/osr/

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>>54189119
>How do noncombatants dress?
The answer (as it is for many questions in these threads) is "it depends."

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>>54189231
So give multiple of circumstantial answers.
Ideally alongside your context, to prevent or retard conflict down the line.

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>>54189353
I believe I did, via the medium of pictures.

>my wizard OC ended up being the OP post of a future thread

I'm so proud.

To celebrate, give me a request for an encounter list to a certain location or biome.

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>>54189471
>encounter list to a certain location or biome.
Giant Abandoned Underground City. No original inhabitants, but what else is creeping around in the dark, three miles underground?

>>54189518
>No original inhabitants,

Suppose there never were any

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>>54189471
A university gone feral.
Lots of knife-fighters, of course.

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>>54189583

>>54189518
That cartilage giant from Deep Carbon Observatory is creepy as fuck and I highly recommend it.

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>>54189518
>>54189583
>>54189725

I like this. Pretty spoopy.

>>54189645

Regular university, or magic university?

Great suggestion today boiz

>>54189231
furs and leathers. Warmth is most important, and that means multiple layers of reindeer fur. Keeping the damp out is also useful, so that means waxing the out layer.
But in my setting 'non-combatant' basically means 'children and invalids'. If you're an adult, you hunt.
>>54189518
The Things They Made should be there. For example:
>repair and janitorial drones
> helpful medical bots
that are almost indistinguishable from
>horrible torture bots
>golem law enforcement, that think the PCs are tresspassing.
>shambling results of forbidden experiments
>Entertainment puppets with their weird arts
>artificial slaves

>>54189920
Mostly regular university with strange magical investigations into uncovering and translating ancient texts. Like if the renaissance fascination with ancient greek and roman stuff also had things man was not meant to know.

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>>54189920
Is there a distinction between "regular universities" and "magic universities?"
Old-timey universities had pretty heterogeneous curricula.

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>>54189920
>Great suggestion today boiz
Dirty fucking tables boiz
>Real fucking dirty
Dirty like Dave
>Dave Arneson
With the Dave Arnes-guns *pow* *pow*
>Guy didn't look like it, but he was fucking stacked bro
Stacked in 10' cubes bro
>Stacked like bonuses to hit bro
Stacked like....

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>>54190002
>that are almost indistinguishable from
I think that concept's been done to death, desu. It's a little trite these days.

>>54190012
In my setting, yes. Wizards can't study theology in any serious capacity.

>>54189770
It's very good.

>>54190046
>trite
Does this actually happen? I get people who are into osr as a scene, dm and read a lot more stuff than we play can get blown out on things, but do players call things 'cliché' or whatever at the table? I see a lot of discussion about cliché' things and trope on /tg/ but I can't tell if its just complaining. I might just have lucked out in having mostly noob players. If one of them got it together enough to gm, I'd by mostly exited to play... at all really.

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>>54190046
>Wizards can't study theology in any serious capacity.
That... seems pretty at odds with the original idea of a university.
Not wholly juxtaposed, but enough that I'd imagine wizards having guilds instead.

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>>54190153
Correct.

See, it started off that wizards could totally study theology.

Then angels started showing up.

This made a lot of people very unhappy, but it also made a lot of people very dead.

Now, they can still go to University, but they get their own semi-affiliated buildings and they aren't allowed to muck around with scripture.

Moving from B/X to 2e and I want to be clear on how spells work

>A wizard tries to learn a new spell, either from a book, other wizard, or research
>he has a chance to fail based on ability scores
>if he succeeds, the spell is copied into his spell book
>specialists can't learn spells from the opposition schools
>then as he pleases based on spell slots, he memorizes spells
>casting spells works similarly to B/X except some cost materials
>if a wizard loses his spell book, when he starts a new one he needs to reacquire spells
>your skin can be used as a spell book

>>54190281
Your spells known limits are by Intelligence, instead of matching how many spells you can memorize.
Spells known are also a separate concept from your spellbooks, which can really screw you if you need to replace a book.
You gain a new spell each level up, from assumed downtime research. You don't roll chance to learn on it.
You can learn a spell from a scroll by spending half the cost of inventing a new spell.
Your spells aren't automatically last each round. The "Casting Time" entry on every spell is an initiative penalty.

On a scale of 1 to 10, how much do you hate classless OSR?

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>>54189119
Alright, so I contacted this guy Kevin a few days ago, from an Ad on our FLGS, and he's aiming to play a 1E AD&D Adventure he's been working on.

My experience with RPGs have been 5e, GURPS, FFG Star Wars, Cyberpunk 2020, Savage Worlds, RuneQuest 6e, and a couple other minor games.

What am I in for, what should I expect, and most important, which is the least "problematic" class in 1E, or the one that every party usually wants in a classic Dungeon Crawl.

>>54190790
>paly
Good luck.

>which is the least "problematic" class in 1E,
Fighter.
>or the one that every party usually wants in a classic Dungeon Crawl.
Thief or Cleric.

>>54190281
>except some cost materials
Some materials are a pain to acquire or transport.

>>54190790
Just going by that ad, I feel like Kevin is in his late 40s at least.

I hope you have a good time palying with Kevin!

>>54191046
As a general rule of thumb, I'd stay away from anybody hooking.

>>54190790
Why does that ampersand look like a beggar?

>>54189569
The magic item creation is neat, but feels overly bookkeepy.
Does it have anything else going for it besides awful aesthetics?

>>54190644
Thanks. So spells known are separate, that means you can have spells in your book that you don't know and can't cast. If you lose the book, you can only transcribe the ones you know. Is that right?

>>54190915
I like that aspect.

>>54191503
>that means you can have spells in your book that you don't know and can't cast.
That's absolutely a thing that you're allowed to do.
>If you lose the book, you can only transcribe the ones you know.
If you haven't filled all your spells known and you pass your chance to learn, you can add new spells.
But for the most part, yes. You will need to find copies* of the exact spells you lost.
*unlike in Bx, where you can freely rewrite any of your spells without access to your book

>>54191503
There are a few other differences between the spellbooks, come to think of it.

Bx Magic-Users implicitly have one spellbook, which they take everywhere.
It costs nothing to add a spell, but 1000gp per spell level to replace a missing book.

AD&D Mages often have many 100 page spellbooks. Spells occupy level+1d6-1 pages.
Each page costs 50gp tp fill, and the book can't leave down.
You can also pay 100gp per page to fill transportable 50 page books.

For comparison, 15gp buys you 1 day's Iron Rations in Bx amd 10gp buy's you a week's in AD&D.

What do you think about increasing the fighter's critical threat range as he levels up? Too overpowered?

>>54191881
>>54191950
Thanks, that's very helpful. My party really likes using magic so I need to be clear beforehand.

>>54192664
Too arbitrary?
Whatever floats your boat.
I don't even use crits.

>>54192829
I like crits. Gives the players something to look forward to when they attack, and something to dread when a monster does.

How much of a crossover is there between people who enjoy storygames and OSR? Apocalypse World honestly seems like a decent system to do OSR-style shenanigans in if you cut out the faggotry.

>>54192976

I thought that is what dungeon world was about?

You could always make your own hack. I've also tried my own hand at it, but people didn't seem to like it very much on this board.

>>54190790
I would avoid playing wizards and thieves. But I think you will have a good time

>>54192882
There's already a 1-in-8 chance that my d8 weapon does 8 damage.
I don't see the need to add a 7-in-(8*(20+AC-THAC0)) chance to that.

>>54192976
Torchbearer sees far less play than OSRIC, and nobody plays OSRIC.

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>>54192976
>Apocalypse World honestly seems like a decent system to do OSR-style shenanigans

It's called Dungeon World, and it's shit.

>>54193080
It's fun and it adds just a bit more danger and uncertainty to both sides without being totally unbalancing. I think there's very much something to be said about simulating the random lucky shot.

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>>54193197
I'm already doing that with the d8.

>>54193049 >>54193197
>if you cut out the faggotry.

>>54193049
Dungeon World is a trash version of Apocalypse World.

>>54193197
>It's shit.
AW is not DW. DW is shit.

>>54193080
Torchbearer isn't even an RPG. It's basically a boardgame sans board.

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So I was going to work on some new material today but I realized I had this half finished one from like months ago and I decided to finish it up.

Magic War-Torn city encounters. To whoever requested it; sorry for the long delay.

>>54192976
It depends on your tolerance for narrative hijinks but I think it works pretty well if you emphasize that kind of play.

