And Merry Christmas!
Not all muslims will be come radicals.
There's 2+ billion muslims on the planet,
there are less than 190k radical muslims that make up ISIS in the entire upper african/middle east considdered to be 'radical' and even still they aren't concentrated.
I think you missed the point...which is that if Trump saying we should have a moratorium on Islamic immigration is enough to recruit "moderate" Muslims into terrorist organizations, then those people are not worth having in the US to begin with. Basically Clinton and Dean's argument is self defeating because of this.
>There's 1.4b muslims
>No, theres 1.6b
>No wait theres 2b! More even!
Why does this number seem to go up by several hundred million every week?
The fairest numbers say around 1.5billion.
If we take your estimate of 190k (lets say an arbritrary but conservative 100k since you were off on the total number of Muslims) lets look at the damage this 'small minority' can inflict.
And as we've seen, just 7 radicals can kill 130 people. Lets math it out.
130/7 = 18.57. We'll call even that to 18 victims per radical Muslim.
You say that the 190k (which I rounded down to 100k) make up ISIS in the mid east, so we're discounting radical muslims placed elsewhere in the world. Lets say that half that number make it out of the mid east into the rest of the world over the next couple of years.
50,000 displaced ISIS members x 18 victims per radical = 900,000 potential victims.
Hey almost a million victims worldwide from half of a small minority of muslims. Guess thats alright then. Thank Allah there aren't more radical Muslims in the world harbouring ill will towards secular and christian western civilisation. And the US wants to bring in 12,000 Syrians through a broken system that barely screens the people coming in! Sounds like a great idea to me!
I'm an Australian, and memes aside, I just wanna say one thing about Trump.
I believe him. I think he is telling the truth.
It is so fucking refreshing to have a politician speak their mind instead of dancing around issues with politeness and political correctness.
This whole back and forth feels artificial and rehearsed
1. MSNBC would never defend a Republican candidate
2. MSNBC has repeatedly altered facts and footage to form their left wing biased narrative
3. The governor slowly concedes he is wrong, I've never seen a politician retreat on live tv in an interview
Maybe the left is getting sloppy or maybe MSNBC is trying to retain viewers, but I have a hard time taking this at face value considering what I know.
The scary thing is that he should be right. Trump shouldn't be able to just whip out his dick without any semblance of plan or goal to the roaring applause of republicans. They're children being impressed by fireworks.
I hate ultra libs, but conservatives in general seem absolutely fucking brain-dead.
Remember my fellow Americans, our government is run by both dumbasses and sell outs who haven't the slightest clue on what they're talking about when it comes to the real world. No facts, no statistics, no reason, just "Here's our political slogan and we're sticking to it no matter what."
If Trump truly destroys the Saudi/Muslim lobby in America...it will be worth paying for the wall.
Americans just need to vote for him.
America, don't fail us.
Europe is done.
Africa is done.
What remains of the world rests its hopes onto you.
>Hope and Change anon, most everyone believed it at the time
Except for the fact that he already supported the 2007 FISA Amendment Act, before the election, so we had already seen his true colors as a neoconservative, and should have known he would change nothing or even make things worse.
Dennis Kucinich was the only democrat on the field in 2007 worth voting for. He was the only one calling for Bush and Cheney to be impeached.
Dean, like Wasserman-Schultz, is a politics-politician, not a policy-politician. So many of them are, these days. You occasionally get good policy-politicians, but they're becoming ever fewer and farther between.
It's sad that this guy is making such headway with my fellow Americans. Fucking scumbag politicians have left people starving and gasping for plain talk and truthfulness. But Trump is not a good choice for President. It's unfortunate, because there are some legitimately good choices right now, but Trump is just taking up all the attention.
Can a friendly ameribro please explain this. If Trump doesnt get elected as the candidate for the republicans, will he still be able to run as a third party ? I highly doubt he will be selected as the candidate for the republicans.
that picture means literally nothing if the game is fixed.
bernie is crushing hillary in the polls yet he's getting ron paul'd right now. hillary will most definitely get the nomination despite liberals wanting sanders. the game is fixed.
