/CofD/ & /wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness

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Version 1.22
Now with the Secret Order of the Gate

Remember kids, don't romance the Lonely Exarch.
She's much too old for you, and she's got to put her career first.

>>54650369
>Have you ever used a Immortal in your games? (Purified, Blood bathers etc...)
We played a 1e Vampire game once. 5 players. Everyone ended up going one clan. Nobody actually realised it until the fourth-to-last session, but our terribly secretive 'mekhet dragon' was not a strangely built mekhet as we'd originally thought. Mechanically, we assumed he was using obfuscate and coils to avoid reading as a kindred. He was our recon specialist, but so incredibly shady about his comings and goings, even for Kindred, that we were following him to check for meetings with people like VII or local mages.

We discovered this was not the case, (VII or him being a Kindred) when he was staked in the heart. He died a very normal death, two turns later stood up and force fed the vampire who did it a fireball. Several very tense conversations later (Mostly revolving around topics like OH GOD WHAT THE FUCK and ARE YOU THE DEMONS and BELIAL'S BROOD, KILL IT!) we hashed out a rough understanding of what he was, that he'd just learned some dragon parlance earlier in his life. He liked Vampires because money and sexy thrills.

It was a shock OOC, because the smug fuck had kept it a secret from us there too. The chronicle went on mostly unchanged, but he didn't have to be so quiet about his comings and goings anymore.

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>>54650487
Listen, I really appreciate the work you do, your dedication and your willingness to format things for PDF - but if I want to try and stick my dick in wrinkly unreality I will.

>>54650487
>She's much too old for you

But age is attractive, anon

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>>54650553
This anon knows what's up

>>54650369
I had a blood bather antagonist once.
Another time I used customized body snatcher immortals. They would just kidnap people every X years, swap out bodies, and then the new bodies would morph to look like their old bodies. They made the usual immortal mistakes (like keeping 300 years of family portraits on the wall) but at that point the hunters were already in too deep and barely escaped getting ate.

>>54650768
>stay hydrated

There's a terrifying thought. Some hunted gatekeeper, running through the Place Between, desperate to finish his work finds a glass of water somewhere and 'stay hydrated' carved in the parametric language around in. With hearts. Or like thousands of words that rule out everything but hearts, I guess.

>I am a guinea wop goombah greaseball grape-stomper Guido Mafioso, a garlic-breathed Fonzi with, as fellow Siciliano Quentin Tarantio pointed out in True Romance, n-word blood.
> ---- Phil "Satyros" Brucatto, on the topic of family history

Can someone give me a summary of Mage 20th Book of Secrets? If I have to read another sentence of Brucatto's "unique" writing style I'm going to have to book myself into a psych unit for extensive shock therapy.

>>54650919
I like how he heaps shit all over Italians and then hauls himself up on the "dirty n word", the fucking hypocrite. Either slurs or cool or they're offensive as fuck, this is just trying to have it both ways like Ice Cube lecturing Bill Maher about using the word "nigger".

>>54650768
>>54650553
I've no idea who this Gate thing is supposed to be. Though I get the feeling it is oWoD related.

>>54650515
I assume he was a Purified?

>>54651031
Really? I assumed it was anime.

>>54651083
Anime and world of Darkness really go hand in hand.

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tfw the only decent thing to come out of the Time of Judgement was a review of a shotglass

>https://www.rpg.net/reviews/archive/9/9809.phtml

>>54651031
>>54651083
Gate is the 11th and forbidden Exarch in nWoD Mage. And despite the other 10 being grade A assholes, Gate just keeps the Abyss from eating the universe and murdering everything, and does it even though holding back the Abyss is a thankless job and she gets shit from the rest of the Seers for it.
Thus Gate is a pure waifu and best girl

>>54651031
The Gate is the sole Exarch who did not remain in the Supernal Realms.
He/she left, and travelled to the newly formed Abyss, she bargained with it, and introduced Quiescence, the Sleeping curse into humanity, to stop those Mages who remained from dominating the planet (but also perhaps to avoid the Exarchs achieving total overt domination of the planet).

She is entirely essential for the Exarch's tyranny to continue, but also (to my eyes) hampers an exhaustive victory.

The Secret Order of the Gate are her servants, or at least the latest iteration of them. They seek to 'balance' the Supernal and the Abyss, when one grows too strong, they introduce the other to balance it out, culling and strengthening the presence of Abyssal entities as required.

However being the one Exarch who might have some of humanity's interests at heart (if you look at it one, weird way), and being the one which isn't in the Supernal, living it up as a tyrant, and also because of the weird Eldrich Waifu craze, people Waifuify her.

>>54651105
Well that really depends on the gameline, doesn't it? KotE and Hengeyoki were so strongly influenced by anime that it over-ruled any kind of cultural context or realism about Asian cultures, but other games like Wraith or Changeling don't seem to fit the same mold.

Now I think about it, the oWoD started strong and then had a pissweak ending... just like most Anime series I've ever seen.

>>54651080
Yes. 1e Vampires could pretty easily pretend not to be vampires with some low end powers, or at least not read as one to other vampires. That was how we were fooled, by trying to metagame.

>>54651146
I think they're the first and last iterations. She waits until they all go crazy and die, then re-activates them with forcible legacy induction when she needs eyes and ears and hands.

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Why did they decided to nerf vampires so hard in requiem compared to masquerade?

>>54651343

The old WOD suffered from decades of power creep, often to support the bloated metaplot.

In the new WOD, all splats received a significant power decrease to focus on street-level, toolkit, local stories. While the CofD / 2e has seen a general across the board power increase among the splats (and elimination of weakness designed for game balance or to force stories to remain local), they have not, nor does OPP intend to, be anything like the old WOD.

>>54651343
Vampires had legit Methuselahs and Antediluvians in oWoD and their Disciplines went up to 10.
Not as powerful as Archmages and their Arch-Spheres, but it was rather obvious why they were leagues ahead of their Requiem counterparts.

Classic Celerity was pretty stupid though.

>>54651626
That isn't true at all. Awakening mages are just as powerful as ascension. Geists are stronger than wraitns. And descent demons and changeling far outstrip their oWoD counterparts. Vamps and Woofs are the only severely weakened splats

Mage the Awakening question:

What are your characters' nimbus tilts? Give me some examples please, real ones you used in actual play, and ones you've considered as well (maybe specify the difference though).

>>54651755
Demons from Fallen are noticeably more powerful than their Descent counterparts.

>>54651755
>Awakening mages are just as powerful as ascension
It's strange, but cheesed out Ascension mages vastly outstrip their Awakening cousins.
In general Awakening is more meaty.

>Geists are stronger than wraitns
Evidently

>And descent demons and changeling far outstrip their oWoD counterparts
Changelings? Yes.
Demons? No.

>Vamps and Woofs are the only severely weakened splats
Like Ascension, cheesed out Masquerade Vampires are meatier than their Requiem brothers.
Werewolves are a mixed bag, depending on a couple of things.

>>54651745
Aren't 6+ Disciplines supposed to be at least as powerful as what the Archmages can do?

>>54651788
>>54651816
How are fallen demons stronger? Granted I never player fallen and this is coming from anecdotal evidence.

>>54651842
You will have to read Fallen for yourself. Earthbound are on par with Methuselahs and lesser Archmages, or perhaps sufficiently prepped masters.

>>54651830
no

>>54651781
Non-Euclidean: Penalty to perception tests as everything twisted and bent in upon itself, sounds of low chanting of gibberish.