The optimal strategy for an AW derived game is to describe your PC acting in such a way that they would plausibly attain their goal, but that doesn't trigger a Move (and cause you to roll dice, which can cause you to fail), because then the GM will just give you the thing you want in all likelihood. So in a way those games emphasize player knowledge of real life things, creativity, and persuasion skills (which can make a nice break from testing systems knowledge so much). For example, you don't have a lot of real life knowledge of climbing, but you theorize using a rope to climb a cliff is better than not using one, so now when you roll Defy Danger the sorts of consequences that the GM is logically allowed to inflict on you if you fail are dramatically less bad for you because the rope would prevent you from plummeting to your death. Then if you had a lot of experience with mountaineering and free climbing it's possible you could use that knowledge to specifically describe a procedure that would entail so little risk the GM and the other players decide you're not even doing anything risky anymore and you don't have to roll at all and just succeed. By emphasizing the social rather than the systemic aspect I think it is sort of like Mafia or Werewolf is to board games.

That procedure is very similar to the OSR method of "say something smart your PC does and the GM interprets it based on how likely it seems to succeed" in most ways that matter I think. Two big sticking points for some people is that AW-derived games have very strong suggestions for how you should best be interpreting player actions in terms of their success/failure/consequences via the GM Move system, and that some of the game mechanics are heavily abstracted (like ammo or gear). I don't mind the former and chopping off the latter is easy enough, so I think it works ok.

>>54193626 >>54164404
>Buying his time for a more respectable
position
You buy time from things, you bide time for things.
Biding time is waiting. Buying time is delaying.

Unless I'm badly misreading the rest of the entry, Cat-scartach demon is trying to /become/ significant rather than trying to avoid it.

>>54192976
>faggotry

The main game I run is a mashup of apocalypse world and b/x. I push moves pretty hard, use 1HD:2harm as a rough measure, do stuff with more procedural generation and make lists with tables so I'm not always asking players everything, I cut out Hx and use a bastardized ask/answer xp system, probably a bunch of other hackjob stuff. Seems to work fine.

The dark ages game they were going to make but fucked up and made AW 2nd ed has a lot of cool stuff going on to loot. Beyond The Wall is obviously taking direct cues from AW. Dungeon world is mostly shit, I like how they do adventuring equipment and other parts of inventory though. It also lead to Perilous Wilds/Freebooters on the Frontier, both of which have excellent material for pbta and osr. World of Dungeons is pretty neat as well. PbtA also lead to The Quiet Year and The Deep Forest, both of which are amazing content and world generators. The Deep Forest especially for D&D.

I come to /osr/ for tables, maps, links to books and material to steal.

>>54193702
eeee.... I don't like badwrongfuning people, but that's really far from how anyone I have played, would play, or would want to play a pbta game and seems like an odd reading. If you're concerned with optimization strategies for player success you're focusing on the wrong things. Also the mc can make failing a roll as dangerous as the circumstances require, the question is not 'how can I make this seemingly benign so I don't have to roll?' its 'how can this be interesting, and if its not, don't roll'. If the mc has notes or ideas regarding other events that can interfere with the group in question climbing a cliff and they can make it interesting, they can inflict. Its not about trying to immobilize your mc's imagination by providing so much seemingly authoritative information that they can't fuck with you, its about making compelling events by elaborating on each other's ideas.

>>54193803
>do stuff with more procedural generation and make lists with tables so I'm not always asking players everything

That bit functions better as advice than a game rule anyway. It makes exploration-based gameplay almost impossible because players are making shit up instead of discovering it.

>>54193950
I'm not sure I see much of a difference between making shit up and discovering it. I'm not too worried about simulating pioneering free agency though, the collaborative aspects are more interesting to us. When hex crawling I roll on tables as appropriate, and ask players for more input and ideas.

>>54193942
It's obviously not the INTENDED way to play, I won't dispute that. But in spite of the advice to play the game as a hippie story circle this way works just fine and me and a dozen other people found it fun for like 70 or 80 sessions I think.

It really depends on which principles you emphasize. For example, if you emphasize "ask questions, use the answers" to a high degree then you basically wind up with GMless storygaming. Similarly, if you emphasize "make AW seem real" and "say what honesty demands" then you naturally arrive at the fiction-manipulation gameplay among challenge-oriented players who want to describe and interact with the scenario so that what the truth demands is them succeeding.

>>54193747

What an incredibly specific grievance. I have fixed it now though, for future installments.

>>54193981
If you don't mind the distinction more power to you, but to me it's like the difference between reading a story (discovering) and writing a story (making shit up). Like I want to learn what's in the chest I just opened not create it. If I wanted to put contents in chests I'd be the GM you know?

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>>54194082
It seemed like an honest mistake, rather than a typo.
>grievance
I wasn't thinking badly of you, I was thinking less of you.

My correction was with pure intentions!

>>54194079
I'm not really sure how making the game about elaboration on risk management isn't a story circle jerk? Like, ymmv so go for it, and we're getting into very different group dynamics at this point. The dozen or so people thing is neat, did you have a decent amount of player turnover and/or big games?

>>54194127
I get that. When I want to read a story I read a story, when I'm hanging out telling stories with my friends I'm interested in what we can come up with together. Its one of rpg's greatest appeals to me, that you can do live collaborative story-telling with rng and prompts.

Sorry about both of those posts, I think I came off more like a jerk than I wanted to. Its actually interesting to learn about what things in playing games people like.

>>54193435
>AW is not DW. DW is shit.

And that's why I said Dungeon World and not Apocalypse World.

>>54193301
AW isn't faggoty if it dovetails with the narrative heavy, cinematic style that one might be looking for in a game. There are several PbtA games based off it like Monster of the Week that are great because they know the specific tone of game that the system is tailored for. Dungeon World fails both as an oldschool dungeoncrawler and a newschool narrative storygame.

>>54194500
>Sorry about both of those posts, I think I came off more like a jerk than I wanted to. Its actually interesting to learn about what things in playing games people like.

Not a problem. What people find fun is highly idiosyncratic, often to the point of wondering how anyone could find one of their pastimes enjoyable at all. Most people I know would think painting miniature plastic army men is incomprehensible unless you're an action figure manufacturer.

> I'm not really sure how making the game about elaboration on risk management isn't a story circle jerk?

What do you mean by "story circle jerk"? I'm not sure what you consider to be one so I'm not sure I can explain further.

> The dozen or so people thing is neat, did you have a decent amount of player turnover and/or big games?

It was a shot at a West Marches-y thing, but it was hard to advertise for something that emulated modern D&D's priorities (realism, discovery, challenge) using the AW engine, which for good reason tends to attract more storygamer types. Typically about 1 in 8 applicants ended up playing long term, 1 in 8 played a couple times, I threw out the applications of 4 in 8 because they were bad, and 2 in 8 decided against playing for whatever reason despite a good application.

> learning means not being active

I agree with your priorities in terms of player agency, but I don't think these two are mutually exclusive. For example, you can display a lot of that sort of thing in a mystery oriented game, but it kind of blows apart the whole idea of solving a mystery if the players get to write it as you go.

>>54194500
>>54194840
I should clarify, by "players writing the mystery as they go" I mean the parts of the mystery that traditionally if you knew them you would have the solution to the mystery and it would stop being interesting except in a dramatic irony sense.

>>54194840
I'm not sure what you meant by the intentions of the game being a hippy circle jerk? Or I think I do, in that its a dialogue call response kind of way? I think its probably only going to be a preference as to what sort of story masturbating we prefer really. I find the idea of everyone sitting around trying to elaborate on rock climbing so as to avoid rolling dice to be a really unintuitive way to have fun and it was confused by what constituted a circle jerk I think. How did that end up working in practice? How much/what sort of descriptions of things did people come up, or what made them more compelling than others? Did rolls come up much? It sounds neat, just very different than how our group plays. I think it makes sense also given a rotating cycle of players, as there's less regular contact and time to build rapport for rffing on each other's ideas.

That does seem tricky to filter for. It almost sounds like you used the moves in an osr mentality of rolling dice is a failure state, as a way to incentivize free-form in a weird way.

Yeah, mystery games as how they relate to 'finding' or discovering is a neat space. I haven't had a chance to play many investigation oriented games though. CoC didn't really do it for me, but I hear mixed things on Gumshoe and have only read the rules. I think some of the revealing of the mystery is key in how it appears and feels to be discovery and gming that would be a delicate matter.

>>54194882
I get what you mean. I think mysteries would be difficult with my group given how much we collude and try to link things up thematically. They'd be more like police procedurals/noirs where everyone knows the form and the acts, we're just sorting out how the formula comes together this time.

>>54195050
>I'm not sure what you meant by the intentions of the game being a hippy circle jerk?

