Why do liberal city idiots get up in arms whenever people who

>>2248003
cats would be a better example.

swans are a non-issue.

>>2248005
>>2248005
Mute swans aren't a non-issue for native ducks and seabirds. And they could be realistically outlawed and eradicated at this point.

Cats are horrible too and ideally wouldn't be legal pets - but that's a much taller order.

>>2248014
ducks and seabirds aren't declining due to swans mate.

swans are large pretty largely harmless animals that are just slightly annoying.

Sure they're invasive, but not horribly so. Whens the last time you've seen a shitload of swans anywhere?

>>2248024
we have a lot of swans here, but they're not invasive.

and the fucking chinese keep stealing them.

>>2248005
I would think the reason liberals refuse to do anything or even listen to common sense would be the same in both cases.
>muh precious kitties
>muh elegant swans

>>2248014
Yes, they are. Logically, how the fuck could they not? Wetlands are limited anyway, and the mute swan eats way more food than any native swan or, obviously, duck, and are more territorial and aggressive. They also destroy ground nests of seabirds like terns or skimmers.

Most states already have "management" of them. So how exactly are they a "non-issue" in your opinion?

>>2248029
comparing swans to cats is like comparing the flu to cancer.

>>2248024
You don't see a shitload because they're territorial. "Not horribly so" doesn't mean anything - considering how much vegetation a mute swan eats relative to native birds, one or two in a pond means effectively a bunch of natives can no longer use it.

>>2248035
I agree with this, and I'm not comparing. I'm saying they use the same excuse to validate their ignorance.

>>2248037
if anything swans only increase the amount of biodiversity because they're cunts.

>>2248029
I just don't understand how city-dwelling people with almost no connection to wildlife, can somehow doubt the opinions of people who literally studied and made a career of ecology.

As per the mute swan example, the State Department of Environmental Conservation made plans to eradicate them a few years ago, and was supported by hunters etc upstate. But the plan was protested and shot down by NYC liberals.

Similarly, we can't mass euthanize ferals or ban outdoor cats because of these idiots.

>>2248045
Because instead of using logic to formulate an educated opinion, they use emotion.
They can't see that a cat or swan has any negative effects because they are pretty.

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>>2248003
I think it is because they are typically white Americans, whom see these invasive animals as almost symbolic to themselves... Invasive.

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>>2248003
Depends on what do you mean by "liberals". It is not even just "liberals". Even rightwingers like to preserve animals, are against hunting, and against animal cruelty (which I will get more on to later on).


Furthermore, it depends on what do you mean by "exterminate". The last thing we need are a bunch of pro-gun nutjobs or sword-collecting nitwits going on a bloodlust killing spree, as if they are inanimate objects rather than living creatures; can really be breaching animal cruelty.
It also depends on whether the animal is even a legit issue, as are pythons in Florida; swans are generally not a real issue.

>>2248216
>swans are generally not a real issue

Then why are they "managed" in every state they've invaded and why was there plans to eradicate them in New York very recently?

Don't just say it's not an issue when you don't know anything about it.

I would guess very few "right wing" people are against hunting in the United States. Look at electoral maps - every rural area in the country is Republican. I don't know about other countries.

And mute swans are "preserved" in the countries they originally came from. It's not an issue of "preservation" - it's feels fags disagreeing with actual experts.

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>>2248206
It's like why the phrase "as American as apple pie" exist...

Apple pie was actually invented in Britain, which was brought in to America by said people whom settled there... As in, it lives there (an American favorite), despite origins being elsewhere.

>>2248220
>it's feels fags disagreeing with actual experts.
/thread

I remember back in highschool, a friend found a baby Cuban Knight Anole, and was in love with it. I told her that they should be eradicated because of what they've done to our native animals. And she got into an autistic fit about me being so cruel to a harmless lizard, and doesn't care about animals being native and nonnative. God, I hate my city.

>>2248241
maybe you shouldn't have sperged out on her?

>>2248245
I didn't she sperged on me.

>>2248249
Not everyone is an animal nerd, you will never educate people if you make enemies out of them.

>>2248252
I watched people in my highschool have an epiphany after learning people have two lungs. A fucking 16 year old went through life thinking people only have one lung.

>>2248254
See this is the problem. Either people have shit science classes or just don't pay attention...I remember learning about harmfulness of invasive species in middle school.

