I've been told I was intelligent all my life. By my parents,

>I never took a proper IQ test administered by a psychologist, and at this point im too scared to.
>However, personality wise I tend to follow the INTP archetype, who are typically masters of reasoning.

Fucking lol, you sound alot like me when i was younger. Just realize that you are not extraordinary in any way.

>>18101035
starting to realize that at this point

well, how'd things end up going for you

>>18101031
What are you saying? What is this? Are you trying to say you're paper smart but not street smart?

First I would suggest learning how to communicate your thoughts. If you can't do it typing in the comfort of your own home, you definitely suck at it on an interpersonal level.

Learn logical fallacies. Start visiting forums on politics or some other controversial topics and develop your own arguments. They will get picked apart... -this is okay. You will learn.

Next, once you have a few ideas of how to express yourself clearly you will have won half the battle. The other half is learning to vocalize your ideas in a social atmosphere. This part is about developing confidence.

Good luck

File: hotair.png (474KB, 3340x3176px) Image search: [Google]

474KB, 3340x3176px

I guess I'm not so much asking for advice, but just venting.

>>18101059
Well I just gave you some advice so you better fucking read it.

>>18101062
I do appreciate your post. However with my very faulty logic, I see logical thinking gained through practice as inferior to that which comes naturally.

If I had to work for it, it feels less worthwhile, and I can't tell if it's just my own natural talent or something which can be attained by anyone who simply puts in enough time.

For this reason I refused to study for tests in academia for a while. I would sooner accept a low A earned through minimal or no studying at all, than a high A earned through hours of preparation.

>>18101069
Holy shit, it feels like i'm talking to myself from the past. Just do shit, dude. Stop being ''methodical'' and just go out and do something, go outside, lift, anything.

>>18101075
I have, joined clubs, talked to people, went to the gym, but the problem is it never sticks. I don't really have any motivation to do it other than some abstract idea of "doing shit" and therefore as time goes on I slowly and slowly do less until I have a routine which involves the absolute bare minimum of exertion.

I can be extremely self-disciplined, but only when it's towards goals which I desire to acheive from the moment I start working towards them.

>tfw i am basically a cardboard cutout of the typical INTP, "intelligent" but lazy, kind of nerdy 4channer, nihilistic person who complicates everything
I'm not OP btw

>>18101031

sometimes people are just stupid. as long as you aren't harming anyone or yourself with your stupidity, then it doesnt matter.

>>18101031

I am also very strongly NT (I/E and P/J close to be 50/50, varying within time) and I can tell you clearly know the answer to your own problem:

>I understand the solution to all this would be "get out more, gain experiences in the real world, make friends" the reality is it's not fucking happening

>the reality is it's not fucking happening

As a good INTP, I am sure you know very well that this is just you telling yourself some lies to avoid the truth

stop telling these lies to yourself and start working on what you haven't worked.

Being INTP isn't being lazy. We are a bit unfocused, that I can agree, but that is not being lazy at all.

>>18101031
>I know that all these sort of tests are fucking bullshit but I really have nothing else to go off on.
Are you serious? Are you quicker than your peers at learning and understanding new concepts? Do you tend to solve problems faster than others around you? Can you study less than your peers and still get a grade as good or better than there's? If you said yes to any of these you're probably intelligent. Why do you think IQ tests are the only way you can base your intelligence on?

>>18101069
>I would sooner accept a low A earned through minimal or no studying at all, than a high A earned through hours of preparation.
Holy shit, this sounds incredibly autistic. The end grade is all that matters, nobody gives a fuck whether or not you studied 7 weeks in advanced or just winged it. If you ever got a B or lower on a test because you thought you were too naturally smart to need to study for it, you should end your life. No matter how smart you are, everybody at some point has had to study for a tough test.