Oh, I was just exaggerating the idea that the GM and players' roles strongly overlap and that the game frowns upon "winning" except insofar as "winning" is collaboratively 'writing' a good story with some mildly asymmetric authorship roles.

I meant to draw the distinction between being diagetically clever (doing smart things on behalf of your character and finding fun in their success) vs. being a clever author (doing smart things on behalf of what an audience would find entertaining, even if it means bad things for your character).

> I find the idea of everyone sitting around trying to elaborate on rock climbing so as to avoid rolling dice to be a really unintuitive way to have fun

Rock-climbing is just one example to be fair. In the general case it's the same kind of fun you can have when you consider "how do we beat these orcs using only a bag of marbles" or "how can I use my spear most to my advantage in this combat," only instead of thinking in terms of the rules for marbles or spears you are thinking about how they would best be employed in real life (or the nearest equivalent, for stuff like magic), or at least thinking up an idea that will convince the other players of your success.

> How did that end up working in practice?

It taught me one thing that I still use, at least, which is that you should make the default consequences explicit, and then state how those consequences are modified by players' ideas so they can make informed choices. So, like, if a player wants to climb a cliff you could say "well you could do it free hand but you'd risk falling to your death," and then when they say they'd use a rope to help you could say "OK well now you might hurt yourself but you won't fall to your death." It's a great way to feed players info so they can make informed choices without having to make a wild guess about what your ruling will be. (1/2)

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>>54192976
I think you could use Apocalypse World to tell a story that has similar aspects to an OSR game, but Apocalypse World is driven, as written, by Player + Player interactions, not Player + World. It's also highly non-simulationist.

I do like it though, and other story games like Fate, etc. They wouldn't be my first choice for an OSR game by a mile.

>>54193702
Wait... you minmaxed Apocalypse World to avoid losing?

Why?

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>>54190247 >>54190046
Wait, are you Skerples? The desu threw me off.
You would be new enough to not know the word filters.

>>54195050
(2/2)
> How much/what sort of descriptions of things did people come up, or what made them more compelling than others?

A very common variety of this was finding ways to just deal damage in combat without having to expose yourself to danger. Stuff like luring monsters into an ambush and dropping things on top of them, or sneaking up on them while they're asleep, abusing the range of your spear or so on. Commonly there was a sort of hierarchy where you'd get things that relied on character skill like "I attack" (usually triggered a Move, not advantageous) versus somewhat obvious but specific descriptions like "I stay at range to use my spear" (usually triggered a Move, but made consequences for failure less severe) versus no-roll ideas (e.g. specific investigative actions like looking under a couch instead of doing the "tell me what's cool in this room" Move).

It's really not remarkably different in practice than all the "OSR players being clever" stories you've probably heard, except I think it supports it a little better in some ways b/c of the GM Move and Move trigger gameplay loop whereas b/x is just like "you got it GM go make some rulings about stuff that isn't in the rules I believe in you."

> Did rolls come up much?

Most games are mostly made of stuff you don't roll for I think, but that's just how TTRPGs work. I'd say we rolled about as many dice as any other game that doesn't roll wargame tier dice buckets. Most of the player skill came in minimizing consequences for rolls instead of circumventing them entirely b/c that's easier.

> It almost sounds like you used the moves in an osr mentality of rolling dice is a failure state, as a way to incentivize free-form in a weird way.

That's exactly it, really.

> I get what you mean. I think mysteries would be difficult with my group

Cool, yeah, that's what I was getting at re: the difference.

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>>54195314
Or old and lazy enough to forget about them.

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>>54195335
>suggesting oldfaggotry
You fool no one.

You also haven't posted your paper: >>54195020

>>54195191
I get it. Interesting. I think finding ways to encourage detail rich descriptions is worth thinking about. Not how I'd even think to do so, but it also sounds like you were running a very different game.

Explicit consequences are key for sure. I think one of the pitfalls of giving so much potential authorship to players can be a lack of distinction between characters and players, and losing sight of keeping their narration/ideas/responses from becoming too outlandish.

>>54195259
I tend to run fronts pretty aggressively at the players so they have a bit more world to be against together.

I think he's onto something with the optimization. Or its at least worth thinking about.

I can't make my fucking PCs leave this fucking castle alone. They've spent 130k gold on it so far and they keep trying to turn DCC into ACKS and won't even play ACKS. I actually reduced the entire thing to ruins with a massive giant attack and they were like "Oh man this must have something really valuable in the catacombs if a giant army wanted it." And rebuilt it. Dragons blow up towers and they have them rebuilt. They've been doing this so long they're on their third set of PCs, with around 19 level 10 pcs that just sort of wander the fuck around being walking demigods. I have this entire world built and all they want to do is hang out in this castle and "investigate the mysteries." I made the fucking mistake of having one of them, after 10 sessions of digging into the god damn ground, actually find a hidden chamber with a shitty +1 sword and now they've got armies of craftsmen in there, tunneling, holing out and making a small subterranean city. Had them bump into a dwarven thaig or whatever and get invaded, ruining all of their progress. Fuck it, we got lots of gold let's build it all again but this time with more shit. I can't fucking handle this anymore. My players. Will not. Leave. This castle.

Don't respond to this, >>54195425 it was already posted last thread. There's no reason to dozens of posts. This general already moves too fast.

>>54195317
Yeah, there we go. I tend to use moves as prompts for activity, so when/if someone says 'I attack' I'd ask 'how?' and they'd give me detail and we figure out if it actually needs a roll or triggers anything. After a while everyone just gives details automatically, and if the details are significantly in the player's favour I probably don't ask for a move. I think we're talking about a similar enough thing, we just think about it really differently. Brains are weird.

>b/x is just like you got it GM go make some rulings about stuff that isn't in the rules I believe in you
Charmingly accurate.

that was cool, thanks.

>>54195447
That's going in the next OP.

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>>54195356
>You fool no one.
Don't make me go through the archives again, sonny boy...

>You also haven't posted your paper:
Now that guy, that guy is not me. I've been having a nap for the past 4 hours. Anyway, my eras are the breakdown of the Roman Republic, the 100 Years War, and some scattered bits around the Thirty Years War.

>>54189119
Anons what are some things I can do to give my fighter PCs more customization beyond Weapon spec and mastery in 2e D&D?

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>>54195469
>in 2e
You picked 2e, and you need to ask? Kits.

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>>54195379
>I think he's onto something with the optimization. Or its at least worth thinking about.

It's definitely worth thinking about. But it's like looking at a guy who made a beautiful secret prison workshop to produce bone china. Impressive, in a way. Worth examining and cracking down on. But, as you cart the miniature furnaces away and carefully bag the tiny, tiny pots of glaze, you have to ask "why". Why not meth?

>>54195462
Don't you fucking dare.

>>54195481
Yes. And my DM doesn't allow kits at the table so that's out atm.

>>54195490
He allows Skills and Powers, Combat and Tactics, and things of that nature, but as far as I can tell it still only gives Fighters flat bonuses to hit better and the like and Im looking for more to do than charge forward and attack.

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>>54195469

>>54160908
>>54161033

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>>54195502
Are there any weapons besides spears that do special things?
Maybe use one of those. Or fluff your dude in an odd way.
Or talk to your referee out of game, and ask him for help.

>>54195486
>Don't you fucking dare.
Race you!

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>>54195531
>Race you!

>>54195486
Mostly we have to crack down on how much you suck your own dick in public and think its clever.

>>54195506
>>54195531
Mostly My DM is a great person, but he's constantly on a kick to try and make the game his own from the ground up. right now he uses 2e rules as a base line to build characters and lets players go from there, he's changed the way wizards work, the way clerics work, and the way rogues work to make them have their own unique thing that other classes just cant do, but fighters still don't have a thing, and the other person helping him build this damn thing besides myself doesn't think that warriors deserve any special thing to do besides swing their weapon, since they have the most hit points the highest saves, and they can blat the other classes without anything else....which Is mostly just the other person's bias, but I'm trying to come up with something for the fighters to have besides just swinging away all the time. and Im looking for any sort of help I can find.

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>>54195572
And how exactly do you intend to do that? Rudeness? Or posting OC until I there's no room for my stuff in the threads due to an avalanche of much higher quality content?

Please don't do that. It's my one weakness.

Also, I still find minmaxing Apoc World confusing. Brilliant, well thought out, and apparently masterfully executed, but confusing.

>>54195572
Not to defend Skerples, but I reckon you would have hated Diogenes.

>>54195606
And if you ask him to, he'll brew something for fighters.

