/tgesg/ Weekend Elder Scrolls Canon Discussion

>given the mysticism treatment
We were all there! We saw it with our own eyes! It was real and canon!

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>>55200366
>Given the Mysticism treatment.

Someone explain his argument to me, so I can be sure I have it right. Currently, it seems absurd.

1. Merry Eyesore, the Elk was a kirkbride nickname.
2. Elks have antlers.
3. Kirkbride is associated with vivec
4. An ad buy mentioned a popular zone in TESO called vivec's antlers
???
5. Therefore, c0da is canon.

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>>55200648

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What happened to Skakmat after Daggerfall? He shows up for five seconds with Queen Dowager Nulfaga at the Battle of Cryngaine Field to give King Gothryd cover and then just fucks off never to be seen again. He wasn't even acknowledged in any of the Blade's texts in Skyrim like Nafaalilargus was.

Tell me everything you know about Menevia, the city and eventual county of Wayrest.

>>55200648
>vivec's antlers
Is he a wood elf?

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old thread: >>55170764
also, here's a higher-res (perhaps a bit too high) version of the senchal concept art I posted in the last thread (it's not mine btw)

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>>55201307
Wayrest is a large multi-leveled port city located strategically at the top of the Illiac Bay, founded not long after Daggerfall by the Gardner clan as a little more than a fortified merchant enclave some time around 1E 800. Over time, it grew in prosperity due in no small part to being one of the only settlements in the region capable of holding it's own against Orismer raiders and pirates, and was formally declared a kingdom in 1E 1100 thanks to the shrewd political maneuvering of King Farangel Gardner. The Gardners were later peacefully replaced by the Cumberlands, an offshoot of the main Gardner bloodline.

It's main source of income, aside from the impressive warf complex, is it's large market district, and until 4e 188 when pirates overran the city it was one of the most economically stable settlements in West Tamriel.

It has had multiple harsh run-ins with aggressive locals, initially the Reachmen, rallied behind Durcorach the Black Drake who attempted to wage a war of attrition. Against a port city. Without a navy. Unsurprisingly the siege failed. The second encounter was with the forces of the Supernal Dreamers, a militant sect of Vaermina cultists who's psychic manipulation led High King Emeric forming an uneasy treaty with the local sect of Azura cultists who had refurbished an abandoned and desacralized temple and rechristened it Pariah Abby.

It served as capital of the Daggerfall Covenant and personal stronghold of High King Emric from 2E 567 until being overrun during the Tiber Wars.

By the late Third Era the city had expanded beyond the bounds of the Bjoulsae River and the palace was apparently rebuilt, now sporting an impressive garden, elaborate hedge-maze, and significantly more striking architecture.

The local temple is dedicated primarily to Akatosh and the Order of the Hour has a strong presence here. The knightly order of Wayrest is The Order of the Rose

(con't when i get back from work)

>>55201471
Does this eventually talk about Menevia, or is it just Wayrest?

High Rock is pretty interesting, but how would you translate this to a game without making it generic high fantasy capeshit? Would you go full on nostalgiatrip and include old time dragons and orcs and generic-ish medieval plate armour, next to witches and demons? Basically, how to do it not like ESO?

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>>55201375
>Rice terraces

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>>55201648
>Would you go full on nostalgiatrip and include old time dragons and orcs and generic-ish medieval plate armour, next to witches and demons?
Mostly. Except for dragons, replace them with Rocs or some other massive bird creature. Basically, rather than just go Tolkein and try to spin something unique off it, base it on medieval stories and art. Lots of color, druid groves, oracles in the forest, witches and wizards galore.

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>>55201734
Also Landsknecht-inspired mercenary guild. Fabulous as fuck.

>>55201734
>Lots of color, druid groves, oracles in the forest, witches and wizards galore.

Ie go full fucking Tolkien.

>>55200648
Most people say C0DA is canon because it was referenced in Sermon 37

>>55200648
>>55201873

To be clear, I'm not saying C0DA is canon, I'm saying IF people try to prove its canonocity, they usually cite Sermon 37 as an example.

But that doesn't matter if you think ESO isn't canon.

Either way canon arguments are retarded/

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>>55201858
What did he mean by this?

But yes, I agree, have hobgoblins and dryads and hagravens and just plain regular old hags and what not.

>>55201858
>Tolkein
>Witches
????

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>>55201858
>any of that
>tolkein

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>>55201542
It'll get there in a bit. Wayrest has a lot of history to go through.

>>55201471
As of the late 3rd Era, Wayrest fell into the hands of King Eadwyre, or rather into the hands of Queen Mother Barenziah and her children, Lord Helseth, who later becomes the King of Morrowind, and her bastard daughter Lady Morgiah of Wayrest who has explicit dealings with the Order of the Black Worm, trading her first born child in exchange for Firsthold, birthplace of Emperor Regent Ocato, which she later rules as Queen. A small sucession crisis took place as King Eadwyre's daughter and Barenzia's step-daughter Elysana feuded with Helseth for control of the throne of Wayrest, backed by the devious Lord Woodborn, his own bloodline possibly connected to the Gardener clan via bastardry.

Menevia is a less documented region, once home to the aforementioned Pariah Abby and later absorbed by Wayrest during a period of rapid expansion. As a result, discussing it is nearly impossible without returning to the topic of the Petty Kingdom of Wayrest.

The city for which the region was named is or was a walled settlement, build in a similar vein to Wayrest and Daggerfall, and holding no less than 16 bars, 3 jewelers, 3 pawn shops, and a pair of rather cramped libraries. It was also home to a Thieve's Guild outpost, as many of the major cities of High Rock were around the time of the Warp in the West. The local temple was dedicated primarily to Dibella. The city also boasted an impressive graveyard, though whether it or the city itself still stands as of the 4th Era and after being subsumed by Wayrest is unknown.

The area itself is a grassy hill covered region, home to the beautiful Cumberland Falls, and positioned precariously close to the site of Orsinium

Oddly enough, the region, or at least Pariah Abby seemed to already be in deference to Wayrest in the 2nd Era, although that may have had more to do with it being King Emric's personal holding than anything else.

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>>55202391
It shouldn't be surprising, given the wealth of the region and the existence of more than a dozen skeevy bars all within 4 miles of eachother, that these two regions have a long history of criminal activity.

At one time, a pervasive organized crime ring known as the Midnight Union dominated the criminal underworld along coasts of the Illiac Bay, with a strong presence in Wayrest. Notable exploits include destroying the light house to maroon incoming merchant ships, attacking Pariah Abby in conjunction with the Supernal Dreamers, and generally being unpleasent folks. Once their power began to wane within Wayrest City, a new group known as the Backstreet Bo- er, Gang took their place, causing less sever but still frequent crimes through the lower class areas of the Residential District. Even the sewers of Wayrest were infested with criminals, up to and including the disgraced Investigator Garron who plotted the downfall of the city from under it's streets.

Fortunately, as of the 3rd Era such things seem to be less common, though the Guild still holds a strong presence in the region.

That's all I've got for the general history, anything more specific you wanted to know?

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When playing an Elder Scrolls game, can you actually see the constellations of the various signs when you look at the sky?

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>>55201648
Nostalgiatrip sounds fair - half of what I like about Daggerfall is how comfortably old it is. Sometimes you don't need to make something feel new, if what is really liked about it is how classic it feels.

High Rock is also pretty interesting politically, since it has so many kingdoms in a loose confederation only when they're not squabbling, along with trade and warring with the nearby Redguards and Orcs. You could take cues from history for shit like that, as well as legends and myths.

>>55202675
You're assuming Bethesda is anywhere near that thorough.

Can we all agree that the Thalmor are the objective good guys of Elder Scrolls? They only want what is best for all races.

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>>55203000
The only good Altmer is a dead Altmer, get out of my province.

>>55202975
I'd like to think they could be, since they have the two moons and all.

>>55202675
I know you at least can see the Warrior, the Mage and the Thief in Morrowind.

>>55201279
We don't know.

He was going to show up in the actual game, but didn't because Daggerfall's development was a mess. I kind of suspect that the Agent was meant to slay him at some point.

The reason he's not mentioned again is probably because he's pretty obscure, and Bethesda might just have forgotten.The dragon from Battlespire isn't ever referenced again either.

>>55202391
>her bastard daughter Lady Morgiah
No.

>>55201873
>>55201907
Sure, but if you check, this argument was written 3 years ago, before Sermon 37.

>>55201661
Explain this meme to me.

>>55203028
>black N'wahs with swords

kek, fucking Dunmer.

>>55203332
>>55203028
>Swords

>Not CURVED swords

>>55203318
Dr. Septim, I'm CIA

>>55203135
Morgiah was a bastard. She's the daughter of General Symmachus. Unless you meant her having power over the kingdom, in which case I guess that's sort of subjective. The fact that she had direct dealings with a powerful necromancer coven and is capable of extending enough influence to keep it quiet and sell off her child to Mannimarco without anyone noticing implies to me that she's got substantial power, but that may just be an interpretive error on my part.

