Is the "two base forms" theory for Dragon Ball Super

Does this show get any better after the movie arcs?

>>144533569
Universe 6 was okay-ish

>>144533569
much better imo

What?

They explained this in the Freiza Movie

Base Form Goku and Base Form Vegeta = Same shit from Frieza, they've never improved this.

The form used by Goku against Frieza initially was similar to Gohan's.

He's using God ki without super saiyan.

Its a power up.

>>144537162
Wait, it's confirmed that's how it works? I saw others bring it up on Dragon Ball forums and they get shit on for suggesting it.

>>144537162
Hasn't been confirmed

>>144537201
But then knowing dragon ball, they don't really conform how anything works.

>>144537379
I wouldn't be too sure. One of the guidebooks for GT at least explained how SSj4 was only called that out of convenience and wasn't actually a SSj form. There's a chance it could be explained elsewhere

>>144537201
I'm not sure if that is true, I couldn't see there bases stay at the power they were.

I was under the impression he could acess his God ki and Normal ki separately, which would explain why he is still able to use Saiyan God (super saiyan red), and infuse it with super saiyan (super saiyan blue), or alternatively not tap into any God ki and retain a normal super saiyan form, which is how I would imagine he doesn't one shot every villian after the Revival of F arc.

>>144537162
Episode?
Because it's bullshit and it does not make any sense, even for a retard like Toriyama

All of you are fucking retards
Causal Beerus>>>>Majin Buu
Base Goku was fighting on par with a somewhat serious Beerus (because of the boost from SSG)
There is no "two base forms"

>>144538044
Why can he use regular SSj forms then when Blue is supposed to be SSj1? How the hell did Piccolo not just get one shotted by Frost when he's nowhere near the level of destroying the universe with his punching? How the hell did Future Trunks get so strong so fast?

>>144537162
none of that makes any sense

>>144538199
>Why can he use regular SSj forms then when Blue is supposed to be SSj1?
SSJ = Normal Ki
SSJB = God Ki

Pay attention dumbass.

>How the hell did Piccolo not just get one shotted by Frost when he's nowhere near the level of destroying the universe with his punching?
Are you stupid? Did you not see Goku beat the living shit out of Frost before hand?

>How the hell did Future Trunks get so strong so fast?
What the hell are you talking about?

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>>144533569
U6 was okay. The Future arc is much better

>>144537592
>doesn't make any sense

Goku's base never got stronger than Frieza era because he has Super Saiyan.

Goku's base form all through Buu was still the same strength

Super Saiyan got stronger until he could do the full power Super Saiyan

SSJ2 gets stronger

SSJ3 gets stronger

But his base never moves

Him using GOD KI is no different than transforming into Super Saiyan.

SSGSS is Super Saiyan regular ki + god ki

The form he used to fight frieza prior to that is Regular Ki + god ki.

But his standard normal base for is just ki.

Goku isn't a god unless his hair is red.

>>144538199
Blue is Super Saiyan + god ki

>how the hell did Future Trunks

Future Trunks was the next closest to SSJ2 behind Gohan.

Its assumed he's SSJ2 when he fights the androids given that his hair is different despite it being short again.

Plus, its been like 18 years since cell. Trunks would have gotten stronger.

>>144538614
Oh I know, I can get behind Trunks being strong enough to compare to Buu saga characters or so, I just wouldn't understand how he can get all the way to not die against opponents "Godku" needs to use his SSj forms for if he's as strong as SSjG all the time in base now.

>>144538715
>he can get all the way to not die against opponents

Because nobody besides buu was stronger than an SSJ2.

Gohan is shit and doesn't train.

>>144538715
>how he can get all the way to not die against opponents "Godku" needs to use his SSj forms for if he's as strong as SSjG all the time in base now.
Did you even watch the episode? He got stronger as he was fighting Goku besides they were both sizing each other up.

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>>144532584
From Toriyama himself:

> Will Goku be able to transform into [Super Saiyan] God in the future?

I think you’ll understand if you watch [the movie], but Goku has already absorbed [Super Saiyan] God’s power and made it his own, so there is no need for him to transform into [Super Saiyan] God.

So yes, SSG is Goku's new base. Or at least when he uses god ki.

That's why the manga version of Goku vs Hit made no sense. Goku shouldn't be able to transform into SSG at will.

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>>144538830
>Goku shouldn't be able to transform into SSG at will.
What are you on about? He did so when Beerus was about the destroy Earth.

>>144539019
After the movie.

>>144539073
>After the movie.
Why would that change suddenly after the movie?

Is this the general DBS/DBZ thread? If so I have a question.

What are Vegeta's and Gohan's opinions of each other? It's obvious Vegeta cares about Goku, Trunks, and Bulma in some way or another, while pretty much everybody else is irrelevant to him, but how he feels about Gohan is a huge question mark it seems.

Vegeta and Gohan have interacted with each other an inordinate amount throughout the entire series, so I'm curious whether they could actually be completely ambivalent considering how often the two have fought with and against one another.

Would either one care if the other died?

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>>144539073
Well I mean Akria Toriyama didn't pull any plugs on the manga fight with Hit, so I assume he just doesn't care and whatever looks cool.

