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The 2016 Martial Arts Tier List God Tier: Boxing Top Tier:

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The 2016 Martial Arts Tier List

God Tier: Boxing

Top Tier: MMA, Wrestling, Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu, Judo, Kickboxing, Muay Thai

Medium Tier: Pradal Serey, Sanda, Sambo, Kyokushin, Shotokan, Army Combatives, MCMAP, Krav Maga, Savate, Kajukenbo, Jujutsu, Eskrima

Bottom Tier: Taekwondo, Shaolin, Tang Soo Do, Goju-ryu, Pankration, Karate, Kenpo, Kung Fu, Bajiquan, Hung Gar, Silat, Hapkido, Capoeira, Sumo, Jeet Kune Do, Kalaripayattu

Shit Tier: Wing Chun, Aikido, Ninjutsu, Shorin-Ryu, Hwa Rang Do, Chin Na, XMA, Tai Chi, Systema, Dim Mak, Drunken Fist, Praying Mantis
>>
>>1049028
>God Tier: Boxing
lol no
>>
>>1049028

>Shorin-ryu
>Shit tier

I see what you did there
>>
>>1049028
>God Tier: Boxing

Nah son

Boxing is hella rad, but there are hardly any good fights. MMA is a much more entertaining soectator martial art imo.
>>
Why isnt kraft magic in the shit tier
>>
Shotokan has a higher tier than karate. Nigga what the hell is wrong with you
>>
>he's posting the same troll thread again
Youve been doing this since this fucking board was created
>>
>>1049028

This is just a randomly sorted list of martial arts. How the fuck is Capoeira above anything? It's literally just a dance. With songs. And musical instruments.
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>>1049900
It's obviously not as practical as other stuff, but a good Capoeirista will lob your head off with a kick very very quickly.
Really if you throw honor out the window and apply common sense any martial art will clean house once you get to intermediate-high skill.
>>
>loom mom, I posted it again
>>
>>1050035

Against an untrained person? Quite possibly. There's a reason /asp/ recomends competitive full contact striking arts and/or variants of wrestling.

They work against people who have trained the other martial arts. On a similar level that those arts work against untrained people. Capoeira isn't exactly bad. But if you want to fight, why not do muay thai?

If you wanna bust sweet moves, get lean, impress chicks, have fun and get slightly better at fighting then go for capoeira. If fighting is your goal though, don't learn it in a substandard methodology. You'll only be holding yourself back.
>>
>>1050184
In my experience, at the end of the day, the individual's skill matters far more. Of course, as I said, Capoeira isn't exactly ideal, and someone learning to wrestle will get much easier results. But in an actual fight, a smart fighter who throws all the dancing bullshit out the window just needs one opportunity and boom, you now have a concussion.
Video related: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JtR21rSFAjk
There's a bunch of similar ones in the related videos section.
And Capoeira actually teaches some very dirty techniques that aren't used in playing. Such as "telephone", which is basically just an open-palm strike meant to rupture eardrums.
I agree that a wrestler will likely be better off if both fighters have equal skill, but even stuff like Capoeira can kick some serious ass.
>>
>>1049028
How about you differentiate the arts?

First of all, there's competitive, non-competitive and non-interactive arts. (i.e. sparring/drilling in free form with a resisting partner/trying the technique a few times like in Aikido)
Then, among the competitive arts, you have martial arts and games. The difference?
"Games" are arts that only teach the things necessary to compete, everything else is considered superfluous.
This distinction is important depending on your goals for learning an art.

And then there's arts that are more about personal well-being with a side-dish of combat-usable movements, which obviously aren't comparable to most other arts.
And those can be divided into arts that are about spiritual stuff with a decent level of fitness and arts that focus on making you unusually fit, like that "lean on a spear" shit in Kung fu.