>>55201648
>full on nostalgiatrip
That's exactly how I would do it. In my mind, the best way to portray High Rock is as a love letter to classic High Fantasy, emphasis on chivalry, courtly love, rescuing fair maidens, dashing rogues, all that jazz. Part of what makes High Rock stand out to me is that in contrast to Morrowind's alien environment, Skyrim's harsh bandit infested wilds, and Cyrodiil's Pax Romana but Also Samurai and Ancient Elf Nazis gimmick, High Rock is a more traditional style of fantasy, which ironically makes it more unique.

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I don't know what these are but they would look cool in Colovia.

>>55203355
Now I'm more confused.

what does c0da mean?

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What can you tell me about the Imperial Navy? Where is it located? What's its state?

>>55203843
The name of a spin-off story by former writer/currant guest writer Micheal Kirkbride. Blends some of the more obscure elements of TES lore with sci-fi into a weird trippy story following Hlaalu Hir as he battles coming of age, bad drug trips, excessive amounts of eastern philosophy, and the Numidium in the late 5th Era.

Following up on this, his philosophy in regards to world building is that it should follow an "open-source" style and encouraged people to create their own C0DAs, essentially dedicated headcannons that they ascribe to and use them to interpret and build off of existing lore.

>>55203850
Assuming in the time of Skyrim

>What can you tell me
It's pretty large but not the dominant force in the world, that'd be the Thalmor navy.
>Where is it located
Probably spread out around Imperial holdings, like real life navies.
>What's its state?
Perhaps a bit antiquated with old ships and not many fresh recruits, but far from terrible.

>>55203850
The Imperial Navy isn't really as well documented as the Legions or the Battlemage corps. Ostensibly, it has presence throughout controled territories, likely more-so in areas of interest to the EEC. They apparently take a role of military specialists rather than policing the seas, as can be infered from the general impunity pirate crews like the Blood Horkers, Blackblood Marauders, and The Ordinator's Revenge. It should also be noted that the Red Sabre Pirates were explicitly defeated by Cyrodiilic naval milita, not the Imperial Navy This lack of policing could also be explained by the waning power of the Empire itself however.

During the reign of Uriel V, Esroniet was a major hub for the Imperial Navy, and the main port of call for ships being deployed to Akavir, though in modern times little is known of it. In all likelyhood, the Imperial Isle, Topal, or Rumare are the best picks for a major drydock in modern times.

The precursor to the modern Imperial Navy was most likely, the All-Flags Navy, a collation effort based out of the Colovian Estates to launch a crippling blow against the Sload in recompense for unleashing the Thrassian Plague, spearheaded by the legendary flagship The Golden Era.

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>>55204050
I imagine that frigates due to how out of place they look in this medieval time period are of Altmer design which the Empire merely adopted from the Ayleids, assuming we are in a period without the lateen.

>>55204245
Well there's also some lore about the use of cannons during the war between the Empire and Hammerfell, so I guess the navy is just super advanced for some reason. Probably because most people associate naval combat with the Age of Sail.

>>55203355
I actually don't like excessively curved swords. I prefer a slight curve, just feels more elegant to me.

And thanks to everyone last thread who helped me with Redguard lore! You're all aces.

>>55204093
I believe Stros M'Kai was a port for the navy during Tiber Septim's reign, might have stayed that way due to it's strategic proximity to Summerset.

>>55204303
>cannons
That I did not know, like early 13th century ones I assume?

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>>55204316
That reminds me. Anyone mind the occidentalization of the Redguards in Skyrim and ESO?

>>55203922
I assume he was asking about actual meaning of the name: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coda_(music)

>>55204603
How do you mean?

>>55204303
I have heard many times there was cannons in Redguard ships too. Would be nice to have picture of them though.

I guess they're limited to navy use for some reason like them being very expensive or that battlemages aren't very useful artillery on the seas.

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>>55204245
I disagree, I really do, mostly because the common thinking is that frigates are from the age of piracy or something, which they aint, it's compeltely possible for the empire to have so-called frigates.

As a plus point, like others have pointed out, the Imperial navy likely isn't actually made for ship-to-ship fighting, more probably they're just a way for Imperial soldiers and more specifically Imperial Marines to get around.

>>55204603
Well, I disagree with the thesis behind the question. If you look at Redguard and Daggerfall Hammerfell wasn't nearly as DUDE MOORS LMAO as in Skyrim and ESO.

>>55204715
>>55204401
Keep in mind that Redguard and Daggerfall had a different style to them, a more early modern kind of thing going on. Skyrim is like the 10th century, thematics-wise, while Redguard and Daggerfall is 16th century.

>>55204715
Redguards just don't like mages in general.

There was also quest in Skyrim which had a ship fire explosive projectiles at player and it was pretty obvious they were meant represent some sort of cannon.

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>>55204752
>I disagree with the thesis
I don't understand what you mean by that.

>>55204683
Arabized essentially.

>>55204752
Skyrim is just primitive province though. Other imperial provinces are apparently still late medieval to reneissance style.

>>55204861
Huh, to an extent. I dislike that they don't have more influences like Sub Saharan or Ethiopian African.

>>55204839
This armor is fucking rad as fuck, though.

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>>55203393
>Morgiah was a bastard
No. Symmachus was Barenziah's husband.

>sell off her child to Mannimarco
Again not the case. This whole affair is kind of strange and requires some knowledge about the development of the games to get.

I swear, Anon, you're going to get bad marks in Dunmeri Political History 101 if you don't properly read your textbook.

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>>55204895
What I'm getting at. It strikes me as lazy characterization to depict them like this while not drawing any Sub Saharan influences.

>>55204781
Yes, but Imperial Navy also apparently uses cannons.

>>55204839
>I don't understand what you mean by that.
I don't think they're getting occidentalized, I think they're becoming less and less western and more and more Near Eastern, the opposite pretty much.

>>55205072
That's what I was referring to.
>>55204861

>>55205018
That armor is fanart if you're wondering, pretty sure.

I think much of their religious practices are Yoruba-based, but ESO's depiction is just weird since they're all over the place. They're Arabic cities and names, but they have this utterly forgettable arms and armor that look bog standard fantasy European.

>>55205127
You realize the Occident is Western Europe, not the Middle East, right?

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>>55205137
You could be set for architecture if you based it on Ethiopian churches that date back to Christ.

>>55205201
Yeah, that's why I threw in the mention of it. Ethiopia has a lot of cool history. Though truth be told, I think I'd rather fuse that architecture with West African stuff and then put your fantasy spin on it. Avoid just copy and pasting human civilization.

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>>55205178
>I don't understand what occidentalism is the post

>>55204861
Original Redguard (the game) had Arabic influences too. It was just more mediterranean and very advanced (like 17-18th century) due to pirate theme.

>>55205235
Shit, no I didn't... Damn auto correct.

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>>55205201
>>55205235
>Let's make them African because they're black
Please don't do that

>>55205245
>I don't understand what occidentalism is; The post

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>>55205137
>utterly forgettable arms and armor
That's most of ESO's gear.

Pic related is a set of Yokudan armour.

>>55205264
Meant for.
>>55205178

>>55205266
I make a mistake. I'm sorry alright?

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>>55205264
>>55205289
It's cool my dude. To answer the question as you intended it; Yeah, I dislike how it's becoming generic arabian nights, really shows a lack of imagination and a bordering on uncomfortable implication of racism where "They're black so they're african so they're muslim" seems to play a big role.

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>>55205235
I'm right with you on the West Africa.

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>>55205277
I think ZOS got a new armor designer for Morrowind, some of it looks pretty good

>>55205266
>Let's make them African because they're black
This is kinda funny because Redguards have never had African stuff in any game. Original Redguard portrayed them as having mix of Arabic and western architecture with generic 17-18th century western clothes. Morrowind pretty much continued with that and then Skyrim made them like Arabs or Moors.

I personally prefer the original though even if it's quite generic.

>>55205326
I didn't even know Zanzibar had a fort. It would look great in the Elder Scrolls universe.

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>>55205335

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>>55205277

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>>55205400
>we wuz winged hussars

>>55205335
I feel pretty sad that modern TES armor looks so bland compared to Morrowind. That's far better than Skyrim and ESO in general, but if that's supposed to be the ebony armot, it's really lacking compared to original Morrowind version.

Holy shit! The thread is alive! I've been running the best campaign I've DM'd in years and it's because of you guys! Fuck! Lemme war story at you.

>Nord, Reachwoman, Argonian and Khajiit are all caught by a Telvanni mage for various reasons.
>Nord picked a fight in a bar in Vivec and was purchased from prison.
>Argonian was a Shadowscale operating in Morag Tong territory and got bagged.
>Khajiit was tricked into attempting to rob the mage on the promise of a big score.
>The ex-Forsworn was promised she'd find super medicinal reagents in the mage's tower.

