/anrg/ - Android Netrunner General

Fucked up the Old bread:
>>53371975

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Now that the dust is settled, how do you handle the spendable Legacy aspect of Terminal Directive?

>>53477040
put every sticker on labeled pieces of paper
sleeve your cards with the stickered pieces of paper on top of them

>>53477040

Someone at the club made printable shits for everything. Can put papers in sleeves. Just keep a DO NO OPEN decks of card available and in order.

>Is Android Netrunner a good implementation of the Tech Noir setting?

I don't remember Tech Noir *having* a setting proper.

I do think the system could work well for Netrunner if you set up the proper Transmissions.
Game is good, and actually might be a good fit, but I never liked much running it myself.

I know we've talked already, but really, from what we've seen of the cards so far, where do you see the HB ID going on Mars?

I have a feeling the NBN one is going to be as yellow journalism as can get, and from the cards is going to be about getting richer in one way or another I think (could have been making the runner poorer I guess, but SYNC and Spark already exist...).

Given how cool the rest of the cycle has been, I have high hopes for the unrevealed IDs.

>>53478542

The whole sticker sheets can fit into card sleeves, so just sleeve 'active' ones as needed. The 3-offs can just be left out as a reminder for both sides.

>>53480445
Are we getting an ID for every faction this cycle? It would be a waste if we don't but the lack of talk or hints from the teams makes me wonder.

>>53482247

Looking back at the cycle announcement, I found nothing to support the claim, though for some reason I was certain there was going to be one ID per faction.

Maybe I assumed wrongly though.

>>53480445
The newest Earth's Scion blurb on the FFG page mentions a lot about warroids and how they don't have the "don't kill humans" directive, so HB's will likely be related to that. NBN seems to be going the brainwashing angle, don't know how they'll implement that.

>>53483242

Thematically, the NBN brainwash seems a likely candidate. Good call.

Looking at card effects on NBN this cycle, looks like something about resources to me though. Hopefully not draw power?

So anyone played in a Cache refresh event yet?

>>53484811

Hasn't been gaining any traction here, which I find kinda weird, (but then we've already been going at it with our no Core experiment, I guess, though I would have expected the competitive types to at least give the format a try).

What really surprises me is how little talk there is about it locally. No mindshare capture - which is sad, because I think it's a decent idea.

Though we've always been a weird meta, so I wouldn't expect us to be representative.

>>53485020

No core sounds pretty brutal for any list. Even the mini factions are hard pressed without stuff from there.

But yeah Cache is pretty interesting so far, with far more shapers and few anarchs runner side. The lack of Jackson is rather obvious corp side.

>>53485349

The neutral cards hurt a lot, and there's been a lot of debate about adding them back, but we stick with it for now. Quite like it myself.

>The lack of Jackson is rather obvious corp side.

And I'm of the opinion that it's a good thing, but hey...

>>53485419

The only neutral card that everyone will miss would be sure gamble. Everything else could probably be substituted elsewhere. Not an ideal situation though.

The lack of Jackson does make things a lot more dicey for the corps. Personally trying out Shannon as a reasonable alternative, since she helps protect those GFIs you had to toss in the bin. Hopefully the runner doesn't go Showing Off, but again not many Anarchs showing up yet.

>>53485565

Hedge Fund, PAD Campaigns, Armitage, Access to Globalsec (we love our link).

But yeah, the cool thing is that the game has grown big enough that you can do without the staple go-to all-purpose vanilla options.
But to most I think it's *been* an effort.

>>53482247
>>53482910

HB and Shaper got an extra ID from TD, so their total numbers are still about average, even if they don't get a Martian ID. Harder to say regarding NBN though.

>>53486187

HB and NBN both have 9 IDs. Jinteki 11. Weyland 10.

Anarchs have 9 IDs (with a 10th known on the way), Crims have 11, Shapers 10.

All in all, I'm thinking TD or no TD, if NBN i getting one, HB is getting one. Neither might be though.

>>53486533

Once rotation hits in a few months,
everyone loses 1 (plus 1 more for Anarch and Big W), with the resulting average being 9 across all factions.

>>53486681
Is TD rotational or counts as a deluxe?

>>53488410

It would seem TD is more of a core extension box rather then a deluxe box per se. I doubt it's on the rotation list in any case.

>>53480445
>>53483242
>>53483389
Yeah, looking at what's been seen for NBN so far, we've got them using the runner's stuff against them - some in a more general "this is what NBN does" sense - C(ost) P(er) C(lick) Generator and Net Anlytics isn't very Mars-centric, but MCA informant really is, and Biased Reporting kind of is.
There's also a fair bit of profiting from tags, kind of expected, but in general I'd say they're more using their position as the media more than anything else - other than Reeducation, that I think is them working for the Martian government as much as it is for themselves - though they're probably getting paid handsomely for it

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Finally some new artwork from Mr. Zeilinger!

Lets start with something totally awesome and tragically made obsolete a pack after its GNK announcement.

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>>53490059

Some random Martian dude.

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>>53490074

Whoever thought a simple delivery crew would be key to replacing a whole government.

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>>53490103

Time and Money

>>53478922
It's called cyberpunk

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>>53490059
Ah, you beat me to it, I just saw them!

>>53490074
He may be "the archivist", but like Whizzard and Donut, he's actually a real person - in this case it's Dan Lovat Clarke

Who the fuck is pic related guy, though, I've not seen him anyware?
Is he in New Angeles? - the title says Coach Walden : Android Netrunner

From WoA, New Angeles's American Football team is the Swordfish, so I guess that's who he is. Where we'll actually see him though...

New Angeles also has a football team (I'm actually surprised it was written that way, instead of "soccer" or even "association football" which is its long form), the Giants, and their Baseball team is the Yellowjackets. They all play at the Blue Sun stadium.

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>>53490183
I suspect Matt puts all Android stuff under the same "Netrunner" titling though, as Yuri here is definitely from New Angeles.

He's the boss of Melange, is considered a jumped-up Russian gangster, and is incredibly rich.

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>>53490183

He's an asset-for-auction in the New Angeles boardgame yes. No idea who he is supposed to be otherwise, or why he's of interest to the Corps.

>The Great Lady of the House of GlobalSec

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>>53490209
>>53490211

>not having Lizzie Mills as the Official Spokeswoman instead.

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The One and Only.

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>>53490211
Ah, interesting. I know we see a lot of familiar faces in NA, and a lot of reused art (like >>53477040, for example), as well as some funny captions (I loved Floyd's "crime-solving machine), but I've not got it, so he's new to me

Hail to the Globalsec's chief, she looks pretty damn scary.

>>53490243
You need a friendly face for that. Mills is a lot of things, but despite Public Support, I wouldn't call her friendly

There's also some new non-Zeilinger stuff

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>>53490275
Does this look like Enigma getting whacked in the face to you?

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>>53490294
A shaper decoder we've only seen a snippet of yet

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>>53490275

>Definitely Not Psychic

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>>53490342
Also gold

Is this lady (who by her name seems like Akitaro Watanabe's mum) in NA as well?

>>53490211
Is he? I don't remember him at all, maybe his ability passed under my radar the couple times I've played it. What does it do?

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>>53490430

I think he gives you creds if the player next to you wins any auction. Or something like that.

>This guys steals creds for you from anyone else who dares win an auction. 'Fun' dude.

>>53490480
Oooh, THATGUY, I made an "alliance" once with the player next to me when he had that one. Basically, he supported me while I got us into a better position. It was tricky bc he was also the player I had to beat, but this alliance allowed me to control his profits.
I won by 1 credit.

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>>53490266
His tagline is "He Knows What You Want" - Which isn't creepy at all
Bryan Stinson's, iirc, was "Corporate Tool"

>>53490480
Wow, what an asshole.

