I doubt I'd play any pokemon games if I hadn't played the first few gens so much from the start.
That being said, there's something lost to the magic of the game. Instead of just grabbing a mon that looks neat and leveling it, you google it, check it's stats, get a movepool, breed for ~3 hours, EV train and pump up to lvl 50 now. Anything less and you feel "uncompetitive."
But maybe I've just gotten old and hate fun for fun's sake.
>>257507959 I was just thinking about something similar today where pokemon is a type of RPG, right? But unlike most RPGs you have a minimum of 150 available party members who usually can only fight in one on one battles. Why aren't there some RPGs with a shit ton of human party members you can get? The only ones that jump to mind are I think Suikoden and Chrono Cross.
>>257507959 Mario is good, but it's an incredibly tired formula because it perfected 2d platforming too quickly and had no room to improve, and set the standard for 3d platforming, but did the same thing.
Pokemon could definitely have some improvements, and it definitely seems like a rehash series to someone who doesn't keep up with its intricacies. But each new game tweaks little things to counteract overplayed strategies as well as add small touches to make each game unique. But the core game is always the same and it feels repetitive.
I have nostalgia goggles, but they aren't tinted.
Also, nothing is a bigger rehash than cawadoody. Literally the same mindlessly garbage game rehashed every year like clockwork with DLC out the asscrack and spawning the most obnoxious wannabe-military expert dudebros that snicker at your taste in games because you woulx have to be some kind of babby faggot to not play anything else.
>>257517335 Yeah, but what about remakes and stuff like third versions? Since 2007 we've got Diamond/Pearl Platinum Gold/Silver remakes Black/White Black/White 2 X/Y and now this year: Saphir/Ruby remakes That's 7 games in 7 years
>>257507959 I think Mario games and Pokemon games generally have enough new content to merit not being called rehashes. A lot of Mario games are real gems and there are far lazier sequels out there and tons of different and good spin-offs
Pokemon, I don't know, it's hard to tell. I think if you played the newest one, you'd play the next, but wouldn't rush to go back and play the old ones. But I don't think that necessarily means that they're rehashes. The games just don't hold up after an update without the nostalgia factor.
For Pokemon, I probably wouldn't get into it because it would be too much to process and catch up on. But as someone who has played it since the beginning, I love the new species, regions, music, mechanics, abilities, etc that each new generation brings.
Mario, yes, definitely. Those games are solid and simple, pure fun that just about anybody can enjoy.
Neither are rehashes, outside of maybe the NSMB series, and the hate for that is way higher than necessary.
I know I'm in the minority here, but my console was the PS1 and have been a Sonygger all my life, never touching a Nintendo game.
I played a Nintendo game for the first time in 2012: Super Mario Galaxy. And I fucking loved it. For the past two years I've been mostly binging on Nintendo games, old and new, which I sorely needed to catch up on. Zelda, Metroid, Pokemon, all of them. I can definitely acknowledge that not all games in these franchises are good but for the most part they're consistently great. I really wish I had an idort life growing up now.
>>257524164 Well, I actually finished the main story of White and never touched it again. I rushed the game pretty much and don't even know half of the pokemon. I saw White 2 for 10 bucks a few days ago, but since X and Y are out, I don't think I could really enjoy the game.
>>257523663 Holy shit man, I'm doing the exact same thing in reverse. I just finished Kingdom Hearts and it blew my mind how fun it was.
As for OP, a good game is a good game nostalgia or not. People need to loosen up about their favorite games and accept all opinions whether they agree or not, always remembering that it's special to them for reasons nobody can dispute.
>>257525167 Well, I grew up with Playstation 1 and NES/SNES. I liked the original Mario, I fucking loved the Pokemon anime, franchise and the idea of collecting monster and leveling them up.
For some reason though I absolutely had no interested in later Mario games, I tried to get into Pokemon during GBA era and found it to be very bland as well.
I've recently bought a 3DS and just wanted to confirm my feeling for these series, I still has no interest in these games but seeing how much they're being praised and being recommended as must play I'm a little confused. But I guess I won't be getting either after all.
>>257525574 Don't try to force an interest, that will only make you more sour on the series' than before. If it's not for you then so be it, don't let people tell you what you are supposed to like. I know this is /v/ and those are meaningless words here, but it's the same thing with the board. If everyone keeps trying to force the same interests we end up with the same thread over and over where the same games go under the same scrutiny and praise forever.
Just play the games you enjoy and if you like them, start threads about them or whatever. I hate to see people forcing themselves just because pushy people think the things they like are perfection and mandatory. You can respect the impact and design of Mario and Pokemon games without liking or playing them, and that's a-ok.
