Be honest, are comic books an effective and worthy way of

Oral Storytelling > Puppetry > Graphical Novel = Novel.

Yes.

paper>pixels

>>143721781
A chick with boobs is more attractive than a wall of text

from a historical standpoint, yes; no other medium has been as effective and had an impact on society as writing has. While we're dominated by visual and oral story-telling today, written form should always be the preferred method.

It's a bit flawed.
There's editors that can change aspects, both good and bad.
There's publishers that might not allow certain material to be shown.
There's schedules that may cause either rushing or forgetfulness.
There's merchandising that might cause the series to go on even longer.

It's dangerous.

>>143721931

>>143721781
What do you think, OP?

>>143721781
Be honest, are just trying to bait for replies?

>>143721866
Novel is the most effective by far kiddo. Oral storytelling is defective from the get go, takes forever to communicate the same amount on information and either changes everytime or relies on the fallible human memory.

>>143723755
A Game of Thrones by George RR Martin ;)

>>143721781
I think it's better than anime.
All conjecture: it's just one person working on the story so they have absolute control of character design and plot. I feel like anime can have too many interests involved where things can get muddied.

I have no idea how the anime/manga business works, though. I've only seen Shirobako.

>>143723755
The bible

>>143723755
Infinite Jest

It works if you know how to use the medium effectively and maintain a good workflow. Most dont.


The most pragmatic way is straight up prose. Its completely unparalelled.

>>143723755
The Blood Memeridian

>>143723755
The Odyssey.

An image is worth a thousand words.

>>143724596
I'd rather read a 300k word novel than get the same story through 300 pictures or 12.5 seconds of video.

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>>143724596
Gib my thousand words

>>143721781
Yes, for fiction and whatnot I prefer this method because it's effective like writing, and fun because it has pictures. However, writing is the most effective method and should always be preferred to convey something historical or serious.

>>143724678
(I am going to pour their tears into my asshole) × 100.

>>143724652
Why

>>143721781
Any creator can choose to tell their story in any format. The medium isn't what matters.

Yeah.

>>143721953
Is that why most people still haven't figured out simple logical shit the Greeks wrote down thousands of years ago, but most of the global population can get by speaking some kind of English because of TV and movies? Because the books are more effective at connecting and communicating with an audience?

Get the fuck out of here with that pseudo-intellectual bullshit. The vast majority of a human's capability to perceive the exterior world is dedicated to the visual medium. The only reason that written works even had an advantage to start with was the roughly 10,000 year head-start they got on the visual mediums you're trying to compare.

>>143723755
War and Peace

>>143724678
I need to call my mommy.

>>143724402
>It works if you know how to use the medium effectively and maintain a good workflow. Most dont.
What an empty statement. The same is true for any medium.

The key differences between prose and most other methods of telling a story are its age, allowing it to accumulate classic works, techniques and cultural prestige, and its low barrier to entry. That is to say, there are so many people flinging shit to the wall that even if the floor is completely covered in shit, there will still be a considerable amount that ended up sticking to the wall.

>>143727393
Its more true for comics since theres two entire skillsets involved, art and the writing itself. And production is hideously slow compared to about everything else.

I gurantee you Berserk would already be finished if it was written in prose

No, they are made in multiple parts to string along idiots for as long as possible, there is no integrity
Anyone interested in stories is into literature

>>143723755
Scary Stories to Tell in the Dark

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>>143730476
forgot pic

>>143723755
The Disaster Artist.

>>143721781
Well I prefer to be able to read someone's mind, better than to see him talk to himself even when he goes to the toilet, like 'Ah yeah I need to pee' aloud and all...

>>143730339
>Anyone interested in stories is into literature
This is kinda true but there are more than enough worthwhile anime/manga out there.

Haibane Renmei is one of them. A real gem.

>>143730644
There is likely a book somewhere that tells the same story only better.

>>143730702
What a useless claim

>>143730718
But true, and OP was talking only about manga.

>>143723755
Atlas Shrugged ;)

>>143723755
Don Quixote

>>143730570
You're talking like internal monologue is impossible in that medium and characters need to awkwardly talk out loud.

>>143730966
Text is very limited in comics as it is thats why there are barely any internal monologues

>>143730966
Comic books let you read a character's mind but I never said they are structuring their thoughts into real sentences. I'm only saying anime adds a lot of text that would only need a brief description in a text, and that it's much more realistic.
Have you seen 'Rewrite'? Like 'I wonder who is at the door', etc? Comic books often avoid to bore readers with extra useless text like that.