The flavour text of Puff Piece (a media action, but with Hiro in the art) amused me greatly - "Be sure to get him from his good side. If he has one" - you tend to forget just how much the corps dislike each other sometimes

>>53490651

HB and Jinteki by all rights utterly hate each other due to direct competition in the same field of Android production.

GlobalSec are direct rivals to Argus, and by extension the rest of Big W in a manner of speaking.

Melange and NBN don't really have any direct rivals though.

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>>53490983
Amusingly, despite how they seem in the games, in WoA's description Globalsec seems to actually be the more well-armed corp.

Globalsec also has a big intelligence division and have perhaps the most comprehensive database of personal information outside of NBN's, so they have some rivalry there

For big W, Skorpios has a rivalry with HB's NEXT, and I think both the parent corps have heavy engineering divisions in their portfolios somewhere

>>53490074
I didn't notice the hair before, that's awesome.

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>>53490059
...waitaminute

Marilyn bioroid
Brutal cybernetics dude with tan vest jacket
White gloves, cane, dark skin

It's the same crew from Infiltration!
Well, half of them at least, and the others all appear at least once on other cards

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>>53492569
I know! I recognized Mr White immediately after the AA was spoiled. "Animal" McEvoy took me a little more time because differences in art". Totally missed that Marilyn though.

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>>53492852
Ah I'd forgotten that Mr. White was black until I went back and looked, so I didn't notice it was the Infiltration crew (and the pics I'd seen of the AA before were a bit small), but it's cool to see they're still breaking and entering together.

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>>53490243
Yeah there might be a reason for that, lets have a look at her caption

>Not Known for Subtlety
You don't say

>>53492569
>>53492852
What's your opinion on the Infiltration game? Is it worth it?

>>53489665
>C(ost) P(er) C(lick)

I like that.

>>53497054

I like it, the risk taking - the deeper you go/longer you stay, bigger you could win but less likely you are to - aspect is fun.

I think there's something off with its balance though.

Overall, not a bad game at all, good for relatively short bust play, but the competition is fierce, and I'd be lying if I said it was a very common go to game when trying to fit something in its allotted time/people frame.

>>53486681

Hadn't accounted for rotation, but then the Big W will ne the one lagging behind with only 8 IDs, in spite of TD. With Jinteki still at 10.

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>>53497896
It's an actual thing.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pay-per-click

The flavour text is also pretty decent
>"The customer pays to use our service, and then the advertisers pay us to put ads on their screens, and then the customers pay us a premium to remove the ads. Welcome to the dream."

Yeah, big W didn't get one in San San or in Mumbad, where Jinteki got 3 (though 1 is Chronos)

>>53499222
>It's an actual thing.

I know, but i just fits SO well here.

>>53492569

Huh. Didn't know that rogue fembot was a Marilyn model in particular.

Nice to see the last few guys from Infiltration finally appear at least.

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>>53500336
McAvoy has been around (he's on a card on the MWL even), though he's easily the least consistently drawn character

But yeah, she's specifically a Marilyn, which I think says some interesting things about that model.

Meet the crew, including early Gabe

>>53500520
Yeah, no kidding, I actually think McEvoy is also pictured in Temujin art.

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>>53501613
Yeah, pretty sure he is. And Infiltration, naturally.

Woot! Persephone galore this week end.

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>>53503745
"Cry 'Havoc!', and let slip the dogs of war"

>>53505041

I have high hopes this produces fun games.

>>53500520
>>53501613
>>53502168

Frankly, i'm surprised the rest of the Infiltration crew hasn't appeared as their own unique cards yet. Hopeful they would actually be useful if that day does come though.

>>53506629
Marilyn and McAvoy I can kind of understand - the bioroid isn't entirely free from her programming the way Adam is, and McAvoy is little more than a thug

Mr White I might have expected to see though, seeing as he's a broker of information and data, and pretty competent, with enough contacts to both get the job, and to put the team together

>>53509043

Marilyn sounds like she is free from most of the inconvenient Directives, and there are in-game connections that are actual gangers/loansharks/black marketeers.

There is an existing criminal mastermind in the form of Mr Li as well fwiw.

>>53505041
The times I rezzed lab dog, I liked it. It might just ate a clone chip or some MU, but with fewer options for hardware recursion the impact was real.

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>>53509428
Yeah, Mr Li is the head of the Tri-Maf, he's a pretty big deal - Mr White seems more of a middle man, and I think he's probably a bit more independent.
Maybe.

>>53510251

Mr White could easily be similar in class to Iain Sterling (strange lack of inf aside), who can probably hire up his own crew to do some fancy heists.

Poor Mr Sterling (and Kit) could really do with extra influence, considering his ability is pretty similar to Gabe and Los for the most part.

>>53511067
Or at least 12. His ability is different in the sense that it engenders passivity, unlike Los and Gabe who have to make runs for it to happen.

>>53511396

I actually like what some of Stirling's ability fosters. With a Keyhole deck it touched a rare intersection of Anarchs and Crims, where you'd throw things in Archives with intent to steal them as late as possible. Also loved the Archive Interface version, aiming at getting rid of all agendas rather than steal them - it's fun to play.

In a way that's probably why I think the ten inf is too low - even disregarding the crim color pie issues. Like early Reina decks that depended on Crim tech to work, Stirling, at least the way I like to play him, is really dependent on external tech to do its thing (if only Film Critic, though however rational, I can't say that's my favorite choice).

>>53511792
The closer I see is data dealer. Selling agendas to stay under is good fun, but leads to longer games and may even deny the points you need.

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>>53512833
I definitely think 10 is a bit harsh - Kit and Stirling both have very powerful IDs, but not THAT powerful. Critic is far better than Data Dealer, because you can have 3 and just hold agendas. That idea with with archives/Keyhole is interesting though.

Amusingly, the art of Data Dealer was also the art for "Informant", which if you use the "specialist" rules which gives each character a pair of starting cards, and "Informant" is one of Mr White's

>>53513319
Problem with Iain Keyhole is the same as problem with HQ targetting in Criminal. Corp recursion makes it trivial to avoid that win condition.
Plus, Keyhole is 3 influence and there is no tutor in-faction for Crims.

>>53514713
>Corp recursion

By which you mean Howard, really.

>>53513319

I think Kit's ID ability can be extremely strong. More so than Stirling's now that you have proper tool to extend its impact over the game.

>>53512833

There's also the semi-passive Gang Sign builds, but then others - if only Leela - can capitalize better on them.

>>53515025
Now that HQ interface is rotating, Gang Sign is losing edge.

>>53514713
>>53515025
Again with the Jackson recursion meme. In any case that new resource (Rosetta?) that lets you RFG a program and tutor another one should prove valuable for any out of faction program tutoring shenanigans in Crim now.

>>53515619
>Again with the Jackson recursion meme.

Not sure I understand where you're going with that one. Is the implication that JH isn't a problem?

>>53515576

I've used it with Neutralize All Threats. Obviously less threatening, but still pretty decent I think. Especially if you build around (I'm liking the idea of SYNC in that build, will have to see next I try it).

>>53517180
It's because JH gets mentioned as "completely turning off RnD mill win condition" so often, despite only returning 9 cards. Just like how "dies to Yog/Mimic" is a meme.

>>53517487

It's not just the number of cards (though if we go with a common 10 agendas spread deck, that means one single Jackson can roughly negate a 15 card mill on average - that's not small, quite the contrary) It's the number associated with the fact that it can be played at paid ability window.

In itself it kills access window plans something fierce.

>>53517818

Another way to put it: in that common set up, one JH allows you to mostly casually dismiss the agenda flood issue for one third of your agendas.

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I keep trying to compare Assassin with Holmegaard

>>53519829

Didn't play it myself - didn't fit my decks - but having faced it, from a design standpoint, I really dig Holmegaard. Pretty nice central piece. As with a few other cards released these past few months, I think the worst I have to say about it is that it's honest in a card pool where honest can all too often be snubbed - unless I'm mistaken best you can break it totally is 5 credits.

