Just finished NGE and watched the EOE. I can't understand

>>135548898
You are probably not familiar with Biology and Judeo-Christian theology

>>135548898
its the same for gundam wingfags too

>>135549049
No. explain it to me. Explain NGE relation to Judeo-Christian theology. Please.

>>135549049
>You are probably not familiar with Biology and Judeo-Christian theology
As a kid i knew more than 20 christian poems and songs, and I was a nerd.

Then, is NGE shit?

>>135549050
I didn't watch Gundam.

Are there more kekdeep shows that /a/ overrated?

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>>135548898

>>135549481
>Lain
Is Lain better than NGE then?
I understand the kekreferences of NGE and the final movie's, but I don't understand the hype you guys have for this show, even though I have already read some kekreviews afterwards.

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>>135549629
>reading reviews
watch it and see for yourself
you asshole

>>135548898
>am I missing something
You're not missing anything. It's overhyped shit and everybody loves it because it's baby's first anime.

>>135549874
I told you i read them afterwards.

>>135549932
>baby's first anime.
Then it's reasonable good.
>You're not missing anything
Fuck

You didn't understand it, anon.

>>135548898

It's really not that deep. Hidden behind all the fancy Judeo-Christian symbolism are some pretty basic messages.

>>135550170
see >>135549128


evidently the fans didnt either.

>>135550221
Almost nobody actually understands Eva. I think I've only met one other person that understood Eva.

>>135550216
>symbolism and pretty basic messages
I like them, but where does the hype come from?
Nostalgia?

>>135548898
because, probably, you're judging by what you see at first sight you're not even trying to understand the series as it should.

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>>135548898
Hourly reminder to read the manga. You won't fully uderstand origianl anime unless you share your drug dealer with Anno.

>>135550315
The messages in Eva are touched upon in very few anime and the ones that have similar messages were almost all influenced by Eva. The show is original and unique which is insanely rare.

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Evangelion really isn't as DEEP as a lot of Eva fans will claim it is, there is a lot happening and a lot of things you can pull out from symbolism, but a lot of it is subjective to you and others, some people will see things and connect them to ideas and other things and others will call you crazy.

One of the be basic messages of Evangelion (at least in the anime series and the continued ending of EoE) is that humans are flawed creatures who do horrible things to each other and to themselves to feel joy and happiness, this causes some people around them to be in pain and feel hate, fear, anger, and all these other emotions. But even though there are some HORRIBLE human relationships there is still the amazement of human interaction, the amazement of the kindness, love, respect, and joy we feel for each other.

This basic message in Evangelion is no matter how awful you may find how others treat you, and how disgusting some human beings can be, it's those heartfelt, deep, emotional connections that make all that pain worth it, because there is nothing like it on Earth.

Of course there are other messages behind it, such as how you should always look ahead, "Anywhere can be paradise as long as you are alive, as long as The Sun, The Moon, and The Earth exists, everything will alright." This basic idea of going forward is really common in Evangelion, as we see how multiple characters who hang onto their past (Shinji, Ikari, Asuka, hell most of the main and supporting cast) have some of the worst lives and decision making because of it.

But in all honesty, you can pull anything out of Evangelion, it's a very personal anime if you make it, what I see and the meanings I got out of it are so different than what other people have. I've watched the whole anime about three times now and I try to watch it once every few months to try and find new things to focus on and think about.

Congratulations, you finished Evangelion!

>>135550315
It made people emotional.

>>135550434
Sort of got it. Some of the more important symbolism probably went over this anon's head.

>>135550291
>"Why is NGE Good"
>"Its so deep"
>"How?"
>"Its a deconstruction of mecha!"
>"Ok. but it doesn't really do anything different from what it deconstructs. only thing different is characters who don't outgrow angst after doing it for a while."
>"You just dont get it. its an allegory for christianity and the bible. full of Judeo-Christian messages and undertones."
>"Like what?"
>" Well its all about religion. its hidden themes that relate to the bible."
>"Give me an example."
>" Neon GENESIS. Genesis was in the bible"
>"Thats not really an example. its just a name."
>"y-you just dont get it do you. its too deep."
>"Then explain it to me."
>"Fuck you"

>>135550428
this post pisses me off. Ever heard of Space Runaway Ideon?