Celestial: Halo of lowing light, bonus to expression tests with the pure light of inspiration, residual was a glowing effect

Insidious: Everything gains a hidden, secret meaning that you can scarcely comprehend, penalty to resisting intimidation tests

Numbing: Everything seems further away, your thoughts more sluggish, as if your brain is drowning in tar, each thought slower, and slower, and slower. Penalty to Investigation tests, but bonus to Composure tests.

Inevitable: Everything takes on an appearance of significant age, residual nimbus is a fine coating of dust and an old smell. However the inherent purpose and design of everything shines from within.

Resilient: Physical objects seem more solid, especially manmade ones. Actions, words, everything seems more solid, more lasting. Bonus to Resolve tests.

>>54651830
Nowhere even close.

>>54651830
Pick up Masters of the Art. Basically, picking up archspheres at 6 is.. okay. At 7, you start to run into serious issues with how you interact with the world. A time 9 master, for example, is basically powerless. They can't do anything without spawning a million other continua. Most Archmastery levels have something that severely limits your freedoms.

>>54651890
Thanks, notes are being taken!

>>54651816
It really bugs the fuck out of me that Vamps are given the same baseline stats (5/4/3) as humans. Woofs too, but at least their forms give bonuses, even then though they are kind of meek compared to what they are actually described as (stat description at x dots vs description of hulked out Gauru)

>>54652001
Yeah, in virtually every piece of source literature I can think of, vampires are always described as being physically MUCH superior to humans as a baseline. Forget all the celerity and other blood spending funk, your vampire not even trying/expending effort is much more than human. Yet in requiem, that's all they are. It's foolish, and really violates the image of what vampires are. Same applies to werewolf I'd say.

>>54651859
>>54651913
How so?

>>54651963
I thought that was only because they can't go back to earth

>>54652027
I don't know. In some media, you can tell they have to 'try' to be special when it comes to physical strength.

They aren't always zipping around at the speed of sound, or hulking out. They do that when they need to, and it is obviously magical. Not in all vamp stuff, but in some.

>>54651969
Look into the 1e book, Tome of the Watchtowers, it had loads of example nimbuses by path and philosophy.

>>54651781
Running an Obrimos with a classic super saiyan nimbus. Gold light, +brawl, -stealth. With the -stealth malus manifested as having a really, really loud voice.
>>54651842
Well, if you'd like, the wiki has their Lores available. They don't really illustrate it fully, nor their other abilities. But it's enough to give you an idea. They are *incredibly* disgusting. A well built demon basically becomes an occult blender no matter what's infront of it. A utility demon is everywhere and anywhere.
>>54652067
Sort of. Lots accumulate enough paradox that earth is a no go zone. There is the new avatar storm issue with the gauntlet. But lots of the powers limit your ability to interact with the world in any meaningful way.

>>54652083
Vampires were never Flash in folklore. They only incredibly strong and durable.

I fucking hate what Anne Rice did to them.

>>54651963
That's only Time 9. By that point you can't interact with the material in any meaningful way. You'd have to worth through proxy means.

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>>54652166
Boohoo bitch. I happen to like my super strong and fast leeches

>>54652733
Go fuck yourself

oWoD celerity is terrible and getting rid of it was one of the best things nWoD did.

>>54652861
I'm almost afraid to ask.

What did owod celerity do?

>>54651343
It was so starting players actually had a fucking chance going toe-to-toe with the power players. The mechanics of V:tM were slanted heavily in favor of the oldest and most pure blooded, from things like Dominate not working on someone of lower (purer) Generation, to the amount of Blood Pool the character could access, to the ridiculously hyper-powered NPC's that were supplied in settings and expansions. Neonates had to play a careful long game of manipulation, going full Scarface as they first get the blood, then the power, then the Diablerie, using social outmaneuvering and a complex web of favors.

With Requiem, they wanted for players to be able to scream "ALUCARD SMASH" but at the same time they wanted Mortals to have a better shot at kicking vampire ass.

>>54652869
Mechanically it was a god mode. You needed it to engage in any sort of combat, because having it over an opponent meant you'd instantly win otherwise.

>>54652869
Got you torn apart because Force Mage increased the magnitude by which the force of friction affected you.

>>54651755
>Geists are stronger than wraiths

Are they, though? An Embodied Wraith has 10 health levels, becomes invulnerable for a turn after someone hits it and suffers no wound penalties. A lot of their passive abilities are pretty neat, as well. Good luck hiding your motives when your feelings are literally edible radiation, flavored with intent.

In terms of broken mechanics, though, Geist is definitively easier to be a wanker with. One cited example was a "remote seeing" power that could have been simply left at that (perhaps with the added limitation of it being only vision, no sound) .... but which the head dev decided to grognard hard with the inclusion of being able to use attack powers, invisibly, to assassinate powerful NPC's in their secure havens from the other side of town.

>>54651816
>Werewolves are a mixed bag, depending on a couple of things.

The Changing Breeds book for Chrod fucking sucked. Distinct tribes of were-creatures wasn't good enough for Satyros, so instead we get wishy-washy thought bubbles, stereotypes and a "horned god of the forest" that had his original cock airbrushed out of the book.

*his* cock, by the way. Not his father's. And it was dangling, rather than thrusting.

>>54652974
how the heck did Changing Breeds get brought up?

>>54653012
It made that anon think of their hate for Brucato.

>>54652945
You know Ascension was fucked when it could hard counter classic-Celerity

>>54651830
Yes and no.

On the one hand, they do some fucking impressive stuff - I vaguely remember Obfuscate 9 allowing someone to literally erase any memory of them ever existing - but they are static powers, locked into a single effect.

Archspheres are far more flexible, but they accrue such insane levels of Paradox that they take long rituals, massive levels of Quintessence and a safe environment in the Umbra to pull off. They're more suited to a plotline device than the spur-of-the-moment feel of Disciplines - "defending the ritual at all costs" stories, or "stop the ritual at all costs" stories.

Finally, learning powerful Disciplines doesn't ever seem to have any impact on Humanity or Path ratings, nor prevent a Vampire from achieving Golconda; learning Archspheres is ultimately sacrificing true Ascension to obsess over controlling a limited piece of the universe utterly, so there's a sense of bittersweet loss to Archspheres as much as absolute power.

>>54652027
The one piece I can never find in any sourcebook, the one trope from pop culture and folklore about vampires, is an ability to walk on walls and the ceiling in full defiance of gravity (Interview With The Vampire and Wir Sind Die Nacht are my two favourite examples).

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>>54652974
What the fuck are you going on about?

>>54651830
I don't seem to recall any 10 dot Discipline affecting the Tellurian as a whole.

The Archspheres on the other hand can do just that. Shit is whack.

>>54653100
Yeah, you're right. Strange!

>>54652166
Um, which folklore?

If we're talking the extensive vampire hunts in Europe centuries ago, they were either disease-spreading shambling corpses or vengeful dead come back to shag their widows to death. Modern vampire folklore is inseparable from contemporary fiction, and that stretches back to Bram Stoker (nobody remembers Varney the Vampire, and that's okay, because it fucking sucked and given your complaints you'd fucking hate it... Varney gets revived a bunch of times from wierd moonlit rituals like a Hammer Horror Movie and finally tops himself by swan diving into a volcano)

>>54652733
>not posting the pic that had Eric and Bill naked except for a thin coating of blood and Sookie Stackhouse

Inconceivable!

>>54653143
What's your fucking point you dreary autist?

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Speaking of Archmages. Is this actually mechanically achievable or was anon just blowing smoke?

>>54652869
Literally an extra action for every dot. Whereas Potence meant automatic successes for damage and Strength rolls, and Fortitude affected soak, Celerity was decidedly universal and almost unstoppable. There wasn't an easy solution to counter it except giving all the NPC's a few dots of it too.