You need to understand that no matter how intelligent you think you are, there will ALWAYS be a group of people even smarter who will make you look like a retard in comparison. This does not mean you are dumb or stupid, however, because there will always be people much more dumber than you. Being a good debater doesn't mean you're smart, but if you're insecure about debating or being "rational", then just practice debating with others online more. You get better by doing, you can't just expect to be a natural prodigy at everything.

But, if you really stake your entire self-worth on being intelligent, then just find a job filled with idiots you can feel superior to.

t. INTJ

Ok this is kind of me. All the time I was at primary school I was told I was very intelligent and had a lot of potential. I started programming at the age of 6 and was given computers and praise. I used these computers to basically shit talk with older people on bulletin boards and telnet into various servers and fuck around while becoming very socially isolated in the real world.

I was antisocial to the point of being excluded twice from secondary school and I barely attended, I did a lot of drugs. I went on to study chemistry which I dropped because suddenly it was difficult. I went on to study systems analysis which I dropped because it was difficult. I taught myself to play 5 instruments during this time, I was into hobby level electronics and making my own equipment and went on to study audio system design which I dropped out of because it was difficult. I ended up with a bachelor of arts in music.

I don't think I'd ever learnt to apply my intelligence instead assuming that I could coast on my potential. I started my own business which didn't really do very well another sign that I drop anything once it becomes challenging and I worked a series of mundane office jobs.

So while I dealt with being antisocial I still am incredibly antisocial, as in I've not left the house to socialise in over three months now. I'm completely unexceptional apart from being stupidly quick at learning new things and applying myself at a slightly higher than average level, I've a wide but shallow set of skills and abilities, but I've had no fame or significant success to speak of. I own a house which is significant and I'm relatively wealthy, but this is simply because I'm quite old, I've always had an average income and I don't spend money on anything except basic food and bills.

My personality is basically to try and blind people with all the shit I know which is an insecurity I have. Then I get fucked up on drink or drugs and then avoid them.

>having top grades

That means you are intelligent but not that intelligent.

The really intelligent people fail school because its too mind numbingly boring and easy that they just can't stand it.

I wasn't one of them but that is how it works.

>>18101031
Nigga. Figure out a future goal for yourself. Think of what you want in life and write out a plan to achieve it. Something that you know will make you happy and proud to achieve. Everyday look at that sheet of paper to remind yourself. Fully apply yourself to this goal. Tell yourself that things like videogames, tv, etc. are just distractions that hold no real value and will only leave you empty and disappointed.

Now once you reach that goal, sit down and reflect. You applied yourself? Stuck the course? Stayed consistent? You did what you said would be done no matter what? Cool. Doesn't that feel good?

Now go do it again.

Stop thinking you're special and stop thinking people really care about you. The only person that really gives a single fuck about your happiness and success is yourself. But if you half-ass everything because YOU don't care about yourself, then you've already lost.

>>18101700
You got a source on that, buster brown?

>>18101700
The OP's opinion and this post are examples of mystification of intelligence. Allow me to explain: There is no such thing that can't be learned. IQ tests can be learned, having done so myself, I can vouch for it. I managed to get a govt stipend intended for undergraduate students with exceptional talent for research while a sophomore in high school. The stipend was awarded based on IQ test. Previously I have, in a math competition training camp, participated in a shitload of IQ tests because some psychologist was writing a thesis and we let her use us as lab rats. After she ran out of tests, we were writing them. By that time we figured out the tricks and could do it as well as pros. A few months later all of us who were participating heard about this stipend and beat the test to get $$$. A member of this group who wanted to show off took a MENSA test and scored above the level where it was measuring with confidence (putting his official IQ in the 175+ range). In other words, IQ is bullshit, nothing inherent about it. Training matters just as much, or more, than ability.

Ability includes propensity for hard work. Terry Tao, widely considered the world's best mathematician today, said that his ability just allowed him to start earlier. He won International Math Olympiad medals at 11, 12 and 13, finished college at 16 or so, PhD at 21 and Field's medal at 25. Terry said that the only benefit he had from his talent is that he got to the same place at 20 where a lot of people were at 30 or so, so he had 10 more years to work.