Whether you prefer the 3 Net Damage or the access prevention will depend on your deck - though it's probably disheartening to have that as your only ICE against a runner focusing on replacement effects, say trying to Keyhole you into submission.

Now, subroutines firing is an exception and trace subroutine hitting after a fire even more so. Makes that second subroutine a bit more interesting than Assassin's. More specialized, but then that's partly why you want it on a central: can help secure your remote.

Another ICE that immediately comes to mind as a comparison is Grim, tough I don't see it played much anymore. Which to a point is telling, I guess.

>>53521251
Thanks for the input, I was going to include it, but had some influence free and so I ended up playing Colossus instead. Strength boost in a sentry? This is too good.

>>53447974

A bit late, but between Chiyashi and DNA Tracker added to the big ICE list and the new options added to make it happen, a deck using Mutate could probably pull some neat stuff.... Add things like Cortex Lock or Mind Games as interesting options for replacement.

>>53519829

Assassin isn't that bad if one is playing a Cache list and chose D&D for non-HB corp.

>>53517818
>>53518091
Sure, but if you're going for a mill win anyway what you mill doesn't matter, you're still milling 15 cards per Jackson use. Agenda flood is a harder target I'll admit, but that still doesn't excuse dismissive comments like "Jackson turns off Noise/Fisk" and "maybe after Jackson rotates".

I don't know, maybe I'm just getting sensitive about hyperbolic statements after lurking /bgg/ for too long, I apologize.

>>53529951
Wonder if this would make a good import in an upgrade spam Gagarin along side Caprice + Ash + K.P. Lynn. Probably no Prisecs, which is unfortunate.

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>>53531457
That's a cool card (I love the mechanics/theme combo there), but even with the 5 bypass cards from TD (incidentally, that's a full half of the runner cards in the pool that involve bypass) I don't think it's worth an include (even more depressingly, there's only 1 more runner card that uses expose than there is that uses bypass, and it's an ID, and expose is rarely as valuable)

Pic also related, but with terrible stats as well

>>53528279

That's if you're going for the mill kill - which is the exception. Most of the time milling is about getting agendas to steal in archives. Same as making the corp overdraw.

And does JH hurts that.

I maybe a bit overstating things, but I'm thinking it's a just backfire to "Fisk is unplayable shit".

>>53532557
It's worth it if you are going to play Tollbooth/Komainu in there. Maybe even certain boostable ICE like Firewall and Colossus. It's a nice tech against that Femme.
I love expose and I like taking away that advantage the Corp has though. A shame so many people don't think like me. Account Siphon into scoring server using doppelganger is one of my favourite moves as Silhouette.

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>>53532775
>Account Siphon into scoring server using doppelganger
That's a sweet move indeed.

Yeah, I mean they're still trying, dammit, pic related is this cycle, but they're still not making it valuable enough for what they make it cost - or conversely, aren't making running without good knowledge dangerous enough - only new players really fear the risk of running without knowledge.
But, conversely, if they make running without looking too dangerous, running itself is discouraged and rush/FA becomes dominant, or things become too RNG

>>53532864

Spot the Prey really is one of those cards where I like the base design but can't see why they balanced it the way they did.

Should be a zero cost event. The fact that a run is mandatory, whatever the exposed card happens to be, is enough of a constraint I think.

Makes the card narrow enough. Would lose to Infiltration in camping decks already.

>>53532864
And Spot the Prey is not even a run event to play Public Terminal. What gives.
As much as I love expose, even I wouldn't play Spot the Prey. Maybe if it had something like "1 cost event. Expose 1 non-ice card, if it isn't an agenda you may return StP to your hand paying 1c, otherwise, make a run on that server."

>>53533033

Zaibatusu expose econ war would be funny.

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>>53533033
>What gives
Someone wasn't giving a fuck when they made STP

The only thing I like about it is that you can make the run wherever - like "expose a card - it's a snare? - okay then, I'll run R&D" - that's neat, but everything else is pretty poor

I think the best expose card ever made is Drive By.

>>53533320
Drive By is great.
The fact that Starlight Crusade makes doing drive bys much easier is amusing

>>53533320

Drive-by+Blackguard can be glorious.

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>>53533382
Not really seeing the value with Blackguard

>>53533581

Force them to rez that SanSan before you trash it for free?

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>>53533703
Huh, didn't realise it worked like that in the rez/trash order

>>53533736

Having played it a lot, I'd say, in the end, it might be a good thing Blackguard has been balanced the way it has.

Because while it's hard to get it going, it can get pretty oppressive for the corp when you do - when you can start dictating how much money the corp spends/has each turns, basically forcing it to play low-econ with no margins all the time.

>>53533835
You think it might be worth it with Los?

>>53533865

Hadn't really thought about it. My first hunch is the opportunity cost makes it not a great choice - if only because of the expose options you have to pack on top of the derrez/anti econ.

Worth a try though.

>>53532762
>Most of the time milling is about getting agendas to steal in archives
That's subjective to the player. I have never considered mill as a "secondary" method for stealing agendas myself, more "denying the corp options before they draw it". And if you're half-assing your milling then of course it's going to be shit, unless you want a game with broken decks that can equally multitask scoring and kill. OH WAIT

>>53533835
I know - I played against a Silhouette deck with Blackguard, compromised employee and the brirbs that kept siphoning me, it was horrible.

Though the worst bit was that he kept doing it well after he could have won.
For once though, my money-gaining ice let me down, as it firing meant I had money to rez ice, which meant I had no money

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>>53490342
It's fine, they're clones

>>53533969

I always wondered why no one else found that aspect problematic when discussing why milling Runner side shouldn't be stronger.

>>53535353
The denial part? Anarchs play denial. It would be like saying that Whizzard and Kim are problematic bc they trash cards.

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>>53535353
I think Milling is considered worse (and thus needing to be harder to accomplish) than Killing because it'll happen anyway, given enough time, and there's always a chance that you'll mill an agenda - no matter what you hit if you wound or even mill a runner, it won't be as valuable in pure game terms as an agenda

>>53535534

No, the whole "mill shouldn't be easy to do" argument when, as >>53533969 pointed out, there are plenty of Corp decks that can score out just as easily as murder you despite those requiring *vastly* differing styles of play to play around.

>>53539080
>>53533969 here. Thing is, score-and-kill decks are, or atleast should be, an abnormality. If you have a game plan, especially a game-warping plan like mill and kill, then you should be required to focus on that game plan to be able to execute it instead of being able to attack through multiple vectors. If you spread your resources, then one aspect or the other should suffer. Milling *shouldn't* be so strong that runners could execute it without effort. Look at the backlash from when DLR was a thing. Now imagine a deck that can perform 3 - 4 mills a turn (without the DLR setup) and still do ice destruction, break through gearcheck, or siphon spam.

All in all this is still the same old "uninteractive is stronger vs interactive" issue. People that want milling to be stronger are unconciously supporting the former, which can't be good for game health. Not that this is that much related to the "dismissive of mill because of JH" problem.

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>>53539080
Well other than the fact that those decks were recognised as being broken and (eventually) got nerfed, >>53539709 has it - concentrating on a non-standard strategy should make you weaker, and it often does, though perhaps not enough.

After all, that's a huge part of what makes Asset Spam, in all its hideous variations, as obnoxious as it is - by going asset spam you thin R&D and forgo all but the minimum ice, which makes you vulnerable to deep digs, but you can quite often win before that, if you get your bio-ethics engine out, or you can just dominate by being rich as hell and being able to score fine because you're HB/NBN (they still don't like deep digging though)

>>53533969
>That's subjective to the player
>I have never considered mill as a "secondary" method for stealing agendas myself

However you may consider it, you just have to consider the numbers: by the time you've milled half of R&D, you're more likely to win by getting the points in Archives than you would milling what remains of the deck.

Simple as that.

