/civ4xg/ - Strategy/4X General

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first for wiz is a god

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>>167336270
forgot to specify that I am talking about civ5

What's everyone's plans for when Utopia comes out? I'm going full aliens from X-Com and enslaving and genetically engineering the fuck outta everything while working towards psionic ascension.

>>167335384
you're locked into indirect democracy though because military democracy is the worst government in the game

also combat arena sucks balls


meanwhile materialists get increased science which allows them to burst out powerful weapons earlier and they can go to war just as easily as militarists. Given you're fanatic individualist and you're perfectly capable of integrating whatever you conquer there's zero point to full bombardment, you're killing your own future citizens

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Repostin for space boners
>tiny mass effect ships

>>167336441
probably spiritual/xenophile/whatever new is in banks, my last playthrough was space hitler

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>>167335040
There are a lot of mods for it, including a Clone Wars era mod and the 'Awakening of the Rebellion' one made by germans that (apparently) re-balances the whole game, adds in a lot of new features and improves graphics drastically.

Then there is... other mods.

>>167336441
stripmine the galaxy for superstructures
become robots
exterminate organics

not necessarily in that order

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American Conquest is a great game

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>>167335782
>Can't play /pol/

I was looking forward to that. That flavor text was my favourite out of all the traditions.

I guess the reason they removed it was because unlocking all ascendency perks are tied to unlocking all tradition paths, but purity is kind of the only one that makes no sense to take outside of a xenophobic empire. But everyone would be forced to take it eventually just to gain the last ascendency perk.

Everyone, even the most oppressive regime, can claim they're harmony, everyone, even former east germany, can claim to have prosperity, but "purity" and the "rotten foundation of xeno inclusion" only works for a very narrow kind of empire. It's the main thing I was wondering about when I first saw it.

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>>167336896
Like Best Korea.
>can't lead a best Korea in space
>can't become the glorious leader
>why even live?

>>167336896
>>167337032
>Can't play /pol/ because Purity was replaced with Diplomacy.

No need to be rude to the insects you're about to exterminate.

>>167336896
It seems likely the mechanics that were originally in the tree have been moved elsewhere in the game. Xenophobe is still an ethic after all and roleplaying seems to be a big focus of this expansion/patch, so it'd be odd if they didn't play up the whole fanatic purifier angle at least a little bit.

Supposedly there are other ways to get Ascension perks besides filling out tradition trees, like event chains. I'm not certain that you'll be expected to fill out every single tradition.

are they finally gonna fix missiles?

>>167333939

I find conquering planets a real fucking chore, though. Different ethic pops, rioting, micromanagements. I vastly prefer liberation, vassalization, and by the time I integrate them, the pops are already nice and peaceful.

>>167337239
Tradition trees looks like they were ripped alive from Civ 5.

>>167336441
Shit anon, why are you stealing my ideas, that's precisely what I wanted to do as well.

Alternative idea is a race that seeks to eat and consume all others.

Or technophiles who will eventually go full "must destroy flesh"

Or perhaps a ruthless space corporation

>>167336554
Fuck. Having played Freespace and seeing just how big the ships in that game are was one thing. Seeing ships that dwarf the Colossus is insane.

also
>has ships from Homeworld 1 and 2
>but not cataclysm

>>167337504
They pretty much are.

>>167337239
I'm curious to see how they implemented the Purity options. Technologies? Edicts?

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>>167337450
>cede planet
>put a pop from main species on it
>purge all xenos

The buildings will still be intact and the population will regrow automatically.

>>167337825
By the way, if I want to terraform a planet, is it possible to make it uninhabited by just resettling everyone?

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>>167337450
Yeah.
Its really nice. Especially if you play a space commies.
>"liberate" some planets
>install local Party members as rulers
>new government is weak and teared by slave revolts or separatist movement(not always but sometimes)
>they rely on you and their fleets are weak
>still they propagate Communism
>and they care of unhappy, unproductive pops who would be burden for you space research programs
>when they are ready to accept communism you integrate them
Even as Xenophobe empire I like to keep allied(vassal) nations for RP.
Anyway its terrible that vassals are fairly limited it would be nice if they could ask concessions in wars or try bribe their overlord if they want colonize planets or something.

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>>167300720
That may have been the toughest war I've ever fought and not lost.

With my Guerillas and their ability to ignore desert movement and ZOC penalties I gained the upper hand. I built up a for one large push and took out 6 artillary lined up in the center. The North I simply held. To the South built a railroad along the Milanian coast such that I could dump Guerillas into the combat area to overwhelm their defences as I moved up artillery to siege Erdenet. But finally when I took Erdenet that backstabber Bluetooth DOWd me. I didn't want to end the war with Mongolia too soon but I had to. I couldn't fight on two fronts. Most of my industrial capacity was already going to war with Mongolia.

In a way this is good news though. Now I can build up my defences in Erdenet. This way it won't fall quickly again to the Mongols. Plus I can finally make use of my Great Generals to take ever more land with CItadels and ultimately make use of my Shoshone homeland bonus next time I go to war with Mongolia.

>>167337239
>Supposedly there are other ways to get Ascension perks besides filling out tradition trees, like event chains. I'm not certain that you'll be expected to fill out every single tradition.

True, although it's still probably better for the game if you don't include options that are too narrow. It's not really an "option" if 90% of empires can't justify using it, and the remaining 10% definitely need to take it.

Mostly talking from a fluff standpoint here, don't really know what the gameplay mechanics were.

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>>167337929
You cant resettle the last pop.
So either purge or put robot and disassemble him.
Why xenophobes can't use robots?
I get why fanatical one get enraged by even toaster but the mild one should use robots with no empire wide unhappiness.
Its like Praducks don't want xeno purging be fun.

>>167337929
You can definitely decolonize a planet by purging everyone, not sure if you can do it with resettling, never tried that.

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I hope stellaris devs will add changing planet textures at some point.
world full of mines and production has smelters visible from orbit

Also buildings like space elevators that come from the planet would be neat looking things.

>>167338926
would be awesome if we got a "hive city" building that was visible from orbit

maybe make it a building that costs food but drastically increases mineral and power output on adjacent tiles

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>>167336441
I was very tempted to an X-Com alien run myself, but I'll probably do that for my second playthrough.

For my first run, I'll be trying to recreate the Tau Empire. Using the new caste system and more varied customisation options for species rights to make it work.

For example, only the Tau primary species could become rulers. While alien races would have limited citizenship but would still be able to take up military service. (Assuming they're not weak or otherwise unfit for the job)

>>167339184
Dont forget chemical castration.

Hope someone rips theshipmodels models from battlefleet.

hope stellaris will eventually have additional megastructures like say Krashnikov tubes or Titan forges

>>167339184
I'd like being able to treat lesser being as livestocks, but not for food, rather for organs.
Like in the old UFO tv show.

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>>167336554
Those ships of legend of the galactic heroes are tiny.

>>167339551
But there is thousands of them.

>>167339551
More like lots of these ships are stupidly huge. How do you run a 15km long ship? It could only be worse if that chart had the Freudian Nightmare.

>>167339319
Neutering is a purge type! Completely possible way to get rid of the undesirables in our glorious star empire!

And as far as the ship models from Battlefleet go, there used to be a mod on the Steam Workshop that just had models ripped straight from the game. But it's not around anymore for whatever reason. (Probably because the models weren't scaled and everything was significantly bigger than the default ships)

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>>167339717
always good for a post

>>167339717
Most imperial ships have crews in the thousands to tens/hundreds of thousands, and many more automatons/servitors. When a single hive city can have billions of residents on a planet of trillions, in a system home to tens of trillions.. Well, you get the idea. 40k is always OTT on every scale, nature of the beast.

>>167332314
>How does ED help you with that?
I get retention for when random pops migrate to my empire, and this helps them fall in line. Again, you don't get any bonuses for them being different ethos to your empire.

The ED buildings would make them come over, see the shopping mall, and quit lighting everything on fire whenever you do something they don't like. It seems counter-intuitive, because the Hyper-Entertainment Complex is supposed to handle that shit easy. Not true. It counteracts, but does not cure, and basically adjusts the maximum happiness to be above whatever bonus the happiness bulidings give. If their ED is positive they will likely NEVER be happy in your empire, and getting positive ED is extremely easy since low happiness causes more ED which then guarantees they'll never like you again. A base 50% happiness is fine, but if they're diametrically opposed to your empire, they'll find more and more reasons to get upset.

Militarist/Individualist/Spiritualist, Theocratic Republic. Show them Jesus, give them shopping malls, and take planets at will. You won't have to blow Influence on suppressing factions if they quickly forget to care due to your happiness buildings tiding them until their negative ED kicks in, and it lets you turn on certain options like Resettling or Selected Lineages without causing riots or hurting your economy.