>>144539148
super changes things that happened in the bog movie and the rof movie

manga is also different during the u6 tournament.
manga: goku can turn into super saiyan god (red) at will and uses it to fight hit
anime: goku combines super saiyan blue with kaioken to fight hit

because suddenly ssj blue takes a ton of stamina to maintain

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>>144539157
i think vegeta just finds it a shame that gohan neglected his training and wasted the power he had.

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>>144539157
Gohan and Vegeta had a mutual respect for one another as warriors, but now Vegeta just views him as a disappointment like the rest /a/. Even though he achieved all of his dreams and is now a family man.

>>144539148
How I always understood that, Red God was just a temporary form caused by the ritual giving Goku access to the God Ki, I was also sure it was stronger than later Cyan God, which resulted from Goku tapping into the remains of god ki and combining it with SSJ for a more stable, god ki infused form. Vegeta unlocks his god ki thanks to taking part in the ritual and training with Whis in realm full of god ki.

So Red God - requires ritual
Cyan God - something Goku/Vegeta invented when they got an access to god ki

>>144539237
>because suddenly ssj blue takes a ton of stamina to maintain
He could combine it with Kaioken only because it doesn't use that much stamina compared to SSJ.

It's all still a big mess.

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>>144539237
>while pretty much everybody else is irrelevant to him,
Anyone know why Vegeta wanted to help Tien here?

>>144539305
>just views him as a disappointment like the rest /a/.
Speak for yourself.

>>144533569
The only okaish episode is Hit vs Goku, the first episode for Trunks' arc is decent, but the rest is meh.

>>144539439
The general consensus on here is that Gohan had no reason to stop training

>>144539157
Just based on the content, it seems Vegeta simply sees Gohan as somebody who is wasting his potential, while Gohan sees Vegeta as just another acquaintance.

I don't think the two are close friends or anything like that.

>>144539157
Canonically, I think their views towards each other are more shallow than they should be since they've fought so many battles together, but Toriyama is a pisspoor writer when it comes to character relations.

Just based on the story writing, it seems Vegeta simply sees Gohan as a softy who is wasting his potential, while Gohan sees Vegeta as just another acquaintance.

Admittedly, their relationship appears more shallow than it should be considering how much time they've spend around each other.

>>144539668
Whoops, messed up my copy and paste.

>>144539627
Whatever helps you sleep at night anon.

>>144532584
>>144537162
>>144537587
>>144538614
Unlike others I doubt that Cabba and the others were god level. Goku and Vegeta with god ki in base form are post 4 months training Final Form Frieza, I doubt Buu is as powerful as any of them, because if wew take the stupid jelly Vegeta filler then Gotenks is a fly to them, and Gotenks was stronger than Super Buu.
So Vegeta and Goku can access to their god ki when they want it, but in their casual life they turned it off.

>>144533569
Pretty great outside of the animation, Goku vs Hit is among the best moments in the franchise, lots of world building, cool character moments, the current arc seems interesting.

>>144539792
>So Vegeta and Goku can access to their god ki when they want it, but in their casual life they turned it off.
Nice headcanon

>>144539915
>>144539792
>>144538614
????

>>144539668
I think you're understating Gohan and Vegeta's relationship.

Sure, it's not on the same level that either one has with Goku, but Gohan and Vegeta were directly responsible for quite a bit of character development in each other.

I think a lot of the reason Vegeta softened up as the series progressed was due to exposure to Gohan, and inversely, Gohan toughened up by being around Vegeta.

I'd say they're probably bigger friends than either one is willing to admit.

>>144539157
>>144539283
>>144539305
>>144539408
>>144539439
Vegeta seems to have some respect for Gohan, he unlike Goku thought Gohan should had participated in the tournament, which I find it funny because now Vegeta wants to train FTrunks, unlike Goku who doesn't give a shit about training Goten.

>>144539915
>>144539966
>Nice headcanon
Nice meme. The show has given proofs of this, unlike your retard fanfiction that you love so much,

>>144540217
Goku stopped trying to train Gohan because Piccolo made him realize during the cell saga that Gohan doesn't love to fight.

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>>144539761
Don't be a dick. Gohan should be able to train, maintain a job, and be a parent.

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>>144540217
>Goku who doesn't give a shit about training Goten.
Why is /a/ so obsessed with every character becoming a martial artist? What if they don't want to and have other motivations? Then they turn around bitch about how Goku and Vegeta are obsessed fighting.

Gohanfags thread
>>144538245

What is the best dub of Dragon Ball Z and why is it TeamFourStar's version?

>>144540374
>Goku stopped trying to train Gohan
Goku stayed in the otherworld to see Gohan's training, Goku wanted to see him fight. So your excuse isn't valid. Also Goten in the other hand has too much fun fighting, but Goku has became so selfish that no one but him matter.

>>144540498
Sure but the anime sucks, the manga is the only DB worth seeing

>>144540217
The last time Goku had expectatives for Gohan, everyone call Goku an asshole and he died. Goku learned his lesson, never expect anything from his son

>>144539157
Gohan cared enough about Vegeta to jump in front of a cell blast which paralyzed one of his arms, and then Vegeta apologized to Gohan for fucking up.

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SOON
gohan old and busted
the new saiyan trio hotness in

>>144540374
>Gohan should be able to spend time with family, work as a Scholar and somehow keep with both Goku and Vegeta.
Don't be stupid.