And so on.
Make distinctions, then you can rank them in their categories instead of measuring up boxing to judo, aikido and tai-chi.
>>
>>1049028
>eskrima
I don't know if /asp/ is aware, but eskrima is a term for ALL FMAs. Which is a fuckload. And they can be very distinct.
You can't compare a knife style to a dual-machete style.
>>
>>1049028
>god-tier - boxing
you just did a 1-2 on my sides
i'm out, i can't breathe
>>
>>1050621
Is your shift key broken?
>>
>>1050035

>capoeira
>not practical

Nigga I take it you've never seen this movie.
>>
>>1050629
>movie
You mean like Highlander is a movie about ancient humans with hundreds of years of training in their favorite weapons, who treat their ancient and well-groomed swords like sledgehammers and randomly jump around with backflips for no reason?
Would you use that movie as an example of good swordsmanship?
>>
>>1049028
Most of the time, dedication to one's training matters a lot more than style. Boxing is powerful, but the first time a "pure" boxer takes a roundhouse kick to the lead leg or gut, he's going to fold like a house of cards (to say nothing of his reaction when a skilled judoka slips a jab and bodyslams him into the mat).

Now, if you're a boxer who's just THAT MUCH faster and stronger than everybody else, good for you, but that has more to do with how HARD YOU WORKED to get there than what style you rep. The man who wakes up at 7am every day to practice his Shorin-ryu forms for two hours before heading outside to do knuckle push ups in the gravel and kick palm trees is going to DESTROY the guy who boxes on the weekends.

TL:DR: It's not what you do, it's how and how long you do. "Tiering" is silly for most arts.
>>
>krav mango
>not bottom
>>
>>1050663
>The man who wakes up at 7am every day to practice his Shorin-ryu forms for two hours before heading outside to do knuckle push ups in the gravel and kick palm trees is going to DESTROY the guy who boxes on the weekends.
That's not true though.
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>>1050663
>all of this
You said it perfectly anon.
>>
>>1050629
>movie.
kill yourself
>>
>>1050663
since when did /asp/ become full of TMA apologists?
>>
>>1049028
Boxing/Muay Thai/Kickboxing/Kyokushin + Judo/Wrestling/BJJ/Sambo
Anything else doesn't matter
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>>1050477
This is another good K.O.
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l6oiADjOdFg
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_nRBcePZ7Ss
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>>1049028

shotokan medium tier karate bottom tier

what?
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>>1050663
this
>>
>>1050873
>apologists
It's obvious you know fuck all about about TMA`s or martial arts in general if that's what your willing to label traditional stylists and others that choose to actually learn abit about TMA`s as. Your question isn't even worth answering, especially when you shit on other styles
>>
>>1049028
>>1052599
I just noticed that, if your going to make a chart at least fix it OP. Also how are Pradal Serey and Muay Thai on different tiers? The should be on the same one
>>
>>1052889
Ive done TKD, Goju Ryu and Kenpo in the past. Im sorry but your delusional to the state that traditional martial arts are in. there are exceptions of course but for the most part TMAs are a poor choice for anyone that wants to learn to fight. you can deny it all you want but in the end its gonna be your loss.
>>
>>1050663
a guy that boxes on the weekends is gonna destroy a lifelong wing chin practioner or aikidoka.
>>
>>1049028
Boxing is only god tier when it comes to the paycheck as a professional. switch boxing and mma.
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>>1052898
You mean TMA`s taught by mcdojos. A non shit TMA school, will teach you just fine. I'm not delusional nor denying anything, if anyone is it's you. All your doing is stating your completely subjective and disproven opinion. Yeah, everyone who used TMA in a fight, never actually fought. It wasn't "muh real fightin". Nah. In fact the entire existence of TMA`s for unarmed combat is just a hoax or meme and no one up until MMA ever learned how to fight properly. Even though TMA`s are the progenitors of MMA, and have mountains of evidence of being used in fights, duels and battles. And some anon on the internet knows better than all those fighters and people who did all that research. But yeah I'm the one who's delusional and denying things. Those three arts you trained in might not have been personally for you. That doesn't invalidate them nor prove every TMA useless in teaching a person to fight, and certainly not when you've trained in just three of them. Want to say it's all piss poor, train in the rest/beat every last TMA on the planet. Then you just might be able to back up what your saying. Until then you can neither prove anything you've said and certainly have nothing to discredit all those who proved you wrong. In this thread alone there are . two examples of a TMA, Capoiera, being used effectively in an MMA fight. A system with rules and a format that other arts like MT have fought under similarly longer
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>>1052903
Depends on HOW they practice. I think >>1054072 gets it in the sense that people see a TKD or Karate school churning out 8-year-old black belts who've been studying for 3 years tops and think "Oh, that's what TMA's are" but, speaking as someone who's done a little (a VERY little) training in asia, I can say that part of the misconception about the effectiveness of those arts is the attention to CONDITIONING.

