/CofD/ & /wodg/ Chronicles of Darkness and World of Darkness

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Yes yes you can, you just need a number of the right Arcana to do so.

>>53565149
>Can you make spaceships in new mage?
MtAw doesn't havesome retarded "space is another dimension" bullshit of Ascension, so yes, going strictly by the rules you can use Magic to construct a Spaceship which operates entirely on fallen principles.

What interests me, is whether the time-delay on a "live" view of the moon is sufficient to render remote targeting impossible.
Because if not, you only need access to a world-class telescope and one more reach to teleport to the Moon.

Only problem is uh, all the fucking Idigam.
Aaaaaaand pissing off Luna.

>>53565149

Finally the Mage questions that really matter!

There's a whole bit in Secrets of the Ruined Temple about a group called the Bellerophon Society doing this and making the guardians collectively shit themselves because their security was too good.

Then some of them went crazy and the group collapsed or something. So the guardians take a negative view of outer space shenanigans, much like anything that would challenge their retarded fifth column theology.

>>53565240

Idigam are all gone by now, hitched a ride on Apollo rockets. And if Luna didn't throttle them, she's not gonna throttle a bunch of mages.

>>53565149
>Can you make spaceships in new mage?
Yes, and probably should at some point. With all the places available when playing mage the mundane universe should be just as interesting as the shadow, astral, underworld, hedge, alternate times lines, wendings, etc.

I'm a VTM fag, sell me on VTR second edition, please.

>>53565149
To be honest I'd be shocked if there aren't minor orders that don't travel the universe or if the major orders pentacle or seer don't have some secret facilities hidden throughout the universe.

>>53565413
Hey you know how people get super autistically caught up in bullshit about super-ancient vampires, and masturbatory fantasies about retarded clans from far off places who have no rational place in a sensible universe, and everyone who isn't a God-Vampire must fellate everyone who is and everyone has turbo-murder-boner, and you can really never get any better than the level at which you were embraced which forces everyone to constantly think of diablerie because they want to increase their stats to further enlarge their murder-boner?

In VtR 2e you're a Vampire, from a clan, who belongs to a social group.
Everyone starts weak, everyone can get strong. There's no biblical bullshit, and very little metaplot.
And the setting doesn't assume there are turbo-powered Mages who can come along a butt-fuck your undead existence inside out, and want to harvest your blood for Magic juju.
You can tell the story you want, and play the character you want, without necessarily being inhibited by the setting.

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I made this for my group to celebrate us finishing our campaign

>>53565491
Nice job, anon, this unironically sold me.

>>53565505
Tell us more, please.

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>>53565491

Also watch out for Angry Birbs.

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Stats: https://pastebin.com/f51TiHTj

Feedback welcome.

>>53565505
Was it a crossover?

>>53565491
No Tremere though
Big old flaw in the system
It's okay though, I like the Stryx

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>>53565596

Don't say I never did anything for the thread

>>53565803

Three of the Covenants do Blood Magic of some form.

>>53565803

Tremere are Mages in NWoD. In other words, they succeeded where the original Tremere Failed.

What is the best option for running a Jojo's Bizarre Adventure game in CoD: creating a Micro Template, or waiting for Geist 2ED and making a setting hack for it that is more about the Weird than the Gothic?

>>53565950
They're still a group of fuck ups. Continuing the proud tradition of the Tremere for being the short bus of magic users.

Can Vampires smoke?

>>53566036
The Tremere in CofD are hardly on the short end.

They're an altered Template, and still considered Mages.

>>53566038

I think they can. I don't think it does anything for them.

Why is WoD so devoid of splat balance?

Mages are humans not monsters. SO shouldn't they be under vampires and weres?

>>53566088
>Mages are humans not monsters.

There is more debate about that than you think.

>>53566088
Mages are the Only actual humans in the setting. Sleepers are nothing more than animals that look human. Calling a sleeper human is an insult to the entire species

>>53566088
Because the splats aren't supposed to be balanced? This isn't a hard concept. If you're playing a game of Vampire, you're not supposed to be fighting Archmages, you're supposed to be fighting Vampire antagonists.

Mage's powerlevels make sense for the story it's trying to tell: you play a human who has been granted access to the source code of reality. That is a cosmic-level story, and it is not supposed to crossover with street-level stories like Werewolf and Vampire. Crossover is a bad idea in general, but Mage is very clearly not supposed to crossover with anyone.

>>53566088
The biggest monsters are almost always human.

Give said humans phenomenal power? Yikes.

>>53566249
>Mage is very clearly not supposed to crossover with anyone.

I disagree. They do a far better job than Beast.

>>53565950
>>53565876
Yeah but the new blood magic has no academical aspect to it, it's basically dark catholicism, naked witches in the woods,, or Dracula wannabes & any filthy degenerate bloodline can use it.

>>53566296
>They do a far better job than Beast

This is true, but second-worst is still pretty bad. Like I said, none of the splats are "good" for crossover, but some are worse than others.

>>53566088

The World of Darkness is anthropocentric - Blatantly so in the new game. Which is probably why Aliens were never a splat, or were Mages as well. (The old WoD never gave a satisfactory answer on that end, the Ka Luon are supposedly Mages or something like Mages in "Not with a Bang," which was pretty horribly done)

All splats are defined by Humanity in some way or another. Therefore Humans with Big-league Power are the strongest combination.

>>53566382

The OD is pretty academic in it's behavior. Have you actually read their splatbook?

>>53566382

Mage and Demon mix pretty well in my experience. Then again, I use the Crowded Shadows model, so it's likely you'll at least bump into another splat at some point. How it goes down depends on the game you're playing.

Is there anything the Gentry could offer mages in return for raiding a freehold and capturing as many changelings as possible?

>>53566711

I have a Seer NPC in the works who trades sleepers to the Gentry for all sorts of goodies. Privateering is more dangerous, but I'm sure the rewards would be better too.

Then again, I'm trying to come up with characters that highlight the depths to which Seers will sink.

Remember kids, if it doesn't involve using Magic, it's not a sin against Wisdom! Or it shouldn't be, anyway.

>>53566711
Hedge-beast servants, goblin fruit, generic "favors", secrets from the ancient past.
It'd really only be Seers, or perhaps some jackass Mystagogues who would accept such a deal though.

>>53566804

Even the Scelestus have lines they won't cross, and shit like this might have led them to think maybe we need a different reality then our current one. In fact, I think I have another character idea for an antagonist in that side story - A Scelestus who wants to erase the Gentry.

>>53566924
Thing is, Scelestus don't just think "maybe we need a new reality" they're committed, wholesale, to the destruction of reality by the Abyss.

Some will see this is because the world is such a horrifyingly awful place, ruled by tyrannical Exarchs, where even death is not the end as souls are (ostensibly) recycled back into new bodies. Only destruction by the Abyss will permit a new world to be birthed from the complete lack of existence as anti-reality and reality collide and erase each other (this argument has NO objective truth btw... or does it?).

However others just want to destroy it all.

You don't have to be a Scelestus to want to destroy the Gentry though.
While the Underworld and Shadow seem to be a 'natural' part of the world, the Hedge and Arcadia seem almost like a parasitic attachment to it. A "lesser" lower depth which has somehow taken root and connected to reality.
I wonder what element it would be argued is missing from Arcadia though.
Certainty?

>>53567114
The Wyrd is essentially living fate. It's not an entity per se but it runs off of strange logic correlating to stories.

I have a changeling the lost game coming up and I'm honestly in a bit of an rpg slump atm.

Have any of you guys got any good source material (or just flat out ideas of your own) that I could use to get those creative juices flowing?

>>53567154
So the missing element should be "choice" or perhaps "truth".
As a story is nothing but a lie we tell ourselves, and Changelings entire morality-stat is about their perception of reality and "truth" crumbling.

>>53567114
>>53567154
I liked the previous mention of an Archmage creating his/her own version of Arcadia within a Chantry.

Would really make you wonder just what "flaws" the Seeker would correct in relation to the real thing.

>>53567196
>I liked the previous mention of an Archmage creating his/her own version of Arcadia within a Chantry.

How many dots would this require?

>>53566565
Yes they are a bit bookish. But they are boring Dracula wannabes.

Where is the cool blood penny ritual? The Mind over Matter Path? The ritual to create an aggro weapon? Blood changing flasks?