I actually think Trump will get the nomination but it wouldn't surprise me at all if he didn't and never had a chance to.
honestly how the fuck can you not vote for this guy?
Why do muslims think they have a special right to flood white countries and why do libcucks enable this thinking so much? I will never understand the thought process behind it beyond simple naivety by the liberal whites and some primal urge for conquest by shitskins.
I don't think even liberals know. They somehow in their minds have reconciled Islam's beliefs with their own liberal ideals. And found through some mental gymnastics that they are compatible. Despite Islam promoting the destruction of just about everything they support such as gay rights, womens rights ect.
Liberals are fucking retards.
They either support things like gay rights, women's rights, the civil society, freedom of religion (all religions), etc..
They support Islam. They cannot do both.
Such retards the libs are.
Can we sticky this post on every website on the fucking planet? Holy shit
libfag here who is also muslim.
You're acting like a religion dictates everything in our lives. There is nothing in my faith that says I have to be radical towards people I don't agree with.
The media is blowing this out of the water guys, people can follow as much Islam as they want to without hurting their own views. It's like all religions that way
>You're acting like a religion dictates everything in our lives.
Yeah that's the idea. That's what Islam is. Why do you think Saudi Arabia literally has the Quran as their constitution?
that's the joke
people think it's not impressive to see what Trump did with that loan, but they never put it into perspective.
>b-but it's harder to turn $1 into $10,000 than to turn $1,000,000 into $10,000,000,000
Then why doesn't it happen all the time?
Even if that were true, I fail to see how it would make a point. Presidential candidates shouldn't make statements that would make terrorists mad? Are leftists THAT terrified of ISIS?
You don't combat a threat by staying silent in fear your enemies will come after you. You combat it by being strong enough to deter it.
This. I found the claim that Trump was ISIS's best recruiter very strange and that it somehow was a bad thing struck me as odd. Being hated by evil bastards like ISIS is a great honor i'd say.
I wonder sometimes how WWII would have played out with the people that now are in charge. We'd hear things like "Mister Churchill is the nazi's best recruiter." or maybe "Don't be so naziphobic, most Nazi's are law abiding citizens that don't call for the destruction of the Jews" etc. We need to get rid of this post modernist bullshit quickly before it's too late.
Islamic oil money lobby actually is really cozy with libs (and rightys). Both leftys and Muslim interests (who have a big voice thanks to their oil company proxies) have gotten closer over the years in their mutual dislike of Israel.
Frankly I couldn't give a damn about the Israelis, or most of the middle east.
I don't like the guy, and I disagree with a lot of what he says, but I get physical pleasure from hearing how much he pisses people off.
I'm voting for him because I think it'll be entertaining, and I really want to see how far he'll take things.
I'd love to see what would happen around the country if he really tried to ban a religion, or the shitstorm over building that wall
Trump said if he becomes president, he'll give the source of this song
That is not what is happening, there has been no evidence anyone has become a member of a terrorist organization because of Trump.
>Presidential candidates shouldn't make statements to push people who are not terrorists to be terrorists.
You make it sound as if terrorists are the victims here, those poor people who became terrorists because of what someone with silly hair said. I'd say good riddance they show their true colors and were not our friends to begin with.
> there has been no evidence anyone has become a member of a terrorist organization because of Trump.
That may very well be true, but there certainly is evidence that muslims in the middle east have turned to radical terrorist groups because of violent islamaphobia in the west.
Islamophobia is a bullshit term that i will not take seriously. There is barely any violence against muslims in the west and the acceptence of 1 million mostly islamic 'refugees' by Germany is a great example of this. There is however in the middle east extreme violence against christians and all kinds of crazy conspiracies about the West and Israel are commonplace. Have you ever considered they turn to religious terrorism for religious reasons?
Does anyone have that webm of that edited republican debate where they made it awkward as fuck?
It wasn't primarily about trump, but he was in it, lasted 2 minutes or so. Can't find it anywhere.
The acceptance of refugees is not evidence for a lack of violence against muslims. That's not how evidence works you twat. And it doesn't even fucking matter whether we are significantly islamophobic or not. Muslims in the middle east believe that we are. That's the problem, that's what drives their hatred, and that's what we need to fix.
