Pathfinder General /pfg/

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>>55051387
Serious question, not bait, not trying to start a fight, just want to make an informed decision.

Why would/should I play Pathfinder over 5th Edition D&D?

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How well do your roleplay attempts go?

>>55051387
No children for her to pass anything down too.

>>55051412
They're both shit, but PF has easily 10 times the options that 5e has.

>>55051412
It really depends on the type of game you're interested in. 5E is great for a game that's less constrained by needing to have a precise rule for every action you take, whereas Pathfinder has a rule for everything. Unfortunately, 5E by virtue of being a newer system has significantly less material so it becomes harder to find crunch to precisely match the character you have in mind. If you want a simpler game where the narrative flows more easily, go with 5E. If you want a more complex game where you can precisely define what your character can do, go with Pathfinder.

>>55051412
You honestly shouldn't unless you plan on making heavy use of 3pp.

How do you quickly identify an element on the backstory that makes your character a Mary Sue?

>>55051539
If it feels cheap, forced, and only there to make them look more sympathetic/badass without also helping to add some depth to them.

>>55051387
I've only had one character with children, and he did when they were young. Now he's an old, old man, and they are adults.

>>55051539
Does it add anything to their overall narrative? Does that narrative ever have them fail or suffer due to their actions or inability to achieve?

>>55051412
Pathfinder has massive content bloat, so given any random character concept, there is probably a way to mechanically reflect what that concept could do in pathfinder, but there are rules systems for /everything/, so there are a lot of things to keep track of if you want to do anything.

5e is much less rules heavy, but has fairly restrictive character options, so any specific aspects of your character will likely be exclusive to roleplay, making your character mechanically dull by comparison

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>>55051387
I have two that have children.

The first adopted his squire when he lost his arm, and taught her his sword style. He only did it so she could protect herself, but then she went on to become an adventurer as well. He followed her secretly for months until he finally threw himself in front of her to save her from an Orc spear. After that he was too wounded to carry on, but he gave her his armor to show that he accepted her decision.

The other had two children, and taught them both to hunt and track, but they never became adventurers. He died far from home, without getting to see them grow up.

>>55051387
He might, if he ever has them. Mostly, he adventures so that he can give potential children something better than he has to offer right now.

>>55051438
I'd go with her. I'd go with her so hard.

>>55051556
>>55051556
I don't think that's inherently a sue thing just a mediocre writer/trope thing.

>>55051412
>Why would/should I play Pathfinder over 5th Edition D&D?
If you're asking that question, you probably shouldn't.

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>>55051582
I'd go with the bottom, but man do I wish that I could go with the top. Maybe I could help her to reach that point.

>>55051438
My attempts seem to go fairly well, but then, I don't really know what to use as a measuring stick. Attempts to seem cool usually get laughed at, attempts to seem sympathetic don't visibly hit home, and attempts to act naturally usually get overshadowed. I just try and act naturally, but I don't know if that's enough.

>>55051594
Bad writing is usually the cause of mary sue-dom, even if not all bad writers create mary sues. The point still stands.

>>55051539
Here's a good, but not necessarily flawless checklist

Loner?
Tragic Past?
Always wins?
Sits in the corner, away from everyone?
Vague revenge goal?
Is the best of the best, even though they're lvl1?

If three or more are checked, beware

>>55051412
5th edition is a boring, pared down system with barebones mechanics that serve only to facilitate cookie cutter characters. The skill system is a joke. Bounded accuracy is a garbage meme. It's a good system if you don't want to dive too deep, and that makes it ideal for playing with "normies", because you'll never have to explain much. It's stock car racing.

Pathfinder is a giant pile of garbage that you have to sift through, but if you do enough digging you can find something that works for what you want. The skeleton and basic mechanics are good enough that it's still enjoyable, but a lot of the details are fucked up and need some buffing out to make things smooth. It's like a bunch of hillbilly motorheads in the sticks racing wheeled abominations that, despite all logic saying they should just collapse, stay together and drift hard enough to make Initial D start spontaneously playing.

>>55051624
>Tragic Past?
Define tragic past, because I've seen people claim "anything bad happening to the character ever" as tragic.

>>55051387
We already had two threads up, you're a shit for making another. I dont care if you don't fucking like anime OP images, use the thread that was already up and had 100 posts.

>>55051539
Is the writer emotionally invested in the character?
If yes, then it will likely become a Mary Sue because most people are terrible writers.
Just accept it and run with it.

>>55051624
Always winning can be sort of done if you do it like a classical hero. They always win the battle, or defeat the bad guy, but they become humanized by failing somewhere personal. Maybe they can't actually prevent their daughter's death, or their loved one still rejects them, or something.

>>55051651
SHE STUBBED HER TOE ONCE, THE SUE!

>>55051651
I guess you're looking for someone who's past is defined by the tragedy that happened to them. It's the only thing about them you know.

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>>55051659

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>>55051539
We got a guy in our group that, without eve realizing it or trying to, creates ALWAYS a mary sue. Did this in 3 campaigns by now so i 'hope' to be able to give you some guidelines how to not create/play-like a mary sue.

1. Don´t make your char stronger than his actual level via backstory, you´re a level 1 fighter? Well, then you just learned how to use a sword without cutting yourself and probably have a bodycount from 0-1. Remember that cutting up even a little Goblin creates gallons of bloods and guts. Behave like that when you cut one for the first time. Don´t tell your GM "i try to behead him with my last strike". Don´t give away that "i´m awesome" vibe.
2. Don´t play a special snowflake. Chaotic good Drow? Fuck off. 3rd party white necromancer with a god-send mission? Sush.
3. Give him emotions. Even if you play an elf who is very distant, your char still feels stuff. Does it start to rain? Make him remember that he lost a friend in that rain.

And the most important point which i can´t stress enough.

5. Don´t force the party to see you as the fucking protagonist. Dramatic 10 minute monologue? No one will listen and find you annoying. You will feel when the group want´s you to be dramatic.

tl;dr: Don´t be a furry/goodly evil race/lvl-1 hero with a birthmark which you got because a god blessed you.

>>55051685
You're a giant faggot.
>>55030827
>>55030827
>>55030827
Actual thread. Use it until it hits bump limit, then come back to this thread if it's not gone.

>>55051438
Pretty well, depending. I've been in scenes that made people cry, which is probably the highlight of my roleplay experience. Other times, I've missed the mark with a character, and had to change the way they behave to fit what the party needs(quiet character becomes driving force of conversation because others aren't talking.) Overall, I think I do alright, but there's always something to work on. I need to improve my smug and condescending roleplay.

>>55051712
Fuck off, troll.

>>55051387
The only character I played with a child didn't know about his son. He knocked up a teenage farm girl when he was in his teens and young and dumb enough not to know how to take precautions, but his daddy was a traveling trader who he was helping with work, and they moved on out of town long before she found out.
Now his son's nearly 18, but the character is engaged to marry the love of his life hundreds of miles away. It would take a miracle for the boy to find his father.

>>55051701
You have shit taste. The only piece of advice worth a shit is 3 and 5.
>l-1 hero with a birthmark which you got because a god blessed you.
This full on describes one character class, multiple archetypes, and I'm pretty sure some traits.

>>55051387

Had an elf dude who's goal was to save his adopted half elf daughter. He actually saved her and retired from the group to continue to raise her while looking after and investing on the party's farmland.