>>53567278
For the real deal and not just some sandbox reality?

Fate Transfiguration

>>53567278
Practice of Dominions is required to create a Chantry, with Fate you could probably make it rooted in the Hedge, much like Mind can create one that effectivley mimics the Astral, Death the Underworld, Spirit the Shadow, and Matter the "material" world.

>>53567317
Would the Gentry be angry that some wizard created a superior Wyrd / Arcadia though?

I mean think about it. The Archmage is capable of spawning his own infinity of Gentry, without any of the previous drawbacks such as iron or hospitality.

>>53567369
Actually, to create an entirely new Arcadia, you'd need Assumption.

Using Transfiguration, you could just temporarily command Fate to do whatever you wanted.
When the spell ends though, the state will reset, but not anything you did.
The practical effect of which would be you could destroy every single Gentry you encoutered for the duration of the spell, peel back the hedge's encroachment, and decrease the probability of more Gentry arising and having such easy access to mankind when Arcadia births more of them.

So ultimately, to make a new Arcadia? Likely Assumption.

Possibly even an Ascension rite to absorb Changeling Arcaida "into" Supernal Arcadia, purifying it and properly re-incorporating its bastardised symbols.
Also retroactively erasing every Changeling from history but eh, whatchagonnado?

What would that add to Arcaida though?
Would all stories suddenly start to resonate with Fate?

>>53567443
The effects of Transfiguration are permanent.
If you so desire.

It would only take a moment to create the spark of a duplicate-Wyrd and let it run its course.

>>53567163
Set it in high school. Don't worry about using kid rules, just use adult rules & squint.

The Courts are clicks, so the Jocks are Summer, the Goths are Autumn, the Nerds are Winter (along the lines of being logic over emotion) the Stoners/party dudes/sluts are Spring. Flavor for taste if you don't like my suggestion ed clicks.

Plot Hooks
Girl goes missing, her locker was a hedge gate

Dude who was a lower suddenly gets really good at a sport, like swimiming, starts to become star athlete, is he a Changling? Did he make a deal?

Is the new Principal (or other authority figure) a huntsman?

Musical Episode!

School play starts to bleed into real life

Kid makes goblin fruit brownies, for the bakesale

Kid makes goblin fruit Drugs

I can think of more if you like

Is it correct to assume that all Ascended Mages are under the effects of Assumption?

They can't leave the Supernal, but I would imagine that they could still affect the Fallen if they were inclined.
Awakening to one of the five Watchtowers is an Imperial spell at its core.

>>53567599
No. Not at all.
For one, you don't even NEED to have achieved Archmastery to Ascend.
What's more, Ascension through a 10-dot practice is only one method open to Archmasters, amongst Ascension Rites, Exarchal favour, and so forth.

>>53567599

Well the seers have to get all that money and power from somewhere, right? Too busy doing the Exarchs' will to turn a serious profit.

>>53567599
The capabilities of Ascendants is a wonky topic. Supposedly they're ludicrously powerful but I've yet to see examples of how they'd defend what their symbols represent.

For instance, how would they defend the Phenomenal World if their Ochemata fail?

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>>53565312
There's far, far more Idigam than could ever fit onto the Apollo rockets, they were pretty clear on that. Even if close to a hundred or so came back per lander, they still have a minimum metaphysical space they can occupy, and the number originally imprisoned is supposed to be in the thousands I thought?

Occasionally one or two of them manage to hitch a ride on particularly complex radio wave reflections and the like. They're fucking desperate to get out of there and if you open a portal they will come fucking running.

>>53566088
Mages would be far less thematically rich if they were weaker. The Mage story is about suddenly not only being powerful enough that a small slip-up using your powers could result in the death of everyone you know, and also of no longer having the sense of security that comes from being beneath the notice of the truly terrifying things that control the universe and crush civilisations like ants.

Vampire meanwhile is about having a shitty fucking awful time after having effectively sold your soul for immortality, and honestly the presence of Mages as essentially humans cartwheeling about enjoying their godlike powers seemingly consequence-free only adds to the deep regret they are supposed to be feeling over their choices.

>>53567599
They would have a set of definable conditions that would result in their Ochemata being summoned to the phenomenal world, and if another ascendent infringes their symbols, then they would resist that, realigning their dominion over symbols as the encroachment occurs.

But the thing that really makes this confusing is that its questionable as to whether they actually 'think' in any way we could understand, or whether they simply ARE. Their Ochemata can strive for things, it is a component of that ascendant's grip on reality that those Ochemata will appear at specific times with specific objectives. But they already know whether those Ochemata will succeed or not, since they are beyond time.

>>53567736
>how would they defend the Phenomenal World if their Ochemata fail?
Highly unlikely. They can spawn an infinite amount.

Other than that I don't know. They can probably cast Imperial magic at a whim and without Quintessence. Just a guess.

>>53567477
I'm actually a player I'm trying to look for something that *clicks* for a character concept.

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>>53567599
>>53567989
To be clearer, not all Archmasters are Siddha. Someone who achieves Ascension by Assumption has a supernal identity strongly centred around their chosen Arcanum. But strictly speaking there's more ways of chopping up the eleven dimensional supernal pie than just down the lines of the arcana, as evidenced by other supernaturals.

As mentioned by >>53567650 there's plenty of other ways to ascend, and should you do so, it's likely that your specific supernal dominion and symbolic inscriptions wouldn't be centred around a single arcanum but rather some other domain of control. I dunno, maybe you are the dude who made it so that food gets better when you cook it. This entails being related to heat, meat, plants, fire, light, chemical bonds, proteins, even the sensations of taste and the sociology of culinary professionals. And honestly you probably have a hell of a lot more dominion over those specific things than those who associate directly with say, the Force, Matter, Life or Death arcana themselves even though those are ostensibly the root origin for the phenomena according to the traditional taxonomy of Mages, which precedes the advent of archmages.

If an Ascended's Ochemata fail, it already, and for always, knew that they would fail, but they were fatalistically summoned because that is simply the type of god that they are, that they would intervene if those circumstances came up. They can't really CAST onto the fallen world as such because that implies that a reality alteration is necessary. They simply are. They aren't observing things in real time.

PERHAPS though, there was some loophole that was always concealed within their domain to screw over those that threaten them. Going back to the Ascended Cooking Guy, maybe it's a more fundamental law of the universe than you would expect that those who like raw, bland food are shunned socially by everyone around them.

>>53568168
Or in a more extreme scenario, the sensation of tasting good food from the fallen world actually implants an undetectable, imperial strength compulsion that if anyone ever truly is at risk of threatening the fundamental nature of food, you will turn on them and kill them, no matter how closely allied to them you are, no matter how precious they are to you. It just turns out that noone pushed those boundaries up until now.

Any defensive measures that the Ascended have, already are, and always have been.

At least, that's my perspective. They get to understand the entire world in its entirety once, and they can set up some bulwarks and countermeasures against it to stop it from threatening them, after which they are a part of reality and their defenses are unfathomably powerful but effectively autonomous, since they now always were a part of the nature of reality. They can't "change their mind" because they realise that those defenses weren't effective enough, because to change their mind would immediately destabilise reality itself, since they are supposed to be serving as an eternal symbol that creates it in their image.

How do you impose mystery or investigation elements into your games?

>>53568531
What game line?

>>53568547
CofD and Hunter. Mostly doing mystery without That Guy messing it up.

>>53565149
>That op pic
Did I miss another stupid mage debate last thread?

>>53567736
It's an artifact of the fact that high power content is being provided to what was never really meant to be a high powered game. Archmages are supposed to be crazy powerful, but we don't have a single instance of anyone ever doing anything relevant to my knowledge.

>>53568785
Yeah. Last few threads this week have been filled with mage wank trolls.

>>53569331
Ech it wasn't even that bad last few times until yesterday someone started the topic.

>>53568597
I have little advice anon but tell us about your local that guy

>>53565991
Track down the CofD Jojo fan supplement. I remember it being pretty good.

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>>53564330
Is there a way for Vampires to eat?

There are some thaumaturgical shenanigans which allow the vampire to eat food (among other things) without immediately chucking it back up, yes (The level 5 ritual "Gift of Life" in the "Corpse in the Monster" path, for example).

In addition, at character creation you can select "Eat Food" as a merit, which allows a vampire to eat and drink regular mortal food and even savor the taste. They still need to throw it back up before the end of the night though.