>>18101776
That didn't make any sense.

You and your friends had a very unusual chance to practice IQ tests for a while and then got high scores on said tests and that, somehow, disqualifies them as tests ??

This is like saying that given you can practice for an an year to run a 100m sprint, it shouldn't be used on regular people (who didn't specifically practice for that run) to check their athletic conditions...

>>18101825
Not that anon, but most scientists agree that IQ tests don't do a great job at accurately measuring intelligence. They're good for getting a general idea, but they should never be used as proof of someone's intelligence or anything like that. There's also the fact that IQ tests do a poor job at accounting for other kinds of intelligence, such as creative intelligence.

>>18101837
>but most scientists agree
Source.

>>18101841
Take a psych class.

>>18101844
No, show me the hard evidence that most scientists agree.

Don't pull the autism card whenever you don't want to improve in areas you actually desire. Nigger, I tell you what. I don't think I'm an autist but I sure as hell are somewhat of a freak. The folks I've dealt throughout my life were usually afraid of or aggressive towards me the second they saw me. I have a tender-hearted nature but there is just something off about me - do I make bullshit excuses do escape social situations? No. I came to not give a fuck how others perceive me and just present myself how I am, and even it was rare, some people were attracted to me even though I have an eccentric personality to begin with. That's one example.

And take the IQ-test if it's so important to you.

IQ is good at telling how dumb you are but not so good at telling how smart you are

I believe in different types of intelligence as well as intelligence as a rule being difficult to qualify. Like I've known some really stupid rich people and stupid educated people. I've known intelligent people who don't earn a lot of money or don't have any higher qualifications. My father barely finished school and hasn't had a job for the last 20 years yet I consider him intelligent because he supports himself easily with his skill and ability to fabricate whatever he needs in his workshop, grows most of his own food, works for people mostly to trade goods that he can't get otherwise and for the little money he needs and isn't subject to whims like wanting the latest and greatest of everything to feel happy.

Then there are people like my boss who are highly educated, have a large amount of money, yet have a weird arrogance where their people skills are so bad, they can't maintain friendships/relationships or even hold on to staff very long because he is convinced that he knows best at all times and everybody around him is an idiot out to get him and let him down and this attitude in itself isn't very intelligent. Like a supposedly wise man who assumes he is the automatic expert in everything despite knowing nothing about a ton of stuff. He is so bad he hires people to be experts to help his business in the areas he is weak in, yet he thinks he knows best at all times, doesn't listen to them, respect their opinion or show them even common courtesy and is confused as to why nobody wants to come work for him.

>>18101915
>I believe in different types of intelligence as well as intelligence as a rule being difficult to qualify.
There's only one intelligence, and that is intelligence. You can be an asshole and still be intelligent. How does that not get into your skull? They don't lack "emotional intelligence", they lack emotional finesse.

I could sing a song about all this bullshit about "but everyone is intelligent somewhere else", no they aren't. I'll just link your to that one: https://www.quora.com/Why-do-some-people-dislike-smart-people

>>18101920
I don't believe that everybody is intelligent in some way. I believe that some people might display intelligence in a number of ways, others a few, some no ways at all. I believe that intelligence does not always directly correlate with academic achievements or financial success and to assume these things are the measure of intelligence and all manners in which it can be displayed is kind of ignorant.

My post followed on about IQ as a suitable objective measure of intellect and I agree that it isn't. I get your point regarding social finesse, but if you cannot see where your actions run counter to and are harming your stated and intended goals while claiming to be the most intelligent individual this is just dishonest at best, stupid at worst behaviour.

>>18101920
Also while the article you posted is great for being absolutist and full of great sound bites for the alienated and disposed target audience, what is it trying to say exactly?