>>54195259
>Why?
Lots of reasons. For one, I enjoy that sort of thing. For two, I think the game supports it surprisingly well and somewhat uniquely if you read the principles a certain way (favoring fiction-first and disfavoring player-as-author).

Knowing and applying the rules in AW doesn't really give you any kind of advantage when it comes to "winning," but being able to persuade the other players that you deserve to win by giving effective descriptions is highly incentivized. This makes the skills being tested in AW more like Diplomacy or The Resistance (political/social deduction games) instead of traditional board games where knowing and applying the rules is what matters most.

Considering RPGs aren't really about winners and losers but that I still think it's fun to solve problems in an RPG context, I think it makes a unique sort of sense that you are solving problems via a social dynamic instead of through systems mastery.

(OSR games usually also solve problems via the same social dynamic that relies on convincing the GM your idea is clever instead of rolling dice at a problem, but they have a lot fewer guidelines for how to make that fun and fair than AW does.)

Thirdly, and this is incidental, I needed a system that could provide challenge, discovery, and simulation gameplay but that was as rules light as possible for running West Marches (because prep is a pain but you have to do it given the campaign archetype). Basically my choices came down to "try this unusual way of playing AW-like games or use labyrinth lord" and I decided to try something new. It was pretty fun but a lot of the advice on how the game is supposed to work is phrased as rules so it was hard to cut wheat from chaff initially when it came to, like, players design the world for you kind of stuff.

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>>54195606
This sounds like more of a problem to workshop with your DM in a sit-down setting. Without the full context, changed rules, GM style, campaign type, existinc PCs, etc. it's tricky to make suggestions. Now you could post all the changes he made... but that would take ages and wouldn't get you much help anyway.

I made fighters "unique" in 2 ways:
1. They get Camp Followers and have early access to the whole hireling economy
2. They are Best at Fighting. Wizards get burst damage, sure, but Fighters are very, very, very good at hitting stuff until it dies.

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>>54195638
Thanks for the background. That's sensible and very thorough.

>>54195606
To explain a bit further. Wizards(Arcane Spellcasters) operate on a mana point system which I think he grabbed from spells and magic, and can create their own custom spells from a chart that the DM has created (which I don't have access to atm or I'd post for further explanation)

Conduits (Divine or Other Source Spellcasters) cast spells with Favor Points and gain bonus spells from their provider and may spend favor points to cast spells beyond their current level.

Rogues gain % dice scores which besides gaining rogue scores, they can place a % score onto any non weapon proficiency they have to gain a % chance of success before rolling on the skill itself.

And warriors have....Nothing but their Arm, armor, health, and how many times they can swing their weapon currently.

>>54195613
skerpls is about as much a cynic as your third asshole

>>54195613
You're also weak to criticism. If you're going to high horse about oc, get some new gifs.

>>54195259
Sorry I missed this but it's relevant to my point -
>It's also highly non-simulationist.

It sort of is and it sort of isn't. It has lots of non-diagetic highly abstracted bullshit in it that is clearly constructed to serve narrative convenience, but the game is extremely insistent on putting the fiction first and only ever "saying what honesty demands" (e.g. only doing things that make sense).

For example, in spite of Dungeon World being a kludgey hack of a game I think I can run the most realistic combat this side of Riddle of Steel or GURPS using it precisely because I'm a member of a HEMA club and I can use all that crap I know about real sword fighting to influence how the game proceeds. Knowing melee combat minutiae lets me assign highly realistic consequences to various combat ideas, and that's encouraged and supported by the rules to a very large extent.

The game is at its least simulationist, I think, when you don't have anyone at the table who really knows about the thing going on in the current scene. Then things move along at the behest of narrative convenience. But when you have an expert on that thing it actually becomes quite satisfying from a simulation perspective (bar one or two annoyances).

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>>54195689
>If you're going to high horse about oc, get some new gifs.
Now that's remarkably petty.

>skerpls is about as much a cynic as your third asshole
Eeeh... I'd go check out the non-OSR "Stories, Hard Science Fiction, and Moloch" post. Might be worth a read.

'Course, it's mostly autofellatio, so your mileage may vary.

>>54195709
I can see that. What I meant is that the game has "starving to death" occur as a matter of narrative, not as a matter of running out of food, if that makes sense. It's not a criticism.

>, but the game is extremely insistent on putting the fiction first and only ever "saying what honesty demands" (e.g. only doing things that make sense).
And if you do that, almost any system works for your game of choice. It's a good guideline in general.

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Should spell books look like Illuminated Manuscripts?

>>54195662
Here's my explanation anon>>54195671

>>54195909
Hell no. Pages are written in ear wax and scorch marks, and maybe have a few post-it notes.

>>54195379
>I think one of the pitfalls of giving so much potential authorship to players can be a lack of distinction between characters and players
I agree for sure. I've come to embrace the idea that you shouldn't put somebody in charge of their own opposition because the conflict of interest is usually too hard to resist. Like, sometimes it's great, but often I find it kind of sucks because they won't punch themselves hard enough to be interesting.

>>54195457
> I think we're talking about a similar enough thing, we just think about it really differently.
Yeah, your procedure and mine sound basically the same, it's just that in my case I find a lot of enjoyment in pursuing making the details significantly in my favor (or having players that try to do the same).

I'm not curmudgeonly about the kinds of consequences I use when players roll 6-s either - if three or four things are similarly likely to happen I'll always go for the one that makes for the most entertainment even if it seems very marginally less likely. Probably we agree about that I would guess.

> What I meant is that the game has "starving to death" occur as a matter of narrative, not as a matter of running out of food, if that makes sense.
Would you explain it a bit more? I think I see what you're getting at but I don't want to put words in your mouth.

> And if you do that, almost any system works for your game of choice.
I can't really phrase my response here very well, but one thing to think about is that the game usually isn't "wrong" in the sense of being unknowingly unrealistic (unlike some games that pretend to simulate, like D&D 3.5) so you don't need to rip out a bunch of rules, while simultaneously it embeds simulation in its core gameplay loop to offer more guidance than just "go make up a story that makes sense I'll wait here." I dunno if that makes sense, but anyway I think the game cares more about realism than it appears.

>>54196058
>>54195752
O shit I forgot to quote this guy. Last two quotes are you.

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>>54196058
>Would you explain it a bit more? I think I see what you're getting at but I don't want to put words in your mouth.

No problem.

Apoc. World says "You need food. If you don't get food, you die, because that's how the real world works. Sometimes, the world is fucked, and you run out of food, and here are rules for the world being fucked up."

Some OSR games go "You have 10 rations and you eat 2 rations per day. If you have no rations, you lose 2 HP per day until you die." or something like that.

Apoc World assumes you and your players know about starving to death and how that works. If a player brings in an article from a journal that states that they can live for an extra few days by eating the bark of the sycamore tree, then that gets added to the game's fiction. Rather than building a system to simulate reality, Apoc World relies on reality to provide details to the story. It's a handy method, desu. Works for all games though once you get the hang of it.

Whereas simulationist games try to emulate reality using mechanics. You could be a chemosynthetic alien from the planet Gorblax and still understand the core idea of "humans need food or they die" from the simplified starvation rules for OSR games I listed. Does that make it good? Eh. It makes it quick. I don't need to give two shits about the reality of the situation - someone else did the legwork for me.

>I think the game cares more about realism than it appears.
It does have very good tools to drive non-narrative storyelling, that's for sure. Stories that break from narrative tropes are really, really tricky, but Apoc World, despite character generation being tropey as hell in the core game, is,at its core, a great game for realism. Tricky as hell to run though.

For most hyper-realistic games these days, I'd just use Fate, and roll dice about once a session.

>>54195425
FUCK YOU YOU SUBHUMAN IF I HAD PLAYERS WHO LIKED A DUNGEON HALF AS MUCH AS THEY DID REEEEEEE

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>>54196335
Don't take the bait, anon.

>>54196335
That's also going in the next OP.

So what is an OSR with plenty of classess (like 6+) and with high level play?

also do you guys use an skill system?
are there any rules for using mana/spell points instead of normal casting?

yeah i am a faggot but i am trying to do something good i promise!

>>54195909
No, but clerical scrolls are

>>54197231
Astonishing Swordsman & Sorcerers of Hyperboria
Fantastic Heroes and Witchery

Both have an abundance of very good classes.

>>54195425

>not taking your interesting world and putting it below ground

Faggoto!

>>54195425
Then remove the castle. Goddamn demons STEAL THE CASTLE AND TAKE IT TO HELL.
YOU WANNA EXPLORE THE CASTLE?
GO DIG IT OUT OF THE 567th LAYER, WHERE IT'S SUNKEN IN A SEA OF DEMONS.