>Have you ever considered they turn to religious terrorism for religious reasons?
I haven't considered that any more than I've considered that Christians turn to the KKK for religious reasons. I HAVE considered both. And I've ruled both to be totally unreasonable ideas. Christians turned to the KKK because they hated blacks, Muslims turn to jihad because they hate the Western world. It's that simple.
Jihadists try to justify their hatred with their religion, but ultimately what separates Jihadists from the rest of the world isn't the Quran or Islam. ~15% of the world's population follows the same holy book. The violent rejection of Western culture and standards separates these extremists from the rest of the world. Other groups who share this trait (DPRK, Boko Haram) are, shocker, rejected and opposed by the Western World.
>There is nothing in my faith that says I have to be radical towards people I don't agree with.
Yes there is. You just haven't read all the Quran. The Quran explicitly states you have to kill apostates and Jews wherever you find them. Somewhere else it says that killing innocents is bad but that's talking about other Muslims
He meant Islam explicitly forbids all other religions, and atheism. They're all nonbelievers and should be beheaded. The nice parts of the Quran talk about how to treat fellow male Muslims.
Meaning you cannot have freedom of religion and Islam simultaneously in a country, unless either side makes compromises
Your original argument was that ISIS and Al Quaeda used Trump in their videos. This lead you to believe that Trump has made them terrorists. But they already were terrorists, they're just now using Trump's words. You said that to prevent terrorist organisations from using his words, a president candidate shouldn't say bad things about Islam, even if they're true
>evidence that muslims in the middle east have turned to radical terrorist groups because of violent islamaphobia in the west.
Please provide this evidence. I don't believe you, since radical terrorism comes from the Quran, not from islamophobia. The other way around makes more sense: radical Islam leads to islamophobia
can you provide an example of an emotional diversion i used
or better yet, convince me that any of my assertions are moot. seeing the same assertion several times and repeatedly ignoring it doesn't invalidate it
it's a vicious cycle
i didnt say trumps words made isis terrorists lmao. i said isis can use examples of anti-islam sentiments provided by public figures in the western world to fan the anti-american flame in the middle east, effectively spreading the influence of already terrorist organizations
If all it takes for "peaceful" Muslims to turn to jihad is because of the words of 1 man asking for a temporary ban, then how "peaceful" are they really?
>Liberia a country where you cannot own land, work or own property if you aren't of negero descent, this is in their constitution
If Blacks really mean it, they could fix that country up.
extremists are such a small minority, though. However, as these groups grow, the people in these group feel more vindicated in their ideologies just because of the sheer numbers.
after years of seeing the same shit, people slowly become angrier and more vengeful. at some point, it only takes a single message to push one to the limit. these extremists are the middle eastern equivalent of picrelated
>wahh! women dont like me! i must kill them!
do you think he thought to do that the first time a woman turned him away? these violent mindsets take years to cultivate
80 women in Germany were sexually assaulted, 1 raped, including a female police officer during New Years Eve in public.
Upwards of 1,000 "Arab and north African men" were groping, fingering, beating, and raping women in Cologne Germany, and you want to tell me that WE are the fucking problem?
because once we know who our enemy is we can destroy them with great ease and many millions of pounds of explosives
idgaf about any of the middle eastern countries anymore. the iraqis that we trained, supported, and protected abandoned their posts. they abandoned both our nation and their own people. they left tanks and humvees sitting in the streets for isis to steal away. despicable.
It doesn't matter what we think of ourselves you twat. Muslims have the impression that the western world hates them, and that feeds the extremist fire. Giving them more evidence that shows we hate them creates more terrorists you ignorant pile of shit. You can defend us and condemn muslims all you want, but that's not helping anything.
>be part of a religion that is responsible for the deaths of thousands of people in recent years
>"Oh Allah Allah how terrrible why does the west hate us so?!"
Should we tiptoe around and avoid Muslims like we would a pack of rabid dogs? Hoping they dont decide that today they want to kill us?
You don't think the majority of muslims condemn the actions of muslim extremists? They know exactly why we're so intolerant. At least for the most part. They just can't do shit about it. The terrorist minority is a strong minority, and it's ever growing because of our bullshit.