>>2248014
>>2248005
This. OP, you're a retard. Mute Swans aren't a weed species. They're only present where introduced like Peafowl. Next you'll be advocating for burning down zoos and botanical gardens for having Guinea Fowl.

>>2248033
Don't see a lot of Mute Swans in wild wetlands, retard.

>>2248220
Pick something that makes more sense, moron. Like mustangs or cats, which have already been mentioned. And unless you're actively promoting reintroducing Trumpeters, shut the everloving fuck up.

>>2248227
OP had a good point, but he almost entirely invalidated it by choosing a fuckretarded example when there were so many much better ones.

>>2248296
>They're only present where introduced like Peafowl

No they aren't. Otherwise they would not need to be managed at all. I live in Virginia in Appalachia and know of at least two lakes with mutes. There's no fucking way anyone around here "introduced" them.

>>2248299
How is it a fuckretarded example when NY State Department of Environmental Conservation specifically wanted to exterminate them and was blocked by NYC liberals?

>>2248298
>And unless you're actively promoting reintroducing Trumpeters

What does that have to do with anything? Are you implying that mutes are inhabiting some niche previously taken by trumpeters or that people have to have white swans to look at or...what? Doesn't make any sense.

>>2248296
>>2248298
>>2248299
Please explain how mutes are "not a problem" when they are considered a problem by professional ecologists and wildlife management.

>>2248306
>How is it a fuckretarded example when NY State Department of Environmental Conservation specifically wanted to exterminate them and was blocked by NYC liberals?
Alright, I already understood your point, but you REALLY should have chose a better example. Mustangs in the west are a much better example. They're not anyone's pets, they're widespread, people are protecting them and they're not native.

>>2248311
They're not in my area. I guess I'm not as familiar with yours. All I've ever heard has called them adventive at best.

>>2248312
I don't know anything about western US. So why would I say anything about mustangs?

Seems like you just called me an idiot and said mute swans are a bad example when you just admitted you literally know nothing about it besides what you've "heard".

>>2248314
Mustangs are MUCH more widespread than Mute Swans. Globally, in fact. Or at least I believe so. I'd have to check now that I think of it. Certainly is more widely known anyway. And I don't live in the West. I live in the East, which shows you just how limited a problem they are. It's just your area.

>>2248312
What is "your area"? If you have a decent number of mutes, google it and most likely there is already some management plan in place.

>>2248316
Why does it matter how widespread the problem is? What is your point? I chose mute swans because I'm familiar with them. Doesn't make it a "fucktarded" example when it's a clear-cut case of exactly what I stated in OP.

>>2248310
Because why the fuck are you so concerned with removing a non-native animal, but not reintroducing it's native replacement? You honestly just sound like a fucking edgefaggot who wants to kill some animals.

>>2248318
I dunno. I work with wildlife a lot in the state and I've never heard anyone mention them here. Wetlands are sort of my focus too.

>What is your point?
My point was I'd never heard anyone even mention them as anything but adventive, which isn't a problem. Maybe they are in your area. Maybe they even are in mine, but I've never heard anyone bring it up.

>Doesn't make it a "fucktarded" example when it's a clear-cut case of exactly what I stated in OP.
Dude. I focus on wetlands and I live in the East also and I've NEVER heard anyone say anything about this. Not DNR, we certainly don't have ANY of them locally, not zoos, nobody. Never heard it before. But I have heard of cats, feral dogs, mustangs/brumbies/etc. Hell I'm even aware of Camels and Rabbits and Cane Toads in Australia, but never Mute Swans to my recollection. That's why it's a poor example.

And to answer your original question, I'm sorry to inform you of this, and you probably won't believe me, but you will NEVER change this. People like the animals they think are pretty. NOBODY in this godforsaken country cares about the environment. People actually protect fucking Burros in the Southwest. At least you can argue that Equus ferus MIGHT have been here historically in some form (but for damn sure not the form of Spanish domesticated horses), but fucking donkeys? The normies will always win and all they care about is what they like. Every DNR is shit. Every park district is shit. All they focus on is giving permission to hunters, anglers and hikers to rape the fuck out of nature any way they see fit and sometimes they introduce some native plants on microscopic patches or """""""manage""""""" a historic area. And that's it. The public will NEVER remove non-native species. If you truly care about this issue, you're going to have to wait for human depopulation to do anything about it.

>>2248326
Why are you assuming the mute just "replaced" the trumpeter in whatever habitat it's in? What the fuck are you even talking about?