>>54653012
because Changing Breeds is part of the Werewolf line, and because we were comparing old world to new world...?

>>54653023
Donate to his Patreon, his cat needs surgery.

hey /CofD/, in Geist, when you use plasm to block a wound, does that count as plasm use for the turn? Or is it just something you can keep doing with plasm?

>>54653234
And his goat needs treatment for its anal prolapse.

>>54653241
That counts as plasm used for the turn

>>54653234
Actually, Changing Breeds is a blue book just for 'world of darkness'. I mean, we instantly treat it as a werewolf related book because it constantly has to remind us the forsaken exist.

But you can easily just play as some random weirdo who changes into an animal sort of, and has nothing to do with spirits or werewolves.

>>54652945
Sadly in 2e that damage is capped at Potency.

>>54653173
My point is that you are a retarded piece of shit who is literally too young to understand what he is complaining about

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Just saw this excellent film. It has given me alot of ideas both as a player and a storyteller

>>54653192
He's skipping the century long+ massive quest to set up said ritual.

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Just saw this excellent film. It has given me alot of ideas both as a player and a storyteller

>>54653476
There's nothing of the sort in Ascension.
It only takes that long to reach Archmage status.

In Awakening, yes.
You need the necessary Quintessence.

>>54653488
Would you fuck off retarded magefag. Isn't it past your bedtime now?

>>54653503
Ah mixed up the lines

>>54652001
These ARE games.

>>54650487
Can you do 'the illuminated path' next?

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We are a miniature society of spiteful anons, huh?

>>54650487
I wish I could actually play that Legacy but it's already two degrees of separation from an average playable PC (Seer & Abyss fuckery).

>>54653658
Blame the Magedom

>>54653488
The dream sequence in that movie had a well done vampire fight scene.

>>54653682
no

it was crap

you're crap for thinking it wasn't crap

>>54653475
Let me guess. Lots of gay shit.

>>54653678
Blame the whiners who get salty over Mage.

>>54653615
Games about Vampires and Werewolves, where players expect some degree of verisimilitude with their counterparts in the actual fiction they are based upon.

>>54653742
You do know the starting stats are 'above average to exceptional' people to begin with, already out doing most average humans. right?

>>54653727
The film is super hetero. Nothing gay appears at all.

>>54653742
And they have it. You can still use powers to achieve all the feats you see in fiction, but these are games, and permanent superhuman stats were probably disallowed for a reason.

Vigor/celerity/resilience should be baseline with all vampiric clans

>>54653756
Yet still hardly representative of the fiction. Stop being obtuse.

>>54653756
Have you ever seen a vampire movie from the era prior to the original VtM, or read Stoker's Dracula or other fiction in that era, even friggin Rice?

>>54653682
The only well done fight scene in the Twilight series is Edward v Victoria in the Eclipse book. The films are all garbage.

>>54653768
That doesn't even make sense. GURPS and HERO system have been around for longer than WoD functioning quite well with stat spreads ranging from mundane to superhuman baseline. Exalted did it too, so it works in Storyteller. The designers just went full retard with the current iteration, in that aspect.

>>54653780
Yeah. Because it has to represent all the fiction. Even where vampires can be bummy drug addicts that are lucky if they can regenerate right.

Like blade.

>>54653846
Blade wasn't even representative of vampires within his own setting, you fucking idiot.

>>54653865
I meant the movies, not the character. Idiot.

You know, the lines of vampires Blade cuts through because outside of the more powerful ones, the rest are just mooks with fangs?

>>54653846
Blade's vampires were largely killable mooks. Not representative at all of what anyone here is talking about. Optimistically you are just trying to play devil's advocate here, but yeah, I think that deliberately obtuse, just to string out an empty argument, is far more likely.

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>I want to play superheroes with anger problems and fangs

>>54653839
It's not just the system. Thematically it could have been an issue as well.

>>54653933
Strawman

>>54653906
What are we talking about here if not that vampires need to be representative of their literature and media.

They can be. You can make a 'move so fast I blur' and 'now I'm a flying bat' and 'I mind controlled your waifu virgin' vampire. But you have to make that vampire. Because those are aren't all automatic, to don't get bit and day one start turning into bats and bench pressing cars.

You start like Blade mooks.

And that is Vampire representing the vampire vision, from the terrible demigod with more powers with superman, to the guys running through the street like parlour addicts on PCP, to pale mooks with fangs.

That seems pretty simple to me.

Anyone got the full version of Changelings the dreaming?

>>54653964
I always thought of vampires in these games as being similar to how Stephen King does them. Basically coming in three types. Type Ones are the real monsters, like Antediluvians. Type Twos are the mature and intelligent vampires who lead the Type Threes, who are basically glorified mosquitoes.

>>54653964
Typical dev sycophant or apologist. This type hangs out on the OPP forums kissing the ass of DaveB and others, even Dave Hill before he quit, freaking out at anyone who criticizes the vision.

Someone comes along and points out how the vampires at default don't match those in literature and media, and immediately this dude comes on the attack, bristling, because the sacred dev vision is questioned.

It's pathetic.

>>54654011
This is hilarious since Vampire is literally my least favorite of the big three.

I would probably run Mummy before Vampire.

>>54654027
But do the mummies match up with the fiction staring american heros like Brendan Fraiser?

>>54654011
>Someone comes along and points out how the vampires at default don't match those in literature and media
Were they ever supposed to? You realize none of the splats line up perfectly with their counterparts in media and mythology, right?

>>54654027
They don't actually care that vampires don't match, they just hate that they're the weakest supernatural splat in both lines.

>>54653964
If that was their intent, well - even then, it still seems off, as another poster noted, to really match that classic image, celerity, vigor, and resilience, should almost be baseline skills, as superior physicality is a common thread among vampires in general.

Having to fall back to *mooks* as your argument for just what their baseline vampires are representative of only makes one wince. I mean seriously, mooks are non-entities, comic book style combat like Exalted, they are not the things of WoD, and using mooks as a vampire baseline, or even doing as they've done and statting Vampires baseline the same (well a dot better than) a Mage or normal human and making them depend entirely on blood spenders to do "superheroics" is a little off (given that there is already baseline blood drain for all activity).

>>54654072
That's fair.

>>54654101
I don't know, isn't it actually appropriate? Isn't it a big part of Vampire, that you start on the bottom as a mook for somebody else?

>>54653970
It should be in the MEGA link in the pastebin.

>>54654072
Or both. I actually rather miss the old idea where vampires started off weaker than werewolves, and were weaker until well aged, at which point they became scary as shit. But even then at baseline they should be beyond simply blood addicted humans with a power or two.

>>54654135
Why?

>>54654118
That's where the social structure comes in. It always is. You can still be stronger than any human and be the bottom man on the vampire pecking order, with the elders and ancients being just above and beyond you, both in strength, and because of much richer, and deeper power capabilities. They can control feeding grounds, and politics of the city, which still leaves you as the guy at the bottom of a very heavy pyramid scheme, with the challenge of scheming your way up.

>>54654135
Verisimilitude.

Is there any reason why vampires should have permanent superhuman stats other than you want them to match some of their portrayals in media and mythology?

>>54654011
In the original novel, Dracula, an old vampire and a powerful magician, and his three "wives" were killed by a group of petty bourgeois with few fighting skills and little occult knowledge. Carmilla, in her own novel, was killed by a vampire hunter of some experience despite being centuries old. In folklore they are a bit hard to kill since they are undead and have a few supernatural powers, but they aren't superior to humans in every way. Super fast super strong vampgods were mostly a creation of Anne Rice.

>>54654198
Weren't Drac and Carmilla killed during the day, though?

