Do you think contemporary anime designs are too detailed to

It's possible. I don't know. I don't animate things for a living.

>>148708040
It's not a problem for KyoAni.

>>148708415
But don't you think they could animate more and better movement if their character designs weren't so detailed like in Hibike? K-ON for instance had rather simple designs so it's easy to find more expressive and lively animation.

>>148708415
They lost ability to draw different designs for different shows instead. Since Nichijou.

File: 1476636565166.jpg (145KB, 1280x720px) Image search: [Google]

145KB, 1280x720px

There's a lot of ultra simplistic 3D out there too.
I don't think it's necessarily a matter of design complexity, just budget.

I don't know. 90s and 2000s anime look great, so I'd be fine with going back to the detail used back then.

I remember some complaints about the complexity of modern anime eyes a while ago, if that's part of the problem, yes, go back to older eye designs. At least Love Live eyes look really awful, they look so creepy. I'd much prefer something like Rayearth instead.

>>148708040
As much as I like higher detailed designs, I wish more shows were willing to go for lower detailed or more stylised designs to make them easier to animate.

I'll take a design that takes a third of the time to draw in exchange for more frames of animation, or something that's more visually daring.

>>148708040
Those are nothing but excuses for being lazy and having lots of QUALITY.
Though he might be right, since whenever there's dinner serious QUALITY idiots tend to say is 'intentional' instead of criticizing the studio for being such a bunch of lazy cunts.

>>148708607
>instead of criticizing the studio for being such a bunch of lazy cunts.
Or we can address how incredibly overworked animators are with not nearly as much time as they should have.

>>148708600
It probably doesn't help that a lot of anime have to work with shitty detailed designs from light novels. Sure the anime designers can simplify them a lot but it'll piss off the readers.

>>148708600
look at the preorder numbers for Flip Flappers and see how hard Japan doesn't give a shit about animation that actually moves

>>148708040
On the opposite side of the spectrum we get Mob Psycho 100, fucking sakuga cubes and that infamous Naruto Pain gif so no.

File: 1431080206965.jpg (42KB, 720x480px) Image search: [Google]

42KB, 720x480px

>>148708707
Flip Flappers is a good show with strong art direction and fantastic animation and a lot of imagination, so it's going to sell like shit because it's not devoting its efforts to pandering harder and being blander.

>>148708707
Sakuga otaku are definitely a small demographic. The average anime otaku on the other hand is satisfied by pretty designs with lots of superfluous detail.

I think the demand for more details is a natural byproduct of higher resolutions and perfectly even computer-coloring.
It's inevitable really. Either they go back to small resolutions and imperfect lines and colors, or they use details to fill the wide empty spaces. Even if it's just random noise like using a filter that makes the background look like it was painted with oil colors, everything's better than empty nothingness.

>>148708739
>sakuga cubes and that infamous Naruto Pain gif
It's far more interesting to watch then a barely-moving cookie-cutter moe character wearing some ridiculous uniform.

>>148708818
If there was a button in front of me that removed school uniforms from anime forever I'd hit it so hard you'd be able to see the impact from orbit.

>>148708455
What works for K-On doesn't work for Hibike

File: 00040.jpg (471KB, 1449x1920px) Image search: [Google]

471KB, 1449x1920px

Good design.

>>148708512
Hyouka is one of KyoAni's best animated productions and that has designs just as complicated as Eupho.

>>148708600
>>148708707
The number of frames is a borderline useless thing. What matters is how well frames follow one another.

>>148708600
>I wish more shows were willing to go for lower detailed or more stylised designs to make them easier to animate.
Not that I don't agree, but look at the shitstorm from Pokemon.

>>148708512
meme

>>148708910
Hyouka is the peak of visuals in a tv anime, it's not comparable to anything else.

>>148708904
The hair and eyes still could be simplified further to lessen the workload but I suppose it's alright for a movie. Come to think of it, hair in anime tends to be ridiculously detailed as well.

>>148708950
When I say lower detailed art styles, I don't mean worse art styles.

Animators should just get better at animating then.

>>148708966
Seriously?

File: 1475253348421.webm (736KB, 1280x720px) Image search: [Google]

736KB, 1280x720px

>>148708925
You sure about that? It's almost impossible to pull off nuanced and believable motion with limited animation.

File: veg_pv.webm (3MB, 852x480px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 852x480px

I think he fails to look at the root of the problem here: there are far too many shows airing at once in one season. If studios and producers can wisen up and prioritize quality over quality I'm sure Kyoani will have serious competition in the technical field.

When they band together the rest of the industry can produce brilliant things, just look at Your Name. They must focus their efforts instead of trying to make more for less.

>>148709012
Why is this strangely arousing?

>>148709006
When you have the best animator in the industry complaining about designs, something has got to be wrong somewhere.

>>148709025
The industry has backed itself into an otaku-driven corner. It's an odd bubble that really should burst one of these days, but judging by the fact that the industry is still lively and still growing thanks to it, this seems to be the only path to follow until everything comes crumbling down.

Less products and more quality doesn't seem to mean more profit in this market.

I wouldn't mind going back to this.
In fact, please go back to this goddammit.

https://youtu.be/V2eUOG2-vUc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IsMTpSDAGxM&t=1m5s

>>148709012
Why are they all walking like they are undead?

>>148709145
If they had two or three times as many frames it would probably be more of a swagger.

>>148709025
>>148709091
You can't say "make less anime", because how would that help? what would help is letting the studio take more time to make an anime. But this can't happen, because there are costs involved in making animation that can't go lower than this.
What need to change is the whole industry, from the bottom.

The bottom line is that, if Kyoani can do it, everyone should be able to.

>>148709169
>>148709012
Anime is literally animating with few frames, almost everything unique about it comes from this fact.

>>148708910
Oops, this post was meant as a reply to >>148708455 in case that wasn't obvious.

>>148708966
That has nothing to do with my point. Eupho's detailed designs aren't preventing it from being as well-animated as Hyouka. There's other factors to consider.

>>148709191
>The bottom line is that, if Kyoani can do it, everyone should be able to.
I'm convinced that the way to save anime is to pack up shop and move to Kyoto. You'd probably be able to afford to treat your animators like human beings that way.