>muh dramatic singing
i had to mute her voice when i watched the debate
why can't they get a guy or girl to just sing it fucking normally
sorry bitch but you singing the anthem with a few extra pitches wont get you a record label
You can't have freedom of religion in a country without allowing Islam in the country, because by its very definition, freedom of religion does not allow the government to ban religions. It doesn't matter if Islam forbids this or that, Islam doesn't make the laws, and continuing to allow Muslims into America isn't going to do anything to the 1st Amendment.
Well the guy was talking about supporting it. You can't simultaneously support the freedom of religion and Islam, because Islam forbids freedom or religion. You're right that Islam doesn't make the laws, but what isn't can still be
That's not entirely true. You can have freedom of religion and Islam, but only if the particular version of Islam permits it. 500 years ago Christianity wasn't big on religious pluralism either, but nobody today argues that Christianity isn't compatible with freedom of religion. You could argue that contemporary Christianity isn't genuine, but that's another topic.
The issue is that modern radical Islam often involves a political component that seeks to replace secular laws and government with religious ones. That is fundamentally incompatible with the establishment clause of the 1st Amendment. Legal precedent holds that the establishment clause takes precedence over the exercise clause if there's a conflict. Reynolds v. US held that Congress can regulate religious activities "which were in violation of social duties or subversive of good order".
THEY'RE ALL IN THE FUCKING TANK FOR HIM NOW
I'd much rather live in a country that values freedom and guns than one that values feelings and diversity.
Thing is, progressives do to, they just don't know it yet. If they actually did succeed in crafting an SJW paradise, they would quickly discover how terrible of an idea it was when the thought police turn on them. A society based on victimhood needs victimizers. If there aren't any readily available, it will create some.
>A society based on victimhood needs victimizers. If there aren't any readily available, it will create some.
And what does a society based on victimizing do when they run out of victims? For instance, if Trump succeeds in shutting out all Muslims, who will he turn to as a scapegoat next? Probably the Mexicans he calls "rapists". Then what? Trump's sort of rhetoric needs a scapegoat, and if he doesn't have one readily available, he'll still come up with something.
Iif i give you a loan of 100$ with the goal of you making 100 000$ in a month would you be able to do it? If not you better shut your mouth because that is essentially what trump did.
100$ is a small loan if you want to use it as a starting capital for making 100 000$. But its a lot of money to a somalian.
>wants to solve real and important issues of the day concerning illegal immigration and terrorism
>BUT IF HE SOLVES THOSE WHAT THEN, HUH???
I dunno, we've got plenty of problems in this country and in the world at large, I'm sure he'll have plenty of other problems to work on solving. Sounds good to me, I don't know what you're crying about except muh cultural enrichment.
Also he wants to TEMPORARILY stop muslim immigration, until the government can get a handle on the ISIS thing in the U.S. and figure out wtf is going on because honestly, they just don't know yet. He never said to "shut out all muslims", he never said it would be permanent, he never said anything about putting muslims in the U.S. in camps or arresting them just for being muslim or shutting down mosques or banning the practice of islam.
You liberals are really fucking afraid of him because you love to exaggerate shit to insane levels and outright lie about shit. That whole calling him Hitler thing was hilarious.
Yeah what happened was terrible. I mean it's a serious problem. The amount of racism and xenophobia that people expressed after it happened is something we should all worry about.
My solution would be importing more immirants.
Neither did Hitler when he started talking smack on the jews and the queers.
He predicated the need of shutting out Muslims on a very vague premise. One that could easily become a dilemma of "moving the goal post" as we say in logical fallacies. How will we figure out whats going on? When will we "have an handle" on the situation? In the more than 10 years we've been at war/conflict would you say we ever had a handle on things? At what point has Trump, or even yourself, defined the solution to this question?
So go ahead, say "Temporarily" all you want, what you really mean is indefinite and that affords you a lot of options to do questionable shit.
I'm not saying Trump's ideal America is a good place. I'm just saying that the more extreme aspects of progressivism undermine the principles that allowed the movement to develop in the first place, and allowing those beliefs to have too much influence on our government will lead to a very bad outcome. The road to hell is paved with good intentions.