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>>135550494
There's a lot of symbolism true, I absolutely LOVE Evangelion but it's one of the hardest animes for me to talk about personally because, well, so many things happen and it's hard for me to remember them all and also it's just so personal to many people, and since Anno has pretty much said "The anime can mean anything" it's very hard to discuss it in any objective way.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=px7FFMOTtyM

>>135550548
Eva isn't a deconstruction and it has nothing to do with the bible. Anyone that tells you otherwise didn't get it.

>>135550567
Something can be influenced by something and still be original. Ideon and Eva don't even remotely touch upon similar ideas. The only thing Eva lifted was Ideon was some visuals.

>>135550428
see >>135550548

Living embodiment

>>135550644
If you ask me a question I can give you an actual answer.

>>135550567
Eva directly addressed the isolation in the hearts of many of the lost generation. It was a product of the time that is still relevant to many individuals today, as well as being much more visually impressive than Ideon. Ideon does not work with the same ideas.

>>135550671
Explain the Religious undertones and connections to Judeo-Christian theology that lies within NGE. Explain their meanings. give examples. reach the summit of NGE fandom above the poser ass masses.

>>135550815
Wikipedia

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>>135548898
It's all about broken people coping, with a side of immanentizing the eschaton to up the ante, and dressed up with kewl stuff from a bunch of sci-fi.

The "deep" bit comes from seeing how the window-dressing fits together, and analysing how Anno's direction shows rather than tells.

The staying power is because many of the audience see something of themselves in one or other of the characters -- and on the flip-side others may find it hits too close to home, or they may even be socially well adjusted.

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>>135550876

The Dead Sea Scrolls/ Secret Dead Sea Scrolls and the Seeds of Life reflect the relationship between the t.RNA and the DNA, respectively.

Much like our DNA, the Seeds of Life follow a process that need to be "translated" in for us humans (our bodies) to understand (protein production).

>>135548898
If you dont like psichological thrillers this kind of stuff is realy not for you

>>135550916
Eva is not a thriller.

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>>135549128
"There are a lot of giant robot shows in Japan, and we did want our story to have a religious theme to help distinguish us. Because Christianity is an uncommon religion in Japan we thought it would be mysterious. None of the staff who worked on Eva are Christians. There is no actual Christian meaning to the show, we just thought the visual symbols of Christianity look cool. If we had known the show would get distributed in the US and Europe we might have rethought that choice." ― Kazuya Tsurumaki

>>135550548
How is it strange that only retards will try to assign exact meaning to symbols?

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>>135551047

haha. thats funny. Good work.

>>135549049
Feel good about yourself?

>>135548898
You understand the creator remade it three times plus two summary movies, and it kept getting worse and worse and worse. It's rubbish, you wasted your time. The JD words it uses have no deep meaning or symbolism.

>>135550815
Eva uses Christianity imagery and names as a means of better conveying its tone and concepts to its audience. The idea that the body and soul are two separate things is a Christian (albeit not exclusively Christian) concept and understanding this concept is key to understanding the show. Understanding the concept of a 'God' in the Christian sense is also pretty important to understanding the show and by relating the imagery in the show to Christianity, the viewer can understand what a God-like figure in Eva can accomplish. Have you ever seen a show or book or movie lift elements from other religions like Hinduism or Buddhism? Eva is doing the exact same thing. You just notice it more because they're using Christianity. Some examples I can give you of shows ripping concepts straight from religions are Avatar (the cartoon) or Thor from Marvel.

The handling of some of the religious imagery in Eva is pretty poor though. Most specifically, the cross is a prominent image seen throughout the show that doesn't even remotely have anything to do with the cross in Christian mythology. In Eva, the cross symbolizes the disruption of identity or ego. When the cross is present, it's meant to convey to the audience that the characters we're seeing are having trouble defining who they are in relation to other people, or in the worst case losing their identity as a person all together. This concept is most touched upon in Episode 16 during Shinji's first experience inside an Angel. During this sequence, Shinji is forced to confront his feelings of insecurity and dependency on others. His perception of himself is represented by one line, and other people's perception of him is represented by another line intersecting with the other and forming a cross. As the scene progresses Shinji's identity is disrupted by the way other people perceive him - and so the cross is disrupted as well.