All 15th-generation Thinbloods get the "Eat Food" merit for free, and they can even force their bodies to digest it (in case they're unable to throw it up), though this costs blood.

I remember reading about a fan-created thinblood inceptor (vampires that can make new disciplines), and how his unique discipline was basically "Eat Food 2.0", to the point where he could eat and digest food without spending blood and gain some nourishment from it.

>>53568531
If its mage you dont :P Or you at least accept the fact it will get solved fast and move on to the Why and what are we going to do about it and thenot How part..

>>53569982
wow eat food discipline, my unlife is fulfilled.

Hopefully he got crisped when other vampires found out cos what a faggot.

>>53570014
Eh? Mage is all about investigating stuff but mystery needs to be hidden behind magic or stuff they can't strong arm throu without putting work in

>>53570039

Well, I mean, yeah.

It's canon that most "new" disciplines by thinbloods are either absolute crap or just slight variations of already existing vampiric traits (sometimes they're just weaker versions of already-existing but largely unknown disciplines)... but the Elders are still wary because there's a LOT of thinbloods out there, and they're shtitting their pants at the thought of one of them discovering some form of "instakill and/or diablerize ALL the elders" discipline.

I mean, they're never gonna find such a thing, but the Elders don't know that, and are scared shitless.

>>53570273
So elders need to eat all the poor pe....thin bloods

NWoD question.

If I lose the 10 again quality on all manipulation rolls, but have the 9 again quality on Subterfuge rolls

When I roll a manipulation + subterfuge roll do they cancel each other out? Do I only reroll 9's and not 10's or do I get the full benefit regardless of the prior penalty?

>>53570928
That's... A very particular question.
I'd probably just say the two effects cancel each other out.

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I'm making a VtM campaign, so I decided to draw characters to show to the players.
What do you think? Is it any good? He's supposed to be Toreador.

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>>53571336
And she's a Ventrue.

>>53570928
Loosing ten again and gaining nine again in mechani ally the same as ten again, one in ten numbers explode so it's really the same thing, and I'd just say tens explode for easiness

>>53566296
I thought beast was made for crossovers? Are the devs truly so incompetent they make the worst crossover while actively trying to make a good one?

>>53571336
>>53571363
Both look pretty nice and match the typical clan look.

>>53571615
It was. But the way they went around it is awful.
Rather than making it so inoffensive it could work with anything, it's essentially the autistic kid who talks too loud at parties and thinks he's fitting in.

>>53571615
Listen to Darker Days radio podcast of it. They talk about some of the problems with crossover mechanics and other problems with crossovers in beast

WtF 2ed The Pack is good crossover book thou

Need some ideas about DtF campaing. Not very strengh enemies, becouse PCs is new

>>53569524
Do you mean this one?

http://forum.theonyxpath.com/forum/main-category/main-forum/the-new-world-of-darkness/1071380-chosen-of-the-ripple-a-jojo-s-bizarre-adventure-game-for-chronicles-of-darkness

>>53568119
Tell me about the setting. Time period, location, etc. I'm good with concepts.

Here is a few ones

You could play a kid who literally ran off too join the circus, but it was a front for one of the Gentry & they kidnapped you to play in their own personal circus, making you perform.

A character who spent their time in Arcadia as a game piece in some Gentry's parlor. Chess, checkers, 40k, Foosball, etc

You are a tin soldier, taken from your job in the military when you were badly attacked. The military thinks you KIA, but you have warred for a thousand years, at the behest of the Gentry

The Gentry thinks themselves a fashoinista, you are her manniquin

& here are two of my characters you could use

One spent years as a horned hound of Hearne the Hunter, chasing down fleeing changlings, until he & his pack were able to escape

A male model, who was stolen by Leanansidhe to hold up a marble pillar & look like a Roman statue

>>53565491

>Lancea Sanctum is Lasombra-lite
>Ordo Dracul is Tzimisce-lite
>Invictus is Camarilla-lite
>Carthians is Anarchs-lite

This is what bothers me the most about VtR's covenants.

>>53566088

>Why is WoD so devoid of splat balance?

Because this isn't a mutliplayer fighting video game. Not to mention, the splats aren't meant to crossover directly and blatantly. If they do, they tend to be watered down versions for the most part, and in some buffed ones.

>>53571363

Is that supposed to be a cigarette? Because it looks more like lipstick.

>>53572991
See I never understood this point off view. Covenants are their own things and mix various things from both old clans and sects. Using your logic VtM Ventrue are etchnic Lasombra/Tzimisce.

>>53572991
Blah I ment >>53573139 Lasombra and Tzimisce are etchnic ventrue

>>53573014
when i sit down to play a nwod game its usually because i want to explode the themes or that particular game, if some fucking special snowflake wants to play something else then i hope my ST (or me if im ST) would say no.

Its not even about balance, if we were playing mage and somebody wanted to join playing a vampire, then hopefully he would be told to fuck off, (why do we want to carry that fuck and only do shit at night anyway).

how many people actually run crossovers? Ive never played in one for the above reasons, is it as common as it appears, is every game people run a open house of play what you fucking want???

>>53569389
Typical poor player attitude. When he plays, he looks to win, and his characters reflect that too. Min Maxed, no personality or flaws, and if one thing goes wrong with his character, he blames the GM. We've been playing with him for a couple of years since he is a decent person, but his tabletop manners are lackluster.

>>53573783
>how many people actually run crossovers?
Too many. Because it should be nobody.

>>53574003
maybe, im sure its mostly just assholes who moan about "X splat is better than my fav splat" but have never actually played in one.

Please somebody tell us stories about the fab crossover games you have been in, and how everybody contributed to the plot....I DARE YOU!

>>53573783
apparently enough that Beast was supposed to focus on it

>>53574215
Beast is full of stupid things.

>>53574215

Crossover is an immensely tempting idea because so much of our current urban fantasy fiction primes us for it. Weirdly enough, it's a harder sell to present a world where only one kind of supernatural and their related creatures exist as opposed to a kitchen sink type setting, at least from personal experience.

Personally, I'd just pull out Urban Shadows if a group I was in really wanted crossover. The WoD/CofD conversion fansplat isn't comprehensive but it is not bad at all.

>>53572991
Carthians are better than Anarchs in every fucking way and I'm an OWoD Vampfag.

Anarchs are so one note but the Carthians have a whole goddamn peer reviewing system for any alternative form of political movement you could imagine.

Unlike the Anarchs they have a fucking purpose.

>>53574812
There's an Urban Shadows conversion for WoD/CoD? Where?

>>53565950
>>53566036
Didn't the concept for the Tremere come from Ars Magica anyway?

>>53575138

I'd link but apparently the creator trashed it to give it another editing pass a few weeks ago, and I never downloaded it. It's called World of Darkness: An Urban Shadows Suppliment, so keep an eye out for when it hopefully resurfaces.

>>53575281

Yeah but they weren't vampires in that

Do we have a list of which legacies Dave intends to redo in 2e?

>>53577194
No, but it's not going to be for a good bit.

So, beyond reading the books, what are some resources I can use to learn more about the Chronicles of Darkness? Looking to run a crossover game, and I need to get a crash course in this world

>>53578364
Check out the inspirational material cited in the books.

For example, the Changeling 1ED Core mentions the Pan's Labyrinth movie, which really is excellent inspirational material.

>>53578364
I read DaveB's actual plays to get a handle of the goings ons of Awakening, so I guess you could try some actual plays if you can stomach the audio ones.

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>>53566249
>Because the splats aren't supposed to be balanced? This isn't a hard concept. If you're playing a game of Vampire, you're not supposed to be fighting Archmages, you're supposed to be fighting Vampire antagonists

Tumblr girls physically NEED to be superior to the humans that hate them so much, anon

Nerf the entire Mage game or give every vamp truck-hurling Twilight powers, nothing else can suffice.

Even bleating to themselves about "MAGES DON'T EXIST IN MY WOOOOORLD" has proven ineffective.

I am legit anticipating the 'I was gameraped at my V:TR sesh this week, a player forced me to let him play a Mage, ban all Mage books' stories any day now

>>53579242
>>53579305
wtf are you talking about

>>53579467

Mage Supremacy

>>53579467
He's talking about how only awful Marxist people who believe in forced equality think interspat balance is important.