He's still around teaching her his adventuring skills while also teaching her how to be a good farmer and landowner.

>>55051721
The only troll is the person who makes a new thread when we've already got one to use that has 100 posts in it.

For fucks sake I don't care how much foxposting animu OP's trigger you. One. Thread. At. A. Time. We've had generals banned before because people can't not be shitheels about sticking to *a* thread.

>>55051412
I choose pathfinder because more options, and the other anons have mentioned, but also, it's completely free. The SRD is pretty well taken care of.

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/

>>55051747
>implying getting /pfg/ banned isn't a noble and worthwhile goal

>>55051734
Ignore his stupid chart. He's just jealous of my vampire Kitsune Paladin/Necromancer who the BBEG is secretly in love with.

>>55051734
1 is actually decent advice. Level 1 characters being the land's greatest knight is fucking garbage. It's exaggerated in that you don't have to have JUST learned to use a sword, but you aren't the hottest shit with 5 titles to your name either. It makes no sense when you get BTFO by a CR 2 scrub after you killed an entire army before showing up in town.

>>55051760
5e has an equivalent website too, you know.

https://astranauta.github.io/5etools.html

>>55051747
Nah, dawg, the only troll is the asshole who spends his day bumping his shit threads because he gets his rocks off to forcing anime into the OP and then pretends to have the high road when the thread wrestles control of their messaging away from him. Get fucked, you literal pile of shit.

>>55051775
Yeah, I'll give him half of 1. It's just that.
>Don´t tell your GM "i try to behead him with my last strike". Don´t give away that "i´m awesome" vibe.
Seems so absotluely anti-ethical to a game like Pathfinder/modern D&D in general I wonder why the fuck he even plays it instead of a crying into blood, piss, and dirt simulator like Song of Swords and OSR shit.

>>55051734
I´m okay with having a shit taste than i guess.
1. No human being gives a fuck about those story-driven traits since they heavily influence your free writing.
2. Those classes and archetypes actually always got a fluff description why they are not aweseome chad. Oracles for example lose their vision to see more after like, 8 levels or are in constant immense pain because their arms are constantly charred so they can cast free fire spells from them.
You don´t get the point, It´s about not "being awesome just because you´re awesome".

>>55051780
1) The OP image doesn't affect the content of the thread at all, aside from triggering autists
2) Making duplicate threads is by any account a complete shit thing to do
3) I didn't even make the thread
4) Your 'protesting' does nothing aside from piss people off
5) You're a faggot.

>>55051776
Well shit me sideways.
Here I was thinking http://www.5esrd.com/ was the only attempt at that, and it had been largely abandoned halfway through core.

Thanks for showing me that.

>>55051776
Shame 5e's design philosophy means it's probably never going to have more options than PF.

>>55051809
Because it´s a RP about harsh medieval times where you can get nommed by pretty much everything no matter where you are, your Guildleader could be a friggin Medusa or Blue Dragon in disguise. Not Skyrim-on-Paper 3.5.

>>55051814
>ose classes and archetypes actually always got a fluff description why they are not aweseome chad
Please explain to me where Chosen One Paladins, Imperious Bloodline Sorcerers have shit like that.
>because their arms are constantly charred so they can cast free fire spells from them.
Sounds like edgy mary sue bullshit to me. It's not even some kinda green conscript who spent all 20 years of his life fucking potatoes!

>>55051814
>No human being gives a fuck about those story-driven traits since they heavily influence your free writing.
Oi fuck you m8, those traits are pretty fucking rad. A free holy symbol you can't get stolen on top of another bonus? That shits great. You should start out as a scrub, but that doesn't mean scrubs never have anything cool that makes them want to look forward into the bright future.

>>55051651
I've seen tragic past work. I think it's how much you emphasize it, and how tragic it is. If it's within reason and it has affected the character, but doesn't DEFINE the character, it's fine. If it makes no sense(needles torture and wanton cruelty that serves only to make the character tragic) or it's all they'll talk about, that's a problem. Knew a character who's family died. He'd shoehorn it into every conversation, and never got over it. Knew a character who killed his wife and fell into a depression for a time. Only found out about it like, 8 sessions in while trying to console another party member by sharing our own tales of hardship. It's about more than "has tragedy" it's about how it affects character development, and how it's presented.

>>55051859
>Because it´s a RP about harsh medieval times
D&D/PF isn't fucking medieval at all. The earlier editions DEBATABLE were, but certainly not 3.X

>>55051833
Options are fucking cancer. Why are there dozens of ways to hit people with swords in a system designed to penalize sword-hitters?
Pathfinder's "options" are a god damn farce

>>55051647
That is a really good metaphor. You sir have a way with words.

>>55051909
Yet somehow, despite 90% of it being trash, it still has a million times more content than 5e

>>55051930
This even ignoring the blatant trash, there is still more meaningful content than 5e ever had or will hope to have.

>>55051880
I guess you overlooked the fuckton of dragons, castles, swords and kings then mate. You pretty much forget that P&P is about taking or creating a Setting and doing what you want with it, ergo making it fun and immersive for your group. They want Dragons and Wizardry, fucking give it to them. Even the paizo main-storyboard writers said "can people stop gobbling down the raw setting?" They retconned pretty much the first year of books. Example: Elfs of Golarion is pretty much 50% non-canon by now.

>>55051957
>>55051930
PoW isn't meaningful just because it strokes your autistic fucking Naruto-watching number-crunching dick.

>>55051994
B-but muh jutsu.

>>55051485
Good answer.

>>55051964
Ah yes, how could I ever forget those late medival period dragons that were in central and eastern Germania

>>55051994
It is. You can not like it for other reasons, but the choices that system provides are actually meaninful.

This also ignoring Legendary Vigilante Content, Psionic Content, and Spheres of Power. Even base pathfinder martials(Slayer, Brawler, Bloodrager, etc) provide more choices and variety than 5e.

>>55051964

Most fantasy settings are late medieval or outright renaissance but with no guns.

>>55051994
PoW at least varies up your turns to be less full attack or charge spam

>>55051994
Kineticist more accurately reflects nardo anon. With the gathering energies and jutsu's and being drained by using too much magic.

>>55051485
>5E by virtue of being a newer system has significantly less material so it becomes harder to find crunch to precisely match the character you have in mind

Name five character concepts that can't be folded into a 5e PHB class or multiclass combination, and I'll belittle your taste in characters as a rebuttal

>>55051994
>I'm going to bring in something barely relevant because you said something I didn't like!

1pp Pathfinder alone still has a hundred times the interesting, useable content that 5e can or will have within the next decade. You throwing a fit because the system ALSO has tons of 3pp support is just whining that people like things you don't.

>>55051964
>dragons, castles, swords and kings
Those things don't automatically make things medieval and the rest of your post is pretty much just buzzwords and non-sequitur. 3.X settings as portrayed both by mechanics and what is written have a lot more in common with the mid to late early modern period

>>55051994
>he thinks Naruto is about ninjas
Nigga that shit is just wizards being wizards

>>55052027
Not that Anon, but how do we weigh the value of choices when we look at decisions like this? Are buffets the best kinds of restaurants because you can tailor your experience from loads of interesting options? Or are they the worst because they make you feel ill afterwards?

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Man, this thread sucks.

>>55052053
Psion

Soulknife (Warlocks don't count unless you can show me the text where soulknives make pacts with demon lords to get their mind blades).