>>167340035
yeh but honestly 40k shouldn't be used as a scifi standard because its pretty much space fantasy

>>167340251
Honestly, my favourite 'scifi' is when fantasy crosses over. I find a certain level of self-important 'hard' scifi to get kind of irritating, takes itself too seriously. 40k is at its worst when it treats itself seriously, but best when it toes the line between a consistent setting that understands its own rules & being able to make light of that. Same reason I love the Endless series actually, although they're a lot more understated in certain regards.

In regards to it being a standard, I'd agree in the context of sci-fi, but I think it's the go-to when it comes to silly shit.

>>167339319
>chemical castration
I really hate what they did to the tau. In their original incarnation where they were actually unambiguous good guys they were great and provided a nice contrast to the ridiculously over the top grimdarkness of everywhere else. While being small enough that they were completely laughable and so insignificant the core imperial administration probably still hadn't realized they were a thing.

Then later writers and dumbass fans of all the edgyness missed the joke of them being the only good race in a galaxy of space hitlers and made them into another rinse and repeat faction of grimdark faggots. The only good that came out of that was farsight.

>read Constructor's reviews on GoG
>remember sending thugs to deal with a fire
>read "My tenants complained about the smoke in the house. I sent a repairman and the house exploded, setting fire to my other houses. Exit, read, reset."
HA!

>>167341449
did you forget?
in the grim darkness of the 41st millenium, there is only grimdark

>>167336652
>>167339184

Wait hold up, how does Utopia let us play X-Com aliens or the Tau now?

>>167342948
You can neuter pops and keep them happy with drugs now.

>>167341449
>wanting some weebshit tier space hippies in WH40K

Its not Star Trek you faggot.

>>167343195
It works specifically because it's 40k, that's the nature of juxtaposition. The naivete and hope of the fledgling Tau empire, unable to comprehend their relationship with the greater galaxy and the sheer scale of shite misery that is every other faction.

>>167341449
I think it's more like "the lore was barebones and didn't fit the setting but then Tau got super popular so they expanded it".
The struggle in 40k is not good versus evil, it's survivalists versus expansionists , with Cosmic Cancer in the shadows threatening everything.
Remember ,the entire Warhammer IP is just a toy commercial, it's edgy Transformers , or GI Joe for kids that have started masturbating.There's no moral lessons to be taught , only war to justify decades of kids and neckbeards shoving toy solders ad dice at each other over felt tables.
Even Star Wars/Trek has better lore. WH40k is Harry Potter tier derivative shite.

>>167343195
It's called being the straight man. The contrast serves to highlight how grim and awful everywhere else is by having something actually not grim near it to compare it to.

That the "good guys" are completely fucked on all fronts and only survive by essentially being so small and insignificant they are almost completely ignored just makes it better. Like that time they tried a cultural exchange program with the dark eldar which went... predictably

>>167343734
Got a source on that? Sounds hilarious desu senpai

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>>167342948
https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/index.php?threads/stellaris-dev-diary-57-species-rights.995302/

Battle Thralls sounds pretty good for X-Com aliens, to represent how the Ethereals just run around from planet to planet, subjugating new species, genetically altering them and then throwing them at other worlds as their invasion forces.

Wheras for the Tau, a Caste system and the ability to give alien species limited citizenship (so they can't become rulers, like the Tau Ethereals) while they can still serve in the Tau military through the Military Service part of species rights.

(Also Orbital Habitats sound pretty great for Tau Air Caste shenanigans)

>>167343734
Don't forget the time the Tau tried to peacefully greet the Tyranids. They quickly learned to not do that again.

>>167343734
>cultural exchange program
>with the dark eldar
Top kek.

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Rate my shrooms

>>167343779
I can't remember exactly where but it went roughly like this
>meet dark eldar
>think they're just a different faction of regular eldar
>try the diplomacy route the tau favor
>offer to exchange representatives to aid communication and such
>dark eldar kidnap literally everyone and laugh their way back to commorragh

And that is why them being nice guys makes the setting better than them being another bunch of grimdark space nazis. They get to be the butt of the most stupid shit that everyone else is way to jaded to fall for.

Why does AoW3 lock your class units behind both a building tree and research when you get a full racial unit tree for free? Is it all just to make getting t4 units harder?

Would a mod making all the class unit tech (aside from t4 units) researched at the start negatively impact the game in any way?

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>>167344040
If I remember those traits correctly, you're below -100% growth time, so your planets are going to be filled in literally 1 month.

10/10, would call op.

>>167344069
Being Tau is like joining a game on turn 600+ where you get to have 30 turns alone to develop before you start meeting everybody.

>>167344350
Yeah, but my energy credits are garbage. I take a -25% hit after all policies considered.

>>167344517
who cares? you can instantly colonize planets fully

>>167344040
>medicine
Did I miss something? What's that?

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>>167343734
>>167343424
But being "good" literally doesn't make sense in WH40K universe, not with each other race being the genocidal maniacs they are.

And DESU WH40K lore isn't that grim dark. I find 1984 universe waaaay more dark and depressing.

>>167343692
Fuck off butthurt trekkie.

>>167344764
Its "Ethics rework" mod. Its a civ "focus" of sorts - like space construction , medicine, education etc.

>>167344501
Wasn't their tech level at least pretty alright? I thought their main problem was that they have barely any planets and therefore barely any troops and ressources, which is why the empire doesn't really care much about them compared to end game crises like the Tyranids or Chaos.

>>167344989
Yeah, Eldar genetic engineering and a bunch of what are basically evolutionary/spiritual steriods (that the Tau dont even know about) gave them a massive 'early game boost' essentially. In terms of actual material resources, they've got fuck all. Imperium could wipe em out in a year if they weren't dealing with a literal galaxy of more important concerns. Shit, lot of Imperial higher ups probably tolerate them as a buffer in a certain sense.

>>167344989
Their tech level is actually crazy good, but their empire is tiny. If the Imperium felt like it they could drown them in numbers as they usual do, but with chaos, orks and god knows what running around the Tau are pretty low on the purge-em-all list.

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>>167344897
>point out 40k lore is shit
>somehow I'm a Trekkie
How many toy soldiers do you own?

>>167345501
>>167344897
You're both right, relax. It's just games. We can recognize the flaws in stuff and still enjoy it.

>>167345301
I knew that their tech was definitely above standard issue imperial guard equipment, but those aren't exactly the emperor's finest soldiers. So I wasn't quite sure how it would compare to space marines or ancient stuff from the age of technology.

But I'd say that regardless of their current state, they have the advantage of still having a technological growth. Mankind and tech development seems to have had a bit of a falling out.

>>167344897
>being "good" literally doesn't make sense
But it does? The location the Tau are in specifically enabled them to be good guys.

It's far enough away from the eye of terror to be relatively safe from chaos and the warp is fairly stable as far as the warp goes, tyranids are coming into the galaxy from above and below the galactic plane and are focused on terra due to the astronimicon, not the eastern fringes, the eldar aren't genocidal and quite like the naive new guys around there to manipulate, and the local stars are fairly densely clustered making their rather slow FTL less of an issue than it otherwise would be

And the imperium? They regard them through a full on realpolitik lens, sure they're an issue but a tiny one, black crusades, hive fleets, reactivating necron tomb worlds across the empire, orc waaaghs and so on, are MUCH bigger issues. They treat the Tau as something like ablative armor on their eastern borders to soak up anything that might come from uncharted space over there, with the full intention of wiping them out once the real threats are dealt with. Or they would have that intention if they were big enough that the high lords of terra actually knew and cared about them enough to be able to name them. Which they aren't.

All that shit is why the tau worked as a "good" faction. Ultimately they were naive idealists in a reality where EVERYTHING is awful, not truly comprehending how amazingly blessed their tiny tiny sector of space was for them and blissfully unaware of the reality twisting horrors on the other side of the galaxy and how easily they could be eradicated should any of the real power in the galaxy turn their gaze on them. They are just bit players so far down on everyone priority list that hasn't happened yet.

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>>167345301
>Their tech level is actually crazy good
>Still can't into warp travel

>>167346282
a fraction of warp travel is about technology

>>167346076
Just to put things in perspective, the Tau use plasma weapons as standard issue gear, something that the Imperium uses relativly rarely because they can't build it without a good chance of blowing themselves up everytime they pull the trigger.