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>>144540673
Meant to >>144540427

>>144540374
pic related

>>144539019
Right after the movie.

Not minutes after the initial SSG ritual.

That scene implied that Goku lost his god ki, but then in a time of desparation, he scrapped whatever lingering god ki he had left from the ritual.

>>144540462
>Why is /a/ so obsessed with every character becoming a martial artist?
In my case because it's canon they are going to become martial artist (Goten and Trunks) in DBO. Second we are in a fighting series. Third Goten and Trunks were showed to enjoy fighting for him but unlike Goku and Vegeta they can behave in society, that would given them some deep and development they really need.
>>144540559
>The last time Goku had expectatives for Gohan
Can't you stop memeing? Goku in the Buu saga when they were in the Kaioshin planet was hyped for Gohan. Just accept Goku was became too selfish in Super, he doesn't for anyone except him. Even Vegeta has been more heroic than him with his butthurt because a non nigger Goku killed FBulma.

>>144540498
Because the cast clearly cares for the source and that's why they have no problem making up good jokes for it.

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>>144540643
>>144540732
We finally reached the point where the shitposter genuinely believe their memes.

>>144540673
During the cell saga, Trunks and Vegeta (Both already stronger than Gohan at this point) spend a year in hyperbolic time chamber, then Gohan and Goku went in for a year, came out, and while they went fishing, Trunks and Vegeta spent an additional year in the chamber.

And despite all this, Gohan completely outclassed EVERYONE.

He doesn't even need to train half as hard to keep up with everyone.

>>144540828
Vegeta is boss that speech he gave to Future Trunks is sweet "Don't give up we will find a way"

>>144540828
>DBO
Isn't canon .

>Second we are in a fighting series.
So? Dragon Ball as well other battle shouens have characters who don't fight, hell Bulma is a major character in this series.

>Third Goten and Trunks were showed to enjoy fighting for him but unlike Goku and Vegeta they can behave in society, that would given them some deep and development they really need.
Ok now you're just being stupid.

>>144541042
Vegeta sure has come a long way from that genocidal asshole he was at the beginning

>>144541073
Is DBO's future non-canon? I don't remember any statement saying it's not anymore.

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>It's a gohanfag delusion episode

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>>144540982
yo gohanfag where is my dick sucking at?

>>144541025
>During the cell saga, Trunks and Vegeta (Both already stronger than Gohan at this point) spend a year in hyperbolic time chamber, then Gohan and Goku went in for a year, came out, and while they went fishing, Trunks and Vegeta spent an additional year in the chamber.
Because Goku is a martial arts master, Gohan is not.

>And despite all this, Gohan completely outclassed EVERYONE.
You mean after Goku fought Cell first, letting Gohan see how he fights. Hell Gohan was still getting rekted until Cell made him mad.


>He doesn't even need to train half as hard to keep up with everyone.
Nice meme, hence why Gohan's training in the Majin arc before the tournament was so fruitful right?

>>144541073
>Isn't canon
More canon than anything else. Also Toriyama has been stealing ideas from DBO, the Z gang fought Frieza's army in DBO, just like in Super. Satan said he wanted Pan to be his heir, just becomes true in DBO. PTrunks seems to like swords, just like in DBO where he has a sword school.
>Dragon Ball as well other battle shouens have characters who don't fight, hell Bulma is a major character in this series.
And what do happen to the characters that don't fight nor are genius like Bulma? I think Goten, the long forgotten character has the answer. And why waste their potential when Toriyama bothered to show how much they like to spar in the manga/Z? That's just lazy writing.
>Ok now you're just being stupid
Pic related.

>>144541411
Getting rekt by cell is still better than anything Vegeta or Trunks could have done. They were amazed by his power even before Gohan got mad.

>>144541490
>More canon than anything else.
Until he adds that DBO shit to DBS it's not canon,

>And what do happen to the characters that don't fight nor are genius like Bulma?.

>What if they don't want to and have other motivations?

>Pic related.
...

>>144541377
Funny enough, shitposter I was with the people that said Toei was going to use a cheap excuse to get rip of Gohan for Trunks' arc. And shut up, a fucking shitposter is in debt with me, Gohan didn't die in U6 arc.

>>144541556
Really? Because Final Flash did more damage than pre SSJ2 Gohan.

Again Gohan was only strong because of Goku hand holding him.

>>144540828
When F Trunks told Goku about the androids killing everyone, Goku regretted he died before fighting the androids because they seemed to be really strong so it's not THAT out-of-character. I agree that Goku has been flanderized but that's ineludible with long franchises with different interpretations

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>>144541632
> Until he adds that DBO shit it isn't canon

- The Yo Son Goku Returns OVA is canon
- Android 16 = Gero's son is canon
- 17 and 18 = Lapis and Lazuli is canon
- Trunks x Mai in BoG is canon
- The Jaco Manga
- DBO timeline is canon

Whatever Toriyama himself said or wrote is canon. Just because it's not in DBS or in your head-canon, doesn't mean it isn't so.

>>144541806
A fully charged Final Flash.

I actually miss that move.

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>>144540828
>Just accept Goku was became too selfish in Super, he doesn't for anyone except him.
Stop being stupid.

>>144541865
>The Yo Son Goku Returns OVA is canon
>Android 16 = Gero's son is canon
>17 and 18 = Lapis and Lazuli is canon
>Trunks x Mai in BoG is canon
>The Jaco Manga
These are true because they have been referenced in official canon media.