>>53578633
Plays? Is it just centered around Mages?

>>53579620
>>53579779
No I mean where the fuck is this dumbass 'muh tumblr sjw boogeyman' coming from

None of the posts in the chain the first one is replying to talk about tumblr girls, and the second one is completely out of nowhere

I'm assuming they're the same person trying super hard to bait but holy shit is it a piss poor attempt

>>53579856

I usually associate vampfags with tumblr whores and evangelical SJWs

>>53579973
This is one desperate bait mate

>>53579856
That's OPP / New-WWs targeted demographic.

>>53580014

Except I'm not joking or baiting. Vampfags are horrendous.

>>53579827
For DaveB, yeah.

>>53579242

I'm honestly surprised they aren't bawwing about every other splat since Vamps are the weakest major template by design.

>>53578633
The Komodolord's Mage APs are what got me to give the line a try. Do recommend.

>>53580045
Magefags are just as bad, if not worse.

>>53580233

Hardly so.

>>53580191
Every other splat on Mage's powerscale is also a special snowflake otherkin so it's ok

>>53580112
Is there stuff more for stuff like Prometheans, werewolves or beast?

>>53580314
And which splats would those be?

>>53580326
You probably should look around OPP forums. I think someone was posting his games of Geist and Demon at least

>>53580314
Yeah no. Magefags are special snowflakes because they're the strongest in terms of potential and have an actual god-tier Template.

Mummy and Demon players have some actual humility.

>>53580370
To be fair they are fewer and noone is trying to force crossover with mummy and demon while there is some kind of draw to mixing everything else with I do not understand

>>53580370
>Mummy and Demon players have some actual humility.

People actually play Mummy and Demon?

Who knew?

Well, first question didn't help, then ask another - would books/fims may give some inspiration for good Demon The Fallen story? Except those one in rulebook

>>53580370
>god-tier Template.

The only other splats that have come close to having this luxury would be Beast and Changeling.

>>53580492
Prophecy with Christopher Walken has some solid owod/dtf feel

>>53580496
Vampires had god tier templates in Masquerade, but they were hardly the equals of Archmages at the higher end of play.

Requiem is kind of lackbuster.

>>53580370

>Implying we won't get a "Lord of Hell" template at some point

>>53580399

Mage and Demon actually mesh pretty well.

>>53580665
With the way Imperial Magic works I doubt we will ever see anything playable on the scale of an Archmage.

>>53580680
Does anyone even play archmages? And do we need equivalents for other splats? I play VTR as organized crime/supernatural mystery game. While I will always grab any cool powers they will give me I do not really need more power.

This is also something that bothers me in Beast. We are beasts given so much power when their main inspalt opponents would have their asses kicked by limp ghoul

>>53580472
I played Demon once.
It was fun I guess.
I also played Wraith once.
It was... confusing.

>>53580326
ChrisA has some let's plays as well they're pretty good and more creative then the usually murder orgy you get in the typical werewolf game.

>>53580680

Imagine, if you will, a Demon that can make it's own infrastructure. More than that, it IS the infrastructure it creates. This, then, is a Prince of Hell - a being that can create a world where they are the god-machine.

>>53580326
If you're willing to brave the cancer pit of RPGnet MrShopping has some good W:tF actual plays

>>53580789
I've run Archmage games before. It's a lot of fun with the right group.

I don't think other splats need a super-powered 'prestige' class. Archmages make sense within the gnostic and/or enlightenment themes of the base game.

>>53580918
That goes against how the God-Machine functions.

Won't happen. There can be only one.

>>53581103
If an Archmage perhaps created the God-Machine, then surely another Archmage can make a duplicate.

But only one will triumph over the other.
Infrastructure needs no peer.

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>>53580789
>beasts given so much power when their main inspalt opponents would have their asses kicked by limp ghoul

"In Beast: The Primordial, you are one of the Begotten: a human being with a monster's soul; not just any monster, but one of the great monsters of legend: A titan, dragon, gryphon, kraken"

ie, it's a fetish game like FATAL, conflict is not a major theme at all and combat doesn't need to be meaningful or make sense

>>53581264
I'm still salty AF at how Beast turned out. How do you fuck up "You're a monster of legend reincarnated in human form". By turning it into a tumblr otherkin blog apparently.

>>53581337
>giant muscledog mancreatures
>walking corpses that shoot knives made of blood
>eldritch mutated half-pixie
>robed dudes that hurl fireballs
>.... teenager with identity issues
sigh

Classic no-mortal-must-see-you Nossies were nixed outta Requiem

Kind of hard to have an entire splat in that niche after burning down any lore that might have ameliorated the playstyle issue

Better make them snowflake-Americans rather than, oh, blanket glamor handwaving or something interesting

>>53581337
So I know Beast fiction is fucked but can the mechanics be salvaged/can you add better fluff to it

>>53581711
It's been discussed before but if you scrapped the entire 'teaching lessons' you'd be a quarter of the way there to a decent game.

MtAs question:

I'm getting tired of my group claiming Technocracy is the saviour of humanity and defender of mankind, and Traditions are bunch of unfit troublemakers.

Can you guys tell me why, or on what account Technocracy is 'bad?' Or some negative qualities?

>>53581711
>>53581766
You could probably make a better game if you redid 80% of the lore, made the Insatiables the primary enemy, and for sure did away with the angst and the "hating a monster that feeds off human suffering is just like hating gay people."nonsense.
As for the rules, you could hack Werewolf and Demon together and probably have something more entertaining and functional then the core Beast set.

>>53581800
It can be hard as an ST when you are wrong and the players are right.

>>53581800
Unless you believe that it's a fundamental part of the human condition to be kidnapped by a Verbena, have your heart torn from your chest then blended up into a fertility potion for a 12 year old child bride then no the Technocracy is the better alternative for the common sleeper

>>53581800
What era Technocracy are you playing?
Pre-Dimensional Anomaly?
Post-Dimensional Anomaly?
After the Revised Convention books?

Because respectively, their flaws are:
1. Ancient Masters of the order solve problems heavy handedly and think mind-wiping everyone is a good plan. The Union is still mostly run by tyrannical dickbags who have lost sight of their pure original intentions.

2. The Union's going to shit because all those powerful assbags previously mentioned have been lost behind the Anomaly. Desperate times call for desperate measures, and the Union has not yet stopped hemorrhaging. They're desperate, and desperate people can be extremely dangerous.

3. The Union has been renewed, refreshed. Sure we can't really reach Deep Space like we used to... And like, nobody but a few Void Engineers ever come back when they do go out. Sure the Syndicate's butting heads with the NWO like never before and the Iterators are still in mourning over the loss of Autocthonia. Factionalism, Rogue Elements, and the fact that the NWO still refuses to stop mind-wiping Traditionalists and turning them into shock troops are the main flaws.

>>53581800

Because what the Traditions do is entirely possible in the World of Darkness. They could simply will a better world into being, one without the police state bullshit of the Technocracy, and the Technocracy prevents them from doing so.

Well, they could do the above if they weren't so hung up on, well, tradition. >>53582345 points this out by example. The problem with the Trads is right in their name.

>>53581800
The Union is "Bad" because Ascension was written by a bunch of 90's era hippies who thought being made to work 9 to 5 for "The Man" was worse then living in a feudal hellhole run by psychotic manchildren (AKA Hermetics)

>>53582345

Is a Mage not entitled to the results of his own will? No, says the Traditionalist, it belongs to the People. No, says the Technocrat, it belongs to the State. No, says the Nephandus, it belongs to God. I rejected those answers; instead, I chose something different. I chose the impossible. I chose... Madness.

What is a good group for a technologically inclined mage in CofD? Cause if the Free Council is the only option ILloyd just shoot my character in the head, Tumblr run liberties & deviants aren't what I'm looking for. I'm looking for old school mechanics & hot shot pilots, backyard DIYers & thoughtful engineers, just with magic/magitek. Also not particularly looking for people who are crazy about awakening everyone like the Free Council is

>>53582849
And Diamond order would work really.
Just try to mesh technology with one of their philosophies.

Though if you're tetchy about caring too much about Awakenings, then avoid the Silver Ladder.

>>53582849
Literally any of them

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>>53572991
OK you're totally missing the point. Like, entirely. Did you read the covenant books? Let me take every point you've got here and examine it.

