Any other parents, I'd love some advice. Been very frustrated

It's hard for a child so young to really understand what "appreciate" even means. Certain words don't gain their full connotation until the right experience. She would probably have to lose something she really loves and can't buy another of in order to get that sense for inherent value and without that, talking isn't going to do much.

>>18232115
Combination of carrot and stick. When she DOES do something right make sure you give her lots of praise. When she refuses to do something, take something away (TV, computer, phone, etc...)

Also sometimes peer pressure works better. If she doesn't want to brush her hair before school, just tell her that's fine and that most of her friends won't notice anyway. A few "what's the matter with your hair" from peers will get her brushing again.

>>18232163
No she just played the victim and says other kids are being mean to her, nothing is ever her problem. She acts like everything is so unfair, like your being an ass hole by even asking her to do things in the first place. She thinks she should just be able to do what she wants all the time and that rolls don't apply to her. No matter how much we try to explain that everyone has to get dressed, or that everyone has to do homework, she thinks she's some how above having to do those things and that anyone who asks her to is just mean. She won't clean her room or do school work or even brush her teeth. It's so hard to deal with, I'm so worried about her. She's getting so behind in school they are talking about holding her back.

>>18232191
You can't put a fucking 9 year old girl in her place? Pathetic.

Crack her one.

Right across the face when she's mid tantrum.

Don't let this develop into "behavioural issues". Increase the discipline and she will stop.

Sounds either really spoiled or some emotional problem, does she get picked on in school? I'm no child expert, but I was pretty bad at this age too, nothing could stop my stubbornness and I too wonder if something could have been done to help the situation.

>>18232191
Arbitrary rules don't make sense to some kids. Maybe explain to her why brushing her hair and doing homework are necessary rather than relying on the good old "everyone is doing it". Would you accept "everyone is doing it" when she starts smoking weed, or acting out in some other way?

Also the fact that you come to 4chan to ask a bunch of roasties and 19 year olds, rather than consult a real book on parenting techniques, is a bit of an indicator about your own level of intelligence and parenting skill. Kids have different temperments. Some will do whatever you say, just because you say so. Others just won't accept it.

You also seem less concerned with making her an integrated member of society, than you are with just getting her to blindly obey you so that your life becomes easier. Have you tried asking her why she feels like she doesn't have to do these things, and understanding her in general? Do other adults respect you? Do you have your life together? If you're not someone worth respecting kids will definitely pick up on that.

>>18232273
She dosen't have tantrums she is just defiant and won't do things when told to. I will not hit her, she has gotten a few spankings but not many. I don't think that gets through to her at all she just feels like the punishment is unfair and feels sorry for herself. She dosen't connect that what is did was wrong and she got in trouble because of her own actions.

>>18232274
This exactly she is just so stubborn. She is a bit spoiled mostly from our extended family. My husband and I are not crazy with spoiling her. We try to reword good behavior but not just give her bunches of stuff for no reason.

>>18232281
Wow your a condescending one. Yes of corse I've asked her, the answer is always because I feel like it or because I don't want to. She just gives you this pissy look and won't explain Anything beyond that. I've read a lot of parenting articles but haven't found much that has helped her teachers are at a loss too. My biggest concern is her functioning in society. How can she live on her own when she won't pick up after herself at all, how can she hold a job when she refuses to fallow any kind of directions. I don't want her to just do what she's told, we always try to explain why we are asking her to do something, why it's important. Like brushing her teeth, "you have to to keep them healthy, you'll get cavities" she dosen't care even after a mouth full of fillings and a root canal she dosen't care. And it's not like I can hold down a 9yo and brush her teeth, I'm not going to fight with my kid, that's wrong. I just don't know how to help her understand their are things you have to do and rules you have to fallow. I want her to be happy and successful in life and I and really worried all this is going to hold her back.

>>18232329
As anon said before, I think she has too much freedom and just doesn't know what to. She either needs something to do that will give her direction, or something that will make her think. For example an event that will shake her and make her reconsider everything from top to bottom. I do not know whether you can manage to create such a scenario, but if it will be traumatic enough for her to stop and think, but not traumatic enough to give her problems, then in my opinion it could help.

>>18232350
I think I get what you are saying, maybe moving. She was a lot better about things when we lived in a different state. Not sure if it was just that she was younger, but I think it also had a lot to do with her bing in a better community, better schools, also we didn't live as close to our other family who spoils her like crazy. She still saw them but not all the time like now. I think maybe a move would be a good change.