Alchemists

Spiritualist

Oracle.

>>55052066
Naruto isn't fucking about ninjas at all. The earlier chapters DEBATABLE were, but certainly not Shippuden

>>55052093
What is 5e's Mystic?

>>55052015
Oh sorry, i wasn´t aware that you need to delete fantasy in a medieval fantasy setting to have a real medieval setting. My bad.

>>55052034
Guns in Golarion are just enough to arm 5% of the population. 4% of those are ONLY in the mana wastes. So you got on 95% of the planet 1% of all guns. If you´re talking about those laser-rifle and bot/clockwerk stuff. You know that you don´t have to use it ever if you don´t want to. That´s what i meant by stop eating the raw setting.

The reason paizo made so much content and not 20 lands with the same setting but 1 land with medieval stuff, 1 with lazerrifles, 1 with pharaos, 1 with vikings, 1 with russian mythology etc etc etc, is so you can choose what the hell you want to play in.

>>55052082
>Or are they the worst because they make you feel ill afterwards?
I don't feel ill afterwards. I personally would rather enjoy a mediocre meal of stuff I love than a well done meal of stuff I dislike/am incredibly ambivalent towards. It ultimately comes down to what you value.

>>55052082
That's almost a decent analogy. You could look at something like 5E as being a family style restaurant, where you get something simple and easy to make, but that can still satisfy if you've never been to or had an interest in gourmet cuisine.

Pathfinder is like a buffet, where you can load your plate with whatever you like, but some of it isn't as good because how could it be? They have to present all these choices so they don't have time to make sure they're all high standard. But some people don't mind loading up on rolls and mashed potatoes because they're staples and they get the job done.

>>55052102
Anon was clever. They picked classes that Wizards admitted they were missing by putting them in UAs; the Mystic and Artificer do cover all of those (except oracle, which was a joke suggestion and a background at best,) but Mystic and Artificer expressly are not core 5e

>>55052053
Mounted knight, with a mount that doesn't get slaughtered at higher levels.

>>55052089
What did he mean by this?

>>55052055
Fuck off, Kawase

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>>55052136
What do you think they meant?

>>55052111

Guns is not what defines a renaissance setting. Renaissance settings feature bigger cities, stronger kings, standing armies etc. Guns is an element of the renaissance but not the only nor the most important one.

>>55052102
Not a PHB class. And honestly a lot less fun and well designed than what the Psion/Psionics as a whole was
>>55052131
That's not being clever that's literally doing as asked. But okay, we can go deeper.
>Aegis
>Summoner(with Eiodolan)
>Monster Cowboy
>Ungermaw
>Savage Technologist Barbarian
>Techslinger Gunslinger
>Corpse Puppeteer Kineticist
>Symbiotic Slayer Vigilante

>>55052125
I just wanna play a cute game with my bread and potato friends...

>>55052157
..."Hey guise look imma gurl lookit mah boobs"?

>>55052163
Those are all atrocious and you know it

>>55052200
>get told
>well they're bad!
Enjoy your Lord of the Rings rip off game, because that's all 5e can handle adequately. Luckily it handles it well.

>>55052183
I secretly wrote a campaign where you take an Elf child from one side of the world to another to meet her family, and for the most part it revolves around protecting her and nurturing her, and when you get to the end she wants to stay with you and cries if you don't let her and uses all the adventuring skill she learned by watching you to escape her home, track you, rejoin the group, and ask you to be her family. It's in a lockbox and nobody will ever read it but it made me feel good to make

>>55052131
How the fuck can either of those classes emulate a spiritualist.

>>55052246
>spiritualist
>even remotely a valuable or worthwhile concept
Holy shit nigga what? Make your case, because I ain't seeing it

>>55052226
Marry me Anon

>>55052221
I've never played a game that even came close to the Lord of the Rings and now that I think about it, it really upsets me.

>>55052265
I'm not because at this point we'er getting into what we think makes good fantasy witch is purely opinion based. And it's not like your going to be open to anything I say in the first place, so why fucking bother?

5e does not let me emulate concepts and shit I care about beyond super basic bitch martial types. That may not be the case for you, if so, good.

>>55052197
>he doesn't know what that shirt is
Newfags need to go

>>55052053
>Vigilante, in the actual "dual identity" sense and totally ignoring the radical amount of modularity of the class
>Occultist, mechanically
>Unchained Monk, in the "I am not just a shitty fighter with a 3/day stun" sense
>Iron Caster Fighter
>Do I seriously have to pick only five, because Alchemist has at least a dozen ways to build it factoring archetypes that are all perfectly functional

>>55052226
>elf
It's shit right off the bat. The rest is shit too, the concept was damned from the beginning.

>>55052322
Fuck you, that story sounds great

>>55052321
>>Vigilante, in the actual "dual identity" sense and totally ignoring the radical amount of modularity of the class
To be fair, fluff wise Vigilante is something EVERYONE with a disguise check should be able to do if so inclined. Let's be real.
>Occultist
Fluff wise too strictly speaking.
>uncahined monk
Base 5e monk.
>Iron Caster Fighter
We both know that isn't really a concept, just an esoteric build.

I agree with you overall though.

>>55052321
Why are you listing classes instead of character concepts?

>>55052310
>witch is purely opinion based
Anon confirmed for consorting with Satan

>>55052353
Because I could lost anything and you'd just call it garbage if it couldn't be done in your shallow system

>>55052368
I don't even like 5e, I'm just wondering whether you're trolling or genuinely that stupid.

>>55052353
By the nature of the way some classes are they can be one in the same.

>>55052321
>>55052321
Iron Caster was a fucking mistake and you know it, core 5e monks are proportional superior to unchained monks, and vigilante is covered by the disguise skill and a damn background with casual ease.

I'm tempted to give you credit for alchemist and occultist, though. Fictional substance and item users are underrepresented in 5e.

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>anime OP so bootyblasted that we didn't use his thread TWICE so he stirs shit about 5e and PF
Calm down, buddy, relax.

>>55052392

>I'm tempted to give you credit for alchemist and occultist, though. Fictional substance and item users are underrepresented in 5e.

They've had 2 shots at the Artificer and both of them ended up pretty damn crap (Though the first was a lot worse)

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>>55052197
>Girl
Ohohoho

I'm building an encounter where the party are fighting a Greater Magma Elemental on a lake of lava. They'd need to keep moving between small patches of land as the lava levels rise in different spots.

I'm trying to figure what the lava would do if they somehow fail to make the jump. Surely not instant death?

>>55052416
Yeah, and object/drug use is probably the only meaningful design space that's conspicuously absent besides psychic powers, which they're also working on.

>>55052416
Even then artificers really aren't alchemists. They're wizards who make things. The alchemist artificer doesn't get extracts, mutagens, tumor familiars, stink bombs, etc.

>>55052458
>which they're also working on.
And are also kinda shitty last I checked.

>>55052458
I hope they never release psionics. Ever psionic character I've ever played with was horrible. It's like a magnet for socially stunted jerks

>>55052385
Do you actually want exact, esoteric character concepts or something? Because it's 2 in the morning and fuck sifting through the bowels of nethys for exact details to prove a point in a meaningless argument started by obvious (yet delicious in salt produced) bait.

>>55052482
>t. shitter

What should be the penalty for adultery?