Here in the states, because we tend to be more concerned about how much pain we inflict on children (not a judgement about either culture), we tend to focus more on technique in teaching than on nerve-deadening or bone-calcifying practices, which are a major staple of traditional striking TMA's from Shorin-Ryu to Kyokushin to even TKD or Karate. While in Japan, I had the privilege of doing some sparring work with a Shorin-ryu black belt, and that guy may have been the hardest motherfucker I've ever met. I've broken bricks before (thin ones) but I could kick and punch this guy ANYWHERE and he would quietly and calmly ask "Harder please".

This conditioning makes up a lot of the "gaps" western artists see in these styles. Those blocky-looking counters and formal stances are much more frightening after you land your hardest roundhouse on some guy's ribs and he just shrugs it off, or when every time his fore-arm blocks your jab you feel your bones grind.

TL;DR: The "Inefficiencies" in many TMA's are actually a perception created by lackluster teaching/ training of American students and instructors.
>>
>>1054240
Meant to say "TKD or Wing Chun".
>>
>>1049028
Tell me how BJJ is better than the original. BJJ evolves almost only grappling on the ground. How does that beat getting them onto the ground in the first place or actually defeating your opponent before you even start grappling.
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>>1054240
>blocks your jab

You're living in a fantasy land. When your shorin ryu master came up against even an amateur boxer who timed his over exaggerated block and landed a jab on a non condition-able area (like his nose) his whole world would come crashing down and he'd be punched into submission quickly. The fact you prize bone conditioning over learning to time and distance resisting opponents makes it clear you've never fought, hell, maybe never even sparred. It's fine if you have goals apart from fighting, but if you want to fight, actually practice fighting, not abstract theory. Until then, don't fuck up sensible discussions between people who actuallyt have the hobby of fighting with your drivel. Thank you.
>>
>>1050477
>But in an actual fight, a smart fighter who throws all the dancing bullshit out the window just needs one opportunity and boom, you now have a concussion.

That's my point though. There's very little bullshit to throw out the window with boxing, knockdown karate, bjj, judo, sanshou, muay thai, kickboxing and wrestling. Why cut through the chaff of capoeira to end up only left with techniques those arts would have taught you? What advantage is there to learning things that aren't your goal?

Unless your goal IS to roda (an I have to admit, it does look fucking sweeet, so I can see why it would be), why do Capoeira?

I just don't understand why every TMA person wants to be Bruce Lee and learn 12 TMAs and chop and change them into a fighting system, when any mma or kickboxing gym has a legitimate fighting system ready for you.

