiting anyway.

So stoked to watch this though so happy we're moving into a new age of quality gear.

>>1998014
>Ugly as sin. I hope they put some kind of exterior on the plastic.
I think they look pretty cool and hope they keep it like that.

>>1998659
Might be for the best. I can always wear something on top of the Progauntlets. They are very form-fitting after-all.

>>1998331
They'll obviously be over 250 and likely over 300.

>>1997635
Looks promising, but I still don't have much faith they'll be able to put out a finished product without it A) Being prohibitively expensive, and B) Being able to be manufactured in any kind of meaningful quantity.

I would be more hopeful if this video was taken 2 years ago, not over 3 years post-Kickstarter funding.

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A few questions from a newlongswordfag:
Other than thrusts, cuts, guards and footwork is there anything to learn? Obviously there's a ton of things to do in those categories, but is there anything else I'm neglecting?

Are the 5 basic guards (Ox, plow, fool, roof, and nearward) sufficient guards for sparring, or would it be wise to start looking into more complicated stuff like the 12 guards?

>>1998895
As far as getting to know the material by muscle, sticking with basic guards will do you fine. And depending on which source you want to work from, some guards aren't really emphasized or present. For instance, Einhorn is really just a Meyer thing.

Are you studying solo, or with a group? Managing and gauging distance is a huge thing to learn.

As is parrying effectively, but not moving your sword way too far in one direction. For example, you're in right-side Plow, and someone cuts to your left elbow. What you usually don't want to do is move your sword into a left-side Plow so far left that it looks like you're trying to hand the sword to someone on your left. Moving into a secure and relaxed left-side plow saves time, protects you, and allows for a quicker riposte.

>>1998921
I'm studying solo, which is were most of my troubles are coming in. There's an insane amount of content to learn, and everyone has their own take on a particular move. I have no particular direction, that's why I wanted the outline of all the categories I need to learn.

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>>1998895
You want to train at home and that's fucking dope!

More power to you brother but don't be rushing to learn everything at once. One day wether you like it or not you're gonna run out of things to learn in Longsword and hopefully that day will be years away.

After that it's just learning variations on interpretations and how wrong your form is. Not as fun as the the initial grind.

If you're lucky enough to have good teachers to teach you properly you're better off not rushing off on your own.

So focus on the things that actually really matter in sparring. Your fitness. Your distance. Your footwork. The speed and fluidity of your transitions.

Don't fear the man who knows 1000 cuts etc.

>>1998941
Thanks, I'll keep trying. I've gotten a few of the initial guards down pretty well (I think) and it's really damn fun so far. I hope that day is very far off.

>>1998331
>'preorders get bulky prototypes' bullshit
I don't get it...
>>1998881
Yeah, but they're no longer just going for the HEMA market, so it's not an issue for them.

>>1998936
>that's why I wanted the outline of all the categories I need to learn.
wew lad

I'd recommend finding one YouTube channel and sticking with that until you have a basic MECHANICAL understanding.

Once you can do the stuff in a sound manner, then worry about Feeling, Before and After, and other concepts.

>>1998895
Well there are more abstract concepts that you need to get good at... e.g. fuehlen, vor+nach, appraising your opponent's style, etc.

>>1999155
But what other markets are they for? Every other sport has been professionally established for at least a century and has their equipment needs being constantly met by multi-million dollar companies.

>>1999173
Any recommendations? I have one or two bookmarked, but the one I was using immediately moves into the twelve guards which I felt was a little out of my depth, especially considering there was no explanation of how to block or a track from that stance, only the stance.
>>1999651
But that comes later on, I assume?

>>1999788
Meant for
>>1999252

Ausfag here, I'm looking to source some spes elbows, forearms and knees.
Is there anyone in Australia selling? If not can anyone recommend a seller

>>1999651
Filipino Martial arts for example and some more.

>>1999651
I guess they'll try and sell to military contractors and things if they want to hit the major money.