File: hair.jpg (558KB, 2560x1440px) Image search: [Google]

558KB, 2560x1440px

>>148709082

>>148709025
Jesus, that looks fucking amazing.
KyoAni had better not waste these visuals on a shitty series.

>>148709025
>He thinks this shit is good
Inconsistency is never good. Detailed and rich mechanical hands which puts the head out of place. Vivid characters moving smoothly with lots of random shit flying on the screen while the background is dead. Absolute garbage

File: orig[4].jpg (479KB, 2556x2740px) Image search: [Google]

479KB, 2556x2740px

Will webgen shitters fix this problem since these lazy fucks don't use many line?

>>148709254
The sauce is good.

>>148709169
Even their walking poses in general though, especially that guy on the far left. Who the fuck walks like that?
He looks like a dad extremely drunkenly about to beat his wife

>>148709254
It seems like the usual light novel adaptation but it should look cool if the PV's anything to go by. Think Kyoukai no Kanata or something.

>>148709277
>Where is Thailand?
What did he mean by this?

>>148709254
Violet Evergarden looks vastly more interesting than pretty much every other Kyoani show because it actually has an interesting setting instead of fucking modern Japan in high school.

It's literally their first show to not focus on Japanese high schoolers.

I think he's wrong. Anime was more detailed back then and less animated as well.

>>148709210
And it is restricting its potential by doing so. More frames allows for depicting movement more effectively, there's a reason why western animators tend to work with simpler designs and higher frame counts.

>>148708040
They have to get good or get out.
If a lot of animators quit because it's too hard then maybe their wages will rise.

>>148709300
We might get a new PV in December when the second novel hits

>>148709367
No, then they just outsource more because Japanese animators are completely expendable.

>>148709329
Aside from the odd OVA with 4-tone shading I don't think that's the case on average. A lot of TV anime these days are derived from LNs or VNs with original design work done by hack artists so animators have to work with designs inherently unfit for animation.

>>148709329
Examples to support that claim? Most 70s and 80s shows I've seen were pretty simplistic in character design.

>>148709367
See>>148709049

>>148708415
But it is, their detailed shows are mostly SoLs full of close-ups with little no movement.

Instead more dynamic shows had to adopt a more simple looking artstyle like Nichijou.

>>148709429
Nichijou is a manga adaptation, numbnuts.

>>148709429
That's not really true, if anything they're a lot more dynamic than most shows these days, even those with simpler designs.

>>148709429
>But it is, their detailed shows are mostly SoLs full of close-ups with little no movement.
b8

>>148709343
Too bad western animators have no concept of good cinematography. Anime uses perspective and camera angles to create proper moods, like looking down on the characters and hiding their eyes to show that they're feeling down, or looking up at the characters and showing the blue sky to show that they're following their dreams, etc. You simply don't see that kind of stuff in western animation, it's almost always boring shots from the same angle.

File: just outsource lmao.jpg (95KB, 1440x810px) Image search: [Google]

95KB, 1440x810px

>>148709426
>something has to be wrong
Animators are being left behind and this is not the designer's fault.

>>148709395
Sure.

File: muh background character animation.webm (2MB, 1024x576px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 1024x576px

>>148709091
>>148709191
I cited Your Name specifically as an example that a modern, non-Ghibli production can reach mainstream and be very successful. Although that one movie might be an outlier, it showed that there is demand for modern Japanese animated features. Anime viewerbase is actually quite large, even if you're looking at only Japan, but because of the ridiculous prices only a small fraction of people (i.e. diehard otaku with cash) can afford to buy things. It doesn't help that the BD benefits often cater to otaku specifically, it's a negative feedback loop when it can be much more than that.

>>148709263
It's a preproduction PV. It's aim is to hype and promote the novel (and it seems quite successful at doing that) through flashy visuals. Also digital effects are becoming more commonplace so good luck if you don't like it.

>>148709475
You can apply that to most eastern works as well though.

I wouldn't mind sacrificing a zillion lines for movement if it means we can see this shit again.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VZEFs_A0l7U
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9BoD3uqre4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=brjOR_mRc1Y&t=2m23s

>>148709299
Probably some kind of an in joke, I don't know
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yg5uY2C34OY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g-bPxMfYVCA

I think we just need to ban CG for main characters unless you're going full out like Sidonia.

I mean look at this shit.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sfo5BW1vGog

>>148709481
Yes it is. In animation, it is important for the designs to be made suitable for the animation process to go smoothly. They need to be able to accommodate the level of time and skill available on the project and not just for the few insanely good ones. The industry sure as hell isn't looking likely to slow down and give projects more time to be made so making animation-friendly designs is the most viable solution. It is possible to look good with simple designs and shitty anime otaku need to understand that.

>>148709049
Iso doesn't even animate anymore.

>>148709496
I miss the times when KyoAni's characters weren't overdetailed and ugly.

> simplifying designs

What you mean like Family Guy or some shit like Adventure time?

No thanks

>>148709612
He has been doing uncredited animation.

>>148709592
That's depressing. Having to lower your output because animator can catch up to your work. I guess it can't be helped.

>>148708707
It would've sold decently if it had any marketing whatsoever. Most people have never heard of it.

>>148709520
Funny you brought up that Evangelion scene given that the animator complaining about detailed design in the OP post animated the part you just precisely linked.

>>148709278
Pretty sure you didn't read it.

>>148709616
Those shows look bad because the designs are shit, not because they're simple. Something good and simple would be like Tokuyuki Matsutake's designs in Medabots or Yukiko Horiguchi's K-ON.

File: 1439557770009.gif (3MB, 543x693px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 543x693px

>>148709300
>literally their first show to not focus on Japanese high schoolers

Holy shit how have I never noticed that until now.

File: Birdy Decode 2 Shingo Yamashita genga.jpg (111KB, 640x480px) Image search: [Google]

111KB, 640x480px

>>148709277
I hope so.

>>148709191
>You can't say "make less anime", because how would that help? what would help is letting the studio take more time to make an anime.
I don't seee how these things are different. If they made fewer shows then they would have more time to focus on development.