>The guard in this fungal prison never sleeps, never takes a break, simply paces, completely obscured in bone armor.
>Nord decides he has enough and hits the guard with a lightning rune.
>The Guard "Wakes Up" under the impression that he is a Breton Knight of noble lineage.
>Khajiit insults his honor somehow.
>The "Noble" proposes a duel right there in the prison and releases the prisoners to accomplish this.
>Since they don't have weapons or armor, the Noble begins shedding his sword, shield and helmet for rousing fisticuffs with this rambunctious cat person.
>It's a skeleton.
>A skeleton in bone armor.
>The party manages to convince the skeleton to call off the duel until they can get somewhere more public, appealing to his need for showmanship.
>They go through several scamps and poisonous experiments before escaping.
>With a Telvanni ship on the horizon, they decide to swim to the next nearest island.
>It's Tel Fyr.
>They meet up with Divayth Fyr who explains he's engineered their capture to inspect the effects of being a prisoner on one's destiny.
>In order to stay neutral from that point onward, Fyr informs him that they will never see him again but before they go he patches their wounds, "sells" them equipment and gives them tailored quests.

>>55205440
>The Forsworn is given a lead on Crimson Nirnroot.
>The Shadowscale is informed that the Night Mother is in danger, threatening the religious loyalty of the Dark Brotherhood outside of Black Marsh.
>The Khajiit is told of a fantastic artifact which is being held near Direnni tower which would be the greatest score in history if stolen.
>The Nord only wants a worthy foe.
>Fyr "summons" the Ebony Warrior into the world to seek out the Nord and duel him.

>With that, they're warped to Vivec to begin their journey.
>Seeing as how the issue with the Night Mother is more pressing they endeavor to head south but are sidetracked when a Khajiit slave bumps into the party's own Khajiit, handing off a key.
>After some digging around, they find out the key is to a skooma stash hidden under the foreign quarter of Vivec.
>Apparently, the Khajiit of the party fucking hates skooma with a passion that burns brighter than a thousand suns.
>...
>They set the massive skooma stash on fire and run.
>Thousands of drakes worth of skooma.
>Gone.
>They book it while the entirety of the Foreign District suddenly gets high from the smoke rising into the streets.
>The party runs to the docks and finds a tavern with a massive fish skeleton on it.
>Seeking passage to the mainland they ask around for a capable sea captain and are reccomended to the owner of the bar: "The Fisher King"
>They find an imperial upstairs, surrounded by women, gloating about his adventures.
>Using some ash yam dumplings they bought, they negotiate a price for passage on his boat by saying that the dumplings could give him "Carnal Vitality".
>Somewhere in the course of this, the Khajiit is fucking around and climbs the bar, only to find that the giant fish skeleton that the Fisher King was bragging about is actually made out of Bone Resin and he's full of bullshit.

>>55205439
I think it's steel crafted in a great house style, not sure which.

>>55205400
I like the little detail of rank based on feather amount.

>>55205396
Now this is much better design, but overly ornamental JRPG style decoration kinda makes it bit goofy.

>>55205455
>While they're waiting for the Fisher King to utilize their magic dumplings
>As it turns out the bar is now filled with guards due to them investigating the Skooma crisis in the foreign district.
>A fight breaks out and the Fisher King escapes with the party, mostly because they were in the right place at the right time to help his escape.
>They get on the Fisher King's boat and sail into the night.
>That night, everyone has the same dream.
>A pudgy, smiling, bald, red demonic figure, holding the a miniature Fisher King by his legs, slitting his belly and draining the blood of the sea captain into a golden, jeweled chalice.
>They are then offered to drink from the cup.
>The Nord is the only one who drinks.
>They wake up to find the Fisher King in his luxurious captain's quarters, surrounded by skooma pipes and bottles of fortified wine.
>Upon closer inspection, it looks like some beastly figure may have held him down and forced him to drink the last few bottles.

There's more but I'll post later, I gotta go run errands!

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>>55205368
Responding to what the two lads I quoted wanted to do, rather than what is actually happening.

If you look at ESO, it's basically just Al-Andalus but with the trademark ESO feel of dark materials in a perfect geometric shape.

>>55205462
It kinda reminded me of armors in Skywind mod, especially the helmet. I wonder if they hired the guy who made that as designer.

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>>55205455
What did they mean by the Forsworn being the "the most mixed" in the Guide to the Empire? Mixed with what exactly?

>>55205563
I think Reachmen are supposed to be Nord/Breton mudbloods and Breton are already Elf/Man mongrels so Reachmen may be seen as having the least purity of lineage.

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>>55205235
>Avoid just copy and pasting human civilization.

This, this, a million times this. Something that I enjoyed about parts of Elder Scrolls lore is that half the races and civilizations aren't obviously based on real world cultures, or are at least so much of a mix with fantasy flavors on top no one is dominant. History does have a lot of cool shit that I think people pass over, but slapping on a cultural coat of paint isn't as interesting as something that seems to have formed within its own setting and universe.

I will admit that I'm disappointed that only the Dunmer in Morrowind seem to have pulled this off in-game. The lore descriptions of factions can be fantastic, but once they're in a game developers seem to have to take shortcuts to make it more familiar to audiences or so they don't have to design everything from scratch.

>>55205480
>>55205455
>giant fish skeleton that the Fisher King was bragging about is actually made out of Bone Resin
Clever. This sounds like a lot of fun.

>>55205563
>Mixed with what exactly?
Yes.

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>>55204960
>Symmachus was Barenziah's husband.
Oh hell, you're right. I apparently confused General Symmachus with Tiber Septim and his apocryphal aborted child and am now very confused as to how I fucked up that badly.

I am fairly certain the letter she sent to Scourg Barrow did imply she'd be handing over her firstborn however

>King of Worms,
>I agree to your terms. I will give you my first and you will exert your influence on the King of Firsthold on Sumerset Isle. Only you can let him speak with his dead son. For that, he would even marry Nulfaga!
>-- M

The implication here being, as I understood it, she agreed to trade the life of her first born child for the use of Mannimarco's necromantic talents , which in turn she would utilize in manipulating the bereft king of Firsthold into marrying her.

If I miss something please explain it. I really need to pass Dunmeri Political History, that screwup in Vintage Potions 130 really tanked my GPA.

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>>55205723
To add something that might be a little more divisive onto this: one of the headcanons of Lady M is that the Foresworn basically were treated like the Native Americans in the real world, and that bothers the shit out of me because it's so obvious you'd need to be completely ignorant of Native American history not to realize it. It actually strips away what is interesting about the Foresworn in their stubborn sense of who they are as a people mixed with legitimately dark rituals and practices to maintain their independence.

I know it's just her writings and not any official lore, and I shouldn't let it bother me. And I do think the actual history of the Native Americans should be known. But it's just so obvious and trite for it, and doesn't even really show the Foresworn much respect and instead makes them an oppressed people.

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>>55205723
I funny that you should mention that. I was brain storming at idea for what if Colovia was like the American Southwest too contrast it more with the jungles of Nibenay. I got the idea for Colovians to live in pueblo like architecture.

>>55205813
>Keep the MK/Lady N related squabbling to a minimum.
That said, I completely agree, especially since the Nords already had their own drag nach Ost thing going on with the Snow Elves. Trying to paint the Forsworn in a good light is retarded, they are by definition a people that chimped out and then fled into the wilds rather than stay like they were before, perfectly equal. The only genocide concering Reachmen were the actual Reachmen blowing the fuck out of Markarth. Ulfric did nothing wrong by the way~

In short, it's way more thematically appropriate if the Nords and the Reachmen simply settled in the reach at roughly the same time, and lived in a strenuous peace.

>>55205813
Why care what someone's headcanon is?

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and Colovian architecture in the Highlands would look something like this.

>>55205266
I just like the asethetic and would rather see that then something like...

>>55205277
This.

Just isn't my jam.

>>55205723
Yeah, this is why I'm not crazy on how the Imperials have always just been either fantasy Romans or fantasy knights.

>>55205481
I dunno', man. I just would rather there be some weird fusion of Africa to Middle East to even central Asia stuff with maybe some of the more classical European/Roman feel of the Empire. There's a million games with fantasy Arabs, just want to see it changed up.

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Is there a Scottish/Irish/Celtic/Gaelic equivalent in TES universe? I want kilts.

>>55205978
Some races have elements of them, but none in particular are straight up like them. I want the dreugh to be, just because imperialistic scottish crabs are amusing.

>>55205978
To an extent you get some of that in the Bretons.

>>55205978
Nope, but in Morrowind men used to wear skirts and it was fairly normal thing to do. They weren't kilts though, but rather same skirts women used.

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>>55205895
I was worried about bringing it up, but I figured it was relevant enough to my complaints about culture and shit that I could risk it.