>>55052483
>it's 2 am
Holy shit, why am I shitposting at 2 in the morning?
>>55052504
Your partner takes all your shit.

>>55052504
Give us the context before people start assuming facts.

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>>55052504
>penalty

>>55052504
The accused shall be cut into two equal halves, and distributed to both partners

>>55052504
Could be anything from unofficial censure to being stoned to death.

>>55052504
Depends, how high up the political ladder is the couple? If it's the regent and their spouse, that adultery is often tantamount to treason.

>>55052519
Sounds fair assuming you bisect them across the waist. Everyone gets a hole/fairly phallic appendage to use.

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>>55052546
Jesus christ /pfg/. I know you guys are just horny ERP shits, but that's fucked up.

How high can sizes get?

I want an elemental that is fuck off huge and Huge doesn't seem to cut it.

>>55052938
Colossal is the biggest you can get. Maybe ask your GM about converting the spell Summon Elemental Monolith from 3.5's Complete Arcane.

>>55052993
Oh, I am the GM. I'm building an encounter and was trying to see how big the Elemental could get.

A Colossal Elder Magma Elemental should be interesting.

>>55053024
Don't Primal Elementals or whatever they're called get bigger than Huge naturally?

>>55053055
I'm not sure what you're referring to, I might be unaware of this.

>>55053065
I was remembering something back from my 3.5 days, though with a little bit of modding you can port them over with little issue I think. They're definitely something that fits the mold of "crazy huge elemental", though unless your party is high enough level I'd suggest against having them fight one.

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/epic/monsters/elementalPrimal.htm

>>55053024
I think there are also technically some bigger-than-Colossal sizes for things like Spelljammer, but I don't know how you'd convert something like Titanic size to Pathfinder's system.

>>55053101
Holy shit, that's perfect for another game of mine.

This boss is just meant to be a very difficult endboss of the first long arc of this campaign...

But one of these babies is EXACTLY what I need for another game of mine.

>>55053154
If I remember correctly these things are basically the Dragons of the Elemental Planes (even more than the actual Elemental Dragons), so I'd suggest playing it as such. Regardless, have fun and be sure to do the necessary porting so things work with PF's rules and number mechanics.

>>55053187
Maybe I could even have it be that the Colossal Magma Elemental the party fights is but a weakened avatar of the Primal Fire Elemental that lords of the Plane of Fire...

Mythic Combat Reflexes gives unlimited Attacks of Opportunity.

What's the best way I can exploit this?

>>55053331
Be a warder with 70ft reach.

>>55051387
Can a Witch get any decent use out of a decent intimidate score?

Besides the obvious mad cackling?

>>55053735
Nope

Alright so I asked this question a few threads ago and I got occultist as the answer but that didn't really add up. What is the best class to play a zookeeper Necromancer? I want as many undead minions as I can get. Stuff like Wights if possible

>>55053820
I think Oracle. They have a few ways to cheese more HD. Also, once they're in the exhibits, you probably don't need to control them. Or you can transfer control to employees by having them spam Control Undead. I'm not sure though, I've never played a necro. Just played with one, and he seemed to think Oracle was the way.

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Are these guys synth summoners / gestalted with whatever-the-hell else?

>SeeD's are primary users of Junctioning technology alongside Guardian Forces. Junctioning allows individuals to replicate the powers of Sorceresses through para-magic, a means of 'drawing', stocking and later releasing fundamental forces of creation.
>Through the use of Guardian forces and Junctioning, soldiers can become impossibly fast, unbelievably strong and resilient, and it can even allow small commando squads to take down fearsome monsters and war-machines without breaking a sweat!

Not quite sure what Squall is, but he's a melee specialist and gunblades are noted as being hard to master (so much so that there might only be a handful of them in a generation). Selphie is magically inclined but squishy. Quistis is actually labeled a "blue-mage" a few times and has semi-generalist stats. Zell is a monk-y punch-guy. Irvine is a marksman and 'specialist' who often uses shotguns. Rinoa is a sorceress... who has strength and magic scores a good 20 points higher than anyone elses (at level 100).

Oh and when going gets really rough they can actually summon their junctioned guardian forces to fight for a bit (though as it was an older FF, they just show up, do one attack then fuck off).

>>55053735
>>55053786
Feast On Fear hex.

>>55053820
Let me guess, you're a "good" necromancer.

Evening, /pfg/

I'm currently working on a homebrew PF setting, and it's almost to the point where I need to start looking at maps- so this is a good moment to pause and ask for comment and criticism. The cosmology, the creation history and the gods are up and running, it's a map, society and society history that still needs to be written out.

Setting write-up: bit ly 2vuY1Ys
Discord for discussion: discord gg fSAE7Pk
(add a period/full stop before the ly and gg and a forward slash after, removing spaces)

Tear it to bits, please.

Also, if anyone has any good art of what is loosely a wizard and a knight fighting or embracing, I'd be terribly grateful; my searches are finally coming up dry.

How bad of an idea would playing an Avowed while the rest of the party is 1pp be?

Can you spellstrike and spellcombat with natural weapons and unarmed strikes?

>>55055406
you have to take an arcana for spell combat and natural weapons, but spellstrikes have always been able to be used with natural weapon and unarmed strikes - it's like making a melee touch attack, except without the touch part.

>>55051624
>>55051666
He's still a virgin because he NEVER LOSES.

>>55052504
In Pathfinder? The man is clearly at fault and must lose all his wealth and prestige to the suffering woman.

>>55055383
It's not really a bad idea. Avowed isn't massively powerful so it should work well alongside 1PP classes.

>>55055383
>>55055635
Corollary is that it's much easier to get right than other classes.

For 1pp you need to look over items and feats from three different books to make a class perform competently, and maybe a dozen to make it work to its full potential.

For Avowed even if threw things at a dartboard to see what to pick, you're probably still going to end up decent.

The less experienced the group as a whole is, the stronger Avowed will feel.

Between choosing an Alchemist or Investigator. I play a lot of Bards, so Invest seems neat, but the inability to hand my extracts to other people seem meh? Why have all these killer buff potions if I can't support the party?

Invest seems like not much of a team player unless you want a selfish know it all. Am I interpreting the class wrong?

>>55055868
You are interpreting it wrong in the sense that the alchemist has the exact same problem.

You both need to take the Infusion discovery/talent, which the Investigator can access through this
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/hybrid-classes/investigator/investigator-talents/paizo-investigator-talents/alchemist-discovery

Many GMs waive this tax and give both alchemists and investigators this discovery for free: it's worth asking if they seem the type to allow it.

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>>55051387
>Does your character try to pass down his trade and traditions to his children?

Children? Why would my character have children? Nobody has children anymore, you know that. We just expect the immigrants to replace us when we fall down or waste away. What the heck's a tradition, anyway? We don't have those either, except for the commercialized ones or the stock, "love people" messages we got from Barney. Imagine living in a day and age when the average hero to someone is not a historical figure, but a character from a children's story or fancy cartoon.

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What are the stats make a good vivisectionist?

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What skin, hair, and eye combinations works better for Tiefligns?

>>55056005
Can you blame them? There are no heroes left in man.

>>55056111
That's a stupid question, and you should feel stupid for asking it.

>>55056088
18/18/18/18/18/18, pre-racial, of course.

>>55056111
I usually find that having all three works best, but you can scrape by with just skin and eyes.