NOT A SEA WITH DEMONS IN IT, NOT EVEN A SEA FULL OF DEMONS, THE SEA IS COMPOSED ENTIRELY OF DEMONS

>>54195752

You're mostly annoying because you're this far away from becoming a narcissistic namefag

If you just posted your ideas without having to constantly draw attention to the fact it was you who made it and making whole threads slowly get drawn into the event horizon of your ego you'd be bearable

>>54198907
Fucking savage dude, but yeah you got him dead to rights

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https://rpgcharacters.files.wordpress.com/2017/07/d100creepyrooms.pdf

How're y'all enjoying these

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Wow. So I can come to /osrg/ to get my D&D fix AND my storygame fix now. Is there even a point in looking at other threads anymore?

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>>54200319
>Is there even a point in looking at other threads anymore?
No. /tg/ has gone to shit since all the actually creative stuff was banned and all the creative people left as a result.

This is the final refuge.

Man the walls.

>>54200382

>quest threads
>creative

About as creative as every other person's special way elves are so totally different than Tolkien

>>54200411
It doesn't matter whether you think it's good content - the fact remains that there was a fair amount of it, and some of it was all right. Every time we banned something, just because some people thought it was an eyesore or not really /tg/, we lost a part of the board.

People shat on smut threads but at the same time, we also had people creating OC both to piss off the anti-smutfags and to gain an audience.

People shat on quest threads but at the same time, we also had some decent writefags making decent threads, as well as drawfags coming up with OC to set them apart from quests that were mostly text only.

Hell, even troll threads that got rerailed into decent discussion only happened because people wanted to piss off the troll who wanted flame wars and shit.

With all those things gone, bait's the only thing left that people want to discuss. It has nothing to do with fighting for a cause, it has more to do with the fact that there's nothing out there to talk about anymore because faggots drove away the competition.

We basically already won and now we have no idea what to do with ourselves anymore.

>>54200411
>every other person's special way elves are so totally different than Tolkien
So let's hear your totally creative weird Goblin-Punch replacement elves, then.

>>54193942
The best way to play should be the most fun way to play. If there's a more effective way but it's boring, that means the rules are bad. (See also: 3.pf)

>>54200483

My elves are Questfags. They were banished to their realm of faggotry long ago, but a bunch of humans dedicated to their memory pine for their return.

>>54200557
Then I suppose you are a dwarf, throwing a small tantrum whenever someone so much as suggests some topic of question even remotely resembling elves?

>"It's a shame we got rid of all the strange mystical creatu-"
>"FUCK OFF YOU ELFFAG REEEEEEE"

Is the 2e stuff in the trove all of it? Is there anything missing that any knowledgeable Anon would recommend?

>>54200704
Barring some later stuff, like Night Wolf Inn, it's all of it.

>>54200708
Okay thanks and why does the settings tab have FR under still being audited? who's auditing it?

>>54197231
>So what is an OSR with plenty of classess (like 6+) and with high level play?

The answer is always ACKS

>>54200319
There are occasional nice threads.
And there's always >>>/tg/hwg/

>>54201999
I was just in there earlier shilling for Delta's Book of War, there's not enough wargaming in osr threads normally.

Portal Under the Stars or Sailors on the Starless Sea for my players and my first DCC-Adventure?

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>>54200557
I bet you're upset about all the extinct species of lion.

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>>54202248
Neither. Go for a generic lynch mob adventure instead. Pick a witch or a vampire, grab torches and pitchforks, see who makes it alive.

Ain't no better way to start DCC.

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Finally made my blog. Feel free to shill it for me, because I'm not going to past today.

https://themansegaming.blogspot.com/

>>54200483
Get this: they're UGLY, they're BAD at magic, and they DON'T LIVE LONG.
They're goblins, I'm saying they're goblins

>enter thread
>thread is derailed by storygame fags, questfags and angry counterskerpling
>the castle bait from last thread reposted
>can practically see the 2e-is-osr faggots waiting in the wings, slavering
whyevenlive.png, seems like it's time for a break from the thread again.

>>54202521
Good riddance. Nothing of value will be lost.

>>54202521

>ignoring the thread's OC and not making your own just to shitpost, get attention, and (You)s while simultaneously acting like you're so smart and above it all for 'taking a break' from a very normal thread.

Congratulations.

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>>54202377
Wait, you were they fag who kept asking for feedback without ever making changes?

>>54202521
>thread is derailed by storygame fags,
I tuned that. It looked like they were discussing something.
Was that actuallyjust a circlejerk?

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Let's improve things around here:
>Book of Shadows - C.M. Parker
>In the lands of Nova Vaasa, Kartakass, and Hazlan it is thought that the rope from around the neck of a hanged criminal has certain powers when worn braided around the neck of a thief. The rope must be fresh (no more than a day old) and must be over two feet long when braided. It must be braided from a single piece of rope otherwise it will be ineffective.
>If worn by a thief it is said that the spirit of the hanged man will protect him from discovery, and enhance his skills of stealth. It is sometimes ironic when a thief is caught with such a talisman, and is hung with the very same bit of rope that was supposed to protect him.

Game Rule Information - me
>1. character must be informed of this superstition by a native of that region; native PCs are presumed to know of it
>2. next, determine if the character REALLY believes it; Save vs Wand or Wisdom check - success means the belief has taken hold in his unconscious. Even native PCs have to do this. The result, once rolled, is permanent
>3. The believer wearing the noose gains the abilities of a 5th level thief if he isn't one or has thieving abilities boosted to five levels higher than his current level
>4. the boost only works as long as the believer is doing thing with an illegal and somewhat selfish goal in mind. No Robin Hood and Mission Impossible stuff
>5. since the rope must be less than a day old, the rope loses its powers in 24 hours or less
>6. because the rope's powers fade, its value fluctuates wildly. Almost no one will buy such a rope unless they're absolutely certain how many hours of magic are left in it

>>54202621
>a very normal thread.
Nah m8 it's shit

>>54202377
A bit meme-y but it's interesting.

>>54202940
>I tuned that.
*I tuned that out.

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>>54202960
I'm diggin' it, but I'm not buried.

>Save (or check) when you learn about it. Ref rolls this in secret.
>If you believe it, x2 hide in shadows chance against believers, +1 against non-believers.
>First non-believer to spot you is set upon by THE HANGED MAN's ghost (fights as Shadow).
>Others cannot see THE HANGED MAN's ghost, but can hit it. Noose disenchants if it dies.

>>54202940
>Wait, you were they fag who kept asking for feedback without ever making changes?

I'm not really sure what you are referring to. If you're talking about my homebrew rules I did ask for feedback and did change things when they were appropriate yes.

>>54195671
Still looking for feedback on how to solve this problem

>>54203563
Give fighters bonuses to attempts to do things like kick doors down, intimidate enemies, and so on. Not skills, but just "x times/day you may add y to your strength, dexterity, or constitution when trying to roll under that attribute."

Insanely flexible without being broken or supernatural.

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>>54203563
Um...

>>54195531
>Or talk to your referee out of game, and ask him for help.
>>54195662
>This sounds like more of a problem to workshop with your DM in a sit-down

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>>54195671
>>54203563

>Weapon Specialization
Every level give the fighter 2 points to put into weapon specialization. Each point grants a weapon either +1 to hit, +1 to damage, +1 AC when wielded or +1 to initiative. Every weapon caps out at 4 points spent or your level cap points spent, whichever is closer.

This means at first level your fighter will have two weapons with +1 in a category, at second level they can either improve both their weapons, add a new weapon with +1 and improve one, add a new weapon and add +2, etc. The purpose for the level cap is to make fighters unable to just specialize in one weapon at first level and never use anything else.

>Special Attacks
Your fighter gets a special anime fighting move, usable once per adventure. Make an attack roll + fighter level. On a miss, you deal 1d4 damage anyway. On a hit, you deal weapon damage + fighter level. Have your fighter name the move something over the top, like One Thousand Year Secret or Whirling Blade of Flowers.

>Combat Moves
Whenever you roll a 19 or 20 on an attack roll, you get a free combat move. This is like throwing sand in someone's eyes, tripping them, knocking their helmet off and so on. Can be done on your target OR someone adjacent.

>Iron Will
In combat if you concentrate and let an attack hit you (as opposed to hoping it deflects off your armor), you can reduce it's damage equal to your level.

This essentially is the ideal of a big warrior spreading his arms and letting the giant clobber him with his club, only to pick himself up and dust himself off. Works best for settings where fighters are supernaturally tough, and hit points really are meat points.