>>18232115
Two words: Effective Consequences.
She's young so they should be -
> immediate
Take the tablet right away when she misbehaves. Timeout right away. Timeout should be 1 minute for every year of her life. Take her hand and walk her to the corner.
> short duration
15 minute durations
> always followed through on
Never throw threats out that you would not carry out there and then. NEVER. PARENTS DO THAT SHIT ALL THE TIME, IF YOU SAY SOMETHING YOU BETTER DO IT.

You have a tough road, because you've proven yourself to be weak. Tell her to do something once, if she said no then ask her again and provide a rational
> "Go to bed right now, if you don't then you'll not only be tired tomorrow then you'll lose ______ (thing she likes)"
If she doesn't comply then FOLLOW THROUGH. If she does it then praise her

Kids are like dogs, it's about punishment/reward. That's how humans learn.

I do this for a living btw

unruly kids are a result of how they were raised. the problem with lost parents is that they lack the self discipline to follow trough (like the anon above suggested). yes, it sucks if your kid is sneaking chocolate out of the drawer and you tell her to stop that because it's almost dinner time and she already has had her sweet treat for the day. you WILL have to get up and be consequent and let whatever you were doing rest till this is resolved. that lazy attempt of yelling her to "PUT THAT BACK" from the living room 20 times has zero effect. kids (and adults for that matter) react mainly to body language. it's 93%!! of the message they are receiving. only 7% is what you're actually saying. that's why explaining and bargaining never works in the long run (explaining a rule once is good for kids to see that you have a reason for them. after that, it's a rule and you won't explain it again). 40% is tone of voice and the rest is facial expression and they bodily presence. it is CRUCIAL that you are confident when you demand a certain behaviour. and yes, i mean "demand". if she is able to do something because she is far enough developed and she got taught how, you can demand that she does it (like brush her teeh or wash her hair, clean her room, etc). she needs to feel that you EXPECT her to act in the way you act in your family. the biggest problem with this is that she won't behave better than the standart in your house is. if YOU or her dad never brush their teeth in front of her or if the kitchen is always a mess, stop expecting her to be more disciplined. it simply won't happen. you are her role model and she will just imitate. that doesn't mean i think you have bad oral hygiene or a messy house. it is enoigh if she never sees you actually DO those things. if you always clean when she's in school and always brush when she's in bed, she will feel like these are unfair demands. why should SHE be the only one in this family that has to do those things?

>>18232115

In what situations does this happen? My niece started to act out in the mornings when she was around 10, but it turned out she was getting bullied in school, so she was doing it because she legit didn't want to go and was scared. A kid's behaviour doesn't just change out of blue normally, so figure out what's going on in her life right now and if somethibg could be influencing her behaviour. Of course it could be something like puberty kicking in early, too.

>>18232548
atleast that' how it will look like from her perspective.

another good idea is to set CLEAR rules. you can definitely make a poster to hang in the bathroom where you clearly state the hygienic standarts in this house (hairs get brushed in the morning, teeth get brushed after every meal, hands get washed after toilett use, before esting and after coming come, etc). but those are universal rules and apply for every member of the family. meaning that she needs to see dad wash his hands before dinner and so on.
if she missbehaves in school, it is most inportsnt that she is aware that the teachers and her parents are on the same boat. she needs to know that there is communication and that not acting according to the rules (wether the family or school rules) will not be accepted. the biggest impact is if you gradually take in more people to show her a "closed front" that will not accept her behaviour. in school, that would mean the teacher talks to her. if that doesn't help, the teacher & the parents talk to her TOGETHER. and NO explaining of the rules. sinply stating the rule and how she broke it and that this is unacceptable and that she has 15 mins to think of a way to make this alright again (and yes, the adults actually are silent and wait 15 mins. explain that if she has no own idea, the adults will choose something and she has to follow trough). the best is if her idea is something that celebrates reconciliation rather than "hurt her". iow rather bake a cake for the whole class than clean the corridor with the janitor after school or be excluded from class camp.
if that has no effect, you go an instance higher at ever situaion. the other teacers get involved, the principal, etc. the idea is to show her the whole system that stands firmly behind those rules and that it is futile to try to muck up since this is far bigger then her (ofc make sure that your school doesn't have batshit crazy rules. in that case you'd need to first talk to the principal

>>18232569
and maybe even change school).

in scenarios that happen inside the family, the first instance is one parent. then both together, then possibly aunts or uncles, grandparents, etc.