Isekai campaign where the Pcs are all gestalted 9 casters in a world of 6 casters when?

>>55056111
Mocha skin, black hair, golden eyes.

>>55056221
After everything else bamboozles, just in time to spark hope once more. After the inevitable bimbam, when your hopes and dreams lie in ashes, then you have my permission to cry.

>>55056290
>>55056221
Ruins of Azlant campaign when?

>>55056221
Set it in PLD

>>55056300
Only after you breathe your last breath.

How does Erastil feel about semi-open relationships? Not quite full on open, but like; two dudes are married, one of the dudes is bi and is in love with a girl too, the dude's husband says it's fine, since the girl's a good friend of his too, and they all live together and keep it within the three of them and tehy're all okay with it?

>>55056564
Shelyn would approve, I doubt Erastil would considering the precedent they're setting to the rest of the village.

>>55056611

I'm mostly asking for a game I'm in, which has involved my character (a paladin of Shelyn) falling in love with a druid who worships erastil (the other dude) and a cleric of abadar (the chick), and we're trying to figure out a way to make it work that all our deities will approve of. We've already checked local laws, there's nothing against this sort of arrangement as long as no one's married more than once and no emotional damages happen as a result. No one wants to break anyone else's heart but since we're all divine characters there is a real worry of our deities becoming miffed.

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>>55056658

Well, it's highly irregular, but so long as they all do their part to raise their family and better the community through hard work and honest living, it's probably alright.

>>55056658
Ask your GM. This is gray area, I feel.

>>55056711

GM's told us to present a logical arguement why it will be alright to our gods, since we basically plan to petition them for permission once we have our lines crossed and dotted.

>>55056699
That's the plan; between adopting any orphans and whatever comes from the paladin and cleric, they're definitely all going to play a part in raising children in the household and raising them well; we're all pretty community minded. My character likes to organize festivals and the like; the cleric's put in to be the village's magistrate when the current one passes or retires, and the druid's really loved by the local farmers.

Plus between us and the other two members of our party (a magus and an investigator) we're the only PC classed people around, so we've been quite handy at things like 'dissuading barbarian raiders' and 'helping out with the king's taxes'.

>>55056770
What's actually allowing you to settle down in one area, is this a kingdom building campaign or something?

>>55056843

Campaign's been going on for a bit; started at level 1, we're around level 8 now; we've done a bunch of stuff and decided that it's time to settle down; there's no pressing concerns elsewhere and we're interested in helping a place build up and prosper. (Also the druid is getting nesting urges). So we've gone back to a village we helped save from a dragon once and are settling down; it's letting emotions come out that some of us have been keeping down mostly due to the large amount of life-threatening danger we had previously been in; we've been settled down for about eight months now.

We're basically transitioning into at least a village building/comfy campaign from a traditional campaign, and it's pretty nice.

>>55056658
This is the kind of situation Commune and Divination was meant for.

What's the fastesr way to a man's heart?

>>55057054
Through his eyes, then his penis, then his stomach.

>>55057054
4th rib

>>55056883
That sounds really cute. Hopefully your bisexual triangle lives happily. Do they actually all pile into bed together, or do they keep separate rooms?

The pillar of flesh has been constructed.

>>55057230

We've been working on the house; right now there's one master bedroom we all generally use, but there's individual bedrooms both for storage and in case someone's out late they can slide into there without disturbing someone else.

>>55057253
Pious Augustus pls go.

I can't believe Taveena is fucking dead

Why are my characters always cursed to eternal loneliness?

>>55057333
probably because the person playing them consistently isn't able to roleplay an open and friendly personality

>>55057284
If you don't mind my asking, what about romantic and physical expression? Do they all go on cute dates at once? Do they all get frisky at once?
I can see a problem with a yes or a no answer, so I'm curious which it is.

>>55056564
Erastil doesn't really give a shit about your sexual perversions as long as it isn't damaging the community and you're still contributing/trying to contribute to the benefit of the whole.

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>>55057544

>>55057515

Romantic is usually between the two halves--the druid and the cleric are good friends but not lovers, but aren't above hugs and chaste kissing (especially since the druid is about as gay as a daffodil).

Three way dates are, however, a go and extremely cute, because there's nothing better than going on a date that also involves your best friend and making everyone involved happy. Frisky is the same deal as romance; two of the involved aren't romantic partners, just good friends, and one of those people isn't sexually attracted to the third.

>>55057628
That was what I figured. The problem I see is that this arrangement puts our bisexual in a very good position (double romance,) while forcing the other participants to share time and attention for their respective single romances. It sounds like everyone is a goodly person who cares about everyone else, but know that on some level this fundamental inequality could cause issues (or even just sad feelings) in the future, even if the subordinate participants don't realize it or even willfully deny it.

>>55057574
I feel bad for Eamon's friend, he's a childhood partner, single, and graying.

>>55057423
But I do! I do! Only NPCs are either disinterested in anything more than working partners, and the other PCs are enamored with their own little ships or dalliances.

I feel like the third wheel everywhere I go...

What does an elf look like at the end of his or her life?

>>55057693

We've acknowledged that may be an issue, but have resolved as a group to try to head it off at the pass and, if it happens, work through it as best we can.

>>55057882
You sound familiar...

>>55057892
I think a worthy gift an outsider could give them would be to surreptitiously use a series of enchantments to make the two subordinate points attracted to one another, completing the last side of the triangle.
Just a sneaky, nosy enchantress with a fetish for MMF.

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>>55057887

>>55057887
They're described as aging gracefully, so imagine that Grandma or grandpa you still think could score at the club.

>>55057965
Like the old most interesting man in the world?

>>55057908
I do?!

>Feather fall scroll x4
>Hero's defiance scroll
>Etc
Ok, our GM clearly hates us, so many immediate spells on scrolls that only work as reaction to an action. Merchants don't even want them.

I never realized how fucking strong Erastil Evangelist Rangers are.

A second animal companion, wisdom to attack and damage with long bows at level 14. It's so fucking good.

I've never tried a ranger, would an Evangelist Erastilian Ranger be a good start?

>>55058001
Pretty much yeah.
For female elves, think like Helen Mirren or something

>>55058328
This is why you get an extra appendage to hold them.

>>55058328
Sell them to novice Wizards who want those spells in their spellbooks

>>55058381
That doesn't do shit, activating a scroll is a standard action

>>55058328
After deciding what good loot to give a group I like throwing in useless stuff for fun as bonuses.

Sounds like your GM is doing that.

>>55058452
There should be a feat for this.

>>55052061
What is the most Medieval place in Golarion? It's generally agreed to be Brevoy, right? So what specifically makes Brevoy Medieval if not that kind of stuff?

Also, separate but related question: should Medieval be high or low fantasy? Or can it be either?

>>55058790
Aristocratic infighting

What is the best ways to gain feats when one's feat economy is already stretched thin? Specifically looking at feats like Quick Draw (for pre-requisites), Ricochet Toss, Improved Feint and the Startoss Style feats.

>>55058905
Be a fighter, honestly.

>>55058790
>So what specifically makes Brevoy Medieval if not that kind of stuff?

Well, it's all that stuff you listed along with a relatively sober and "historical" approach to nobility and gender roles.

>>55058965
I've been thinking about multi-classing into it. Currently a level 5 Swashbuckler (flying blade), unlikely too commit more too it. Though I am likely too go Devoted Muse, but need too build my feats before that.

