>have a 21 year old brother with depression living with me

Bump. I'm at my wit's end

Kick him out. He'll either kill himself or find motivation. Either way, problem solved.

>>17974601
Is there a serious chance he'd kill himself?

>>17974611
Depends on how depressed he is. Does he see a therapist?

>>17974621
Yes he does. He's also on meds, which I'm sure makes it worse since he is also basically an alcoholic

>>17974625
Does he actually talk about how he feels, or is he the type to bottle things up?

>>17974630
Bottles. I've tried to talk to him nicely, I've tried getting him riled up so he argues with me. he just sits there and stares at me until I stop talking and go away.

If you want to know why he acts like that, it could be he doesn't believe you actually sympathize with him or know how he feels. I know you aren't psychic, but when you're going through depression, it's like something paralyzing you and constantly whispering to you "what's the point?" Instead of attacking him over the job angle, you have to approach with a desire to know how he feels. It might not fix anything, or it might get him to open up to you and accept your help. It sucks, but when you have depression it makes you feel like a helpless baby stuck in an adult's body. There's no way out of that without help, and pills and alcohol don't really do much. He likely does want to move on and maybe get help somewhere deep inside.

He moved in under the pretense that he'd do chores and keep the house clean as well as the yard nice autonomously as well as work a job full time and he would live here rent free. He does very little of the chores and is now jobless. He consumes, doesn't contribute enough in help to even begin to reach my monetary break-even, and he just won't make even the simplest effort to get his shit together. I'm seriously at my wit's end. I'm partially hoping he sees this and realizes I'm serious about this and he has to leave at the end of the month.

>>17974655
>>17974655
For a while, I had tried to help and reach out to him. It gets hard when the person you're talking to is literally blank and just blinks at every word you say. I've tried to be patient. I really have. I don't know how to help.

Gonna bump this. I would like all the advice I can get.

>>17974677
>For a while, I had tried to help and reach out to him. It gets hard when the person you're talking to is literally blank and just blinks at every word you say. I've tried to be patient. I really have. I don't know how to help.

That's another conundrum with depression. Sometimes you just don't want help, as contradictory as that sounds. It really does make you feel hopeless, and maybe even spiteful of the world and everything around you. He needs to want help for it to do him any good. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't force it to drink. Does he have a degree or is he attending college?

>>17974693
Maybe try a different approach? Spend time with him, don't bug him about getting a job for maybe a month or so, buy him something nice, get some weed and pizza and watch some movie/anime together.

If after a while he doesn't take the initiative let him know that you're struggling to meet the bills payments and actually need his help.

If all else fails then kicking him out might be the best option, sometimes people just need to get rock bottom to get some perspective.

>>17974715
What you say makes sense.

He dropped out of high school. I cannot figure out how to talk to him or make him want to want change. I know what he is going through. I was extremely depressed around his age as well seeing all my friends do better than me or have more than me and me feel inadequate. But it's literally all in your head. I cannot help him get over this.

>>17974717
Thank you for this, but I've tried that. I've bought him nice things, I've taken him out to get meals, bars, etc. I think I'm part of the problem and he may be comparing himself to me.

Are you able to talk to his therapist about this? Are you his entire support network, or does he have other friends/family? Can you get him to, or take him to, AA meetings?

Looking up 'Non-violent communication' might help you (a little) there.

This situation is a moral nightmare and there isn't really a correct or easy way out of it. I think part of the problem is that he's basically forcing you to maintain his lifestyle and way of thinking. Basically, you're in a tight spot so go easy on yourself.

What I would do is stick to a SMART framework, I know it's a little clinical but if you set a few goals that are Specific, Measurable, Achievable, Realistic, and Time-based, then you can stick to that structure and hold him accountable. Maybe him getting a job today isn't hugely realistic, but if you explain that you need chores x, y, and z, done. Perhaps idealistic, but if you can work out a list of things that you both agree too, then you can actually hold him accountable. He'll also have a clear idea of exactly what's expected of him, and if he fucks up, he's only got himself to blame in this case. The only real thing is to make clear that if he doesn't keep up his end of the bargain, then you need'll to do x, y, and/or z.

Telling/expecting someone to get a job and do their fair share is quite a high expectation- jobs can take a while on occasion, and people have a very different idea of how many chores they need to do. If you can find a way to agree to each other's situations, you should be able to work towards a mutually positive outcome.

In part this technique is meant to empower you because you agree and set the rules together, can measure his commitment, and he's well aware of either outcomes- he'll actually have a good degree of control.

>>17974737
If you tried everything else then just kick him out, let him find out for himself how much furter down he can go.

>>17974762
Thank you for this. I guess I was setting expectations that I thought were clear and achievable. Didn't occur to me that they might not be for him.
I am his only support from what I can tell. It's a lot of pressure placed on me to ensure he succeeds. I'll give it a shot and recalibrate my expectations but I'm still going to adhere to changes expected in a week. I told him originally he has to apply for a few jobs every week and display some sort of effort for the entire month of January or he has to go. Is that too rigid of a timeline since the end of January is next week? I feel like giving him a time extension is almost like showing I'll fold eventually.

>>17974796

It might just be worth making a new agreement with him, but you could say 3 job applications by the end of this month, I think that's fine. The main thing is just to be clear. Things like "display some sort of effort" aren't really helpful (especially when someone is depressed) because it's abstract. Just ask for a specific chore done or something.

I think it's actually okay to fold once and a while, like it's okay to change your approach, but I understand your point.

If I were you I'd just start slow- I'd set a few chores for the week (sweep and mop floors, take out trash, get the shopping), and apply for 3 jobs this week. I'd go so far as to say I don't really care what jobs he applies for, I just want to see 3 applications in his sent emails, then build up from there.

If he failed that, I'd ask if there was anything that stopped him from doing them, and help a little if I could. But I'd also explain that if he doesn't do these things then I'll ask him to leave at [specific time].

I'm probably repeating it too much, but you have to make it really clear that it's his choice to stay or leave, rather than make it sound like you're just deciding on an arbitrary basis.