Or as I said discussing dedicated FtM milling builds in a previous thread: it's incredibly fun to play, , but rationally, going for the mill is mostly purely for the show of might since you would win a lot easier and earlier just picking the agendas you've dropped in Archives.

>>53541073
True, it would be faster to win by getting the points in Archives, which is why JH stunts that as said above; he lets the corp get back a significant amount of points back into RnD. It does not change that if you *are* on a win-by-mill plan, points in archives are a secondary benefit, and the ability to shuffle only 3 cards per Jackson does in no way turn off mill as a win condition as is often stated, which is what I'm taking issue with. He and the various agenda flood management cards stop milling as a secondary attack vector, which is good, as you wouldn't want mill on top of Siphon spam for example. Not so when you care more about the number of cards left on RnD than points.

>>53539709

There's another way to look at it though: mill and kill were not really designed to be main plans, but support to stealing and scoring.

You should be able to kill in a deck that plan on scoring, because that's what kill options were made to do in the first place: allow a score by threatening a kill. And there's no way around it, you can only threaten a kill if you *can* kill reliably enough (but then Making News, I know).

Conversely, even if I make a kill deck, I expect I should be able to score. If only because I probably need the threat just as much.

Same goes to mill, it's actually pretty hard to win by milling, if only because of the tools we've had (classic DemoRun milling, demanding R&D access meant you generally won by stealing way before the mill... the mill wins were a *big* anomaly) and the way milling impacts agendas positioning (even discounting my comment on Archives there >>53541073, if I milled, say 20 card off your R&D and you managed to save three agendas via JH, well the R&D agenda is more than probably off the charts).

>>53541706

But then, that's the thing, strict milling is *impacted* by JH. But support milling is killed by it.
Especially secondary milling by forced draw, which I think is a *very* fair way of support-milling the corp that really didn't need the hate.

I would add I think strict milling barely exists in the game as of now, and when it does is more than probably accidental - DLR was never meant to be a card that allowed for a complete mill.

FtM is probably the first time I think we've had a direct strict milling option that was willfully so.

>>53541919
>well the R&D agenda density is more than probably off the charts

Sorry, I accidentally a word again, for a change.

So how long does it usually take for a champion designed card to appear?

>>53543512

Release schedule has been pretty inconsistent I would say. What with CBI raid and Deuces Wild being released less than 6 months apart.

>>53540441

NBN kill wasn't nerfed *that* hard. All they lost was Power Shutdown. They can still go on the Fast Advance plan and any time it looks like they won't be able to score out they just fall back on 24/7>BOOM! because all you need is a Breaking News and literally anything else. You'd be *very* hard-pressed to set up damage protection while trying to race them for points.

Meanwhile things like DLR are cancerous yes, I can agree with that, but I'm taking more about things like going the Equivocation or Fisk route. Forcing the Corp to draw while flooding HQ faster than they can empty it. The Corp still has counter play to things like that but it can still force bad choices on them. The problem is in addition to the aforementioned Jackson meme there are also things like Museum and Friends (Which while it won't put anything back in RnD still makes you care much less about pitching since you can always dump Assets to retrieve them). That unfortunately makes going the degenerate route a la DLR one of the only really viable ways to do mill because of how many tools already exist to make the "fair" versions completely ineffectual anyway.

>>53545306

Aaron is a pain to deal with for kill, although by happy coincidence, NBN has an in-faction way of making him (and other troublesome characters) go away.

All those talks about Stirling reminded me of how sad I am The Archivist is 4 influence. Definitely would have wanted to slot one.

>>53547752

Even if Mr Sterling had standard inf, that random martian is hardly worth 4 inf, considering he only fires in specific conditions and even then success is dependent on the credit difference between him and the corp.

It's a win more card at best really.

>>53548750
look at it this way. Every time the corp scores an agenda with those subtypes he will have to spend credits if he wants to be bad pub free. Otherwise he's reducing the trash value of all his assets by one. It's a taxing resource.

>>53541919
>There's another way to look at it though: mill and kill were not really designed to be main plans, but support to stealing and scoring.
I don't disagree with that. The benefit of moving agendas around Runner side has been made pretty clear. The problem is when decks can interchange between both too easily. Dedicated decks should overpower multitasking decks, because the latter is dedicating resources multiple ways. Wouldn't it be considered unhealthy if a deck can do everything well, by virtue of all decks end up looking the same? If every deck can abuse milling as a way to win, that doesn't sound like a fun meta.

>>53542119
Back to original issue, since we've already agreed strict-milling isn't completely disabled, I wouldn't say support-milling gets killed by any of the agenda flood cards either. Like the anon above you says, if they shuffle only agendas back into RnD, then RnD agenda density will be sky high because you're still trimming non-agenda cards out of RnD. Time for Medium/Maker's Eye/Deep Data Mining! It only seems weak because most decks dedicate slots to typical Crim shenanigans over comitting to the support-mill plan, and that you should only be scoring from milling agendas into archives is stupid. The Archives bounce to RnD is also a very Crim tactic.

>>53545306
>That unfortunately makes going the degenerate route a la DLR one of the only really viable ways to do mill because of how many tools already exist to make the "fair" versions completely ineffectual anyway.

>Forcing the Corp to draw while flooding HQ faster than they can empty it.
Maw and Hacktivist Meeting is a thing to support that.

>there are also things like Museum and Friends
Archives Interface and Slums.

Not to mention typical econ crippling strategies and the above Archives to RnD swing. The "fair" methods are fair because you have to dedicate support into it. No complaints about the influence cost, of course you should be spending them to solidify your game plan.

I bought the core, an expansions a few packs about a year ago to play my brother in but he never really got into it and don't really know of any local hobby centers around, let alone into Netrunner. Is Jinteki net a good alternative for someone relatively new? How up to date is it relative to the real thing? Any caveats I should know about?

>>53549753
>Is Jinteki.net good
If you want to be super competitive, sure.
Otherwise it's pretty toxic imo

>>53549753
While Jinteki.net is fine for playing with a friend over long distances, playing against the world meta can be harrowing when you're just starting out. I'd say look for a board game gathering group on social media for your area and start looking for players there, hopefully maybe find another newbie to play with.

>>53549762
It can get pretty toxic and tiring if you keep encountering the competitive kind, and it can happen both in casual and competitive room.
Let's do a thing, whenever you want to play with somebody from /anrg/, add to the room [4LC] (4 leaf clover) to summon one of us. I don't know how effective that would be, but I think it's worth a try.

>>53549753
You can add to the room chat that you are learning and want a casual match. That would make it easier for you.

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>>53549863
>add to the room [4LC] (4 leaf clover) to summon one of us. I don't know how effective that would be, but I think it's worth a try.
That sounds amusing - might be cool for jank testing.

Just as a random thing - pic related, first turn against core NBN sucks.
It sucks hard

>>53550420
It looks really cool. Different to City Surveillance.

>>53550420

Yeah, unless you are going power taps (and even then) it's worse then playing vs ethical prisons.

At least it isn't all that common.

>>53549713
>Like the anon above you says, if they shuffle only agendas back into RnD, then RnD agenda density will be sky high because you're still trimming non-agenda cards out of RnD

Both posts were mine actually. Here's my issue with that: first you don't get those huge discard/trash numbers from support milling. So while you might get better R&D density, the impact is less significant, and I would argue probably not worth the milling tech investment.
Second: this creates a situation that magnifies the R&D focus issue we've had, with decks tailored being Medium deep dig machines, because it so consistently ends up begin the most efficient strategy whatever your opponent may be playing.

Milling is supposed to try and do three things:
- in the case of crim forced-draw, clog HQ with agendas.
- then, and that's more the option for direct R&D milling, get agendas in Archives for you to steal.
- last , what is ultimately more the dedicated-mill province: fasten the clock of the corp.

JH defuses the first two, and hurts the third:
- the corp doesn't need to keep agendas in HQ as it can freely discard them in Archives because
- it has access to tech that can remove agendas from Archives at paid ability window for no cost.
- three cards back in R&D is not nothing. I would go as far as to say it shouldn't be nothing for the milling to remain healthy.

