>games aren't built in C anymore Are today's game

>>387587587
>Are today's game developers just less talented?
Yes

>>387587587
C is basically obsolete now

Yeah

>>387587587
As a consumer why would it matter at all what language a game was programmed in?

>>387587768
This.

Even if you choose not to use C++ there's no practical reason to use C over D, Nim, Rust or any of the other dozen languages that have been developed in the past decade to supplant C. There's absolutely no benefit to be gained out of it besides the possibility that a bunch of people might just know C and not something else, and don't want to learn another language, which basically isn't going to happen.

>>387587587
What does language has anything to do with the games? They can be written in goddamn COBOL or APL or Racket for all I care.

>>387588473
C will always get you bugs. It's just an outdated language not fit for today's video games.

>>387587587
>tfw too intelligent tooo not waste time mimicking RAII with jumps and manual calls to free()

Games are probably the most useful place to utilise OOP because of the ingame objects - code objects bijection.

>>387588861
>C will always get you bugs.

Yeah, maybe if you're a shitty developer

sorry /g/, but the world just doesn't care about your contrarianism. Nobody wants to spend an enormous amount of time installing difficult distros like gentoo, just to end up making minimalist themes for your desktop and windows, while coding small programs no one will ever use in C using crappy editors like sublime

>>387587587
Yes, game development can be done fairly easily now which is a good thing overall because it gives us more games and doesn't prevent those with actual skill from using big boy languages and programs to get stuff done. But, it does mean that the bulk of game developers won't be talented.

>>387589019
It's not suited for games you fucking retarded monkey.

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>Not wanting your games to be written using 8086 assembly
>not wanting your car to run on coal
>not wanting your doctor to heal you using blood leeches

Man, i fucking hate technological advancement, you never get any good by using new techniques that allow you to spend more time on fun features

>>387589019
>Yeah, maybe if you're a shitty developer

This is how I know you're shit. Even the best programmers make mistakes and want to minimize them, it's people who think they're 1337 and so much better than those other stupid programmers who think that they're good enough to get by on their raw ability.

How long until all video games are written in HTML5 and JavaScript?

>>387589320
>features
Gee... It's almost as if it's a separate profession to sit down and program all day.

>>387589387
probably never, javascript is not meant for good memory performance, and html5 can't do jack shit without a controller

>>387589484
javascript is absolute crap in every regard

>>387589387
Runescape 3 ran on HTML for some time. It performed horribly, but I guess it was a step up from CPU-rendered runescape 2

>>387588080

Support is a good reason. It's the language you are most likely to find a compiler for if you're working with microcontrollers, signal processors and the like. Often not much reason to use any more modern language on the smaller of these platforms either.

>>387589096
true /g/entoomen use vim or emacs

>>387587974
No of course not. There are both optimized and unoptimized shit on any language and engines, but """"gamers"""" pretend they know shit about the technicalities of game making.

>>387589432
Yeah, i bet my ass that coding the whole day to fix a memory leak because pointers don't act consistently is more productive than twitching physics engine or creating more tools for game designers to improve the game

>>387589519
>tfw when played thousands of hours of Runescape on my parent's old as shit desktop computer at abysmal framerates
>never cared because I didn't know better

It was a simpler time... I wish I was that easy to entertain still

>>387589567
You have to be very negligent to cause memory leaks and even more so to not fix them.

I know it is a meme, but is Rust worth looking in to or is it going to be dead in half a decade? Seems extremely interesting and syntactically different from other languages.

>>387589567
Memory leaks aren't an issue in modern C++. :^)

>>387589586
It doesn't matter, runescape's max framerate is 50 and everything is rendered at different times.
I never got the 1-second delay on every single action on the clientside, tho. Disgusting.

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>>387589320
tfw can only code 8086 assembly
It's fun!
And easy for my dumb brain to learn

name a worse language than php

I'll wait

>>387589667
I can't tell you if it'll be dead soon, but if you have the time you should learn it anyway.

>>387589523
>Support is a good reason.
True, C is useful as the defacto language that has a compiler implemented for everything.