DBO has not YET

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>>144541898
That one scene in Super, which is basically common sense to say, doesn't automatically mean Goku's a great person

>>144542012
How big of a reference needs to happen in order for that to work out? Would it count if the Supreme Kai of Time shows up or we actually see future Trunks join the Time Patrol?

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>>144542012
The DBO game isn't which Toriyama himself wrote the story for, is less canon than an interview?

They're both equally as canon. Quit being delusional

>>144542050
Retard pls if he wasn't was a good person why would he say it? Quit grasping at straws


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ZmN79SDUlc
4:20

>>144542184
>Would it count if the Supreme Kai of Time shows up
>we actually see future Trunks join the Time Patrol?
Yes because in DBS right now time travel is outlawed which goes against the Time Patrol.

>>144541816
I am not saying Goku isn't selfish in Z, my point was in comparasion in Super he is too selfish, he only thinks in himself now.

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>>144542230
Retard pls if he wasn't was a good person why would he give Cell a senzu bean to fight his own son?

Leave his pregnant wife and son behind?

Risk Majin Buu killing more innocents and destroy the universe, because he wanted kids to save the world this time?

Quit grasping at straws

He's so dumb, he's almost border-line accidentally evil

>>144541898
You really think Goku was worried about Trunks' well being when Goku said that because he knew Trunks wasn't able to fight if he was too tired.

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>>144539157
>>144539305
>>144539668
>>144540090

Vegeta was pretty upset at Gohan being killed by Buu. And lets Goten call him uncle.

>>144541806
Gohan is one of the few characters who's power actually made sense in the cell saga given his get mad potential has been constantly hyped since he was first introduced.

After the Namek saga, power comparisons went completely off the rails. It's a farce than Tien, Krillin, and Yamcha appeared almost as strong as Trunks and Vegeta when fighting the mini cells, and stronger than a tired Goku. Piccolo also should have been irrelevant by the time perfect cell showed up. It also made no sense why Goku was apparently the 2nd strongest fighter by the end despite training less than Trunks and Vegeta.

As much as a meme as power levels are, they kept DBZ grounded through Raditz-Freiza. Character strength went completely bonkers after Scouters stop being a thing.

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>>144540217
>>144539157
>>144542554

Vegeta wanted Gohan to keep up his training

>>144532584
>headcannon
the use of god ki is just supa cyan everything else is bullshit fanfiction

>>144542230
Stop trying, even the shitty author said Goku is selfish, only cares for fighting and just think of his family as pals.

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>>144542475
>Retard pls if he wasn't was a good person why would he give Cell a senzu bean to fight his own son?
Because he knew Gohan would win retard pay attention. Why else did he sacrifice himself when Cell wanted to nuked the Earth?

>Leave his pregnant wife and son behind?
See above retard

>because he wanted kids to save the world this time?
Because he wanted to the new generation to be able to defend themselves since he would not able to anymore.

Read the manga, retard you clearly haven't.

>>144542475
Not to mention Goku giving in to Majin Vegeta's request, allowing Buu to be resurrected in the first place

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>>144542685
Have some of this too

>>144541632
>What if they don't want to and have other motivations?
Haven't you watch Super? Trunks and Goten have spend the series asking everyone to let them fight. This is what bothers me in Super, they waste the time showing how much Trunks and Goten want to fight just to erase them from the plot. At least in GT Goten was all over his girlfriend and showed no interest in fighting, Trunks in the other hand was having his own crisis because he hated his job but wasn't able to ditch it.
And I can´t upload the pic for some reason. But it's from the episode where Vegeta and the rest went to the nameless planet. There Goten and Trunks asked them to let them fight.

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>>144542531
>What are senzu beans?
Retards pls

>>144542617
>only cares for fighting and just think of his family as pals.

>>144542725
Not the same anon but can you please try to use manga pages only? Even Toei made him more heroic in the anime. Not quite to the levels of early dub where he was a Superman clone though.

>>144542685
>>144542725
>Why else did he sacrifice himself when Cell wanted to nuked the Earth?
Because Piccolo made him realize he fucked everything by not telling Gohan about his plans. And for the rest cry a river, faggot, Toriyama already answered your delusional, Goku is a shit because he is retard.

>>144542725
Filename made me laugh

>>144542840

Kai is nothing like the original Japanese anime.

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>>144542685
>>144542685
> Why else did he sacrifice himself when Cell wanted to nuked the Earth?
Well guess fucking what? He probably wouldn't have to sacrifice himself if Goku never gave Cell a senzu bean. And a father should never put his son in harms way because he wants to see a "fair fight"

> Because he wanted to the new generation to be able to defend themselves since he would not able to anymore
Then train them. Don't put the universe at risk when you didn't have to.

> Read the manga, retard you clearly haven't.
I did faggot. Goku was selfish there as well

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>>144542840
>>144542875
>>144542904

>>144542863
>Because Piccolo made him realize he fucked everything by not telling Gohan about his plans.
Lies

>And for the rest I don't have an argument
I accept your concession.

>>144542904
>Then train them. Don't put the universe at risk when you didn't have to.

He was fucking dead at the time, how could he train them? His time was running out.

