I believe that drunk people are responsible for everything they

I wouldn't say they are responsible, but rather that they concurred for the fact to happen.

It's not like they thought "oh, i'll sleep here where my wallet can be stolen"... The responsibility is for the drinking, not for the deed.

Now, you said people that kiss another person that isn't the bf or gf, in that case there was a conscious decision to kiss that person, so it doesn't apply to the same rule as being raped or stolen because of a black out.

Bump

tl;dr if your girlfriend got way too drunk and got raped, would you stay with her?

>>18081649

If a drunk person is smart enough to realize not to cheat, aren't they also responsible for being smart enough to not drink too much?

Sorta. If a man rapes a woman who is black out drunk he needs to go to prison. But at the same time I could never feel sorry for a girl who gets wasted at a party and goes home with a guy and she gets the dick that night. It's like wearing a nice watch walking alone in a bad neighborhood. If they catch the guy who robs you, definitely punish him, but ultimately it was the guy walking around like a dumbass who should have prevented the situation.

>>18081654
No...
There are many psychological factor to weight here, and they are very individual, singular to each person, in a way we can't just make a 'general rule' of it.

You would expect the person is smart enough in that sense, but you can't say her unconscious mind or her deeper wishes won't affect her judgement.

I don't think being in part to blame for the situation arising equals carrying responsibility for the other person's actions. It is flawed logic to me to give one person so much responsibility that they should know 100% what's going on even when drinking, but another person being a scumbag and stealing something is somehow more the drunk's responsibility than the thief's? No way.

And let's not forget that it takes a lot more to rape someone who is defenseless than to grab a wallet from someone defenseless. Both are cowardly and shitty moves but it's hardly in the same league.

It also takes some experience to know how you personally respond to alcohol, how to pace yourself, and especially what the influence is of other factors like how much you ate, the temperature etc.

Honestly I often feel like guys who have zero empathy for girls who get raped when they blacked out would talk differently if it was a serious risk for them to get assraped just because they were a stupid kid/student misjudging what they could handle.

>>18081520
Even if you behave irresponsibly and put yourself at risk, you still are a victim.
If my wallet gets stolen while I'm black out drunk in a park, the person who stole the wallet is still a thief and a criminal. I'm just irresponsible.
In the same way, while I can agree that a woman who gets blackout drunk is irresponsible, if someone rapes her he's still a criminal and it's not the woman's fault.

>>18081659
I believe that rapists deserve prison and castration, but I think that the rape would have been prevented if the woman didn't set herself up to be in that situation. This isn't a "men came out of the bushes at night" type of rape.

>>18081667
I was asking for opinions.

>>18081672
This situation is implying that they know their limits and they weren't drugged. I personally would think someone deserved to have their wallet stolen if they have it while getting that drunk, but I wouldn't say someone deserved to get raped. It's unfortunate, but they caused it to happen by being purposefully reckless.

>>18081681
See
>>18081686

It's definitely the criminals fault as well.

To clarify for everyone, I carry a gun on me at all times. I'm very cautious and I do not understand why people would become that vulnerable or set themselves up to be victims.

I so not blame women in any way for being raped by their clothing, unless it's the ghetto and they're wearing three band-aids for clothes.

>>18081686
>they caused it to happen
The fact that it couldn't have happened if they didn't get drunk =/= them causing it to happen. Again, it is really weird to me to place more responsibility on an unconscious woman for getting raped than on the literal rapist. If he chose to not rape it wouldn't have happened, either, he had to go through a whole range of actions in order for her to get raped. All she did was be unable to do anything.

I don't agree that people "deserve" to get their wallet stolen either. People don't have a plight to be on their guard 24/7. Hell, people are defenseless sleeping for a small half of the day.

>>18081697
Also in regards to your first answer, I find it pretty insulting that you seem to imply that "normal" men partying will be tempted to stick their dick into someone literally completely out of it just because it's a possibility. That sounds a lot like the whole "all men are closet rapists" narrative.

>>18081688
There is no way to prevent being the victim of a crime, it is a flawed (but very human) way of reasoning.
By shaming the victim we are psychologically distancing ourselves from them. It happened to them because of their flaws, we're safe because we never behave irresponsibly and we're never off guard, unlike the victim. The victim *deserved* it because she was wearing a short skit, she was drunk, he was in a bad area, etc.
It cannot happen to us because we'd never do it.

>>18081697
Please tell me where I said the criminal was not a guilty criminal. Both parties are responsible for the event. The woman let this happen. She made herself be so drunk that someone could literally rape her without any resistance.

>>18081704
Very few men are rapists, but those that are rapists are opportunists. They wait for the "liberated" woman to be vulnerable and alone. Few rapes are violent, and most are blackmail or unconsented sex yet non-forceful. I didn't mean to imply that a normal person of either gender would rape someone.

I didn't state it, but I was sexually abused as a child by a high school age boy who later hanged himself. I say what I do with weight added to it because to an extent, I have experienced something similar.

>>18081711
I already said that the clothes/bad area thing is not a good argument. Women don't have to worry about those things unless there is a very blatant reason as to why, such as going into a gang infested area. It is much less deliberate than getting willfully drunk to the point of unresponsiveness.

>>18081711

How can I lose all of my money if I only carry $100 cash on me at any given time? If you carry your life savings and get robbed, you didn't rob yourself, but you are responsible for allowing things to be worse than they could have been.

People prey on passed out women for sex, and EVERYONE knows it. It's very unlikely to get taken advantage of if you drink responsively, but that chance spikes if you become unconscious.

"Blackout drunk" means the brain is so impaired that the process of memory formation has stopped. It doesn't mean "unconscious" or "passed out".