In terms of originality and storytelling, most anime is so shit because they're stuck in this rate of high turnover which means they don't have much time to develop anything. It's why so many shows resort to all these default tropes. If all anime are the same, then of course they have trouble selling the BDs to people and have to rely on sales of merchandise which basically to amounts selling pure visual designs.

To have a wider variety of more interesting shows, they need to stop the market from being so oversaturated and allow themselves more time o develop the stories.

>>148709295

You never seen a Yakuza/Bosozoku swagger like that?

It's all about budget.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m_nL1PWWSDY

>MFW Disney will never bankroll an anime studio and let it do it's thing

>>148709145
>>148709295
That shot is a reference to A Clockwork Orange.

>>148709968
It's all about talent and a good schedule.

>>148709968
>>148710013

It's all about a plethora of contributing factors, you fags.

File: scheduledude.jpg (137KB, 1280x720px) Image search: [Google]

137KB, 1280x720px

>>148710013
>a good schedule.

>>148709343
It isn't. You have to pay for frames, be it in time or animators, and it's not worth it.

>>148709496
Movies are completely different from normal anime.

>>148709911
>most anime is so shit because they're stuck in this rate of high turnover
No, most anime are mediocre (not shit, huge difference) because they are based on cheap LN. It has nothing to do with the high turnover, it has to do with one key feature of anime: they are made to advertise something.

>>148709911

Because they are weekly series, each week they have a episode to air, making less series would not change that.

Its not a OVA or a movie were they have much more time.

Even if they ad more time it would be pointless, anime for a decade now been digital, most series are entirely CGI that just points to one thing, the lower animation quality is caused by simply lower standarts, its not they cannot make it better ... is they dont give a shit.

>>148710262
>most series are entirely CGI
You don't know what you're talking about.

>its a /a/ thinks it knows about animation episode

>>148710262
You do realize they can make most of the anime beforehand and then just do the last few episodes while it airs right?
You don't have to make it just as you're about to air it

>>148710225
Cheap LNs are similarly mediocre because like anime there's too many of them. The exact same thought process seems to happen with the writers >How do I make this good? I'll just mix and matches aspects from other LNs I've read.

>>148710302

Do you really believe they still use cell animation? even manga is digital now.

File: yawara1.jpg (188KB, 960x720px) Image search: [Google]

188KB, 960x720px

>>148708040
I don't care how hard it is, give me more cute fucking outfits.

>>148710302
>>148710391
You're confusing multiple things here.

>Hand drawing & Scanning into PC
>Hand drawing on a tablet directly
>Hand drawing, photographing on to cells, & coloring cells
>3D
>Computer coloring/editing

File: WiGLG2L.gif (1MB, 458x360px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 458x360px

>>148710391
The post-production part of manga is digital, most anime and manga is still handdrawn on paper.

>>148710391
You think "CGI" and "digital" can be used interchangeably? He doesn't think animation now is still produced on cels, he knows it's digital, but it isn't CGI. The G in CGI stands for "generated", which implies the computer is doing more work by itself than the simple bucketfilling of colour that it is used for when digitally colouring hand drawn frames.

>>148710335

Series are done by committees, you have about 6 months in advance as they are announced.

Studios usually have several teams, of course there is preparation work but they still have to produce about 240 minutes of animation and there is also recording voice acting and then splice them, even if you have the footage done doesnt mean the voice recording is done.

A lot of things can go wrong, plus anime doesnt make much money, studios have to remain active all year around to pay their staff, this is a businesses not a hobby.

File: 1405532770343.webm (3MB, 800x450px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 800x450px

What do we think about flat shading?

I've always felt it was interesting, back when I used to watch Naruto, that it was clearly visible the episodes were produced by different teams that would alternate from one episode to the next, and there were good teams and shit teams. The good team's episodes would have better animation and flatter shading, while the shit team's episodes would have poor animation and more shading. Obviously the less time dedicated to drawing out all the shading, the better the animation can be...

But what I also noticed about this was that the shit teams episodes would also have much poorer drawings, they were basically less skilled on all fronts. If you flattened out the shading it would be obvious, meaning the shading actually hides their shoddy construction, because the more detail (or rather, noise) that there is, the harder it is for the eye to truly grasp how much skill has been put into the drawing.

File: 1402005949127.webm (2MB, 640x360px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 640x360px

>>148711211
And then there's the likes of Mamoru Hosoda who uses flat colours even in theatrical releases. Obviously there's an element of it being an aesthetic choice, but you've got to have real confidence to know you can even pull it off.

>>148711314
Hosoda and Shinkai had some of Ghibli's talent working for their movies. Projects like theirs aren't easy to come by.

>>148708040
There is no way that shirt isn't shopped

>>148712099
You think so? I believe this is absolutely the sort of thing KyoAni would put into their anime, especially after Ritsu's cock hat.

File: cocknow.png (166KB, 342x299px) Image search: [Google]

166KB, 342x299px

>>148712166
They can't keep getting away with it

File: thisishowactuallyanimationis.webm (3MB, 854x480px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 854x480px

>>148711314
>the background characters are static

>>148712458
In that Summer Wars webm you're supposed to be only looking at one thing. In you Urusei Yatsura webm it's supposed to just be a busy scene with no particular focus.

Also I'm pretty sure that Summer Wars scene is precluded by a scene just like yours. I hope you're trolling and aren't trying to make any sort of legitimate point.

>>148710330
I blame /m/fags (muh cells) and kyoanifags being bored again and coming to /a/ to pretend to know what they're talking about.

But at least they're not studiowarring right now.
Not that this thread is any interesting, since it's just the same people regurgitating the same things again.

>>148712839
>pretend to know what they're talking about
>muh cells
the irony

>>148710337
No, they are mediocre because most writers are mediocre writers.

>contemporary character design is so detailed that the industry may have to give up on 2D in favour of 3D
Is it not a consequence of Japan being host to both a large animation industry and a large videogame industry? There's certainly some crossover when it comes to design, just look at Kozaki Yusuke, for example.

And manga too.