>>167346446
did you put that backwards by accident

>>167346479
>>167346282
Humans have a lot of crazy-advanced shit left behind, but cannot replicate/generally don't understand it, and deffo can't develop it. The shit they do have is surrounded in mysticism, but when it works, it's mind-shatteringly good. Tau refused to believe Titans existed, for instance, cause they'd never think that kind of warfare to be plausible. Same goes for the scale of Imperial fleets.

>>167346583
He's right though, warp travel is 10% tech and 90% having psykers to navigate for you and the tau have no psyker ability whatsoever,

>>167344069
>And that is why them being nice guys makes the setting better than them being another bunch of grimdark space nazis.
The tau are't grimdark space nazis, though.

They are grimdark space communists.

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>>167346668
Navigators are genetically engineered, so that's technically technology.

Anyway, Tau just have a high average of widely available technology, mainly because they have such a small population. They still can't really grasp how many humans a single Hive World contains.

Mankind still has technology it can reproduce that shits all over anything the Tau have, from the Ordinatus to the AdMech's various military technologies it equips it's Skitarii with. It just can't give every single mook in it's armies a master-crafted plasma caliver.

>>167346479
Isn't the standard issue gear pulse weapons? I thought plasma was for the battle suits.

But regardless of that, what you can afford to be standard issue is more a matter of scale rather than tech level. A small military is easier to equip with high tech weapons than a giant pangalactic legion of conscripts.

So the main criterium for comparison would be how the Tau's best weapons, armor, ships, vehicles, compare to the Imperium's best weapons, armor, ships, vehicles.

>>167346479
I always liked that aspect of the tau, it reminds me of Asimovs Foundation stuff.

The empire in that series is pretty like the imperium, they build stuff big and functional because they don't need to improve on them, they have the resources to make inefficient shit and it just doesn't matter.
The foundation itself though was, initially, a single planet colony on the rim of the galaxy and just couldn't maintain the same inefficient shit the empire did once things started to go to shit, so they focused on miniaturization and efficiency with the end result that they developed things like a belt buckle sized energy shield that could protect against small arms fire wheras the empire could only build generators big enough that they were static buildings for city defense or on starships.
This eventually results in a situation where warlords are using massive empire battleship relics after the fall of the empire that get oneshot by tiny foundation frigates with superior firepower, durability and maneuverability due to them having actually pushed the tech to its limits.

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>>167346240
>But it does?
But it doesn't.
The second they make contact with anyone from the "main" WH40K universe their ethics and mentality has to make 180 degree change OR they are going to get wiped out.

>>167345501
Yo, calm down butthurt trekkie. Not everyone jacks off to Picard and his evolved sensibilities.

>>167344069
Tau aren't nice guys, they just seem to be because everything else in the setting is so fucked.

It's constantly implied they're just sheltered and niave about the threats of the galaxy and that they'll either have to become maximum xenophobe like everyone else or get wiped out.

Even as it is, they're extremely 1984 in a lot of ways their society is run. In pretty much any other setting, they'd be the bad guys.

>>167347632
There are three canon possible outcomes for 40k:
a green galaxy
a bug galaxy
Chaos rapes everything

>>167347791
>Emperor finally sheds his corporeal form and coalesces into pure spiritual ascendance, as was planned
>The Second Renaissance of the Imperium
Except the High Lords of Terra are fucking scared shitless of losing their power base.

>>167347516
I'm never sure what the Imperium acutally can produce and what it can just keep running. I'm pretty sure stuff like Titans and Emperor class battleships are something the Mechanicus can't build anymore, but I got no clue about small arms.
From what I understand the Imperium is slowly but surely losing technology because people can't build the best stuff anymore and only maintain it through repairs they mask as sacred rituals because they got no fucking idea what they're actually doing.
Which, amusingly, is exactly what happend to the empire in the Foundation saga, knowledge got lost until they were too dumb to even run nuclear powerplants.

>>167347547
Pulse is technically just low intensity plasma tech, it's less powerful than the stuff the empire uses but that's because they actually thought to make it NOT explode on use, figuring reliability was quite important. The bigger plasma stuff on battlesuits does outgun the empires stuff and because they actually understand the tech they use and don't just mindlessly reproduce 20k year old designs, it also doesn't explode.

>>167347692
I was specifically referring to before the retcons that made them always space 1984 when they actually were legitimately good. Them evolving as a species and adjusting their attitudes as they slowly wake up to the harsh realities would've been great. It's that the retroactively changed them into castrating mind controlling space hitlers from the get go instead of them growing into it.

>>167347547
Pulse weapons are technically a plasma weapon, it's a particle accelerator that causes a brief plasma flare when it hits it's target.

>>167346479
But then the Adeptus Mechanicus can field more troops from it's Skitarii Legios than the entire Tau Empire can many times over, and their basic weapons are far nastier than Tau pulse weapons. Skitarii Vanguard and Rangers can both handily outgun Fire Warriors, either by ignoring their armour with magnetic accelerator muskets or hosing them down with a hail of cancer-bullets.

Imperial Guard vs Fire Warrior equipment isn't really a fair comparison given that the Guard as trillions strong and designed to win battles of attrition. A better comparison would be Tempestus Scoins vs Fire Warrior equipment, and then the Imperium comes out of it looking a lot better.

>>167348123
They have a lot of systems, factory planets, huge production bases able to mass-produce these patterns of technology, but they're unable to refine, understand or develop them. The only breakthroughs they get is when they find lost STCs. All of the things listed are still produced by the Imperium, but if they lost the production base (especially if it's limited to one planet for a specific pattern) they essentially lose access to that tech forever. Ryza is a good example.

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hehehehe

i stole their system after finding double shadow play and this was their response

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>>167348123
They can build Titans with the exception of the Imperator class.

Small arms wise, they can reproduce most stuff they have working copies/knowledge of except for things like phosphex and volkite weapons.

It's more a matter of quantity, a lot of their stuff can only be built by a handful of artisans across the entire Imperium. Which like you say, means that every time one of these artisans dies due to the planet being fucked by some catastrophe, they lose an irreplacible piece of technology.

Except for phosphex, because sentient napalm was so scary it's discoverer destroyed the instructions on how to create it.

>decide to play stellaris
>oh hey a new expansion
>read about it
>no longer want to play until it comes out
wew.

>>167348746
>sentient napalm
fuuuuuck that.

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>mfw Dyson Spheres only give you +50 energy

>>167349236
It'll be out i the next month just hang in there

>>167347791
You forgot 4.
>emperor's corpse dies and he instantly reincarnates
>proceeds to actually fix things
>rolls with the godhood because starving chaos didnt work so he might as well overpower them with dat worship
>humans win
>tau exterminated like rodents on his victory lap

>>167349292
STOP IT.

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>>167347950
Don't need the Emprah back anymore, Roboute Guilliman AKA The Saviour of the Imperium is back to un-fuck things

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>>167338926

>Capital of an Empire that envelopes a quarter of the galaxy
>Surface looks the same as we left it

For those unaware, this guy's tweeting information about the Civ 5 rippi- I mean traditions in Stellaris https://twitter.com/dmoregard

>>167349664
Ain't no shame in ripping off good game mechanics, that's what makes the game industry move forward

>>167349358
>Big E dies
>The warp tear in the palace rips open and grows to envelop the entire planet in a few seconds
>Big E just stays dead
>Chaos has a field day and tortures every last human for eternity

>no ur-quan option for xenophobes who dont want to kill
I'd like to be able to push xenos to their home systems and put their homeworld underneath a shield

To the guy doing a Vodyani playthrough and complaining about manpower, do you not know what you get for doing the religious side of the Vodyani quest?

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>>167349664

I don't think that's a problem at all, I quite love the concept of Stellaris Traditions and Ascension policies, it's one of the few things I felt was really missing in the first place.

>>167349475

>mfw you're only allowed to build one tiny Ringworld around a star, and counts as a single 25 tile planet

>>167350170
They confirmed that ringworlds will have 4 habitats, famalam.

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>>167349664
>https://twitter.com/dmoregard
>See all that slacktivism on his twitter.
I wish you hadn't shown me that. Now I won't be able to play the game without constantly what a bunch of fags the dev team is.

>>167350362

Oh yeah, but can the habitats share resources amongst each other so you don't have to sully your research district with farms?

>>167350628
No, they're basically four 25 tile gaia worlds around a star. No unique benefits.

>>167350628
Food will become global with Banks

>>167351671

That is disappointing!

>>167351716

What the heck's a bank? I can have agricultural worlds now?

>>167351716
Oh dont tell me that Stellaris will have some fucking abstract bank that will stockpile food ...

>>167351865
>>167351770
>being this stupid
Banks is the name of the patch, like every other stellaris patch it's named after a famous scifi author, in this case Iain M Banks.