It means the next day, the person wakes up and wonders "what happened? what did I do?"

If you don't to be with someone who routinely does this, it's your right to feel that way. I would make that clear ahead of time so that your response to a relationship partner's being drunk is not a surprise.

A lot of cheating that happens occurs while the cheater is drunk, and the excuse is always "well, I didn't mean to do that, I was drunk and didn't know what I was doing." That excuse might be true, but the decision to drink and to get to that point of drunkenness was deliberate. A drunk person is still responsible for their behavior unless they were drugged against their will.

Kill someone while drunk driving? Cheated while drunk? Got into a fight and hurt someone? "I was drunk, it's not my fault" is not a valid excuse.

As far as getting raped goes, I wouldn't break up with someone for that, drunk or sober. If I was ok with a girlfriend going out and getting completely trashed, I wouldn't blame her if she were raped. Making yourself vulnerable is not the same as wanting a terrible thing to be inflicted on you by someone else.

If I were NOT ok with a girlfriend going out and getting trashed, I would have sympathy if something bad happened to her, but I would still break up with her.

I believe each person is responsible for their actions. In reality to be alive your already risking your life. If you get killed by say a lightening strike, is it your fault or the earths? Your fault for being out and unprepared in a storm.

Women somehow have come to the conclusion showing more skin means I'm better looking, which leads to a mentality of who can have the shorter cloths. I personally as a male know this drives me crazy, its like dangling a lump of prime rib in front of a starving child, even if that kid is the best behaved child in the world it is going to be druling over that meat even if the child never goes for it.

Just as a male is responsible for his actions sober or otherwise, so is a female. If a girl goes to a party with questionably short clothing what is she trying to achieve other than attention, if she gets blackout drunk, what is she looking for other than an excuse.

I would personally beat anyone into the ground if I knew they had ever raped or taken advantage of someone. But I do understand how it happens, because just as the girls that get blackout drunk the males should have known better.

It takes two to tango and unless you were rofied and carried off and fucked while passed out it is partially your fault for being there at that time and place doing what you were.
The best defence is not to be in a fight in the first place. Same applys here,.best defense against rape is not to put yourself into the situation where it becomes possible

This week I woke up after heavy drinking and found out that my roommate is moving out allegedly because for the things I did that night as I was informed by my other flatmates. In the morning I didn't remember a thing. We had a party at the flat and the last thing I remembered before blacking out was that I fell down from pretty steep stairs at our duplex flat. They told me that they've been told by my now exroommate who had his gf at his bed at the time that I got to my bed, layed down and fell asleep. After half an hour I got up, I tottered around the room, grabbed by the handle of the door but didn't get out, took my dick out and pissed in my room, just by the doors.

Roommate and his gf were dickheads, but I'm still ashamed of the incident. Drinking causes me to be more selfdestructive than I already am, and I'm finding out that alcohol isn't a good way to selfmedicate yourself.

>>18081520
You're a dipshit if you get so drunk you're able to be raped

But it's not your fault, someone else had to decide that you were a good defenseless person to be raped

So i still consider them rape victims

>>18081803
I know someone that pissed in his cupboard after a big night. We all laughed it off.
Alteast you didn't get so drunk you shat yourself

>>18081803
You have a problem if this is a normal thing. I've had a single instance where I was lucid dreaming and I though I was awake. I really had to pee so I walked in the bathroom in my dream and did so. I didn't know it would make me piss in real life, but I started to and woke up immediately. It was one of the weirdest experiences of my life.

>>18081807
I consider them victims as well, but I think they brought it upon themselves because everyone knows rape is a likely outcome.

>>18081776
Anywhere past the point of conscious decision making is my line. I would break up with my girlfriend is she tried to drive when drunk or anything of the sort. I have no tolerance for this.

>>18081787
Walking down the street or wearing a short skirt are so harmless that you don't need to worry about it. If you're drinking a little or in a bad neighborhood, you need to be very cautious, but its not your fault if you're a victim. Only when you put yourself into the category of a prime victim (being passed out in a park, wearing a T-shirt that says "nigger" while in the ghetto) should you be responsible for what happens. There are different risks associated with it. I would feel very bad if my girlfriend were raped while sober, but I would break up with her if it were because she let herself be irresponsibly drunk. In both situations, I would likely shoot the rapist if they could be reliably identified.

By being responsible for getting drunk you are automatically responsible for all the shit you do. So, unless someone forced you to get so fucking drunk you literally don't know what you do you're responsible.

If you willingly put yourself in a situation where there is high probability of someone taking advantage of you, you are a) stupid and b) partially responsible. Feminists are throwing a fit about how wearing slutty has nothing to do with rape, while simultaneously arguing that men are horny rapists. In an ideal world what you wear or how drunk you get would not make you responsible, since there would be no danger from other people to put yourself in. But since world is a shitty place, walking drunk/alone/wearing slutty at night is, to some degree, "asking for it".

It does not however reduce the responsibility of the rapist/thief. They are guilty, first and foremost.

I feel like people show their true colors when their drunk, another side of them is either blown out of proportion or they became a certain kind of drunk, happy drunk, sloppy drunk, sad drunk, angry drunk etc. I do feel they should be responsible with their intake of alcohol to ensure a good time without the hangover or blacking out. After you've been drinking for awhile you know what your limit is so there's really no excuse. Unless of course someone spiked your shit. In terms of rape or being mugged...I mean you can't expect everyone in the world to be perfect and 110% good all the time because that's not how the world works. It doesn't cater to you. So it's best just to be safe, smart and drink responsibly.