If an anime is an adaption of a manga or a videogame, or even a light novel, then the designs have to be downgraded, which is a disappointment for expectant fans. If it's an original property, then that is less of a problem, but now it's competing with the visual complexity of those mediums.

>>148713203
So what you're saying is that we need more original series that aren't tied to anything and less LN and manga adaptations that are often incomplete and have to have their designs downgraded for the sake of animation?

Because let's face it, LNs are the YA and Airport novels of Japan

>>148708040
>Iso crying that he hasn't kept up with modern anime aesthetics

Sorry bud but your realism and 90's forms are old and busted. There are plenty of new animators who have no problems with modern anime and probably want to continue animating autism-tier level detail of moeshits.

Honestly though I like the 90's aesthetic. The models feel more solid and grittier.

Iso should just make a studio with a focus on what he wants to do. He could get a bunch of older animators who have a similar skill set. Then they just need a character designer who's a good balance between modern aesthetics and 90's style. It would work well with more experimental anime, too, since waifushit doesn't work that great with DEEP plots.

>>148708040
What is this guy even saying?

>>148713581
He did that in Dennou Coil and he burned a fuckton of bridges because he's a goddamn autist.

>>148713701
at least we got Dennou Coil out of it

>>148709254
>LN

>>148713753
His Raxephon episode was better than his work on Dennou Coil

>>148713819
What makes you say that?

>>148713871
My opinion. I liked the style of that particular episode more than the whole Dennou Coil series.

>>148713701
>mfw Dennou Coil's designs
Yeah Iso shouldn't be in charge of design since his sensibilities are questionable, even though they worked for the show. In that same year, Gurren Lagann aired. You could easily argue that GL designs are relatively simple, yet everyone would probably say they're much more palatable.

Studios are getting pretty good at doing good artwork for their shows (even JC staff shit is pretty impressive nowadays), but honestly I don't know how much it matters. I think there's still a place for simpler designs, especially if they can capitalize on it with better animation and in other ways.

File: 1475967870626.webm (73KB, 388x555px) Image search: [Google]

73KB, 388x555px

>>148708040
what exactly are examples of overdetailed designs today? Kyoani shows are all pretty damn plain.

File: 2yv6qly.jpg (20KB, 552x300px) Image search: [Google]

20KB, 552x300px

>>148714001
The final designs were by Takeshi Honda, not Iso. They looked a little different before Honda refined them

File: Cuk9syQUIAAFv5A.jpg (198KB, 752x1037px) Image search: [Google]

198KB, 752x1037px

>>148714327
I love Hibike's designs. They feel classic but well done.

>>148714563
Holy fuck left looks like she has a brain tumor and downs syndrome

>>148708040
Blend with western cartoon style like Star vs Forces of Evil and Grav Falls.

>>148709343
I don't know about you but at least with Disney animation it always pissed me off how the characters just NEVER STOP MOVING.
They're constantly contorting their faces and bodies like fucking water and making one facial expression after another and they just won't stay fucking still.
Anime is nice. Things move when it's necessary. Then when they pull off the sakuga it feels really cool because you don't see it all the time.

> too detailed

fuck off, two-tone shaded garbage calling itself too detailed.

>>148709025
wow that's some good animation I wish I could see it through them blinding me with lights.

>>148708040
> there are designs that look complex but are not difficult to draw
So what exactly is he saying the issue is? They're easy to draw but difficult to draw in motion? Does he think this has caused anime to move too little, or that it moves enough and looks bad because of the detail, or what?

Also,
>Do you think contemporary anime designs are too detailed to be animation-friendly?
>Legendary animator Mitsuo Iso certainly thinks so.
Please don't start your posts like clickbait news articles, complete with descriptions of who Iso is.

>>148714327
wtf is that bow even for?

>>148715541
To help establish her as the ribbon character.

>>148715541
That's the real "Ribbons".
The thing under it is just a meat puppet.

>>148709025
This argument is always dumb as shit because it treats labor as a zero sum game - you take away time and effort and money from one show, and it all goes to the remaining ones. But that's not how business works. If JC Staff only did three shows a year, they'd just have fewer people working on their shows. Hell, look at Sunrise - they cut way back on TV anime the last two or three years, and did the average quality of their shows go way up? No, we just got Love Live, Cross Ange, and bad Gundam installments, and they certainly weren't using most of their manpower on those. Quality and quantity aren't some sort of magical tradeoff, this logic is ridiculous.

>>148714563
Yikes. Anyway, more appealing designs might have helped.

>>148714327
They're not plain. I'd say Hibike has among the most complicated bishoujo designs, especially with closeup shots. The instruments also look like a nightmare to draw. Anyway, they aren't super efficient but they still typically emphasize having very detailed drawings in their animation (and it's getting worse - S2 looks better than S1 IMO).

Horiguchi did pretty simple designs because of her style which is chibi-esque, but the other character designers seem to put out much more complicated (i.e., lines everywhere) character art. They've been doing it for a while though - I think the first big jump was with Hyouka. I also thought the CM for their most recent work (Violet Evergarden) was overanimated.

>>148715541
To "look cute".
It's a girl thing, you wouldn't understand.

>>148715815
>overanimated
Fuck you

>>148715815
>overanimated

>>148708753
>I love my shows that have absolutely tons of style with no regard for substance whatsoever with the most boring and linear cast known to man.

>>148716173
my fedora nigga

File: 1476700096173.jpg (144KB, 1280x720px) Image search: [Google]

144KB, 1280x720px

>>148716173
>I hate cute things

>>148716173
It's the only show that's impressed me this year in terms of writing.

File: himeee.png (2MB, 1824x1030px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 1824x1030px

>>148708040

Yeah man, all those details in anime today. We should have less. Human eye can only perceive two lines per second anyway

>>148715815
>overanimated

forced animation

File: 1447535765546.webm (3MB, 1280x720px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 1280x720px

Just make more CGDCT and drop every other inferior genre.

>>148716103
>>148716116
>getting triggered by a word

By "overanimated" I meant that the studio was animating excessively in a way it's not yet comfortable with, resulting in awkward animation. The Evergarden CM is noodly and has awkward animation. Kyoani went full retard, sticking drawings in where they normally wouldn't, screwing up the overall look.