>>54654483
Yes, but unlike the post-Rice, or should I say post-Nosferatu vampire, Carmilla, Dracula and most literary and some folkloric vampires were able to act during the day, in a somewhat weakened form. If you wanted to have "accurate" vampires, they would be able to walk in the sunlight but lethargic and unable to use most of their disciplines during the day.

>>54653642
Sure.

>>54653115
>conflating religion with 19th century concepts on race

Fuck off back to the retirement home, grandpa, the war is over and the Shultzstaffel fucking lost. Eat your pudding.

>>54653192
IF the ST allows you to combine a cherry picking of rules from Masters of the Art AND Forged by Dragon's Fire. You also need to get a character that goddamn high in Sphere Magick. Assuming they started with Forces 3 and as a Hermetic, that would take... 294 XP.

How much do you get per game?

>>54653328
But then it just becomes absurdist, devoid of any context. It's literally Kafka - here is Kevin, he turns into a 800lb cockroach, don't ask why, and he lives in this house and just acts like a dick for whatever reason. At that point it's Buffy RPG with better combat rules.

At least if you work it into the mythology of Forsaken you have a context for their existence, a reason for them to be there and even a side for them to be on.

None of this changes the fact that "Changing Breeds" was an OWOD term for other tribes of were-beasties.

>>54653279
There is no evidence he ever fucked a goat.

He admits to being a dick to other WW employees during the gaming boom. He admits to being annoying enough that people beat him senseless in Hawaii on a regular basis. The dearth of quality in his work is self-evident, as is the death spiral effect it seems to have initiated in OPP kickstarter projects.

In short, there is plenty to accuse him of, and enough evidence to justify that, without you having to invent stupid shit like a teenage schoogirl.

>>54653457
Seconded.

>>54653503
>There's nothing of the sort in Ascension.

Masters of the Art states that it should be a long, dramatic process obtaining the rare components and Quintessence, as well as conjuring the effect. They say it's only appropriate given how powerful the effect is.

>>54654853
Go away Phil.

>>54654878
Eh, there's no actual mechanics forcing you to do this.

>>54654853
There is no evidence that there was kissing or ball fondling going on during the goat sex. That is all we really know.

>>54654899
>They say it's only appropriate given how powerful the effect is.

It's right there in the text though. That's a pretty solid, reasonable guideline. That it's not fully quantified and codified mechanically is not an issue, this isn't D&D, this is Storyteller, where the story come first. Roleplaying, not rollplaying, buddy.

>>54654927
The anon who asked specifically asked if it was mechanically achievable. And evidently it is, as written, mechanically achievable without having to do all the prep.

>>54653780
Vampire fiction is *extremely* diverse, pal.

There's a world of difference between Zillah from Lost Souls and Faethor Ferenczy from Necroscope. Hammer Horror vampires got powers from Satan, Dracula 2000 got powers from disappointing Jesus and Lifeforce had Patrick Stewart chasing evil aliens.

Near Blood vampires couldn't handle sunlight at all, didn't know where they came from and showed little supernatural power other than nightvision, unnatural resilience and being stronger than they looked, but not enough to flip cars. From Dusk to Dawn vampires could shapeshift but could be held at bay by anything vaguely cross-shaped. 30 Days of Night? they were just fucking landsharks.

You're going to have to be more specific. Which particular novel are you so obsessed with that you are outraged by an absence of it's influence?

>>54654878
>>54654927
What above anon posted (the image) suggested a single one of these drawn out plot related rituals you are suggesting constitutes dozens of separate instant Archsphere effects.

I'm not sure the amount of 'storytelling' is going to beat the amount of cheese here.

>>54654853
This is all true. He basically lucked out in getting handed the Mage line, and his fumbling touches to it, personal politics and poor understanding of science and western civilization (if not outright ignorant contempt for both) ultimately were what necessitated its reboot.

>>54653779
So everyone was identical in fight powers, leaving combat up to whoever gets the drop on the other guy first?

Just leave the suggestion on the floor, over there. Next to the wastepaper basket.

>>54654985
>Because those are the only fight powers available and possible to create within the limitless breadth and scope of the human imagination.

Always with the fucking strawmen.

>>54654853
There is no truth in the vicious slander that JK Rowling took her inspiration for Dumbledore's goat-fucking brother from a passing encounter with Phil and you should not repeat it

>>54653950
Actually, it isn't. The fuckhead is literally arguing that his vampires aren't powerful enough - a "superhero", if you will - but still need the tropes of vampire fiction, such as emotional stability and.... fangs.

I don't understand why he doesn't just play RIFTS. The vampires in that were megadamage creatures, so you needed either massive firepower, heavy magic or supernatural races to get your shit fucked up. Just good luck trying to cross a fucking river.

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Just a reminder that all mages are trannies at heart.

>>54654011
What do you want, exactly?

You want us all to agree with you? Hold your hand, nod our heads, not offend your thin, fragile ego by suggesting counterarguments? Dave B to suddenly appear and guarantee that he will personally change the entire game canon to suit one random anon poster on 4chan's personal vision of "how it should be"?

The only person I see around here bristling is you, cupcake. You seem genuinely upset to hear the truth, so here goes:

These games were not written just for you, princess peach. You don't get veto. Have a coke, and a smile, and shut your cum hole.

>>54655034

That's one of the most mild gender identity sidebars in WW book, all of which include them.

>>54655034
Animal fun fact: the idea that magical traditions were a haven for LGBTIQABCDEFG is burning times tier revisionism

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>>54650369
Does anyone have nice stories of times they played Vampire: the Dark Ages?

I am planning on playing a Ravnos that is basically a preacher Knight who wants to make himself a herd of likeminded people and make the World (of darkness) a better place.

>>54654031
More importantly: who fucking cares?

>>54655028
Dude. These are mage players. The idea of vampires being strong threatens them. They're freaking out over it. You came to the wrong place to discuss it, even if it's a topic that probably would normally fit the forum, sans magefags.

>>54655034
At least it isn't preaching anything at me and is somewhat relevant because it's true. Mages do construct new identities, many entities in the fluff don't have a fixed sex (all the Exarchs except the Father alternate pronouns), a Mage with Life and Mind could conceivably totally change their gender (but not likely to be a Thyrsus, RIP), literally, and then there are the weird sex Legacies like the Daksha.

Man, I want to fuck a Daksha. I still find it hilarious and hot that they offer up magically enhanced sex for gaunxi favors.

>>54654171
Vermilion.

>>54655063
Man, I really angered you just by questioning this little design decision? What the fuck is wrong with you? I made my point, and all you've done is rant and rave and throw strawman argument after strawman argument, or outright trying to vilify me for god knows what reason.

I mean seriously, all I did was point out that in nWoD, the base vampire was not the powerful supernatural creature of the literature and media that inspired the popular image of vampire. This incited nothing but nerdrage and nonsense. I mean seriously, what the fuck?

>>54655034
I take that sidebar with the caveat that a Mage with 1 dot in Prime can tell an attention seeking non-genuine transexual for what they are with a look.

>>54654527
>unable to use most of their disciplines during the day.
"except upon the stroke of noon" according to Stoker. "The Vampire, like all noctural creatures, is capable of moving about during the day - but in a weakened state".

>>54655084
>implying that vampires being naturally physically stronger without the use of powers all the time would make them a threat to mages
We just had multiple threads about how Forces 2 could no sell all natural kinetic attacks. Take the Disciplines out of the equation here and make the enhanced physical stats an inherent feature, and you take away one of the only arguments for physical Disciplines being able to invoke a Clash of Wills against kinetic shields. And you would definitely lose out on any duration boosts they would get in the Clash, if they happen at all.