>Fearsome Charge
Whenever you charge into combat and let out a fearsome battlecry (no surprise round or ambush) add your encumbrance penalty from armor (+1 to +3) to your attack rolls until you miss an attack or are hit. Enemies with spears negate this bonus.

At least one of these should help you.

>>54203633
OK that could work. I was also thinking of talking to my DM and asking him to use the fighters incredible strength scores for other stats as well. So a Fighter with a high Dex could get the same sort of bonuses that a high strength fighter would and so on and so forth.

>>54203763
Im gonna compile all of these into a notepad and toss them to my DM so hopefully He has a lot of things to pick and choose from. So keep em coming.

>>54202308
That sounds 100% awesome. I'm just too lazy to work out a whole lair and shit when I have enough work to learn the rules inside and out. I'm not playing anything without a very good grasp of the rules. My Prussian heritage demands it.

>>54195425
Play 5e because you obviously never read the DCC book. No way should the PCs have that much gold and no way should there be that many max level characters.

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>>54195425
>shitty +1 sword
Yeah, re-read the DCC core book, primarily the Judge's chapter and the Magic Item chapter. No magical item should be considered shitty in DCC.

Then have the PC's hirelings dig up the attached staff and wipe it all clean.

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>>54204766
>>54204808
Sshh.

>>54204766
For gods sake it's copypasta, as already mentioned several times.

Would you prefer for races to have their own unique mechanics or have a generic template race (tough race, magical race, sneaky race, etc) that can be used to represent a lot of different racial archetypes? Just something I've been considering for a setting.

>>54205712
To be honest, I'd much rather have weird unique races with their own mechanics.

>>54205769
Yeah, that's fair. I was just considering it after seeing White Star's Alien Brute and Alien Mystic races.

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>>54198907
>>54199384
Haters gonna hate.

>>54202377
Yay!

>>54202521
> angry counterskerpling
I've been... verbified? Oh lord.

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>>54199528
Handy, but tricky to use effectively with how I build stuff right now. Worth mining.

>>54200382
>No. /tg/ has gone to shit since all the actually creative stuff was banned and all the creative people left as a result.

Only one way to fix it, anon.

>>54205712
I've gone with
-Race lets you reroll 1 stat at character creation and keep the higher #
-Gives you a minor bonus (leap twice as high, turn head 180 degrees)
-Gives minor penalty (can't eat cooked food, afraid of being alone)

Seems to work out Ok with minimal mechanical fiddliness. Character's races are also randomized, so minmaxing is hard.

>>54205712
Complete Book of Humanoids is the way to go if you're doing race-and-class.

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Are there any OSR systems where warriors are stronger than wizards?

>>54208167
They're always stronger than wizards. Wizards have no need for a high strength score.

>>54208167
Almost all of them. Magic-Users were mediocre pre-3e.

>>54208167
AD&D 2e

>>54208318
I honestly cannot think of an OSR system with stronger MUs than 2e.

>>54208470
Yeah, but fighters were at their most powerful in 2e as well - and I'd argue they got far more benefits from the system than MUs did, compared to the other OSR systems.

Yes, 2e is OSR.

>>54208504
Fighters are a lot stronger in OD&D if you use CHAINMAIL.

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>reading through Maze of the Blue Medusa
>it's good, really good
>realize that the number of groups who have actually played it is only in the double digits
>the number of groups who have played it to a satisfying conclusion is only a single digit

What's the point in publishing for such a niche hobby, /osr/? Your work will be a cool talking point and shelf-filler for a few months, then it'll be forgotten forever.

My players are on a boat sailing to turtle shaped pirate island and i want a water djinni to ask them a favor, what is a good reason for the djinni to ask them a favor and what could the favor be?

>>54208982

Writing? I love the type of emergent gameplay, the combination of rules and fluff. The only hobby where worldbuilding and creation of fantasy worlds and races and stuff is taken 'seriously'.

Publishing? I have no fucking idea why anyone does it. I just keep it to a hobby, actually selling this stuff for money and trying to buy actual, physical books must be a total nightmare.

>>54209006

Find him the purest drop of water in the entire world. Tell him a riddle that nobody has ever heard before, and then don't tell him the answer so he can ponder over it for his many years stuck on the island. Find him a wife, which is the most perfect pretty little koi fish that you'll have to take over to the island. Kill the pirate who pissed in his magic pool.

>>54209066
>actually selling this stuff for money and trying to buy actual, physical books must be a total nightmare.

POD probably makes that easier and I'm a sucker for books. Vinyls and Blu-Rays I'll never understand, but give me those dead trees.

>>54208982
The print run was ~1500 copies, right?
And that sold out.

Plus all the PDFs that sold.

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>>54208982
I like helping people. And I get satisfaction out of it. Hell, what's the point of doing anything if that's your standard?

>>54210067
>Monks Do Biology.jpg
This is exactly why you leave it to friars.

>>54210067
How did bestiaries end up like that anyway?

I can understand rhinos being exaggerated through superstition and hearsay, but magpies?

Give me the interesting truths, /his/ anons.

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>>54210215
What The Master Would Not Discuss is a beastiary.
Those are not from beastiaries.

Those are just doodles in margins.
By very bored people.
With very boring jobs.

>>54210318
>What The Master Would Not Discuss
No, wait. Not that one.

Classic of Mountains and Seas?

There is a book I'm thinking of. It has a name.

>>54208167
Mage the Ascension.

>>54209006
Tiamat was cut into three bodies of water. One the vast waters that surround tiny islands of land. Two, the vast waters that dwell beneath the earth. And three the vast waters that dwell above the sky. The water djinni demands a jar of water from each body.

>>54210663
Marduk will set you up with a crown of eyes if you sensibly agree to not fetch that shit.

Anybody have "The Chaos Gods Come to Meatlandia"?

>>54210783
It's not in any of the file share archives, but they might hit?

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Why did none of you faggots ever tell me about ASE2-3?

What are some good rules for researching spells or how long should they take to learn after killing another Wizard and stealing his spellbook?

>>54212794
That's a thing you start doing at 5th level, right? Just write some odd level 3+ spells for it.
And you should be able to learn captured spells immediately. "Use before surfacing" immediately.

>>54212794
I'm fond of the LotFP rules straight out of the book.

Among other things, it allows magic users to prepare a scroll of (but not memorize) any spell they capture. So with a pile of gold and a high level spellbook, even a low level wizard gets a chance to do some of the really cool spells (at least once).

Researching/copying spells is a matter of money and time, determined using fairly simple tables. You need money for materials and a library and lab.

The lab/library is cool because it means magic users need to invest money and effort creating (or negotiating for the use of) a vulnerable resource. That's the kind of thing that makes murder hobos put down roots.

>>54212794
The rule I like for captured spellbooks is that it cuts your research time and costs down by half, but you still have to research it.

>>54196261
> Rather than building a system to simulate reality, Apoc World relies on reality to provide details to the story

Ah, ok, that's what you meant by simulation - you were concerned about the process of reaching realism more than the result of reaching realism. I'll grant you that, then. AW games do have a couple rules that help simulate reality for you, and they put a huge emphasis on the fact that fluff is mechanics (which means that anyone interested in realism has a big mechanical incentive to throw that knowledge into the game), but for the most part the work of understanding how reality functions is more encouraged by the rules than provided by it, you are right.

Fun anecdote tax: once I asked Sage LaTorra what the deal was with all the narrative stuff in Dungeon World like adventuring gear and how solo monsters get more HP than group monsters. His response was that all of those things actually simulate reality and are not narrative stuff.

I thought he was full of shit but it's interesting to think that's an author's perspective regarding simulation in AW-derived games. Maybe it explains something about the hacky mess that is dungeon world.

>>54212794
You can prepare them straight from his book and use them like that.

>>54212196
>Why did none of you faggots ever tell me about ASE2-3?
We sure talked about it

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Are there any good rules for possession by outsiders besides Van Richten's Guide to Fiends? It's nice but I don't like how drastically appearance and powers change even in the first stage.

>>54210783
Praise this based anon: >>54213389

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We dead

>>54221650
t. sunnavabitch

I had the next OP ready.
I was bumping the few threads below us.
I was going to win the race.

Fuck blogger.

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>>54202377
>he took it down

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>>54222153

I'd rather just post my content here. You guys like my MSPaint art, right?

>>54222188
Of course!

>>54222188
Not speaking for anyone here but myself, but I don't see a problem with posting content here while also archiving on a blog. The blog probably shouldn't be advertised here, in that case.

>>54222551
I don't see the point of a blog if you aren't taking advantage of the blogosphere.
>>54222188
Backing it up on a site is a good idea, but I would recommend going more barebones.