If you want something that's extremely well animated but not "overanimated," look at realist animators. The animation is silky smooth and perfectly on model, but doesn't feel awkward.

>>148716258
>didn't watch Re:Zero

>>148715815
>for their most recent work (Violet Evergarden) was overanimated
>not even released
>judging the animation in a PV
>overanimated
this post fucking sucks

>>148716489
Nah, it was good bait.

>>148716470
Shit you're right, ignore my post I'm retarded.

>>148716576
>>148716470
110% samefag.

>>148716443
>like CGDCT
>posts the most annoyingly bland CGDCT other than Kiniro Mosaic
smhtbqhwyfamalam

>>148716173
What the fuck is substance

>>148716576
>>148716470
>>148716458
>>148716263
>>148716173
How many layers of irony are these posts in?

>>148715815
its a CM, its supposed to be flashy. That's like saying a movie is poorly directed just by watching the commercials of action shots

>>148716657
Jizz.

>>148716657
muh human condition

>>148716657
Stuff you find in shows like Evangelion, Utena and Re:Zero.

>>148716723
One of those does not belong.

>>148716489
>quoting "for their most recent work" instead of "the CM for their most recent work"
>arguing that point and saying that the show hasn't been released yet, even though that has nothing to do with the criticism of the PV
Way to quote out of context and argue that point. Guess you're that desperate to disagree.

>>148716758
>hating on based Anno

>>148716758
You're forgetting the alternate definition >>148716719 provided. Once you account for that, Evangelion does belong after all.

File: 1437644645496.jpg (60KB, 1280x720px) Image search: [Google]

60KB, 1280x720px

>>148716654
>bland CGDCT
There's no such thing.

>>148716705
Fair point. I don't like it, but it got the attention it wanted. I also don't think a trailer says nothing about a studio and what we can expect from it, either.

I would much rather have more detailed characters and environments than good animation. I just cant take animation seriously when it looks childish like American cartoons.

>>148716904
There is. Most recently I watched Kinmosa and Gochiusa and those shows are as bland as a CGDCT can get.

>>148716687
>thinking those post were any kind of highly regarded irony layering
I bet you haven't even seen post memetic multiversal irony.

>>148717080
Kinmoza was a miracle, though, and I can't wait for the movie.

>>148717042
You can sacrifice detail without making it look retarded. Future Boy Conan, for example, has very simple character designs but they're a far cry from Adventure Time.

>>148717123
I know your tastes are shit, but Kinmosa is objectively a dull CGDCT show.

>>148717080
Can you explain what do you mean with 'bland'?
Which other CGDCT doesn't apply for the term and why?

>>148717127
No I prefer actually realistic proportions and backgrounds. I don't want a middle ground, I want anime which is why I watch it. If I didn't like what they were doing I would do something else with my time.

>>148717205
It's not great but it's cute and has some nice moments. I dunno why you're being so adamant about this, it's pretty innocuous.

>>148716785
This post is even worse.

>>148717260
What are / are there some popular or well regarded anime shows with character designs you think are too unrealistic? Or is it only American stuff you dislike? What are some of your favourite character designs?

>>148717387
Ironic shitposting is still shitposting.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bvIO-YwMxEo

embed related

>>148717245
Keion. Keion is the perfect CGDCT show. Characters have characteristics outside of their main "draw". They feel alive. They progress. They feel. CGDCT shows these days only focus on each girl's draw and omit everything else. Sansha Sanyu was a great return to form though.

>>148717498
don't people argue that CGDCT SOL shows are supposed to stay in a status quo though? Something about muh comfy

>>148717205
>objectively
That's not how entertainment works.

>>148708966
Maybe if you've only seen 10 anime.

>>148717636
what has better visuals?

This thread gave me AIDS.

>>148717545
Drooling retards claim that. People in the industry have actually praised Keion as the peak of japanimation.

>>148717715
and people wonder why the industry is shit

>>148717245
Kinmosa and GochiUsa's character archetypes and the contrast they have with each other is as generic as it gets, I'm talking A-Channel tier of generic. Character interactions feel scripted and unnatural, unlike actual good CGDCT shows like K-On, Azumanga, Lucky Star, Love Lab, Yuyushiki, etc. They're not bad shows per se, they're just mediocre.

>>148717812
Not him but I can't think of a show as good as K-On! since. The industry is shit, yes, but I don't think that show's to blame.

>>148717715
Toshiyuki Inoue criticised KyonAni's sense of movement as being overtly samey and comfortable and that they should be trying to reach beyond it. He said he enjoyed the show, he could see the appeal in it and it wasn't a disparaging comment, just that he thought they're kinda stuck in their ways

>>148717675
Katanagatari, Haikyuu, Eva, Mononoke, CCS, Ippo, YST the list goes on and on

>>148717898
>Haikyuu
>Ippo
>YST
What the fuck.

>>148717898
Nice bait.

>>148709300
>It's literally their first show to not focus on Japanese high schoolers.
They had that one shit show Munto with fantasy setting, were there any highschoolers?

>>148708966
>Adobe AfterEffects
>peak of visuals in anime

>>148717942
Haikyuu has gorgeous, fluid animation are you retarded?

>>148717953
So you honestly believe Hyouka had better visuals than Eva? Are you blind?

>>148717988
Munto's "normal Japanese highschooler actually has magical destiny".

>>148717988
Haikyuu's visuals are plain as fuck my man.

File: 1430218399819.webm (3MB, 1920x1080px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 1920x1080px

>>148717851
Kiniro Mosaic would not be utterly forgettable if it wasn't for Karen, that funny little urchin

>>148718029
Fuck, meant for >>148717964

File: 1442555974906.gif (498KB, 260x200px) Image search: [Google]

498KB, 260x200px

>>148717498
>Keion is the perfect CGDCT show
I disagree with this, I loved the characters and the story but at the end I didn't perceive a single evidence of a change in the former, as another point I didn't like how the quality of the show was constantly dependent of the story itself rather than in the daily situations.

I find Manabi Straight the real perfect CGDCT, for reasons.