You don't even have to do much interpretation. It's competition tested. It fucking works. Why dance?
>>
pradal serey and muay thai are the same thing
>>
sanda sambo kyokushin and savate should be above medium tier
>>
>>1054573
> When your shorin ryu master came up against even an amateur boxer who timed his over exaggerated block and landed a jab on a non condition-able area (like his nose) his whole world would come crashing down and he'd be punched into submission quickly.
And you can back this up with what? Amatuer boxer? Can the amatuer boxer do all of that without gloves on his fists? I doubt it. That's part of the reason why bareknuckle arts/sparring and conditioning like that bone conditioning exists. Because your certanly not going to have gloves that give extra mass to your fists and allow you to punch harder than you normally would and definitly not in a street fight, which are majoritarily bareknuckle.
>The fact you prize bone conditioning over learning to time and distance resisting opponents
He never said he did read the post again.
>makes it clear you've never fought, hell, maybe never even sparred.
And what again do you have to back this up? Nothing
>t's fine if you have goals apart from fighting, but if you want to fight, actually practice fighting, not abstract theory.
Nothing about conditioning is abstract and if were talking about bareknuckle Karate they sure as hell fight. Or just because it's something you don't practice, it's not "real fighting" either?
>Until then, don't fuck up sensible discussions between people who actuallyt have the hobby of fighting with your drivel. Thank you.
He wasn't fucking up anything. The only one who was, was you with baseless accusations and pulling more shit out of your ass.
>people who actuallyt have the hobby of fighting
Anyone who knows their shit about fighting would agree with what he's said. You certainly don't know a damn thing about it, as the only thing you've done is asspull. How about you don't fuck up discussions with shit you can't prove
>>
>>1055051
there is countless evidence on the internet of amateur boxers punching people into submission without gloves and being just fine.
>>
>>1055151
I well know boxer's can hit people without gloves. But you cannot say even most have bare hands that good. It is also a proven fact you cannot punch with your bare hand as hard as you can with gloves and wraps on them, with give extra mass to your fists and allow you to hit harder. Part of the reason bareknuckle TMA`s train things like their punches a certain way and do things the way they do is to account for the fact that there is nothing protecting your fists. Without gloves you abosultely need to dail back, avoid punching as hard as you would with something on your fists, and aim even more carefully than normal and at targets that don't run a high risk of damaging your hands. And if you land a punch wrong there's no gloves to save your hands. A glancing shot or a near miss with gloves will pretty much leave your fists ok. Without gloves you run a high risk of dislocating knuckles, and breaking your finger bones and the rest of the bones in your hand. Not accounting for any of that, makes the risk of fucking your hands up even higher. An amateur boxer who trains mostly with gloves will not be as good barehanded as a bareknuckle karateka. And certainly would not be able to beat one as easily as previous anon claimed, especially in a bareknuckle fight
>>
>asp
>every body talks like they are good at martial arts
>but nobody is actually good at martial arts
>>
>>1058304
>An amateur boxer who trains mostly with gloves will not be as good barehanded as a bareknuckle karateka. And certainly would not be able to beat one as easily as previous anon claimed, especially in a bareknuckle fight

Yes, and no. If the bareknuckled karetaka was from kyokushin or an offshoot style where live sparring, bagwork and conditioning where prized then yeah, I'd give them the edge.

Shorin Ryu though dude?

Really man?
>>
What's the best art for getting free from holds and grappling attempts?
>>
>>1060206

You answered your own question.

The best martial art for getting free from holds and grappling attempts are the martial arts devoted to grappling like wrestling, judo, and Brazilian jiu-jitsu. Fight fire with fire. There's no such thing as "anti-grappling".
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>>1059787
>Shorin Ryu though dude? Really man?
Take it up with
>>1054240
>Shorin Ryu though dude?

>Really man?
Yeah. And?
>>
>>1060305
>There's no such thing as "anti-grappling".
There is such thing as anti-grappling, just like there is such thing as anti-striking.
Covering up? That's anti-striking.
downwards forearm block? That's anti-striking.
Clinch? That's anti-striking, at least from longer ranged strikes.
Double leg takedown? That's anti-striking.
Grab onto someone's arm to control it? That's anti-striking.
Stop being a triggered faggot with muh buzzword anti-grappling.
>>
>>1050873
Honestly I think it was when the wrassle fags invaded. Eirher they're grouped in with them or they're more noticeable now because all the good people left.
>>
>>1060305
I want to learn to add it to my performance. I can already get free from handcuffs, thumb cuffs, zip ties, some rope, and can pop padlocks. I want to allow people to try to hold me in place and get loose as part of my escape artist act.