More importantly I guess, the card is ubiquitous. There's basically no deck in the competitive meta that won't be armed - and well armed - against a (support) milling strat.
And an efficient dedicated-milling strat that can consistently disregard the effects of three JH in every deck, with the implication that deck can also be good at stealing, is looming close to degenerate. A word I don't use often or lightly, because I don't much like how it's thrown around in vain.

>>53553050
>Both posts were mine actually.
Figured, played it safe though.

>first you don't get those huge discard/trash numbers from support milling
That depends on what your definition of support milling is. A Fisk/Equivocation deck that plans to steal isn't a dedicated mill deck, but the mill plan definitely isn't just thrown in either. If by support milling you mean just adding 3 copies of Fisk Investment Seminar and SYN Attack, then of course that wouldn't work as well. If you see support milling as "a synergy of cards that enable the runner to see more cards off the top of RnD" however, or whatever other way they can use the milled cards to further their game plan, then they work a lot better.

>Milling is supposed to try and do three things:
The preconception that milling should *only* be about those three things is narrow minded and misses certain subtleties during a game. You forget two that aren't directly related to Runner win conditions, and one that is:
- overwhelming the corp to make and commit to bad decisions
- closing off options by throwing off corp tempo or removing them before they have access to it
- as above, get more accesses off of RnD

JH only tackles the second well, but the corp suffers from the first if they do (eg: using all 3 Jacksons early for recurring milled Jacksons and agendas). And the third will only be mitigated until the Runner shaves off another 3 cards off of RnD, which ultimately isn't a tall order if you're built for it.

I will also put forward that HQ trashes are also a form of milling as it achieves the same three things you suggested (well, maybe only indirectly doing the third) and the three things I added. Which means considering milling as only affecting RnD is tunnel vision.

>>53554129
>closing off options by throwing off corp tempo or removing them before they have access to it

I always have a problem with that one given, an average (non-mill centric) game will have the corp finish with around 20 cards still in R&D. If I strict mill those 20 cards, from a randomness standpoint I haven't changed anything to the corp's accesses to its resource pool.

Similar to the old MaxX analysis with all other things it entailed. If anything, it helps the corp commit to *good* decisions, as it enhances knowledge of what can be expected of upcoming draws. Not to mention chances of drawing the good stuff by recursion (cuts both ways agenda density isn't the only thing impacted)

>Which means considering milling as only affecting RnD is tunnel vision.

No argument against this from me, I specifically mentioned HQ in my three points with agenda clogging after all. My point wasn't that milling is R&D focused, my point was that JH tends to make it laser focused on R&D.

Granted all that conversation is more about high level design than current state of the game. The designers have offered plenty of non JH options that I think are fairly costed (thus disliked) and are going to replace it. And some solutions to circumvent it if need be (the Rumor Mill Atom bomb for one).

>>53554129
>If by support milling you mean just adding 3 copies of Fisk Investment Seminar and SYN Attack, then of course that wouldn't work as well

To hopefully help make things clear: by support milling I mean any strategy that includes milling, but whose end game isn't victory by reducing R&D to zero cards, by opposition to a strict-milling deck, a deck whose main, if not sole, aim is to win by reducing R&D to zero cards.

>>53554502
>from a randomness standpoint I haven't changed anything to the corp's accesses to its resource pool.
Not wrong, but there's also the matter of opportunity. For example, flooding the corp with ice or Restructures/IPOs while they are low on credits. If you let them take their time gaining credits and eventually mandatory draw certain cards, they'd be more able to play them vs if you get them to those cards while they aren't ready (and preferably while they want to do something else). Or trashing those cards while they are looking for it.

>by support milling I mean any strategy that includes milling
Fair, though again, while weaker, there are still other available attack vectors to exploit, as opposed to the "Jackson kills mill" meme. Viable and/or competitive or not, the option exists, and being dismissive about it only due to a single card is a terrible attitude to take and does nothing to help with the health of the game.

>>53554784
>Not wrong, but there's also the matter of opportunity

Keyhole ICE targeting + Immolation Script was definitely a lovely little thing to play.

>being dismissive about it only due to a single card is a terrible attitude to take and does nothing to help with the health of the game.

There's definitely hyperbole, despite the issue being real, and I don't want it to sound sour or dismissive. I play those decks after all. And enjoy playing against them.

I'm thinking a lot of the hate for JH comes from, as I said, its ubiquity. Imagine wanting to play a kill deck in a meta where 3 Plascrete in every deck was the constant norm. That's kinda how it feels. And I'm thinking, given how above the power curve JH happens to be, you really don't want to make milling *itself* strong enough that it can ignore it.
That's a tough balancing act.

Never played on Jinteki myself, but I have to say some of the horror stories are hilarious.

Turn 1
>ICE R&D
>ICE HQ
>Hedge Fund

>Opponent: fuck you
> Opponent has left the room.

That being said, I wonder how bad it it actually is given the number of people I see that does use it.

>>53555218
It's actually quite good, most players are well behaved, unless you play IG...

>>53555218
I did have an amusing one the other day - he finished tagged against me, knowing I had a scorched... but I was on 0 credits. He still conceded

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You know what's fun (and probably very annoying?) - 3x Film Critic, this asshole, Chakana and Medium

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>>53556395
What a haashole

>>53555359

Cute one.

>>53558071

Next Thomas card when?

>>53554784
>For example, flooding the corp with ice or Restructures/IPOs while they are low on credits.

I've been thinking... apart from Record Reconstructor and, to a certain extent, the Maya/Equivocation combo I guess, what actually lets you do that?

Because removing cards from a central server, OK. Basic milling. Targeted removal? OK, we have a few options.
But being able to chose what the corp is going to draw, according to board state? Very rare isn't, it?

>>53556395

I've played variations on that. I like it. I'm thinking with things like Data Breach/Mobius to help rearm it, might be time to see how it would fare in current card pool.

>>53559118
Indexing is probably the big one

>>53559257

Good call. Shame on me for forgetting good ol' Indexing.

EMP Device + Maxwell James.

Not bad.

>>53559307
Rotating though.
I was thinking Equivocation + Baghat, you need to do 2 runs though.
Equivocation + Noise? Keep virus in hand for targeted trashing.

>>53559942
Mean, I like it

>>53556395
3 Film, 3 fall guy, 1 source was my initial Iain setup. But that influence HURTS.

Too many interesting decks to build and play, not enough time...

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>>53562793
I feel you bro

>>53560102

Assuming you run multiple hostages, you could go with 2 or even 1 FC to save a pip or 2.

>>53565955
Yeah, problem is not FC, is The Source.

First impressions on TD. Seidr ability to both recursion and Biotic so many 3/2 is curve stomping the criminal runner. My Protector ethos won't fire much. Marylin campaign is good asset bait.

>>53474899
Guys, can you make your OP a bit more compact? It's more than a screen long

>>53570297
A screen of what? Is your Font size too big? Also, 4chan collapses big messages for page visualization.

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>>53570297
There's this thing called scrolling

>>53571524
With 4chan addon you don't eve n the scroll, tap the left/right key and you navigate the thread.

>>53549713
>Maw and Hacktivist Meeting is a thing to support that.
Not really. Maw and Hacktivist are HQ pressure, but they're less about flooding HQ with Agendas and more about pure disruption. I play a Maw Val deck and even when the Corp doesn't have a clogged HQ the random discards can still throw giant holes in their game plan, whether it's getting rid of ICE early or getting a lucky hit on that Hunter Seeker. That you can occasionally dump an Agenda in Archives is just a happy coincidence. And since the discard is random, that doesn't necessarily help forced draw, since as you put more cards in HQ the chances of you hitting the thing you'd want out of HQ go down slightly.


>Archives Interface and Slums.
I do wish Interface would get more traction, and Slums is easily dealt with by Mills.