>>55058790
Male-oriented primogeniture, a distinct lack of magical influence (almost everything is knights, swordfighting, and intrigue), a lack of a clear moral compass (which is bizarre since Mendev and the Worldwound are RIGHT FUCKING ACROSS THE LAKE), and a huge emphasis on aristocratic infighting to the point where you can actually just say "Oh those are just [x] from Game of Thrones"

>>55057882
I too have been this wheel.

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>>55059677
From one third wheel to another, c'mere you.

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>>55059904
You're so kind. Like an angel.

Are my players retards? It feels like the second any enemy uses their brain they immediately buckle.

Here is an example:
>NPCs talking about a hobgoblin army forming in the mountains
>NPCs tell PCs how merchant caravans are raided, but not killed unless they resist, and a portion of their goods taken
>PCs hired as guards for a caravan against these hobgoblins specifically
>heading through the passes they know contain hobgoblins
>PCs don't bother keeping watch
>PCs don't both scouting ahead
>Two PCs are drinking, one is in a caravan brewing potions, the other is behind the caravan on his horse trying to woo a female NPC
>no one sees the hobgoblins on top of the bluff overlooking the road
>hobgoblins have set up a barricade down the road
>two hobgoblins there, they announce "Offer your wagons for inspection and no one will be injured, we will take a tithe for the maintaining of the safety of the mountain roads."
>PCs come up front as the leader of the caravan says he isn't gonna surrender their goods
>Two hobgoblins tell the party they need to comply or action will be taken to force them to comply, unless they wish to turn around and head back where they came
>Caravan leader tells the PCs to kill them
>PCs start going for weapons
>One hobgoblin blows a whistle, from over the barricade a rope ladder is thrown down
>Other hobgoblin pulls out his sword
>from behind the PCs they hear a crash, a log was thrown from atop the cliff into the road to block the path back for the wagons
>Hobgoblins grab the rope ladder as initiative starts
>Round 1 they start getting pulled up over the barricade as one fends off the PCs with his sword
>From above hobgoblin archers are firing down
>This is one of only like 5 passes through the mountains, the garrison here was 30 hobgoblins, 10 in the barricade, 20 on the cliff with their camp 300ft back
>Hobgoblins above target the PCs and other caravan guards
(1/2)

>>55060076
>Fighter goes to try and break down the barricade, it's just lashed and tarred together logs, it's pretty solid
>Other PCs fire back and realize the hobgoblins are shooting from behind cover and there are a ton of them
>Eventually a bunch of guards and two PCs go down
>Fighter decides it's time to book it, grabs the two unconscious guys and goes down the cliff (it's a 30ft drop, he bet he could survive)
>He does and books it into the woods
>Other caravan guards and merchants are doing the same, abandoning their stuff
>All in all 8 of the 24 men in the caravan died, another 10 were badly injured.
>6 men died to arrows, 2 men died in the jump down
>7 of the injured were left behind
>party blamed for what happens
>Hobgoblins decline to pursue the party, but now they're without supplies in the middle of the forrest in enemy territory with a group of injured merchants and caravan guards who hate them.

So is it my fault the PCs walked into an ambush. Sure a caravaner told them to go for it, but he thought it was because the PCs were so cocksure that he didn't need to worry.

>>55060090
Is your party used to these kinds of basic tactics being necessary? I know that in a couple of groups I've been in they're so used to being handheld and coddled by the GM's plot that whenever they were being led into a trap they'd go happily skipping and jumping into oblivion.

>>55060132
This is their first big combat encounter.

>>55060132
Or leashed by it. Sometimes groups stop bothering with those tactics because they quite simply do not work: Whichever path you take will have you start the battle surrounded at close range by the ambush, whichever first chest you open is the mimic, and so on.

>>55060179
The path one I personally get as a GM, but if you're not even trying to leave your players in suspense if you're planning on throwing a mimic at them then you're just bad at suspense.

>>55060076
Your players seem pretty retarded.

Although granted I'm not sure what party composition they have, what level they are, how many of them they are, and if this scenario was something they were meant to actually be able to fight it out and win.

The 30 enemies in a fortified position makes me guess no, they weren't supposed to try and duke it out, and I'm not sure how easy it would have been to sneak up on them given the Hobs seem pretty competent.

>>55060076
>>55060090
>hired as guards
>don't do any of the things guards are supposed to do
Nah, they deserved it.

>>55052053
The good old brute rogue.

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>>55058905
Ask your DM to use alternate rules, like the feat tax revision:

>http://michaeliantorno.com/feat-taxes-in-pathfinder/

>>55060450
I'm still waiting for this to be expanded on

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>>55060467
I would expand on it for my game, but they've all been gestalt with PoW.

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>>55060564
Shit feat taxes are still shit feat taxes.

>>55055383
I'll agree with what >>55055817 says. The Avowed, despite people attempting to meme it to death, isn't actually that amazing. It can competently deal damage in various methods (AoE, full-attack, single-target range), and has plenty of different options for you to fill a niche a party doesn't have filled yet (skillmonkey, debuffer, utility caster, self-buffer, etc). In that way, it's no different than Alchemist.

The difference is, Alchemist needs you to understand how the class works and what combines well with it to make what you want, or else you'll feel like you're lagging behind. Avowed, in comparison, doesn't need to think as hard in order to get the same results. To someone with system mastery, this is a weakness or a neutral effect; you don't need to optimize when any route you take is going to end up "decent at the very least". To someone who doesn't know, however, the fact that you're ALWAYS going to be competent makes you look more powerful than you really are.

>>55060825
So ivory tower good, avowed bad? Got it.

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>>55055817
>>55060825
>mfw the ease-of-creation is exactly why I want to play one
>mfw because it's so damn easy to work with it LOOKS to be way stronger than everything else, despite likely falling slightly behind
>mfw it keeps getting nerfed and denied from games because people bitch about perceived power

I just want to be a generic magic knight guy without having to suffer through vancian magic's shitty limitations, or juggle a million stupid sphere talents to attempt the most basic fucking things.

>>55060965
The exact opposite, actually. Avowed is great for new players because you can't go wrong with it; point and click, choose whatever sounds cool, done. It's like the magical Barbarian, except even easier to understand and even more options to mess around with beyond CHARGEPOUNCELANCE. People who think Ivory Tower design is good don't actually know good game design whatsoever.
>>55060988
It's not really "nerfed" if it's still in playtest, isn't it? Some shit is too powerful, other shit is too weak, they devs have a balance point they're aiming for and making adjustments to reach that point, and most importantly they actually KNOW what balance is, as opposed to Pai "Crane Style" Zo.

>>55060988
>tfw aether channel and aether blade are perfect for being the "I use a magical flame sword" from level 1
>people bitch about dumb shit so it keeps getting nerfed
I fucking hate you goddamn pfs-tier faggots who whine if something martial does what it intends to before level fucking 5. Fuck off with your bullshit game design practices.

>>55061080
>>55060988
Is it wrong that I prefer the fact that the AoEs got buffed rather than caring if Channel/Blade/Barrage got nerfed?

>>55061092
I mean, it makes the common solution to PoW's problems easily solved by avowed's strengths. Can't use a lot of small guys to soak up the initiator's strong single target damage, and force counters as easily if they all die to the avowed's AoE.

>>55061017
>It's not really "nerfed" if it's still in playtest, isn't it?