I can continue if you're interested but there's a lot of stuff to go over

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>>135551352
you. back of the class. you have failed the test.

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The secret of Evangelion is that they took super robot pilots and reversed their genders
if Rei was male, he'd be the awesomely silent/cool/calm guy.
When he rushes that angel with an N2 mine under his arm sacrificing his life ... that is the scene where MANLY TEARS flow for A MAN'S WAY OF LIFE AND DEATH.
Asuka, if a man, would be an awesomely HOT BLOODED pilot. And pervy with his advances on Shinji, but a little tsundere.
And Shinji, as a weak little girl, as a girl, puts it into context. You'd be fapping furiously to Shinjiko every night because of her shy demeanour
And with girl Kaworu, Shinji x Kaworu would be amazingly hot.

>>135551455
>give a real answer
>get completely disregarded anyways
It was literally too deep for you.

>>135551423
If this doesn't answer your question then you're probably a REDNECK.

WE DO THIS EVERY YEAR BOYS

THE SAME DISCUSSION

BUT WHY
U
T

W
H
Y

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>>135551550
We just thought the visual symbols of Christianity look cool. ― Kazuya Tsurumaki

>>135551652
You completely misunderstood what he meant when he said that and didn't understand the show. Go watch it again.

what are some nice recent hentai to fap to?

>>135551550
see >>135551047

you just pulled shit out of your ass. and even then didnt really give any good examples or explanations. jsut basically said OP levels of power = god mode. many things takes pages out of religious writings

all you had to say was ; "connections are purely physical/visual , and have no deeper meaning." you instead write a dipshit essay. even when you say "The cross has no meaning with christian mythology" you still go on about what it means.

fact is NGE. Isn't. Deep. any answer of what it means that comes in a form longer then a few sentences is bullshit.

>>135551792
You are simple and didn't actually read what I wrote. I gave multiple examples and explanations. The cross in Eva has no relation to Christianity but still has meaning within Eva.

It was too deep for you.

>>135551352
>cross symbolizes the disruption of identity or ego
I personally think it's more of a symbol of hope in that sense. Something that a character clings to when their world is falling apart around them.

After all, religion emerged from the need of a human to have hope, a higher power to cling to and find comfort, a being to which you can pin the blame for your trouble in life.
It was later historically used for the purpose of authority source: The Golden Bough , but the base concept of religion is heavily shown in Eva.

I honestly can't tell you how deep it is, because I dropped it after maybe 10 episodes or so. I was hoping that it gets better, because people here seem to like it, but it was just boring to me.
When I read the comments here on why it should be deep, I'm forced to think it is just a meme. There really isn't anything going on behind the curtains. It's juts a simple minded mecha shounen, with some flat drama elements. I guess the only good thing is, that they don't flash some panties every other second. That makes the anime seem more mature than it is.

>>135552229
It doesn't get deep until episode 14.

>>135552229
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jfM3WjyCt8s

>>135550369
>As it should
Who knows how should I watch it? Typical fanboy
>>135550409
Maybe you are right. I personally prefer manga over anime.

>>135550428
>>135550435
That's good. I just wanted a hint so I could feel the same.
>>135550906
I know every author puts a bit of his fetishes into their "creations".
>The staying power is because many of the audience see something of themselves in one or other of the characters -- and on the flip-side others may find it hits too close to home, or they may even be socially well adjusted.
I actually found the characters a bit obsessive and dramatic. But i can bear it.
>>135550916
I like psichological thrillers. But NGE is not that.

>>135551423
I already read some infiographics like that.

Thanks /a/. Is Lain better than this?