I'm not asking for the Foresworn to be painted in a good or bad light, just be treated like an actual people, with their own culture and society that has been unfortunate enough to turn to (questionably?) dark pacts that may damn them in the long run. And that's interesting, because it makes you question who's really in the right, or even if they are in the right, are they going about things the right way?

Making them not!Native Americans is just...making them a trope. 'These are oppressed people, feel sad.' Though I admit, I haven't thought about it from a thematic angle or what would be appropriate as a story. Though I'm glad no one's tried to touch the Aylieds in a while.

>>55205933
Because I am autistic as fuck.

>>55205723
This is funny to me, because one of the responses to your post >>55205813, glosses over the Celts. The reachmen aren't native americans, they're celts.

Native Americans weren't the only victims of genocide as a result of two cultures clashing in our history. Hundreds of thousands of Celts were killed or sold into slavery as a result of Caesar's wars against them, and their culture was absorbed into the Roman Empire. The Nords are the Roman Empire to the Reachmen's Celts, which is appropriate, given the fact that the Nords would later go on to forming the Roman Empire equivalent in TES.

>>55205978
see above. Bretons would be the later, more """civilized""" versions. Forsworn are the traditionalists clinging to the ancient ways.

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>>55205748
Originally Morgiah's wedding was supposed to be part of the setup for TES III. Likely this has to do with the fact that at the very early stages of what would eventually become Morrowind, the game was called Tribunal and set on the Summurset Isle, which means we would have met Morgiah again.
Obviously the development of TES III changed radically, so the whole plot-line was just never resolved. 'Tis a mystery.

>>55205978
Bretons have a bit of that, I guess.

>>55206046
The reachmen may have been oppressed in the past, but their descendents are not (unless they choose to be by becoming Forsworn).

Celts aren't oppressed today. Italians don't owe celts reparations for Caesar's crimes against them, etc, etc.

I think you're looking too much into it for problems.

>>55206012
Dreugh in general are the biggest mystery in TES now.

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>>55206058
Trying not to talk too much about Lady M, but I'm pretty sure she made a post saying that her headcanon was based on that of Native Americans. And I'm pretty sure that the Celts weren't sent to boarding schools to learn Imperial or something.

But either way, I don't want the Foresworn to be just the Native Americans, or just the Celts, and treated as something only worthy of a distant sort of pity and empathy. Mix Native Americans and Celts together, throw in some Nordic and Orcish culture, slap on some other shit related to their relationship with Hagravens and werewolves and whatever, and make them feel like more than a cardboard cutout not!RealWorldCulture. This is a fantasy universe with a shitton of magic in it, you can do that.

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>>55205813
I don't want the Foresworn to become some lazy American Indian analogy. They more resemble the Metis anyway.

>>55206146
They're a hard topic to approach, since they're a bunch of Molag Bal worshipping assholes who were turned into a totally feral state (even more than the Falmer, who at least maintain some semblance of intelligence), and who once ruled the world.

>>55206154
Whoever that lady is, she's a moron, and you should disregard whatever fanfiction she's feeding you.

>But either way, I don't want the Foresworn to be just the Native Americans, or just the Celts

Sure. The reachmen are analagous to the celts, but they have influences with all the "savage barbarian" type peoples of Europe. They're the strange folk at the edge of civilization.

>>55206046
>I'm not asking for the Foresworn to be painted in a good or bad light, just be treated like an actual people, with their own culture and society
Ah, but you forget, actual people are also generally painted in a bad or a good light. I have no problem with them being made to be villains as long as they're actually made with some thought put into them. Can you imagine a Reachman old hag playing with her grandson? Can you imagine a father going hunting with said son the next morning? The ritual feast in the evening where they slaughter a sheep and then roast it over a bonfire? All of that shit. When you can do that, you're pretty far on the road.

>>55206058
What's your reasoning for why the reachmen are gauls? I don't see it, except I guess some very vague idea of their naming conventions.

>>55206154
This too. Mix a tribal culture together with a strong clan structure, add a pantheon of generally malevolent gods, then the martial culture that comes from living in such a harsh hill enviroment, then compare and contrast to the more developed Breton culture minus the elven aspects, plus some nord and quite a lot of Orc interaction..

This is just my headcanon though, but it's canon anyway (thanks Kirkbride)
Oh and by the way, Reachmen and Orcs are brother people.

>>55205480
>After tossing the Fisher King overboard, the party claims the ship and sets sail for Omayni.
>While out on the water, a small raft approaches with a dour, dark figure.
>The Ebony Warrior challenges the Nord and just knocks him around a little bit without doing damage.
>The Ebony Warrior takes his leave and vows to return when the Nord is ready.
>Once they land in Omayni, they attempt to sell the ship.
>Unfortunately, they took to calling the ship the "Cursed Rose" and no one wants to buy that shit.
>Eventually a slaver offers them a small sum and ten slaves for the ship.
>The only thing the Khajiit hates worse than skooma is slavers.
>The party hatches a plan, selling the ship and assassinating the shit out of the slaver and his guards.
>The actual town guards come to inspect and the Forsworn convinces them to turn a blind-eye as it turns out that slaver was particularly not well liked.
>Not because he was a slaver, he was just a swindling asshole in general.
>Rather than sell the ship again, the party gives their slave crew jobs as fishermen, buying all the equipment needed for their new occupation, using the funds they murderrobbed off of their former master.
>They purchase an old dying silt strider named "Snuffles" and take off towards the Velothi mountains, their next stop: Cheydinhal.
>While traversing the mountains, they see a crashed wagon at the side of the road and they go to investigate.
>It appears to be an over turned mage's guild wagon and in the clearing next to it is a berserking Goblin Warchief who seems to be bashing one of his own goblins into a fine paste.

>>55206229
>After beating the pissed off Goblin, they investigate the crash to discover a small white house cat with a collar that has a strange blue bell.
>They adopt the cat immediately and head off to Cheydinhal.
>The party gets another lead in the bar upon arrival.
>After losing a drinking competition to an Orc with a dwarven metal eye and strange brass markings on his face, he hires them to go on a dungeon dive into a dwemer ruin in the morning.

>Late that night, a barmaid comes to their room and delivers tea.
>The Khajiit passes his perception check to wake up and see their new cat lapping at a floating tea cup.
>Before he can say anything, the Khajiit is hit with an overwhelming calming effect and falls deep asleep, under the assumption what he had seen was a dream.
>The next day they head back into the Velothi mountains to find this ruin only to be robbed at arrow point.
>Upon recognizing the Khajiit in the party, the bandit leader calls off the attack.
>It was a Cathay of massive size who knew the Khajiit from their old rebel days.
>After catching up, the party is led to the dwemer ruin where in they find the entrance is full of traps.
>They see a small tonal switch on the side of the wall and manage to snipe it, unfreezing and releasing an intact snow-elf who was a new player coming in.
>This Snow Elf was more or less used as both a tour guide and also a preserved specimen and the last thng he remembered was the dwemer putting him into the cryogenic chamber and then feeling slightly chilly.
>Just like that, the entry room is a mess, filled with bodies and there's the assholes with their weapons drawn.
>What the fuck is an orc?
>What the fuck is a dunmer?
>Where the fuck is everyone?
>These questions had to be saved for later as they convince him to lead them through the dungeon.

Another pause! This has been quite the campaign!

>>55206219
>This is just my headcanon though, but it's canon anyway (thanks Kirkbride)

I can't tell if you're serious or not, but fuck off either way.

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>>55206046
God damn you're so dull. Why not just leave them the way they are and let people draw there own conclusions?

>>55206250
t. kirkbride himself

>>55205653
Nord/Breton/Altmer, belonging to neither, I like it.

>>55206259
That's pretty harsh, anon. I think that's what the other guy is saying.

>>55206154
Speaking of TES magic, how do you folks like seeing it done? Specifically mystical or something more akin to a science?

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>>55206083
Oh, thanks Anon. I don't think I've ever seen that quote before. Didn't even realize there was that much set-up in the works for the original TES:3, beyond what would've been the Eye of Argonian spin-off game. Always did feel odd that her whole side quest set up such a dramatic revelation as the Princess of Wayrest collaborating with The Order of the Black Worm without any payoff besides a ultimately bearing a short lore book.

>>55206332
I like it somewhere in between. ESO has a neat little scene where an Argonian shaman and a Dunmer sorcerer are debating whether magic is a byproduct of nature or the influence of an external force of ambient energy manifesting itself in the Riften Guildhall.

>>55206332
Science, since that's specifically what it is. Dwemertech should ironically seem more mystical.

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>>55206332
He's whole "I want people to learn about Native American history" was a red flag to me. This is fantasy not real life.

>>55206219
>What's your reasoning for why the reachmen are gauls? I don't see it, except I guess some very vague idea of their naming conventions.