>>54655034
>>54655068
>>54655069
>>54655115

The funniest thing about that sidebar is that Mages actually have the power to cure the mental illnesses that cause the problems cited in that magical realm sidebar, and those of the Diamond and probably even the Free Council probably fight tooth and nail to do so.

Transgenders and homosexuals are probably tools of the Exarch to disrupt healthy family structures and further debase the fallen world, and as such, any good mage fighting them does his best to fix what they've broken.

>>54654011
>>54654101
>retards that don't understand that vampirism is a curse not a super power

>>54655166
Oh jesus, it's this mage superiority shit again.

>>54655143
Prime can spot any active deception, yes. So if a man likes to pretend to be a tranny in his off time at gay bars, you would be able to tell if you were looking at him while he was like that. But if you passed him on the street while be was being normal, you wouldn't be able to tell.

>>54654899
>there are no mechanics forcing you to do that
>>54654927
>the book doesn't have mechanics but it suggests you do it anyway
>>54654958
>conclusion: it is mechanically possible with no prep, given the absence of mechanics and the text in the sourcebook recommending prep

Nigga are you blind or just so white that you're fucking retarded?

>>54655141
That's not all you did at all, you asked why vampires don't start right off the bat with their classical powers.

The anon said, because the games designed to be low powered with the opportunity to grow into those powers.

Then you called him a brown nosing sycophant for some reason and now you're acting like a wanker who thinks he's a victim.

>>54655190
>again
>implying it ever goes away

>>54655182
Hey retard, even with the enhanced physical capabilities, there's the fucking undeath, the beast, loss of emotion, need for predation on humans to survive, ever decaying humanity, sunlight lethality, every other vampire out there being a fucking awful predator.. yeah, it's still a fucking curse, so guess what...

ANOTHER FUCKING STRAWMAN.

You are pathetic.

>>54655006
Yeah? How much of the "limitless breadth and cope of the human imagination" was incorporated in the original suggestion of three existing powers, you stupid illiterate cunt? You must have voted for Trump.

>>54655141
>act like an ass
>gets treated like an ass
Welcome to life.

>>54655195

Except for the man face, adam's apple, masculine facial microexpressions, and movement, broad shoulders, man's body... no way to tell it's a man.

No one can tell a tranny.

>>54655232
I mean if he was dressed like a normal man.

Just a note. I didn't make the sycophant post. We really need poster id

>>54655141
>everyone who calls me out for retardation is "angry at me, Mummy"
>everyone calling me a gobshite is actually one guy with a dozen proxies running simultaneously because I'm so super-special-snowflake I deserve secret Onyx Path conspiracies threatening my paradigm-shattering suggestions

Take your meds.

>>54655203
I am blind, yes.

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>>54655258

>>54655176
Maybe. Or maybe traditional family structures are just one more part of the lie, tying people to mundane concerns and ideas of lineage, painted over with plastic notions of "romance and love eternal" while the divorce lawyers make a killing.

But sure, serve the Lie. It doesn't make you a hypocrite *at all*.

>>54655269
This reaction image immediately makes me a picture the poster as a middle schooler.

>>54655213
hee hee, touched a nerve did we?

have a tissue, dry your eyes. your mascara is running, princess.

>>54655203
The book doesn't *codify* mechanics, it provides a basic suggestion for how to deal with such a powerful thing. That doesn't mean it is mechanically possible with no prep at all - it means that it's fucking high end shit that is left to storyteller fiat as to whether or not such a thing is possible, but it probably shouldn't be, without prep

>>54655232
>>54655255
Who cares? Any hole is a goal, and they're all the same in the dark. You assholes are just denying yourselves. Besides, this is /tg/ - everyone here is LGBTQIAPP

>>54655283
Yeah, and on a school night, no less. Daddy will be cross.

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>>54655291
"we"

>>54655277
>Everything is caused by Exarch oppression!
Awakening was a mistake. So was Ascension, and probably the entierity of the WoD.

What's the current topic tonight, chronicles of fagness?

>>54655341
The universe was the mistake.

>>54655343
Vampfags are tired of being on the bottom of the supernatural pile and want their physical Disciplines made into permanent superpowers for all Clans.

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>>54655343
Mage superiority as always. Tonight some dude said vampires should be stronger. The usual suspects lost their shit hard over it. They're in the face saving phase now.

So, does anyone actually play here ?
What chronicles are you currently engaged in ?

Also does anyone play Demon or is it completely swept under the rug ?
So far, it looks to me like the splat with the most potential for quality storytelling and GM/Player interaction, but it also looks very deserted.
Would you advise to use static settings for it or rather chronicles with the PCs moving around the world a lot ?

Anyway, don't forget to have fun, guys

>>54655343
1) a butthurt middle schooler faggot is angry his vampires don't conform to a specific piece of vampire fiction, but he's so incoherent we're not sure which fiction he wants.

2) One idiot asked about Masters of the Art references taken out of context and then didn't like the fact we looked it up.

3) There's at least one fuckwit acting like this is /b/, and at least one inbred acting like this is /pol/

4) Mage 20th Book of Secrets went live with 300+ pages and I'm still asking someone to give me some idea of what's in it.

>>54655388
Nice. A put up or shut up post.

Let's have it guys.

>>54654587
Thanks anon.

>>54655213
You keep mentioning "the literature and media" but you still haven't specified what literature you are getting all this vampires are leaps and bounds stronger than humans from. The closest we've got is not blade.

Are you taking your vampires from Jojo's bizarre adventure or seraph of the end because it sounds like you want anime vampires?

>>54655394
>One idiot asked about Masters of the Art references taken out of context and then didn't like the fact we looked it up.

That's not how it happened.

>>54655401
I love that this millenial's idea of vampires seems to start with Blade, and now we're even moving into anime.

>>54655388
Which Demon, Fallen or Descent?

>>54655371
It's been said dozens of times, but have you considered homebrewing that Mages are replaced with Hedge Wizards and other occultist quasi-splats from Second Sight ?
They're thematically closer to the nWoD feel and can still fuck you up with the right rituals, without being all-powerful cuntosauruses
Their power-level would be along the lines of hunter, with the potential for high-risk/high-reward feats of magic, with varying degrees of squishiness

>>54655408
I interpreted that as a scoffing, scathing question that >>54655401 directed at >>54655213, assuming that >>54655213
was the one obsessed with anime. Anime in general is not thought of highly around here, which seems arbitrary, because grown adults playing pretend can hardly throw stones.

I now see why vampfags are decried as infinitely worse than magefags when they actually rear their heads.

>>54655410
Descent, I don't know the first thing about Fallen, but I was under the impression Inferno was a lot closer to it in nWoD

>>54655431
They're equally awful at power wanking.

>>54655388
I run a VtR game, play in a semi-silly crossover game, hope to join a VtM game, and hope that a VtR and HtV game resume.

>>54655423
>It's been said dozens of times, but have you considered homebrewing that Mages are replaced with Hedge Wizards and other occultist quasi-splats from Second Sight ?
No, because I think Mages are fine thematically, I don't do crossover games, and if I use other splats as NPCs in a chronicle I know better than to openly bully my players with them or make them a focus.

Masquerade vampires are the second strongest playables in OWoD

What the fuck are you idiots spewing

>>54655432
From what I understand of it, Descent has a cold war feel to it, so the stories could go either way. I guess the big question regards the Cover of the Demons - can they plausibly travel around without raising suspicion? Is it believable?

>>54655451
That would imply that they're stronger than either werewolves or mages in oWoD. They aren't.