File: plain.gif (2MB, 500x250px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 500x250px

>>148718037
nice b8

>>148717851
I don't think putting Love Lab, Lucky Star and YuYu together with Keion and Azumanga is correct. Azumanga, Keion, Hidamari and TAmako are peak anime in my opinion. The others while great shouldn't be put on the same level.

>>148717988
Hyouka's is easily on par, and the visual direction is much better.

>>148718029
>>148718054
Oh, ok.

>>148718069
>tumblr gif
Go fuck yourself with a rake, you piece of shit.

>>148718110
The character designs are far better. They actually look like different people. The fluidity of the animation is consistently better. I will agree that the visual direction is better.

>>148718028
Eva had great compositions but holy fuck did it look bad in the latter half. And Ep 23/24 exists. FLCL looked better than Eva. TTGL finale looked better than EVA.

>>148718109
Tamako is bad and Azumanga, despite being fucking funny, is only good as a manga and even then it's pretty trashy at times. I still gotta see Hidamari, I really hope it's as good as people make it out to be. In terms of anime K-On! is the only cute girls show I can name of outstanding artistic merit.

>>148718152
>getting triggered over a gif
I just went with the first one I found autismo

>>148718069

If you're going to try to prove someone wrong with an example, don't use a shitty washed-out GIF. Apply yourself, Anon.

>>148718109
Azumanga is stupidly overrated.

>>148718200
>The character designs are far better
stopped reading there

>>148718215
FLCL is an OVA so it doesn't count. The TTGL finale actually had a budget so of course it looked better than the 23/24 episodes. But overall as a series the visual direction, and sakuga are some of the best in anime. Also EoE exists.

>>148718308
>EoE
>including movies
Kaguya hime is a thing.

>>148718271
Can't handle the truth anon? KyoAni has recycled the same character designs for each show after Nichijou.

>>148717988
>Haikyuu
>lets draw the same arm flick every time
>lets draw Hinata and then slide the background for the 20th time

>>148718363
Wait, so Shouko and Chitanda are the same design?

>>148718200
It has ugly generic fujo designs.
At most it looks better than Free.

>>148718366
It's a volleyball anime retard of course they're going to draw Hinata spiking the ball a lot. Every time it happens it looks fantastic.

>>148718269
Azumanga is stupidly underrated and underwatched.

>>148717898
>Katanagatari, Haikyuu, CCS, Ippo, YST
I an dying right now

>>148718379
With LN adaptations they reuse the same designs. They actually did a great job at adapting the manga characters for the movie.

>>148718461
So Kumiko and Chitanda are the same design?

>>148718442
How does Katanagatari and Card Captor Sakura not have incredible animation? Is KyoAnis dick so far up your ass that you can't notice other studios?

>>148718474
They're very similar, they just changed the hair color/style and eye color. The face looks exactly the same.

>>148718474
Those are novels.

Also Kumiko is an adapted design and Chitanda is original.

>>148718402
Nice buzzwords anon. Maybe next time you'll come up with a real argument.

Here's what I don't get about people who hate ufotable and love Kyoani, their approach is not that different than Kyoani, their use of CG is almost exactly the same except for the use of particle effects and 3D backgrounds more often, which doesnt happen that much anyway.

>>148717898
>YST
Do you mean Tatami? Or Yoroiden Samurai Troopers? Either way, no one fucking uses that abbreviation.

>>148718582
Because retards fell for the GodAni meme, and couldn't stop sucking their cock. Studiofags are the biggest cancer on this board.

>>148718497
>Visuals
>animation
also
>Katanagatari
>animation
At least mention Utena you raging homofaggot if you want to mention old anime with some actual good understanding of compositing.

There's so much industry specialists on this board, amazing.

>>148718586
I use it because I don't want to type out Yojouhan Shinwa Taikei it should be obvious anon. Samurai Troopers is garbage.

>>148718566
>>148718461
>every show since Nichijou
>except half of them

>>148718677
The first thing that comes to mind when I see YST is definitely not the rarely-used Japanese name of Tatami Galaxy, anon.

>>148718645
We're talking about direction AND animation try and follow a conversation retard. Katanagatari excels at both.

>>148718624
Most KyoAni fans are director fans. Fujos are still sucking Utsumi's dick even after she left. Other like Takemoto or Yamada. It isn't about the studio as much as it is about the creators.

>>148718536
The shape of the face and of the eyes are also different, so basically what you're claiming is that they're the same because they both have the same nose and mouth.

>>148718730
So a shitty, forgotten 80's anime comes to mind before that?

File: maxresdefault.jpg (183KB, 1920x1080px) Image search: [Google]

183KB, 1920x1080px

>>148708040
>>contemporary character design is so detailed that the industry may have to give up on 2D in favour of 3D
ArcSys anime studio soon.

>>148718741
Katanagatari had a great art director and good color usage. Other than that the anime was meh to look at.

>>148718741
We're talking about visuals, which includes both, but every time someone criticizes your choices you go "IT HAS GREAT ANIMATION" as though anyone had disputed that. And no, Katanagatari excels at having an interesting artstyle, but the animation and visual direction aside from that are solid at best.

>>148718768
The shape of the face is near identical. The Chitanda's eyes are SLIGHTLY elongated. They still look very fucking similar.

>>148718800
THey don't have shit on CyberConnect2.

>>148718785
Yes.

>>148718855
How's autism treating you?

>>148718851
>slap on cel shading
>that makes it look like anime right
Kill yourself.

>>148718363
I don't think you know what a character design is.

File: boom.webm (2MB, 852x480px) Image search: [Google]

2MB, 852x480px

>>148718808
So this is meh?

>>148717964
Middle schoolers, but there was a time skip of some years.

File: sameface.jpg (450KB, 1300x1129px) Image search: [Google]

450KB, 1300x1129px

>>148719005
I could say the same to you. KyoAni is notorious for using similar character designs. Where do you think the KyoAni sameface meme came from?

>>148719016
Not him, but there's nothing particularly impressive about that either animation or directing-wise. And that sudden switch from a higher-detail shot of the tower to a lower-detail one is shit.