>>257512643 No you're right anon. When I got my friends back into Pokemon, it was fun. Then they started EV training and IV breeding. We couldn't have fun battles after that. Their Pokemon were just leagues better than mine. There wasn't much point to the battles anymore when my Friend's Blaziken would just sweep my entire fucking team. I can't imagine it was that much fun for him either. All he had to do was press the same move to win 6 times. Before those times, playing with our non IV or EV thought out Pokemon meant an element well roundedness kept most of the Pokemon on a relative level playing field where our unique team combinations, moves, and Pokemon made the battles interesting and fresh. Once there was a clear difference in the innate abilities of our Pokemon, it was like an NBA player going beast mode in a friendly game of 21. An F1 car vs a Prius. >inb4 git gud Ain't nobody got no time for that.
>>257526431 I EV train my Pokemon and battle with friends who EV train theirs. It's fun to try and break highly competitive teams with less-used Pokemon. Or at least, for me and my friends it is.
I will agree that it kind of sucks the soul out of the game, though. Individual Pokemon no longer feel special. I keep the mons I went through the game with, but then I keep finding them to be a waste of space in the PC.
>>257526701 I would love to play with some interesting strategies of EV trained and (maybe) even IV bred mons. I'm not mad that my friends do it, It's just kind of lame when they know you aren't trying that hard and then they bring in their A-Team. I already have an idea what kind of team I eventually want to put together once I get the time to really get into breeding and team balancing. What ended up happening was that the first friend I brought in wasn't interested in EVs and IVs either until my other friend got into it. Once he got killed by my friend's EV/IV team, he started getting into it. Then another friend got back into Pokemon, curb stomped both of them, after a little more time, they dropped it altogether.
>>257528667 I frequent /vp/. Been there since that first bulba post actually. I'm actually a pretty big fan. I don't generally go on showdown threads or wi-fi general but I did get a nice shiny treecko from some good anon in anticipation for ORAS.
>>257529228 In a turn based strategy game, it's hardly a big deal. It was also Game Freak's first jump to full fledged 3D models instead of sprites. That said, you are pointing at one hiccup. Do you have any other anecdotes because I've played all generations of Pokemon and by and large, Game Freak seems to put out well polished games.
>>257529436 I believe it was Iwata that had to come down and work on G/S because Gamefreak couldn't fit all of Johto on one cartridge. Iwata shrank it so much that they decided to throw on Kanto too since they had room. >fps doesn't matter cause it's an RPG It makes the game look like shit, and adding to the fact that it isn't a graphically demanding game at all makes it unacceptable, especially from a gigantic company like Gamefreak.
>>257529581 You should have brought up the first games which are notorious for having a lot of bugs and glitches. Now you are bringing up examples from when the company was still new. Regardless, Game Freak took steps to have it properly coded. The Game Freak of 1999 isn't the gamefreak of 2014. It's bigger and more resourceful. RSE, FRLG, DPPt, HGSS, BWB2W2 all seemed relatively well put together. It's not as if any game isn't without it's faults. Not perfect=/=shit >and adding to the fact that it isn't a graphically demanding game at all makes it unacceptable It's a 3DS game recall. Also it probably uses a lot of data just on the 700+ pokemon alone and the battle mechanics. The FPS drops are usually in horde battles and even then it's noticeable but not "shit". It doesn't make the game look like "shit". I really wanted to hear why you felt that way because I haven't heard anything about modern GF being shit at programming before. I wasn't expecting hyperbole.
>>257529928 >People only like it because it's babby's first RPG. Whenever I hear people say this I know they are talking out of their ass. Something on the order of 718 different party members in any combination of a 6 member team. Each has access to some dozen moves; 4 at a time. Each has one or more possible unique abilities. 6 different visible stats, and a few that aren't apparent. DIfferent status effects; burn, paralyze, sleep, and so on. Effort values, and individual values. Held items. Type effectivenesses. Forme Changes. Priority. Weather. Double battles. Go try to battle someone on wi-fi and see what happens.
>>257530785 I get wrecked by a point-pinching OU-toting autism with way too much time on his hands? The people who actually care enough about the game's mechanics to grind invisible statboosting tasks for every Pokemon for months is a very, very small minority. You did not play Red or Silver with intricate knowledge of the system, or multiplayer for that matter.
>>257531073 Babby's first RPG refers to the fact that people are blown away by everything mainstay to RPGs - Leveling up, the presence of a story and characters etc. Thing is, with those other games, the fact that they're baby's first RPG is hardly the main focus at hand.
