/CofD/ & /wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness

http://www.strawpoll.me/13211093

>>53846104
>What non-WoD splats/settings would work well with a crossover game for a WoD chronicle?
For oWoD:

Mage works well with Demon, Changeling, Werewolf and Mummy.
Werewolf works with Changeling and Mage.
Vampire doesn't really work well with anything, both rules-wise (Virtues) and conceptually.
Hunter works well with every supernatural, but can't do rules overlap.

The key part is to understand that you are running a (Splat) game with (Other Splat) elements. You have to pick a focus and approach the game from that perspective.

>>53846220
>Mage works well with Demon, Changeling, Werewolf and Mummy.
>Mage works well with Changeling
>Changeling

nope

>>53846104
Still working on my sorta Shadowrun 1e / Cyberpunk 2020 D:tD game.
Still praying it's not going to be shit.

>>53846104
Unknown armies, Cyberpunk 2020, Delta Green

>>53846215
Mages are supposed to be stronger than other playable supernaturals.

Not sure why this is so hard to understand.

>>53846220
Also I misread the question, thought it was what WoD splats work as crossover. Woops!

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>>53846104
SLA Industries, horrors inside and out

>>53846104
Paranoia seems like a good enough fit, i suppose.

Wish me luck, I'm going to run the V5 playtest tomorrow but using a familiar city instead of the crazy of their scenario. The baseline will be an attack happens under cover of daytime that takes out the Sheriff and the Toreador Primogen (bloodbound lovers), and when the call of court happens, the seneschal doesn't come. As the city huddles, the pro temp sheriff asks his childe (one of the pregens) and her coterie to go check out the seneschal's penthouse. His contacts had gotten word of a fire there, and anything to keep the barely-lucid Malkavian Prince from snapping at this point. From there they'd run afoul of Anarchs, and an Homeland/Project Twilight grouping in the vein of the GSG9 fights against' terrorists' in the main scenario, played up for my players' playstyle.

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Ok. Just wanna bounce an idea off you guys I run games for a club and we have a horror theme night coming up. Beast the Primordial set in the world of Creepypasta.
Slenderman
Jeff the Killer
Ben Drowned
Eyeless Jack
Smile Dog and
The Seed Eater
Are all PCs.

The plot will involve them all being at a Convention Panel discussing Candlecove their favorite TV show but they announce due to corperate Executives the show will have to be cancelled.

The party is randomly selected as part of a raffle to meet the creators and their mission is given to get the show back on the air.

>>53846440
Also NWoD conersion rules

http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/main-forum/the-new-world-of-darkness/147170-sla-industries-character-species-races-wha-cha-ma-jigs

>>53846220
Vampire works fantastically with demon

>>53846623
>The Seed Eater

Jesus when did Creepypasta stories go to shit.

Was it Blood Painter or Sonic dot exe that started this trend?

>>53846688
Creepypasta was always shit to a degree, but once the tumblr / Deviantart crowd got into it with the "OMG This murderer is so kawaii I'm gonna draw yaoi fanart of him" nonsense.
It went from a little fringe group of nerds that liked doing their horror shortstories to a bunch of cringelords shitting everything up.

>>53846688
I mean, what else would you put in its place?

>>53846386
Yeah, pretty much. I prefer Vampire, but that's because I prefer street-level games. I don't want to zip around the solar system and fight a multiversal conspiracy with rayguns powered by belief, but if people are into that sort of thing, they should have a game for it. The whole idea of crossover is stupid and flawed.

>>53846832
The Rake

>>53846753
This is the only acceptable gayness involving creepypastas

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p1wdsh65w2o&t=218s

>>53846878
That might work.

The sad truth is that this club is more there for one-shots and more one shots. I do need to try and go to places that not only are relevent are flexible enough to allow for player agency.

I wouldn't run a campaign there, but for a night of messing around, I think it could be fun.

>>53847002
fag

On the topic of creepypasta that could work for WoD. The earlier "Holder of x" series seems to have the right level of esoteric bullshit for Abyssal intrusions.
"You must blink exactly 27 times during the elevator ride while wearing shoes stolen from a Mexican Buddhist at 11:59pm on a Thursday and carrying $5.24 is your left pocket. Failure to do this will have the door open to unreality and you will vomit out your own kidneys out of fear and die. If you do everything right you get a cool cursed item."

>>53846104
>What non-WoD splats/settings would work well with a crossover game for a WoD chronicle?

I have a campaign arc coming up for my awakening game inspired heavily by the movie 'event horizon'.

The shadow outside the protective gaze of helios and luna is a terrifying place.

>>53846104
Does it have to be table top? SCP could work well

>What non-WoD splats/settings would work well with a crossover game for a WoD chronicle?
Dead by Daylight basically IS based in arcadia. A very creepy variation of the wild hunt. The Entity is a True Fae.

>>53848148
A lot of games and movies go well with Changeling.

Especially movies.

>>53848191
Coraline and Labyrinth are essentially Changeling films.

>>53848093

That's why I said setting, because chances are there's things out there without a game that could be used for crossovers.

>>53846834

>Crossovers are shit

Full crossovers where every mythology is fully incoorporated are shit. I hate it when vampires conspire with Pentex to fuck over the Technocracy.

In myWoD the main splat is vampire.

-Antedeluvians are the strongest beings. They don't really have a role in my chronic but they are a building bloc for the setting. (Malkav for example has reached the path of heaven version of Golconda and has reached sanity again. Unfortunately the insane and destructive part of his character has left his body. This evil being IS the malkavian network and responsible that dominate isn't a Clan discipline anymore.... The Evil being is slowly gaining more intelligence looking for an avatar it can use to become a person. Malkav on the other hand is in torpor and has lost the blood connection to his children. Both are on the power Level of a mighty metusaleh. The Evil being is hellbent on diablerizing malkav to regain antedeluvian powers though.)

-True mages don't exist. Hedge mages take their role in the setting. Magic in general is "occult rituals from ancient tomes" and not "Hit-Marks vs. Fireball throwers".

-Werewolves exist but they have a completely different role. The umbra and their whole mythology just isn't there. Wolves See tormented by their version of the beast. Their beast drives them away from humanity (the reason they avoid cities) and is spread to a werewolves children.

-Mummies exist as a product of mighty and tainted Egyptian necromancy. They are fucking strong but they lack the support structure their old empires provided. So if a Mummy awakens it has to quickly gather some Hedge magicians to teach them Egyptian necromancy because it needs someone who conducts the rituals that provide a Mummy with Energy.

-Changelings don't exist just like Kyasid.

>>53850880

-Wraiths exist but their background isn't this relevant. The underworld is a fucked up place and Wraiths try to escape.

-Some end up as Poltergeister.

-The weaker One becomes mindless zombies.

-The strong ones can get a Body with their mind intact but unlike risen they don't heal and they have to quickly find a Way to Keep them going (Hedge magicians, giovanni etc.)


Hunters exist with their Numina. The whole Messenger shtick doesn't. Numina are just the immune reaction to the supernatural. Hunters become much more common because due to higher populations and rising concentrations of Vamps.

-Demons don't exist. Infact the whole Judeo-Christian shit doesn't.

>>53847305

>Technos venture out to far.
>Confronted with shit they can't logicially explain within their Dogma.
>The few that survive are hunted like dogs by their former comrades.

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Version 1.17
Carnival Melancholy is done.
Got stuff over the next few days, but I'll add more requests to the list.

Also, has anyone actually used my stuff in their games?
It depresses me to say that I've only used one of my own so far.
I'd really like to hear if anything works or doesn't work.

You want nWoD crossovers, you crossover Changeling and Promethean. People who were never human but want to be and people who aren't human but once were, combined.

Also hot Promethean-on-Fetch action.

>>53851513
Hunter and Geist is a fun crossover too.

>>53851768
I played a Fetch in a hunter game once

>>53851405

Re-requesting Fallen Pillar

>>53850880
>>53850900

The whole point of Pentex is to provide a crossover antagonist

And if we're doing "myWoD"

myWoD Main Splat is mage

-Traditions, Technocracy, Marauders, and Nephandi each have part of the puzzle regarding the truth about reality.

Traditions understand that belief, will, and imagination define reality. On at least a subconscious level. Actually, all mages understand this on a subconscious level, but the Trads are the ones who can act on it. Such blatant force of will is why "backlash" has always been a risk for the Tradition mage

Technocrats based their Willworking off of Cosmological constants and extrapolated from there. That's why Technomagic always has some advantage when it comes to getting shit under the radar. This results in their inflexibility when it comes to improvisation.

Marauders "understand" the true nature of Avatars and Ascension better than anyone else. In fact, they suffer from too much perspective.

Nephandi have an edge when it comes to cosmology. They understand that the universe has no inherent meaning, but rather than create one for themselves they damn everything. They'd rather curse the darkness than strike a match.

