How did this meme start that it is immoral to buy a non-shelter

>cross-breed
>get double the genetic diseases

thanks Obama

>>2306737
I honestly think it started with the kennel clubs becoming corrupted in small sections. The AKC for example, besides it's questionable standards it allows, gives puppy mills certifications to breed dogs. It doesn't make puppy mills any more legal, but it does help them be less conspicuous. I've always been of the ideology that if you are going to pay money for an animal, that money should either go to a dedicated reputable breeder or to a nonprofit organization. Getting some byb mutt is fine too as long as you pay less than $100 for it. Honestly $60 would even be pushing it.

Because it's the reality of pet overpopulation

and you're also enabling shitty BYBs and irresponsible owners since only a fraction of breeders are reputable

>>2306795
This

Buy from an actually reputable breeder and there's no problem.

Protip: if your dog came from a store, parking lot, or Mexican, you didn't buy from a reputable breeder

>>2306737
Because there's already enough animals for pets without you paying someone to breed you another.

>>2306799
also 99% of the people on Craigslist, and/or if they're a "designer" or "teacup" breed of anything

>>2306808
The shelters here are 99% pits. So you're basically saying if someone doesn't want a pit bull they shouldn't get a dog.

>>2306737
let my tell you why, I once bought a Scottish terrier pup, House seemed nice the mam and dad were there and the litter was only 3. everything seemed legit so I paid £300 and got my puppy. Took it to the vet and they could tell what Irish puppy farm he was from just by looking at him. he was from a town outside Dublin called Blessington where they have a barn full of dogs they breed non stop for profit..

Because it's all wealthy white people's fault, not the rednecks and Mexicans who filled up the shelters in the first place.

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>>2306781
>how do genes work?

>>2306737
Those floppy ears yo!

maybe from the fact that it IS immoral

>>2306811
>muh instant gratification
You could just be patient and hold out for the 1%.

>>2306831
>the rednecks and Mexicans who filled up the shelters in the first place.

>dog pees on wealthy white person's lambswool rug
>to the shelter it goes

>dog pees on redneck's concrete slab flooring
>hose the floor off and keep the dog outside

Wealthy white people are the ones filling the shelters.

>>2307135
>Wealthy white people are the ones filling the shelters.
I see your reasoning, but considering the majority of dogs available for adoption in shelters are pitbull type dogs and not purebred status symbols I'm going to have to disagree.
Add to the fact that actual wealthy white people are vastly outnumbered by every other demographic and I would say you have absolutely no basis for your argument.
Maybe I'm wrong, who knows. What I can tell you from personal experience from volunteering at two different animal shelters is that I've never seen an upper class person of any race or color adopt or drop off a dog. Maybe they get their servants to do it.

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>>2307136
>having expensive flooring means you'll abandon your dog

I...what....

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>>2307130
Not always anon.
Believe it or not, not every breeder is a BYB, some actually care about the breed and actively try to improve on the overall health by selective breeding. People who are passionate about these specific breeds then support these reputable breeders.
An example would be the outcrossing of Dalmatians to eliminate the recessive gene that causes high ulric acid producing kidney stones in these dogs. If every person who bought thier child a Dalmatian puppy when the Disney movies came out would have bought from and supported LUA breeders instead of BYBs the kidney stone issues with these dogs would be significantly reduced.
All that being said, for the average owner who just wants a pet should strongly consider adoption.

because you're being an elitist speciecist poser by getting a tailor made fashion accessory breed

if you really cared about dogs and animals you'll rescue one

>>2306811
>shelters here are 99% pitbulls
you feeding into the local breeder market won't help that. and I certainly hope you aren't saying that just because of the breed labels are notoriously inaccurate

plus location is a lot of it. I live in a decent area where there pitbulls aren't only owned by white trash and people mostly adopt. so the shelters actually have a wide variety of dogs. Just yesterday there was a miniature poodle puppy and last week a beagle puppy got surrendered. My friend who works at another one just showed me some pics of a corgi and GSD that came in too. Plus of course lots of cute mixes