>>53572382
>Slums is easily dealt with by Mills.

Not for much longer for some.

I wouldn't say easily either. If you're playing an asset heavy deck, you certainly don't want to give the runner the benefit of one bad pub lightly

>that you can occasionally dump an Agenda in Archives is just a happy coincidence.

Not downplaying the HQ pressure - nor the fact, I agree, it doesn't really play the exact same role as a card like Equivocation, but on that later bit, same goes for R&D mill though. Where, according to you, is there a significant difference? (genuine question)

>I do wish Interface would get more traction

After all this time, I'm still mad at the cost raise.

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About time we got the good version of Pop Up Window. Jesus, what a beauty she is

Corp
https://imgur.com/gallery/mf2EW
Runner
https://imgur.com/a/M2Ho9

>>53573984

Oooohhh... shiny!

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>>53573984
This is interesting, if one were looking for SanSans, Core+this get you the full playset.

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>>53573984
You know, at first I thought that Archangel was the guy in the middle with these HUGE FLUFFY WINGS. But looking at it closely... I think the HUGE FLUFFY WINGS with the BLACK HOLE at its center is actually the Archangel, while the dark reddish guy is being dragged by it and trapped between the HUGE FLUFFY WINGS.

>>53574015

All we need now is someone winning with Desperado and you got those 'completion' packs all those who dislike the multiple core format are asking for.

>>53575150
Valencia with Desperado for 2 free credits trashing.

>>53572556

Well, with things like Maw and Hacktivist I'd rather try and keep HQ as bare as possible, as it means I can focus more pressure on RnD. If there's nothing there then you have time to build up. And if the Corp has to spend their clicks drawing, it's more difficult for them to reinforce, allowing you to go back and ransack HQ when they try to slip something by. It's more about being able to focus your fire down to fewer servers.

Milling, when not going for the straight deck out, always felt more like what >>53553050 said. Fasten the clock of the corp. It stops the Corp from turtling until they can put something in the remote, but also runs the risk of getting them to their outs sooner.

Basically, to me, HQ pressure is more about slowing them down and hindering them from reaching their outs, while forced draw is more trying to flood them with resources faster than they can spend them, effectively forcing them to waste resources. Straight milling is somewhere in between typically. If you're just trashing from the top of RnD that always felt to me more like attempting to farm Archives than force a mill-out. So one's a bit slower but is better about managing its counters, the other is faster but slightly riskier. I'm not quite sure where direct RnD trashing falls on the scale though.

>>53575150
Someone should go into Worlds with semi-decent decks with all the remaining 1-ofs and preface each match with "so listen, my deck has the rest of the core singletons..."

Though I guess that would count as bribery huh.

>>53575334
I made a thing, post-rotation deck

Valencia Asset Trashing

Valencia Estevez: The Angel of Cayambe

Event (20)
3x Corporate Scandal ●●●
3x Day Job
2x Demolition Run
3x Deuces Wild ●●●
3x Dirty Laundry
2x I've Had Worse
1x Showing Off
3x Sure Gamble

Hardware (5)
2x Archives Interface
2x Desperado ●●●●● ●
1x Skulljack

Resource (10)
2x Earthrise Hotel
1x Human First
1x Ice Carver
3x Investigative Journalism
1x Neutralize All Threats ●●●
2x The Archivist

Icebreaker (8)
2x Black Orchestra
2x Crypsis
2x MKUltra
2x Paperclip

Program (7)
2x Datasucker
2x Medium
3x Progenitor

15 influence spent (max 15, available 0)
50 cards (min 50)
Cards up to Daedalus Complex

Deck built on https://netrunnerdb.com.

>>53576048
>Human First

I like the cut of you jib.

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>>53575812
Wouldn't Astro stop that now?

The old curse...

"What's happening, I have room to put everything I need in this deck... oh right... hadn't slotted agendas yet... now to remove some cards."

>>53583277
I almost always start with the agendas and make my gameplan around them. If my agendas aren't advancing my gameplan, what ass agendas do I have?
Weyland is easy because agendas=money

>>53583362

Sometimes one just starts off a stupid idea...

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>>53583277
>>53583362
Yeah, some decks, they're all about what their agendas do (BN NBN, for example), in other decks they seem to get more in the way than anything else, or don't matter

Personally I think the latter is a shame, and the worst offender by far also happens to be one of the best agendas in the game - it's a part of all self-protecting agendas, really, but they tend to be really good - how do you balance that?

>>53584487
Making it a liability if it is indeed stolen would be a start. In that sense we have Merger, a bland blank 3/2 that gives extra points if stolen.
A shame I can't say the same about GFI, and I don't know why would they think it is ok to print blank agendas that do nothing when you score them. It creates an environment of thinking "why score this, it does nothing except give points" or worse. In a game so thematic having around 1/5 of cards just giving you points is a total shame.

Consoles: can I run two in my deck, and trash the first one if I install another, or can I only put one kind in my deck?

>>53587213

You can't overwrite consoles like you can with other stuff, so generally its pretty pointless to have more the one kind of console unless you have a way to get rid of the first one (like Aesops/Chopbot/Trade-in).

>>53587388
Was thinking of splashing in an Ubax on top of my Astrolabe, since functionally it just better albeit more expensive

>>53587439
You could slot in Modded if you have the slots, makes your programs cheaper too.

>>53587439

Assuming you are having the full card pool, it would seem Astro is generally better vs corps now (esp anything asset spam related) unless you are facing nothing but glacier.

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>>53585241
Yeah - at least with the Public agendas they made scoring them interesting to actually score

As good as they are, the over-advanceable 3/2s are some of the worst in this area - as you say, agendas should never just be about the points

>>53589743

What's great with Public Agendas is that's they not just interesting to score, they're interesting to *advance*. Even more granular. Love their design.

>As good as they are, the over-advanceable 3/2s are some of the worst in this area

Even ABT when you're down to it. Because of our conversation on 3/2 I started paying more attention to this, and some people don't EVER let ABT fire. Just here to be another blank 3/2.

>>53584487

The Future Perfect made sense in the context of Jinteki servers being by design really porous.
Global Food Initiative makes sense as part of the Jackson removal package.
NAPD Contract is the only self-protective I took some issue with.

Trouble with those to me is that basically people don't plan on scoring them unless. Hell in the case of NAPD in some decks, I've seen people actively plan on *not* scoring them.
To some extent, this all ties back to the 3/2 issue.

I guess you could had the sensie agendas too in a way to that list...

Food fo thought here. Must give it some time.

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>>53590197
>to *advance*
Ah, yeah, the process is what I meant there.

TFP makes sense with Jintkei's ice, but I know for sure it's not an agenda I want to score - trying to score it makes it vulnerable, much better to just leave it in a central where you have a fair chance of beating the runner on psi

I don't like GFI very much though, even with it being part of accommodating Jackson leaving

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>>53590197
And I love Obokata concept of the Runner suffering damage to steal it. But nevertheless these are all agendas designed to "not" be stolen, rather than scored. They fit in decks that prolong the game instead of closing it further.

But what if they take this concept and turn it around? Agendas that hinder the Runner when stolen. "4/2 - E3 conference - While this agenda is in the Runner score area, the Runner loses 1 click at the beginning of his turn. This can be prevented by taking 1 tag. "

On ABT, playing the TD campaign I came to the realization that HB has Archive memories for a deeper reason over just recurring Biotics. It saved agendas thrown away by ABT (I lost like 5 points there over 3 games because I fire every ABT). I mean, I still won those 3 games, but still.

Offtopic, I love "Trash all connections and jobs"

There is a Europe Championship stream here, if somebody wants to watch it:

https://www.twitch tv/neoreadinggrid

>>53590592

There's just something SO satisfying in getting that Aaron out when they thought themselves unreachable.

>>53590592
>But what if they take this concept and turn it around? Agendas that hinder the Runner when stolen.