In the case of Vampires, the Caine Story is basically true, but the specifics are not what people think.

Werewolves are so close, yet so far. Their way of thinking causes them to anthropormorphize everything, even when there's nothing there. For instance, while there are a whole lot of Jhor-tainted spirits out there, the Wyrm is not a discrete entity.

Wraiths exist, but the sixth great maelstrom has drastically culled the numbers of both Wraith and Specter. Surviving wraiths seem to be stronger than before, but their "societies" are mostly shambles beyond repair.

Changelings are as-written in C20, but the Prodigal theory is bullshit.

Hunters are Cats-paws of a variety of different forces, as the messengers actually aren't all the same thing.

>>53852287

Mummies exist, but they are the results of mages pursuing immortality by internalizing a life-death-rebirth cycle, or doing so for someone else. This of course costs them their True Magick, but they are still hedge sorcerers of unparalleled might, with their own unique arts.

I don't really know ODemon, but I'm thinking demons will borrow a page from Descent, with the motives and actions of "god" being extraordinarily questionable. "Demons" come from many different mythologies and legends, and replace Umbral "demons."

Also, you really don't want to know how the Massasa wars went in my setting if you're a fan of the Tremere.

>>53852287
>>53852587


Nice. You did the same thing. Mage is your lense and that gives you Room to include nearly all the splats.

I will answer you more in depth after i had Dinner.

>>53852961

Who'd I miss? The Kuei-Jin? They're also Vampires, it's just their blood is so warped they seem to be a different species. The tale of the Ebon Dragon and Scarlet Empress contains unique insights into the Caine/Lillith story that is actually more true in some ways.

Is there any published material on what happens if a member of the one of the Giovanni Families Awakens?

>>53853201

>Kuei Jin

Ahhh they don't exist in my world.

There are some Vamps in Asia but they only came in colonial times and were quickly opposed by Hunters when they left the bastions of colonial powers. Nowadays you have vamps in places like Hong Kong etc.

>In the case of Vampires, the Caine Story is basically true, but the specifics are not what people think.

In myWoD the christian stuff is wrong and even the Antes don't really know how it all started. Their memory is somewhat hazy especially in the very early stretches of their unlife and "Caine" wasn't present himself in the second city.

Gehenna is a cyclic event that can happen locally. The Antes are seeding vamps regularly (after eating most of the ones existing, some methusalehs are they agents and some Antes opose that like Malkav) by embracing some new 4th Generation.

The next Gehenna could be different though because the Antes probably will collapse human civilization (or die trying) because modern nations fuck the environment too much, so that they are on a pathway to destroying humanity and thus the vamps foodsource.

Antes are mostly concerned with feeding themselves and forcing vamp and human society in the destination they desire (with varying degrees of success).

>Hunters are Cats-paws of a variety of different forces, as the messengers actually aren't all the same thing.

I really like that idea. I am thinking about using it but without demons, umbra and true mages there is nearly no one who could embue them with the powers needed.

>>53851405
I've fiddled with/adjusted some of your conversions for my game for two of my PC's that didn't want to develop their own legacies.

>>53853737

In Vamp-centric games I depict True Mages as "Hidden Batshit Secret Masters." It's quite possible they are something other than human from a Vampire's POV.

Of course, you don't need True Mages to have Illuminati-esque groups who can ritually imbue an appropriate individual with the soul of a quasi-gnostic "angel"

Demons really haven't come up beyond the odd infernalist.

>>53853888

>In Vamp-centric games I depict True Mages as "Hidden Batshit Secret Masters." It's quite possible they are something other than human from a Vampire's POV.

Thats just hedge magic in my world. If a hedge magic "branch" is developed long enopugh it can become absurdly powerful.

>Demons really haven't come up beyond the odd infernalist.

I am thinking about including demons as something from beyond but i am torn.

Has anyone tried the Alpha rules for nu-oWoD yet?

>>53851788
Did you or any of the other players post a link to your game's story? I seem to recall a story posted involving a fetch that was a hunter.

Hos is vampiric frenzy any different from human chimpout?

>>53854332
Vamp frenzy is less chimpout and more autistic rage, only the vamp usually isn't a 300 pound /r9k/ reject so it's a bit more frightening.

>>53854085

We had a quick trip report two threads ago, apparently it works well and can evoke VtM: Bloodlines feelings.

>>53854026

so any reason some hedge wizard group couldn't do what I described?

>>53846283
It does if you're running traditionalists. They have very similar goals and both can easily fall into the "People caught up in something larger than themselves while just trying to live their lives", mould.

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>>53854085
>Has anyone tried the Alpha rules for nu-oWoD yet?

Yeah, did a playsession last night.

Basically, the whole "feeding" thing is... well, getting way too much focus.

They could have instead just wrote "Hey, maybe don't let feeding turn into just a boring roll, and instead spend a little bit of time exploring the theme of feeding, since this is a vampire game, m'kay?" to a sidebar or something, and it would have been better.

The big focus on feeding was fun the first time when shit happened. It was okay the second. By the third it was already getting boring, or worse, aggravating.

Introducing a mechanic that makes me *not* want to play the game is not a good tactic, no matter how much it might fit the "theme" of the game in question.

As for the new dice rules, they are okay, but nothing spectacular either way.

In short, they tried doing something new, and it wasn't anything amazing.

>>53854382
What if... assburgers are poeple who somehow are born with beasts?

>>53854938
People were bitching that the rules were very LARP centric?

>>53855020
That's just slang for over simplified trash.

>>53855049
IDK, I'm not familiar with LARP but the focus on feeding could make sense if it means some neckbeard can get a simulacrum of human contact w/ a gothopotomus.

>>53854085
Finished the playtest now, I played Nicholas Dietz.

We never went inside the club where we were supposed to because shit went down and we decided to gtfo Berlin. When we were leaving the scene, we ran into a police patrol that tried to stop us, because we looked suspicious and one of the characters was arabic. We started running, but they chased.

I ran to an alley and one of the beat cops followed and tried to attack me with his baton. I boosted my physical to 4, roused blood for potence 1 and broke his arm. Saw there were going to be more cops coming in, so I wanted to get out of there and feed on him. I asked the Storyteller if there's anywhere to run, he said the alley leads to another street and the buildings that form the alley are three stories high.

For my combat action I said I'll grab a hold of the cop and jump up to the roof of the building with potence 2. I had my physical stats already boosted and potence 1 active, so my total pool was 8. Rolled 4 succs, re-rolled the failed dice for 3 more succs with willpower and jumped 14 meters up to the roof. Then I drained the cop dry in safety while the other cops were still looking for me down in the alley. I had to do a hunger check when I started feeding, and I rolled two 1s and two 8s which caused a compulsion which made me want to do something I had done when I was alive. After feeding I smoked a cigarette on the roof even if it didn't do anything and I had to spend blood to use my lungs. Nice smoke after a meal, just listening to fire trucks and chilling while my coterie was getting shot to shit by a sniper from a helicopter.

Later on we remembered my character only eats from vegans, but we retconned the cop to be one because it was a cool scene.

>>53854946
aspergers and autists have no soul in WoD, so could they have a Beast?

>>53854332
>hey look at me I'm being edgy on 4chan

>>53855340
uh, I'm pretty sure that isn't true.

Can we get some citation? Because if so then we'd have Aspergers spirits running around

>>53850880
>>53850900
>>53852287
Primary Splat: Mage

Mages Exist and have returned to something resembling the status quo. Old Horizon realms are gone but the Avatar storm has lifted.

Vampires are there and basically as written in the book.

Werewolves have a piece of the puzzle that mages don't have. The three fundamental forces are the triat and there are enormously powerful entities behind them. Werewolves just know this because they are natively part of the system.

Wraiths? Yeah, they're there.

Changelings? Yeah, they're there but I use them as an antagonist faction mages occasionally trip over changelings, fights get started and Weird shit happens because glamour.

>>53855371
Conceptual spirits exist, couldn't there be a Autism spirit? Not legit medical autism, but the internet autismos.

>>53855317

My character wasn't a very good fighter (physical 2 brawl 2), but he felt really powerful when spending blood. Disciplines were really awesome and combat was fast. I wouldn't want to play a character with a feeding restriction tho, feels like you need to go hunt for blood after every action scene.

One of the PCs ghouled a first responder and we managed to save the NPC vampire in torpor we were supposed to save after all, but then another PC turned invisible and diablerized the NPC we were all trying to save.

The rest of the game was us trying to kill the PC until we all died to a special forces attack.

I liked it, but we didn't really follow the plot.

>>53854568
No reason at all. Its just not the same mythology thats linked to True Magic.

>>53854938
Jesus that sounds like artsy pretentious bullshit.