>>2248328
What state are you in? Google your state if there is significant mutes and there is likely a management plan and outlawing of introduction.

>>2248329
Oh my god you're literally, actually retarded. How much more do I have to sound it out for your retarded, pea brain holy fuck? I literally just explained what I fucking meant in detail and your response is "What do you mean HURR I'M FUCKING RETARDED!!"

So are you concerned about wildlife or do you just want to kill something? Because if you actually gave a flying shit about native Swans you'd be concerned about Trumpeter reintroduction, which you are clearly not. You REALLY want to neck some Mute Swans though.

You want to know what I think? I think you see something other people think is pretty and you know is pretty too, but you've finally found a contrarian way of justifying to yourself why you can now get to destroy something other people like and hurt a living thing in the process. You just sound like another sick fuck on a board full of sick fucks.

>>2248331
K, why do you care? You clearly have already indicated you do not.

>>2248328
Why is it a poor example when New York State specifically wanted to eradicate them and anyone can easily look up that information?

I just don't get what your point is. Because you were unaware of a fact it's not a fact?

>>2248332
What are you even talking about???

Fact: mute swans are a harmful invasive species.

Fact: it is illegal to introduce any new mute swans in some states.

Fact: they were to be specifically eradicated by the state of New York, but we're not due to the feelings of NYCers.

That's what this thread is about.

What do trumpeter swans have to do with anything??? "Destroy a thing other people like", "sick fuck"...what are you even talking about?

>>2248335
>Fact: mute swans are a harmful invasive species.
K.
>Fact: it is illegal to introduce any new mute swans in some states.
K.
>Fact: they were to be specifically eradicated by the state of New York, but we're not due to the feelings of NYCers.
K.

Now why do YOU care? You already have basically agreed you don't give a flying fuck about the environment. Yet, as I said you still really want to kill these fucking swans for some reason.

>What do trumpeter swans have to do with anything
Alright, at this point, I'm just going to take this as an admission of guilt on your part. You don't give a shit about the environment. You just want to kill. Get the fuck off this board right now, you insufferable faggot.

>>2248337
>You already have basically agreed you don't give a flying fuck about the environment.

When did I agree to that???

What the fuck?

>>2248337
>thinks a non-native species is harmful
>just wants to kill

What the fuck?

>>2248338
Alright, this is just amusing now, so I'm going to try to figure out if you're actually like literally retarded or something.

Step 1: Do you know what a native species is?
Step 2: Why do you care that there are non-native species present, yet FOR SOME REASON you don't care about MISSING NATIVE species. - IFFFFF you actually CARED about the environment, you would care about BOTH issues, yet YOU DO NOT.

HOW.

MUCH.

MORE.

FUCKING.

CLEAR.

DO.

I.

HAVE.

TO.

MAKE.

THIS?

If you only care about killing the Mute Swans, but you couldn't care less about reintroducing species that BELONG WHERE THEY NOW ARE WHICH ARE MISSING, then what is your agenda here? Jesus Fuck you're denser than fucking Osmium, kid.

>>2248340
Huh?cHow do you know I don't care about both issues?

This thread isn't about the re-introduction of trumpeter swan. It's about eradicating non-natives.

>>2248341
You know what? I just re-read you OP.

>liberal
There it is. I was right the entire time and didn't even realize the answer was right in your OP. You're a conservacuck. You hate nature. You really do just want to kill something and feel justified for it. The reason you're acting dumb is because you were shocked someone countered your attempt at self-righteousness. You son of a bitch. Piss off to the NRA's website or something.

>>2248340
And how do you know trumpeter swans "belong" wherever mute swans are?

>>2248341
And for your information, in the West, it's CONSERVASHITS who are staunchly against the removal of non-native horses and donkeys. So suck a dick, kid.

>>2248343
Trumpeters are native to most of the continental US. At least the northern half-ish. It's kind of hard to know for sure since hunters wiped them out so fast.

>>2248342
I don't know what your problem is. I don't even hunt, though most of my family does. I'm a birder and press leaves - that's how much I "hate nature". I just get tired of ignorant liberals "protecting" species that don't need it. That's all this thread was about. Calm the fuck down.

>>2248345
>ignorant liberals
Speak for yourself, you dumb fuck. You're sitting here bitching about how you don't get to kill Mute Swans without even knowing you have a native Swan in your range. Because that's all fucking conservakikes do - destroy. You can't even grasp how to regenerate or protect anything valuable.