>>144542788
>What are senzu beans?
Vegeta's idea.
>Your pic.
Wow, Goku likes a trait of Chi Chi's personality, that must mean he is madly in love with her.
Please, retard, you know no one believes your shit, not even Toriyama.

Toriyama is better at writing romance than story ever since the middle of DBZ.

Literally the only things interesting about the series post-Namek are Gohan/Videl and Trunks/Mai's romance.

>>144542972
Gohan then. Vegeta. ANYONE.

Earth blew up because Goku was selfish.

>>144542929
>Goku leaving the Earth to some kids under the age of ten.

>>144543042
Well more retarded in this instance than selfish

>>144543040
And Goku/Vegeta

>>144543040
That's ironic since he used to talk about how that's one thing he was never good at.

>>144542941
>Lies
Discuss that with Goku's shock face.
>I accept your concession.
I accept you are such a Gokufag that thinks he is some hero worried about muh universe. It didn't help you compared him with Superman and Batman in past threads. So kill yourself.

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Goku is pretty selfish. Denying Goten some pussy

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SS Goku (Funi's hero): I am the light, hope in the universe, etc

SS Goku (Toriyama's selfish guy): I am Son Goku! A Super Saiyan!

I think you guys have a different view of Goku because of the original dub.

Toriyama himself called Goku selfish. Why are you guys fighting this?

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>>144543304

I think Vegito would be a better dad desu. Gogeta too.

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>>144542904
>He probably wouldn't have to sacrifice himself if Goku never gave Cell a senzu bean
Actually Cell probably would have nuked the Earth sooner because he lost at a disadvantage.


>Then train them
He did retard who do you think taught them the fusion dance and train with Gohan(Z sword) so much for
>I did faggot.

You clearly haven't.

>>144543000
>Vegeta's idea.
My point retard is that Trunks had a Senzu bean so he wasn't tired so Goku didn't say this >>144541898 because of this retarded reason >>144542531

>Wow, Goku likes a trait of Chi Chi's personality, that must mean he is madly in love with her.
Quit grasping at straws retard.
>just think of his family as pals.
>posts a pic of Goku saying he loves Chi Chi
>massive butthurt

>>144543740
> just think of his family as pals.

Toriyama stated this as well.

Why should I take a random faggot's words over Toriyama's?

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>>144543304
No one is saying Goku is Super man but saying Goku is a selfish asshole who only cares about himself is just plain wrong.

>>144538614
>Goku's base form all through Buu was still the same strength
What about his fight with Uub?

>>144538614
I asked episode not headcanon.
It is impossible they never got stronger in their base form.
Do I have to assume he never got stronger sonce he was a kid?

So Black is future Zamasu who encountered Goku in the past?

>>144543740
>My point retard is that Trunks had a Senzu bean so he wasn't tired
The senzu bean healed his wounds, but he still was tired for some shitty reason.
>posts a pic of Goku saying he loves Chi Chi
Goku said he liked something about Chi Chi's personality, Goku doesn't know what love is.
Also liking some side of a person=/= being in love with said person.
Anon if a friend tells you he likes something about you you are going to think your friend is gay for you with that logic.

>>144543938
>saying Goku is a selfish asshole who only cares about himself is just plain wrong.
Toriyama intended for Goku to be a selfish and self-centered man who really only cared about fighting. Goku does not primarily fight for others, he fights mostly for his own enjoyment. The reason he does so many questionable things throughout the series and endangers the lives of his friends and family is because he puts himself before them.

He is, but he doesn't do it with bad intentions because he is a retard.

>>144544374

>>144544917

He's a Saiyan, it's what he does. I thought people understood this by now. He's an alien, he's not human.

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>>144544917
>Toriyama intended for Goku to be a selfish and self-centered man
It doesn't matter what he intended, the manga says other wise.

The only retards here are people like you who keep ignoring the evidence of said manga.

>>144545273
Said that to the Gokufag that thinks he is great hero.

>>144544860
>but he still was tired for some shitty reason.
No he wasn't you're retarded.

>>144545375
>The only retards here are people like you who keep interpreting the evidence of said manga wrong.
Fixed it for you.
Goku is a selfish retard, he has the same maturity of a child.

>>144545263
> Only retards dislike Gohan
Be ready to face superfags.

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>>144545464
>he wasn't
>Goku: you need to rest.
Kill yourself.

>>144545464
Can the senzu beans even heal stress and PTSD?

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>>144545468
>who keep interpreting the evidence of said manga wrong.
Big of you to admit your mistake anon good job.

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>>144545263
Because Superfags are manchildren that likes to shit on Z and praise DB b-because it was too edgy, but deep down they like fanfiction elements like an evil Goku. It doesn't help Black is like this dA recolor. Hell, almost everything in Super is just a shitty recolor. And Super went to shit the moment it ridiculized Great Saiyaman.

>>144545632
>heal stress and PTSD?
So you admit Goku was worried about his well being?

>>144545646
Is there a link to the whole manga in color if it exists? I would reread DB for that

>>144545780
I'm not that anon, I'm just wondering.

>>144545632
>>144545817
Probably not

>>144545814

Dragon Ball Full Color - Saiyan Arc (Akira Toriyama)
https://www.nyaa.eu/?page=download&tid=643757

>>144545772
A skinny bitch as a villain and people are praising this shit.