>>135552229
>When I read the comments here on why it should be deep, I'm forced to think it is just a meme. There really isn't anything going on behind the curtains. It's juts a simple minded mecha shounen, with some flat drama elements.
>I dropped it after maybe 10 episodes
Yeah, it really shows.

Eva is one of those shows that has a very close and personal meaning for most of its viewers. The most prelevant reason for this is that all the characters have major flaws. Shinji, for example, is a coward that indulges in escapism and can not handle social situations too well. Asuka is extremely insecure and craves attention and praise, which she hides by boasting a lot and generally acting sassy and on-top of everybody else. I could go on. The point is that many people who watch Evangelion find their own flaws reflected in one or more of the characters (and considering the stereotype of the neckbeard weeb otaku that is probably Shinji). The show also touches philosophical topics, such as what it means to have a firm and secure identity and what separates humans from one another. The simple truth is that for most viewers, Evangelion has a large emotional impact, and if my personal experience is any good for judging, I can assume that the series stayed with them after they finished it, and that they still thought about it. Not because it's 2deep4u (it really isn't all that deep), but because it has a large emotional impact. And the visuals and music are very appealing as well. Anyway, if you didn't like it, OP, that's fine. You're not obligated to find things good.

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>>135552348
>Is Lain better than this?
It's different. It's more a grab-bag of turn of the century internet, heavy on the /x/ than anything else.

>>135552268
>>135552401
>This are the greatest anime of all time. The first 13 episodes are shit, but then it really gets deep "I promise anon".

Look it's really okay if you guys liked it and it certainly isn't the worst anime of all time. But for me it was really painful to watch and I don't care for the characters. I hoped they all die from the start, especially the MC. He is such a diva and I don't care for his psychological problems at all. I simply can't watch a show where I hate the heros more than the foes.

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>>135550428
>The show is original and unique which is insanely rare.
>The show is original and unique
>original and unique

>>135552348
Lain is stranger, Eva and Lain are very different, Eva is about broken people and how people can sometimes unwillingly, accidentally hurt each other, about despair, hope, anxiety and depression. About people trying to hide their true feelings for fear of being hurt. It's also about failure (Asuka), and coping with your problems (MISATO).

And just a bit of existentialism in the end.

Lain is about the possible future of humans being incorporated with the internet. Humans don't need bodies to be alive, we are our brain (similar to Eva, just replace souls with consciousness).
A brain sends signals in a similar way to a computer, with electrones.
It's full on mindfucking, who know's what's real the internet or the physical world, or even which one is the physical world, existential.
Lain on the other hand has not much in terms of characters.
It's pretentious, but pretentiousness isn't bad per se.
It just didn't click with me, unlike a similar one Haibane Renmei because it goes back to souls again, and it's a metaphysical topic i like.

>>135552731
First 13 episodes are good once you've seen the second half and can appreciate the first half.

I don't expect you to believe me, but the first and second half of Eva are actually two completely different shows.

>>135552348
I'd say Lain is lacking in the character development part and it has a stronger more clear message that delved deeper into post-modernistic view of society instead of personal issues.

>>135551423
I wish people would pass this around a little bit more.

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>>135552348
The show that normally gets associated with NGE is Utena, rather than Lain.

>>135552731
I don't give a shit. Just don't make retarded statements like "it is just a meme" and "it's just a simple minded mecha shounen" as if you've seen it completely when you literally just admitted you haven't even watched half of the series.

You just fucking said that you couldn't say if it was deep at the beginning of your post and then proceed to say it isn't.

Also, the 13 episodes aren't shit. You might be able to appreciate it more if you would actually fucking watch the entire thing.

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>>135552731
Shinji is much like Amuro from Gundam, only without the necessary Bright-slaps.

>>135550632
How is Eva not a deconstruction of the mecha genre? Unless you're using deconstruction in derrida's terms.

>>135553299
Because it didn't destruct anything.
Everything about it was taken from some other Anime or movie or work, even other mecha.