>Muh Le beast, being a Monster and the struggle for humanity has to be the focus at every

>>53855403
Yeah I suppose a spirit of internet Autism exists, but if people with Autism didn't have souls there would be "Spirits of People With Autism" just like there are "Spirits of Cats"

>>53851405
>Also, has anyone actually used my stuff in their games?

Thanks to you i am able to run my Mage the awakening game focused on legacies.

So far i am using the Tamers of Fire, Uncrowned kings, perfected adepts, melancholy carnival, timori, house of ariadne, forge master, orphans of proteus and Clavicularius. I am only missing the Bokor and Brotherhood of the Demon Wind.

So thank you for making my game possible.

>>53855317

The playtest City is Berlin? Nice. As a German that Sounds interesting.

The rules Sound shitty though.

>>53855401

Why are changelings the enemies of mages ?


So werewolves have a deeper understanding because they are part of the natural System/triat?

>>53855589
Berlin was one of the first city they featured as a published setting.

I think right after Milwaukee

>>53855489

Are these the legacies your players are interested in?

>>53855589
Yes. Tiergarten area.

I liked the rules alright. The combat felt a lot better than in classic WoD. In classic you have the whole process of roll initiative, declare actions, then take actions in reverse order, roll to attack, then enemy rolls defense, then roll damage, then roll soak. In V5 both the attacker and the defender just roll once and it still results in the same sort of thing because soak and damage is static. You never have to spend your action dodging either.

Dex isn't a godstat anymore, nobody gets instakilled before they get to act and number of blood points&generation doesn't determine who wins.

>>53854167
I did a half story time of it once, big ass greentext but I've since lost track of it

>>53855774
Hmh the feeding shit Sounds tedious though.

Should i give it a shot ?

>>53855420
>Disciplines were really awesome and combat was fast.

How did they change celerity?

>>53855774
Oh and do you have the link to the test version?

>>53855849
Vampires feel a lot more competent baseline and blood makes them really, really awesome. One of the characters never had to feed during the entire game even when they used a significant amount of blood because they rolled well on their hunger checks and never went up in hunger. I personally rolled bad and was pretty hungry most of the time. The compulsion stuff doesn't really come up that often and you can easily do away with it when it does, I think only in prolonged action heavy adventures will you start losing your shit.

I give it a solid 4/5 ruleswise.

>>53855886
First level of celerity doubles your initiative and gives your celerity dots as autodice to dexterity and athletics rolls.

Second level of celerity removes multiple opponent penalties and lets you dodge bullets without cover. (Which was super powerful in my experience. The celerity guy had three cops fire at him with assault rifles and he just flash stepped out of the way.)

Third level celerity gives you an extra action for a number of turns equal to your celerity.

>>53855907
https://blog.white-wolf.com/2017/06/15/v5-pre-alpha-the-curtain-rises/

Should put that to the next OP

>>53855939
Okay, what about more open ended disciplines like vicissitude and chimerstry?

Also, how are generations handled?

>>53856091
No rules for vicissitude or chimestry in the playtest.

Generation alpha test gives people blood potency:
Gen 13-10 = 0
Gen 9-7 = 1
Gen 6-5 = 2
Gen 4 = 3

When you roll for hunger, you reduce the pool by your blood potency. Higher gen gets hungrier slower. When you suffer a compulsion, its effects are increased by blood potency. Higher gen means you get more fucked up. When feeding, you get blood potency less hunger reduction. Takes more blood to sate higher gen vamps.

>>53855768
>Are these the legacies your players are interested in?

Yes and no. The main theme of my game is "Souls, what you do with them?" so the way i got the setting is that most "adult" mages in the region have a legacy and put lot of stock on the philosophy of the them. Like a paradigm on Ascension.

So far the players are new mages with various mentors and while they are in the process of joining orders they havent pick up a Legacy but they are insterested in a few.

The acanthus is joining the House of Ariadne, another has as a mentor a bokor who has a funerary. Third one is learning "alchemy" from the Uncrowned kings and the last players is either joining the claviclarious, the Tamers of fire or the Orphans of proteus.

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>>53856688
Top tier legacies there.

>>53856169

I have just read the scenario.

Its strikes me as very edgy.

>Muh camarillia are the Edgy, degenerate Spoiled Golden Cage

>The anarchs are the downtrodden revolutionaries

>Hah all the Cam traditions are bullshit and its 2k17

>the Cam Domains Start falling and even mithras is killed by the second Inquisition

>Vampires are constantly hunted by the second Inquisition and a Western Democracy basically has turned into a surveillance state really quick (Police Controlling all the highways)

>>53854332

Human chimpouts don't have disciplines

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>>53856959
>>53857070
Oh no, le scary /pol/ man is attacking. How will /tg/ ever recover.
There ya go. Don't spend it all in one place.

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You memes are stale, tumblranon. Nobody here is gonna buy the "I'm totally from /b/ or /pol/, look at my shitposting". You won't get good material for r/trolling 4chan or whatever you're planning on posting it to.
I'm not even mad, just disappointing. This is time you could be making something of, you know that anon?

Is this the 3rd worst general after the jumpchain one and /pfg/?
When it's not magecucks masturbating to blowing up the universe by popping bubblegum it's yiffers self-inserting into werewolf x mage fantasies, when it's not yiffers self-inserting into werewolf x mage fantasies it's some OPPcuck shitting over oWoD, when it's not some OPPcuck shitting over oWoD then it's /pol/ and/or tumblr.

>>53857603
I just want to play Changeling the Lost but literally nobody else ever does

>>53857641

That's how I feel about Promethean and Demon.

>>53857662
I'm not big on Demon because the whole God-Machine stuff just turns me off when they do nothing but describe how INSURMOUNTABLE and INCALCULABLY VAST and BLAHBLAHBLAH IT'S BIG AND YOU CAN'T FIGHT IT

Promethean though I do agree is underrated

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Being vampire is presented as a horror, but it must be pretty sweet actually.

>don’t age
>only needs blood, that shit is fucking everywhere, unless you are subcainite Ventrue
>don’t give shit about exposure to elements unless it’s really extreme
>don’t have to breathe
>don’t have to bathe
>can masturbate anytime you want
>can rest during the day in the of layer filth at the bottom of a pond, nobody will find you
>can run naked in the forrest at night, howling at the moon like wild beast drinking dry anything unlucky enough to cross your path

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>>53857603
>tfw no yiffer will help me make my sordid vampire x werewolf fantasies come true

>>53857603

The 5th Edition masquerade fucks me up.

The rules seem to be nice but the setting really seems like SJW trash...

>>53857641
>I just want to play any WoD game but literally nobody else ever does.
Fixed that for you anon.
Fuck, man. I just wanna play some urban fantasy without a party of tumblr or edgelords. Why's finding a group so damn hard.
>tfw no game

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>>53857707
>can't go outside during the day
>constantly hungry literally all the time
>after a while can barely relate to non-vampires
>have to occasionally fake your death and skip town to avoid people getting suspicious of the reclusive pale dude who only comes out at night and doesn't age
>endless politicking from other douchebag vampires
>every other supernatural creature has some reason to fuck you up and will do so unless you gang up with the aforementioned ouchepires

I dunno man I'd call it a wash.

>>53857867
I’d be happy with a party od tumblr edgelords half my age at this point.

>>53857867
I've got friends who want to play Mage and refuse to consider anything but Mage.

>>53857974
I wouldn't turn down a Mage game at this point, anon.

>>53857940
>sun sucks
>come on, it’s not that bad
>who cares about kine?
>that’s why you sleep in the layer of filth at the bottom of a pond during the day and run around naked innawoods at night
>you just stay away form these assholes
>they are even rarer than cainites, what are the odds?

>>53857603
>Is this the 3rd worst general after the jumpchain one and /pfg/?

Is still better than the faggotry that is the OPP forums, at least here i can call you a corporate shiv and you cant do shit about it.

>>53858995
>OPP Forum
>SJWs Unleashed


There are 5 interesting topics there.

So, in Hunter the Vigil, what exactly do blessed items do? It references a World of Darkness rulebook, but we've been playing Chronacles of Darkness as our ruleset. I was thinking about getting the benediction that blesses objects, but I wasn't sure how niche a blessing like that really was.

>>53859088
>There are 5 interesting topics there.

such as?

>>53859088
Because every relevant question that could be said about WoD was answered already?

We even know bullshit that will never be relevant to any table such as: "Can Tremere conjure nukes?"

>>53859150

A Good Topic about celerity where people suggested some good alternatives.

101 Plot hooks for chicago.

>>53859150
>>53859211
What do you think about masquerade V5?

>>53857940
>>53858826
>"Come on, drink the old man, what're the odds he's Hermetic?"

Famous Cainite last words.

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>>53859264
V5 might be nice, but the lack of granularity is a bit worrying.

I know we live in an age of simplification, but the original system of nine atributes ensured each character was meaningfully different not just in descrition, but also on paper.

>>53859291
>Famous Cainite last words.