It has nothing to do with trying to create space so I can be a pure striker in mma or something. Although I see no reason that people who are more comfortable striking couldn't do that except that the person trying to grapple them is likely better at it (hence the other person wanting to grapple and them not wanting to).

Anyway, which grappling art is best if I just want to make people let go, without hurting them, so I can move away?
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>>1060836
Aikido and Judo.
If you're going to be on the ground, Brazillian Jiu-Jitsu.
>>
>>1060836
>except that the person trying to grapple them is likely better at it
It depends, really.
Training how to throw, takedown, or submit someone, is not the same as training to avoid those things.

You don't have to be a well rounded grappler to avoid grappling.
You don't have to be a well rounded striking to avoid striking.
Generally speaking, anyway.
>>
>>1049028
What is this ranking based on?

Effectiveness in a competition?

Effectiveness in an imagined street fight, where you are still nice to the people you practice with?
Or effectiveness in a real fight where your opponent is a drunken douche actually trying to stab you in the face with a broken bottle?

If staying in shape and improving flexibility and general fitness is the goal, most competition arts rank rather low. If you have bad knees/back/wrists before you're 30, your art is not good for your health.

Self defense without legal problems afterwards?

Or how interesting they are?
>>
>>1060936
> aikido
no
>>
>>1060936

>seriously recommending aikido

brazilian jiu jitsu. with its popularity it should be easy to find a school. and you'll probably roll on your first day.
>>
>>1060828
I too noticed the martial arts threads quality dropped since the /wwe/ invasion. I think you may be right. either they brought pajama dancing weebs with them or all the good people jumped ship.
>>
If karate and kung fu didn't go super mainstream would they be better today? They're the mcdojos that you always see in every suburb.
>>
>>1060336

Everything he posted was denialist self validatory bullshit though. Everything. Shorin is worse even than shotokan. It doesn't work. Fuck off.
>>
>>1060998
Karate would probably be better. I'm pretty sure it would resemble the hardcore knockdown point karate it used to be instead of stop-tag like it is now. Kung Fu was a lost cause the moment mysticism and tradition became as important as fighting ability.
>>
>>1050663
>"Tiering" is silly for most arts.
Not when that tiny edge is so important to whether you win or lose.
When you're with the best of the best.
>>
>>1061451
>Everything he posted was denialist self validatory bullshit though. Everything.
More shit your pulling out of your ass and reading what isn't there.
>Shorin is worse even than shotokan. It doesn't work.
And, again more unproveable bullshit.
>Fuck off.
Make me faggot
>>
>>1060828
>>1060990
>either they brought pajama dancing weebs
>implying /wwe/ posters are what's causing MA thread quality to drop and your constant asspulls and shitposting
>good people
You mean people who don't know what they're talking about and don't bother to learn. And way to nutride fags
>>
>>1050621
>getting the wind knocked out of you by a 1-2
Should've exhaled, friend
>>
>>1049028
I've recently got interested in martial arts. Can someone explain why Taekwondo is in the bottom tier?
>>
>>1063591
You should watch this video to learn about why Taekwondo is better as a supplemental art.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U4dpoSQWsE0

This video shows why Kickboxing is better for MMA than Boxing.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zQ7bbmjtAB0
>>
>>1063591
>>1063609
The videos don't just show it
the videos explain it.
>>
>>1063609
>>1063612
Thanks!
>>
>>1063609
the kickboxer in the video did not train taekwondo. he was a muay thai fighter.
>>
>>1063609
many mma fighters have boxing coaches. dont put the idea in his head that boxing is useless and is to be avoided because that is just not true.
>>
>>1063591
For the most part the quality of training is poor and they dont work enough with their hands. muay thai supplemented by boxing is a much better option. i would avoid TKD entirely.
>>
>>1063609
Also many schools are WTF which is olympic style competition which is no good for fighting. ITF is better but it is still outclassed by the other options out there.
>>
>>1063674
Is pretty useless in an MMA setting. Today, 2016, many Muay Thai gyms aren't really Muay Thai gyms anymore, but teach "Muay Thai" that is actually a hybrid art containing Muay Thai, Kickboxing, and Boxing.