>>144545902
Just the Saiyan saga was done? Not the whole thing from Pilaf to Buu?

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>>144545646
>You are still trying.
Anon, how does it feel everyone even the author is against you?

>>144545263
Beerus was the first mistake. Vegeta kneeling before a fucking cat. Super killed Vegeta before Gohan.

>>144546116
I thought Battle of the Gods, the movie, was fine. The problems started with Revival of F and Super

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>>144545973
>Just the Saiyan saga was done?
Yep

>>144545999
>even the author is against you?
Really? I mean he wrote the manga pages I'm posting to refute you so he's probably not.

>le smug anime girls reaction as argument
Welp, I accept your concession.

>>144546400
>Really? I mean he wrote the manga pages I'm posting to refute you so he's probably not
He interpreted them in a really different way than you. And posting them page where Goku got to living la vida loca.

All this God is shit, ssj means nothing now, we have Gohan ssj and we have goku ssj, no way they are equal, so whats the point? Thet should stay with more ssj#

>>144547114
Super Saiyan forms were never equal as they were multipliers but I get what you mean. I would have an easier time buying Super if "Saiyan Beyond God" is a canon thing

Somebody has that funny image of Goten eating while Goku looks from afar?

>>144547255
I srarted watching super yesterday, and i feel like i was trolled by /a/, everyone is ttalking how animations are shit but they are nowhere as bad as audio part, music is shit but the worst is voice acting, its like im watching cheap dub, and there are no more these nice screams like in Z, listening to king kai is suffering wtf is wrong with this nigga, are they recording this in a toilet or something?

>>144547579
Didnt mean to quote

>>144545384
He's not a great hero, but he has a kind heart.

This is canon BTW so suck my dick if you think otherwise

>>144547909
And when did I say Goku didn't have a pure heart?
Goku is pure person because he doesn't do anything out of malice, he does it because he is too native to realize his errors.

>>144547579
The only good thing in Super are the flashbacks.

>>144548085
and the slice of life scenes

>>144548011
He's also been show caring about people and being willing to sacrifice for them when it really matters. Yes, he's irresponsible, he's an adrenaline junkie, but he's also an altruist.
No, not just "pure because he doesn't understand" I mean actually altruist. He's been shown to do that multiple times.
He's also irresponsible at times, and that's something that makes him a more interesting character

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>>144546116
>>144546313
>>144547114
>>144547255
Super is the worst enemy Z Warriors have ever faced.

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So according to this power level chart, Vegeta during the Saiyan Saga would have been capable of taking out Captain Ginyu if he transformed into a great ape?

http://dragonball.wikia.com/wiki/List_of_power_levels

>>144548280
I remember the first time I saw adult Gohan transformation. He was badass. Now he became a skinny fag who doesn't even care about his friends.

>>144545916
He's charismatic as fuck.

>>144546116
By your logic, Broly 1 killed Vegeta before Super did

>>144548469
>who doesn't even care about his friends
God DBS threads are filled with retards

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>>144545772
> Because Superfags are manchildren that likes to shit on Z

Actually it's GTfags and Brolyfags that like to shit on Super.

From what I've seen, Superfriends and Zfags get along pretty well (for the most part)

>>144548634

Not him but why not ask fucking Future Trunks why he's visiting. There's no reason not to ask him or notice his ragged clothing.

>>144547579
>listening to king kai is suffering
His voice actor was very sick and old. But he sounds better in the latest episodes.

>>144548591
He wasn't begging for his life.

>>144548763
Except when it comes to Gohan...but Zfags seem to be happy with him achieving his dream. While GTfags are mad he's not swol anymore

>>144548634
He doesn't give a shit about F Trunks and people keep posting Goku is a retard.

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>>144548591
No he was worse with Broly. Whining and giving up before anything.

With Beerus, he fought him as soon as he got angry. Then became badass for. Bit after bulma got hit.

Pic semi-related

>>144548763
When you say Zfags, are you talking about the anime fanbase? The manga fans seem to either tolerate Super or hate the direction of it and blame Toei for making it even more nonsensical

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>>144548469
You're welcome.

>>144548768
Oh I don't know maybe he was overjoyed to see an old friend again and got lost in the moment you autistic fuck. Besides Trunks didn't have a sense of urgency about him when he went to see Gohan.

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>>144548970

7 years of no training, with a body like this. Nice.

>>144548383
I can see that. But remember that Ginyu could easily blow up the moon, and creating a powerball took a lot of Vegeta's power.
I also doubt Ginyu would be alone, even guldo could be help enough to turn the tide of battle.

>>144548892
Nice grammar retard

>>144549031
Fuck you weakling shit who discovered DB last year.

>>144549052
He trained casually.

Gohan had much less responsibilities as a home-schooled high school student, than a married father/scholar, while supporting his wife/daughter

>>144549031
>Old friend

Those two barely interacted, dumbass. Other than discovering Cell's cocoon they never hung out. Quit making excuses, he didn't give a shit.

>>144549082
Thank (you) faggot. At least I can read/write four languages americanfag.

>>144549186
They're rich already. What support do they need? If he's gonna regret not training when shit hits the fan, then he can make time to casually train again and balance his scholar work.

>>144549276
> when shit hits the fan

Call daddy or his similarly autistic buddy, if a threat around SS2-tier comes along.