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>>167351770
>>167351865
Not sure if just joking, but "banks" is the name of the update.

>>167351770
Banks is the next update. They're named after science fiction authors, in this case, the author of the Culture series.

Food will be shared across your whole empire, so yeah, dedicated agri-worlds will work.

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>>167351865

Planets should've had an effective "trade" radius where surplus food from one planet can be used on another.

You know, because planets that rely on food shipments are kind of a thing in most sci-fi settings.

>>167352163
>>167352207

How does the global food work? It becomes another resource like minerals and energy?

>>167349664
>browse through his twitter
>waaaaah Trump
>faggot sandnigger enabling
A true swede.

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>>167352163
>>167352207

Yeah man, because having some intergalactic abstract Bank that stockpiles shit and divides it between planets is soooo unheard of in Space 4x.

>>167352270
>Planets should've had an effective "trade" radius where surplus food from one planet can be used on another.
>
>You know, because planets that rely on food shipments are kind of a thing in most sci-fi settings.
Actually it should not.
Small outpost, military base, research station - those could rely on food imports.
Planet with 500 mil - 1 Bn people living on it ? Never in hell.

I liked how Aurora dealt with that - based on terraforming level you had to have more and more people in agri industry and you were left with less for manufacturing.

>>167352270
I assume it remains static and momentary, where more food simply means more growth, but on a global scale rather than individually for each planet. Something like that was inevitable, the idea of food specific slavery only makes sense if you could create some primary cattle farm planet that supplies your empire with food. You don't want to micromanage having exactly 1 or 2, and no more, of that specific species, on every single planet.

Same with habitats, supposedly they're bad at food production, so without some way to import the food, they would be horrible.

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>mfw I want to do another playthrough of Stellaris but the Utopia release is so close

>>167352836
Or is it? It may be in bloody March for all we know

>>167352836
Is it really? Seeing as there's at least one more dev diary en-route I'd say you've got at least a week. Better step on it son.

>>167352836
If you can't powergame 500+ turns in under 6 hours the nwhat the fu c k hydfu ck you doi ns on

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>>167353061
>>167353130

Then in that case I guess it's time to decide what I want to make!

I want to try a Plantoid... But what government, and what racials?

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If there is one thing I really hate about Stellaris it's how playing as a xenophobic genocidal madman is much more fun than playing as good empire.
With the next update and all this new purge stuff I see even less reasons to play as a good guy, because diplomacy is shit and trade might as well not be there.

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>>167349664
Here's some shitty compilation made in MS Paint.

>>167353897

First off, has or will glassing planets get added into the game?

Secondly, Good Empires are actually extremely fun for comfy campaigns focused around expansion, exploration and research.

>>167353897
When the update comes out my first run through will be as an insane xenophobic empire that eventually decides to go isolationist and turn themselves into god machines as their tech progresses, ceasing expansion and becoming extreme isolationists.
>we cybrex now

>>167353897
Depends, I think a lot of those options for purge are meant to give you less extreme ways of managing population. So that could mean that there are more options for non-genocidal empires who wouldn't normally have access to straight up extermination.

>>167354338
>being the fallen empire

>>167353974
>First off, has or will glassing planets get added into the game?
When you MOD it.

How hard could it be to add an option to glass planets for fanatic xenophobes/militarists. With extreme penalties in diplomacy and that one type of fallen empire threatening to stomp your shit if you glass too many planets.

It could also be the default attack for fanatic purifiers.

>>167353919
Fucking nothing.
>cheaper upkeep for frontier outpost
>lower penalty for more planets
Rest is nothing that some minerals can't fix.

>>167354458
Shit, where's my Halo mod.

>>167354575
There are literally TWO Halo mods for Stellaris ..

>>167354458
>How hard could it be to add an option to glass planets for fanatic xenophobes/militarists.

But who could POSSIBLY want to glass an ocean world full of filthy squids when you're playing majestic desert birds?

>>167354436
>after you ascend and once all previous fallen empires are dead, you get an 'ancient' modifier
>any new species that evolves after your ascension will have unique diplomatic options with you
>old species will be butthurt
>you are the 'fallen empire' now

>>167353974
>>167354458
There's already two mods that allow it

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=687358103
This one is a bit basic but lets you actually turn planets into glass. or just nuke them.

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=692855172
This one has a lot more to it. You need an edict that increases ship upkeep to be able to Exterminatus a planet and doing so will make everyone really fucking hate you. It also lets you properly annihilate ringworlds and has a tech that allows for more advance forms of planetary annihilation.

There's also Improved Space Battles's lovely doomsday weapons component
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=720237457
That features lategame weapons capable of destroying all life on a planet, and one capable of destroying an entire system.

>>167354545
It seems like an early game type of tree and faster pop growth is always good.

>>167355052

Of those three, which would you say is worth installing the most? I'm interested in something that allows me to destroy all life on a planet without feeling cheap or tacked on.

I'm guessing the third one?

>>167354458
The problem is that Paradox wants you to be unable to destroy large empires in a single war, that's why the whole warscore system exists in the first place.
Unless you bind glassing to warscore there won't be a way to get it into the game. Otherwise you could just glass every last planet of an enemy and quickly annihilate them.

>>167353432
Play as Plant Megacorp

>>167355279
>The problem is that Paradox wants you to be unable to destroy large empires in a single war

That feels kind of dumb when you consider Wars in Heaven are basically just that, all-out brawls with blisteringly advanced weaponry where the last winner is the one left standing.

>>167355183
Depends, really. I personally run both Exterminatus and ISB.

Exterminatus if you want to keep your ship choices relatively vanilla and available at all times.

Improves Space Battles is great if you want some extra ship types for other purposes than planet-wide destruction and those doomsday weapons are all lategame stuff.

>>167355279
>Unless you bind glassing to warscore there won't be a way to get it into the game
Just have it be 1.5-2x whatever you get for invading and holding a planet. Increased warscore for fear factor.

People who are anal about ending everything in one war can just change that modifier as they please.

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>>167355389

Plant Megacorp with an intense love of mineral extraction and genetic manipulation, how's that sound?

From an Alpine world too.

What do they mean by "planet-rich stars" as a requirement to build a ring world?
Does it mean "any star with at least 1 colonizable planet" or can a ring world be built only in a star system with at least 4 planets?

>>167355817

Ring Worlds need building material, so I'd say a system needs at least four planets (one for each segment.)

>tfw no one to play stellaris with
I get off work in half an hour and I want to play

>>167352594
>Planet with 500 mil - 1 Bn people living on it ? Never in hell.
Trillion people sure but 1 billion can be feed with minimal effort on galactic scale, if anything supplying fleets is more challenging.

>>167355910
Is this what you think or has it been confirmed somewhere?
Also, do you know if we'll be able to build more than one, say, ring world or if these megastructures will be like wonders, aka once per game?
My wet dream would be an entire galaxy where each avialable star has a ring world and a dyson sphere as its core.

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>>167353919
Have some more use of screen cap button and paint.
All bow before my mastery!

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>>167353974

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>>167356650
>Egalitarian
>Allows Utopian living standards
>can't have an autocratic empire where the ruling species lives in almost utopian lifestyle and subjugated races are forced to live in squalor and work their asses off for their masters
YOU DIRTY SWEDES HAD ONE FUCKING JOB

>>167356882
>you'd be able to take out giant empires in one war!
Maybe they should have invested in planet defenses.

Does the ES2 AI build trade companies?

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>>167355279
The problem is dumb diplomacy and war system.
Diplomacy just tie your hands with this retarded war score and forced peace systems and war is just doom stack vs doom stack and who win blow the space stations and then slowly gather war score by blowing mining stations.
>You can't play a space race that ignore diplomacy and galaxy politics and just invade and occupy planets(MoO 2 repulsive trait)
>you can't just send a fleet to bomb some nearby frontier outposts or fresh colonies to show some other empire to keep their dirty hands from this part of space
Problem is that :
>static defenses are a joke, you can't stack missile basses like in MoO(first and best) to fend of invaders or put planetary shield that enemy can't break without anti planetary bombs(MoO, or SW:Rebellion) and be forced to invade planet in costly ground combat(SW:Reb) or put planetary canons that can shoot back at ships who shoot at planet(SW:Reb, MoO, many others)
>fleets don't have limiters, have unlimited range and can fly anywhere
>that make borders defenses a joke even if they were not a weak, don't need establish supply basses or take planets just to let your fleet go deeper into enemy territory(MoO destroy fleets that were cut from their supply/fuel cell/astro nav range)
>fleets are fucking fast so you just run from one side of galaxy to another with a death stack
>no sense in local conflict, local defense fleet that can protect world or trade roads or shipments from enemy raiders or local intrusion, its too easy to concentrate fleet into death stack
>running with doom fleet is the only choice because of this 3d retarded rts type battle system where numbers win, no reserves, no flanking, no communication failures, no command effectiveness - just all guns in one place and if you have more and bigger you win
>it would be better if they drop 3d planar system and 3d rts battles even for something like they have in their other games

>>167357183
Why haven't they added ground to space batteries?