Training in Boxing is really only good for competing in Boxing.

Sure, you can get a Boxing coach if you REALLY like Boxing, but we're past that now.
>>
>>1063674
>>1063751
So if you're doing MMA, you might as well do Muay Thai, because Muay Thai today is Muay Thai, Kickboxing, and Boxing all bundled up into "Muay Thai."
>>
>>1063674
>>1063751
>>1063756
Kickboxing alone is already pretty hybrid.
>>
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>>1049028
>boxer vs muay thai
>muay thai does the long guard, gets into a clich and BTFO boxer

nigga plz, boxing is top tier but not god tier.
>>
>>1049028
>god tier
>not wrestling and sambo
>>
>>1063751
>Is pretty useless in an MMA setting
well that right off the bat is false. of course boxing on its own won't get you far in mma, but neither will muay thai, or BJJ, or Wrestling by its self. Nobody in MMA is a purist anymore. Second of all if your goal is to train MMA you should be training at an MMA gym. Striking becomes alot different when you have to worry about grappling and vice versa. Third of all there have been plenty of Successful fighters that heavily utilize boxing techniques in their standup. Look at Nick Diaz and BJ Penn and JDS for example.
>>
>>1062218

Shorin Ryu is literally shotokan minus point fighting competitions as part of "standard" training.

It's a joke.
>>
>>1063782
you're dumb for comparing muay thai to boxing nigga do both so you aren't a muay thai fighter with shitty hands
>>
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>>1071241
>Shorin Ryu is literally shotokan minus
So it belongs on medium tier of OP's list and,
>It's a joke
isn't a joke.
>>
I'd like to take up either one striking art and one grappling art, or one art which incorporates both. Basically, I want to be able to defend myself if attacked.

What do you recommend? Boxing or Muay Thai, plus wrestling or BJJ? Are there actually any good arts that teach BOTH striking and grappling, since I do have finite money to spend?
>>
>>1073118
With American Kickboxing, you get something that's kind of like Western Boxing with Kicks.
There're no strikes below the waist in American Kickboxing, there's usually an emphasis on movement, and they have hands.

This video isn't Muay Thai vs. Kickboxing, it's actually Muay Thai vs American Kickboxing.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lpl_7w8-jTE

Notice how light the American Kickboxer is on his feet.
>>
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>>1073118

Just do MMA with a focus on stand up fighting.

MMA training gives you the move set, and focusing on standing up is a part of your personal style, but stupid faggots on /asp/ can't seem to understand that.

Lyoto Machida and Anderson Silva are well known stand up MMA fighters.
>>
>>1073146
I was hoping for the kickboxer to win at the very beginning because I'm a boxing fan and he had better fists and good footwork, but holy shit, that arrogant "hurr low kicks don't take talent" attitude his brother had at the end was obnoxious.
>>1073159
Alright, thanks.
>>
>>1073118
>plus wrestling or BJJ?
>>1073118
>Basically, I want to be able to defend myself if attacked.
Judo is a great grappling art for self defense, since it focuses on stand up, and they use a gi.
Unless it's sunny all day every day, people wear at least pants and a sweater, so you can use all the gi related grappling.
>>
>>1054461
Because they don't act like a bunch of weak ass faggots who don't fucking fight. JJ is a fucking joke compared to Judo or BJJ.
>>
>>1073206
A bit of an over generalization. alot of Japanese jujutsu styles spar or cross train in judo or other grappling arts as the rule or the norm
>>
>>1073245
that action pic is a kata, show me hitting that move with someone resisting.
>>
>>1073247
That school actually does spar, but they have very few public videos available and like most Japanese schools don't demonstrate their free play.
>>
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>>1073186
last night we had a MMA match end with low kicks
webm unrelated fight but same kind of finish