If someone like Abo/Cado invaded Earth (Namek Freeza level), Gohan would be fine. Someone around Cell's level...what are the chances of that?

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>>144549126
Same to you retard

>Those two barely interacted, dumbass
Read the manga you fool, also are you saying they are not friends? If so that goes against your point about Gohan not caring about his friends.

>>144549468
Quite a bit higher then one would think considering people who can punch the universe into nothing are running around in Super

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How strong is Gotenks compared to Gohan?

Let's not use the Super Human Water mini filler arc.

Mystic (weaker) Gohan got kicked by Beerus in the stomach and lost. SS Gotenks got spanked and lost as well.

>>144549515
Meant to reply to >>144549189 as well

>>144549524
In the god realm maybe. It's not that common at all.

kaioken was the best powerup

>>144538614
This is fucking wrong. Do you seriously think his base form hasn't changed since Frieza? SSJ is just a multiplier, the base form has to get higher for the user to actually keep getting stronger. What do you think training for 7 years with 40 ton weights on each limb was for?

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>>144549589
Goten and Trunks don't train, anon. They just fuse then job.

>>144549515
I'm not the same anon but it seems like you know everything americanfag. I'm not as retarded as (you) to wrote he doesn't give a shit about his friends and then that "those two barely interacted". We aren't two here you fag.

>>144549630
Normal joes can do it if you consider how most of the people in the Universe 6 arc have that strength and aren't gods at all and if you don't buy into the "two bases" theory. The point is more that they could very well be out there at any given point in time.

>>144549189
I started DBZ (toonami) as a kid beggining with the Namek Saga.

Weirdly enough, I thought Gohan and Krillin were best friends. Not Goku and Krillin. Mainly because Gohan/Krillin were always together in Namek. Then Gohan getting angry at Freeza for impaling Krillin helped reinforce that idea.

This made the reason why Goku turned SS1 for me pretty odd.

>>144543938
That is an entirely different Goku altogether

>>144549708
>americanfag
Are you that crappy grammerfag? That explains why you're so retarded.

>>144549950
Don't be stupid.

>>144550079
I don't mean different universe or whatever it's not that fucking dumb, I meant as in young/kid Goku and adult Goku feel like two entirely different characters

>>144550167
>I meant as in young/kid Goku and adult Goku feel like two entirely different characters
No they're not.

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>>144549759
>I started DBZ (toonami) as a kid beggining with the Namek Saga.

>he didn't start with the Pilaf Saga

>>144550277
im not >>144550167 but he's right. DB goku is WAY different in comparison to his battle centric self in DBZ. atleast in DB because it was martial arts yeah goku liked fighting but he also had a better grasp of the concept of caring about others even if he was mostly just immature. in DBZ im not denying goku isnt a hero and does the right thing. he just goes about it in the stupidest ways possible. letting vegita live? absolute gamble. letting frieza live EVEN BIIGGER GAMBLE, letting gohan WITHOUT ANY KNOWLEDGE fight cell for his own agenda BIGGEST GAMBLE YET and saying that he fixed it by killing himself only shows that he went full damage control after piccolo smacked his shit into decent order. buu saga? i dont even need to speak on it for the amount of shit this guy did.

>>144550293

Leave him alone, Mai!

>>144550293
I did watched a bit of Pilaf in spanish. But they only had it in the mornings.

Then Toonami made it easier to watch.

Telemundo had DB before Cartoon Network did. At least in Florida.

>>144550025
Show me my mistakes.

>>144549193
This is why I don't make fun of other people's grammar.

At least until I learn another language or two.

>>144548763
you must be retarded, super is nowhere near Z level quality, not a single aspect of it is better, only newfags who watched kai praise it

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Does anyone else hate how they turned Bardock into the Jor-el of Vegeta? Sayains are supposed to be assholes, Goku was different because he was raised different, and Vegeta because he had to be a main character. Every other sayain is a piece of shit, Goku's parents should have been no exception. Maybe we would have been fine without even seeing his real parents, or Bardock could have tried to stop Frieza for personal gain, anything to make him more of a dick. It'd make more sense for Raditz to be his son as well, not just "oh he's hanging out with that vegeta again, I hope those boys don't get into too much trouble"

>>144539627
Yeah he did.

He.

doesn't.

like.

fighting.

He was forced to pick it up by piccolo because Vegeta and Nappi

>>144551181
Why does this have to be what's better? I never said that.

It's about what's enjoyable.

I personally enjoyed DBZ and enjoying Super. Didn't as much for GT. But if you do, all the more power to you...

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>>144549589
>>144549665
Mystic Gohan spanked Super Buu and Gotenks struggled with him even as ss3.

>>144544486

>It is impossible they never got stronger in their base form.

If you train as a Super Saiyan, you get stronger WHILE A SUPER SAIYAN.

It doesn't effect your base form. Its like saying base form Trunks is stronger because he has muscle mode.

>Do I have to assume he never got stronger sonce he was a kid?

No,

Kid Goku Episode 1 improved and kept getting stronger right until he got out of the healing chamber to fight frieza.;

Training and Zenkai while normal.

He since then stopped training as normal.