>>148719107
wew lad, I wonder just who is it that purposely cut out the Ghibli part

>>148719144
We all know that Ghibli is guilty of it also. There's no point in including it.

>>148719144
Other way around, the Ghibli one was added in a later edit.

>>148719176
>We

>>148719107
None of those characters have similar character designs. I think you should look up what 'character design' means.
>taking memes seriously

>>148719144
The right question to ask is why the fag who made this put the faces in such a way that only one studio has the same expression for all their characters ;^)

File: ghibli.png (345KB, 500x367px) Image search: [Google]

345KB, 500x367px

>>148719214
Do you disagree? There are a couple outliers but for the most part they all look very similar.

>>148718755
That's a byproduct of watching every show the studio makes when they only have a few directors. I doubt Kyoanifags know about anime directors outside the studio any more than the average /a/non.

>>148719283
>tumblr

>>148719265
And left out all the shows that looked the most different.

>>148719243
>being this delusional
Get your head out of your ass. I love KyoAni but saying that they don't reuse character designs is retarded.

>>148719322
Well meme'd

>>148719322
Learn what a character design is.

>>148719322
Here's a hint - "character design" does not mean "the design of the interior of the characters faces only".

>>148719309
How autistic are you? I've never been to tumblr.

>>148719395
Clearly anyone who isn't from tumblr is autistic

File: SUCY.jpg (58KB, 710x502px) Image search: [Google]

58KB, 710x502px

>>148708904
Could you still tell who these characters are if I got rid of all surface details? Nah, didn't think so.
Pic related is a good design.

>>148719283
>>148719107
To be honest it makes sense to keep improving on a single design over the years and only change when it's necessary for both Ghibli and KyoAni. Why would you change a working formula when the teams working for you know how to handle it well already. Other studios don't have the luxury of teams being really familiar with each other's work.

>>148719452
Because they all look the same, the design doesn't even look good. They excel in art direction but their characters look like amorphous blobs.

>>148719515
Cute amorphous blobs.

>>148715541
>wtf
Kill yourself

>>148719440
That's a cartoon design though. Not anime.
Look at Taeko Okajima for a lesson on good simplistic character design.

>>148719357
>>148719379
See
>>148719440
This character looks fundamentally different than other characters in the show.

>>148719440
Just because they follow a different design sense doesn't make them good or bad.

>>148719515
Which design?

File: 14324190579.jpg (65KB, 499x498px) Image search: [Google]

65KB, 499x498px

>>148719558
>LWA
>not anime
Are you retarded?

File: IMG_0002.jpg (35KB, 480x640px) Image search: [Google]

35KB, 480x640px

>>148719515
They make cute characters. Pic related on moeifying old men.

>>148719598
K-On, KnK, Hyouka, Hibike, Free!, Tamako, Haruhi

>>148719599
LWA and P&S are /co/ tier desu. Far too removed from anime to enter this kind of discussion.

>>148719562
Non sequitur. They are not reusing the same design, and Sucy has nothing to do with that.

>>148719627
You're not being specific here

>>148719627
If you honestly think that Nishya's and Horiguchi's design look similar this discussion is too pointless.

>>148719661
I don't have to be specific because the designs in all of those shows look almost the same.

>>148719627
>the design
>which design
>names shows
I'm beginning to think that you've conflated design with artstyle or something.

>>148719698
What a retard.

>>148719698
You're going to need to be specific because they look different.

File: 1474556263960.png (145KB, 702x397px) Image search: [Google]

145KB, 702x397px

>>148716173
>linear cast

>>148708040
Alternative opinion
https://washiblog.wordpress.com/2015/04/09/ryo-chimo-the-digital-animation-movement/
https://washiblog.wordpress.com/2014/07/12/the-animation-of-love-lab-the-dogakobo-gang/

File: 1356340570999.jpg (1MB, 1500x3266px) Image search: [Google]

1MB, 1500x3266px

>>148719515
>>148719322
>>148719107
>muh sameface
Kill yourself.

>>148719635
So does that make Crayon Shin-chan not anime too? Doremon?

Considering anime can all look completely different, it means you need a more robust qualifier than "this doesn't look like the average anime"

>>148717636
I watched almost 160 days of anime, from 60s to 10s, including experimental ovas.

>>148719787
Only LN/Originals were discussed not adaptations retard. Horiguchi makes the same characters for most of the shows. Tamako and Hyouka could be the same fucking show the characters look that similar.

>>148719821
To be honest Shin-chan, Maroko and Doreamon are too big to compare to the other shows. But yeah LWA and P&S are made with way too much western influences for me to talk about them in a thread talking about average Japenese designs. LWA is an outlier.

File: grid.webm (3MB, 1920x1080px) Image search: [Google]

3MB, 1920x1080px

>>148717675
Kyoukai no Kanata

>>148719926
where are the proofs :-DDD

>>148719926
>Only LN/Originals were discussed not adaptations retard
>LN
>not adaptations
Apparently "design" isn't the only word you don't understand.

>>148719787
>I can name the different designers
This never sees like much of an argument to me. Considering how any anime production completely relies on a group of people's ability to draw the same as their colleagues, it shouldn't be a surprise that a house style starts to emerge, especially from as insular a studio as KyoAni (much the same as Ghibli). Yes the characters have differences, but is it so much of a stretch to admit that all of them align fairly closely?

Literally only Lucky Star and Nichijou have seen them actually push themselves to achieve any sort of distinctiveness in the designs.

>>148719926
Nishya has an artstyle that he tends to use in all the works. Horiguchi's style is far too blobby to be compared to Nishya's. Tamako could pass as a Keion if you're blind but there's no way she could pass in Hyouka.

>>148720050
>achieve any sort of distinctiveness
Because kyoani only adapts the original designs, no shit.

>>148719980
They never adapt the designs from light novels adequatel, they turned Mirai into another generic moeblob.

>>148720050
LS and Nichijou required those art styles. Hibike especially is a huge improvement over the LN and manga designs(yes LN). So was every KyoPublishing design. When they needed to do another peculiar character design they did it with Koe no Katachi.

>>148720050
>Literally only Lucky Star and Nichijou
Have you repressed AM I KAWAII UGUU?