I don't think FMA will be interested. The level of dexterity really isn't that necessary. Not for the price. I mean that will be an 280 Euro mark up from their usual gloves.

>>2000308
>I don't think FMA will be interested
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5HfF4QjASqg
Marketing to the FSA community was there from the start.

>>2000308
>military contractors
What for? They have no need for clumsy gloves as broken fingers are not a major concern. Get some Mechanix or Oakleys and thats that.

Anyone know if there are any sabre wasters out there with a half-basket? Like the gymnasium sabre type.

>>2000964
You can buy the baskets (german academic fencing, check for Korbschläger) and might ask a HEMA maker to make you a blade for it. Other than that no, I don't think so

>>2001033
Alright, no worries, just gives me more reason to help students get going on steel.

>>1999890
Sorry m8,
It's online retailers or nothing.
Pepper your Angus for the exchange r8 cucking.
>Just buy FMA forearm protectors, they're cliterally the same.

>>1999788
In relation to this, I've been using this channel: https://m.youtube.com/watch?list=PLA2CE2706099821D7&params=OAFIAVgF&v=9ZvoRN-Vbl0&mode=NORMAL
for all of my learning so far, does this seem like it's teaching the right stuff? It's spent a lot of time on cuts and hardly any on guards so far, which concerns me.

>>1999788
Yes... but you need partner drills to actually learn it, then actually applying it to your sparring is a whole nother hurdle.

>>2003223
I haven't looked at video, but cutting is one of the things that working on solo is actually fine and dandy, and very helpful to your development.

You still need experienced people to check your form ideally (think about recording video of yourself), but you can do flow drills until you die and still be improving your cutting technique all the way. Being able to cut smoothly from guard to guard is a really good habit to develop.

Then, there's test cutting to check what you're doing is up to martial snuff.
Basic guards/parries on the other hand... you actually need somebody trying to hit you for real in order to learn how to defend yourself effectively and counterattack.

>>2003296
I suppose I'll work on my cuts more then, but I'd still really like to know if these are good drills to be practicing, or if I should look for something else. I'm looking around my city for a sparring partner of some sort, but until I can find one I'd like to make sure I'm learning the things I should be.

Forgive me if I don't know the actual terms, but when making a vertical downwards cut with a longsword when it's resting on your shoulder in a "cocked back" stance, exactly how far should you be stepping? I've been told that you need to take a rather wide step, but my days of unarmed martial arts are messing with me and telling me to take tiny, reserved steps, which is obviously affecting my swing strength.

>>2005213
As long as you need to. And that need depends largely on what distance your opponent is standing away from you.

>>2005213
In addition to what
>>2005298
said, I'll note that the size of the step you take shouldn't really affect the strength of the cut. Even if you don't step at all, you should be moving your hips with the swing. You'll end up in a bit of an awkward position without a step, but it should hit just about as hard.

are there any late medieval saber manuals? e.g. polish or hungarian?

>>2008103
Were there sabers in the late medieval times?

>>2008317
afaik yes, at least in eastern europe.
germans had the dussack but it's not really a saber I think

>>2008103
>>2008324
>>2008317
How is the dussack / tessack not a sabre?
How would you define a sabre? That would be a good start.
There's not a lot of anything eastern europe for the medieval era though...

>>2008893
>How is the dussack / tessack not a sabre?
dunno tbqh, just thought so

>>2008103
Sounds like you're looking for broad/backsword.

>>2009842
no, he looks for Hungarian saber. Now go back to bed Mr. Silver.

I've been practicing my cuts and guards and so forth for a while now and I've noticed a consistent problem, the blade always feels much too light. I'm using a dowel rod for now because I don't have the cash for an actual longsword yet, but it's about 5 1/2' long and it weighs about 9lbs after I strapped weights to it. It still feels really light, despite Wikipedia telling me that most longswords only weigh about 5lbs or so. I'm not totally surprised, I've always been a tad bit stronger than average. Is there something bigger/longer I could be using, short of switching to a polearm or something different? I'd like to still be using a sword of some sort.