A savage, barbaric people by the standards of a southern empire, the ______ were forcibly subjugated by a legendary general on his rise to the Empire's throne, with the help of an even savager people to the north.

Tiber Septim's rise to power is extremely similar to Caesar's, and the Reachmen play a similar role to the Celts in the story. Culturally, the reachmen have many similarities to modern fiction regarding druidic cultures as well. Forsworn are basically pulp fiction celts.
>>55206294
I think cuckbride is the worst thing to happen to teslore (though he did do some good things), and c0da is the most poorly written piece of trash in his entire library, but it just isn't a good thing to bring up.

>>55206359
That actually sounds pretty cool.

>>55206377
I tend to like a mix of the two. I dislike the really heavy science magic stuff of some of MK's works where you have these weird spaceships.

>>55206400
I'm afraid you've lost me, I took the other guy's statements as being upset LadyN was comparing the Reach to Native Americans.

>>55206402
I think you're just using conjecture desu, the only thing they have in common is the fact that they both got shat on by the Empire (which for that matter, shat on absolutely everything in its' path) And the names. There's no reference whatsoever to gallic culture, appearance, armour, or more importantly, metalwork. It's incidental at best, partly because everyone always feels the need to classify ES cultures as expies of real ones, and partly because Skyrim just doesn't go very indepth about the whole culture part.

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>>55206402
I like the analogy to Roman history just reading through Caesar's Conquest of Gaul myself. The whole melting pot of the Bretons and the Nords resembles the Celts and the Germans in Gaul.

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>>55206400
I want people to learn about real Native American history, not through a fantasy lens. I don't like what LadyN has done with it, wiping away their darker aspects as well as some of their lighter aspects for a placid view. I want the Foresworn to be their own thing without constantly being compared to real life cultures - and not in a way that's in bits and pieces, but 'no they're totally one thing pasted into this fantasy world.'

But hey, if people actually want something that's instantly relatable and understandable, that's fair. I'm just one guy on the internet that's happened to grab your attention, where normally I'd get ignored anyway.

>>55207063
Alrighty, anon.

What do you like 'bout the Foresworn? Just give me the whole spiel. Might a little slow in responding since i'm grabbing some food.

>>55207063
>and not in a way that's in bits and pieces, but no 'they're totally one thing pasted into a fantasy world.'

Important typo correction there. I don't want things that way, but I'm okay with the bits and pieces way.

>>55206377
What do you think of Dwemertech that's obviously mundane (aside made to run forever) like light bulbs and steam turbine generators in MW?

>>55207091
Are you the guy who asked me (Not the Forsworn dude) what I liked about Falkreath? Good lad anon. I'd respond even though you didn't ask me but I need to go to bed.

>>55207173
They're mundane, but they're working towards some weird purpose. Also the lightbulbs in MW were a lot weirder if you take a look at them, they're some sort of crystal that's being powered to glow.

>>55207063
I think you and I can come to an agreement then that it's a dumb analogy at least.
>>55206192

>>55207237
Yeah, it was a good answer! Sorry the thread died before I could respond. But you have a good night.

>>55207091
I'll admit, I'm not that strongly versed in Foresworn lore, but what I do know seems interesting. I like how the Foresworn use primitive weapons and armor, but make up for this with pacts with the Hagravens. That's a relationship we really don't see often in Tamriel - usually it's just with a daedra if anything - and that and the Briarhearts and the Legend of Red Eagle suggest the desperate willingness to trade their humanity for power. You could also argue the Briarhearts are interesting for the metaphor of having their heart cut out alone. How mysterious the source of this power is, and the Hagravens themselves, adds to that interest for me, even if it's arguably something we've seen with most barbarian cultures in fantasy settings. Though apparently in ESO they have the Foresworn as daedra-worshipers, which is a little disappointing, but still goes with the theme.

I also find it interesting how the Foresworn/Reachmen aren't united in their efforts. These aren't necessarily noble savages, but a people who are varyingly trying to live on under Nord rule and hardship as best they can, or turning desperately back to old and dark ways to fight against their oppressors. Some Foresworn groups themselves seem to argue over where to go, how to best fight the Nords and Imperials. Sometimes they're little more than bandits, other times they're essentially terrorists - and then there are those who just want to be left alone. This is an interesting contrast to vague ideas that once they had their own kingdoms in the Reach, and now they're a bunch of petty tribals.

It's also a little interesting how even though they're arguably Bretons, the Reachmen don't consider themselves Bretons and the Bretons of High Rock don't consider Reachmen kin. It speaks to their cultural heritage and pride, and how they've probably intermixed with Nords and even Orcs. That's a sort of distinctiveness that you don't really see outside of Colvians and the Nibenese.

>>55207277
I was thinking of Bamz-Amschend which had conventional filament light bulbs. The same you used in SSE. Those other more wierd lights would appear to be some sort gas lights based around on reacting ebony with electricity.

>>55207452
Solid points. That last bit about their distinctiveness gets me. Stuff like the Crown and Forebear or the areas of Cyrodiil are fun in fantasy. I like that kind of subculture stuff and wish more games did that.

>>55207535
Definitely, more setting need that level of detail. The things like Imperials being split into ethnic sub-groups and the little touches with cultural differences between cities and regions is something I can really appreciate.

>>55207452
The thing with the Daedra worshipping Forsworn in ESO is a bit odd in the way it's executed. It's explicitly stated, for example, that Angof the Gravesinger is part of the conspiracy based around advancing the goals of Molag Bal, but it never really comes up. All the Wyresses explicitly refer to him personally as the source of the corruption, the spirits he summons name him as their master, not Molag, and the only time it's even mentioned in any significant degree is when he resurrects Faolchu, and then it's just for one sort line of dialog. In fact, the majority of the Reachmen end up having dealings with Mother Murk and her Hags (in Glenumbra) or the Hagravens (in the Rift) with the Order of the Black Worm and the Cult of Molag Bal being more like a side note. Their loyalties just seem sort of random and the Molag Bal angle is tacked on pretty haphazardly.

One of the more prominent examples of how early content was something of a mess, in my opinion. They've gotten better, but there still some of those "because plot" moments that pop up every now and then, and the sudden shift from worshiping Old Gods, Hagravens, and Daedric Aspects to worshiping whatever the scene requires them to be worshiping at the moment is one of them.

>>55207733
Yeah, I have some friends who play WoW and I've tried telling them a massive turn off for that setting for me is how one note a lot of the races are in it(or actually all of them).

Like, even though people criticize the games for not always following the lore, the cities have been pretty consistently distinct. Oblivion is the weakest in that regard and I still got a feel for each of them(Skingrad a best).

>>55207519
Good point about Tribunal ruins, but Dwemer lights in base game aren't some sort pressurized gas lamps. They work even if glass casing is broken, so They would seem to be electrically heated filament lights just like in Tribunal, but they do use ebony (2 pieces of it hold the filament) in their design for some strange purpose.

>>55207535
Is the feud between the Crowns and the Forebears solely an ideological one? Tradition against progress, Yokuda or Tamriel?

>>55207173
MW?

>>55208059
id wager that theyre just two different ethnic and political groups within the redguards of tamriel who picked up where the feuding kingdoms that destroyed yokuda left off

>>55208071
Morrowind

>>55208059
There is an ideological core to it, but they have distinctive cultural differences. Forebears tend to be more nomadic and while they're culturally open to the rest of Tamriel, they are stricter about their religious practices. Crowns are more centered around the cities and they tend to try and honor Yokuda more strictly.

>>55208093
There's no indication of an ethnic division but there is of a class division. Crowns consisting of the ruling aristocracy and rural residents. Forebears of the middle mercantile class of Rihad and Taneth.

>>55206248
>And then Sheogorath did a kickflip and memed lol ecksdee sorandom X'D

>>55208047
Gas lamps like neon do still glow and emit light even if the gas is lost. They use same kind filaments as normal light bulbs. It's just that they emit more light with gas.

>>55208350
I don't think they're really gas or neon. They're some sort of ebony-lit crystal. Even looking at the Tribunal ones they seem to be more crystal then filament. The ones in Skyrim are lit by gas, though knowing the dwemer that gas is probably liquidized kittens or something.

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>>55207903
>Skingrad
Top tier taste. As for Oblivion, really, even being the weakest in terms of distinctive locations, there was still a pretty good effort made to make places memorable. Seeing Anvil for the first time from over by the harbor and spending an hour wandering around the streets will always be one of the best memories I have of that game.

>>55201279
Skakmat's not a real dragon, he is a powerful familiar taken dragon form.

>>55208829
Skingrad just gave me this very...uptight feel. Like everything was on guard despite how outwardly fine the city seemed. The buildings are high up around you and the streets are tight and close together. People are pleasant enough but you still have everyone acting like they know something you don't. Anvil is second best, however.

>>55208829
>Skingrad
>Skin Town
What did he mean by this?