>>135552731
First 6 episodes are great. I have an eye for details, and that part when stuff falls down and Shinji instinctivelly raises his arm only to have Eva 01 do the same gesture and save him from being crushed foreshadowing the fact that they're connected.
Episode 7 is so-so, it's there to show that SEELE are pulling all the strings.
Episode 8 was good,
Episode 9 was very good
10 is boring
11 is just ok
12 and 13 are good
14 is great. It seems like a recap, but it's not skipable, and Rei has a GOAT monologue
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWkXT0HBUkg

>>135550906
>The staying power is because many of the audience see something of themselves in one or other of the characters -- and on the flip-side others may find it hits too close to home, or they may even be socially well adjusted.

Huh, perhaps I'm too young to relate to any of the characters? I don't know, I just never got the same impact other people seem to have felt.

>>135553077
Look I said I can't really tell if it's deep or not, but based on what I have seen and what people are talking about, it the "deep" part mostly are the psychological states of the characters and their struggle to overcome their flaws. This might be fine, if the characters really had something going for them. But to me they don't have any personality at all, they are just textbook stereotypes. They are very predictable and only there to show of shit like the porcupine dilemma. Which is retard tier psychology. Well at least they have a stupid penguin in their closet, I bet he is the key to the whole plot.

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>>135553427
So long as you're old enough to have been a teenager, then you're old enough to have had some of the issues that the characters face. But if you're lucky, you won't have characters reminding you of the uncomfortable parts of adolescence.

>>135548898
It's a horrible show.
Only autistic kids like it.

Would be nice to have discussions about the themes of the show without this angst debate about how deep it is.

>>135553858
OP here.
Just wanted to feel hyped about Evangelion.

It seems that depending on when do you watch it, anime can feel good, dissapointing or excellent.

In short it's a rejection of gnosticism

>>135550548
Eva is considered a deconstruction of mecha, cause aside from the average mecha show where MC was a hot blooded hero and whatever. Eva was a little bit more...fair... on what would happen when you get a bunch on ill raised 15 years old, and make em fight giant abominations risking their lives and with the weight of all mankind on their their backs.

add in sexual themes, religion imagery and some drama and you got a recipe for something good.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FckkZihQUaU

>>135554266
see >>135553340
Watch some old mecha, because Eva was definitely not the first to do what it did.

>>135553490
>But to me they don't have any personality at all, they are just textbook stereotypes. They are very predictable and only there to show of shit like the porcupine dilemma.
Again, the fact that you're saying this really shows that you've haven't even seen half of the show. The show, more or less, completely changes after episode 14. The characters aren't established just for the sake of giving you a psychology lesson and they are anything but shallow stereotypes. If anything, NGE is the show that helped establish and popularize certain archetypes, for better or worse.

I'm not even trying to argue whether it's deep or not, because that doesn't mean anything to me and I couldn't care less either way. I'm just saying that there's a legitimate reason why people have high opinion for it and its theme and they aren't just solely a bunch of pseudo-intellectuals circlejerking and pretending it's on the same level as Ulysses.

>>135554332
But it did it much better than Ideon.
Eva takes so much from many western sci-fi novels and movies:
howard fast the general zapped an angel
2001 a space odyssey
Colossus: The Forbin Project (even referenced in 2.0 if you play the dummy plug backwards)
just to name a few.

>>135554038
If the themes didn't resonate you then that's on Gainax. I think there's much else to appreciate with designs of the mechs and angels, and I guess the whole monster film aspect where each threat manifests in much different forms. You can tell a lot of work was put into the setting. To be honest the series doesn't do that much for me either, but I can see why it's worthy of being called one of the best.

>>135548898
>I can't understand
/thread

>>135554332
they did it best tho. take a look to any other show. they were maybe space operas, or characters acted way more mature, Evangelion really sticked with a fucking 15 years old with daddy issues, and the few times he grows, shit happend and he devolves back to a be a fucking 15 years old

Same will be with madoka, it kept shit constant, not just 1 or 2 times for dramatic impact (see sailor moon 1st arc where everyone dies)

>>135554532
No, it didn't do better. It just copied more shit.
Eva is literally a mash-up of all the things Anno likes and all the series he grew up with as a kid.
There's nothing original, not the characters, not the themes, nothing.
Blatant ripoffs.