>Lancea Sanctum are Lasombra-lite
I think you mean 'Sabbat with less babyraping'. They're a highly religious, spiritual covenant with a driving purpose to enact Gods will on earth. They also pack an insane punch in the form of blood magic, and their religious beliefs vary from region to region.
>Ordo Dracul is Tzimisce-lite
You mistake transformation as being the same as transcendence. Fleshcrafting is far, far different from the Coils of the Dragon. The entire goal of the Ordo is to transcend the nature of vampirism and see what lies beyond it.
>Invictus is Camarilla-lite
The Invictus is the Camarilla. They aren't the lite diet version of it, they ARE the Camarilla, just the Camarilla in a world where there's more sects and less clans. The Invictus are just as ruthless, just as strict in enforcing the traditions, just as deeply intwined with the mortals, and just as twisted as the Camarilla.
>Carthians is Anarchs-lite
The Anarch Movement is very very different from the Carthians. The Carthians are less about saying 'FUCK THE MAN' and more about organizing and exploring new forms of Kindred society. They constantly experiment for good or ill, and adapt modern forms of government to suit their needs. Communist and fascist rub shoulders in the Carthians and both approach the same goal from different directions: utopia.

>>53583159
>I think you mean 'Sabbat with less babyraping'.

>implying the babyraping isn't the part that makes the Sabbat the Sabbat

>>53582849

None have quite the tech focus of the council, but it could work in any order.

>>53583418
Don't get me wrong, the Lancea Sanctum can be just as monstrous as the Sabbat in terms of horrible brutality, it's just that they don't view it in the same way. They're brutal because they believe god's will is to have them punish and brutalize the mortals who walk astray. The Sabbat are brutal as fuck because FREEDOM.

It's the difference between a serial killer and a contract killer. Sure, both kill people but one does it for pleasure, the other because it's his job.

>>53568119

Do you have any preferences as far as kith and seeming goes? Any more information about the game so we can have a reference point for what sort of character you're looking for?

>>53583511
>>53583103
>>53582979
>>53582849

Also, consider joining the Nameless Order.

You still have people to rely on and do magic bullshit with, but no marching orders that come from the Pentacle or Seers.

>>53583672
Any downsides?

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Life 4
Matter 4 to be a shapeshifter right?

>>53583912
Matter is optional but makes things more interesting. Changing your wear alongside your physical form is pretty awesome.

>>53582849
Man did they butcher the FC that bad in 2e? 1e Free Council is just what you're looking for.

>>53583912
Life 3 can modify aspects of your being, such as adding tentacles, wings, gills and so forth.

Life 3, Matter 3 can add aspects of inanimate objects to your body, through incorporating them. Such as implanting a smartphone in your head and granting yourself a direct neural interfact to it, as well as a HUD.
It could ostensibly also add properties of inert matter to your body, such as adding the imperviousness of titanium to your skin without compromising any other functions of your body.

Life 4 can remake your body into any living organism. You can turn wholesale into any lifeform that either exists, or that you design. Just ensure that you design it properly so you don't collapse under your own weight, and stay within the scale factor.

Life 4, Matter 4 can remake your living form into any inanimate matter, or any state in between. You could become a being entirely constituted of some form of biological, semi-fluid titanium. A gaseous being, or just turn yourself into diamond.

FC isn't tumblr libertines. They are mash up of everything that human culture has to offer. There are probably conservatives/capitalists/communists/nazis/atheists/religious in there. The only reason they haven't imploded is because their shared hate for the Seers.

>>53583823

Yeah, no High Speech or Rote Specialties unless you buy them. But you can buy whichever ones you want.

>>53584029
Also no Order Status, which can be used to requisition sweet, sweet Awakened merits, like imbued/enhanced items, hallows, sleepwalker retainers, grimoires and so forth.

Every individual with Status 3 can for example permanently request the assistance of a 1-dot Sleepwalker helper/retainer.
It only gets better as you get more advanced as well.

Man it's good to have rank in an Order.

>>53584021

And shared devotion to the fallen world. Their main idea is that humanity is magical, meaning human works have supernal merit. You wouldn't find Nazis though, see Operation Oracle.

>>53584060

If you're doing it for the perks you should join the Seers. For ideals, pick the Pentacle. For yourself, go Nameless. And that's not counting the grubby little groups that also get called "nameless orders."

>>53584065
what book would Operation Oracle be in?

>>53584021
I don't have a pic to share but isn't their introduction art a fucking pride parade?

>>53584130

Mage Noir

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>>53584145

>>53584145
yes but if you actually read the fluff FC is more than just Tumblr. The authors are liberals of course they don't want to show the conservative/right-wing/capitalist portions of the Order.

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>>53584145
Yeah, and the Arrow one is a bundle of C-Grade Batman villains planning their next heist.

You really can't take that shit seriously.

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Best art in the book

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>>53584249
Then post a quality version of it.

>>53584249
>>53584284
I don't see the vampire stripper

Are they ever realizing Hunter 20e?

>>53584311
Why would you ever want a vampire stripper? Just get a normal human. At least with a human you could get a lapdance without it feeling like your dick is being shoved against an icebox

>>53584311
>I don't see the vampire stripper

She was at the soiree earlier. The picture was taken before the Seers turned her into furniture. Now she's the couch.

>Join the Seers
>Sleepers are your playthings

Anyone have Beast: Building A Legend?

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>>53565149

>>53584695
Go fuck yourself

>>53584695
Lol what?
I see it as about

Mage
Demon
Werewolf Changling
Vampire Geist Promethean
Hunter Half-Templates
Mortal
Hero
Hobgoblin
Drugged out homeless
Defenseless child
Earthworms
Beast

>>53585025
>>53584711
Shhh it's okay.

Not everyone can be fabulous half-fae

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>>53585025
>>53584695
hunters number one

>>53585333
I can support this

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When I told the man that the punishment for a masquerade breach was dying, the poor guy just fell to pieces

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Virtue: Cunning
Vice: Tyrannical
Aspiration: Enslave Other Races, Consume Brains, Flesh-Craft Aberrations

Mental Attributes: Intelligence 8, Wits 7, Resolve 8
Physical Attributes: Strength 2, Dexterity 5, Stamina 2
Social Attributes: Presence 4, Manipulation 6, Composure 6

Skills: Academics 2, Crafts 1, Investigation (Espionage) 4, Medicine 2, Occult (Psionics) 4, Politics 3, Science (Genetic Engineering) 3, Athletics 1, Brawl (Claws And Tentacles) 2, Larceny 1, Stealth 2, Weaponry 1, Empathy 1, Expression 2, Intimidation 4, Persuasion 3, Subterfuge (Mind Games) 4

Merits: Area Of Expertise 1 (Mind Games, Espionage), Indomitable 2, Interdisciplinary Specialty 1 (Mind Games, Espionage), Trained Observer 3, Iron Will 2, Pusher 1, Table Turner 1, Untouchable 1, Fighting Finesse 1 (Claws And Tentacles)

Health: 7 (Size 5)
Willpower: 23
Defense: 6
Initiative: 11
Speed: 12 (Species Factor 5)
Potency: 7

Dread Powers: Hypnotic Gaze, Madness And Terror, Psychic Talent 3* (Aura Reading 3, Clairvoyance 3, Telepathy 5, Telekinesis 5, Psychokinesis 5)

*Psychic Talent: Creatures with this dread power are endowed with great powers of the Mind. Each dot in this Dread Power grants a creature a number of Merit dots equal to its Potency. These Merit dots may be used to purchase supernatural merits. The Supernatural Merits listed above are just examples of the psychic powers that Mind Flayers might possess

>>53580348
>>53580951
>>53580873
Got links?

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>For Ascension game decide Quintessance is an accepted currency on Horizon, alongside US Dollars, Yuan, Euros, etc.
>Calculate the total quantity of Quintessance produced by the Earth per year in my setting.
>Now Ether/Chi/etc is worth its weight in gold.

What are the odds one of my players abuses this to get old wizard money?

>>53586391
BTW, I forgot Mortal Mask, Blast, Hallucination and Regenerate 1. At the ST’s discretion, Mind Flayers may possess Advanced, Epic and Styled Supernatural Merits.

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Have you ever borrowed from traditional mythology for inspiration?