Yes, it has gotten hard nerfed, being in playtest means that they openly admit that they need to keep making more changes. That they're still better designers and have a better grasp of game balance than paizo is pretty much just praising them for not having brain damage. Plus, like >>55061080 points out, they've still made numerous fumbles that they've yet to recover from, though given how much they have to spread their attention to other projects it's understandable if they have to put shit off for later.

>>55061092
Aether Blade and Barrage are both good, and I don't recall either getting significant nerfs recently. Aether Channel and Rounds, meanwhile, have been shafted super hard, and I don't feel the damage you add is worth the significantly lowered accuracy.
Channel/Barrage adding full Pulse dice was a mistake

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>>55051387
r8

>>55061259
What class?

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Stat Corrupted Eshe from Sundered.

>>55061397
Tetori Monk

>>55060414
Strength rogue is fucking great, go barbarogue and you're the best martial grappler in the game.

What does a PC's race tell you about the player? What does each race say?

>>55061813
Absolutely nothing.

>>55061813
People who always play Kitsune tend to be flaming homosexuals.

>>55052131
Actually Oracle is a base class. Wizard with a Divination focus has more or less similar abilities as you'd expect from the 3.5 Oracle.

>>55061813
Habitual tiefling players probably got issues.

>>55052321
You can use the Charlatan background to be a Vigilante with 2 identities. It's in the core book.

>>55061977
Good point. Add a custom background to reflect your sad sack oracle life if needed.

>>55061999
I still want to fuck tieflings though

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>>55061977
>>55062016
>>55062019
>5efag dredging up old posts to stir shit

>>55062036
Males, females, or #83?

>>55062058
All of the above, Anon

>>55062019
I'd either pick Sage or Acolyte personally, but plenty of the backgrounds could work.

>>55062074
Hermit, with the "seen some shit" bond

>>55061813
Usually nothing at all. Race choices often both mechanically boring, and poorly use their race to really add to their narrative. People pick it for stats/abilities. People pick it and then do absolutely nothing with it. These aren't exclusive.

So uh for Evangelist, you absolutely, positively can't cheat on your god for the purpose of qualifying for other classes right?

>>55062224
>cheating on your god
Is it ever an idea worth considering if you have an important connection with them

>>55062284
For crunch reasons, I want both Evangelist of Gorum and Darechaser

For fluff reasons, I'd argue that it would make sense for my gladiator to pay homage to both, since he's both a warrior and an athlete

>>55062284
Grass is always greener

>>55062284
>ywn cheat on Shelyn with Milani
>ywn make Shelyn cry the tears of the cucked

>>55052053
I mostly play pathfinder because of the very expansive 3rd Party support which allows me to not only create nearly any character concept, but have those character concepts available at or before level 5. Hell with Spheres of Power, most magical character concepts can be made at 1st level.
>Ant-man? Resizer Mageknight
>Magneto? Incanter focusing in Metal geomancing.
>Megaman? Blaster Armorist
>Daredevil? Blind Swordsman Samurai
>Thor? Armorist
>Beastboy? Protean Shifter
I could go on, especially if Spheres of Might is included.

>>55062405
Shelyn would probably just bone Sarenrae and Desna in a goddess threesome that has been canon since 2012.

>>55062485
>implying she didn't have real feelings for you
>implying you didn't crush her heart and trample her joy

How have you hurt your waifu today, /pfg/?

>>55062552
Shelyn has real feelings with everyone, that's her nature as a Love Goddess.

>>55062552
By warning her too late that I was going to shoot, and not leaving enough time to pull out.

>>55057965
She's 580 years old but has the butt of a 17 year old.

>>55062920
Now you have to take responsibility!

give me tips building a archer

>>55062955
Yo I wanna fuck that Elf!

>>55062973
Monk zen archer
Warrior with bow related feats

>>55057965
I had someone who played a middle aged elf wizard girl, and she was the most precious thing I ever witnessed in a PC. 10/10 MILF, but a total cinnamon bun.

>>55062973
Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Rapid Shot, Manyshot, Shot on the Run, Snap Shot

>>55062962
What if you wish to take responsibility, but she terminates the pregnancy before you even realize she's pregnant?

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>>55062955
>>55062984
>>55057965
>>55057887

>>55062962
Who implied I wouldn't?

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>tfw not really salty about bamboozles or failing to get into games
>tfw the bitterness doesn't entirely go away
>tfw slowly becoming jaded about the entire hobby
Shit.

>>55063256
Don't worry, anon. The bamboozles will have stopped because there will be no more games.

>>55063305
That doesn't help, because I still want to play.

>>55063305
Should have shilled and fetishized harder, fuccboi.

>>55063317
The fire has faded, and only ashes remain.

>>55063339
The light has faded, and the age of darkness has come.

>>55058354

Eh, I can see it being okay, but I am really not a fan of losing BAB on mostly martial classes.To be honest, I think rangers are a pretty self-sufficient class, even for newer players. Any of the major combat styles can work passably.

A hunter-evangelist or warpriest-evangelist, now that s..t is scary

>>55062485
Shelyn herself is supposedly chaste, to everyone's eternal dismay.

>>55063411
And let the feast begin.

>>55063456
>Shelyn herself is supposedly chaste, to everyone's eternal dismay

False, JJ confirmed she's romantically involved with Sarenrae and Desna.

Hi people, I want to run an AP, either RoW with automatic bonus scaling (since you are invested by the Rider) but more than 50% WBL or Strange Aeons with bonus VMC to represent the characters' forgotten past. Which one would you prefer and what advice would you give me?

So I just moved to a new city and the only group I can find is a pathfinder group.
I'm not opposed to it, but as someone that primarily plays 5e, what are some pitfalls I should watch out for?
I'm gonna try to read the rules and know what I'm doing as well as I can, but I hear there's a shit ton of rules for everything.

>>55063498
Reign of Winter sounds the best, do that one! Alternatively, Ruins of Azlant would be really neat!

>>55063498
My advice is to only bring 2 or 3 players, because they're gonna break those APs over their knees.

>>55063498
>VMC to represent the characters' forgotten past.
Oh man did you read the whole AP, because that's going to be fucking awkward.

>>55063481
Nowadays people say that you can be romantically involved with someone without any expectation of sex.

Whether or not those people are actually in functional relationships, on the other hand, is another matter entirely.

>>55063521

- Do not play pre-unchained monk or rogue. Absolutely no exceptions for the rogue, only consider the Zen Archer, the Sohei and the Tetori for the monk.
- Everything with magic is (eventually) superior. Do not trade magic via an archetype unless you want an extra challenge
- If you are a martial character, power attack / deadly aim (for range) are pretty much necessary.
- If you want to play a paladin, be absolutely clear with your DM just what your code is and what you are supposed to be doing.

There is a lot of other stuff, but those seem to be the biggest ones. What kind of a character do you want to play?

>>55051412
If you're into furry or loli porn, then Pathfinder is what you want.

If you're boring then you should use another system.

>>55063584
Generally speaking, they are not.

Paizo is just angling to take advantage of the polyamory fad that a vocal minority of hedonists are trying to push. In truth, there's nothing to it but people trying to get free cock/pussy.

>>55063593
But what if I'm into furry loli porn?

>>55063621
Then you should probably be the GM.