And dogs labeled pits typically stay in the shelter longer, and other breeds are adopted faster. other dogs are here anon, the pitbulls just "build up" so to speak. It's called putting a little effort in. I was looking for a couple months before I found the perfect dog for me, but it's well worth it. Plus local rescues have other dogs

>>2307136
>>2306831
>>2307140
I've seen it happen. Beagle puppy got surrendered by this white girl because it whined and she didn't want to train the dog. Purebred huskies surrendered because they chased the cat and the owner didn't want to deal with it. GSDs surrendered because they acted the nervous way a GSD acts without intense training. Shih tzus surrendered because the owner didn't want to groom them. dog was used for breeding but got old and wasn't turning a profit anymore. Surrendered.

although for strays it's usually more the lower class who just let their dogs run and don't bother to find them, but for owner surrenders it's definitely the middle/upper class white demographic that I find most infuriating

>>2307149
a lot of Dalmatian breeders also threw a hissy fit about that and don't consider them "real" dalmations because their gene pool is "tainted". reputable breeders are rarer than you make them out to be, and the vast majority of breeders really don't have the best intentions or put animal welfare first

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>>2307231
>reputable breeders are rarer than you make them out to be,
This is correct, you will find many more BYBs than reputable breeders for any dog. If I implied any different I can assure you it wasn't my intention and I apologize for the confusion. With any breed of dog research about that breed needs to be done, this includes sourcing out a breeder who is just not in it for a buck, and is part of your responsibility as a dog owner.
As far as the "purists" who don't believe they are "real", well them and the fags who are more concerned with breed standard and markings than overall health can fuck off. I've talked to many people in the community who feel the same way, there is quite a division between kennels that specialize in show dogs, and kennels that deal with LUA dogs.
There are health problems inherit with the breed. There are breeders who are making every effort possible to correct this. I've been in contact through local and national Dalmatian clubs with breeders who purposely select sires and dams with non standard markings all in an effort to help curb the deafness issue that plagues not just Dalmatians, but other pure bred white dogs.
I guess what I'm saying is that anybody willing to do the regular research required of anyone looking for a specific breed can find a reputable breeder. Anybody who just picks the first dog available that they fancy would do better adopting.
As far as Dalmatians are concerned, here is a great place to start, these are LUA dogs, and recognized by the AKC.
http://www.luadalmatians.com
If you talk to an enthusiast who doesn't believe these are "pure" then you should really consider the source. These people are more concerned with markings and standards than happy healthy dogs.

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>>2307297
pedigreedogsexposed.blogspot
More info on the division between Dalmatian clubs, and LUA breeders.
While the sad fact remains there are far more BYBs more concerned with money than an animals well being, reputable breeders do exist and can be found if you are willing to do the research that should be required of all potential dog owners.

Interesting thread.
I've been meaning to adopt a dig, been visiting the local rescue group at the park every sunday to see the dogs, but never have the balls to actually dew it.
Theres a crosspit something pup thats been for adoption quite a while for now, should I pick her? I dony really like pitbulls in general, so im not sure, but i feel so bad for the fucker.
I heard pitbuls are good running partners

>>2307325
First thing you should consider is if you have the time available to spend with a new dog. If you are leaving a new puppy home alone forn10-12 hours a day then you should have gotten a different pet.
You should have money set back for emergencies. It is not uncommon to rack up $3-4,000 worth of unexpected vet bills. Don't be one of those people making posts on /an/ about how their puppy is deathly ill and you can't afford the vet bills. If you are not financially able to commit to this then don't get a dog.
It is your responsibility to properly train and socialize your new animal. The info is out there, use it.
A new puppy will try your patience, so be prepared, and don't be surprised if things become chewed up around the house. If this is going to be an issue, don't get a dog.
Getting a dog for the first time is not as big of an inconvenience as some might lead you to believe, but it's not as easy as it was "back in the day" because honestly most people are ignorant to proper care and responsibility of pet ownership.
Do your research. Start by Google potty training and puppy training. Good luck.

>>2307231
Fuck. I would kill for a pair of huskies.