>>135554659
ok aside from your
>NO ITS NOT
point out what other show is eva like but did it much better before eva?

as you said, its a mix of thing, but eva brought em together

>>135551635
So a few failures can feel good about themselves

All delusions though

>>135554659
Anon, we have to talk about creativity. You see, putting together a creative work is, in essence, nothing BUT creating a mashup of things you already know. Can a painter paint something that does not exist and has absolutely no connection to anything in the real world at all? No, he fucking can't. The human brain recognizes shapes and patterns (in the literal and the abstract meanings of those words), and re-arranges them either logically or creatively. That is the essence of human creation, we can't really 'create', we can not make something that is 100 per cent new or unique. But we can arrange things we already know and mesh them together to create something that at least feels new. That's what taking inspiration is, really.

>>135553340
Yeah, but that doesn't mean it didn't deconstruct. Maybe not the mecha genre entirely but certainly character tropes. I also wouldn't say it destroyed anything. Maybe subversion is the right term. Early Gundam and Ideon had some characters and themes similar to Eva but not as intense and all out as Eva.

I've yet to see any anime before Eva that did what Eva did with its characters. There aren't any heroes, true villains, or a protagonist that's likeable or strong. Every character has something going on with them.

So I guess it's less of a deconstruction of mecha anime but moreso of characters that you would expect in an mecha anime.

>>135554562
>I can't understand
I can't understand the hype.

>>135554659
Then i guess every fantasy universe is just a ripoff of JRRT?
There's a big difference between a ripoff and an homage.
I guess Gundam is a starwars ripoff (not counting F91), because Char's helmet is modeled after Darth Vader and the robots have lightsabers.
Who didn't ripoff the monomyth?

>>135554819
>but certainly character tropes
How can that be when all the characters are ripoffs of other characters from older Anime?

>>135553752
I mean, I can certainly relate to some of the problems the characters have. But isn't that the case in most shows in the first place? I didn't feel like Evangelion made me relate to the characters a siginificant amount more than other shows.

>>135551423
When was that entire backstory part brought up or established?
Was it brought up in secondary sources, interviews or commentaries, because I never noticed a description as detailed as this anywhere.

>>135555040
In some of 'em jap video games
The whole mythology part frankly wasn't necessary in the context of just the show, but becomes useful when you start talking about rebuild

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>>135548898
>people think that NGE has any religious meaning.
>people cant see the real meaning of NGE.

>>135554969
Uh, the point is looking back on older characters and going all the way with them with your premise.

What mecha anime did what Eva did with its characters? What mecha anime had characters as pitiful as Eva? It took the premise of having young people fight in robots seriously and had them damaged. Everyone in the series is pretty fucked up or dealing with their own major problems.

>>135555146
That sounds like every 80s mecha Anime to me.
Literally every single one.

Anno even said he wanted Evangelion to be Sailor Moon with Robots.
A literal ripoff of another show he liked.

>>135555109
This short post doesn't satisfy my curiosity at all, but thanks for clearing that up.

>>135555233
>That sounds like every 80s mecha Anime to me.
>That sounds like
Nice job admitting that you have no idea what you're talking about.

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>>135555137
You need my rare, higher quality one, my friend

>>135551423
Huh, I wonder what happens after EoE, well to Yui/Eva-01 anyway. I know the manga has humanity come back.

>>135555572
3.0

>>135550291
I'd link you to my freewebs site that I made in 1999 that explains how each character represents a node in the sephirothic tree of life and how their interactions are governed by Anno's interpretation of the Kabbalah but I took it down when I finished middle school.

>>135549560
kek

>>135555800
That sounds super cool, think wayback machine may have a copy?

>>135555040
IIRC there were pamphlets handed out at the screening of either EoE or 1.0 that talked about all the lore. You could probably find sources on evageeks.

>>135556082
The Red Cross booklet.

>>135554266
>Keep seeing this video in my recommendation's box on youtube and still watch it almost every time I see it

Theres just something so entertaining about it

It just is not that deep. It's father issues the anime.