>>55063579

Yep, I read through it once. I am just itching to use the VMC mechanics at some point and this looked like a good excuse. I need to reread the part where they regain their memories.

My main issue with SA is that the group wil likely include a French expat or two. I am not sure I can do a good French accent for the ghouls in front of an actual Frenchie.

>>55063562
I subscribed for the Ruins of Azlant AP, but the first one did not really blow me away. I will wait for 1-2 more before I decide if I want to continue.

>>55063521
They're pretty different games at their core. 5e is rules-lite and conducive to players being able to say "I want to do <thing>", having the gm decide a good relevant skill, and having the player roll. It keeps things flowing and puts more narrative power in the hands of the players.

Pathfinder is more crunch heavy. If you want to do <thing>, there's probably already rules for it. Pathfinder is more game-y, and ultimately provides more opportunity for the player to express themselves mechanically. It does require more effort to learn to play, but all relevant materials are easily browsed and cross-referenced in one of two places online, so you never need to pull out a pdf.

>>55063610
It's always free cock, whenever the man starts bringing home other women their "primary" girlfriend always gets super jealous and tries to call the whole thing off.

>>55063639
> I need to reread the part where they regain their memories
You really should, because that justficstion for VMV makes no sense iirc.

>>55063586
>What kind of a character do you want to play?
That's the million dollar question isn't it. I hear you can pretty much flesh out any character idea in pathfinder.

5e usually sucks if you want to play a summoning class. How is it with pathfinder?

I just want to apply to Reign of Winter, I've got a concept I really want to play!

>>55063704
You have options for days. Granted your GM and table are going to hate you because summoners tend to be busted.

>>55063709
What is it?

>>55063709

What's your concept, anon? Tell us so we can tell you how terrible it is.

>>55063716
I was under the impression most spellcasters were busted in pathfinder?

>>55063734
This is true, but summoners tend to be busted in a particular way. Mostly just because controlling lots of monsters is something players won't do smoothly, so it bogs the game down.

>>55063734
Yes and no. They can be if built a certain way, but that way is very hard to play. Brokenness tends to be relative in Pathfinder. If you get 9 casting(access to all 9 spell levels) you definitely have the potential to be broken. 6th casters generally fair a lot better.

That being said summoning brings a whole nother bugaboo to the table. Grinds the game down to a screeching halt most of the time. After a certain point you stop playing PF, and start playing Brigadine or Fire Emblem while the rest of the party watches.

>>55063734
Summoners are the annoying kind of busted in that their summons get their own turns, so rounds of combat take forever because you have to manage half a dozen summons

>>55063704

Fairly okay,

- The summoner is dope, the unchained version is weaker but still solid; both have a unique summon (eidolon) that you can have as a personal minion or can throw around scaling summon monsters when it is not around.
- The Herald Caller cleric can throw scaling summon monsters. It loses a bit of combat power but is still, well, a cleric
The Monster Tactician inquisitor gets the same kind of summons at the cost of its usual judgement ability. It is still a great trade, and its summons come with its teamwork feats. The inquisitor is basically a trickier, more circumspect and skillful cleric with less magic

Oracle, druid, sorcerer and wizard can also do some summoning, but for a summon specialist, my choice would be one of the above.

>>55063734
Some spellcasters are busted. I wouldn't say most, because spellcasters kinda form the normal. Entirely martial classes are often eclipsed once you reach higher levels, but this can still be avoided with some optimization.

The biggest issue with summoners is less power than time consumption. If you're a newish player who just got their summoner to level 3, and you decide to summon 1d3 eagles and roll a 3, you're now controlling 4 creatures. And 3 of those creatures have 3 attacks they can use in a single round with good positioning. This can result in your turn taking longer than everyone else's combined.

>>55063793
>forgetting the alchemist archetype that lets you basically summon Saibamen

>>55063812

Oh yeah, that one was cool too. Still not at the level of summoner, herald caller or monster tactician, though.

>>55063801
Are there any summoner variants that trade out access to Summon Monster [X] for greater Eidolon power or versatility?

>>55063825

Hm, the half-elf archetype gets more evolution points, but it cannot take certain evolutions and it gets summon nature's ally over summon monster. Does that count?

>>55063727
>>55063732
A Slayer (Sniper) poacher who's laying low in Helgren until the heat dies down for killing a few of the king's deer. He's over-proud of his marksmanship and is something of a swaggering braggart, but is revealed to be an utter coward in close engagements.

>>55063825
Not REALLY. You can kinda do that by just... Having your eidolon out all the time. Summon Monster is more of a backup for the average summoner, though it could be argued that it's the more powerful option if you specialize in it.

That said, if you want to try focusing on your eidolon, you could try making a synthesist, which lets you summon your eidolon onto your own body, creating one mega creature with your mental stats, its physical stats, and both of your health bars.

..If you can get a DM who will let you play it. It's not actually that busted, but it's incredibly easy to minmax and immediately outshine any martials on your team.

>>55063812
That AT is kinda weak at a lot of points, due to its staggered progression. Especially at the levels you're most likely to play before your DM inevitably needs a break and the group falls apart.

You don't get SM2 until level 5, and you're stuck with it 'til level 8.

Summoning killed /pfg/

This is why summoners are busted and so often banned.

>>55063790
Yeah this is the same issue as in d&d.
Needs to be a more elegant solution for summoning creatures.

>>55064031
For a TTRPG, there is no good solution. People want to summon because they want to control multiple creatures. Simplifying it wouldn't be satisfying, but keeping it complicated creates issues with game flow.

The only real solutions are to either restrict summoning or make sure the only people at your table doing it are fast.

>>55064031
having your turns ready ahead of time, and not being a huge faggot, help immensely

>>55064021
Can confirm, am a DM that always bans summoners. ALWAYS. I also have taken to banning Brawlers, and stacking size increases/carry modifiers, since one faggot I had was routinely soloing encounters 10 whole levels above him.

>>55064082
You don't have to ban stacking size increases. They don't stack. You can have one for-realsies size increase, and one effective size increase.

>>55064082
>stacking carry modifiers
how is that a problem worth banning for

>>55064124
Maybe they were dropping houses on dudes.

File: came here to giggle.png (169KB, 680x489px) Image search: [Google]

169KB, 680x489px

>>55064082
>I also have taken to banning Brawlers, and stacking size increases/carry modifiers
>banning fucking BRAWLERS
>banning the thing that doesn't stack beyond "one real increase, one effective increase"

>>55064124
>>55064110
>>55064186
I mean doing shit like obtaining a size increase, and then obtaining an item that allows you to carry an item one size category larger than yourself..

What the fuck was I supposed to do? This cheeky fucker Solo'd a CR 102(Wasn't intended, he walked into a mead hall and started attacking NPCs) encounter at level 3, over the course of about six hours. On top of his previous brawler soloing a world-boss at level 6, by killing it in only 2 rounds.

>>55064234
Your either making shit up or are just really, really shit at char op and encounter building because a brawler doesn't even get that much out of size increase cheese.
> world-boss
Are you playing a fucking MMO or something?

Fresh bread
>>55064278
>>55064278
>>55064278

>>55064234

There's gotta be something we're not being told here.

If your player's level 3 character is soloing a CR 10 like say, a Fire Giant, letting them have a 4d6 greatsword is not the source of the problem.

>>55064234
>by killing it in only 2 rounds.
>a martial does its job
>this is bad

nani the fuck