Idealism is bad? Or what the fuck was the point of F/Z?

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Just Urobuchi jacking off to his own nihilism. A fun ride to an already known outcome, but not a masterpiece by any stretch. Fate/stay night is superior.

>>150157955
UBW, right?
coz the 2006 one is kinda lame

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>>150158169
The VN. In anime adaptations I do think Zero is the best Fate, but UBW is also fine and HF is looking great.

>>150158169
More like the whole VN

>>150158169
they are both lame, read the VN

>>150157892
I adore the scene of Kiritsugu at the Grail. Yes this scene is horrific but it also is a wonderful illustration / deconstruction of Consequentialism, Deontological, and Virtue basic ethics. For the most part I am a consequentialist / utilitarian but the grail scene illustrates why you can't be an exclusive consequentialism and that you need to temper your beliefs and your ideals with the other two ways of looking at the world as well else you will break yourself, or you do not realize the horror of what you unleashed.

Nothing short of a masterpiece.

>>150158658
what fucking copypasta is this from

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Gil in Fate and UBW is meant to come across as if he was corrupted by the grail, a flawed man who became evil due to grail juice. In HF and Zero this is revealed to be incorrect and that he is still the same person he always was and actually has a reason to be engaging in the behaviour he did in the previous routes that is consistent with his previous morality recalled by Saber and Kotomine.

Shirou’s last words to Kirei are pretty much identical to what Kirei says he’s going to do to Shirou’s dad, Kiritsugu, in Fate Zero. I wonder if this was intentional? Most likely.

Kirei decides in Zero that his role is to crush the Holy Grail, and in turn, crush Kiritsugu’s dream. And then he actually comes into contact with Grail and realizes it’s the only thing in the world he actually wants for himself. Having discovered his true calling as the villain, the man who spreads destruction and suffering. And the Grail being the ultimate tool to fulfill that wish. Then at the end of Heaven’s Feel, just like in Zero, it ends with Kirei and an Emiya, fighting to the death as the Holy Grail begins to overflow right next to them. The difference is here, the roles are switched. It’s Kirei’s wish to obtain the grail, and Shirou who ultimately decides he’s going to mercilessly destroy it, having discovered his true calling as the hero, the man who beats the bad guy, and saves the world from destruction. And the Grail being the weapon of mass destruction that needs to be thwarted.

Urobuchi & Nasu wrote the entire backstory after FSN in a way that it ties into everything perfectly.

>>150158169
>Fate stay night [Realta Nua]
https://www.nyaa.se/?page=view&tid=427133
http://nicoblog.org/pc-games/fate-stay-night-realta-nua/
realtapatch.tumblr.com/

Fate zero
https://bakabt.me/torrent/170043/fate-zero-bd-720p-utw

Fate hollow ataraxia
https://mega.nz/#F!Ls8lmRaY!eEugmqoaDvgHIw9jrgzaBg

Holy Grail 2.0 - Rips of Type-Moon's PC games by Keripo
https://mega.nz/#F!BA4yHYoT!NwGVKj4q9Z1vnpKlYY-4UQ

>>150157892
>Or what the fuck was the point of F/Z?
An advertisement to sell more Saber figures to the pathetic Fatefags

>>150157892
I think it's more "utilitarianism is a farcical philosophy" as regards Kiritsugu. I thought the arguments against Saber were pretty shitty so I won't try to defend them.

>>150158954
>Those readers who thought Fate/stay night “should have more than blood, tears and tragic endings”, this is for you! This is the true ‘Heaven’s Feel’, with the battle for survival as its essence!
>This is Emiya Kiritsugu’s other side that was never mentioned until now and unknown by others.
>This is the fourth Heaven’s Feel that’s never been completely described until now.
>Be them the magi on the stage or their Servants; they are all boss level characters, and between them a cruel and merciless battle of elimination will be conducted.
>Urobuchi-san thought ‘Zero is a story based on Fate. So it’s better if Zero doesn’t become available to the public before Fate is released.’ Therefore, after waiting for a year, it was finally released in the winter of 2006. That’s how things went.
>Yes. Zero is canon, but at the same time it is another legend different from ‘Fate/stay night’.
>If we have to define it, it’s an extra part spin out of canon story. It's a unique leaf of a melody that Urobuchi Gen conducted from a completely Fate-ish trunk. Here, you don’t have to consider the content of the ‘Fate/stay night’ game. Only move the story according to your wishes, let the characters shown portray themselves to the fullest and rush towards the ending without regret.