>Paper Mario: TTYD Fantastic writing and very creative.
>FF7 Revolutionary approach, modernized the entire genre.
>FF6 Unique interpretation of steampunk, broke many typical RPG clichés.
>Chrono Trigger Simply a masterpiece.
>Pokemon Grinding and tedium. Barebones RPG with quantity before quality.
>>257531162 That didn't stop it from advancing as rpg. People don't just say this because it was their first rpg. It isn't like most rpgs. People don't play it for it's great story or characters. People play it for the hundreds of monsters with unique attributes. They play to explore the region and collect. They play for the competitive scene. It's a little ignorant to think that Pokemon has maintained it's spot in the industry solely on nostalgia.
>>257531506 No, it has maintained its position based on marketability and absolutely rabid fanbase. You're extremely naive if you think quality is what keeps Pokemon going, not even Mario has that luxury. Galaxy 2 got beaten by the vastly inferior NSMB in every regard.
>>257531447 I think you misunderstand the appeal of pokemon. It doesn't appeal for the usual reasons most rpgs appeal to people; story, characters. Pokemon like other great rpgs has deep battle mechanics however it can also be easily accessible. How many other games can appeal equally to casuals and tourneyfags, children and adults? The story and characters in pokemon are pretty bland and redundant. But people love pokemon because people love to customize, they love favorites, they love variety. >grinding and tedium You described the whole genre of rpgs. Pokemon doesn't require you do any obscene amount of grinding to get through the main story. It just happens to allow different styles of play and post game content.
probably not. to be honest with you, i think the only reason i liked pokemon r/b+g/s is because i could remember the first time i heard the anime theme and fell in love with the show when i was like 8 years old.
i remember freaking out when i saw a mew sprite after getting missingo and cheaking my elite 4 record.
It seems that people who call Pokemon a rehash tend to be the people that know very little about it
Yes, the series follows the same general progression of collecting badges and defeating the evil team/Pokemon League in the main games. That's part of what made the original games stand out. It's not like they don't make games without that, they make lots of them and they're called spinoffs. The same thing happens with plenty of other series but nobody ever seems to call that out.
Despite following the same kind of progression the games differ greatly mainly in the optional content. Emerald, Platinum, HGSS, and BW2 are all games that I think to be great and arguably the best in the series because they all have different optional things to do in them. Emerald has the best postgame battle area with the original Battle Frontier. Platinum has a largely expanded story from DP and a fair amount of postgame content. HGSS fixes some of Gen 2's biggest flaws by making Kanto into an actual second region with plenty to do, even just simply maintaining the original content from RBY/FRLG, while also adding a lot of extra content to Johto to make it less barren, notably a Battle Frontier and the Pokeathlon. BW2 has the Pokemon World Tournament and a massive postgame checklist, from tons of legendaries old and new to unique concepts like Black Tower/White Treehollow. If Game Freak had any sense they'd simply add on to the content with each new game rather than removing things regularly, but at least it makes the older games worth replaying.
As for the competitive scene, they actually make a large effort to make drastic changes to the metagame with each new generation, from gameplay mechanics like the Physical/Special split in Gen 4 to simply adding more diversity in moves and pokemon. It's a testament to that design that the usage rates and cookie cutter teams of each gen are vastly different and that people still play simulators of all those different generation metas.
>>257535640 > It's not like they don't make games without that, they make lots of them and they're called spinoffs. The same thing happens with plenty of other series but nobody ever seems to call that out.
It's the same template with significant differences. If you think it's the same game every time then that boils down to you not liking the core mechanics and therefore naming any differences that exist as superficial and unimportant. Not sure what other way to say it considering that you're stating something I already addressed in my initial post.
>>257536391 Pokemon games do have a story. It's always been very minimalistic with the exception of Gen 5. You're confusing a simplistic overarching goal with a story. I already pointed out plenty of other things that change in each gen, and of course I'm defending it, why would I claim any different, and why is surprising in the slightest when people are so eager to nitpick Pokemon in particular compared to other series and do so in a way that simply parrots widespread opinions rather than provide their own thoughts? You know, like you're doing. If you wanna complain about rehashes so much why not start with your posts?
>>257536391 pokemon game mechanics change plenty, sure its still a turn based rpg but why should it be anything else? Majority of sequels these days change their gameplay less than pokemon does. usually major gameplay changes only happen when there's something fundamentally wrong with said gameplay, an issue pokemon does not have
>>257507959 Yes. I don't even necessarily like games I happened to grow up with. For instance, Super Mario World was my first game ever, and I consider it a far more inferior game than, say, Yoshi's Island, which I played first when I was older.
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