>>143730570
There's 0 reason this can't be done in comics, you dunce. Japanese stylistic choices aren't the universal rule.

>>143726449
reading comprehension: the post

How does /a/ feel about Light Novels?

Most of the ones i read are trash af. There are definitely some good ones tho

>>143731506
There is a niche following here
I despise them, they are all shit.

>>143721781
Yes, visual media is always a worthy way of telling a story.

Problem is most producers and authors forget they have to tell a story.

>>143731002
Which is why art compensates for that. And when it's in the hands of a good artist it can be more impressive than prose. Art can definitely count for something.

I dare you to find a scene in any written work that matches the horror and carnage of the eclipse in berserk. Most prose in genre fiction can't exactly match what Miura's art expressed, that I know for sure. Too bad he's gone digital now.

>>143731908
Not really, words are more descriptive than images could ever be, specially when describing how characters feel.
Art does help a lot in filling the background though

>>143731908
And your berserk example only shows that you dont know much about written works really.
Art gives you atmosphere sure but atmosphere is not story which is what OP was talking about

Personally, I think that anything you can read > anything you can watch.

Because movies and anime and whatnot, they control the pace, it gives a little too much. Sometimes I just prefer to read manga over anime adaptation, because in time I'll finish third episode I should be able to finish at least one or two volumes of manga (6-7 chapters each) it's based on. It depends on how fast do I read, but there's nothing I can do about spending whole hour to watch 3 episodes of anime.

>>143731428
This CAN be done, but the problem is if it's OK or not. And it's very often not.

>>143731937
>Dissing on good art
>Implying art can't visually convey emotion or feeling well especially in the hands of a master
>Implying most authors today possess impressive mastery over prose

Cmon anon.

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>>143721781
yes.
a picture is worth a thousand words.
theoretically the more superior mediums have more to offer and more potential
>anime>manga>novels
but the truth is in practice, it's the opposite. the mediums with the most potential can't always reach their full potential.
>novels(not LNs or WNs)>manga>anime

>>143732471
I like art in my paintings, I just dont think its a more effective way of telling a story than text

>>143732491
>a picture is worth a thousand words
Literally not true when it comes to storytelling, Id rather get the exact words of what the characters are feeling than a generic anime face that can only emote in very exaggerated ways

There are probably retards here who really think they are.
I suspect that these people are autistic and have no imagination, thus since they cannot picture scenes from powerful wording, a comic probably is the most effective way for their malformed minds to understand a story.

>>143732602
Is not only imagination, being able to bring text to life in your head and knowing the nuances of synonyms words etc is a skill that most people these days just dont really have because visual mediums made them lazy
I cant really blame them because Im very lazy myself

>>143724596
Only if that image is worthy of a thousand words anon.
Proof: try selling your artwork or post it here.

>>143732539
with this you're deliberately assuming generic or bad artwork.
it's like me saying actual porn videos are better than nasu's description of "sex".

>>143732681
visual language vs written language, that's the only difference really.
sure you have instances where your imagination can provide you with vivid imagery, but the opposite can also happen.
how often have you seen artwork that helped you imagine a concept that you otherwise couldn't see clearly? or music? don't underestimate those.

again, theoretically moving pictures and comics are superior to text. movies contain 3 powerful arts, comics 2 and novels only 1.
if we assume mastery in all arts, then obviously cinema>comics>literature is correct.

but in reality it's different. the more simple the medium, the better its works become. it's just easier to make something good when you only have to master 1 art and you don't have to work in teams.

TLDR more potential != better works

>>143732919
Words have the highest potential, manga and anime have many restrictions that text doesnt have.

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>>143732919
>how often have you seen artwork that helped you imagine a concept that you otherwise couldn't see clearly? or music? don't underestimate those.

TRULY TRANSCENDENT WORDS CANNOT DESCRIBE SUCH SUBTLETIES AND SYMBOLISM.

>>143732938
again, in theory manga and anime contain words in addition to the other arts. that's why in terms of potential i rate them higher.
potential as in "possibilities"

>>143732983
>post crap
careful m8. don't make me come over there and quote shitty WN passages.

maybe it's easier if you think of music. music can give you things text/art can't and vice versa.

>>143733095
>careful m8. don't make me come over there and quote shitty WN passages.
Sure, only this shit is considered 'good' manga.
You're trying to make this words vs images, when the argument is actually novels vs manga.
Sure you could produce 300 pages of stunning artwork that describes the indescribable, but manga doesn't do this, not even close. Manga is fucking trash.