>>54655425
I posted >>54655401
I was asking what fiction he is getting all his vamp ideas from, his ideas seem to coincidence with the vampires depicted in anime. I like anime but I would say it is one of the last authorities on western folklore.

>>54655461
I'm referring to the fact that methuselahs trash anything other than archmages.

>>54655438
At least Magefags are right most of the time and don't have to beg for their splat to be stronger.

>>54655451
More importantly: who the fuck cares?

>>54655473
Are methuselahs playable? I didn't know that.

>>54655465
Yeah, I just don't understand why he doesn't try RIFTS. It would give him the power fantasy he clearly craves.

>>54655461
Not to flame, but elder vampires tend to be stronger than werewolves at high levels, and Antediluvians are as powerful as the ST wants thanks to 10 dot disciplines.

>>54655488
The sourcebooks Elysium and Dirty Secrets of the Black Hand feature rules for creating ancient and powerful PC's, up to Methusalah.

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>>54655461

>>54655492
Well yeah, that's the problem with the guy's statement. It needs another piece of information.

"Second most powerful straight out of chargen"? "Second most potentially powerful"? "Second most powerful because of [advantage]?"

>>54655388
Just finished an OWoD werewolf and Vampire game (2 separate games not a mixed one) and going to be taking a break from WoD.

Werewolf was set in the Black Forest and was basically a pack forced together by destiny and seeing why that doesn't really work (The Child of Gaia Ahroun basically had to become a monstrously rage fuelled monster to keep us in check and had a great tragic hero failing arch).

Vamp was a slow burn game set in Berlin where all of the players were basically fucking each over and playing ancilla politics. Was really good fun but might not be to everyones taste because it was very PvP and that's what pur group likes in vamp.

Stoker, more traditional horror movies a-la Hammer Films, the original Dracula, Near Dark - even early Rice, vampires as they were when the Vampire game was inspired, before the 90's kind of diluted the myth and sort of randomized what vampires are a great deal.

>>54655505
Cool, that looks wrong.

>>54655451
I was referring to nWoD specifically.

>>54655537
nWod, where vampires start out with the exact same stats as human characters, the 1 dot base, 5/4/3 spread. Same experience costs for raising them as all the other splats too.

>>54655396
Since I started it, I'll tell you about mine

>Changeling
Double-DM'ing a massive campaign that's supposed to spread over 20+ games, set over three cities, starting at street level and climbing up all the way to Arcadia
Since I've been out of town for a while and we lost players it's been on a prolonged hiatus, but I'm coming back soon and some of my friends are showing a growing interest in RPGs, so we might well start it again
I'm mostly in charge of acting DMPCs (not the mary-sue game-ruining kind) and helping out, the other DM comes up with most of the stuff

>Mortals + Second Sight, soon to become Hunter
DM'ing a campaign set in 1950s Cairo, getting mortal characters involved in the supernatural bit by bit, especially avoiding the major splats and going for a BPRD/Constantine/Cthulhu feel

>Vampire
Double-DM'ing another campaign with the same co-DM
Politics heavy, set mostly in Paris, picturing the rise and fall of a demented King of the Night, it should end with the players in charge of their very own city

It's been a while since I've had the occasion to have a game because of work and personal reasons (let alone play a PC), but we're constantly writing new stuff to add and we occasionally have one-shit sessions in the settings we built for our campaigns (we've got literal hundreds of NPCs and half a dozen fleshed-out cities, gotta use them)

>>54655505
God Machine would be behind the Exarchs/Supernal
Old Gods count amongst Supernal natives.


The Principle *might* be above the Supernal.

>>54655505
This is a mishmash of both old and new. It just looks wrong, all around.

The placements are wrong, the power levels are wrong, and the chart just looks, quite frankly, hideous.

>>54655555
>5 5's

Also, who the fuck is The Principle? From Promethean fluff or something?

>>54655449
Hey, good for you
Keep being excellent

>>54655555
quint quints.

>>54655565
The Principle might be the entity within the Empyrean, which is supposedly 'Raw Truth' in Supernal terms.
Promethean might be more connected to Mage than people realize.

It's one of the interesting theories floating around regarding the cosmology.
Even as a Magefag, I am partial to it.

>>54655458
That's what I was wondering about
Some covers allow much more flexibility than others, which seems tricky to manage
Maybe the more flexible covers could be considered more suspicious by default, thus having some sort of "cover cap" they can't go above unless they integrate sedebtary elements to it ?
Or does that sound too convoluted ?

>>54655521
Well PvP is alright, as long as everyone enjoys it
Otherwise it's just dickbaggery

>>54655505
>'Caine may possibly be in this tier'

Yeah, no. The only thing -truly- divine about Caine is his seven-fold curse.

>>54655584
It sounds like it could either really neat or totally disastrous. I personally would like to avoid any kind of monotheistic god figure that's head and shoulders above the other god figures, if only because there will be people jumping on the obvious parallels.

>>54655599
Is PvP commonplace in WoD games?

>>54655505
This makes me angry. Not because it's wrong, but because you used both OWoD and CofD.

>>54655620
As far as I know, it's a staple of oWoD and specifically VtM, but not so much in other lines or in nWoD
Though it largely depends on the players and DM, there's nothing in the system that makes it obligatory

Why do power levels even fucking matter

>>54655686
Because vampfags are insecure.

>>54655686
It all started with the first lawn chair

>>54655686
They don't...
For some reason that I can't quite grasp the denizens of this thread feel compelled to take part in a neverending make-believe peepee-measuring contest, forgetting all the while that the most important is to play and discuss games that you enjoy

>>54655693
If they were, wouldn't they just play Mages? Exarchs. Vastly more power, vastly fewer drawbacks.

>>54655708
>the most important is to play and discuss games that you enjoy

I enjoy playing and discussing the splat that beats all other splats.

>>54655714
Exarchs have responsibilities. Insecure players gravitate to tradition mages, because they pretty much get everything anyway.

Mage is the superhero system of WoD.

>>54655714
No, they're insecure because of Mages, and therefore hate them.

>>54655734
No, I think they're absolutely on to something. If they were insecure enough to be bothered by another splat in the first place, they would be playing the most overpowered splat.

Ergo, the only logical conclusion would be, they would be playing mages.

The insecurity hypothesis is patently false.

>>54655739
Fucking OPP incompetence. Hunter 2.0, when?

>>54655714
>>54655729
>>54655748
Flawless logic
Magefags btfo

I swear Mage turns its players into actual hubristic assholes

>>54655748
Insecurity comes from a lot of places and can be about a lot of different things, and it's not the only reason to play a game for an insecure person.

>>54655769
Meta.

>>54655388
>>54655396
>not a single magefag actually plays
like pottery

Face it. We would all be Mages if we had the choice. Lie as much as you want. Privilege is privilege.

>>54655783
>like pottery
You're using this incorrectly.

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>>54655783
I expected as much. It's pretty clear they are the kind of players who cannot actually get into a group at all. Fat, repugnant, argumentative, vain, primadonna, rules-lawyer powergamers who shit all over the system and everyone and everything around them.

>>54655807
So, the average /tg/ anon then?

>>54655797
Isn't it just a mock-misspell of the sarcastic "like poetry" ?
What do you think is the correct usage of this, then ?
>>54655807
Now I wouldn't go that far, but it's still amusing to see, given the amount of shit they talk on here

>>54655807
You should use different images if you're going to keep making the same kinds of shitposts. It's pretty easy to spot you. You're the same anon who goes on about the Matrix and you like to cry magefag at the drop of a hat.

>>54655825
>What do you think is the correct usage of this, then ?
In regards to something actually poetic, maybe? Magefags not even playing Mage isn't poetic.