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>>2306737
>look at me, I'm so self-righteous, unlike you I RESCUED my dog. That's right I RESCUUUUUUED them. I'm such a good person omg. Praise me. I'm a rescuer. I literally put myself in harms way and removed a dog from a highly-volatile life in a no-kill shelter.
>you didn't RESCUE your dog?! Wow what a shitlord worthy of contempt. Doubt you're even aware of all the negligent owners perpetually abandoning and abusing their dogs which get killed in shelters because of pure-breed buying scum like you. You--whom is not worthy of praise like I am for RESCUING my dog. Don't you dare imply I went to the pound with a preferential breed specific look and that I would've bought my preferred breed from a renowned, legitimate, licensed, and registered breeder like you did. Don't you dare imply I'm just a poorfag with a complex

Leftmost is purebreed. 3k @ 8 weeks and she's considered 'pet quality' because of some minor sootiness in her forepaws and chin. Roast me

>>2307349
Maybe it's just the poorfag childhood in me, but I can't imagine paying that much for a dog.

>>2307349
>roast me
Helen Keller, Ray Charles, Stevie Wonder, and Roy Orbison all could have taken a better pic than you.

>>2307353
Individually or collectively?

>>2307356
All four in the dark room at once.
Imagine the fuckery.

>>2307352
It was about peace of mind honestly. Our last rottweiler was ill her whole life in some way or another. Bad hip came first after her adolescence.
Then the poor girl had to have her nails cut down flush to the paw on all fours. For nearly a month I was the only thing that stopped her bleeding to death in the middle of the night from her paws until the nails "grew back". All thanks to Symmetrical lupoidal onychodystrophy. Something like 1-in-a-million odds. Caused the keratin shell that was her nail to just detach from the sensitive quick underneath like a hood would pop on a car. I'd have to delicately cut the little remnants of skin that'd hold on to the nail after it'd detach. Either that or let it tare and be much worse for her.
Nails that didn't detach were flaky and needed constant maintenence to ensure those flakey areas didn't become cracks or a fulcrum-point to pop the nail off. On top of that, feet with freshly popped nails needed to be submerged in a warm epsom salt bath to keep them as clean as possible and free of infection. As you can imagine, she was on medication for quite awhile along with a strict regiment of vitamins and diet. Eventually, I was able to maintain her well enough that I could forego the medication altogether. Her years without the medicine were the best. She loved going on walks despite her condition.
Then came our battle against cancer. Again she needed medicine. Again it was affecting her negatively. She fought hard. I fought along with her. Pan fried liver for lunch and medium turkey burgers for dinner were a staple during those months. Eventually she just couldn't take it and fluid was filling up her lungs. Fate forced my hand and I held on to her as she drew her final breath in the same vet clinic that took care of her as a puppy. I wanted more than anything for her to live. But I wasn't about to watch her drown. Only 6 years old. Not in the least bit fair.
[Cont.]

>>2307371
After months of devastation I decided that going to work, coming home, and dying inside over losing such a bright part of my life wasn't going to bring her back or give another dog a loving home.
This time, however, I was determined to do everything within my power to ensure I get a dog that's as healthy as possible. If it meant spending a chunk of change and a 5.5hr ride then so be it.
>tl;dr--my other dog was sick her whole life and eventually died at a young age. This time around I made sure to purchase my dog from a breeder that is 100% legitimate whose dogs are individually and generationally tracked, health tested, and from a verifiably healthy lineage.

>>2307345
It's a constant thing, shelters get way more huskies than people expect because they're fucking insane and people don't expect it

>>2306737
More of an over population issue the way I see it. Reputable breeders are fine sure, but your average normie doesn't spend hours looking for verified, documented breeders and won't ask for any documentation of lineage and we get all these shitty kennels with awful conditions and tons of strays, especially in the city.

When I get my own property with a couple acres I'd love to have a malamute, it's going to be hard to find one but I'm pretty sure there's a couple malamute specific rescues around the country. Don't mind driving a couple states over anyway

[spoiler]Same for humans too tbqh, abandoning eugenics in the first half of the century was a mistake[/spoiler]

>>2307349
>>2307371
>>2307386
>insisting on getting a purebred of an extremely unhealthy breed
>dog is sickly it's whole life
gee what a surprise

>>2307395
>extremely unhealthy breed
You must be referring to pugs or inbred pits. Other then those you're just shitposting.
I own two extremely healthy rotties currently and breeders like the one I went to have more just like them.
It's more like you get what you pay for.