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How do you introduce locations and events to the PCs in a way that feels natural and reflects their decisions?

There are plenty of rules and articles on how to stock a hex map, but I haven't seen all that much in the way of practical advice or rules on RUNNING a sandbox game.

>>54222599
>Backing it up on a site is a good idea, but I would recommend going more barebones.
What's more barebones than blogger?

>>54202377
>>54222188
wtf i hate cracklecharm now

>blog drama e-celeb shitposting

I'm gonna just wait for the next thread.

>>54222705
>I'm gonna just wait for the next thread.
You will have to wait a loooong time

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>>54222705
>discussion is shitposting

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Random tables, or wherever they go when they follow hooks.

>>54222654
If I cURL a blogger page, I'll have thousands of lines of markup and scripts.
A title, some links, and a few image, needs maybe 50 lines. Plus the text.

>>54222756
Do you know of any good guides for setting up a website and doing basic html?

>>54222756
>Random tables

Any good ones? Stars Without Number is solid but it's all very setting-specific.

>wherever they go when they follow hooks

Then the problem becomes how to introduce those hooks, without some bullshit like "the adventurer's guild jobs board says there's a dungeon to the east and a murder mystery to the north".

The simplest answer seems to have stuff happen, but that's tricky when you're staring at points of interest on a map. Some kind of random events table or a relationships system would be appreciated.

>>54222791
>dropped the link to fix a typo AND missed a resposne
Well fuck me sideways on a gibbet.

>>54222792
There are only two places to learn web development.
W3Schools, which assumes you want to do a bad job.
Mozilla Developer Network, which assumes you already know web development.

I'll give you a rundown of the very basics in a minute.

>>54222792
HTML Dog is a good one.

Honestly you're better off with something like WordPress or Blogger. They're customizable enough and let you focus on the content. There's very little reason to reinvent the wheel or make more work for yourself.

As for >>54222791, there are plenty of tools to strip the text from a web page (or convert them to Markdown, PDFs, whatever you want).

>he put it back up
Whatever floats your boat. :^)

Is there a simple website where I can upload .pdfs, preferably for free, that other people can see/download?

>>54223344
Mega.

While you're at it, make a private mirror of the Trove in case it ever gets taken down.

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>>54222047
>Fuck blogger.
Correct. It's an awful site. And sorry, I was actually planning on shilling your stuff in the "new up-and-coming OSR bloggers" thread on G+ once you had a bit more content. :(
>>54222605
I use feudalism to help with larger "do this, go here" choices and greed to sort out the rest. My players are pretty good at following up on leads, and I'm pretty good at improvising. The main thing is to understand the motivations of your characters and their players, and build interests that draw on those.

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So, given that these are 6 mile hexes, does this seem like a "big enough" map for a set of games that aren't based around wilderness exploration?

(Now I have to name most of these fucking baronies. Fuck.)

>>54224282
>296 viable hexes
That's big enough for games that /are/ based around wilderness exploration.

>Now I have to name most of these fucking baronies.
Typos. Backwards words. Transposed letters.
Bonus for starting with foreign words.

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>>54224404
>296 viable hexes
Sounds about right. Never understood numbering them individually though, unless you're doing a super-strictly keyed map.

>Bonus for starting with foreign words.
Actually coming up with the names is not an issue at all. Built a query to pull french author names off wikipedia. I have 300+ names stacked for use. I just have to copy them over, rescale the map, and then get the terrain generation section written.

>>54224282
Dogfuck is a good county name

>>54224447
The point of numbering the hexes is being able to put everything away, wait a week, but everything back, and know where everyone is... without having to redraw the hex map whenever it gets too smudgy.
And you have to key your map in play whenever people find locations of tables. There's no harm in making that easy on yourself.

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>>54224517
This is true, but in this digital age, it seems weird. And yes and no. I'm kind of leaning towards a "list of locations" system with a general table for "wilderness" hexes, rather than specific keyed hex events. Haven't solidified the ideas yet, so I might end up just numbering everything.

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>>54224570
If people say "we go to that broken tower we found in the woods" it's fine to skip navigating the map.

Knowing how far away it is would still be useful.
They might get jumped by bandits or need to crash a wedding later in the day.
Or run out of food. I expect your players to do that at some point. They don't sound like smart people.

Is anybody else having trouble with the mega link in the pastebin or have i missed something from threads ago?

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>>54224677
>They don't sound like smart people.
They are smart, but not at rpgs. Not yet. They're getting better. Nobody died last session and they all leveled up.

>>54224698
It's just you.

>>54224698
It's working for me

>>54224734
>>54224766
logged out of my mega account and it started working
weird

How is Birthright supposed to work during low levels?

What are some OSR classes you wish somebody would make?

>>54225825
Shapeshifter

>>54225825
Goat Thief

>>54219139
Thank you so much, Anon!

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>>54225825
green slave girl

>Gary Gygax saw the the gotchas as a test of player skill and relished enforcing the punishments. His son Ernie recalled casting Fireball and how his father “would always let you know whatever cool thing you had destroyed. Normally it was difficult to figure out what anything was, but once it was destroyed, my dad would share. ‘Oh, it’s a real shame.’”

>Few others saw the fun. Ernie Gygax found the lost treasure so bothersome that his wizard Tenser developed the spell Cone of Cold specifically to avoid the drawbacks of Fireball.

What did Gary mean by this?

>>54226028
He meant fuck you.

>>54225825
Animate Bonsai

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>>54225825

>>54225825
A version of the Druid and the Cleric that aren't spellcasters.

>>54226135
A version of the Magic-User and the Illusionist that aren't spellcasters.

>>54225825
Narrator

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>>54226225
>I see something long-absent in the sunken faces of /osr/ - a glimmer of hope.

>>54225900

Is this a goat that steals things, or a thief who just steals goats?

>>54226414
The latter. It's tickled my fancy ever since Lorwyn.

But if you're writing these up, I won't stop you from making both.

>>54225825
>What are some OSR classes you wish somebody would make?
not one specific class, but I'd love to see someone make a class book dedicated to classes for Monstrous Humanoid races that 1) has them actually be equal to the standard Human & Demi-Human classes and 2.) actually cover as many races as possible, preferably giving each race at least 2-3 classes in the ACKS manner of Racial Classes

most supplements I've seen of this sort of thing only cover a couple races, and the classes often end up being very unappealing to actually use

>>54226724
That's an awful lot of work. And then there's the matter of which ones to include: >1e only?
>2e only?
>Everything in Complete Book of Humanoids?
>Only stuff in GH/FR? Dark Sun stuff or no?
>Psionics or no?
>If psionics then which psionics?

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>>54224282
Ah! Your player's check your blog, so it's probably too late.
DO NOT show them your hex map.

They map it as they go, same as dungeons.

If they're willing to deal with cartographers, sketch them a non-hex copy from memory.

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Does anyone actually do that meme I read in one of the primers about how the dungeon master might just tell the players roll on a d20 and if they get X number they succeed?

Do people make up rolls like that or do you avoid it?

>>54226978
I tend to avoid it, but it's a decent fallback ruling if you honest to god don't have a strong sense of whether something should work.

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>>54226969
Well of course not. Even if they saw the map, they wouldn't remember it, or be able to use it.

They're getting an outline of the coast, a lot of dragons drawn in the margins, and a big arrow pointing to "FOREIGN PARTS" if they ask.

>>54226999

I asked because I thought it might be interesting to tie this mechanic into Rogues somehow.

like maybe Rogues get X number of bonus die they can throw during these made-up skill checks?

I need mechanics to make Rogues more interesting is what I'm trying to say.

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>>54226969
Plus this map isn't going to give them useful exploration information. That's the whole point. The setting is /mapped/. Anything on the map is known. This isn't a classic D&D Wilderness. It's a feudal society. That means every bit of land is owned by somebody, in theory.

It's the stuff that's not on the map that'll make them rich.

>>54226978
Yes. I re-wrote the rules for my game, so if there's a situation the rules don't cover (or I don't feel like looking it up), I'll just ask for a roll against a stat, or a straight Save, or something else entirely.

For example, last session I gave the chance of a Str 6 Dex 6 character being able to do a backflip a 3%. That's below a natural 20 - you need to do a little better. Motherfucker rolled a 02.

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>>54227048
Ooh! Why didn't you just say that?
This might help: https://coinsandscrolls.blogspot.ca/2017/07/osr-class-thieves.html

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>>54227006
>a lot of dragons
Large cat dragons, snake dragons, predatory bird dragons, or forest fire dragons? This is important.