>Often not much reason to use any more modern language on the smaller of these platforms either.

That's assuming that these 'modern languages' are less flexible, have a bigger runtime footprint and weaker performance than C does, which isn't necessarily the case anymore.

>>387589779
Javascript.

>>387589735
Get the fuck out.

>>387589779
Haskell

>>387589851
What's the matter anon, too dumb for RAII?

>>387589543
Yeah I blame tb and the like for that.

>Python is now the most popular language in the world

This is the sad state of computer science. This is what happens when you let women in.

>>387589931
Haskell has its place, academics can jerk off about it.

>>387589779
fortran

>>387589959
how is that surprising?
python is basically the nicest scripting language right now

>>387589667
>but is Rust worth looking in to or is it going to be dead in half a decade?

Basically, something ought to replace the mess that is C++ for real-time systems, but we don't know yet which, if any, of the new languages is going to win. Rust is being popularized because it's the one currently with the most momentum behind it, but in practical terms I feel like Rust is only worth developing with over the others if your working on something that needs high level of safety requirements and will cost a lot if it screws up.

>>387589997
sad but true
ruby is too sow and hipster, but perl will always have a place in my heart. Everything else is too fucked.

>>387589997
Good luck doing anything other than running other people's code.

>>387589997
>python is basically the nicest scripting language right now

Btu the problem is that that's all its good for. There are vastly more powerful dynamic languages that can provide ridiculous levels of power and flexibility, but people have just decided to use this instead. It's even supplanted LISP as the language most important for AI despite all the benefits that would be gained from it retaining this status.

>>387590158
lisp is a meme from the 70s

Because 75% of all CS/CE programs in the US are $60,000 diploma mills that shit out 'programmers' that have only learned how to badly use Javascript

>>387590158
How could lisp be more useful for AI if everyone just uses neural networks anyway?

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You have 10 seconds to explain why you're not making your game in Panda 3D.

It's open source and supports scripting in both Python and C++. There is no better option as far as engines go.

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>muh safety
there is any better sign of a shit programmer with a second degree in women studies?
Of course that C isn't suited for game development, all game developers are the bottom of the barrel as programming goes. A game is not something that needs to be reliable at all.

>>387589096
Really? Because I just started my first job 3 weeks ago and have to program entirely in C. The whole team uses vim (or some of the older folk use vi) and the codebase is entirely C with the exception of some files which are PowerPC or x86-64 assembly.

>>387590375
because I use godot

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>>387590436
> all game developers are the bottom of the barrel as programming goes. A game is not something that needs to be reliable at all.
Yeah it's not like video games have incredibly competitive semi-hard real time performance requirements or anything. Making a video game is fucking easy.

>>387590193
>I haven't actually used it at all or otherwise just wrote a bunch of school exercises in scheme

Sucks for you.

>>387590249
>How could lisp be more useful for AI

Because, even if the bulk of the execution time is in tensorflow or something that uses GPUs, you still benefit from having a highly flexible description/data manipulation language to pair with that, simply because this is good regardless of what you are programming in general. If all you are doing id manipulating some parameters anyway, then it probably doesn't matter, but if you are doing any kind of serious, exploratory programming where you want to be able to arbitrarily manipulate how the code executes as easily as possible, there's little downside to having that.

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>>387590436
>programmer with a second degree in women studies
Tell me more.

>>387590436
>Dur, what's a zero cost abstraction?

>>387587587
yes, and less ambitious

>>387587768
no it's not, it's still the cleanest and best performing language

>>387588861
bugs are a reflection of the programmer, not the language, however languages like java were invented so careless idiot programmers would have a job, even if it meant everything runs slowly and uses up loads of memory

>>387588473
if you want your game to run at 60fps, it matters

>>387589112
there's more games written in c and c++ than anything else

>>387589387
most games will likely be clang compiled to webassembly and have 70-90% of native performance, computers will keep getting stronger, but devs and gamers will keep trying to max out future hardware and native/compiled will always shit on javascript, so never

>>387590449

C is very common in embedded and systems programming and is an essential skill to have. Wether that is a good thing is up for debate. Personally I don't care much, it does the job for me. Maybe it's because I'm from an EE background, having autistic meltdowns over programming languages seems more like a CS thing.