>>53586507
https://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?446663-Werewolf-The-Forsaken-quot-Detroit-Rock-City-quot

>>53573783
I have been doing such a thing. I bent a lot of shit but so far it is working great and everyone is having a tonne of fun.

The reason why it came about was I had so many people in my club wanting to play different splats. SO I decided that if there were people out there who knew about the splats and what they did, why not hire them for their particular skills. I gave them only 2 rules, 1st edition rules only, and your character must not have any affiliations with any of their own splats, Vamps all hate their sires, Changelings never found a freehold or court, etc.

They are all working for Eurydice, an organisation for hunting down rogue splats capturing or neutralizing them. It is more about the team working together against horrors that they know, or tapping into power they don’t understand.

Currently we have a hunter, a changeling, a vampire and a mage.

>>53580472
Mummy is good for one player games. I run those sometimes, and i got a friend to run Mummy, chasing after an qncient relic that was a golden coin. It was cool

Do supernatural splats suffer tilts from using firearms? e.g. a group of woofs and vampires get in a scuffle and empty an ak-47 into each other, do they suffer the deafened tilt for firing a weapon full auto inside an enclosed space?

>>53587009
probably more so if they are using auspex or have heighened senses.

why wouldnt they suffer? What makes you think they wont?

>>53587009
technically by raw though you dont get those tilts just for firing weapons in enclosed spaces, so that would be a ST call.

>>53567114
>While the Underworld and Shadow seem to be a 'natural' part of the world, the Hedge and Arcadia seem almost like a parasitic attachment to it. A "lesser" lower depth which has somehow taken root and connected to reality.
>I wonder what element it would be argued is missing from Arcadia though.
>Certainty?

In Imperial Mysteries, there is a section about the "Old Gods of the Thristle:" a bunch of rank 7 fate based Supernal creatures who haven't got the memo that the Exarchs have taken over, and kidnap Sleepers to use as play-toys.

>>53587103
They were originally meant to be the True Fae before the 2e semi-retcon.

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>>53579856
Spotted the tumblrfat.
You have to go back.

>>53581800
Fans of MtAc generally fall into two groups; those who like the Traditions and think the Technocracy are evil for wanting to destroy magic and destroy people's ability to have dreams and live to their full potential, and those who like the Technocracy and think the Traditions are dangerous lunatics because they'd reduce the world to a chaotic hell-hole without medicine or indoor plumbing. There's a lot of good arguments on both sides; the Technocracy, as written, really is quite bad. Brainwashing, torture, giant mecha powered by Imperial Japanese Army war-criminals, World War II, the trans-Atlantic slave trade, genocides, colonialism... all very bad. However, at the same time, despite having the authors on their side, the Traditions have a very questionable end-goal; accomplishing their goals is almost always dependent on destroying the scientific Consensus, and by some interpretations this will also remove all the benefits of science and replace them with a reliance on mages for all your medicine and indoor plumbing needs. Exactly what the consequences of defeating the Technocracy are, and whether there was a moral imperative to do so because of its evils, and so forth, are pretty complex debates that are pretty interesting and reveal a lot about the way modern Western society engages with the world. At least if people are capable of arguing their points properly, which is not always.

>>53587125
What retcon? I'm not aware of it.

>>53587704
The two Arcadias were supposedly the same place before second edition hit.

>>53587734
>>53587704
Yeah BrucatoMage got his wizard boner in a twist over the notion of the Supernal Realms being actual realms and decided the realms of Platonic Forms had to be really spiritual and source-codey and so here we are.

>>53587750

I much prefer the new Supernal.

So on the topic of unconventional solutions to problems, can a vampire in theory live through destroying their own eardrums with surgical tools and then growing them back later?

>>53587734
No, they were mentioned as possibly being the same location, or one was a derivation of the other.

However they decided that was retarded, and also didn't fit into 2e's innate ability to detect the Supernal nature of any power given a complete analysis with Focused Mage Sight.

So they had to definitively say no, they are completely differnt.

>>53588080
yes?

>>53588080
yes

>>53580496
>>53580622
>>53580665
>>53580680
>>53580789
Given how indistinct imperial spells are it's actually really really easy to make archmage tier anythings if you ever felt the need.
Just make some vague evolution scenario that only people with power stat 6+ can reach, and then say that gives them access to powers that are as strong as they need to be but you have to go on a special quest to obtain the ability to use each one. Hunting rank 6+ spirits would work for werewolf to get powerful gifts, for vampire say that you can do a faux version of diablere to humans to absorb their souls and make new disciplines but the person has to be of a very particular sort for it to work.

>>53588114
>>53588119
Neat.
What sort of medicine roll would that be to not fuck it up super hard?

>>53587750
I don't think Brucato has ever written for Awakening

>>53588204
If this is requiem it will regenerate by itself w/ vitae and day sleep.

>>53588204
Dex + Medicine? Maybe Int + medicine to come up with the procedure then dex medicine to do it, with successes added as dice from the int + med roll?

I would probably also require a willpower point if your doing it to yourself without pain relief

>>53588278
Also be a breaking point roll in 2e requiem

>>53587750
Mage 2ed was Dave B. I don't think brucato ever worked on it

>>53565413
In VtM you are a comic book character in a comic book universe, with comic book rules. It's a long running comic book, with a well established metaplot, well established characters, and the PCs are placed generally as neonates or fledglings trying to make their place with the weight of all that history on top of them..

In VtR2e, you are playing a vampire, in a shadowy, much more open, mysterious, nebulous world, where you and the StoryTeller have the double edged sword of more freedom and more responsibility for fleshing out the world, and making that story.

My group loves the new version, hated the original. I like em both, they're good at what they do, though I think they really do different things.

>>53566088
White Wolf can't do mechanics. Never could. Maybe the new iteration, Kenneth Hite can work something decent into the system, but doubtful. A white wolf game with sound mechanics, much mess any semblance of balance, wouldn't be a White Wolf game. Though in some senses, intersplat imbalance was intentional (in oWoD at least, werewolves were supposed to rip vampires to shreds) for instance.

Question about 'operation oracle' why did the free council try to rescue member of the pantechnicon? I thought the council hated all seers even more than other pentacle factions?

Isn't the great refusal and their hatred of the Seers what lead to the formation of the pentacle?

>>53581503
What the fuck are you getting on about? Classic nossies are absolutely a part of requiem, you dumbass faggot. They just broadened nature their discomforting/disquieting characteristics from the standard physiological, which are still a part of the template, to other, more psychological/less tangible aspects. Nosferatu are monsters, terrifying, disquieting, horrifying monsters, that aren't going to be just strolling out in the open under normal circumstances.

>>53583418
It's not rape if the baby is bound with the vinculum.

#babyghoullovers2017

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>>53589020

>>53586885
Fuck rpg.net - that place is a den of fucking sjw faggot nutcakes. Seriously it is run by the worst people ever, worse than reddit

>>53589090
Oh it's absolute cancer, it makes fucking tumblr seem like sane and well adjusted people. which makes the few good games there all the more depressing.

>>53588935
I've long seen the Free Council's supposedly intense hatred of the seers following the great refusal as a bit of a dramatic exaggeration.

The great refusal nearly didn't even happen. For sure, service to the exarchs is wholly incompatible with Free Council philosophies, probably more so than the Diamond orders, but they don't have the same history of being adversaries to the Seers that the diamond has.

The Free Council hasn't lost as much to the Seers, nor have they ever really experienced being on the losing side of the war with them. They harry and assault the Seers because that's the side they picked in the war, and the Seers should be stamped out, but they are a lot more inclined to be sympathetic to individuals within the Seers than other orders, since they have an order of magnitude less history and prejudice to hold against them.

If they were presented with an opportunity to take in Seer defectors, they would take it in a heartbeat.

Honestly, there's a lot of big cultural differences worth playing up between the Free Council and the Diamond. For instance, the Diamond generally seek to coexist peacefully with other supernatural hierarchies in their cities, reasoning that even though say, vampires are gross, if they were ever existentially threatened they could replicate out of control before the Mages could put a stop to them, so it's better to maintain a good relationship with the local domain.

Whereas the Council were only convinced to stop torching Vampires on sight very recently, because they don't have that same institutional experience to teach them that it isn't really an effective enough way to keep them under control, and that the price of war, even with weaker supernaturals, can be extremely high.

So i like reading actual plays.
Are there any Beast Actual plays that are worth reading/watching/listening too?