>>54227096
A good dragon can manage all of them.

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>>54227096
Mostly really confusing dragons. The cartographers have read descriptions, and the descriptions were taken from a guy whose grandfather saw one once.

The actual dragons are proper fuck-off terrifying, but the map dragons are kind of derpy.

>>54226954
well I meant more in the line of BX/BECMI/RC style Racial Classes

as for which ones to include well I'd have to think it over

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>>54227133
>but the map dragons are kind of derpy.
Draw some for us.

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>>54227167
You need to ask:>>54202377
>>54222047
>>54222188

My arts are not so good.

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>>54227192
Chucklefuck can get to that on hbis own time.

You'll have to draw them for your players.
Why not for us?

>>54227067

Stop shilling.

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>>54227226
>Why not for us?
Because I'm trying to name 300+ fake French towns, baronies, and castles right now.

>>54227227
Dude asked for help on a topic I wrote a post about. What do you want me to do, copy-paste stuff over here? Not help him?

>>54227274
>Because I'm trying to name 300+ fake French towns, baronies, and castles right now.
Let us fill the rest of that out for you. this is one of the few sorts of activities 4chan can actually be expected to complete.

>>54227296 >>54227274
Ah, but maybe tell use what font that is.

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>>54227296
>Let us fill the rest of that out for you. this is one of the few sorts of activities 4chan can actually be expected to complete.
Nah, it's all good. I've got a system. I'm about halfway done and I've only been seriously working on it for 2hrs.

>>54227317
You misunderstand. That wasn't a request.

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>>54227332
Are you... aggressively trying to help?

Anyway, nah, it's all good. Go draw some derpy map dragons. Or go make up classes for >>54225825
Or go help out>>54227048

>>54224282
Explain the letters and shapes.

>>54227048
I play a pretty minimalist game, but the gimmick I use for Thieves is being able to safely immediately exit rooms in any direction from any point in the room every now and then.

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>>54227397
Letters are just a quick key so I can go "Baronies A, L, and J belong to the Count of Pellamy."

Triangles are towns large enough to have a wall.
Octagons are large towns, small cities, or big castles.
Font is arial narrow.

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>>54227133
>>54227192
>>54227226

Way ahead of you, my dudes.

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>>54227520

anyone have stats for a really low-ranking demon in becmi? i tried "lesser demon" but google keeps giving me runescape results.

>>54227669
"Fights as goblin"

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>>54227096
>snake dragons
COBRA DRAGONS

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>>54227669
"fights as a goblin, talks as Gilbert Gottfried"

>>54227669
Use the AD&D<->BECMI/RC converter in the back of RC to convert over a Dretch or something?

>>54227745
*Talks as Joe Rogan

https://youtu.be/qR_ZMAM9t2I

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>>54227841
Nah man, all my demons have the Gilbert Gottfried voice.

>I accept the deal.
YOU FOOL
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T3djXcx2ewQ

>>54227669
1d4 for all statistics.

Rolled 2, 3, 3, 4, 3, 3, 2, 3 = 23 (8d4)

>>54227963

>>54204766

I guess if the DM ran the game nonstop for years yes, but the idea is that if you hit level 10 you're literally a demi-god, fucking hercules tier so the whole "le max level pcs sitting in deep freeze" concept is just a sign that the poster is an unimaginative prick

>>54228120
No, wait. I didn't need that many rolls.

>>54227669
You are set upon by 4 Leaster Triangular Pyramidal Demons! (AC 2, 1 HD (3 hp), #AT 3, 1d4 Dmg, Save F3, Ml 2)

>>54204766

Just a minor thing:

DCC's adventures drown the players in gold. I mean, if the players keep finding it, it's not really a problem, the Corebook mostly just mentions that maybe you think before you kick open a check in the goblin hideout and find 1000 gp(250 for each player!) If the only village in 50 miles has one export and it's vegetables, sometimes, then why is there 1000 gp? Did that 1000 gp get lost? Was that the town's entire coffer? Was it being saved by some Silas Marner-esque miser who lived on the edge of town? Why?)

So on and forth. It's less "do not give your players gold" and more "gold should be more interesting than a generic currency that every enemy in the game spews at the PCs constantly."

>>54228206

You would be surprised how many people think that DCC's judges section is full of iron-clad rules and not a collection of "hey, how about this"

>>54228206

You are replying to a fucking copypasta shitpost.

>Make Wizards into scholars who get a few in-combat spells they can cast that grow as they level up
>No instant or resource-based out of combat magic

Interesting take on Wizards?

>>54228261

He's also replying with good content, anon. Try to see that.

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>>54227274
Anyway, all the naming is done. If you want to see the logic, I've written the system up here:https://coinsandscrolls.blogspot.ca/2017/07/osr-fast-mapping-part-2-county-barony.html

Most worldbuilding advice goes "start with a coastline, then determine the prevailing wind, then determine the density of soil, then determine the patterns of migratory birds [...] then, based on what areas are fertile and what areas are infertile, assign settlements and factions."

I'm doing it in reverse. Coastline first, sure, but then immediately politics. We'll use the politics to determine the terrain, and not the other way around. Much faster that way. Start with the interesting stuff.

>>54228268
Combat is the least interesting part of play. Limiting out of combat play certainly won't to fix that.

It's historical revisionism to say you should discourage combat altogether, but your suggestion goes a bit too far in the other direction.

>>54228268
I like it, just add rituals that cost a lot of resources and take a long time to cast

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>it's a "skerpeles shitposts" episode
Excuse me while I stifle a yawn.

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>>54227520
So cute! Are those for a map you're working on?

>>54228940

Yes.

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>>54229154
Excellent.

>setting up a classic megadungeon campaign
>one player says he doesn't know how to make his backstory work because he's not greedy
>trying to explain to him not to worry about it too much
>still confused
What do

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>>54229267
He steals from the dungeon and gives to the poor.

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>>54229267
-Religious order is going broke, needs donations.

-He's not greedy, but he is in debt. The loan sharks are actual sharks. Ghost sharks. Very dangerous.

-Archeologist, interested in ancient coins for their historic value

-Not greedy, just really eager to please.

-Alternatively, "If you can't find any motivation for your character to participate in the megandungeon, they don't participate. Easy. Roll up a new character."

>>54229267
He dropped his lucky guinea down there by mistake.
He remembers the scratches on it exactly, and vowed to retrieve it.

>>54225825

>>54228003 >>54228004
>>54228008 >>54228044
>>54228227 >>54228653
>>54228805 >>54228864

>>54227963
That'd be a good way to do Modrons?

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>>54229324
>Easy. Roll up a new character
You're not wrong, but

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>>54229267

Every year humans offer sacrifice to an evil God. If they don't, he curses them and sends sickness to them.

This God is also the father of all monsters, and he dotes his children with the stolen wealth and goods of humanity.

Every one of those subhuman beasts down there in the dark is enjoying gold they stole from your taxes, your land, your people. Your king built a wooden palace and burned it down last year in sacrifice to the Red God. Are you gonna let those filthy beasts have keep the plunder without a fight?

>>54226028

https://youtu.be/7UjXi1HKjms?t=7

>>54229267
He's in a party of treasure seekers who DO want to go down the dungeon.

>>54229267
His character is actually looking for bread, but can only find gold. But he keeps the gold so that he can buy more bread in the future.

>>54229267
Dude is secretly filling the dungeon with treasure, he's usually the last one out of a room and he joined the party for escort.

>>54229891
If people get sacrificed, do they end up as monsters or as prisoners in the dungeons?

>>54229267
After some very bad deals with the fairies, his character subsists by eating gold.

>>54229267
What are they still confused about? If you're doing classic megadungeon stuff, characters don't really need that much of a back story. They're going into the huge murderhole, that's the game. Are they having difficulty playing a character that isn't like them?

>>54229267
FInd some other way to give him xp.

>>54229267
One mega dungeon, or several mega dungeons nearby?

>>54197667
A castle would be a pretty weird thing to take out of a dungeon.

File: voynich4_dd_161014.jpg (617KB, 2400x1800px) Image search: [Google]

617KB, 2400x1800px

>>54195909
Like the Voynich Manuscript, but all the pages are sticky.

File: voynich-manuscript.jpg (48KB, 610x373px) Image search: [Google]

48KB, 610x373px

>>54195909
>>54234417

File: voynich3.jpg (186KB, 1050x700px) Image search: [Google]

186KB, 1050x700px

>>54234417
>>54195909

File: Voynich_Manuscript1.jpg (169KB, 1536x767px) Image search: [Google]

169KB, 1536x767px

>>54195909
>>54234431