I kinda fond of the idea of agendas that would have effects when scored or stolen, per Medical Breakthrough, but they'd have to be very careful with that.

>>53592710

I accidentally a word again.

>I kinda fond of the idea of agendas that would have incremental effects when scored or stolen

>>53590197

I actually saw a guy running Precognition in an EtF deck. He'd precog, install ABT and a piece of ICE, then attempt to rush out said ABT for maximum value. It was actually pretty neat to watch.

>>53593329
I used to play Precog out of core too, the card is awesome for that.
Nowadays I've seen people play Hasty Relocation the same turn it is scored, although that single trash is still dangerous I guess.

>>53585241

Except that's the whole reason Merger's never played in the first place. People are spoiled by their all-upside cards. That being said sometimes there just aren't bigger agendas that you want to use but you still want to lower your density, which is another part of the reason GFI is so prevalent. I think this actually came up in a previous thread as well but most of the 5/3's have effects that are so underwhelming that it just doesn't feel worth the effort to score them. I usually run Hades Fragment and two food instead of 3 food in my decks because that's an effect that actually feels worth the risk to me. I've considered... Utopia I think it was as well, but I just haven't taken the plunge to trying it, mostly because I vastly prefer Running and in the process of brewing three new Runner decks that pop into my head it often gets backburnered. (NBN and HB are my corps of choice for reference, right now I'm running Sol. Haven't toyed around with HB in a bit but definitely down for trying out Elective Upgrade (another 5/3 which really feels worth the risk to me, incidentally. Honestly it actually feels a little broken,all things considered, but it gets some slack by virtue of having to score as a 5/3.)

Haven't played since mid mumbad, what does the meta look like right now ?

>>53594056
Tournament wise, HB Asset Spam with Stelle Moon and Whizzard doing whizzard things.

>>53590592

Or conversely and something that may be a little more well-received, effects that benefit the Corp rather than hinder the Runner when stolen/in the Runner's score area not unlike some of the Sensies. Imagine the Runner grabbing the Corp's top secret Agenda only for that to be exactly what the Corp wanted because once news of the project "leaks" it turns into a viral marketing campaign.

>>53559118
>But being able to chose what the corp is going to draw, according to board state? Very rare isn't, it?

I played a Fisk deck with Woman in the Red Dress, Bhagat, and Find the Truth.

Running HQ and deciding what to draw, trash, or keep was a lot of fun. Downsides are obvious, but the subtle hustle of controlling the tempo when they weren't expecting it was a neat little engine.

Started my Terminal Directive campaign today, had fun with Data Raven + Mason servers. Definitely continuing with this sort of back and forth to get through our respective objectives. Also noticed that the campaign lasts a lot longer if you don't include Inez and Evidence Collection.

>>53595504

You know what? I'm thinking we're close to a CBI Raid build.

>>53597537
Aren't you supposed to include them?

A friend and I started playing a couple days ago with him as the runner and me as the corp. We have yet to do any deckbuilding and we have played 16 games. first one game of each of the twelve match-ups and then four more games of the potential Terminal Directive matchups.

I've gone 11-5, how does the runner GIT GUD?

>>53599599
Know thy enemy.
By playing both sides to understand better when the Corp is weak and where are the agendas moving. How to pressure, and how to let go.
By knowing the Corp cards, knowing what can the Corp do, knowing the consequences.

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>>53601464
The best ID that never was

>>53603162

It's a nice idea, at the very least.

>>53599599

What decklists are being used? Because runners have a better chance of winning in a limited card pool. Esp if MO appears early and makers eyes are being spammed.

>>53599473
Thing is you can advance your objective perfectly fine by just ticking off wins instead of winning with Inez/Evidence Collection in your score area, especially since scoring the two isn't that hard. I'm not sure why they even have the Objective checkboxes at all honestly, since you check it once then sticker over it with a sticker from the new set.

>>53599599
Balance pressuring and setup. Disrupt the corp if you can by messing with their stuff or stealing agendas, but don't overextend and leave huge scoring windows open, build your rig if there isn't a need to run.

>>53605594

We have done zero deckbuilding, the decks are just the neutral cards and the faction that matches the identity

>>53605768

Yeah, that would be problematic for either side in that situation.

I do believe there are some recommended teaching decks on stimhack or reddit which would be better in giving a training experience rather then just in-faction/neutral only decks. Inf is meant to be used after all.

>>53605737

Pretty sure evidence collection is mandatory to include, and probably Inez as well, and if you don't win with them, you are going the super-long marathon route, which is probably not to everyone's taste.

>>53608026
Sure, but the alternative is roughly 1 set opened per game, which isn't as fun either when you the whole campaign can be as short as roughly 4 - 6 games. Which again is why it's really weird that they have agendas and resources that instant advance the story, while also providing the checkbox option; the winning checkbox basically get ticked once before being overwritten, and players have already noted that the catchup mechanic for losing a certain amount of games basically comes way too late.

>>53474899
>RPG when
plz ffg

>>53608870

Fair point. It would be a pretty good houserule if you don't intend to do a campaign launch (which was alright I guess) session.

Mind you though, if the corp gets the 'lose 4 games' stuff in the later part of the campaign, it can get brutal in combination with one of the upgraded assets. The runner 'compensation prize' is not quite as good in comparison.

>>53609061

What sort of mechanics would such a RPG have? Dark Heresy? The star war ones?

>>53610593
Coming from FFG? Star Wars

So bit of build advice here. I'm not a new player but I'm not particularly good with Weyland and every deck I've ever tried to theorycraft with them has never gotten past the drawing board save this one. I'm running a fair number of 5/3's to lower density but I'm trying to get 5/3's that actually *do* something rather than just going the Food route, with the intention of actually scoring them. So to you Weyland veterans in here: what are some of their best 3-pointers in your opinions?

>>53612359
Government Contracts means you're pretty set for money, but shouldn't be relied on as a source of income.

Graft is supposedly fairly decent for combo decks, stuff like searching for your Scorched or just your silver bullets.

High Risk Investment means you're always have the same amount of money as the Runner + your current credit pool.

There are some pretty neat FA scoring tricks using Hollywood Renovation.

The Cleaners work best in decks that ping meat vs the Scorched plan.

In summary, it really depends on the deck, but all of the Weyland 5/3s are actually pretty solid, though Cleaners has a lot more narrow usage than the rest.

>>53612668
>Graft is supposedly fairly decent for combo decks

Or rush. People downplay the ability to just get the money and agendas you need to get real fast.

>>53605737
>>53608026

From my personal experience, I'm thinking Inez/Evidence Collection are a balancing valve against the possible snowballing effect(s) of the campaign.

Corp side I had a very strong start focusing on rush/kill. But several victories - kill victories for the most part, but not limited - I made without collecting evidence.
Which gave the runner window for a single Inez victory, changing the tides of the game. Making some back and forth happen that couldn't have otherwise.

>>53599599

Runner-wise, I'd say first thing I think is : know about base tactics, know about range.

What can your opponent do for 5 credits? What can and can't your opponent afford at 12 credits? How much can be spent, and how much must remain in the bank for threats (kill, score, board disruption) to be credible? What can you withstand? Is the exchange worthwhile?

To simplify things (a lot), say, if you play against someone going for a classic HB Fast Advance plan, there's a credit minimal range for that plan to be put in motion (let's go with 4 credits biotic, 3 credits advancing the agenda) now if the corp is at 7 credits, its threat range is limited by the self-hurt to the main plan; at around 12 credits it's still relatively pretty short and you're going to have to keep it that way by taking risks to force spending. And then capitalize on those moments.

Every resource spent defending a server is resource not spent defending another. So learn to apply pressure on one point to make another weak.

>>53599599
>>53616390

Corp-wise, I'd say: understand tempo and what your means to manipulate it are.

You need to tax the runner one way or another whether money, clicks, grip - death kill or otherwise, board state.