Populism, whether right- or left-leaning, always requires a scapegoat. That's not the point. The point is that whichever system does a better job of preserving fundamental individual liberties will probably lead to a better outcome in the long run. Populists can be voted out, but only if people are still allowed to vote.
That's probably the most retarded thing I've ever read. You think turning a hundred dollar loan into 100,000 in a month is the same as turning a million dollar loan into a billion over ~30 years? Okay anon.
I'd chew that fat fuck up and spit his bitch ass out economically, socially, and physically. Donald Trump is worthless, spoiled shitfaced coward. I'm a 100 million times better than him at everything.
>he never said it would be permanent, he never said anything about putting muslims in the U.S. in camps or arresting them just for being muslim or shutting down mosques or banning the practice of islam.
>he never said anything about...shutting down mosques
>The point is that whichever system does a better job of preserving fundamental individual liberties will probably lead to a better outcome in the long run.
No, I don't believe that is the point at all. at least that's not my point. See, I agree with what you say about the dangers of the tumblr-style culture of blaming former oppressors, or looking for scapegoats, constantly trying to divide people into "people of color" and whites. I think that's divisive. But Trump's rhetoric is just as divisive if not more so. Town hall meetings are being interrupted when a mosque is proposed by people calling Islam an "evil cult."
Trump feeds into this with the things he says. See, I think of myself as a passionate moderate. I don't believe every element of every other culture should just be accepted, no matter how barbaric, but I think we have a responsibility in this country not to shut out innocents because there might be terrorists in their midst. I think there is a way to let in limited numbers of people, in such a way that we can properly screen them, and doesn't send the message that the US is an "Anti Muslim" country.
Except the shoe doesn't fit, you're making a gigantic leap of logic which really shouldn't be taken as lightly as it is in our culture unfortunately.
What we SHOULD do, is declare war on ISIS like France did. Because whether you want to admit it or not, that's what we're dealing with. And they have now successfully committed mass murder on U.S. soil.
In very simple terms, in general, the plan should be to prevent any more from entering the U.S., to secure the border and fix the illegal immigration issue, and finally to fight them over there in the middle east. We need to get the rest of the free world to help as well, the U.S. shouldn't do it alone, it's everyone's problem as we can clearly see from the shit that has happened in Europe. Russia is already on board but Obama is an asshole who refuses to work with them in any way, which is just making things worse over there.
When that's fixed then we can re-allow muslim immigration to the U.S., when we can actually do legit background checks instead of just accepting thousands of people into the country who we have no fucking information on.
I mean c'mon man, they're the ONLY ONES legitimately trying to declare war on the world and establish a "global caliphate". Why can't we actually DEAL with them instead of just ignoring the problem like we have been and letting them gather more and more strength?
You want some Hitler history? Try looking into what the UN did when Germany started taking over more territory, Poland and France etc. They effectively gave him a slap on the wrist and told him not to take any more territory and before you knew it he controlled half of Europe. That's the Obama administration and ISIS today, we just pulled out and said they weren't a big deal and now they actually have territory and a large, well-funded network.
its better than being a little faggot hipster who lives with mommy and daddy and never owned a home or car and yet thinks they know how society works and wants free shit. go back home and suck on your moms tits and come back when you grow a pair and get a real job and learn what it means to be a tax paying hard working citizen.
League, you mean.
Otherwise, well said. Frankly, I'm not certain we need to be fighting ourselves while our domestic situation is so fucked, but we definitely do not need to be hampering those who are actively working against IS/ISIL/ISIS
how the fuck can someone not like the guy
you may dislike his policies, that is okay, but you have to agree that he is literally the only candidate of both parties with real personality
MSNBC is basically Shillary campaign HQ.
I have yet to seriously meet someone unironically support Clinton IRL, plenty of Berniefags but no Shillaryfags. Are all her supporters fucking hermits who only come out to vote? Who the fuck wants her in office? Who can seriously look at our situation and say "Yep we need to just keep doing what we are doing".
Such a terrible politician, shaking my head familia. I wish there was another Democrat running who could seriously give her a run for her money, but for right now its just Bernie who has no chance and has no spine.