Wizard cannot conjure fireball if you snap his neck.

Hey /cofd/, so I'm about to go loud in my next Demon game.
Access to every single embed and exploit is pretty overwhelming. What's the best combination of abilities to fuck up the most shit before I get out of dodge?

>>53859449
>Wizard cannot conjure fireball if you snap his neck.

Hard to snaps necks when you're on fire.

>Finally find some people who are down to nWoD
>They want a beast game
I'm not sure how I feel about playing Mary: The Sue but I'm getting desperate

>>53860009
Just play the game as it was intended to be played: As the Black Crusade of World of Darkness

>>53860009
have them play heroes instead, just make it a hunter game with stronger humies

>>53859449

>V5 might be nice


>Muh you have to feed constantly
>Camarillia suddenly turns into a society of hedonists that is more concerned with fucking over and tormenting anarchs than it is with survival
>Anarchs go fully ISIS on the Camarillia despite the fact that this is going to screw them hardcore because of Police and the second Inquisition

Hell nah senpai. All of that seems stupid

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Timu1cp9zh0

This girl is the true epitome of the Toreador Antitribu. I'm so proud of her.

>>53857603
No, it's second worst.
At least /pfg/ has some shit to discuss now that their new sci fi game is coming out.

So I'm making a Ascension Mage and a big part of their Paradigm is the Cabalistic Tree of Life. They view each Sephirot as the Spheres and I think I've made a good list as to what one aligns to what. I'd like a little feedback though if you don't mind


Keter - Prime - Crown
Binah - Mind - Understanding
Hokhmah - Time - Wisdom
Da'at - Correspondance - Knowledge/All as one
Gevurah - Forces - Judgement/Awe/Elemental Fire
Hesed - Matter - Love/Repairing the World
Tif'eret - Life - Compassion/Beauty/Miracles
Hod - Entropy - Majesty
Netzah - Spirit - Mercy
Yessod - 10th - vehicle from one thing to another
Malkuth - Being a Mage/Being part of The Divine's creation

Thoughts?

So what the fuck happened to Changeling: The Lost 2E? Wasn't it supposed to be out by the end of last year?

>>53860182

I imagine a game run by cuckula has him behaving like this during hunt rolls.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NUJY9AanPJ4

I usually play Sabbat anyway, so it's not like it's hard to get juice.

>>53860516
shit happened, writers got fired and projects had to be restarted

>>53860516
OPP are slow as hell, and how that they kicked the main Dev and have to redo a bunch of stuff, I wouldn't see it being released before next year.

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>Start getting into Vampire
>check out the manuals
>Actually enjoy them and find them interesting
>come to the general
>literally shit

Do you guys actually talk about the games or just discuss powerlevels like retarded school graders?

>>53860573
very rarely they talk about the games

I try to but I am only one Anon and others must try to as well

>>53860573
>wheredoyouthinkweare.jpg

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>>53860369
REQUIEM AETERNAM

BULLETS RIGHT THROUGH THE STERNUM

LULLABY TO HELL, BABE

REAPER'S GOT YOUR NAME!

>Try to find more info about upcoming books
>Go to the OPP website to check out the dev blogs
>Every comment is 'could be gayer' 'yasss queen' or some other variation
I just want to play a game about spooky monsters
Why do I have to suffer

Awakening 2e question.

Do you make someone roll for wisdom degeneration if a sleeper witnesses their magic after they've cast it?

For example my players were in the woods exploring some local ruins which have some connection to the current Mystery mcguffin. They got attacked by wooden golems and constructed an entropic flame cloak around themselves to fight off the guardians.

Afterwards a curious park ranger stumbles upon them and sees six people literally wreathed in shadow and flame fiddling with burnt wooden figures. He freaks out and they high tail it out of there.

>>53860996
I'd say that is a sin at high Wisdom, yeah. Especially if any party members are Guardians of the Veil. Make them roll if they have Wisdom 7 or more. Give them a -1 if the ranger failed his breaking point

>>53860400
Even with Starfinder it's still 90% "With x meme character and x meme character have gay sex in the meme game!? Will celeb player go for a men if he's cute?" "Can we get x NPC banged by a Gnoll?" And "How do I make Naruto as a Catgirl with all 3pp material allowed?" broken up by discord drama and autism.
I'll take the shit we have here over that.

>>53860996
I would say no. Wisdom checks are for when you know what you are doing is wrong, and do it anyway.

>>53860009
I'm in a Beast game. If you know what you're doing it can be fun.

>>53860070
Why would you want to play Hunter but bad?

>>53857641
>I just want to play Changeling the Lost but literally nobody else ever does

Not everyone is interested in roleplaying the effects of severe PTSD on damaged kidnapped victims who are continuously huntered by their abductors (and douche Acanthus mages)

>WTF is "beautiful madness" anyway?

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I'm working on a Sorcery Revised, Revised at the moment modifying some of the rules for Sorcerer to bring its power level roughly up to that of Vampire or Changling, or maybe slightly higher and I want input. My idea is that this would be used for crossovers where Mage is too powerful and yet the desire for human spellcasters and occultists is still present. In effect, these would replace Mages in the chronicle in question.

My basic idea is that the new sorcerer template works as follows. A Sorcerer has a Sorcery Rating, starting at 1 [but with freebies can be bought as high as 3 at character generation]. This rating gives him a pool of Mana, equal to the blood pool of a vampire of a Generation Background equal to the sorcerer's sorcery rating. For instance a Sorcerer with Sorcery 3 would have 12 Mana, the same as a Generation 11 Vampire's Vitae pool.

Sorcery is divided into Paths, each of which is linear but divides successes along several lines such as Potency, Duration, etc, allowing for a degree of flexibility equal to metamagic in some other systems. All spells are cast through Sorcery+Path Rating, similiar to Mage: Dark Ages.

A Sorcerer can make an Extended Casting, taking several turns to perform a spell. All effects take one roll per turn, meaning generating a massive fireball would take 2-4 turns depending on its scale [unlike in Sorcery Revised where the same could take 9-12 turns]. A Sorcerer can also spend a WP to 'hang' any Effect he is capable of casting, without penalty to concentration or mental rolls. The difficulty of all spells would be 6, cost 1 Mana per roll, and a Sorcerer would start with 8 points of Paths.

An example of the system in action, looking at the 'Path of Destruction'. The Path of Destruction would cover obvious offensive magical attacks, such as fire, lightning, or magic missiles of any such kind, all of which would be available to the user of the Path of Destruction. It would be divided as follows.
[Cont]

>>53861569

Path of Destruction:
Potency: Every success deals 2 Levels of Damage
Targets: 1 by Default, 1 success per additional target
Range 0: 30 Feet
Range 1: 100 Feet
Range 2: 500 Feet
Range 3: Half Mile
Range 4: 10 Miles
Range 5: Sympathetic

Damage Type:
-At Rank 1 this Path deals Bashing
-At Rank 2+ this Path can deal Bashing or Lethal
-At Rank 4+ this Path can deal Bashing, Lethal, or Aggravated

Or in brief, the way it would work is as follows. A Sorcerer desires to consume a nearby enemy in flame. He possesses a Sorcery of 3 [like most beginning Sorcerers] and a Path of Destruction ranked 4. He rolls 7d10, scoring 5 successes. Since his three targets are all within 30 feet of him, he spends 0 successes on Range, 2 on extra targets, and the other 3 on damage, causing 3 Levels of Aggravated Damage.

Suppose he wanted, instead, to perform a much larger effect. He would have to spend several turns rolling, gathering the successes needed for the wider effect. He would be limited to spending a number of successes equal to his Path Rating on any given Effect Factor. For instance at Path Level 4, he could spend 4 successes on Potency, 4 on Range, and 4 on additional targets. Thus, he would have to roll until he gained 12 successes, spending 1 Mana for every roll until he gathered them.

He does so, ultimately dealing 8 Levels of Aggravated Damage to a group of 5 men he happens to both hate and know are within 10 miles of his current location, consuming them with lightning from heaven. He rolls 3 times and expends 3 Mana in the process.
[Cont]

>>53861575

Since this is not meant to take place in the Mage cosmology, Paradox and disbelief would not effect their Arts in the slightest. They could perform any feat of which they are capable in full view of mortals, and the worst that would happen is the logical result of breaking whatever Masquerade it is decided the Sorcerers have. A Botch would still result in the effect going haywire.

As you can tell, these notes are a little scrambled and I'm still working out the details of this little side-project of 'updating' Sorcerer Revised, but if I could get any commentary or ideas on what I have now I'd apprecriate it.

>>53861575
6* levels of damage in the first example

>>53861488
Not everyone wants to play super-autism weirdos who navel-gaze themselves into godhood, or magic tranny frankensteins who the literal universe hates, or mardi gras spookums with a ghost buddy-cop in their brain either.