>>2307400
they're going to die when they're 10 or 12 at the very best and you still might not realize how wrong you are because you don't know what a healthy dog looks like.

I find it frustrating that many people are so against BYBs and puppy mills but go and buy a pure pred, spend hundreds or even thousands, and then act outraged when it has kennel cough and worms etc. because it came from one of the many puppy mills in my state. I find it to be hypocritical.
If they really cared, they would go to a breed specific rescue group or to the local shelter. I always hear the 1/3 of dogs at shelters are pure breds fact spouted. I continue to say it regardless if it's true just to get people to go to shelters. Maybe their hearts will melt at the sight of a mutt.

>>2307353
Roy Orbison wasn't blind he just liked wearing sun glasses on tour.

>>2307147
People throw away dogs because the dogs are costing them valuable time or they're ruining valuable possessions.
Neither poor people's time nor possessions are valuable, so there's little the dog could do to make it not worth keeping.

More than the economical cost of getting a purebred dog, what really made it a painful process for me was wading through the shit people that are the dog breeders. the government isnt completely oblivious to animal welfare where I live, so most breeders actually sell every single puppy for a high as fuck price.

The thing about good dog breeders is that they are stupid as fuck and know absolutely nothing about anything other than dogs. Because of this they tend to think their knowledge is very rare and special, when obviously it just isnt. Its not just breeders, its dog people in general. People who get too focused on their dogs often start to imagine that they possess some kind of special dog knowledge that can only be obtained by being a stupid fuck about anything other than dogs, and as such they begin to judge other dog owners and express themselves condescendingly and shamelessly about how other people treat or raise their dogs, offering advice where it isnt in any way asked for or appreciated and being childish little bitches in general.
In reality their knowledge is equal to what you'd obtain from like two books and one dog ownership.
What Im getting at is that breed fanatics are dog people, and dog people are unreasonable little shits by default. Therefor there can never be fruitful discussion about how dog breeds are and have been utterly destroyed by artificial standards set by stupid fucks for the last 100 or so years, mutating the already mutated shit heap animals they had back then into the sometimes almost unrecognizable freak show screwups we pay good money for today.
The breed orgs will only get worse so if you like a particular breed enough to want to keep owning it you better be prepared to work on some breeding of your own if you plan on being a tightly wound bitch of a dog owner talking from a high horse like the rest of the vocal majority

Millions of wonderful dogs are being killed at shelters, and people have the audacity to intentionally create MORE dogs?

It's disgusting.

Only the tiniest number of dog keepers "need" a specialized breed of dog for some kind of utilitarian purpose. Dog-keeping is normally undertaken either for the sake of fancy, or out of compassion for the dogs who would otherwise suffer.

If one wants to become a dog-keeper for the sake of fancy, then one can also be compassionate and adopt a dog and save his life, rather than contributing to an industry that simply churns out dogs for "love of the breed" ("breeds" aren't moral subjects, unlike individual dogs) and for profit.

Im allergic and there are no poodles or other non shedding dogs to be found from shelters here. A couple of years ago I tried to adopt a lagotto, but the owner didnt like me. I tried to buy a three year old poodle a few months ago, but the owner had tens of offers. I made inquiries whenever suitable dogs appeared on the market, but they never picked me. Finally I just found a breeder because I want to take my new dog with me hiking in the woods this summer.

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>>2307449
>there are no poodles or other non shedding dogs to be found from shelters here
then you're not looking hard enough you fucking faggot.
go fuck yourself and your rationalizations as to why you support BYBs.
youre a lazy turd and should be executed

>>2307400
>I own two healthy rotties
yeah, because most of the bad shit doesn't hit before they're two years old. saying your dog is healthy before that isn't anything to brag about, it's called doing the bare minimum

and sorry if you don't like it, but rotties are prone to a fuckton of health issues and are not a healthy breed. no amount of money on a reputable breeder changes that. Makes it less likely they will get sick from some breed specific issues, but some breeds are generally less healthy than others. Rotties are one of those breeds

god breedfags are annoying. Acting like the breed of dog they've become obsessed with is so amazing and special and exempt from being flawed. it's so irritating

>>2307449
>Im allergic and there are no poodles or other non shedding dogs to be found from shelters here
>poodles and non shedding dogs
>allergies
you know that's a myth right?