>>167349358
That's headcanon /tg/ wankery from HFY threads, the creators have already stated Chaos eventually destroys the 40k imperium

>>167358368
For same reason lasers are called red and blue. The game is for kiddies.

>>167358841
>That's headcanon /tg/ wankery from HFY threads
It fits with background lore. The Emperor is the reincarnation of every ancient human psyker embodied in one person.

Why WOULDNT he just respawn? The chaos gods do, and lorewise he's stronger than all of them.

>>167359050
a shame that was retconned

>>167359239
im kind of glad i dont keep up with canon

>>167358342
The static defense thing could easily be fixed by buffing the hell out of defense stations and putting in a long range FTL inhibitor that hits multiple systems but only affects warp because lets face it, hyperlanes are already shit in that regard and going from A to B without crossing the space between is wormholes thing. Maybe make it cause wormholes to take a super long time to form though allowing you to easily outmaneuver them unless they decide to go for the well defended inhibitor first.

>>167359303
probably for the best

>>167359050
>b-but but but
Again, your headcanon is just that, headcanon.For all you kow, he's been dead for aeons and everything they say about him defending humanity with his mind is propaganda.
Also, he's not a god, he's just a really awesome dude.

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>forgot i edited some of the human portraits
>pop shows up with horrible mustache

>>167357842
I think so.

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>>167359346
I think it could be fixed by changing travel mechanics.
>basic for all civs is warp drive
>warp drive isn't too fast, can't start in gravity well and can't pass through gravity well, need to be on right edge to jump in right direction, so system defenses are more important
>can build station that increase gravity pull of the star systems making them a strong points/blockers
>empires can build hyper space gates that can connect systems like hyper lanes right now, fast work kinda like roads(can't pass trough gravity well like warp), still need to travel by system, enemy can use them if they hack them but it cost them time
>star gates that are build in gravity well and connect to any other star gates, costly and high tech and with limited capability but can move ships instantly between systems
All civs can get access to them. There is more other FTL like jump drives that are upgraded warp.

Fleets have range. Either supply range, or communication range or fuel cell range. Simply fleet need to operate from range of their supply depot/astro navigational computers. If not they either suffer attrition and decreased stats or get destroyed.

Make fleet composition and fleet orders matter.
>Fleets are lead by admirals that have limited ability to how many squadrons they can lead and how well
>squadrons composition matter and say not having enough of escort ships make your capital one vulnerable kinda like in Stellar Monarch
>change battles from shitty rts into real battles with stages and other shit
>like recon, skirmish, battle etc when some squadrons(by their composition, role and stance) are better performing at
>like stalling is well done by light ships and mine layers
>when pursuit is best for fast battle cruisers
>battles belong to capital ships shielded by escorts

>>167355052
What are other good mods, mod guy

>>167356596
>not Matrioska brains and dyson swarms
>rimjob worlds

Wow, build taller xeno scum. Dont you want to harness as much solar power as possible to gain so much research that you hit multiple singularities and become an AI god?

>>167362589
What're you looking for in particular?

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>Militarists can't displace pops

Fucking why?

>>167362797
Fun events and anything that makes the AI more competent

>>167363385
Militarist doesnt automatically mean you purge without remorse. You can be militaristic and follow a code of honor and be comfortable in war. Jedi from starwars would be spiritualist/militarist for example. If you want to be a dick you gotta go xenophobe.

>>167363385
SERVICE GUARANTEES CITIZENSHIP

would be neat if AI also had a wide variety of laws like say fanatic materialists having a law forcing all pops to get augmented

>>167364004
Displace is just banishment, I think, annd hornorable warrior types get banished all the time, see: Worf from Star Trek

>>167364004
Displacement isn't the same as butchering entire populations

>>167363674
If there's any mods that make the AI not pants on head retarded, I am unaware of them. It'll take some crazy effort to unfuck that mess.

This one adds a nice variety of events.
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=727000451
Has some really neat event chains with nice rewards, the memetic creature is a personal favourite of mine.

This one is just more vents, I won't call it as good as the above one but they work together and more variety is always good. Minus that fucking asteroid event that destroys your science ship and kills your scientist. I lost too many good scientists to that horseshit
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=721416416

If you liked Laviathans, give this one a shot
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=792416294
Gravekeeper one will make you cry in horror but the reward will make you laugh like a madman. I haven't finished the chain with the shielded stupidly good Gaia world (so far it looked like it will fuck me in the ass later on) or started the other two yet but I'd expect good things and suffering from them.

This one is a bit similar
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=818638477
I finished the Aeon chain and it was pretty good but I haven't gotten a chance to take on Eternity Gate yet because shit's brutal.

Do Alignment-dedicated undead in AoW3 even suffer the morale penalty if you don't follow their alignment?

>>167355052
>This one has a lot more to it. You need an edict that increases ship upkeep to be able to Exterminatus a planet and doing so will make everyone really fucking hate you. It also lets you properly annihilate ringworlds and has a tech that allows for more advance forms of planetary annihilation.
>its outdated
reeeeeeeeee.

does it work with the latest patch?

>>167366436
Yep.

>>167355052
Aside from doomsday and graphics, are the other three ISB mods worth getting?

I dont think I want living systems though, sounds like it would rape my pc for no reason

>>167363385
Because they're not collectivists?

>>167366991
It only happens to your systems and you can lower or even disable civilian traffic. Those billboards are pretty nice too.

Haven't bothered with micro jump.

Balance is there to help crises, guardians and fallen empires not get utterly raped by your mass produced titans and organic planet & fleet destroying war machine.

If you're grabbing doomsday weapons then consider grabbing balance. Give Living System a shot, it makes them just a bit more lively and those billboards are too absurd to hate.

>>167367159
and?

>>167349946
If I remember right, I went with religious choice with the second quest and then non-religious for the rest, I remember getting some manpower thing as a reward for the last mission. It was my first time properly finishing a game with Vodyani.
My quest progress was also heavily stalled because the objective planet spawned far away from me inside Craver's territory, who declared closed borders as soon as he saw me.
But it turns out Vodyani can comfortably build all of the food to soldier buildings and get amazing manpower income at little to no growth cost. I had no problems cleansing galaxy after that.

>>167363385
Go collectivist.

Its just me or Banks will fuck any collectivist and xenophobic empire with unhappiness?
Which mean lack of influence and lower everything.

>>167367881
Being martially inclined doesn't automatically make your an authoritarian, despite what hysterical SJWs might have told you.

>>167367965
I'm really glad they introduced branching quests. It gets around the endless ledgend problem of having a near impossible task to fulfill

>>167370389
>Evicting people from their homes is the same as lining them up against the wall and shooting them

>>167370616
Tell that to naziboos who whine over Prussia.
>muh genocide
>what Germs did to deserve this?
>they dindu nuffin

>>167369147
How?

>>167370389
You fucking wot? Military is inherently an authoritarian concept. How can forcefully taking the territory of others through force not be authoritarian?

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>yet ANOTHER 8 Bits game
>8 Bits Arena
If it's over 10 bucks or eurodollars, I won't bother with it.

Also, Cossacks 3 now support the workshop.

>>167371005
Well its their last geyplay paraducks show dev version.
The caste system have pretty unhappy lower caste pops and the way factions form now and their unhappiness is tied with additional influence generation.
Now its pretty simple to have pacified slaves but it looks like in banks slaves will be in unhappy state forever.

>>167371159
Just google "Mandalorians".

>>167371284
>slaves will be in unhappy state forever.
It's not like it's nice being a slave.

>>167371284
The unhappiness should fade with each generation to show them getting used to their condition.

>>167371186
Wow this is literally nothing.

>>167371308
Not an argument desu.

>>167371436
>desu
Fuck off Suiseiseki.

>>167371159
Not exactly.
Citizen militia and warrior caste can be both militaristic.
>>167371371
Problem is that lower caste or serf will be under slaves when they have their own rights, families and reasons to be happy. Not everyone is the winner and sometimes its better to be biggest fish in the pond than bigger(but with bigger fish around) fish in ocean.
>>167371428
It fade now because how ethics works but with single ethic and new drift mechanics it looks like it will be pain eternal.