>>150157955
>fate stay night
This work was a little too shonen and juvenile for my taste. But when Fate Zero adaptation came out in 2011, I think Type-Moon really came into their own, maturely and deeply.
With his thought-provoking themes and mature setting, Fate Zero makes immediately clear that this production does not only match its predecessor but far surpasses it in every way imaginable.
He's been compared to Hideaki Anno, but I think Gen Urobuchi has a far more bitter, cynical and nihilistic sense of humor.

Their most accomplished show and undisputed masterpiece "Fate/Zero" brought a lot of new fans into the franchise.
A show with battles so catchy, most secondaries probably don't even try to comprehend the deep meaning of the story. But they should, because it's not just about the powerlevels.
It's also a complex and philosophical statement about the nature of mankind.

>>150159138
retard

Can we atleast agree Kiritsugu is best waifu?

>>150159258
HF is the only route the real Kiritsugu is brought up as important (like all his circumstances, his nature, his family, his actions); the other routes mention Shirou's false vision of him. Hell, one of the bad endings involve Shirou becoming Kiritsugu II by making the wrong choice just to make this more obvious (all over HF is like "are you going to be like Kiritsugu or not?" via Illya and Kotomine). Not to mention that, by a narrative standpoint, the other two routes don't resolve Shirou Emiya's issues. FSN progresses with every single route: the presentation of the character (Fate), deeper study of what makes the protagonist thick (UBW), and finally resolve the said issues in the climax (HF).

It's even in the Tiger Dojo. Question routes (Fate, UBW), answer route (HF). HF is the one that resolves Emiya Kiritsugu's dilemna by successfully giving his heir the life Kiritsugu actually dreamed of, deep inside. It's a generational story. That's how the three families issues are also resolved in HF as well.

>>150159138
fuck off underage

>>150157955
>Stay night being better than anything

Generic, annoying MC that often gets in the way due to being useless and retarded. I don't care about "m-muh trauma". Talking about his trauma, he does literally zero progress in that, he starts the anime having the idealist mind of a 5 year old and ends the anime not having changed. I watched FSN UBW expecting something amazing due to all the good things I had heard about it, and ended utterly disappointed.

Fate/Zero was okay, but FSN was pure garbage.

>>150159410
Try the 2006 anime or wait for the movies

>>150159410
Retarded secondaries need not apply. Don't like everyone and their mother hasn't been telling you for years the proper way to start this series.

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>>150157955
>not a masterpiece by any stretch.
>Fate/stay night is superior.

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>>150160114
>le meme arrows
>Fate/Zero is a masterpiece
>posting Prisma Illya

It wasn't about idealism being bad, but about the futility of over-simplified ideals.

In Kerry's case his idea of ending all violence by resorting to violence (and solely to violence) was completely flawed.

In Saber's case it was mostly bad luck, since she could never properly listen to Lancelot, who simply wanted to apologise for his misdeeds.
Anyone who isn't a manchild knew that Iskandar's ideas were full of flaws, and GO shows this clearly.

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>>150157892
It was mostly
>messing with some ancient artifact to suddenly make everyone happy and save your wife that IS that ancient artifact is kinda a retarded idea
>life sucks sometimes, deal with it

>>150160575
>Gil shows off his dildo collection

Kerry never took anything beyond intro to philosophy and tried to act with utilitarianism
Einzberns ruined everything by infecting the grail with angry manjew aids
Of the ones making mistakes you have to give it to the einzberns

>>150157955
Fate Zero is not masterpiece by any means but far better than that porn game.

>>150162766
FSN has better writing than FZ

>>150162766
>porn game

>>150158169
The VN

>>150159258
HF Kirei is infinitely better than FZ Kirei

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>>150162931
They better not remove the Mapo Tofu.

>>150159098

Okay, anime American Psycho. Get your head out of your ass and get to the point.

>>150163048
tl;dr tsukihime remake fucking when

>>150157892
That they're all garbage kings talking shit and Iskandar had ADHD apparently.
Uro really tried his best to ruin everything

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>>150162623
Don't forget summoning this guy as a fucking berserker and gimping him in every possible way thinking they did a good job

Find an ideal that makes you happy in life, because ultimately the world is too big to change.

>>150163241
it can't be helped, you can't blame a bunch of dolls for not knowing how to fight strategically

>>150163241
He was summoned as a berserker because they wanted him to be blindly loyal.
They didn't want to be betrayed again like Kiritsugu did.

>>150163048
>replying to bait