>>2307474
Im not in america, stupid. There arent really shelters here at all, because we dont have the widespread dog problems that you guys have, we are just a lot less retarded than you guys.
There is absolutely nothing wrong with the breeder we chose either, she is reputable as fuck and the pups and dogs are all happy as shit.

>>2307480
You have no fucking idea what youre talking about.

>>2307626
Poodles are not hypoallergenic in general.
In fact, youll never find a hypoallergenic dog, you have to actually order one specially made for you.

>>2307449

Things that never happened. But fine, where are you?

>>2307638
Im not looking for a hypoallergenic dog, Im looking for a dog that I dont have an allergic reaction to. That happens to be non shedding types. Poodles, lagottos, portugese water dogs, cresteds, etc

>>2307626
>There arent really shelters here at all, because we dont have the widespread dog problems that you guys have, we are just a lot less retarded than you guys.

If you're so much less retarded, why the fuck are you wasting everyone's time with your stupid, shitty story no one asked for or cares about? Why don't you have any ability to follow a conversation or at least a fucking filter that stops you spewing out every dumb ass thing that crosses your mind and keeps you from embarrassing yourself?

>>2307136
>dog pees on redneck's concrete slab flooring
>hose the floor off and keep the dog outside

You missed part of the story anon:

>keep the dog outside *not contained in any way
>rednecks too poor and apathetic to get the dog neutered/spayed or take care of it properly
>dog has tons of puppies
>dog is covered in fleas
>dog is constantly at the mercy of angry redneck neighbors shooting it with BB guns and hitting it with their car

Seriously, the above is your average redneck dog owner. Rednecks may not surrender their dogs to shelters themselves, but they just don't take care of them and often straight up abandon them when they move. Plus, all those unregulated litters of puppies contribute to overpopulation... A lot of those dogs end up in shelters.

>>2307661

There's no such thing as a living creature that doesn't shed, wether it's a crystacean shedding it's shell and bristles, a dog shedding fur and skin, or a human shedding hair, skin, and nails. You're a complete fucking moron.

>>2307659
It doesnt matter where I am, if what I say doesnt fit your narrative you blow it off as a lie.

>>2307663
I'll talk about whatever I want, its your own responsibility to stay out when you get too emotional.

>>2307666
Oh, Im so sorry, pendantic satan, I obviously should have specified that I mean the continous shedding of a dogs coat, particularly during spring time. Obviously though, I was previously unaware that living creatures shed and thought every cell lasted a doggy lifetime.

I did specify that I have an allergic reaction to some dogs, and not to others. Unless you are disputing this your contribution is pretty meaningless.

>>2307663
He's most likely from Sweden. Besides 3rd world countries Sweden is one of the few countries that doesn't have many shelters as they don't have much of a homeless pet issue

Sweden YES

There is literally nothing but pits and pit mixes in shelters here. I wanted a dog like I grew up with. Don't care if some self-righteous dipshits are mad about it. Maybe they should get mad at all the trash people buying and breeding pit bulls in the first place.

>>2307231
>because I live where there is every kind of dog in the shelter everyone else does

Don't be dense.

And the "rescues" are full of psychotic PETA fags who want to inspect your house and shit.

It's hard to find a decent dog to adopt if you don't want a pit mix.

Don't ever have a child. You're a specieist, designer baby evil person! You should only adopt children from all the completely faultless third worlders.

sure, I'll take a PTSD shelter pitbull and bring it grouse hunting. I love my meat tender and ripped to shreds.