>>387590627
Stroustrup's biggest lie.

>>387590552
Games are an entertainment product that are often designed to be sellable for a year or two and then forgotten about for the sequel. They have nowhere near the same requirements as, say, a critical piece of software in an air traffic control system that is expected to have a minimum 20 year lifespan.

>>387590624
would this even fucking run without #include and int() or whatever the fuck?

>>387590739
They don't have to be 100% reliable but they're not bottom of the barrel "apps" thrown together by pajeets with no regard for performance. Talent is required to program a good game.

>>387590671
I did not for a minute intend to defend C++ specifically. C++ is absolutely the wrong way to go about creating a successor to C and most of its abstractions have huge meaningful costs, at least in terms of how they force you to structure your program and the consequences this has.

This hardly means that it isn't possible to make massive improvements over C though.

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>>387590804
It would in Java at least.

>>387590861
So how would you improve C?

>>387590552
>look at my exception confirming the rule
also that case you posted it's a big fucking middle finger to any safety-abstraction fag ever, so good job driving home my point
>>387590627
a thing that works only in nice examples in your meme languages, roastie. Go complain on github about master/slave terminology

>>387590643
Probably true. I'm the only guy at the job with a computer science degree, everybody else has EE. My friends from university shudder at the thought of a job working in C, but it's fine by me. I find embedded systems interesting and I like C, but I'd do my best to learn any language if it is the apparent best tool for the job.

>>387587768
so fucking wrong, oh my dog
I see job offers with C skills requirement every fucking day

>>387590904
https://dlang.org/
https://nim-lang.org/
https://inductive.no/jai/

>>387590804
Yeah, that's what's wrong with it. You figured it out. Good girl.

>>387590979
>GClang
>GClang
>vaporware
lmao so much for your zero cost abstractions

>>387590904
Not him, but I think RAII or Go's "defer" are a step in the right direction, which would eliminate half of explicit goto's in C code.

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Brainlet here what fucking language do you guys WANT people to make games in?

>>387591227
Haskell

>>387591128
> Go's "defer"
Could you give me an example of this?

>>387591227
python and java

>>387591227
C++ is the only reasonable answer for something that isn't a shitty indie game.
But C++ is an ugly hunk of shit and there's nothing that can replace it.

>>387591227
Lisp

>>387590643
I looooove C
I don't understand when people are scared of it, do they just suck at pointers?

http://www.woohooitsbacon.com/10-reasons-why-c-is-still-the-best-programming-language/

>>387590739
computers were invented to play videogames on

>>387591227
lmao 4tram

>>387591342
>4. If you know C, you know C++ and Objective-C
fucking lmao

>>387589019

shut up fagget nigger monkey you don't even know how to write your own compiler/decompiler you nigger fagget. Can you draw a cirlcle with 1 line of code? No you can't, stfu you nigger monkey fagget you don't even know shit about coding. Literally who the fuck are you? You're nothing just a mediocre piece of shit with no worth not even 1/10000000000000000000th close to being anywhere near Linus Torvald or Richard Stallman, fuck off little nigger fagget you don't even deserve to be on a computer your dumb nigger fagget brain can't even comprehend such technology.

>>387591227
Real answer: C++.

>>387591227

Ruby, It's Japanese which means its sugoi that means cool for all your EOP gaijins out there

>>387591445
Terry is that you?

>>387591402
desu I didn't even read the article, but I'd use C styled code as much as possible in those two languages, it's nice that C code is directly supported in both

I hate obj-c's syntax

>>387591445
hey terry
you should stop using random number generators as an "oracle", it's actually pagan practice and I think the bible speaks out against it

>>387591694
There are people who write C++ without knowing C. They don't really use those bits.

Their code is godawful.

>>387591581
Too bad Ruby is SLOW AS FUCK

Why aren't you writing your own language?