>>144551346
but super is not enjoyable for a Z fan, only good parts are fillers, fights are shit, and thats what Z was about

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>>144550532
>letting vegita live? absolute gamble. letting frieza live EVEN BIIGGER GAMBLE, letting gohan WITHOUT ANY KNOWLEDGE fight cell for his own agenda BIGGEST GAMBLE YET
Stop typing like that.

You mean like pic related? Read the manga faggot.
Besides, with Freeza they were multiple factors like the planet being moments away from blowing up. Also when Freeza didn't take Goku's advice he did attack to kill in the end.

Why are theses threads filled with people who don't remember shit about the series? Goku trained Gohan for his fight with Cell, he even went first to fight so that Gohan could see how Cell fights and for him to see for himself that he is stronger than his dad.

>full damage control after piccolo smacked his shit
Stop spamming this meme Goku didn't sacrifice himself because of what Piccolo said. Quit grasping at straws.
Besides Goku knew Gohan want to be scholar.

>>144551444
If you train while on Super Steroids, you get stronger WHILE ROIDED.

It doesn't affect you after you quit using. Its like saying clean Armstrong is faster because he has doping mode.

>>144551555
> delusional gokufag

Is this faggot serious

So is GT all but officially retconned?

I mean, if Goku could achieve SSB in Super than what reason does he have to not always go SSB in GT?

>>144552190
GT isn't canon and Toriyama was barely involved in it's story

>>144552190
GT was never canon

>>144551444
This is literally your headcanon since you never gave any proof other than what you think.
It's also fucking retarded.

>>144552110
Nice argument retard

>>144552312
Toriyama seems barely involved in super too, just slightly more than he was involved with GT.

>>144552839
I only consider his manuscript for Super canon and since we don't have that....

>>144552312
>>144552839

He was only involved with GT's character design. He even considered GT a side story.

http://www.kanzenshuu.com/translations/dragon-book-gt-toriyama-intro/

He is WAY more involved with Super.

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>>144550025
Americanfag is angry.

>>144548279
Fag, why can't you understand? After the timeskip between the first part and the second part, there were only two times Goku fought 100% for others, those were against Raditz and to some degree against Vegeta and Nappa.
After that he fought having in mind his live for fighting, he got angry because villains were harming his friends because Goku cares for his pals, but he can't realize they got harmed in the first place because he was too focused in his retard fun. That's fucking Goku's character.
He chose to stay in the otherworld because he wanted to retire, same with Buu, he just wanted to stay in the otherworld to have his fun.
Stop with your retard fanficion.

>>144552898
I think there's a script for Revival of F floating around that Toriyama wrote. If Super's outlines are anything like what he did for RoF, then he might be more involved I guess.

>>144538614
>Goku's base never got stronger than Frieza era because he has Super Saiyan.
you're a fucking idiot, even Whis confirm they need to train their base forms up and get back to the basics.

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>>144548763
>Actually it's GTfags and Brolyfags that like to shit on Super
There aren't any GTfags, fag, those who say GT is less of a mess in comparasion with Super, are anons that are very dissapointed in Super.
>Superfriends and Zfags get along pretty well
Them all the past threads were Superfags shitted on Z b-because Super doesn't have shit quality, I swear!! Look at this inbetween!! were only my imagination.
>>144548874
>While GTfags are mad he's not swol anymore
Again, Gohan in GT is a scholar just like in Super, difference is how both Gohans are handle. Super makes empty promises while GT made him train from time to time offscreen, but gave him the normal life he wanted and allowed him to fight (even when he only jobbed).
So no.
>>144548963
>The manga fans seem to either tolerate Super
Mangafags point how different the characters look in Toriyama's promotional material.

>>144553809
Kek, none of those anons were shitting on Z, they were just fucking with you.

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>>144554060
>they were just fucking with you
Good that I didn't participate in those threads that appeared since Super started.

>>144554214
Hold my hand.

>>144553493
I would be a happy man if we ever end up with Toriyama's manuscripts for Super. I don't care how bare bones they are.

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>>144554241

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>>144554433

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>>144554527
Give the link to the stream.

>>144542929
Goku was just spouting that out because he is a retard. He would have ran out of energy before he could do that because it was all borrowed for the tournament. He would have poofed back into the after life if he even tried.

Why does Bardock forget Raditz?

>>144555550
Who?

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>>144555634

>>144549589
Mystic Gohan was stronger than SSJ3 Goku, and SSJ3 Gotenks was weaker than SSJ3 Goku.

>>144552190
GT is basically a different timeline now and forgotten, like most of the movies.

>>144553533
Yep. The multipliers aren't as high as before, but their base forms are so high now they can start to fuck with the fabric of reality.

>>144555758
>GT is basically a different timeline
Wrong

>>144538814
Have you watched the movies?Buu was a small fry against Beerus had to use 70% to fight Godku

>>144539305
>>144539439
>>144539668
>>144540090
>>144542554
>>144542596
People forget that Vegeta and Gohan interacted a lot on Namek, and would've definitely spoken a lot during the years of training periods of androids and in the 7 year downtime before Buu, I mean Vegeta and Gohan knew each other when Gohan was just a toddler and Vegeta was a young adult, they've known each other their entire lives and must have atleast some bond.

>>144553809
Something wrong with Chiaotzu, it looks like the acid kicked in.

>>144557540

Pretty sure they did chill on occasion. But knowing Vegeta, he was probably tsundere towards Gohan, anon.