>>2248346
I'm aware of trumpeter swans. I don't know what you're talking about. You seem angry for no fucking reason and throwing accusations about me for no fucking reason.

>>2248347
Yeah yeah and you're throwing accusations at liberals for no reason other than because all Trumptards are butthurt little maniacs. Next time you want to post a shit thread, Don't. And go ahead and look up just who is protecting feral horses and donkeys. Or how the cattle ranchers in the West have raped the majority of the remaining megafauna and have basically taken over Yellowstone's management policies forcing them to regularly kill some of the last purebred Bison left on Earth to protect their fucking cattle from a disease THEY gave to Bison.

>>2248349
Come on guy. I don't really give a fuck about national politics, I hate Trump, but everyone knows what I mean by city liberals. Are you really getting all upset over this just because of political identity BS?

The ranchers probably suck too - I don't know much about that. Hence why I didn't make a thread about it.

Jesus fuck this thread went to shit. Sad because OP has a point.

Invasive species that are cute/pretty get a pass (muh cute kitties! muh majestic mustangs! muh pretty swans!) because feels before reals. You know damn well these idiots don't have the same attitude towards animals like cane toads or invasive insects, despite all of them equally invasive and damaging.

>>2248003
>invasive animals

They were brought there by people, they didn't "invade" your land on their own. They have no concept of borders or where they belong or even where they are. Let the things just live their lives and let people enjoy them.

>>2248206
Maybe that's why they want to import so many invasive muslims

>>2248306
swans are only 'managed' because capturing and selling them makes a lot of money.

the chinese pay up to 20k for them.

>>2248045

>I just don't understand how city-dwelling people with almost no connection to wildlife, can somehow doubt the opinions of people who literally studied and made a career of ecology.

There's nothing wrong with them doubting that. A healthy dose of skepticism is good all around, especially when it comes to "professionals".

>>2248794
Moron. Instead of getting into semantics, accept that 'invasive' and 'introduced' are both functionally the same. Also try to avoid the whole emotional path of 'leave everything alone because feelings', it makes you sound retarded.

>>2248839
"Skepticism" is just bald ignorance when you literally don't comprehend what you're advocating.

>>2248842
I never mentioned feelings. But to kill things just because they are foreign is pretty cold.

>>2248003
Because of the killing is bad moral. Which is good when the animal/plant isn't killing other species and reducing biodiversity (not the case)
Or because of the climate change tier argument "Hey it has happened before naturaly so why bother?" (I actually had to hear this from a Doctor in Zoology).

>>2248003
becase they don't know what invasive species are and what they do to native species

oh yes, and because "killing animals is ebil"

>>2248045
just like rednecks denying anthropogenic global warming.

>hurr my morbidly obese overweight friend told me that fawks news told him that 99% of all scientists are lying about global warming DUUURRRRRRR
sure thing, bud

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>>2248794
>>2249978
REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE GET OFF MY BOARD REEEEEEEEEEEEEE

now that that's out of the way, invasive species outcompete and kill native species, possibly leading to their extinction. This has happened too many times to count. Swans, cane toads, Nile perch, longhorn beetles, African Giant Snail etc. Consider the introduced brown tree snakes on Guam, who are eating the native birds (who have never had the chance to evolve anti-snake countermeasures) to extinction.

Sure, it isn't the tree snake's fault it was brought to Guam. Humans brought it there.

But it's there. It's irreversibly wiping out species. So it has to be killed. I realize it's pretty shitty that animals have to suffer for human's folly but if you let the snakes run amok even more animals are gonna bite the dust.

I'm not trying to be an edgelord but your feelings mean literally jackshit out in the natural world. So do mine desu. However the FACTS are that your swans, snakes, mongooses, cane toads, prickly pears, kudzu and all are fucking up the ecosystem, possibly irreversibly.

>>2248351
OP you're a saint for putting up with all the bullshit and denial in this thread

>>2248832
I'm gonna catch me some swan next summer..

>>2251437
People should leave North America then, they are an invasive species.

>>2252011
t. a retard

>>2252011
how's it feel being a 13 year old edgelord?

>>2252011
Sure, that's a realistic solution.
What did you really think you would accomplish with this post? Did you think people would agree? Do you like getting (You)'s as a result of your ignorance?
Really I'm curious as to how your flawed mind works. I'd like to see life through the eyes of a complete retard, please enlighten me.
>this is sarcasm faggot, you don't have to hurt yourself by trying to respond