>>143733095
But its not addition, when you fill your page with drawings the text part gets compromised, when you include voice acting and movement the pacing gets taken away from the person watching, its not an addition but a balance, a balance than more often that not is just not worth it, words alone do the work better but you need to put a bit more effort into it, making it less mainstream and less appealing to some people, which is fine, I myself am one of those people after all.

>>143732509
Visual language can tell a good story though. Written works just have natural advantages like being able to convey character perspective and thought a bit easier but that's wasted if your prose is shit and it's not really impressive if average.

>>143733203
>But its not addition, when you fill your page with drawings the text part gets compromised
often it would've been text that was descriptive. again, pictures are worth etc etc.

other than that yeah i agree. like i said, it's only in theory. i'm talking about potential. you can glimpse a part of that potential when you watch really good movies or comics, and see what they can do in shorter timeframes with much more intensity and power.

>>143733198
>Sure, only this shit is considered 'good' manga.
opinion discarded.

>>143733203
Agreed, thats why VNs are the best.
As much text as you want, with gorgeous backgrounds and even voice acting, and you control the pacing too

>>143731966
Your post shows how little you know of visual mediums. Especially if you think art is restricted to backgrounds and atmosphere.

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>>143733478
>VN
that one's also a medium that is woefully short of meeting its potential.
i love VNs though

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>>143721781
Worthiness is subjective, but considering professional artists literally came up with shit like this (and much much worse) after reading The Hobbit it clearly isn't less effective than prose in every way.

>>143733537
It shows how little you know of literature.

>>143733369
>often it would've been text that was descriptive. again, pictures are worth etc etc.

But thats wrong, text is way more than just descriptions or dialogue, a lot is lost in manga form

>>143729235
>Berserk novel
I could dig it.

>>143733772
You're further showing how little you know of art's potential and it's use in visual mediums. You barely substantiate your claims as well.

>>143730476
>>143730509
That gave me nightmares as a kid.

>>143726449
Take your pills anon

>>143733882
Right back at you

>>143733580
Fuck potential at least VNs end.

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>>143733833
i disagree. most forms of writing can be and are included in comics/movies depending on the creator. the only thing that is lost is the volume and the reliance on written text, which is replaced by the other arts.
in that sense i guess a lot is lost in that you don't use as much as you would if it was only text. but it's not like the other arts don't add stuff in return.
pic related can't be accurately described with words

>>143726449
this.
also let's not forget theater. people have always been looking for more ways to express themselves. and especially when it came to stories, they were always seeking the visual.

>>143734001
i'm sure mahoyo will end before nasu dies of old age (it won't)

>>143734272
Ok you are seriously an idiot.

>>143733975
I did talk about arts usage and potential in the medium. You've just been acting like a condescending and pretentious ass without backing up what you say.

>there are people that can't get boners from words
Sad

>>143734313
i just know more about this than you do. it's ok.
that image was more of a joke though anon, calm down.

>>143734379
>/a/ - unfounded elitism

Pottery

>>143734491
the irony.
then don't reply if you don't have anything to say

>>143734551
The irony indeed

>>143734566
yes

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How exactly is manga still mainstream in Japan, or in other words, why did it(comicbooks) fall out of favor in the US/the rest of the world?

How popular is manga in the US? In my country, manga is limited to shonenshit like OP and DBZ, and only found in some bookstores.

>>143734615
Manga has declined a lot in Japan, its sells less than 50% of what it used to in the 90s

>>143734629
Reading in general has been on the decline in many countries.

>>143734313
How about substantiating your claims and adding something of worth?

>All this animosity towards the visual mediums and arts

Why are you fucks even on this board?

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>>143734833
Some people's minds works in weird ways.

>>143734833
Critical thinking is good for you.
I watch and read plenty of shit

>>143734872
Everybody should hate manchildren, neckbeards and weebs though

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>>143721781
Absolutely

>>143735046
Too bad it went to shit
Feels like it happens to all manga, they never know when to stop and the story goes to shit eventually, then we get a shit ending to go with it once the author gives up completely, this is why I dont read manga anymore.

>>143734629
source on that number? i know there were some extremely popular works in the 80-90 but still. where does that number come from?

>>143734833
kids who want to feel special for reading books.

>>143735111
Number came from the highest selling manga magazine itself, saw it a few years ago

>>143735202
damn, could you be any less specific?
so jump sales i guess? gotcha.

>>143732602
If you can't recognize emotion and feeling from looking at a character's face or discern the meaning behind a character's actions or gestures then you are quite literally autistic.