>>53861488

>WTF is "beautiful madness" anyway?

A marketing slogan that's only made to sound good.

>>53859453
Every single embed and exploit of your type not all of them. Like a destroyer gets all cacophany ones only.

>>53862088
It sounds really bad though.

are Mage players just as annoying like the ones on these generals?

geez

>>53854085
Yes. It plays like a rpg.net darling indie rpg one shot game, not Vampire. I am hoping that it's because it's just in the alpha stage, but I have a really bad feeling that that is exactly what Hite is going for, which sucks, because such games work great for well, one shots, but tend to quickly get shelved and forgotten because they always feel lacking compared to the mechanically more robust classic style rpgs.

>>53862521
Well even if it's shit it's not like people will stop playing Revised / nWoD.

>>53860182
>Camarillia suddenly turns into a society of hedonists that is more concerned with fucking over and tormenting anarchs than it is with surviva
>Anarchs go fully ISIS on the Camarillia despite the fact that this is going to screw them hardcore because of Police and the second Inquisition

To be fair, is how most people runs it.

>>53862233
>are Mage players just as annoying like the ones on these generals?

mostly yes.

So i am checking on M20 (yes, i am a faggot) and i see that to create any instance of your purview with a sphere you need prime.

Would it mess much with the balance to remove that requirement?

>>53855454
Yep, it very, very much plays like that. The mechanic I admit read to me off the page quite cool, but after the fourth action scene of our playtest, it was starting to become clear that this would wear very thin, very quickly. It reminded me of one of those games that you buy once on hype, play once, then never play again.

>>53862898
Just create whatever you need out of rearranged existing materials, that removes the prime requirement for "from nothing".

>>53857057
Yeah, very hurr durr Antifa r da gud guyz shithead level politicized trash that makes me worry about what's coming when the fluff gets fleshed out.

>>53859291
What is it with the constant dick measuring?

>>53863542
Vampfags must ever be reminded of their place, lest they start to think they have run of the thread.

Was there ever a Translation Guide for Sorcerer?

>>53852587
Eh. In Demon, It's left up in the air as to the actual motives of God, but the actions are about what you'd expect.

Most of His children you interact with think he's kind of a dick, though, but most of those are also Demons.

>>53863667
Why haven't you fucks just renamed this magefag general?

>>53863818
This has been going on for years. If they didn't argue, they'd have a new thread once a week, tops.

>>53862898
Does Ascension even work mechanically RAW? It seems everyone has to do a lot of home-brew just to get a game going.

>>53856169
Note that the Generation mechanic was literally tacked on, the rules flat-out say 'these are untested, they will likely break shit'.

>>53863915
The problem is that the rules are EXTREMELY vague. Its not that they don't function, its that 10 people could read the rules and come up with 20 ideas on how its supposed to be run.

So in practice, the ST has to bootstrap a long list of rulings just to make it work, and by that point he may as well houserule a lot of shit too just because everything outside the core Sphere mechanic is pretty shitty [especially the math].

>>53859449
The attribute simplification gets rid of dump stats like Appearance, and you can have multiple Specializations to get the 'super distinct' feel. Dex is no longer a god stat, so there's that bonus as well.

>>53860657
Because OPP is fucking cancer.

>>53862521
It's also a pre-alpha of ONE major mechanic. Don't go full RPG.net histrionics.

>>53863968
>The problem is that the rules are EXTREMELY vague. Its not that they don't function, its that 10 people could read the rules and come up with 20 ideas on how its supposed to be run.

So it's basically Exalted 3e. Shit.

>>53864058
Note that this problem exists in every single oWoD game. 90s White Wolf seems to have been terrified of hard numbers, and when they gave them they were all over the place.

>>53863968
All the snippets I've seen from M20 has given me a new appreciation for Awakening.

>>53864116
Speaking of M20

Book of Secrets
When?

>>53864182
soon as some anon wipes off the non existant bookmarks

>>53862898
You need level 2 in a pattern sphere or prime to make something out of that sphere's purview. Soooo... Forces, Life, Matter or Prime at level 2. All Prime 2 does is allow a mage to create things (seemingly) Ex Nihilo.

>>53863915
Yes, it does. You just need to invoke "I'm the ST so fuck you" and stand by it.

Even though I'm a revisedfag and I took that side in the great mage internet War, Mage needs a reboot to second edition fluff wise and restoration of the revised era rules with M20 as a list of hacks.

Mage was at it's best when it was an Espionage/Conspiracy game with magic in it, despite all of the Umbral weirdness.

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>JUST

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>>53864257
>Mage was at it's best when it was an Espionage/Conspiracy game with magic in it, despite all of the Umbral weirdness.

Easily the worst way to run Mage. Ascension is a game of cosmic scope with characters of unimaginable power, there is hardly a worse way to run it then to try and shrink it, contain the madness, and pretend its a street-level investigation game.

Give me wizards fighting robots in space where wuxia martial artists duke it out with the angels of God. That is what people play Ascension for.

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Cannonwise, is Virstania still active in the modern nights?

>>53866300
with a body like that I doubt the bitch was EVER active

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>>53867446
The volume of an object created via path of conjuration is limited by the volume of casting Tremere.

Besides, she’s still mobile.

Was Book of Secrets shared in the previous thread?

>>53864257
>You need level 2 in a pattern sphere or prime to make something out of that sphere's purview. Soooo... Forces, Life, Matter or Prime at level 2. All Prime 2 does is allow a mage to create things (seemingly) Ex Nihilo

i mean, it just think is kinda pointless to ask a player who has forces 3 to also put points in Prime just to throw a fireball/thunder/wind from his hand.

>>53867865
>>53864182
>Book of Secrets
>When?

Now! Fuck you Brucatto, fuck you.

https://www.sendspace.com/file/apabnr

>>53865091
What is this from? I'm doing a Roman-era vampire scenario and more art would be useful.

The masquerade has vampires listed as 1 per every 10,000 humans. That would be about 30,000 vampires in the US, but its also stated that they are overpopulated.

Assuming 1 pint per day, around 350 pints of blood a year, times, say, 30k vampires, is like 1,000,000 pints of blood every year. But you know they consume more during periods of peak activity, and that they are overpopulated, so its more like 400 pints per year and 50k vampires for around 2 million pints a year, or 250,000 gallons.

Thats a fucking ocean of blood.

>>53868486

You might justify it by saying, "well, they don't often kill, and when they do, its the elderly, sick, and disabled", but the real human cost is our lifeforce.

in WoD, vampires would logically control the technocracy from the inside out, with methesulas exerting unnatural influence over the minds of technocratic mages due to how sexually repressed they are. Which is I suppose why many arch mages tend to retreat to the safety of horizon realms.

>>53868066
yeah, but from a real world perspective, creating matter from nothing is literally impossible, its possibly a mages best "in" when it comes to converting sleepers to their paradigm/worldview/whatever.

>>53868522
creating anything material from nothing is basically why I stopped following the psuedo reality that WoD props up.

I mean sure, you can pop a couple flies into existence or produce a shiny apple from under your coat, you can hand people a 2 dollar bill and call it a magic trick, but the truth is, Newton basically popped your balls, 9's.

>>53868522
>yeah, but from a real world perspective, creating matter from nothing is literally impossible

isnt that what paradox is for?

>>53868558
what is, is, and what ain't, ain't.
i'm sure you have your sooper sekrit nuclear reactor that can turn lead into gold, but I ain't seen it.

>>53868522
>>53868555
>>53868588
well, i just got dubs, trips, and dubs again. Which only proves my point. Magick exists, but it is weak.

>>53868606
Meme Magic is a subtle yet powerful force, Anon.

I just love the lunacy of the traditions.

You have to accept the traditions premise, which we can't tell you, and you must believe we can do things, which we can't show you, because what we do is in your best interests, even though you would not approve.

>>53868066
He could also do it with Forces 2 by concentrating and then throwing ambient heat.

>>53868486
It's actually 1:100,000 so take that number down by a factor of ten.

>>53865902
Stop putting words in my mouth. I didn't say street level, I said Espionage/Conspiracy. Some of that shit is pretty high level and I like wire-fighting with Black Helicopters as much as anyone.

>>53868632
>You have to accept the traditions premise,
You have to accept OUR traditions premise
ftfy

>>53868638
>It's actually 1:100,000 so take that number down by a factor of ten.

damn. really?
crap. I knew I should have double checked. Well I suppose thats not so bad then.

>>53868495
>in WoD, vampires would logically control the technocracy from the inside out, with methesulas exerting unnatural influence over the minds of technocratic mages due to how sexually repressed they are. Which is I suppose why many arch mages tend to retreat to the safety of horizon realms.

I'm just kind of surprised people don't understand this. I mean, why infiltrate the media, the military, wall street, ect. at every level when the technocracy has already done it for you?

technocracy could learn a thing or two from terrorist cell structures.