>>55208945
Let's just say the founding of the town was not pleasant.

>>55208884
>>55208945
Skingrad always came across to me as this cool spooky kind of place, kind of a slight Gothic Horror vibe to it. Aside from the name, the city seal is a blood red crescent moon next to it's smaller twin, there's a murder mystery going on at Summermist, barely hidden necromancy, Count Hassildor is secretly a vampire and the Mage's Guild has been covering it up for years, and once you dig past all the fine wines and allegedly pleasant locals you get the feeling something is very wrong. It's a nice counterweight to Hackdirt in my opinion.

>>55207903
Huh. I feel oblivion did a good job with the cities, and skyrim is the worst. Everything is bland as fuck in skyrim.

>>55209043
Skyrim suffered a lot from the unfair time limit that was put on it for the meme-y 11-11-11 release. Look at Adam's concept work and storyboards, and then compare it to the finished product, and you realize there was so much little detail that was reduced in scale or just dropped for the sake of meeting that time limit and going with the safest rout available. It's a shame really.

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>>55209043
You must have a favorite.

>>55209093
A tie between Balmora and Cheydinhall.

Both super comfy.

>tfw it's raining but you're about to make it back to your warm bed in the balmora mage's guild

>>55209140
I meant in Skyrim.

>>55209159
oh.

None of them really evoke the positive feelings in me that previous game cities could. So the best of the worst would probably be Morthal or Dawnstar.

>>55209030
Yeah, you get it, man. Skingrad just oozes this sense that everything is wrong and yet compared to Hackdirt...it's not actually all that bad. Hassildor is a reasonable guy and most of the people there are still okay.

>>55209043
Really? I found that Skyrim's towns all looked decently apart from one another. The only two I really don't like are Winterhold and Dawnstar...just...not much to them.

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>>55209238
Interesting choice.

>>55209093
>>55209324
You like Solitude, don't you Squidward?

It's okay...

,,,but Markarth is better...

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This is what Windhelm Castle looked like in concept.

>>55209324
It's based primarily on which has the least annoying quest hooks or intro scenes forced on you.


Markarth is right out, since in a lot of playthroughs you will enter it once, get approached by Tino from the Weekenders and the Daedra hunter immediately.

Solitude has that annoying insane guy that finds you, and the annoying and contrived execution.

Riften has the thieves guild forced on you.

Whiterun is just super boring, and I've ran into redguards giving me an annoying quest there more than any other town.

Windhelm has the racists and the victims of racism approaching you.

Falkreath has that whole annoying dog quest annoying you.

Morthal, winterhold, and Dawnstar are the only ones I can think of that don't have someone seek you out once you enter the zone, besides the courier, which applies to everyone one.

Winterhold is disqualified because you have to go through an annoying "prove you're a magic dude" sequence to access half the town.

Little Vivec, added in the Moon and Star quest is pretty comfy though.

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>>55203318
Its not a meme. Rice terraces are sexy.

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>>55209382
She has her charms for an old lady.

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>>55209418
skyrim had way better art direction than oblivion IMO.

the execution fell short, but then again it always does.

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What Morrowind city does /tgesg/ like best? I feel like I spend 99% of the game on the west half of Vanderfel, but that may be because I joined house hlaalu

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>>55209382

>>55209543
Vos/Tel Vos

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>>55209541
I hear you. There isn't much Oblivion art to find.

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>>55208513
I think Tribunal Dwemer lamps were influenced by Dendera light that was meming around same time. It's pretty similar and actually working design, but not likely historical like the meme claims.

>>55209543
Balmora is still, regardless of house, the best. There's just something oddly comfortable about it. Same with Dagon Fel.

>>55209536
>>55209587
I just love cities built into the mountains. Not Dwarf Fortress things...just..mountain cities...

The best are mountain cities with a large port.

>>55209616
>>55209541
Concept art is a wonderful thing that always makes me upset we won't see something more like it.

>>55209587
>tfw could have had awesome nordic markarth carved from the rock but instead got dwarven ruin but on land

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>>55209543
Balmora always felt like home to me. The Odai Plateau was pretty, Tel Vos was fun to explore, and Vivec is a cool city, but none of them compare to standing on the balcony of the Eight Plates and watching the rain fall.

>>55209668
What about mountain towns?
>>55205935

>>55209543
Probably Vivec and Balmora. Sadrith Mora is pretty cool too.

>>55209541
I need to get my hands on that book. I've never seen any of this art before.

>>55209274
I feel like you could tack Falkreath and Morthal onto that list. They looked more like overgrown villages than proper towns.

>>55209734
I wish the guy made models and textures in the image would convert them to Morrowind.

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>>55209543
Balmora, always.
Hlaalu stronk.

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>All these corrupt money grubbing Hlaalu traitors
My niggas

>>55209743
Mountain towns are rad, I have a slight bias to coastal hills because I spent much of my youth in a town like that, but honestly mountains and seashore are just my two favorite geographic locations for stuff.

>>55209783
Someone last thread made a convincing case for Falkreath as a region and I have to sort of agree that it does feel kinda comfy. Morthal I let slide because ehhhhh...it iiiiis in the marsh and does look like a wetlands town, which is more than I can say for some of the other small hold towns.

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>>55209943
From last thread.

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I will now begin posting Skyrim Beyond concept art.

>>55209969
Yeah, I remember that was posted. Do you know where in the world that is? Looks like it could be Georgia but I'm not sure.

Someone said that would be good for the Colovian Highlands and I'd down for that. Have maybe these fortress towns in the west as a comparison to the mercantile cities of the east.

Speaking of Markarth, why did the dwemer spleep on stone beds? Were they that much of a bunch of contrarians?

>>55210125
STRONG BACK MAKES FOR A STRONG MIND

NO GODS, NO MASTERS, ONLY THIS HEART

(I 'unno)

>>55210125
Racial autism.

>>55210075
A late night anon mentioned Georgia when I was talking about implementing Pueblo architecture into Colovia. This is what I post in relation to the Pueblos >>55205889 and while I was researching on Georgia I stumbled onto these. >>55203544

>>55210237
Yeah, Georgia has some really cool mountainside cities. That'd be fresh for Colovia, just something to distinguish it.

>>55210125
Lower back pain is an myth created by the theists.

What are some of the small, even pettier kingdoms of High Rock that my adventuring Breton Knight could be from? Illiac Bay, or northern High Rock?

>>55210418
Maybe Evermore?

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>>55210323
I figured that the Highlands would be their homeland til they migrated down south. They have a quasi roman look to them to separate them from the inspiration for which the Imperials take from but not too much. The Pueblo theme does that enough.

>>55210418
Northpoint, Shornhelm, Camlorn, Farrun, Evermore or Jehenna.

>>55210418
Kambria, Forrun, Menevia, and Ykalon come to mind.

>>55210550
>>55210514
>>55210433
If only there was another game set in High Rock so we could have an idea of just how petty and backwoods those kingdoms are.

>got through a thread in one day
>second thread is already at 216
Holy shit, we're not dead for once.

>>55201873
>The 36 Sermons of Vivec, Sermon 37
Please kill me

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>>55209921
Why is it that Skyrim failed to capture the feeling of it's concept art? Like, it's there in some places, but most of the game feels like I'm playing Oblivion again.

>>55210508
My only real bias against the Roman look is just how often people leave it at that. Fantasy Europe at least gets crazy versions of plate armor but fantasy Rome is usually just...Rome with wizards.

>>55210634
I like these threads being on the weekends so that way it never outstays its welcome.

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I really wish they had focused on and expanded the fluff for the Dragon Cult and Ancient Nord civilization. It's unique in the way Morrowind was unique.

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>>55210789

>>55210789
Does Morrowind have any flaws in how it's lore was depicted? All I seem to heard about is Skyrim and Oblivion in that respect.

>>55210710
To be honest Imperials have some really crazy Roman styled plate armor that doesn't really look like anything Romans had as it's far too modern. Especially in Morrowind they're pretty swag.

>>55210840
Well like I said earlier, I don't care much for how the Imperials came across in game(the pocket guide was fine) and I'll say that a lot of Morrowind can be monochromatic at times.

Morrowind's big defense is that Morrowind WAS where they started hammering out a lot of the lore, it doesn't match up totally with that Arena and Daggerfall had set up, but it built the universe in a way that they didn't.

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>>55210710
It just needed a rework. You have that already with Morrowind's description of Cyrodiil as a jungle land along the Niben with rice farms reminiscent of the Far East but the armor wasn't doing it any favors.

>>55210840
It's hard to have any flaws in lore in Morrowind because it was the game that defined the lore as we know it. Sure earlier games like Daggerfall had some lore, but it wasn't really well defined and was hopelessly generic as you can see from reading early books like Real Barenziah.

Where do you think they got the dragon scales for armor before there were dragons about?

>>55210967
Yeah, that's my only real issue.