I think im wasting far to much of my time trying to wrap my head around Beasts, wtf do they do? Why other than wanting to play otherkin fantasies do people want to play them?

Can anybody enlighten me via actual plays?

>>53589332
Occasionally Beasts fight horrible creatures like people that say mean things on the internet, or college girls that run group counsels.

Is /wodg/ the only place where we can actually discuss WoD without any SJWs injecting their PC diarrhea?

>>53589293
How unified Free Council is in terms of ideology and hierarchy?

>>53589431
We get retard kneejerkers like you instead, so it balances out.

>>53589431
If you mean that you can herp derp about how sjw fucked your dog becouse sidebars then yeah this is the place

>>53589456
Fuck you too, turd burger.

>>53589332
>wtf do they do?

Torture people under the guise of "teaching them life lessons", and bitching and moaning when they're called out on it.

The best thing about the Beast anthologies is that at least one writer picked up on this and wrote a Beast character that was everything Beasts should be and had the other characters (a bunch of Prometheans, IIRC) absolutely realize it.

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>>53589496
It's burglar, anon. Turd BURGLAR.

The insult is meant to imply a thief that penetrates (other men's) asses, as if to steal their turds. You know, as a barely oblique reference to male penetrative sex.

Turd burger makes zero sense.

You fecal hotdog.

>>53589566

The best part of the Beast Anthology actually was Premeditation, the Mage fiction written by DaveB. It just happen to guest star an annoying beast and a changing breed cat, and they all went on a road trip through the astral hunting another even worse beast.

The Anthology was yet another piece of evidence of Mage supremacy and, more importantly, raised the question why mages haven't done the CofD a favor and scoured the planet of the beast pestilence.

>>53589651
>evidence of Mage supremacy

Nah, he only threatened to kill the Beast and she was still able to affect him and threaten him right back. Proper Mage supremacy would mean the story would have lasted all of about three pages max.

>>53581711
The Lair/power mechanics are great. I genuinely enjoy them

So apparently there was some Mage supplement that made Paths obsolete?

Anyone know the name, I can't see it in the pastebin megas

>>53565491
>And the setting doesn't assume there are turbo-powered Mages who can come along a butt-fuck your undead existence inside out, and want to harvest your blood for Magic juju.

I think you're a bit mixed up there, either that or that's a rather dramatic shift in Requiem from 1e to 2e. 1e World of Darkness made the default assumption that VtR, MtA, WtF, and so on all existed in the same world, they just didn't have overlapping metaplots.

Whereas in VtM, MtA, WtA, and so on, each COULD be run alongside one another, but as each had mutually exclusive metaplots, the default assumption was that while Masquerade might have werewolves, they're not the Apocalypse werewolves; and it has mages but not necessarily Ascension mages.

>>53589675
In promethean story beast gets shot in the face so there's that

>>53589747
Eh but were there not overlapping parts of the metaplot? LIke creation of tremere or even the week of nightmares?

>>53589444
Like, obviously they aren't, given that a major schtick of theirs is uniting a few hundred oddball once-legacies and minor sects that didn't align with the orders into one entity, but there are a few tenets of "What we, as Mages, do" that are fundamental to being a part of the Free Council, which is why there are still apostates at all besides reapers or child molesters or whatever.

Generally speaking the core Free Council philosophies with respect to the role of sleepers in the cosmology of the setting are going to be shared by everyone. It's kind of their thing. Caucus? Well it's what they came up with to deal with coordinating everyone so you'd damn well better like non-fascist non-monarchist government. Embracing technology? Not every member of the Free Council will lean quite as hard into this since some of them are descended from ancient nameless orders that may actually have had a luddite streak, but criticism of technology would have to be limited to specific criticisms of specific implementations rather than technology as a whole, since it's again a precept that sleepers will eventually set us free by making everything possible through technology.

Beyond that, things start to get very hazy. Blank Badges co-exist besides people who are, well, the exact opposite of Blank Badges. And both would be considered exemplars of Free Council doctrine.

The Free Council stand totally united on a small handful of things, and their stance on the anything else is muddled out hazily between the specific balance of power between cabals at the time via their caucuses.

>>53589731
The Storyteller's Guide from 1e provides some options for the *non-canon* scenario that the GM doesn't want to run paths.

Like honestly, I'd be fucking tempted. I'm not totally convinced it adds a lot to the game, save that it means there is a countable number of defined supernal realms to draw imagery and other bullshit from.

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Being a child is admiring Nines

Being an adult is realizing Ming Xiao was right about the Kindred being purposeless parasite that are better off not existing

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>>53589090
>that place is a den of fucking sjw faggot nutcakes

what a post this was

>>53590753
So naturally it is the worst site to discuss anything WoD related

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>>53590767

>a den of fucking sjw faggot nutcakes

Is PC culture really so terrible regarding WW/OPP products?

>>53590818
Not always (see Changeling 20th for a fairly good way to handle it), but often enough that it can be pretty groanworthy.

>>53590818
Fuck yes it is. I can barely post on the actual damn forums because of how bad it is.

>>53590831
Makes one wonder what are you trying to post there

>>53590851
Probably because one has to tip-toe their way around posts so as to not trigger some tranny.

>>53590898
Oh is that so?

>>53590947
Very much so

>>53590969
Pity I never noticed it.

The worst part of OPP forums I've seen thus far are people defending the Beast and people who think strix make good antagonists

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What's with all the bait comments?

>>53584213
Why can't Americans do anything without involving it with politics?

>>53590736
Basically.
Also, has anyone played a Kuei-jin campaign?

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>>53590736
Being an adult is admiring the brave Prince for accepting the arduous task of retaking the lawless Free States and shelter the misguided Anarchs in the Ivory Tower.

>>53591410
yes. If you subtract some of the crossover-shit and ignore most of the corebook, it can be really fun

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>>53591423

>>53590736

>Kuei Jin
>bland and uninspired "Le Asian vampires"
>arrogant to the point where it is retarded
>invading foreign lands
>betraying you in the end

Yeah no camarilia is by far the best choice.

>inb4 anarchs

Nooope. Retarded utopian fuckers trying to use society models that failed for humans on superpowered undeads tormented by their beast.

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>>53592407

>>53592418

>Anarchs
Strange that all successful anarch free states closely resemble the Camarillia on organization and basically use the same rules.

>>53592457
The big difference is that younger vampires have much more power and freedoms in the Free States than those in the Camarilla.

Are seemings in 2e pre-durance determined?

>>53566038
Pretty sure that would require a Humanity roll, considering flushing cheeks, sexy stuff, and TRYING TO BREATHE is also usually necessitates a humanity roll

>>53592681
What about stuff like gaining/losing weight, eating, drinking, sex...? Some things make no sense, so is there a way around them?

I want to add to Bloodlines craze that Strauss gives you nicer haven then prince.

>>53592747
The Prince gives you a haven regardless of your clan, while Strauss puts you in his chantry where he can control you and indoctrinate you into the Tremere's conspiracy.

>>53592839
Hey I enjoy tremere conspiracy

>>53592747
>>53592418
Strauss and the camarillia are the best choice. also he's actually fucking nice to you, or at least polite and respectful.
The malk diaglog when you first meet him is great

>>53592743
In VtM vamps can only do the last one, and even then feeding on people is better so they rarely bother. In VtR I'm pretty sure the Ordo Dracul can do all of those things to some degree.

>>53593128
In vtr Blush of Life allows you to ingest drink/food and have sex. Coils mostly help you deal with various downsides like sun,fire or blood bonds

>>53593202
In all the games ive run, Blush of Lofe has been used entirely to get close to difficult prey

>>53593393
Well that is probably why it's there. And too fool medical exams

>>53592522
No, in the 2e dev material (that could be scrapped, they are dropping what is reported to be up to 70% of hills works) it is based right at the tail end of your durance, i.e. your escape and taking back of agency. If you didn't do that you don't have a seeming.

>>53590151

I liked the Warlocks of Arcadia hack.

>>53565201
Wouldn't it just be an ass load of matter and forces, since those are the two things irl one needs to make space ships. Mages can just bypass the materials science aspects and probably deliberately weaken gravity or skip over the speed of light to make them sci fi accurate ships.

>>53566296
Yet another thing Beast tries to steal from another splat and fails in the execution of?

I need ideas for a vampire neonate for a game set in 90s London. Camarilla clans only.