>>53868713
tbf i think the technocracy is organized more like the illuminati card game, with the boy scouts somehow being in charge of the pentagon and nobody really knowing whats going on.

>>53868632
Its all just an excuse to sell opium and listen to Pink Floyd

>>53860464
The Ahl-I-Batin of the University of Light use a similar system. You might want to check out Lost Paths

>>53860573
Everything that could be said has been said.
Just wait for V5. Then, we will talk more about Vampire.

>>53846215
There's no reason to want inter-splat balance unless you run crossover (which is stupid, and you can just houserule shit anyway) or you're a whiny little bitch who can't handle his splat not being top dog. Let me tell you, I love Mage, but if the game was about human practitioners being scrappy and clever underdogs without incredibly powerful and direct magic just sitting at their fingertips and instead something more in the vein of the Pact web serial, I would still love it. Or if another splat was just flat out stronger, I wouldn't have a problem with that. Because I enjoy the game for the magic and the mystery and the potential to interact with the setting at a larger scope, not as some stupid power fantasy.

>>53860657
RPGs in general are infested by these kind of people, because they have not been tolerated in mainstream society until very recently and instead crawled into niche hobbies like ours.

>>53863683
no

>>53868250
you are a good person, anon. Many thanks

>>53868409
V20 Dark Ages Companion, if I'm not wrong. It has something about Rome in 1242, but I think something (like the distribution of districts) could be used for antiquity

if you can't create matter Ex Nihilo, your whole paradigm falls apart.

Personally, I would love to see this, as it would shatter everything I believe in and give me a new foundation for my beliefs, one that isn't so grounded in materialism.

90% of the reason I don't believe in magic is because of this single fact.

I mean, I can accept a lot of strange shit exists in this world. People are born with tails and I find dogs teeth and clocks with extra notches after midnight, but I ain't never seen somebody pull a rabbit out of his hat that wasn't already there.

>>53868847
NIce, thank you!

I'm not asking you to turn lead into gold. (Hell, they claim they already did that at UCI) Just show me something impossible. Not unlikely, not improbable, something that is literally, impossible.

And about the only thing I've seen that is impossible, is creating something from nothing. I've seen people turn air into water, I've seen people turn water into fire. But I've never seen something just... appear, you know what I mean?

Like it all has to come from somewhere. The closest I've ever come to understanding ex-nihilo, from nothing, was when reading a particularly moving religious passage, and having understood it, cause that shit right there, thats an honest to god miracle.

If creating something from nothing were just some cheap trick, everybody could do it.

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RAW, vicissitude upgrades to appearance fail on Nosferatus, but what abour Gargoyles?

Can you make gargoyle go form hideus abomination to cute monstergirl?

>>53868250
after reading the FAQ, I am deeply grateful that Awakening is different and that Brucato will never be able to soil it

>>53868990
Any changes made with vicissitude to nosferatus revert after day sleep.

Since gargoyles arnt cursed then i assume not.

But wasnt there something about changes only being perm to vampires with higher gen than the vamp with visc?

>>53868250
That should be "fuck you Rich Thomas" as Brucato is just one of his victims.

Either way, thanks!

>>53869101
>But wasnt there something about changes only being perm to vampires with higher gen than the vamp with visc?

Vampire of equal or lower generation can spend bloodpoints to heal vicissitude changes.

I have a Demon the Fallen question: if I a demon made a pact with a thrall but then had to move to a different body, is the pact still intact?

Also, if a demon is sucked back into the Abyss, does the pact still stay or is it automatically broken?

Anyone get the new beast the primordial book?

>>53869261
Even if Brucato had some wrong done to him, you should never really consider him the victim because hes the kind of person who will def take advantage of you because of it.

Idea for an antagonist: a one of a kind Slasher that is used by an underperforming department of Cheiron as both a guinea pig and an ingredient hunter on a leash. He is a hulking but cunning monstrosity that is part Mutant and part Maniac, with a Dread Power that allows him to consume supernaturals and mimic their powers, even if they are not fully biological...and someone just gave him the code that breaks his leash.

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>>53869261

nigga they were roasting his nuts back in the 90s brucato's a bonafide lunatic

>>53872004

The other two parodies in that are Andrew Greenburg and Bill Bridges, by the way. At that time they were working for Holistic Designs working on Fading Suns.

>>53868664
We sure about that? 3000 vamps honestly seems low for the things that go on.

>>53869261
Read the FAQ about why his book is so liberal and how fit he is for his age

>>53861104
Not really. There is a lot of e celeb circle jerking going on, but it's not nearly all of it. Theres plenty of actual mechanics talk, some setting stuff, and they do big homebrew things. I'd take that over the occasional system talk and then three whole threads of a continued fight over power level wank any day of the week.

>>53872398
At first glance, maybe. But if you work it out, consider that larger cities would have only around a hundred or so. Or I would think. Basically have clusters of them in larger cities, and the rest scattered throughout. Although I agree that the estimate seems a little lacking. It wouldn't be a much larger number though.

>when you just want to kill vampires, slashers and werewolves but the rest of the cell seems to really want to push a #notallmonsters angle of wanting to redeem them instead

This group is a blight.
Only semi related, but for hunter the vigil, is there a fast healing merit? I have laying on hands as a merit and tend to get shot a lot, so I always seem to end our actually violent hunts bleeding out while everyone else is hunky dory.

>>53868713
Even the Nephandi find inflitrating the union a challenge, and deceit is their "thing" more than any other faction. What chance do a Bunch of licks have?

>>53873066

Brucato is a weapons-grade douche, but the blame for the M20's myriad failing rests squarely upon the shoulder of RichT.

Rich is the sole owner and purported "Creative Director" of OPP. It is his job to ensure quality product, including ultimate responsibility for hiring and supervision of developers and authors, ensuring consistent and focused writing, and acting as the ultimate editor in chief.

It was Rich's decision to hire Phil as the sole developer and have him write nearly all of M20. He approved M20 and the supplements despite all the cluttered garbage and the obvious fact that the tome was Phil's demented vanity project.

Brucato has always been a pretentious, overtly political ass with only middling development and writing skills. He's such a failure that he needs a Patreon to beg money to pay his rent. There is no possible way Rich did not know who and what Phil was about, yet he was given free reign and a rubber stamp on M20.

The buck stops at Rich. [This also applies to other fiascos like Exalted 3]

Although I've not been impressed with nuWW management and vision, to say the very least, I still wonder whether it might be better if the ttrpg license for cWOD and CofD went elsewhere besides OPP and Rich. If most of the current freelances stayed on as writers, I cannot imagine how a lack of Rich could possibly make things any worse in terms of both quality and availability of new material.

>>53873315

You should know that's a monkey's paw wish, Branford.

>>53873445

Who or what is "Branford?"

Rich has not impressed for some time, the only products that actually seem to get any real attention are Kickstarter related (and some are still late or have serious problems), and we've recently learned there'a an issue of Rich not paying certain freelancers. It's bad with WOD, much worse with CofD (and vaporware Trinity), and unforgivable with Exalted.

While it's always tempting fate to change IP holders, as time goes on, Rich's' competence grows further in doubt. Rich used to complain that he just needed more help. Well, he hired Rose and couple of more people as actual employees of OPP, and things are getting worse, not better. OPP is already not going to publish the 5th edition of WOD, so maybe a complete break between OPP and WW might be for the best. No risk, no reward.

>>53873931

It's just going to end up with an even worse licensor if any at all, Branford. FFG has Star Wars, Cubicle 7 had LOTR and Warhammer, Evil Hat has Fate, and those are pretty much the only three major companies who can actually be able to withstand the amount of publishing White Wolf fans crave.

There is no one else worth breaking off for, and it's a choice between a trickle of licensing money before getting the big IP reboot off the ground or none at all.

This, all of this, is the best we're going to get: a creative director whose bitten off more than he can chew, and a creative director whose about to learn just how much he's missed the bandwagon.

>>53873931
>(and vaporware Trinity)

I mostly agree with you but after Exalted Trinity Continuum ain't been radio silent anywhere *near* long enough for me to start calling it vaporware with any modicum of seriousness.

In M20 Book of Secrets FAQ section concerning whether M20 features liberal politics, Satyrdouche first attempts some linguistic and historical gymnastics to argue that there's no real liberal bent, and then spends the rest of the section not only admitting the book is progressive, but exclaiming how proud he is of its obvious "progressive" nature.

Phil still doesn't understand the nature or extent of the criticism, nor address why so much of any politics had to be included when he was (correctly) complaining that there wasn't space for actual rule and setting in the various books.

If he (and RIch) really don't understand why some people, of all political persuasions, might find it anywhere from offensive to puzzling why the book included matters like player culinary demands, to paraphrase Phil, "it says more about him, than than it does about the people reading the book."