>>55210944
I get what you're saying, but I just need something more than just...Roman-esque. Something that really says that this is a fantasy universe.

>>55209943
As a region, I love Falkreath - it looks absolutely beautiful. It's just the town and its graveyard that's a bit underwhelming.

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>>55210418

>>55211056
I'll give you the graveyard, expanding that would have gone a long way, just making this sleepy forest village with rows upon rows of tombstones next to it.

>>55211036
It's not real dragon scales and this is said in game afaik. It's just called like that because it looks so. I don't remember what the real material was or was it ever explained, but it's not dragon scales.

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I think I'm going to count how many tombstones there are at Falkreath for next week. Hell, maybe I'll count them all.

>>55211101
Oh well that explains this then.
>>55211007

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This whole page is golden.
https://www.darkcreations.org/gallery/album/269-smalish-concept-arts-beyond-skyrim/?page=1

>>55210125
hard beds provide more support. Mattresses as used in the west are actually causing a lot of back problems.

>>55211078
Where is the Island of Craghold suppose to be? The one from the Siege of Craghold during the War of Betony.

>>55211269
I'm going to assume it's that really tiny smudge between Daggerfall and Betony.

>>55205889
>>55210237
I think adobe structures would be fitting for some ancient Colovian ruins but they seem like something a bit too primitive for the more developed, Imperial Colovia.

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>>55209764
check out Ray Lederer's blog for the rendered stuff.
Ray's Memorial Flickr pages have all of his sketches posted. RIP

>>55211581
I mean, it doesn't have to be straight adobe, my man. Why not do adobe and then Roman it up? Got that vision in mind? Cool, now do some Japanese lacquered wood on the inside, while you're at it, do carved designs above each doorway of the household diety, one of the Divines or maybe an old local superstition. I want to see your imagination go wild.

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>>55211692
>Ray's Memorial
I meant Adam's, sorry.
https://www.flickr.com/photos/47857688@N08/collections/72157629320914591/

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>>55211581
This Colovia is a wet dry land resembling the Wild West. I'm not sure what you could build besides adobe structures there. The idea is to base it on Pueblo architecture and Colovize thereafter. Though straight up Pueblo architecture would be good as ruins.

>>55211844
Eh, I'm not too crazy about just straight Pueblo, remember we still have Morrowind for a lot of earthy buildings close to the ground. Cyrodiil SHOULD look like an Imperial center. Colovia should just look like a martial/agrarian hub, but still one that is clearly connected to a wider network.

Not saying your idea is bad, I just ain't feelin' it, you know?

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>>55211905
Fair enough. I can see how it would be hard to make it look like a convincing civilization. I image Colovia as the more rural rugged part of Cyrodiil while the Nibenay Valley is the bread basket. Sort of like a dry Skyrim with less elevation besides the Highlands of course. I'm thinking this tower build on a dry land with seasonal rain.

>>55212037
I admit a bias here because I like Mediterranean stuff and I wouldn't mind seeing some of those influences in Colovia. I dunno' if you've ever seen wetland areas of Greece, but stuff like that. Dry heat with these semi-tropical patches.

Georgia is cool though, if you got anything else on it?

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>>55212074
This is more in tune with what I imagined. Reminds me of Skingrad which is important.

>>55212076
>
>>55212135
Are you the guy from earlier that I was talking about Skingrad with?

If so, howdy man.

In any case, I like that style a lot, spruce it up a bit with other influences and I would be down for it. Like the Akaviri stuff, where would you put bits of Japan/Korea/China on there?

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>>55211713
>>55211844
>>55211905
I've always liked to think of places like anvil having a that sort of southern Spanish look

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>>55212074
This I posted earlier is nice as well. I think this what the Highlands should like.
>>55209969
Look up Nakh architecture as well.

>>55212173
Ooooooh! Not gonna lie, man. Spain crossed my mind, but I always pegged Hammerfell for having a mix of Spanish and Carthaginian in addition to the Yokuda stuff. Like, it's Dwarf cities rebuilt by the Ra Gada who then adopted to Imperial ways, you gotta have some sort of wacky mixture in there.

Spain is fucking cool, though. You're good people for thinking of that.

>>55212169
You mean "Skin Town" what did he mean by this? Yup that was me.

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>>55212173

>>55212218
Sweet! Yeah, Skingrad has always been a fun town for me and a bit of Caucasian/Mediterranean in it would be very welcome. I don't know if pictures exist online, but the town of Spartachori has these trellises covered in greenery that black out entire streets at night because of no street lights. Combine that with Greek villages tendency to do cramped and tight winding streets and you get perfect claustrophobia.

(It really fucking scared me as a kid, man)

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>>55212269
Is this what you mean? There better images online, the few of them but they're all watermarked by alamy.

>>55212432
Yeah! I actually think that works really well for Colovia, remember that line you get in Chorral from the blacksmith I believe. "We're God-fearing folk here in Colovia, Easterners worship their wallets and fat bellies."

Something communal and folksy like the Greek idea of the town square would be wonderful.

And those trellises? They go all the way down streets sometimes.

>>55212506
Depends on the kind of viney. I'd picture it in a more cosmopolitan place like Anvil.

>>55212637
Anvil is already pretty coastal enough. Maybe I'm just getting carried away here with my love of that sort of stuff. But Skingrad is known for wines. It would be a nice touch to see a lot of amateur wine-making all around you as you walked into the town.

I 'spose how I feel about it is that a player should...within five minutes, get a feel for why this place is different, it should be visibly unique to them. I've got no beef with your ideas, though.

>>55212660
It would make the most sense in that context I agree with you but can vinery grow in a place with little rain?

>>55212724
Huh, I hadn't considered that aspect. Been having a few drinks so bear with me for a moment here. Did we establish Colovia as having little rain? As far as I recall, we know it is martial, but "little rain" as opposed to the East could just mean something like the Midwest or California. In which case.

...my man, you just gave me an idea.

Why not play up the fantasy bit with succulent vinery? Cactus like vines?

>>55212779
>cactus like vines
You have been drinking but I like it.
Did you post on the thread from yesterday? At the very end by chance?

>>55212779
Rislav the Righteous speaks of great winter rains in Colovia

>>55212871
>>55212878
Uhhhhh, bruhs.

I was there yesterday, from the start to finish, I had this group I was asking Hammerfell questions for and then it sorta spiraled into you guys being a blast to talk with.

>>55212878
>great winter rains

My fucking man, we got monsoons in Colovia! We have a reason to have times of dryness and times of great lushness and greenery!

You both are aces.

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>>55212878
Really? I was just thinking about how the Guide to the Empire describes the western coast of Colovia as "a wet-dry area". Could it be seasonal?
>>55212905
Behold the cactus vine.

>>55213048
Thanks for looking that up, that'd look cool manicured and made into all these specific designs in Colovia. Sort of a martial gardening, you maintain your garden as you maintain an army.

>>55212878
>"The winter rains had washed through the roads to the south, sending much of the West Weald spilling into Valenwood."
Sounds like it is.

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>>55201648
>without making it generic high fantasy capeshit
But generic high fantasy is good, Anon. Stop trying to be a special snowflake and embrace it.

>>55213293
Hey, man. People like what they will, I like high fantasy, but sometimes I like being surprised. A big part of this is how you execute it. There's more than enough room in Tamriel for all sorts of stuff.

>>55213341
Actually, following up.

What got y'all into TES? I had a friend who sorta bragged about it to me until I HAD to try it, what made you all like it?

>>55207452
>they've probably intermixed with Nords and even Orcs
IIRC, don't the Forsworn regularly attack the Orcish Strongholds?

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let's say bethesda is letting you design a quest for tes vi

what would you do? what part of the lore would you try to expand on with it?

>>55214239
I'd make the player have to act out a member of the jury in 12 Angry Men: TES Style where the jury is a slew of different races with the majority being whichever region it takes place in. You have no speech checks, your speech options just change depending on your skill and what you said beforehand. It is up to you to figure out what verdict to make and convince the others to your opinion.

That sound cool, sempai?

>>55214284
It wasn't the best, but deus ex human revolution had dialogue sequences that were basically what you're talking about.

>>55214239
Master tier crafting quests. Basically doing things like using telekinesis to direct lava flows, soul trapping special monsters, all to build different custom superweapons. Those are always fun quests.
Alternative, a quest where you have to attend a ball and sneak around that ball gathering information while mingling with guests and getting to use your reputation to get out of/into specific meetings with important noble people. Also the best kind of quest.

>>55214451
I felt really proud of myself for going through most of the big dialogue moments in HR and figuring my way through without augments helping me out. I just went how I thought the conversation should go for the result I wanted.

It's a pity that TES never really managed to do that - then again, they have to accommodate all sorts of different character types, and even when they focus it down like in Fallout Bethesda seems a little lackluster in that regard.