>>148720082
>Tamako could pass as a Keion if you're blind
It's literally the same art style. They could easily be set in the same world. All this hyperbole makes attempts at discussion in /a/ fucking impossible, especially a topic that requires an appreciation of nuance like this one.

>>148720050
>This never sees like much of an argument to me
How is this my problem, the evidence is right there in the image, I don't give a fuck what you consider to be an argument or not since you've already been proven wrong.

File: not chitanda and not tamako.jpg (128KB, 1156x632px) Image search: [Google]

128KB, 1156x632px

>>148719926
sure thing buddy

>>148720168
But that was Toei

>>148720319
They could be sisters they look so much alike.

I honestly have to ask, why the fuck does it even matter if a studio uses the same artstyle or not? Actual sameface (e.g. some of Hirai's worse works where you literally cannot tell people apart) is one thing, but if it's "these characters could live in the same world," then I don't get the issue. Why does every studio have to do a bunch of different things?

File: what is moe.png (277KB, 1064x1516px) Image search: [Google]

277KB, 1064x1516px

>>148719606
>moeifying old men
I don't see a mustache.

File: 1406296229592.png (149KB, 460x420px) Image search: [Google]

149KB, 460x420px

>>148720384

>>148720395
Because it gets them (You)s

>>148718730
I guess it wouldn'tbe /a/ if people weren't fellating Funimation fanfiction names.

>it's an old man yells at clouds episode again
Get good or fuck off.

>ITT: faggots who'd mistake a Grimshaw for a Monet

>>148720395
If you're referring to my comment here >>148720191 , I have no problem with that, I just took issue with that guy's apparent denial that the art styles of K-On! and Tamako Market are exactly the same.

>>148720562
But he's the best that ever been.

File: sm.jpg (111KB, 816x544px) Image search: [Google]

111KB, 816x544px

>>148720191
>>148720384
I meet people who had hard time figuring out differences between anime characters from the same anime because "they all look literally the same". This is also like with "all white/asian/black look the same" trope in opposite groups. I think there was study on the problem why people can't differentiate between unfamiliar faces or something like that.

>>148720662
Not really. K-On's art style is more blobbish and loose. Tamako's is more refined.

>>148720613
>ITT faggots sucking KyoAnis dick

>>148720982
KyoAni have a pussy, not dick.

>>148720982
Have you looked up the difference between art style and character design yet?

>>148721066
You obviously haven't.

>>148721154
destroyed

File: villains.jpg (191KB, 1384x696px) Image search: [Google]

191KB, 1384x696px

Even their villains have the same design. How do they get away with it?

So it's established that KyoAni has the most cancerous fanbase, right?

>>148721483
Nah, the most cancerous fanbase belongs to whatever you dislike the most.

>>148721536
Nah, I'm pretty sure this thread (and every other KyoAni related thread) are good enough proof.

>>148721410
wtf i hate kyoani now

>>148721410
Ribbons did nothing wrong

>>148721483
The Kyoani fanbase spouts truth and justice with actual research and elaboration behind their words. Anti-kyoani people just shitpost, follow incorrect widespread ideas from internet forums (le Nichijou flop meme). They are just an echo chamber.

Literally all anti Kyoani non-arguments here:
>sameface
>school setting
>spamming filters
>safe zone
>moeshit
>all style no substance
>pretty colors, bad writing
In fact I'm pretty sure someone complaining about Kyoani fans believe in the above points

>>148721410
>Left
Literally Touka in a halloween costume
>Middle
Literally Mugi with a ribbon
>Right
Literally Taki-sensei with his hair brushed

File: well meme'd.jpg (558KB, 1920x1080px) Image search: [Google]

558KB, 1920x1080px

>>148722323
>Literally

>>148709551
>we just need to ban CG
>we
Haha that's cute. You think our voices are cared about?

>>148718351
>>148718351
It had the worst art direction though.

>>148721410
Hibike's villain is Taki-sensei.

File: 1444287665326.jpg (130KB, 800x800px) Image search: [Google]

130KB, 800x800px

>>148722996

>>148722996
Hibike's villain is Mugino.

>>148718978
Not him but he didn't imply that. Also Asura's Wrath and the NUNS series had beautiful animation.

>>148708415
>Moe garbage

>>148722996
>>>/u/

>>148708415

This.

Koe no Katachi under Nishiya's watch was fucking godly.

The issue with anime is not about the character design but rather how it's approached on a perspective of the whole project. Tons of studio still fuck up the scheduling meanwhile KyoAni finished the animation for a beautiful looking movie in 3 months or so.

>>148708455

No. Hibike never gimped out on the animation. And in fact their subtle character acting just became much better.

>>148713782

>LN which has a set ending releasing this December

I'm up for stories with a conclusion rather than fucking long ass piece of shit that lose their value through time.

>>148723101
> he didn't imply that
But that's exactly what the Naruto games are.
Nobody fucking wants 60FPS anime. ArcSys are the only studio who actually made CG that feels and looks like anime and not just cel shaded CG, and there are many details that play into it.

If everything went back to looking like Zeta up through Victory did I would not be fucking mad at all.

>>148709481
Nigger you know Twintails was subject to deadline hell.

>>148724138
Hibike's character animation isn't as lively as K-ON's.

File: 53821f5c.jpg (73KB, 555x490px) Image search: [Google]

73KB, 555x490px

>>148708040
"Anime designs are too detailed and it causes problems for animators"

Im suprised David Production was able to adapt Jojo given the detailed & buff bodies style from the 80s. You can tell they couldnt animate them too well from all the still shots in part 1 & 2.

People will just complain when they see the overly detailed figures/illustration and wonder why that wasn't in the anime.

>>148708966
Xam'd > Hyouka.

>>148708040
The new art designs often favour lots of light lines to convey a feeling of softness and lightness to the show.

In some case it is definitely lazy design which hurts the animation of a show.

In many older show they used less lines with harder definitions to try and convey the same images, emotions ETC.

Because of the lack of computer technologies in the past this was necessary for any animation at all to be done. Nowadays characters are over designed in some cases which in some shows has gotten to the point where the animation has begun to suffer.