>>53874396
>This, all of this, is the best we're going to get

Sad.

There must be *someone* who can make White Wolf Great Again?

>>53874473

You'd need a company that's willing to work with White Wolf's specifications with a proven track record for bringing out material. Anyone who fits that criteria is already selling their own IP or licensing far more lucrative IPs.

The closest you can get to that is Ulysses Spiel, which isn't going to happen since they already have West End IPs to use, along with some old FASA IPs. At best, the IP would be licensed to another brand new company of White Wolf vets.

>>53874625
>brand new company of White Wolf vets

Some vets are better than others, and many of the more recent WW/OPP developers and authors have talent and vision (although I don't know who would really want to own a ttrpg company in this day and age).

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>>53868851
...It's a fucking game about Wizards, retard.

This seems a good a time as any to ask, between white wolf, onyx path, and paradox, who exactly owns what right now?

I think the problem is that the whole white wolf "schtick" is played out. Monsters are real, they have a society, yadda yadda, been there done that.

I think the point is that white wolf got to be too specific, to the point where if you're ideas of what a vampire or werewolf are don't mesh with the setting, then you don't get to play.

Other cultures have some really fucking weird ideas of what it means to be a werewolf or vampire. Its basically tabloid journalism at this point, like the weekly world news "insider scoop" on the camirilla and garou nation.

There is just some point where the brain screams "horseshit!"

>>53874747
shh.. let him have this.

>>53874805
I mean, what mystery is left once you spill the beans?

Its like, "Oh. So that's how that works."

You have to keep creating new mysteries otherwise your characters just become stock. Existential angst isn't a plot hook, its a theme.

You can't be afraid of the unknown once its known.

>>53874725

>(although I don't know who would really want to own a ttrpg company in this day and age).

And therein lies the issue: either they don't want to or really shouldn't run a tabletop RPG company, or they've moved on to other creative industries that pay better, which is almost every other one possible.

Once the monsters are no longer monsters, you have to create new monsters. Maybe part of the mystique is that there are certain aspects of each metatype that are unknowable, beyond understanding, categorization or documentation.

>>53874781

Paradox: Owns White Wolf, letting it exist as a subsidiary, meaning it works on its own but occasionally sends money up the pipeline.

White Wolf: Owns almost all the IPs old White Wolf owned at the time of the CCP buyout: WoD, CofD, Exalted, all the Guardians of Order IPs (Silver Age Sentinels, Big Eyes, Small Mouth, Ex Machina, etc).

Onyx Path: Owns Scion and the Trinity games (Aeon/Trinity, Aberrant, Adventure!). Licenses WoD, CofD, and Exalted material. Publishes Pugmire (owned by Eddy Webb's Pugsteady) and Cavaliers of Mars (owned directly by Rose Bailey).

Nocturnal Media: Shares the rights to White Wolf's d20 IPs with OPP.

By Night Studios: Licenses WoD, specifically Mind's Eye Theatre for the World of Darkness (not MET for CofD).

That should be all of it.

You have to admit some of us have a rather tenuous grip on reality as is, and many of us are used to having to deal with an "alternate" reality that is 100% verifiable and true.

Maybe you really shouldn't be selling people on these mysteries if you know they aren't true. Even Kevin Siembeida put warning labels on his books, stating on the record that everything in this book is 100% fiction.

White Wolf has always been in the morally dubious business of playing on peoples superstitions and hidden beliefs. They have this coy way of saying, "I'm not saying it IS true, but I'm not saying it isn't, either."

I mean, we all love santa clause, but if you still believe in him when you come of age you've got a legit problem.

Stop fucking with shizo's white wolf. Its crass, ugly and sad.

I mean, if you believe in vampires for realsies, you may not belong in a mental institution, but you're definitely a nutter.

You shouldn't be playing a game like VtM.

>>53875036

That sounds like that's entirely the problem of the reader. WoD/CofD books already have those labels in the credits section, and only a fool would believe the books were real without having some kind of untreated mental illness, something that's not the responsibility of the games company.

I met a guy, must have been in his 50's, wore a beard and a cap, came to sessions, was polite if a bit christian, who, 100%, sincerely, legitimately believed vampires were real.

That shits not kosher. We all tend to get a bit lost when playing pretend, but there is a line.

>>53875011
God why is this all so complex geez.

>>53875090
>WoD/CofD books already have those labels in the credits section

Have you read those labels? They are basically a wink and a secret handshake.

>>53875113
Are you positive he wasn't just fucking with you? If he was otherwise completely rational and sane, he might have been.

>>53875011
From what I understand, onyx path has around three or four actual employees and then a big bunch of freelancers. Who if anyone still works for white wolf?

All in all white wolf is very 90's, tongue in cheek sort of horror. The authors seem to have very little self awareness, sometimes it seems like the joke really is on them.

Maybe instead of the rainbow hippie lets all be friends with the thing that crawled out of the sewer mentality, we should return to the 50's pulp aesthetic, wolfman and the mummy, that sort of thing.

Corny, but genuine, none of the smarmy, sardonic humor you see in the WoD books. If I want mysticism I'll listen to Paint it Black, if I want to have a good time I'll watch a horror flick.

Every horror film today has this pretentious air about it that screams, "Monsters are real guys! Really!"

>>53875167
No man, he looked me straight in the eye, he was dead serious. I just couldn't play with him after that, knowing that he legit believed that shit made me uncomfortable.

Is the Friction Curse still a thing as of NWoD?

Instead of trying to dislodge people from their comfort zone, maybe you should make them uncomfortable with their comfort, you know what I mean?

You can't protect them from their own ignorance, but you can show them a fun time.

>>53875256

You can just play another game for that, like Chill. WoD isn't the only horror RPG in existance.

For 99% of us, its just another day in paradise. Why would you want to change that? Why make your angst their problem?

>>53875171

Old White Wolf? No one. They're either freelancing or in some other industry.

New White Wolf, the Paradox one, has five employees: Martin Ericsson as Creative Director, Tobias Srojen as CEO, Karim Mumar as Chief Editor, Dhaunae De Vir as head of Business Development, and Shawn deFreest as head of the Entertainment division.

So, it's the same deal as Onyx Path: small core of employees, boat loads of freelancers making the actual product. White Wolf just has more money at the moment.

>>53875330
Forces 4 could pull it off

>>53875282
Why? Vampires are uncommon,
but where I live, plenty of people, especially middle aged women with poor education education, legit belive in angels and spirits. There was even a guy who made money exorcising bad spirits with his dick.

>>53875256
How about: "Everybody but the most naive at least suspects monsters be real, but it is a social suicide to speak of such things"

>>53875517

Why even use Celerity against a mage

>>53875543
Contingencies will always trump speed-blitzing.

>>53875543
Is there anything vampire can do against prepared mage?

>>53874415
The FAQ was the most embarassing thing I have ever read from WW, even topping some 90s edgyness

>>53875517
Why is suppressing friction a four dot practice instead of a three dot.

>>53875011
so Paradox can send Elricson off the plank if he fucks up? Or is Elricson also affiliated with Paradox?

>>53875804
Depends on what the Vampire has. In general though, the bloodsucker is toast.

I keep reading about the stereotype surrounding magefags and their power wanking personalities.

Yet I don't see it at all when I'm actually playing with them. In fact, it's always the vampfags power wanking. Not magefags.

Also Changeling players are piss annoying.

>>53872494
I did. Fuck.

Fuck Brucato, amen.

>>53875953
Liar. Magefags are even worse IRL.

Second only to LARPers. Of any kind.

>>53875882

They could, but since White Wolf is a separate subsidiary, they don't really have a reason to micromanage the company. Elricson could drive the company into the sea and the worst Paradox has to deal with is paying off some debt if White Wolf collapses. As long as White Wolf cam bring in money from their games and licensing deals, Paradox can pretty much look the other way from whatever it's doing.

>>53876035
That's really depressing

>>53875831
You aren't suppressing friction, you're turning the target's kinetic energy into heat. That's the practice of Patterning, such requires 4 dots.

>>53874415
>Phil still doesn't understand the nature or extent of the criticism, nor address why so much of any politics had to be included when he was (correctly) complaining that there wasn't space for actual rule and setting in the various books.

Thing is you cant complain about it because the devs/OPP people think Goatboy is a good guy.

>>53875036
>You have to admit some of us have a rather tenuous grip on reality as is,

>Beautiful madness

>>53876072
I don’t think they would be okay with killing a goose that might still lay golden eggs.

Vampire: Dark ages themed DLC for CK2, that gotta earn them mad cash...

>>53876072

In the bright side, we did get Ken Hite cleaning up the oWoD system, so that's nice. It's really weird that 5e will have random tables, but apparently that's in there to attract the Swedish audience, who apparently put random tables in all their games.