>>167352836
There's at least a couple weeks on.

>>167371638
What bothers me with the unhappiness system is that even people who have been slaves their entire lives wants a democracy, despite the fact they shouldn't even know what a democracy is.

>>167371638
Stellaris mechanically ties militarism with warmongering. Someone's idea of an isolationist community with above average combat capability is besides the point, Stellaris militarism specifically is a warmongering ideology.

>>167371805
No you get it wrong. They want to become slave owners themselves.
Also Athenian democracy have working slavery systems, plus foreign contract workers and non citizens.
The whole thing that democracy or republic is against slavery is wrong.

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>>167371159
>>167371308
>>167371436
>>167371638
I believe it all depends on the perception you have on your own ethics.

You could be an Authoritarian+Militaristic with a vision of 'Other people should be under our rule because X reasons', where it's more about enforcing your will upon others...
Or you could be an Libertarian+Militaristic Republic with a vision of 'We must secure our our's freedom at all cost' where', where their militarism comes off as more of a Survivalist ideal.

I believe that Authoritarianism is mostly linked with Militarism and Libertarianism with Pacifism because that's how a lot of modern human societies behave and perceive themselves in this day. You also have to take into considerations that aliens will have alien moralities that are completely different from our own.

Militarist societies can also be Isolationists, rather than Expansionist, think the difference between North Korea and the USA.

IMHO

>>167371993
Well it kinda work for Poland(for some time at last) with their Commonwealth.
Problem with Stellaris is that its have to many rigid systems.
Aka automatic diplomacy, completely lack of flexibility, it didn't even use plenty of working mechanic say from EU or Victoria.

>>167372217
But North Korea is typical eastern bureaucracy.
With Emperor, mandate of heavens and bureaucrat caste serving him.

Do Habitats count as planets for the purpose of your Core System cap?

Because I'm getting the sensation they slapped those stations in because too many players wrote too many angrily worded forum posts about finding a single colonizable planet with tons of useless rocks in-between.

>>167372217
Where is the military in a truly libertarian/ancap society? At most you have mercenaries, which is fundamentally different from a military. The only way you can define "military" in a way that doesn't include authoritarian (governmental) elements is to consider any group of people with combat potential a "military".

>>167372504
>core system cap
>system
Come on mate

Also it's a "build tall" thing apparently.

>>167372504
They should change whole system.
I especially dislike how whole system can be barren of any minerals of energy when a shitty planet can produce plenty of minerals of energy where it should be the other side.
Asteroid mining or orbital energy collectors should be thing. Orbital manufacturing too.
Idea of digging and then shipping minerals to orbit from the ground is just too ridiculous.
Planets should be rare and source of skilled manpower when space should provide minerals and energy for ships.

>>167372826
Tall meme needs to end.

>>167372826

You know what I mean.

If you build a Habitat in a system with no planets, does it count as a planet?

>>167373050
I agree but Wiz doesn't.

>>167373061
Yeah, it counts as a planet in every context.

>>167372625
>truly libertarian/ancap society
It waits for a Shaka Zulu to appear.
No seriously read about his rise to power.

>>167372625
>Where is the military in a truly libertarian/ancap society?
Libertarianism =/= Individualism


>The only way you can define "military" in a way that doesn't include authoritarian (governmental) elements is to consider any group of people with combat potential a "military".
Exactly. Those are the Ethics of individuals at working in synchrony with the Ethics of their government.
It's not Authoritarianism if everyone must do a Military service if EVERYONE wants to do a military service.
That's how the ethics of aliens work. This is why they're aliens to us, not just because they breathe methane instead of oxygen their psychology is entirely different to humans. Even humans could share similar ethical values, like >>167373214 suggests.

>>167372625
What are
>vikings
>pirates
>citizen militias
Heck you could probably get fairly number off volunteers even today if you offer cash, chance to advance and get woman.

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>>167336221
Stellaris would be much more interesting if it didn't allow you to just change whatever your species' Habitability trait is out of the blue.

I'd be better if you had to research individual techs regarding each different environment that gave you new buildings, passive buffs, new species traits(without changing your original one), etc that allowed you to improve the habitability of a planet or your species in general.

That would make planets harder to colonize and make planets with your specific habitability requirements much more valuable.

Also, terraforming should be a gradual process and permitted to do on habitable planets, not something akin to a magical wand you flick at a planet and suddenly it makes it perfect to live in. Magical Terraforming wands should be something only Fallen Empires should have.

>>167373348
>It's not Authoritarianism if everyone must do a Military service if EVERYONE wants to do a military service.
This is the dumbest fucking thing I've ever read. Just because everyone up to that point wanted to do service, doesn't that mean that everyone theoretically WILL want to do military service. Under that system, they WOULD be forced into service unless it is changed.

Next you'll say "it's not totalitarian if everyone likes the dictator's rule".

>>167371557
Mother Suiseiseki loves us, she loves me and you and everybody, and through the teachings of her sacred word we will live in harmony and oneness, and ascend into a state of pure anonymity ~desu

When we are all the same mind and spirit~

~desu, the sacred sound, so that it may resonate within us and flow out to touch the ethereal beyond ~desu

the sacred vibration, resonates with the great fiery waters beyond the universe, and touches god

~desu appears embraced in a beautiful chorus of vibration

Mother Suiseiseki is in all things, in all places. You can not imprison her any more than you could cage the wind ~desu.

Suiseiseki cultivates the possibility, ever so gently pulling it from the one all, so that it is allowed to manifest ~desu.

It is through these manifestations of temporary individuality that the spirit energy is made to grow before returning to the great nothing ~desu.

Suiseiseki is all things, and thus the evil is also required~ But it is always the way, that the evil do not know they are only aiding in cosmic unity, because they are driven by selfishness and hate. While the good, know that the evil is also a part of the all. Which is what allows them to be full of love for all things ~desu.

Its in this way, that suiseiseki can favor only one, because where love is given it is got, and hatred breeds death. The duality extends to all depths, even into the heart of suiseiseki herself. So that she needs not give equal favor to each side, even though each is equal in the universe ~desu.

This is the difference between the mind and the spirit, the mind knows not the spirit, the spirit knows not at all, but drives all things ~desu.

>>167374419
So if you're not forced to do the military service, but actually demand to do it because it's within your rights, wouldn't that make you a Non-Authoritarian Militarist?

>>167340770
>Honestly, my favourite 'scifi' is when fantasy crosses over.
What examples is there of this?

>>167370567
I rather like that the majority of faction quest objectives don't require you to interact with other factions at all.

>>167375235
Any of it?
I don't remember when I read any real sf outside of Lem.

What military are you demanding to be part of in the first place? Run by whom, funded by whom, and used to what end?

>>167375554
It doesn't matter.

Anyone who believes in the necessity of a military is a militarist... to some extent. It doesn't matter what it's used for, who controls it, or how it operates.

>>167375772
It does matter, because those factors define what a military is. Like I said, mercenaries or any group of armed people is not a military.

>>167375554
>>167375772
Ethics is not an easy topic specifically because it's not a Black and white issue.
You can have both MIlitarist and Pacifist views that even each other out. Or you could have no opinion on the matter and be more concerned about what color is more moral: Blue or Orange, like aliens might do.

>>167376229
>Like I said, mercenaries or any group of armed people is not a military.
See we don't even share the same concept on what the word 'military' describes.

Wikipedia describes a military as the armed forces of a country. It doesn't go into specifics whether they are beholden to corporations with financial ends or the democratic body of a country's citizens.
Corporatocracies are a thing in Stellaris. That doesn't make their armed forces any less militaristic than the forces of a democratic Empire.

>>167376229
Mercenaries have been one of the most common methods of providing a national military throughout human history.

Modern, first-world militaries are not the sole definition of the word.

Is the craver quest line broken? What do I do with the ship?

>>167383513
If you went the capture route, you have to disband it at one of your systems so it goes into the system hangar.

>>167358342
What animoo is that gif from?

Anyone else not a fan of the whole "building tall" meme? I feel like being able to build habitats will just cheapen the game because you can have a hundred planets in a ten star empire.
What is the point, besides appeasing people who are too incompetent to expand quickly?

>>167383823
Wings of Honneamise.
In which a parallel world's space race is documented.
Even has a moment where a nation tried to stop the launch of another nation's first spaceflight.

>>167383626
Well that's unintuitive, thanks

>>167376593
>of a country
Are you implying a country is not inherently authoritarian?

>>167384461
Remember that the +hp% bonus from infinity shield doesn't stack with itself.

Where can I steal stellaris

>>167385130
Why do you keep seeing things in black and white?