https://streamable.com/dmcg
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>>1073284
can someone make a webm of that streamble?
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>>1071402
this is /asp/ cross training is forbidden here.
>>
>>1073118
Your cheapest option would be to join a boxing gym for striking and then take judo at the YMCA. If you can afford an MMA gym i would just go there though.
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the MA's under the fundamentals are the only ones that matter.Sambo is the best base for MMA.
>>
>>1074621
>If you can afford an MMA gym i would just go there though.
If you can afford something else, you can save up for an MMA gym.
>>
>>1074806
no not really. boxing and judo are both way cheaper than mma gyms.
>>
>>1074676
I thought there were a couple CMAs that basically were kickboxing with some grappling thrown in, that were just less popular because they don't get used in kung fu movies.
>>
>>1078385
those are pretty rare for the most part and i guess can be throw in with the kickboxing category.
>>
>>1076326
That just means you have to save up for longer if you're in that situation.
>>
>>1078385
Sanda/Sanshou is a pretty popular one on /asp/.
I'd say it's more like Muay Thai than it is like Kickboxing.
>>
How does BJJ + Kickboxing sound?
>>
>>1080592
>592▶
>How does BJJ + Kickboxing sound?
cliche
every MMA meathead does that
>>
>>1080595
>>1080595

Because it's good lol and gyms usually offer them together
>>
>>1080595

I dunno it's pretty evenly balanced.
>>
>>1080667
>2 arts
>being balanced
No, just no.

>2 arts
>one of them that's 99.99% ground game
No.

>Muay Thai
It's balanced, it's got structure, but it lacks the substance that styles of Kickboxing and Boxing provides.

It's 2016, modern, more revolutionary people and gyms, are using hybrid arts; a hybrid grappling and striking art, composed of hybrid striking arts, and hybrid grappling arts.

Some people stick to the older, more narrow approach, and they still win, but they could win more and or better, if they used hammers instead of rocks.
>>
>>1080798
you're making it sound like MT is completely archaic and that's a bunch of bull a lot of those hybrid gyms keep going back to Thailand to learn and grab moves, so its not like MT is completely outclassed
>>
>>1073206
>Comparing a sport originating from the original and thinks it's better. Please
How are JJ fighters faggots in any way? What differences them from BJJ fighters except that they fight standing up most of the time rather than grappling on the ground. Both sports are equally efficient in defeating your opponent....
>>
>>1073206
Also how is JJ a joke compared to judo? They are very similar sports with different rules but the ideas behind them are the same.
>>
>>1080805
>you're making it sound like MT is completely archaic
Compared to modern MMA, even compared to modern Muay Thai, traditional Muay Thai is pretty low-tier.

There's only two kicks in Muay Thai.
The "Side Teep" didn't exist in Muay Thai until Kickboxing came along.

European Muay Thai is differentiated from Muay Thai for a reason. European Muay Thai is more like Kickboxing, European Muay Thai fighters are lighter on their feet, and they use more Western Boxing.

Modern Muay Thai is really Muay Thai + Kickboxing + Boxing.
It's a whole different sport compared to Muay Thai, traditional Muay Thai.

>so it's not like MT is completely outclassed
I never said it was completely outclassed, I clearly stated:
>It's balanced, it's got structure, but it lacks the substance that styles of Kickboxing and Boxing provides.

For a striking based art, it's balanced. Compared to Western Boxing, Taekwondo, American Kickboxing; it's got knees and elbows, as well as kicks and punches, so it's not a bad striking foundation, for that aspect, even though the footwork is debatable.
>>
>>1054579
Because it looks cool and it's fun.