>>53594448
Former junkie Ventrue who can only feed on other junkies.
Malkavian gangster with delusions of grandeur.
Toreador punk age relic.
Ex-Provo Brujah.

>>53584021

The Free Council believes humanity is magical and that humans can latch on to glimpses of Supernal Truth just by dint of being human. If they share that with others, others build on it, add to it, and make something great.

The Free Council as a whole also believes that hierarchy fosters the Lie and that ALL humans are capable of magical insight, not just some. As such, libertines are more likely to probably lean towards modern inclusivity.

At the same time, libertines are also prone to groupthink, which means they'll turn tribalist as hell at the drop of a hat. Hence, once they're in a group, that group is awesome and the best. I recall one example from Tome of the Mysteries of a magical style being a Marxist libertine who angrily ranted from Das Kapital to empower his spells.

That said, the Free Council could and probably should have a really diverse membership. Religious traditions are a huge part of what they have, with the Council heavily populated by things like Mages who ascribe a more orthodox interpretation of a Sleeper religion, for example.

I imagine there might also be Communist or Nazi libertines somewhere, but I imagine they're quite rare, if they exist at all. Hierarchy fosters the Lie, after all, and that casts sharp doubt on both to begin with, even without Awakening demonstrating no racial bias and thus probably making any Mages who bow to the swastika far more likely to get a frosty reception wherever they go.

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>>53566038

They can, and many do.

By VtM rules, lighting a cigarette isn't enough to activate Rotschreck, simply because the vampire feels in control of the situation ("I am not in danger at the moment"), though they might still be wary of said fire. The moment a lit cigarette is brandished dangerously close to their face is another thing entirely.

Same applies to candles, etc. Seeing a lit candle or a campfire isn't gonna make you go "FIRE, REEEEEEEEEEEE" unless your character is already under loads of stress, already scared shitless or being threatened with harm-by-fire.

Well, unless they're playing a character lost to their beast, then all bets are off.

>>53592743
>What about stuff like gaining/losing weight, eating, drinking, sex...?

Gaining/losing weight is only an option if you decide to go under the knife... the knife of a fleshcrafting Tzimisce or a random vamp who learned Vicissitude. And if you're a Nosferatu, any such surgeries would only last a single night.

Vampires can GENERALLY only drink blood, and regular food tastes like shit, so it's instantly regurgitated.

That said, there are some exceptions. Having the "Eat Food" merit lets you eat and drink regular food and savor its taste, but you can't digest it, so you have to throw it back up later.

The Followers of Set are capable of brewing an alchemical elixir which is basically "blood beer", which is something vampires can drink and get drunk on. It's

But yes, vampires in general can only drink blood. That said, if they're drinking the blood of someone who's recently been drinking a lot alcohol, or smoking a few cigarettes, or doing drugs, then they can experience a short "high" due to it being laced into the blood, and can even get addicted to it.

As for sex... Yeah, lots of vampires can (and do) have sex, though mostly only the ones on the Path of Humanity. If nothing else, it's a great way to feed, and it still feels good to have sex (though blood is just infinitely better to a vampire).

>>53590124
I really wish we can get on order supplement for 2e for the FC since they've changed the most since 1e.

>>53594643
>Mages who bow to the swastika
Isn't that what The Daksha are?

>ALL humans are capable of magical insight,
The Echo Walkers would agree.

>>53594908

Oh! And I forgot, Thinblooded vamps of the 15th generation get "Eat Food" merit for free, and can even digest it if they spend a bit of blood.

Due to the weakening of the Curse of Caine, they are also more susceptible to random mutations and variations of the blood, which means that suddenly you might get a vampire who *can* gain or lose weight and stuff like that. I mean, 15th Gens can already father (and bear) children with living humans, and some Thinbloods don't even become truly *immortal*, but instead gain a slowed-down aging effect, so it'd hardly be the weirdest thing to exist in the Thinblood community.

>>53595022

The Daksha are usually found in the Mysterium, not the Free Council, and they're considered uncomfortably close to Left-Handed by most Mages; in no small part thanks to how many of its members keep getting found to be proponents of the Jnnanamukti heresy.

How would you stat an Annanuki from the Abyss? Does anyone have examples of prestatted ones?

>>53595089

Anyone with a good idea how Vamps of the 13th generation can embrace normal vamps of the 14th generation but thinbloods are still a thing?

>>53595310
Does it matter? Anannuki are like the personification of GM fiat.

>>53595906
A 14th gen has a 50% chance of being thinblood.

A 15th gen has 100%.

>>53596045
Thats still somewhat gehenna like to me.

I want the Vampiric bloodline to just continue.

Thinbloods should be more of a mutation/random occurence.

I thought about that people who had untapped hunter potential become thinbloods because they are more able to resist the curse.

But unsure about that idea

>>53596106
Well shaking off the gehenna thing is a bit hard since the game is pervaded by a millenialistic THE END IS NIGH feeling

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>>53596106
>I want the Vampiric bloodline to just continue.

Fun fact: It is continuing.

In the upcoming V20 book, Beckett's Jyhad Diary, there's evidence of a 16th generation starting to rise, and some thinblooded members of the 14th generation are instead becoming fully-fledged vampires and spontaneously developing clan-features.

Basically, to make a long story short, vampiric blood slowly (VEEEEEEERY slowly) becomes more potent with age. That's why 13th generation vampires were considered thinbloods during the Dark Ages, but a thousand years later thinbloods are instead found in the 14th and 15th generations.

So, you know, if your players averted Gehenna, then have no fear, the vampiric "race" will live on.

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>>53592510
>Wanting to give power to the Neonates
...and that's why it will always be shit.

>>53589332

Matt, the actual Dev had one up on Rpg.net.

But basically nothing happened. Proving that even the developer had no idea what to do with Beast.

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>>53596312

Ehhhh thats not even bad but not quite what i am aiming for.

Blood potency (even very slow one) seems to be more of VtR thing.

But i might consider it.


on of the core concepts of my version of the CWoD is that the whole hunter schtick is not enginered by some supernatural angels but is more of a human immune reaction become far more common because much more vampires exist due to urbanization and much higher populations.

My mythology is somewhat changed anyway. If people are interested i can post a quick overview.

>>53596477
Hey yeah lets give the young ones the power is retarded in human socities. Much more so in a vampiristic society that basically depends on conservatism and stability.

>>53596477
I'm not condoning them, I just try to explain their reasoning to elder Kindred who are not familiar with the events of the last couple of centuries

>>53591380
Same reason nobody else can these days.

>>53591423
Needs more bloody nose.

>>53596661
well the oWoD is better is setting wise in almost eveything always use nWod Changelings and hunters

>>53596687
In my Dark ages you needed to work hard, serve your elder for centuries killing all of his enemies just to prove you were worth it. This nights every stupid Neonate things he has the right to command a territory just because someone embrace him.
Disgusting.

Leaked footage from the new paradox CoD vidya
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6M6samPEMpM

>>53587323
>colonialism
>bad
you had me until this point

>>53596790
Man, I miss the 90's

No seasonal courts in changeling 2e?

>>53596790
If you want to know what happens in your local chantry

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FyYMAFTmK8A&t=9s

>>53596811
im glad I amused

>>53596729

>well the oWoD is better is setting wise in almost eveything

>always use nWod Changelings and hunters

Meh i don't really like crossovers. When other supernaturals exist i create a backstory that fits the mainsplat.

>>53596929
And i agree. The oWoD is much better setting wise. nWoD never was my cup of tea.

>>53596811
>>53596874
so the vampire werewolf and mummy are obvious what splat do you think the phantom of the opera dude would be, geist? promethian?

>>53596987
Promethean I think

>>53596987
also the lizard dude

>>53597013
Changeling

>>53596987
Now I'm thinking if Dr. Jekyll/Mr. Hyde would be a Mage that went to far or a sorcerer that fucked up things.

>>53597013
>>53597032

Supposed to be a Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde reference.

>>53597053
but what splat anon?

>>53597066
Changeling probably.

>>53597074
so a vampire and promethean a werewolf a mummy and a changling holdign a dance off. this would be the perfect thing to spring on your players on april first

>>53597257

>>53596743

Legion is such a good show.

>>53597037
Could be a Beast who does mental gymnastics around their shitty nature. Making them a more interesting one than most