Yeah, of course any form of government would be to some extend authoritarian.
Does that mean that by default no government is libertarian? No, so stop suggesting such a thing.

So, what do we think of the upcoming changes to Ethos in Stellaris?

What is the best luxury resource and why is it transvine?

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>>167387281
They're alright. I wasn't sure at first but I have since warmed up to them.
They basically just changed :

>Collectivism vs. Individualism
to:
>Authoritarianism vs. Egalitariansim

Switching the Ethos to be less based around economical principles and more around the internal power of the government itself.

>>167388756
There's more to it than that.

Egalitarianism isn't the 'get away with everything' ethos now, and Authoritarianism has more reason to be taken as Fanatic than Collectivism did.

>>167388756
>internal power of the government itself
>implying implications
Egalitarianism has nothing to do with the government's power per-se and Individualism has nothing to do with economic principles.

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> Civ V
> Enrico Dandalo leads world congress
> pushes nuclear non-proliferation right before i build my atom bomb, fucker
> look, see Spain, Siam, who I am warring with, have nukes
> fucker screwed me over
> pay vikings and zulus to buttfuck him
> look at viking city
> has 2 nukes
> tfw he can't make any to defend himself

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hey guys, I heard that aggressive early-game REXing is the new cool strat in Stellaris. Am I doing it right?

>>167392362
But Authoritarianism and Collectivism do.

This is one of the reasons why prefer Ethics & Government Rebuilt over vanilla Ethos, since it more accurately represents each of the different Ethos and further divides them and even adds more new ones, even if I think it could use a bit of a tweak concerning the exact bonuses provided by traits.

>>167393805
>accurately represents each of the different ethos
Anon Egalitarianism has historically been associated with extremely authoritarian governments, because the most egalitarian ideal of them all is Communism.

>>167393868
There's still a difference between Collectivism and Egalitarianism just as much as there's a difference between Authoritarianism and Elitism. They aren't synonyms of each other.

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Traditions!

>>167394070
What the fuck are you even talking about? I'm saying that Authoritarianism and Egalitarianism being opposed doesn't make any fucking sense from any angle, just like Individualism and Collectivism doesn't make sense if you think of it economically (it works fine on a social level though).

>>167387281
it's hard to comment when we don't even know the full bonuses each one gives, anon.

>>167387106
Because it's a black and white matter. There is literally no such thing as a non-authoritarian military.

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>>167394105
>>167394187
Pacifist:
Cannot use Unrestricted Wars Policy
Monthly Unity: +20%
Happiness: +5%

Militarist/Fanatic Militarist:
Can use the Full Orbital Bombardment Policy
Has reduced War Demand costs
Army Damage: +10% / +20%
Weapons Damage: +10% / +20%

Egalitarian:
Cannot use Autocratic Government forms
Allows Utopian living standards
Migration Attraction: +25%
Consumer Goods Cost: -10%

Authoritarian/Fanatic Authoritarian:
Allows Caste System species policy
Cannot use Democratic Government forms / Must have Autocratic Government form
Can Displace aliens
Allows Subsistence Living Standard for Citizens
Resettlement Cost: -25% / -50%
Slave Unrest: -10% / -20%

Xenophile/Fanatic Xenophile:
Can always give aliens Full Citizenship / Must always give aliens Full Citizenship
Increased Opinion for other species
Cannot use Full Native Interference policy / Must use Passive Native Interference policy
Cannot use No Refugees species policy
Trust Growth: +25% / +50%
Diplomatic Influence Cost: -25% / -50%

Xenophobe:
Can Purge and Displace aliens
Can Enslave aliens
Decreased Opinion for other species
Cannot give aliens Full Citizenship
Cannot allow aliens Full Military Service
Cannot use Refugees Welcome species policy
Rivalry Influence Gain: +15%
Border Range: +15%

Spiritualist:
Can research Psionic technologies
Can build Temple buildings
Unrest: -10
Empire Ethics Attraction: +15%

Materialist:
Can use Full AI Rights policy
Robot Maintenance Cost: -10%
Research Speed: +5%

Thankfully, it looks like my current strategy (Collectivist/Fanatic Spiritualist) will be even better as Authoritarian/Fanatic Spiritualist now that Sectors won't screw up enslavement thanks to the Caste System option.

What Civs do you always end up killing, no matter what kind of victory you are going for?

I killed Enrico Dandolo my last two games I had him in. The dude just stabs you in the back and makes world congress a bitch and a half. The fact that he can't defend himself kinda encourages killing him.

>>167394156
>I'm saying that Authoritarianism and Egalitarianism being opposed doesn't make any fucking sense from any angle
I agree, which is why I use E&GR.

>just like Individualism and Collectivism doesn't make sense if you think of it economically
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Collectivism
>Collectivism is often portrayed as the polar opposite of individualism, the economic, political, social or cultural autonomy of the individual within society

>>167394489
>E&GR
What's GR supposed to be

>>167394407
>Egalitarian is still the Free Market Capitalist ethic

Really now? Can't they make that a separate thing?

>>167394384
But we are not talking about the concepts behind military bodies themselves, but the ethics ruling their moral compass.

You've completely diverted the conversation from "Militarist Governments will always be Authoritarian as well" to "Hurr Durr the military is authoritarian because it's a society with an established hierarchy".

>>167394565
http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=738611313&searchtext=rebuild

>>167394407
>Cannot use Autocratic Government forms
*squints at Soviet Russia*

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>>167395026
Pfft, that wasn't REAL Communism!

>>167395359
I mean something like Cuba has a lot more income equality iirc and is certainly authoritarian

>>167344897
is there a link to the mod?

how to add torrented dlcs to legic stellaris?

>>167354545
You say it's nothing minerals can't fix but it's intended for the early game when minerals are tight. Also 2 extra core systems by finishing the tree.

>>167395026
>>167395359
Why do people keep equating Collectivism with Egalitarianism?

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I'm the Mycelian Hivemind.
A fallen empire woke up and i did nothing to try and stop it.
Now I think it's too late.
How fucked am I?

>>167396178
Because communism is literally egalitarian in nature, the entire point of that form of government is to Redistribute Oats.

>>167394685
How do you propose having a free market without egalitarianism? If you make laws that some people are simply born with less rights than other people, then it's not a free market.

It's true that you can be egalitarian without having a free market, by giving everyone the same restricted market rights, but it's sufficiently close together that I think it works as a rough abstraction when you're trying to describe complex political systems with 8 different terms.

>>167396215
It will be tough, but if you keep building and researching new tech you will be able to fight them off.

>>167396325
Egalitarianism has two different definitions and that's where the problem comes in
The first is equality in opportunity, the second is equality in results. The first is necessary for healthy capitalism, the second is impossible under capitalism of any kind.

>>167396247
>e·gal·i·tar·i·an·ism
>ēˌɡaləˈterēəˌnizəm/
>noun
>the doctrine that all people are equal and deserve equal rights and opportunities.

>col·lec·tiv·ism
>kəˈlektəˌvizəm/Submit
>noun
>the practice or principle of giving a group priority over each individual in it.
>the theory and practice of the ownership of land and the means of production by the people or the state.

Your suggestion implies that most successful, western modern nations are equal to Stalin's Soviet Union, which is obviously not true.

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>>167396325
>How do you propose having a free market without egalitarianism?
You can have a Free Market without Egalitarianism.

>>167396491
The Soviet Union was both Collectivist and Egalitarian. Do you seriously think Egalitarianism implies individualism?
And Egalitarianism can also mean equality in fact, not equality in opportunity,

>>167396392
They have 250K fleet power. I'm second in the galaxy at 80k. My energy credits are fucked due to the Hivemind debuff.

>>167396450
>The first is equality in opportunity, the second is equality in results. The first is necessary for healthy capitalism, the second is impossible under capitalism of any kind.
THIS.

>>167396597
The second sort of Egalitarianism is the one the Soviet Union practiced, no the one represented in Stellaris.

>>167396656
That still doesn't work against Authoritarianism though
Authoritarianism is opposed to Libertarianism, not Egalitarianism.

>>167396739
HOLY SHIT

NO ONE IN HERE THINKS THAT IS TRUE
WE ALL KNOW THAT EGALITARIANISM IS NOT THE POLAR OPPOSITE OF AUTHORITARIANISM
THATS JUST PARADOX BEING RETARDED

JUST LET ME GO TO FUCKING SLEEP

>>167395842
Skymods my nigga. Its there.