I mean, maybe I'm misusing the word, but for me intelligence has to have a way to be expressed to the other otherwise it is subjective to the individual and without meaning except to the individual. So the manner in which it is expressed can vary, therefore there are different ways to determine if somebody is intelligent if you observe the manner in which they might express intelligence. Hence emotionally intelligent or musically intelligent which might be a clumsy way to describe empathic individuals or musically gifted individuals, but it is a way most would understand and again, you've got to have an objective measure with which the other can measure something like intelligence for it to have meaning. This doesn't mean everybody is intelligent in some way.

Musically talented or gifted is not the same as an intellectual approach to music. Classical composition is mathematical in its approach. Western tuning systems and the relationship between notes within scales are built upon maths and ultimately physics and the relationships between harmonic series and sine waves. Being able to read music, hear it in your head as another language, manipulate and work with it understanding the core principles behind it is a sign of intelligence. Being able to learn the opening bars of smoke on the water maybe not so much.

>>18101031

Just accept that you're probably average.

You just have to take the ego fall and start sucking at the stuff you want to improve. Bettering your physical health? Start with the couch to 5k plan. I was a fucking slob and couldn't even jog a mile before being completely out of breath. Wanna be more social? Start by being yourself and putting yourself out there. Yeah, there will be cringe and you'll regret saying or doing stuff, but you'll find people that will appreciate your true self and the fact that you're trying.

You'll always be "dumb" if you're afraid of trying stuff, the same way you would consider "dumb" those people that didn't even try at school and got bad grades for not doing anything. It's the same with any skill in the world.

Unless you're seriously defective, which you aren't since you're at least self aware, you can reach an average skill level on anything.

Most people don't even try doing stuff they're bad at. Just trying and improving at least a bit puts you way ahead of the curve.

Just let go of your ego, it's putting you down. The pre-conceived notion that you must excel at something or you're a failure it's limiting yourself in every aspect of your life. It's a poisonous line of thought.

Just do it, take the goddamn fall and try again. That's how babies learn to walk. That's how kids learn stuff and that's how teens do in their love life. It's never too late my man. You don't have to be perfect, or great, or anything, just [spoiler]be yourself[/spoiler]

>>18101825
Well, my example was extreme, but since I don't believe that there were like 15 Einsteins in that training camp (smart kids all, but gimme a break!), I got disillusioned on the whole concept. It convinced me that regular upbringing can swing the IQ scores by a lot. Which it shouldn't, by definition intelligence is supposed to be the ability you are born with, not what you are taught. But now I believe that it matters a lot what kind of parents you had and what kind of a school you went to. If some kid was given Legos, Rubik's cube and such stuff from an early age, they can beat a kid with a lot more inherent talent who got dumped in front of a tv set.

>>18101848
One evidence would be the Polgar sisters. Their father, a psychologist, said that he would like to show that they can become top chess players, when they were born. All three did, Zsuzsa (the eldest) was the women's world champ for a while, Sofia (the middle) was a top women's player, though much weaker than her sisters, while Judit is probably the strongest female chess player in history (never played in the women's circuit, played only in men's tournaments and stayed top ten or so for many years). You may say that chess ability =/= intelligence, but I consider that a very important example on the importance of work and conditioning.

All in all, OP may have had the benefit of caring parents who put a lot of effort into his upbringing. Now he needs to get off his ass and justify that work with achieving something for himself. One starting point would be to communicate with people directly more and electronically less.

>>18101047
I'm not >>18101035 but when I was growing up I put all my self worth in my supposed intelligence. Then I learned that I wasnt all that smart. I was just smart compared to the people in the town where I grew up. But it worked out well. In my thirties, I finally learned to socialize and work hard. The key to socializing is to ask people open-ended questions about themselves and be genuinely interested in the answers. People love talking about themselves and if you give them the chance, they will like you for listening to them talk about themselves.

>>18101031
Swallow the ego, reconnect with those you've left behind.