>>2307626
>You have no fucking idea what youre talking about
the meme of non shedding breeds being hypoallergenic and cleaner is to just to get soccer moms to shell out big bucks for a designer poodle cross mutt

>http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0091674912007932
>http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/ocean/ajra/2011/00000025/00000004/art00021

>>2307712
The point is that you live in a shitty area friendo. and driving to another city for a dog really isn't a big deal, especially since if you insist on going to a breeder for a specific dog, you likely will have to drive a distance to even find a reputable breeder to begin with

>psychotic rescue meme
the vast majority aren't like that. how many have you actually tried? and reputable breeders are typically just as "invasive" as average rescues are, if not more

>>2307349
Wait I'm retarded what kind of doggos are those? About how large are they? The pup I adopted looks identical to them and I was told she was a "lab mix"

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>mfw living in a country with no stray dogs and barely any rescues
>small enough that shitty breeders are quickly shamed to death
>due to lack of homeless dogs retards start rescuing dogs from other countries and cause some issues while doing that
cold winters and mostly good attitudes towards dogs sure help though

>>2307406
Sorry, catfag, 10-12 is normal for large breeds. If they somehow manage to make it there then 15 is practically archaic.
>dont know what a healthy dog looks like
Nice logical fallacy.
>>2307478
I'm more than aware of the health predispositions of the breed. What seems to be escaping you, however, is the idea of genetics. So let me break it down for you in a way you may comprehend.
Your great-grandparents were ugly and fat as hell.
Your grandparents are ugly and fat as hell.
Now you're ugly and fat as hell.
If you have kids then they're ugly and probably getting fat as hell.
Do you see where this is going yet? It's about genetics, simpleton. If your parents had been attractive, hell, if anyone that spawned your brood had been physically and aesthetically superior then you'd also stand a slight chance of being average.
It's the same with dogs. Track their lineage and if they've all been show winning, good hipped, cancer free, strong gaited, and obedient then there's a high probability the product of those dogs will be too.
Tbh, you seem like the exact type of person I described earlier. Self-righteous and too fuckin poor to afford the cost of a purebred, papered dog with a verifiably healthy lineage.
Sucks to be poor I guess. Work harder.

>>2307792
One on the left is purebred european rottie while the one on the right is a rescue which we believe may be mixed with rottie and doberman, or possibly rottie and lab.

>>2307480
Wow.

>ITT
>people who hate every breeder because they group them up with bybs and mills, assuming that truly is what a breeder is
>they get told off that that is not true and then complain that every person is shitty for not looking "hard" enough
>get proved otherwise
>they can't argue back because there is no argument and they'll look like asses doing it.

>>2307812
kek, they triggered you pretty hard

>>2307845
Nice samefagging

One dog has the environmental footprint of two large cars. There is nothing moral about owning pets that dont serve a very necessary purpose.
We are all shit people, and I genuinely hope that keeping pets without strongly regulated permits will be illegal at some point. Also two child policy with the intent to go one child after a while.

>>2307871
you really have to work hard to find non triggered posts in this thread desu

>>2307812
>10-12 is normal for unhealthy breeds
Yeah

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>>2306783
>Mutt (no papers, no information about parent, no vet check, no vaccinated) 600-800$
>Pure-bred (papers, vet check and vaccinated) 800-1000$

Only in my country

>>2307872
That was my first post.

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>>2307989
>One dog has the environmental footprint of two large cars.

>>2308459
Im not him, but this is a quick google that you could have done yourself.
http://www.salon.com/2014/11/20/the_surprisingly_large_carbon_paw_print_of_your_beloved_pet_partner/

>A 2009 study by New Zealand’s Victoria University of Wellington concluded that pet dogs have carbon paw prints double that of a typical SUV.

>>2308462
I thought the same thing when I seen that post and I Google it as well.
Kinda surprised that they were right, it sounds so over the top and fanatical.

>>2308462
1. It's not my job to prove other people right or wrong.
2. Not a peer-reviewed study. In fact, hardly seems like a "study" at all.
3. The numbers and assumptions they used are highly debatable.

http://grist.org/article/dogs-vs-suvs/

Do pets have an environmental impact? Sure, but I'm not going to resort to regurgitating shitty pseudo science and misinformation to make a point.