>>387591623
That's not me Sean.

It's just the same with every field in Video games. If the person is good or even just competent at their respective job, they're working in real fields and positions. Video games are where 90% of people go when they fail to do this.

People who can actually program work in the big leagues as software engineers and shit.

>>387591876
I don't even understand how assembly works.

>>387587587
Why do you care which language the game is programmed in.
Do you also complain about different engines like Unity, UT, Source, etc?

>>387591259
Sorry for the late answer. I think Go's docs explain it well enough: https://blog.golang.org/defer-panic-and-recover
tl;dr you can defer calling some function (usually closing a handle) until the end of the function, and you don't need "goto error" most of the time with it.

>>387592090
or maybe they just find videogames more interesting to make than accounting software?

but as a sidenote, doesn't it feel like all software is getting less reliable and more buggy in the past 5-10 years?

is it the influx of new coders who think they know everything and try rewriting all legacy code in their new favorite language without any consideration for what the old code did

and too many programs sacrifice functionality for simplicity, I want my fucking options when I need them!

fragile people write fragile code

>>387590901
>else return 5
wait a minute........

>>387592528
So it's like a try-with-resource of with statement.

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Why aren't you writing your game in the thinking man's language?

>>387592703
I don't write in DEAD DOG

>>387592638
I'd say it's a dynamic "finally" of a functionn. But yeag, your analogy works too.

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>>387591876
>tfw brainlet who learned C like five years ago and just programs on and off for fun
>finally put in some work and learned how to write my own memory manager and emulate a vm
>now going through a book learning how programming languages are implemented
For the first time in years I finally feel like I'm getting smarter.

>>387590624
>>387590436
is there a collection of these? I want to see if I can solve these problems and see how I differ from the bad solutions.

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>>387592853
This is my favourite one.

>>387592951
>dat memory leak
Why do morons malloc every little thing anyway? It's like the more they call heap functions, the dumber they are.

Someone post the Yandere Sim source code, that is the epitome of bad programming

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>>387593167
You asked for it.

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>>387593249

>>387588956

C isn't OOP.

>>387588956
Elaborate on how in a world where we use ESC all the time and there's absolutely no way to make OOP objects do that component construction efficiently other than having a clumsy wrapper that initializes and references an AOS behind the scenes?
No? You can't? Then shut the fuck up. You know jack shit about this.
Not to mention the syntactic difficulty in doing all that work through an OOP interface. That's probably the real killer honestly. People do stupid shit all the time as long as it's a least effort approach.
>>387588863
>RAII
Waste of time. It's a huge programmer overhead which doesn't deal with the real issues. It encourages individual level allocation. Woefully inappropriate for games.
>>387589096
This is clearly not /g/. At least not /dpt/. The intersect of the lesser parts of /g/ and /v/ is quite high.

>>387592951
>yfw Source engine had the same buffer overflow in it

>>387591801
As C++.
As code it's great.

>>387593119
It's because alloca is slightly inconvenient and people are taught to fear it.

>>387593434
Why would you even need to use alloca outside of c89?

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>>387593249

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>>387590624
>Looking at this before and after reading SICP and solving the problem for coming up with an algorithm for multiplication in logarithmic time
It hurts more than it used to. Christ.

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>>387593479

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>>387593530

>>387593454
It's _the_ method of stack allocation.
>outside of c89
That's _the_ standard of C.

Sure you could use VLAs and cast a bunch. Overall VLAs are cleaner. That's why they exist.
For this case you don't need it but you must understand that programmers need patterns. If you break the syntax for statically known size and dynamically known size you'll have programmers make mistakes. This wasn't known way back.

>>387593434
I'm not talking about stack space vs heap space, I'm talking about needlessly fragmenting memory to save yourself a few minutes of thinking ahead. Reading about zone memory implementations really opened my eyes to these kinds of things.

>>387593479
>>387593530
>>387593575
why does this guy put everything in if else statements? Can it run at 30 fps? I'm no expert programmer, but seriously, this is female tier coding.