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>>2009948

>>2009969
Is that not an actual thing? I figured.

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>>2008893
>How is the dussack / tessack not a sabre?
They have about as much and as little curve as any other "sabered" weapon. However on average they are broader and shorter.
Think the Italian "storta"
Also it could be argued (as it has been) that a "dussack" is the training tool version of leather and/or wood.

>>2009948
Get a small tree trunk and use that.

>>2009948
No, there really isn't. You can buy larger swords used to cut away pole arms or something if I remember correctly, but those aren't really combat applicable. The best you could do is have one specially made, which is going to cost you an arm and a leg+ your other arm and leg.

>>2009948
>Buffalo incoming

Finished scanning the theoretical saber part of Hergsell's "Die Fechtkunst" (about 80 pages) gonna proof-read and upload it the following days/weeks.

>>2011659
Awesome, I love those scans.

When practising cuts and guards and such, should you be doing it full force? When you cut at home do you put the same amount of force behind it that you would if you were sparring?

>>2011812
>should you be doing it full force?
If you have some kind of practice target then I think it's ok, if you're 'shadow fencing' then don't do it, afaik it will hurt your elbow and/or wrist (depending on what you're doing).

>When you cut at home do you put the same amount of force behind it that you would if you were sparring?
Simply put, no.
But that's mostly because I'm actually IN my house and don't want to accidentally damage any furniture or walls

>>2009948
If you wanna lift weights, go into weightlifting.

On another note, my club has just started up and we're getting interest from newbies with no gear and uncertain interest. What kinda stuff could I use to get them started on sabre/backsword without spending an arm and a leg on more gear? I was thinking just get some cheap bokken (maybe shorten the handle) for practicing cuts and such?

>>2011812
>When practising cuts and guards and such, should you be doing it full force? When you cut at home do you put the same amount of force behind it that you would if you were sparring?
If your form is shit, then swinging at full speed and force is just going to give you more bad habits.and they'll be harder to spot.

I'll also second the other anon about needing a target to cut at if you're trying to throw full force.

>>2011812
cutting power and effectiveness doesn't come from brute force.

When you're doing your flow drills, you should be trying to go very very slowly, because your goal is to perfect your form and technique (e.g. you should be focused on developing power from your legs + core for every blow, edge alignment, etc. etc.).

>>2011812
Full force meaning what?

You're trying to kill/maim someone with a bladed object. This does not require attempting to cleave them in half. Give a little thought to how dead is dead when a hunk of sharp metal goes into a dude's head. It sure doesn't need to go far.

So focus on good form.

But also don't forget to occasionally go full force otherwise you end up one of those Roland types.

>>2012855
>Full-force

Nah, that's just going to teach dangerous muscle memory and could easily injure a sparring partner. Don't go full force, go full SPEED. Go as fast as you can while still being able to maintain total control. Even if you throw your cuts as fast as you can, you should still be able to pull your blow quickly to a complete stop, and without straining your bicep. This does 2 things.

1) Creates a safer sparring environment by making so that all strikes can be pulled if there is sudden equipment malfunction, or if your partner accidentally exposes an unprotected part of their body or puts their hand in front of your weapon.

2) Allows you to be able to feint, change-through, mutate, or duplicate much more effectively since you're not committing your total body into your strikes.

>>2012855
They can kill you with perfect form and superior biomechanics. Slowly.

What's a good training dummy for practicing at home? Haven't found anything useful for HEMA online...

>>2012227
>What kinda stuff could I use to get them started on sabre/backsword without spending an arm and a leg on more gear? I was thinking just get some cheap bokken
I'm not sure if bokken are really cheaper than Rawlings synthetic backswords. Either way, the cheapest option for no-contact is almost certainly just pieces of rattan cane with "soupbowl" guards. You should be able to assemble something reasonable in that way yourself.