Hence why i want to practice kuk-sool-won and muay thay on the side, to have the best of both worlds.
>>
>>1054579
>when any mma or kickboxing gym has a legitimate fighting system ready for you.
They can be made better. Some people need to taste exotic dishes like CMAs to help give them ideas about how they could be made better.
Some people just find it entertaining.
>>
>>1054579
>You don't even have to do much interpretation. It's competition tested. It fucking works. Why dance?
Because different people like different styles? And if your not just being retarded and calling TMA`s dancing, Capoiera, specifically uses it's dancing, aside from the cultural and ritualistic uses, in combat to confuse and mislead the opponent; like Drunken Fist Mizongyi and Bagua do.
>and learn 12 TMAs and chop and change them into a fighting system,
Because that's what you supposed to do for every style you train in. You learn the style, improve and keep practicing, and add your own flair to it to make it your own. Boxing an MMA aren't exempt from this. Boxing and MMA are also not exempt from being illegitimate and being taught by mcdojos. Capoiera when not mcdojoified or done by hippies is a legitimate style and , as >>1050477 posted or >>1051039 here, can be used under MMA rules successfully.
>>
>>1082393

>There's only two kicks in Muay Thai.
>The "Side Teep" didn't exist in Muay Thai until Kickboxing came along.

Educate yourself, pleb.
Muay Thai was once a very sophisticated system.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tctvTqNxNdQ


Here's a side kick at 1:08:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LSEyixs5eRs
>>
>>1085855

And if anything, Kickboxing learned stuff from Muay Thai. Not the other way arround:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lpl_7w8-jTE

Let's not forget that "Kickboxing" was originally low tier Karate with a little bit of Western Boxing.

I will admit that Muay Thai has gotten better by the incluence of Western Boxing though.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=braQ5SnX99Q
>>
>>1085858

One more interesting fight was Kianbudit vs. Benny "the Jet" Urquidez. Urquidez was Kickboxing Champion for 27 years and is considered the greatest Kickboxer ever. He's also a pioneer of MMA and has the black belt in Judo, JuJutsu, Shotokan, TKD, Kendo, Kenpo, Kajukenbo and (of course) Kickboxing.

After his first match against "Muay Thai" (back then he thought it was the name of the fighter) - which was also the frist match against a Nak Muay in the states - he said:

"I’d never seen anything like that before. He just stood there tapping the mat with his front toe so I kicked him. But it didn’t do anything. Next I hit him with a ball kick to the body and he still didn’t do anything. This was the first time in my life I’d hit someone and it didn’t budge them. Then this guy kicked me in the legs. That was my first Thai kick. Do you want to know how bad that hurt? Have you ever seen one of those toys that when you squeeze it the eyes pop out? Well that’s how I felt. That kick landed with such power even my ancestors felt it man. I tried to stay away from those kicks by circling him, but he landed a kick to my thigh then he went to my other thigh. I actually jumped in the air and put my hands down on my thighs in an attempt to block em’."
>http://www.usadojo.com/articles/terry-wilson/benny-the-jet.htm


See a berakdown of the fight (starting at 9:23) here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BYwvFIhqSRM
>>
>any martial art not in the top tier

why would you do that to yourself?
>>
>>1085858
Boxing has influenced MT since the 70s
>>
>>1085855
>>1085858
It is yous who is of should being of educating yourself!
>>
>>1086349
that doesnt even make sense
>>
>>1086362
The fault is of not of being mine for you are of being unable to understanding of the words I am of saying.
>>
>>1080595

because it works. we're here to do what works. we're not trying to be edgy or different.
>>
>>1089538
>because it works. we're here to do what works. we're not trying to be edgy or different.
It works, but it's a little outdated.

In the end, Hybrid: Boxing + Kickboxing + Muay Thai + Sanda + Judo + Wrestling + BJJ, works better.
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