>>55214490
Yeah, I kind of regret taking the casie aug so early.
All the conversations ended up being "press x to win" even if they had the same outcome at doing it "manually", and I fear even if bethesda did add branching dialogue like that, then you'd get a speech perk which would basically be the same thing.

>>55214451
Sorry, was in the shower there for a moment. I just wanted to do something that wasn't SAVE THE WORLD or annoying mediocre. Just something that made the character try and think out what they were going to say and give a bit of background into the world as it did so.

>>55214239
I've always liked those scholarly focused quests, like the ones in Morrowind that had you finding ancient dwemer texts to have their contents translated.
Wish there was more stuff like that, sort of delving into ancient ruins to actually learn things about the long lost cultures that built them. Bonus points if the information you learn ends up being in someway relevant or alludes certain insights into the overall story.

>>55214239
You'd get a rumor from a random npc that is initially agressive so you have to calm him to talk to him, and he gives you pointless dribble as a response that somehow makes a map marker appear for the quest that just started, and at the end of that quest is a note floating in midair in the middle of nowhere, and on that note says "c0da is canon, fuck you".

>>55215065
Man, you seem bitter.

Chill for a sec and tell me what the issue is, give me how you feel, no bullshit.

>>55210633
Jehenna, the Dawnstar of High Rock

>>55213293
Generic high fantasy doesn't have maidens and knights though, it has a not!catholic faith and muh templars and muh opressed race and muh strong female protagonists. It's bland.

>>55214239
One way or another, Molag Bal contacts the player in his general brutish fashion. He needs someone to do his bidding and the player doesn't really have a choice. So, the player is sent to kill a very specific khajiit, behead him, then take his head to a blacksmith where he abuses and threatens the khajiit smith to get his will made. After a rough week, you get a letter telling you to come pick the helmet up. You take your helmet decorated with most of the face of a khajiit, and take it to the shrine, where the champion is awaiting you. Instead of just taking the helmet like was originally intended, he attacks you, and when you kill him, Molag Bal shrugs his shoulders and says "Alright, you did good in killing him, take your helmet and go back to what you were doing."

And that's how you end up with a new daedric artifact used with the skinned face of a sentient species as outer layer.

>>55214239
An older, feeble NPC in !UnnamedATThisTime village spends most of his time at the local tavern drinking swill and telling old adventure tales. Everyone in town has heard his stories a hundred times, but you are new and have not heard them. The old man asks you to take him to a very far place, for a reward of all the plunder. He wants to succeed at one final quest.

During this said quest, the old man walks slowly and asks you to also just walk and rest a while. He thinks all the commotion and running around of old is tiresome and you miss the big picture.

Fast travel is disabled during this quest, and all other active quests are inaccessible (but not failed/passed.) If you stray far from this man, you for some reason are attacked by very powerful creatures. Being near him, it is like being afflicted with Kyne's Peace.

The old man leads you to a dungeon all across the map, visiting cities for rest and talking to various people in between. Finally when you reach the dungeon, the old man asks you to lead on. This dungeon is labyrinthine-like, lasting seemingly forever. However, the puzzles inside are not simple and require you to backtrack, think a while, and even need you to have patience. At the end of the dungeon, if there ever was one, would require two people to activate. This old man says his role in the quest could not go beyond this, and even though he wished to have seen the end of this place with his own eyes, he enjoyed the last journey with the Hero to Be. And while he would not even be there at the end for the final bounty with the Hero, and his role a sacrifice for you to continue, the old man seems content to have enjoyed the journey - not the ends. He then says one more last puzzling statement to the player, "Please Save this moment, so I may be remembered forever. Should my story be over-written, please visit me again in the next life."

The end of dungeon has good loot, but no big bad boss enemy. The ending chamber also has no quick exit.

>>55215786
That sounds really heartwarming and also really frustrating at the same time. I honestly don't know how I'd feel about that unless I saw it in action.

Not letting this thread die, we still got one day left on this long weekend.

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>>55201648
My style guide for High Rock is:
>The Once and Future King
>Mask of the Red Death (both the story and the Vincent Price film)
>really, any early to mid 20th century gothic horror/fantasy will do
>A Field in England
>Worms of the Earth
>Twin Peaks
It's charming and idyllic with undertones of ancient strangeness. Everyday activities are tinged by ritual. There is a palatable sense that what is here now has been build on something far older. They world is beautiful but danger and mystery are ways just up the hill, down the road, beyond that tree.

But life it self goes on. The people are common but intelligent and enjoy argument and conversation. Books, elixirs and miraculous secrets are in high demand. Villages are always engaged in friendly rivalries.
The nobles are distant and often spooky to the common folks. While they too enjoy conversation, theirs tend to be to be tinged with conspiracy. Their diversions tend to be exotic, some even debauched. And their rivalries usually involve daedric pacts, curses and war. But for the common folk it's better to live by them than the weird folk of the woods.

The woods are full of chimeric creatures, talking animals with ancient political agendas, witches and wildlings, lost towns and deep holes. Spooky druid shit.
The roads are patrolled and guarded by highwaymen, soldiers hired by nobles and forgotten. Now they wander about in uniform hassling travellers in the name of whoever. They, like all bretons, love talking and often use it as an opportunity to set up traps.

Magic items are all over the fucking place. Usefully made for knights who end up meeting untimely ends by way of the supernatural or left as traps by warlocks.
Common folk ritually kill livestock to charge soulgems.
Everyone smokes pipes
Every town has a naked, opinionated man

tl;dr
>comfy low fantasy with gothic undertones
>No matter where you go someone wants to argue philosophy with you.

>>55217577
>hedge knight is actually a hedge

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>>55202675
You can see the Warrior, the Mage and the Thief in the sky in Sovngarde.

>>55218600
I never noticed that, neat.

>>55202675
in skyrim, there are what appear to be constellations, but I never bothered to really figure them out

>>55211078
>Menevia
>Tiny "kingdom" later absorbed into Wayrest
>Neighbors are Orsinium
Seems like a shitty place to live

>>55214239
It would be a Jyggalag quest,only for male characters.

You defeat,rape and kill a rogue priestess of Dibella to get a flat +25% damage bonus.

>>55220683
It is, unless you like cults and orc dick.

>>55220683
There's little to no lore about it, beyond a focus on Dibella in the 3rd Era and the usual vampire bloodline and witches cult stuff. There's some vague stuff about Azura worshipers in ESO?

>>55211426
That's not a bad guess judging by it's proximity to Daggerfall.

Why was Morrowind shit on so much in the new lore? They can't catch a break from one catastrophe to the next.

>>55222028
Maybe Vivec should have put that fucking rock down gently.

>>55222270
It might be that his post-Heart raw magical power wouldn't have been enough even if he wanted tom

>>55221893
Problem is that there's nothing to really support it - the island is technically a part of Daggerfall, and as far as I can tell none of the towns are named Craghold or anything like that.

>>55222502
I figured that was the case. I just like imagine him looking up at it and going. "Yeah, this is never going to bite me in the ass."

>>55221432
It doesn't even have a knightly order, just a Dibella whorehouse

>>55222028
That was planned during the development of Morrowins (the game).

>>55222270
I don't think he wanted too

>>55223430
Well that's just too bad for him, isn't it?

This thread is still up?

>>55223930
I think it's more of a Dunmer problem

>>55223978
I honestly count it as a loss for Vivec because of how much he stressed doing what he did for the Dunmer. I think it's kinda funny he just never considered what might happen with the giant space rock.

>>55223430
I saw arguments like, "this was to make Dunmer stronger so they're better prepared for the Landfall", but seeing the state Vivec was in at the time of TES3, I feel like he knew he fucked up and his lies are falling apart.

>>55223968
Long weekend

>>55209470
That's true, I hadn't realized how much quests are forced on you in Skyrim.

>>55220870
>implying all the breton attacks on orsinium aren't the female knights thirsting for orc dick

>>55226442
Mark, take your fanfiction and stay gone.

>>55225976
Skyrim and Fallout 4 really share that issue, people constantly try and force you to the main questline or talk about it all the time to you. It feels lazy in comparison to letting the player find it themselves.

>>55226683
>implying it's not fanfiction that makes women NOT like orc dick

>>55227047
This ain't 40k, buddy. Green isn't always best.

File: ordinator.jpg (160KB, 1280x720px) Image search: [Google]

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>ESO has ordinator armor on release
>it's shit
>like absolute garbage
>ESO Morrowind comes out
>remake it
>it looks great
Seriously, Trainwiz, who's the new artist, I want to fuck him.

File: 1458762061486.png (554KB, 973x821px) Image search: [Google]

554KB, 973x821px

Ending! Words! ALMSIVI!

>>55227349
Reminder that Dagoth Ur did nothing wrong.

>>55227280
>Release content
There's your problem. Day 1 ESO was an unplayable shitty WoW clone. ESO: OT is a somewhat enjoyable shitty WoW clone

The ending of these words is thicc argonian dicc.