>>54655847
I don't know, there's some poetic irony in people who spend their time arguing that they're the best at something they don't actually do

Dave, our Komodo overlord, great and terrible: Will SoS contain detailed information about all of the Aeons, like the descriptions of Dahhak and Mordred (and maybe even the Old Man) in Astral Realms and Imperial Mysteries?

>>54655919
Not really.

>>54655947
As if he will answer you.

>>54655947
Dude, we already know the content of Signs of Sorcery. It will contain none of that stuff.

>>54655952
eye of the beholder and all that jazz

>>54655975
>"Chapter Five: The Manifest Supernal is about those Supernal Mysteries that do, in defiance of beginning mage’s lessons, sit in the Fallen World.
>Artifacts, eidoforms (platonic objects; the knife that is the symbol for “knife” and so forth), Sariras (the left-behind chrysalis of an Ascension), Hallows, Verges, Emanation Realms, symbolic places called Manteions like the Nevada test range or the ruins of Troy that are themselves magical symbols usable by mages,
>the creations of archmages, ruins of the Time Before, living expressions of magic like Ochemata, Ananke, and the Aeons, and secret people like Rmhoals and their cryptid animal equivalents."

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I want Signs of Sorcery so bad.

Hey there, I've been typing my hands bloody looking for some kind of nice cheatsheet for Hunter the Vigil (pre-GMC), but so far I've come up empty. Ideally, I'd get myself a PDF of the Hunter Storyteller screen, but I've been unable to find one, and the thing itself is absurdly expensive, it takes much too long to ship it to Germany. Does anybody have any cheatsheets/quick reference sheets he or she could share?

>>54656107
I'd help you out but my grandpa was killed by Nazis in WWII. And also I don't have it.

>>54656113
What a coincidence, my grandpa fell of a guard tower at Auschwitz but some bloke broke his fall. And also, thank you for your effort.

>>54656129
No prob

>>54656107
Did you try 4shared ?

>>54656159
Yep, I've had no luck so far. I don't even mind if it's third party or something, but it's the first game of Hunter I'll GM, and believe, quick reference sheets are way useful.

>>54656189
You just gotta believe.

>>54656189
Right now I can't make any searches because I'm at work, but if I find anything tonight, I'll post it
Good luck on your side

>>54655529
Wow, confirmed for not knowing jack about shit.

The Hammer Films were not "traditional", they were shlock. The only saving grace was the utter authority with which seasoned actors like Cristopher Lee and Peter Cushing delivered their roles. The original Dracula, Lost Boys and Near Dark are woven through Masquerade from 1st Ed onwards - in fact, I remember a piece of Bradstreet artwork from 2nd ed that was a modified frame from Near Dark; Lance Henrikson leaning back under the shadows and light of the trucker bar, with added eye sparkle and prominent fangs.

You're just an ignorant fuckstain who keeps arguing even when you have no idea what you're talking abou-

What am I saying, you'll fit in around here perfectly.

>>54655564
Yes, that's why it gets posted. It's the WOD equivalent of a picture of Jon Luc Picard with the caption,
>"Use the Force, Harry" -- Gandalf the Black

It's purpose is to provoke annoyance. Ignore it.

>>54655592
I think Mortals in and of themselves don't look suspicious - it's their actions that draw attention from the God Machine. Their Cover would most likely survive "out of character" behaviour like jumping on a last minute flight to Yemen, right up until they visit Infrastructure there and blow it up.

>>54655614
Well if they are head and shoulders above the rest, they don't do much with their awesome power past tampering about with creating life. It's like the entity is some wizened, obsessed old toymaker, building his toys for the fuck of it regardless of who might want them or not. The limited focus leads to limited scope.

>>54655624
WOD New 52?

>>54655686
Because felching faggots can't admit their love of Dragonball Z extends to masturbating about their favourite Mage waifu clocking over 9,000 Arete

>>54655729
>Insecure players gravitate to tradition mages, because they pretty much get everything anyway.

Do they get orbital cruisers and HIT marks? No? Then they don't get everything.

/argument

>>54655807
This needs to be screencapped and stickied for all eternity. Not since Moses descended from Mt Sinai with THE WORD has such Truth been uttered.

>our Magefags
>who art in /wodg/
>inbred be thy genes

>>54655947
Tell Dave his work is shit, his company is shit, his swedish overlords are shit, his coworkers are shit, his ideas are shit and OPP is going to crash and burn so hard that Gary Gygax is going to be mocking them.

>>54656038
>more Jargon

YAY, more terms for us to learn just so they'll be dumped next edition!!! My favourite are terms that don't even appear anywhere outside the Lexicons, like "Autarkis".

>>54656381
The cover would survive it, but it would also run the risk of degrading because of the action out of character (namely, catching a flight to Yemen out of nowhere)
More embarassing, the potential mortal friends, colleagues and relations they might have might start asking questions or digging around and that would definitely erode the Demon's cover

What would be good "operational covers" for demons to use strictly in their war against the God Machine, as far as jobs and backgrounds go ?

>>54656113
>>54656129
My great-grandfather was flattened by a horse and cart carrying a load from the distilleries.

They always said alcohol would get him in the end...

>>54656481
Ummmm.....

There are more psychopaths in Finance than any other industry, so if you wanted to hide a vicious character, that would allow for corporate acts of cruelty as well as global travel.

I met a guy who used to help conduct democratic elections, he got to travel to all kinds of backwater shitholes, with security details and armed convoys, no less.

"Civilian Contractor" status for the US military allows for some pretty crazy frequent flyer miles, by yourself or with a small group.

UN Weapons Inspectors, Medicine Sans Frontiers, WHO all jaunt around the place.... but really, the ideal cover would just be some rich asshole that does things because he can.

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Could Julius Belmonte kill an Antideluvian?

>>54655739
>Hunter Stereotypes

>Mages*are* better you. Beside the cosmic power, they're the only true humans, and except for a few sleepwalkers, the rest of the sleeping filth are little more than Abyss-tainted monkeys with delusions of grandeur.

>Also, nice shotgun, L O L...

>>54655783
>pottery

Ceramics serve the Lie.

masters are shit. can't even live on earth. because bitch devs don't understand power creep so they pushed all their retarded power players into no game space, with their dicks in their hands and no setting to interact with.

>>54656470
>more Jargon

I like the splat-specific Lexicon. It helps distinguish the casual fan from hardcore player. It also helps distinguish the settings of the various gamelines, and emphasizes Mage's "academic" vibe.

Also, Forsaken is far worse. You basically need to learn a new language, First Tongue, to deal with the game.

>>54656620
>masters are shit. can't even live on earth

In Ascension, some of the coolest shit happens off-earth. That's why Revised and the Avatar Storm were so damned controversial.

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Nobody wants requiem vamps to be strongest we are just tired of the fact that we are a laughing stock of splats. The only thing weaker than us is fucking changeling and beasts. Even social encounters which is supposed to be our speciality pales before Mages and Demons.

>>54656553
No. Not without a lot of help. Ravnos wasn't the most powerful of the Antedliuvians, and it took Samuel Haight levels of crossover to stop him (her?)

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>>54656578
>Butthurt Shitpost: The Movie

>>54656673
>Nobody wants requiem vamps to be strongest we are just tired of the fact that we are a laughing stock of splats.

Hey, don't feel bad, vamps are more powerful than humans...