>>387593695
Yandere dev seems to have fallen for the "just like make game" meme. I'm actually glad that he has SOMETHING to show for his troubles, but there comes a point where you start having to know your stuff without horribly making a code structuring and/or performance mess.

>>387593634
As long as you're naming your variables correctly I don't think you'll be confused with static vs dynamic array size.
Besides the scoping of alloca is fucky, I'd rather not deal with that akwardness if I don't have to.

>>387593638
If you're talking about that it's completely unrelated to the post other than the fast that malloc is used. I know all about memory fragmentation.
Doing stack allocations is a perfect way to avoid it in cases like these.

You absolutely shouldn't have your RMM allocate in this situation. I can't think of a situation where that'd be a good solution. Stack allocations are faster. Even if you're just a pool allocator. (because known adress ranges are important for compilers, especially for platforms with relative addressing)
>>387593695
>female tier
Nothing wrong with females. I haven't met a woman who produces code like this.
>>387593840
>yandere dev
People don't realize that a loose collection of his fans could outperform him in a month or two. He's given so much work for free.
>>387593916
I don't think you understand the problems here.

>>387587587
I can't tell if this is /g/ raiding /v/
Or if /v/ is truly this shitty of a place that people pretend to be good at programming.

>>387587587
As hardware performance peaks due to the physical impossibility of packing silicon any further, developers who actually know how to manage memory will increasingly be back in demand, and the "do everything in js" millennial numales will be out in the cold

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>>387593967
>Nothing wrong with females. I haven't met a woman who produces code like this.

>>387593967
m'laaady.

>>387593530
brainlet here
explain how to do this properly

>>387590979
>jai
lol

>>387594093
>>387594150
Maybe you wouldn't be jealous little boys if you worked on programming.
I can't imagine any of the women I know writing code like this. They're very structured and spreading behaviors like this just wouldn't do for them. I think one of them are going overboard but it's certainly better than the opposite or this example.

>>387594195
EyeColor should be an enum rather than a bunch of strings for one thing.

>>387591097
>vaporware
You have no idea what that is apparently. I find it strange because it's such an incredibly clear concept.
>>387594209
JAI is a good language from what I've seen. It had very solid design goals and a good methodology to reach there.
And luckily his view isn't corrupted by simpletons who wish to see language features from their favorites in the language.

>>387593249
>>387593530
has this guy never heard of enums?

>>387594304
Is there a Jai compiler I can use?

>>387594227
>Maybe you wouldn't be jealous little boys if you worked on programming.
I have a job programming?

>>387594195
A hash table.

>>387590949

to maintain ancient applications, that would not be made in c if they were to be replaced.

or maybe COBOL is still a living and relevant programming language.

>>387594227
t. reddit neet

>>387593695
I'm sure the code started out simple and kept growing one if statement at a time, until it was too late

if statements run quickly though, it's just hard to manage if you decide to change what things do later

>>387594464
Not sure where the misunderstanding is here. I didn't presume you were employed. What I presumed was that you knew enough about programming to pretend you know better than women in general. Perhaps that's wrong.
>>387594536
No I haven't gone to digg.
If you think holding egalitarian (for real) opinions is a reddit thing you're absolutely wrong.

>>387591227
Anyone who doesn't use Haskell holds back our species' development.

>>387594428
Not available for public release.
>>387591227
I wish everyone had to program games in asm.
It'd make me lots of money and it'd limit the amount of people who think designing and making games are completely orthogonal to one another.

>>387594717
So why are you shilling it?

>>387594717
Brainlet detected.

>>387594610
what's your favorite programming subreddit?

>>387594756
>shill
Because I think it's a good idea?
You can have the same critique about any philosophical subject.
And I don't view my posts as shilling. It's presenting what's clearly just opinion in a way that leaves room for uncertainty.
>>387594970
Do they have any about esp8266? Probably that then.

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>>387593967
>Nothing wrong with females. I haven't met a woman who produces code like this.
'tis a great thing that there are ladies who code! Don't mind me, I'll be the one in the kitchen :)

>>387591227
Prolog.