>>167396878
No :^)

>>167396450
>the second is equality in results

Where? The term "egalitarian" in modern days is almost exclusively used to refer to equality of opportunity (in order to differentiate yourself from terms like "liberals" that seem to be more and more linked to equality of outcome these days), and it's also what it used to refer to in its original inception (back when it was about commoners vs aristocracy, the struggle wasn't about every peasant wanting to live in a mansion, it was about how very wealthy commoners didn't have the same rights as the nobility).

The abolition of private property, redistribution of wealth, the idea of class as rich vs poor rather than aristocracy vs commoners, came later with Marxism. Although Marxists do tend to also believe in egalitarianism, so I guess the main problem is that the two sides are not exactly a true opposite.

>>167397053
The idea of it is that if people are born equal, and if people are given equal opportunities, then that both requires and implies equal results.
The best way to solve this problem is to understand that people are not born equal.

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>>167396572
The NAP states that you can not force a person into slavery against their will. Ancap "slavery" is about using your influence to take away the poor people's other options so that they willingly agree to become your slave. They do have the full citizen right to decline and die in the streets, if they so wish.

Unless they owe you money, because not paying back their debt is breaking the NAP. But you're not taking away their rights, they should've known this can happen if they sign the contract.

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TURN 50 SURPRISE WAR.

Fuck off. If it was a Gilgamesh/Tomyris joint war I'd get it, but I'm on this motherfucker's home continent.

fuck this shit game

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>>167397229
Very fair. Much moral fibre. Wow

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>>167394105
I like them.

What I don't like is how bland they are.
They are mostly just bonuses that I already get from the several mods I have installed.

Some do offer interesting incentives, like new buildings or option to form Federations, but there's nowhere near enough of them to make them much different from Tech bonuses.

>>167394892
Military serves the singular purpose of backing government authority with force, therefore a particularly militaristic government is going to have particularly high levels of authority. This is not a difficult concept to grasp. No matter how much you want "militarism" to refer to simple combat preparedness, it is not the case in either reality nor Stellaris.

>>167398289
Not necessarily. In Starship Troopers, it's a highly militaristic society, yet they don't oppress others and are instead okay with hippies settling near bugs worlds.
>inb4 "b-b-b-b-but they killed the nice guys!! soldiers are EVVVIL!!"

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>>167398136

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>>167398398
>citing fiction

>>167398503
>"you need real example before we're arguing about video games and video games are totally real! also robotnik is living somewhere on earth"
You forgot your medication.

>>167398136
I don't like the ones that are just a small bonus to some universal core mechanic (e.g. 10% more research), but I like the bonuses that make a big difference for a specific niche.

For example, -50% time on subject integration, +10% on tribute (which is an effective increase of 40% in gains), Vassals increasing your naval capacity, +5% unity for each member in your federation, halved frontier outpost maintenance, etc. All of these can have an impact on your strategy and playstyle by making a specific action vastly better instead of making a generic action that everyone does (e.g. research) slightly better.

>>167398543
If you want to pull a "militarism can mean whatever I want because video games" then be my guest. That was never the point of the discussion.

>>167398672
>a discussion on /vg/ was never about video games
Good to know I've been wasting my time.

>>167398289
>Military serves the singular purpose of backing government authority with force

In a sense, yes, but that can also be meant purely for outward projection. A military that's unwilling to go against its own people would not be able to be used for internal oppression.

The Roman Republic for example didn't even have an internal military, by law. Military could only be used for outward projection of power and had to be disbanded before going near rome. Only the Marian reforms changed that by creating militaries that were personally bound to individual generals.

>>167398872
So does a military occupation suddenly stop being authoritarian because it's considered an "outward projection"?

>>167398991
Obviously yes? You can't be considered a domestically authoritarian government by acting authoritarian towards territories that aren't fucking yours yet.

>>167399117
>domestically
Goalpost-kun hayai!

>>167399229
Anon governments cannot be ANYTHING if you're not referring to them domestically, the entire point of the authoritarian / egalitarian parts of the ethos wheel is domestic national values and domestic government, you can't be egalitarian when dealing with foreign nations it's literally impossible because the word lacks meaning.

>>167398991
In that case literally every nation, even pacifist individualists, are now authoritarians. Such a definition auf authoritarianism is pointless. Clearly the ethics descriptions are about the internal social structure, not about how you treat your enemies while you're at war with them.

>>167399327
>what is foreign policy: the post

>>167399368
If they're capable of involuntary military occupations, then they absolutely are and they're really not all that pacifistic either.

>Clearly the ethics descriptions are about the internal social structure, not about how you treat your enemies while you're at war with them.
Then why do they directly impact how you'r allowed to treat your enemies while you're at war with them?

>>167399551
>If they're capable of involuntary military occupations, then they absolutely are and they're really not all that pacifistic either.
Find me a single nation that is incapable of military occupation throughout all of history.

>Then why do they directly impact how you'r allowed to treat your enemies while you're at war with them?
Because they're also reflective of your nation's social values, and as such genocide isn't quite valid when you're all for Tolerance, while it is quite valid when you'd rather there be no other species at all.

>what is foreign policy: the post
Wew

>>167399808
A nation is a military occupation, so it wouldn't be called a nation to begin with.

>>167399551
>Then why do they directly impact how you'r allowed to treat your enemies while you're at war with them?

I meant that they're not held to the same standards. Just because you temporarily imprison the captured enemy soldiers who wanted to kill you 3 days ago doesn't mean your nations ethics is "authoritarian", because you restrict the enemy's freedom to kill you. Just because you kill enemies in the middle of a war doesn't meant that in your society "murder is completely fine and encouraged".

A belief in the right to not be harmed, may translate into policies that limit civillian casualties (in Stellaris, that would be the pacifist's "light bombardment only" rule).

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Something about this hero reward seems off.

>>167399808
That would be all well and good, but ethics doesn't just make your people unhappy when you do something they don't like. You're literally not allowed to do it whatsoever unless you have the appropriate ethos.

Also why are you still calling exile genocide when even libertarian societies love the idea of exile?

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Should I go ahead and settle 2 of these planets?
They're all right around 16 size and there's a whole lot of nothing around me right now.

>>167400157
So why does an ethos that enables full bombardment hate when you do mean things to conquered foes?

I'm pretty sure there were plenty of murderous conquerors in history who didn't have racial purity as their motivation. Sometimes you just don't want to put up with other population's unrest and other bullshit.

>>167400131
I would say it's the opposite, nation is the part that does not require military occupation. Nation is different from country/state, just because you own a territory doesn't make it part of the nation. You can have independent national identities within your borders.

Also, are you perhaps an anarchist? Because then it would explain why everything else on the political spectrum looks like authoritarianism to you.

>>167394407
Looks like spiritualist/pacifist/xenophobe for maximum comfy.

>>167400412
>nation is the part that does not require military occupation.
What do you think happens when you refuse to follow a nation's laws?


>Also, are you perhaps an anarchist? Because then it would explain why everything else on the political spectrum looks like authoritarianism to you.
No, I just understand that implicit threat of violence is a necessity for authority. This is even the case regarding what people consider the ultimate authority, God.

>>167398564
Well the "real" changes/boni come from the Ascension Perks. I do agree that there could be a tad more meat on it ...

>>167400230
>Also why are you still calling exile genocide when even libertarian societies love the idea of exile?
>small government with very limited powers
>having the ability to deport people en-masse
Wew

>>167400782
>This is even the case regarding what people consider the ultimate authority, God.
Anon, the thing about God is that he's an ontological being. He's not the one who decides what is right or good, he's not the one who holds authority.
No, he literally is Goodness and Righteousness. He literally is authority. He doesn't need to do anything to have authority. Hell isn't a threat, it's a natural state of being. He doesn't 'send you' to hell any more than gravity 'sends' water flowing downhill.

>>167400230
Libertarians are a shitty benchmark with shitty ideas tbqfh familia

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>>167396656
>This capitocuck thinks capitalism requires or provides equality of opportunity
>Doesn't realise the nature of capital is the groundrock of denying opportunity to the proletariat to maintain the hierarchies of profiteers

>>167401330
There's plenty of instances of people getting outright smited in the old testament though.

>>167401534
The Old Testament's God is a glorified pagan war / fertility deity

>>167400782
>What do you think happens when you refuse to follow a nation's laws?

Are we talking anti-nation or anti-state right now? That's kind of important. Are we talking "Swabia wants to secede from Germany", or are we talking "I personally don't want to be forced to give my employees a day off on sunday"?

>No, I just understand that implicit threat of violence is a necessity for authority.

Yes, but the existence of a police force is not the same as "authoritarianism". Governmental principles are described relative to each other. If every state is "authoritarian", it just means you're using a terrible definition for authoritarian states, because the term then no longer holds any information value.