the base for this to work is that your daughter feels loved unconditionally. that means her behaviour doesn't infleunce your sympathy for her. ofc you have the right to be god damn angry and you better be authentic. you also have the right to say "i don't want to go out to a fancy restaursnt with a girl that hasn't even brushed her hair" or "i don't want to help you with your homework if there isn't even room to work properly on your desk".
but you can NEVER make her feel like you don't love her anymore because she dissapointed you.

and i strongly disagree with the anon above saying you should smack her. do you know that story from astrid lindgren about the stick? it's about a little boy that did some stupid shit (stole a piece of cake from the neighbours). the mother asks him to go to the forrest behind the house and find a stick so she can discipline him. the boy goes and doesn't return till late at night. obviously the mother is worried. the boy has returned with a big stone and says :" i couldn't find a fitting stick, so i thought if you really wsnt to hurt me, you could also use a stone". the mother was shocked because she realized that her son thought she wants to badly hurt him and placed the stone on her window board as a reminder that physical punishment is never the solution.

>>18232558
It started out a little when we first moved and has gotten worse. She has a hard time learning in school, but since she has such a bad attitude and dosen't want to try it just keeps getting her further behind. We got her on an iep and a lot of extra help but she just really dosen't like it and dosen't want to do it. I don't know what to do we can't just give up and let her not go. It's the best school around us too, like we put her in privet school so she could get more help but idk she is just struggling and acting out. It's hard and I don't know how to help her.

>>18232460
She dosen't have a tablet or phone or any of that stuff, she only gets to watch tv in her room on the weekends if she has a good school week. We do fallow through with what we say. That's not it she just dosen't care you can latterly put her in time out for doing something and she will do the exact same thing like 20 mins later. She just thinks your being mean not that she did anything wrong.

>>18232548
You don't understand at all. Not everyone in her life is "not sending the proper body language" it's a rule not to bring toys to school. I don't think that I and my husband, and her teacher, and her principal, and her school consoler are all just telling her wrong. And no one just yells stuff at her from the couch. If she dosen't listen we get up and deal with it. Kids are not only a result of how you raise them. Our other kids don't have issues like this. Sometimes they just have difficulties and you have to find a way to help them and work through it. I keep our house clean, very clean actually, being a slob is not ok in our house, I work hard, a full time job and provide for all of my kids, so dose my husband. We try to set a good example to all our kids that hard work is very important.

>>18232115
When i disobeyed my parents, they spanked me, yelled at me and generally made me fear them in a sence.

It worked. I obeyed the rules when they were in sight. When they werent, i did whatever.

Literally my first memory of my dad is when i intentionally spilled water at him in summer (and i know it was bad) because right after deed i started running away, he obviously outran me, catched me and spanked me on place.

I never had anybody higher (regarding respect) in my life than my dad.

To me it seems your daughter started puberty.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puberty
>girls begin puberty around ages 10–11
She will never be the same sweet girl she used to be. Now she will slowly turn into horny teen for whom the parents are the lowest persons on earth.

>>18232569
The poster thing is a good idea her teacher actually suggested that last week at her iep meeting. He has a really hard time doing wants asked of her or staying on task and maybe seeing exactly what she's supposed to be working on would help. And yes we defiantly try to work with he school to help things.

1. of course its hard its parenting. your will has to be stronger then hers.. be fair.. dont be mad... be consistent... be supportive.... dont show your frustration

2. establish routines

3. dont request big things.. break things down into steps. reward the successes.. rework and learn from failures.

4. your child isnt a furbee.. . its much more complicated then doing actions and expecting preprogrammed responses... your child theoretically trying to make sense between your based parenting and the culture/world/society she exists in... be strong

Have you ever considered that your child has a legitimate disorder? I.E. is there is a chance that she has some form of aspergers?

I know the word "autist" gets thrown about a lot on 4chan, but this time I'm not even kidding. She might think that everyone is being mean because she literally does not understand any of this happens or any of the cues/rules.

>>18232670
Yes we did think of that actually, and I'm not trying to be mean and be like I I think my kids retarded. It's just she was having so much trouble learning and getting behind in every subject. You worry as a patent and just want to find any answer that could help. We had her tested, that's how she got into special needs classes and on an iep. She dosen't have any diagnosable mental disorder but they found that she can't fallow directions beyond like one of two steeps. It affects how she dose in every subject at school. She's pretty smart tho, if it's something she wants or sees as having good results for her she can figure it out with no trouble. She just dosen't understand why she has to do anything else that she dosen't feel like doing. And no matter how it's explained she dosen't care or want to do it.