>>2015171
You can get a round fence post from home depot and just stick it in a bucket of concrete.

Or hang a dowel/beefy stick from above like so:
http://hroarr.com/making-a-wooden-dummy-for-swordsmanship-practice/

>>2012855
I saw a video on Youtube of Roland messer sparring wearing padded gloves, and also one of him and Tobler in S&B and longsword.

He seems skilled. And him emphasizing learning at half speed seems just as valid as other approaches.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FkQO0kT4SZA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMD6hPQRimU

>>2015366

Bokken can go 15 bucks a pop here.

Rattan cane sounds good. I'll have to find a source.

>>1958242
Enough Dark Souls for today

Does anyone have any suggestions for a decent buckler around 9-12"?

The GDFB ones have fucking garbage handles, as do most others.

>>2018550
the cold steel plastic buckler is not bad, honestly.

>>1965368
/k/ here, go fuck yourself

Most of /k/ is pretty clueless outside of modern arms and armour, but /his/ is even fucking worse, full of misinformation and fucking meme history.

>>1986500
Feders are gay, get a blunt

>>1989328
Péter is great, his stuff if top notch and he charges relatively little for it.

There's quite a wait time though, I asked them about an arming sword and they said March.

>>2018556
Sorry, I meant a steel buckler

Our HEMA club uses steel blunts, so that would get chewed up pretty fast.

>>2018557
>muh cold steel abomination
>muh gladius
>muh knights

Please kys, /k/ is full pleb tier, at his we have nice sword threads with good feed.

>>2018571
http://www.trainingsschwerter.eu/search?sSearch=buckler
Otherwise state where from...

>>2018563
What larp tier club are you from then?

>>2018572
Most /k/ users focus on guns, not swords, and /k/ constantly shits on people who buy shit like "tacticool gaydius" or "moist labia shield" but /his/ just come up with bullshit like "swords are fucking garbage" or "shields stopped being used by "knights" because of guns" while claiming to be a history board.

Those on /k/ who do HEMA are much more tolerable than on /his/

>>2018577
UK

>>2018580
actually once you get past the kiddies, /his/ gets cool, but /k/ never once managed to bring a good thread. Just let them have their cold steel machetes and they are happy.

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>>2018579
>LARP tier
What the fuck are you talking about?
The club I'm from had Matt Easton as treasurer until he decided to branch off and do his own thing, as we exclusively do Fiore.
Feders really aren't necessary, we drill and spar with blunts and haven't had any injuries this year.

If you fight differently in protective gear than without, you're doing it wrong.

BUMP LIMIT, NEW THREAD >>2018589

BUMP LIMIT, NEW THREAD >>2018589

BUMP LIMIT, NEW THREAD >>2018589

>>2018591
>Brits talking about long sword
>never won anything anywhere
>even get btfo at their own tournaments

>>2018594
You mean longsword tag?

>>2018609
As if you would know. Single stick and Silver, thats what you are good at, stick to that.

>>2018660
Love-tapping with an overly long feder and having it count as a point is far from an actual fight with a longsword.
We train to be true to Fiore's methods and for what actually works to kill or incapacitate the opponent

What you do is play sport.

>>2018667
And when you meet someone from the continent he will lick you off 15-0. But keep telling yourself you are not larping.

>>2018690
desu I'd just shoot them instead of facing them with a sword but ok.
You do realise those couple of people that constantly win tournaments also regularly kick the shit out of every other continental, right?

Also, fight someone with sharps bitch, tiggy won't work then, will it

>>2018703
>Also, fight someone with sharps bitch, tiggy won't work then, will it
15-0

>>2018730
Alright buddy, you enjoy that sense of pride for repeating yourself, I'm out

>>2018703
Implying one of the heavies wouldn't destroy you, no matter if blunt or feder.

>>2018563
Blunts are gay, get a sharp

>>2018591
Matt Easton, you say? The one who made videos telling larp is good for HEMA?