So I had an idea for a parody white wolf setting. The setting is a giant indoor mall in demoines, Iowa. The owners decided to trump up business by letting it run 24/7. All the characters are you're typical WoD fair, but they are all young and hang out at the mall all evening.

So basically you have all these vapid, appearence obsessed, pretencious fuckwits, and you relegate them to the one place they belong.

>>53876459
there was a game that did something like this, but it wasn't specifically set in a mall. I forget what it was called but had a teenager using telekinesis to juggle fast food while working behind the counter at a burger joint.

Are Requiem vampires stronger than their Masquerade counterparts?

>>53876459
sounds like a better setup than Beast

>>53876124
2e awakening "Rend Friction" forces 4, 1 lethal dam per 3 yards up to max potency.

>>53876597
Weaker

>>53876597
Somewhat stronger generally speaking

>>53876665
Show your workings or you get no marks!

>>53875330
>Is the Friction Curse still a thing as of NWoD?

Yes, although most magess cure the problem with a little powder or cream (or Life magic).

It's really embarrassing to open your eyes to the Truth of the universe and bend reality to your will, yet still chaffe.

>>53875804
Cry

>>53876597
depends. Antediluvians are definitely more powerful

>>53875804
first throwing himself at the mage's mercy and then backstabbing him before the mage can react.

>>53875330
What's the friction curse?

>>53875804
>Is there anything vampire can do against prepared mage?

Quickly commit suicide, for the alternative is far, far worse.

BTW, other than monumental stupidity or colossal bad luck, why would a vampire be facing a prepared mage, one of the scariest phenomena in the entire CofD?

>>53876808
>knife rebounds due to ward

nice try

>>53876824
Something amazing

>>53876168
>Thing is you cant complain about it because the devs/OPP people think Goatboy is a good guy.

Thank god goatboy never laid a hand on Awakening.

>>53876824
The absolute best way to counter Celerity

>>53876824
Mages rubbing their cocks so hard is the friction curse.

>>53876252
>Swedish WW audience

I believe my block alone in NYC has more WW fans than all of Sweden.

>American purchasing supremacy

>>53876808
>backstabbing him before the mage can react.

>L O L - Forces 2 immunity to kinetic damage

>>53876886
>Mages rubbing their cocks so hard is the friction curse.

Easily countered with low levels of Life or Forces

>Self-love supremacy

>Nobody Does It Better

lol there are no canon instances of archmages going above six dots in a single sphere

get fucked by methuselahs you pieces of shit

:^)

>>53876875

Awakening wouldn't survive Brucato, especially pre-dave Awakening.

Ascension succeeded in many ways in spite of Brucato

>>53875953
>it's always the vampfags power wanking. Not magefags.
Mage players are only bad on /wodg/
OPP forums has scores of Masquerade whores out-bitching even this place. Has lessened to an extent.

It's an oft mistake to label Ascension/Awakening players as minmaxing power-gamers.

There's no basis.

>>53877060
>it's always the vampfags power wanking. Not magefags.
>Mage players are only bad on /wodg/

Mages sleep soundly in the comfort of their splat supremacy.

It would simply be gauch and uncivilized to constantly remind their lessers of their failings or to gratuitously display their awesome power.

>Modesty supremacy

I hate you guys.

Always with the mage dick sucking.

>>53875804
Depends on the vamp in question, and how much the mage actually knows or expects of him. An methusula or elder could quickly escalate the conflict in ways the mage may not expect or even be preped for. A mage could be prepared for a toreador or brujah but end up against a lasombra or assimite whom have odd powersets.

>>53877300
Magic might at times be too all encompassing for encounters to be situational.

You could have a Hermetic surrounding himself with specific spirits made for dozens of conceivable threats.

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>>53861569
>>53861575
>>53861583
>>53861612
Bump.

>>53877362
Sorcerers are practically the same as mages, just obviously weaker and far more linear.

Both gain their magics from the same source/method.

Might as well dumb down mages instead.

Mages aren't monsters

They don't belong in the WoD

>>53877357
Conceivable being the key word here. While a good majority of vamps wont have an out, the higher up the generation and age tree, and the more obscure disciplines and elder levels things can get harder to predict. He could run into a high end tzim who can outright fleshcraft him with his eyes, or send his own bound spirits at him if he is kuldunic. Or possibly even both.

>>53877634
not after prime has its way with him he can't :^)

>>53876597
Stronger in certain ways, weaker in others

Requiem Vampires can heal Lethal quicker and a number of their disciplines are permanent rather than things needed to be repeatedly spent for

Masquerade Elders though are fucking silly though, and have powers that can literally destroy cities and cripple their peers

>>53877634
Tzimisce isn't a good example here. The Hermetics know all about them. The Life Sphere is already a better alternative to Vicissitude.

Koldunic sorcery also wouldn't be enough to pull that off.

Continuing to read M20 Book of Secrets, and my disappointment grows.


According to Phil, "The Technocratic Union, then, is not the force of oppressive technology, but a force that uses technology to enforce oppression."

Did he blackout for most of Ascension, and is now trying to rewrite its entire history?

The contemporary "left-wing, it's all about science, SJW" contingent of OPP were the exact people who were the crystal-waving, gaia worshipping neo-hippies of the 1990's, fully immersed in the earlier 1980's cyberpunk anti-technology and anti-corporate ethos. The Technocracy was indeed very openly all about how technology itself was oppressive, dehumanizing anti-spiritual, and the "heroes" were the "magical minorities" and (mostly) anti-capitalists or the Traditions. It's quite astonishing how wonders like the internet changed perceptions and how a few decades altered fundamental ideologies.

Phil needs to fully own what the Technocracy and the Traditions represented as intended, or openly admit he's making tremendous changes to the setting to suit his modern left-wing sensibilities, which were inspired the setting in the first place

>>53877634
>>53877645
>>53877650

Are we discussing the vampire v. prepared mage issues in WOD or CofD.

In CofD, the leech is in for a world of hurt. There's just too many "I win" powers against vampires, no less if the mage is remotely prepared for conflict.

>>53877680
preaching to the choir senpai

post that shit in a thread on the OPP forums and watch them go into apoplexy.

>>53877711
Mages reign supreme in both WOD & CofD

Ain't no way around it

>>53877680
There is an outside chance that he realizes the 90's zeitgeist has aged like milk and in a moment of self awareness tried to be constructive with the IP.

Yeah, I couldn't type that with a straight face either.

2E requiem are stronger, they got rid of all the speed bump powers.

>>53877717
You say that but the reaction towards BoS, and M20 revisionism in general has been fairly mixed to negative on the OPP forums. Not universally so but they are in no way Brucato groupies to a gender non-binary individual.

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OUR POWERS COMBINED!!

>>53877848
>gender non-binary individual.

The only "gender non-binary individuals" I care about in M20 are Hit Marks.

>Cheering while the Union, the real heroes of the WOD, eradicate the scourge of reality deviants.

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>>53877886
CAPTAIN PLANET!!

>>53877918
>>53877918
>>53877918

>>53877915
>Hit Marks
>non-binary

>>53877777

My primary issue, at least with respect to the FAQ, is not that changes might have been made to the setting to account for modern (left wing) sensibilities, but that Phil tries to argue that the game *always* reflected such contemporary ethos. What a load of crap.

I don't care if he and his buddies are mortified by their beliefs and actions 25 years ago, and would prefer to live in convenient denial. I and many other fans were around when the various Mage iterations were released, were children of the same times as Phil, and we have not forgotten. Phil needs to grow a pair and own what mage was, admit the wholesale changes to the setting in M20, and then convince us why they were necessary, rather than just a vehicle for his use of M20 as his vanity political treatise.

How can one man contain so much douche?

>>53877711
No, we were talking about Requiem vs Masquerade vampires. But thank you for doing your part to make sure that the thread stays as cancerous as possible

>>53876168
Yeah, but whatever they think they aren't paying him anyway.

>>53878016
Ironically, WtA had an inherent leftist political bias, owned it, and never once denied having it. Everything in that book is as relevant today as it was 20 years ago.

>>53878155
>WtA had an inherent leftist political bias, owned it, and never once denied having it.

It was then, and is now, in many ways an apologia for environmental terrorism.

Ironically, the Garou Nation are also the most historically incompetent group ever to exist in the WOD.

>>53878247
>Garou Nation are also the most historically incompetent group ever to exist in the WOD.
no doubt.
kind of got dealt a bad hand though.
only real mistake they made was not enforcing the Impergium

>>53876252
WE don't know if it'll have random tables in the final version, this is a FUCKING PREALPHA DRAFT for fuck's sake.

>>53877680
Satyros is not the most sane of people, remember.

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>>53879130
>Satyros
lol, I got that one.

>>53879096

It will absolutely have random tables in the final version. Swedish gamers love random tables, and VtM 1e had a random feeding encounter chart and 5e explicitly wants to be a more 1e feel with modern game design.

The tables are coming.