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>>18232115
You just described my oldest. She is 7 going on 8. We are constantly repeating ourselves to her to do even the simplest tasks like getting her boots and coat on because we are leaving for school or brushing her hair. Most days it isn't too bad but we get a few here and there that are just hard to deal with. Our main strategy right now it is taking things (toys, clothes she really likes, electronics) and privileges away. Sometimes that doesn't work. From what my wife and I have noticed/heard she really only acts like a brat at home and doesn't have much of a problem at school.

I really dont have much of any advice. Keep trying. My son has an iep at school and hes doing very well with it. One thing we decided to do was when it comes to food and our kids refuse to eat, we don't yell at them. They sit there until the adults are done and then they are dismissed. If they are hungry a hour later we offer them the same food but we no longer care if they eat it. When they are hungry enough they eventually eat what we serve them. When I take toys away I alot of the time make my daughter pick one and I pick one. She has refused to pick one and I just pick a few and make sure it's toys she really likes. I got a few still in the garage that I keep around to kind of send a message that she isn't ever going to get them back. We throw away or donate the rest.

I feel for you. Parenting today isn't the same as it was for my parents. In public you are always watched and if you spank your kid in public or set them straight be prepared for someone to say something (I just hate it but I've seen it and have had it done to me a few times) which never helps.

Good luck.

>>18232115
>fallow
>dose
>perticulaly

>>18232630
>It's all her, it's not me!
Is what that post came dangerously close to sounding like.
>Our other kids don't do this
They aren't her age yet, you said this was your oldest and this became a recent issue.

Yes, tone and body language does matter. Which is why even though my father never laid a hand in me except light spankings i could count on one hand, just one look could make me stop in my footsteps.

And why my son (he is barely 3 though) will cease what he is doing when I make my tone elevated in volume but lower in timbre and more steady. Square my shoulders, that kind of thing. No matter what I say that makes him pause to look at me.

>>18232115
Spank her.

Beat her with a belt. Just lean her over, take your belt and slap her with the belt strongly for 10 times (what my granddad did with me when I was a disrespectful sh*t), next time it happens, make it 20 belt slaps, then 30, 40, 50... And after a while, she will stop.

>>18233024
Thank you so much it really seems like you understand where I'm coming from.
I'm really lucky in that all my kids are good eaters. A couple of them have sweet tooths so I don't keep a lot of surgery stuff in the house but for the most part eating isn't a problem.

>>18233160
No I'm saying she's not like most kids and the normal methods of parenting and getting your kid to behave haven't worked with her. I'm sorry but if you've never parented a special needs kid you should not judge, it's not the parents fault that the child has a harder time with things. You just have to find ways to help and deal with it and sometimes you have to think a little outside the box to get through to them. And my other kids are 8, 6, and 2 so yes actually my older ones are close enough to see that they aren't having the same kinds of issues. They like learning and it comes more easily to them. They don't have trouble fallowing directions. I'm not saying they are like perfect kids or better in any way I just mean they don't struggle like my oldest dose. I just want things to get better for her and help her grow and learn. I love all my kids and just want the best for them.

>>18233268
My younger sister is a nonverbal autistic woman, so I do understand. You use outside resources other than the school, extensively. And you do not coddle, because most assume their child is dumb. However they will take advantage of situations like any neurotypical child.

>>18233281
Yes she dose do that. We do not baby her at all with that stuff, I myself have a learning disorder and I never want her to see hers as an excuse or as something that holds her back. Do you mind me asking what are some other recourses you've used are? Other then consoling, extra tutoring and the resources from her school we haven't found much.

>>18233304
My sister went to occupational therapy and speech therapy specifically geared to autism. Which is why a more direct diagnosis is needed for your daughter. Do you talk with her teachers often? That is how we found off campus resources.

When you have definite reason behind your daughter's behavior, even Googling community resources in your state or county is helpful and gives you a start.

OP you mentioned you were looking for internet articles and stuff to help. Don't be discouraged because you haven't found any help yet. You're on the right track. Giving up and asking 4chan was a bad idea.

Check out youtube. There are college professors giving advice on studying on youtube. So there might be some professionals on parenting with good channels too. Start googling stuff like "Best parenting advice websites" or things like this. Start narrowing down your sources of info to reliable top quality places to get advice from. Look up the best books on the subject. Look up professionals in your area who can help you with this.

I'm sorry you're having so much trouble and I hope your situation gets resolved soon