>Snicker<

>>54656500
>>54656113
>>54656129
Obviously all part of a God-Machine conspiracy to keep anon from getting the HtV GM screen
>>54656525
All great ideas, thanks for that
I guess a nondescript "salesman" cover would work just as well for missions who just need freedom of movement
The issue with high-end covers is that if the person has a very important situation, they might not be willing to sign it off to a Demon
Unless, of course, the Demon manages to give them a reason to give it all up

Gives me an idea : an NPC Demon wants to obtain a high-responsibility cover (let's say a senator or governor) to interfere with the God-Machine's plans (or serve it) and systematically undermines the policies of their target, sows discord in their fief, etc ... to push them over the edge and then offer them a pact
That would actually make a good chronicle for my players, have them be manipulated by an integrator that has them believe said governor is a powerful agent of the God-Machine, while using them to obtain his position, in search for the power that will allow him to become an exile
Dammit this is not going to be good for my sleep schedule and workload

>>54656638
This.
>>54656673
Why are you so goddamn insecure? I happily play these games without worrying about Demon or Mage being "more powerful". If it bothered me, I'd play Demon or Mage.

These games are supposed to be about collaboratively telling an entertaining story, not making YOU feel better about your tiny, impotent little penis.

Just choke.

>>54656673
False flag the post

>>54656715
>The issue with high-end covers is that if the person has a very important situation, they might not be willing to sign it off to a Demon

Maybe, maybe not. The pressure on people in these top jobs to perform is immense. If you fail on a multimillion dollar deal, it could end your career - a bad decision in diplomacy could end other people's lives. Imagine, then, such a stress case being approached by someone who can literally make it all work.... for a price.

>>54656673
>The only thing weaker than us is fucking changeling and beasts.
Not really. Pretty sure they're both stronger than vampires.

>>54656735
It actually reminded me of The Boss's "lemon" speech from Cars 2.

>The world turned their backs on cars like us. They stopped manufacturing us, stopped making our parts. The only thing they haven't stopped doing is laughing at us. They've called us terrible names - jalopy, rust bucket, heap, clunker, junker, beater, wreck, rattletrap... lemon. But their insults just give us strength. Because today, my friends, that... all... ends! They laughed at us, but now it's our turn to laugh back. Embrace your inner lemon. Let it drive you. This was meant to be alternative fuel's greatest moment. But after today, everyone will race back to gasoline. And we, the owners of the world's largest untapped oil reserve, will become the most powerful cars in the world! They will come to us, and they will have no choice, because they will need us, and they will finally respect us! So hold your hoods high! After today, you will never again be ashamed of who you are! Long... live... lemons!

>>54656759
You are absolutely right, though it would also be interesting to see the Demon create the problems, as I said above

But the idea of granting a wall street trader their dream life of being a potato farmer in Milwaukee is terribly heartwarming

>>54656779
Changelings are squishier but they have lots of utility powers and less banes
Powerlevels are dumb anyway, what's important is the tone and the feel of the game

>>54656832
>what's important is the tone and the feel of the game

This needs to be the mantra repeated every time another one of these fucking brain damaged Dragonball arguments start.

>>54656855
That's what I already say most of the time, but so few listen ...

>>54656874
Well, I'm listening, and I'm fucking sick of this thread being /b/ lite as well. All of the retardation, none of the calories!

>>54656963
The trick is, as always, to ignore the trolls, as hard as that can be sometimes
People are baited much too easily (and I'll admit to instances of flaming and baiting myself from time to time)
Just deprive them of the (You) they so desperately crave and they will stop

>>54656963
>>54657002
Why don't you two faggots go jerk each other off on Reddit

>>54656350

>The Hammer Films were not "traditional", they were shlock.

And what fun shlock they were, good Anon! In all seriousness though, yeah, you're right, there's more Hammer in Chill than Masquerade and that's only really in terms of aesthetics than content.

>>54655833
Oh, am I now? I go on and on about the Matrix? In a WoD thread? So what movie do I discuss over in the DnD 5e thread? The Bourne Identity?

>>54657818
>he plays DnD
Gross.

>>54656470
They love their fucking jargon. Mage is approaching Werewolf levels with its tower of babel word soup nowadays.

>>54656620
Actually they seem to understand it perfectly well, hence the sequestering them to lala-land, where they can't apocalypse the multiverse because they had a bad day and Luna got a little toothy on her blowjob a moment ago.

>>54657875
I don't think Awakening has bad jargon. It's not like its excessive or hard to understand. There are a lot of things. Things have names.

>>54657972
It's literally a word soup of greek, sanskrit and lord knows what else. I mean it's fascinating from a linguistic standpoint, but it's just annoying in practice. I'm only thankful that there was some degree of restraint, because it easily could have gotten a lot worse, they could have just flipped out and went the jargon route with everything, rather than accepting the use off commonly accepted terms like "mana", "wisdom", "hubris" and the like. Hell, it almost looks like someone was longing to call Wisdom, "Sophia" heh.

>>54658080
But I'm being a bit over critical. It's much better than Werewolf, where the nonsense language is embarrassing, part of that faux native american fetishization imagery they never really could brush off (probably Skemp's influence.)

>>54658080
What are the especially bad terms?

>>54657834
I have a friend who lost his wife and youngest daughter in an auto accident. He had been withdrawn for almost four years because of it, but when he out of the blue called a few of us who had played for years as kids together, about just getting together to game, that was the system that we went with, for nostalgia sake, and we're having a great time, with a most abominable party. Three halflings (A cleric of a harvest god, mine, a druid of a bear cult, and a wizard), and a lizardman (An ancestor cult shaman - sort of a homebrew one of the guys made). We've arranged an alliance between our halflings village and one tribe of lizardmen against some sort of fungus brain snatcher threat that no one else in the region believes in. Sh

>>54658568
he should have topped himself instead of subjecting you to dnd

>>54658697
Oh wow, look at this faggot. Internet tough guy time, over choice of RPG. In before "roleplaying not rollplaying" line.

any news, rumors, factoids about Deviant?

and the next big new project will be Dark Eras 2 and not a new original gameline, right?

>>54658949
Deviant has entered first drafting, apparently.

>>54658968
apparently they have all the time in the world. release in three years?

>>54659032
Let's round up to five to be safe.

>>54659032
>>54659075
In this thread, RichT, DaveB, Rose/Russ, Satyros and the MacFarlands Brainstorm a 5 year plan/release cycle to save OPP.

>>54659208
Satyros? Using modern technology? Don't make me laugh, anon.

>>54658840
actually more wtf has that story got to do with wod/chron thread?

>>54656673
>The only thing weaker than us is fucking changeling and beasts.
Dunno about Changelings yet, but in Beast vs Vampire I would bet on Beast.

>>54656481
>What would be good "operational covers" for demons to use strictly in their war against the God Machine, as far as jobs and backgrounds go ?
Private dick, bounty hunter, contract killer, business consultant.

>>54659208
Two days later OPP goes broke thanks to an embezzlement scandal, nobody notices, continues to release kickstarters as pure scam jobs this time.

New thread

>>54660012

>>54656481
Utilities inspectors. They're ubiquitous. You know the people with the clipboard, the hard hat, the high vis vest - sometimes, a truck full of utilities gear, climbing harnesses and a jumpsuit made of natural fabrics who you find halfway up a mountain side fiddling with some random bit of technology?

It's practically the perfect demon cover. Council inspectors, sewer workers, all of it. The people who are everywhere, in weird places.

>>54658080
At least it isn't as bad as mummy. Which has so much jargon, I still haven't tries to play it.

>>54659667
>>54660031
All great ideas, thanks
There must be something wrong though ... /wodg/ is being helpful ...

>>54660234
Well, there's a new thread up. The trolls are moving on.

>>54655795
Face it, we would also all be Seers. Just look at this thread, goddammit.

>>54660008

Catalyst already did that.

>>54655748
Mage is too complicated for them to achieve rules mastery, so instead they complain about their splat being weaker.