If you're playing kill, the runner *has* to respect your kill range. Has to beware of you SEA Source trace, or the damage from you Scorched Earth, your ambushes, your ICE. And you have to know when to leave range for the sake of scoring.
If you're going rush, you have to force the runner in a position where risks before being ready are mandatory. Conversely you have to be able to withstand playing on very thin ground.
If you're playing board destruction, the runner has to respect your trashing tools. And you need to be able to evaluate risk margins - sure you just trashed that fracter, what are the chances there's recursion tool, or another copy right behind?
If you're playing glacier, the runner has to be able to keep up economically with taxing fruitless remote runs. but you need to learn to evaluate how safe your servers actually are. If you add one piece of ICE the runner cannot yet break to that server, at how much do you evaluate the cost to make it happen anyway for the runner?

All those things change depending on the game state, and learning to get a feel of the game takes time.

I'd say at the very beginning, corps feels the easiest because it has a mandatory clock. You know where you're going, you have to, so you can let the game carry you as you only deal in things tactically. But then once you and your opponent start getting a head on things, it becomes harder, as the need to think strategically rise.

>>53612668

It's Gagarin Glacier I'm experimenting with for reference.

>>53619149

Interesting.

Gagarin is generally the go to Weyland asset spam ID, for obvious reasons. What's your game plan for a glacier version? How do you intend on capitalizing for that remote credit tax?

PriSec + Dedicated Response Team basr I gather? If you're going full glacier, chances are you're going to have a hard time going lateral with ICE placement...

Architect/Bloom/Next Opal support maybe?

Thinking about it makes me wonder about Graft + New Construction as a weird rush asset spam hybrid...

(Funny/stupid move of the day: Owl+Kala Ghoda Real TV... just when they think they're safe rom your Skorpios shenanigans)

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>>53620720
Not him, but one thing I've seen done with Glacier Gagarin is upgrade spam - piling a ton of defensive upgrades in the scoring server

>>53613075
This. Grafting into 3x Hedge Fund or equivalent money cards is pretty powerful

>>53620720

>>53619149 here.

>>53620856

is correct. Turns out that K.P. Lynn is *phenominal* out of Gagarin. The general idea is to run the Runner into a server of K.P. Lynn and Red Herrings with Scorched Earth waiting in the wings and some Ambush bluffing thrown in for good measure. The fact that Gagarin is pay per card and not pay per server means even if they can manage to get in with enough credits to steal the Agenda they still can't touch your upgrades because they need to save enough to shake the Lynn tag, so you get a lot of mileage out of them. I was considering DRT but I'm not sure where to slot it. The deck is obviously vulnerable to deep digs which is why I'm trying to lower the Agenda density as much as possible, but I'm still not sure how to cover that weakness without compromising anything else. Running Pop-up Window right now, but I'm thinking it's not really good enough. Maybe I'll try Authenticator or Tapestry... I like the concept of profiting off the Runner trying to hammer your Centrals though.

Prisec on the other hand is a nonbo with Gagarin since once the Runner knows it's there they can just decline to access it. Prisec's better when the Runner even if the Runner knows it's there, they also know that they HAVE to access it.

>>53619149
If you have advanceable ice then Hollywood Renovation would help with the glacier plan, especially Colossus. If you have trace based operations then High-Risk Investment will help after the remote run, or any run actually. Graft will help with finding more money, ice, upgrades, or recursion. Off of the neutral 5/3s, Utopia Fragment, Eden Fragment, and Global Food fit the glacier plan.

Personally I'd go for Graft, High-Risk, Utopia, and Global Food. Food, if only to not lose in two steals to a Mad Dash/Freedom run.

>>53622480
>The deck is obviously vulnerable to deep digs which is why I'm trying to lower the Agenda density as much as possible, but I'm still not sure how to cover that weakness without compromising anything else.
Ambush cards, definitely. Snares and the new Breached Dome will probably help put the fear in them. News Team too.

>>53619149
>>53625350
As additional input though, forcing 4 steals via 4/2s and Global Food is still a solid plan. With 5/3s not only is scoring them harder, but the runner can win with only 3 steals, 2 if they play Freedom/Mad Dash. That said, the additional 3 - 4 cards from having less than the usual 10 - 11 agendas could help tremendously.

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>>53613075
Yeah, I've not used it yet, but this does seem a kind of under-rated use of Graft - you can just get money, get things that help you speed up (fast track might be interesting?)

>>53612668
Yeah, Weyland actually has pretty strong agendas - stronger than you'd think when people talk about them - but they have 3 caveats:
1) they're 5/3's that aren't defending themselves (and aren't GFI)
2) they're quite specific to the strategy of your deck (not that that's a bad thing, it definitely helps you get away from the "just scoring for points" thing we talked about upthread)
3) with 5/3s, in Weyland, you'll have difficulty with glacier and defending them - people aren't scared of traps, you haven't got much in the way of defensive upgrades

Effect-wise though I'd say Weyland's got the better 5/3s - most of their issues come from simply being 5/3s really

>>53627486
>you haven't got much in the way of defensive upgrades
K.P. Lynn and Mason could help tilt glacier Weyland to a good spot, even with Aaron around. Not sure if 5/3s will take a part in that though.

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>>53627526
Yeah, maybe. I haven't tried K.P. yet, mainly because Prisec.

Incidentally, I just learned that she's named after Damon's wife, Kelsey Petrowski(sp), so not only is Damon in this pack twice, his wife is there too.
Also both versions of him kinda combo with her, which is nice

>>53627996
Oooh, that's neat. What do you mean by Damon is in the pack twice though? And Prisecs work pretty well with Lynn too, after all it IS an additional tag, and another 3 credits spent trashing upgrades.

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>>53628425
Well there's Mr Stone, and there's Mason Belamy who doesn't seem like a reference at first (though Stone-Mason is a connection), but then >>53490156 is his pic.

So Damon's in it twice, once in name, once in face.
Which probably makes K.P. a happy woman.

>>53628510
Apparently, Mr Stone is just a coincidence.

Sorry for shitting up your thread but I need somewhere to whine impotently about L5R spoilers not coming out last week and the game in general not being out yet. Crab week when???

Thankyou for your time.

>>53629413
There's been a lack of FFG news in general the past week, and I think there's a convention going on too so it could be that. Netrunner side the 2016 decks are out, which is pretty sweet.

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We are now seeing some fan made campaigns, plus the official campaign. How do you think a campaign should develop? What mechanics are good and which oned are detrimental?

I'm considering planning a campaign that can be played with just the core set. Picking a Runner, or a Corp, and going with a story for it. But there are so many variables that I need to order my thoughts first.

>>53625558
Well the other thought was to go with all 4/2's, of which there are plenty I'd happily use, but there were cards here and there that I wanted to make room for and with the aforementioned digging weakness lowering the number of Agendas seemed the best solution.

>>53627486
>3) with 5/3s, in Weyland, you'll have difficulty with glacier and defending them - people aren't scared of traps, you haven't got much in the way of defensive upgrades

Perhaps, but that's rather the point of Gagarin in this case: those upgrades stretch a lot farther. I built the deck under the assumption that the Runner would likely have ways to breach the server *fairly* consistently, but when they have to pay to access the Agenda or that Ghost Branch in addition to the other things they want to access in that server Lynn becomes much scarier. To that end, seems like Hades and either High Risk or Graft is the way to go. Which comes down to whether I can squeeze a HHN or two in somewhere.

>>53625350
I had considered Snare!s and similar which might pad up RnD some but it would make the bluffing less consistent as well. It's the same reason I'm not running Atlas. (Well that and to a degree because I wanted to see how well the deck could do without a 3/2.) Pretty much everything gets I>A'd or I>AA'd to turn running the server into a game of chicken. To that end I actually do wish I could get away with all 4/2's and I really don't want to have to resort to Food. I don't have a problem with the card itself it just doesn't feel right for the direction I want this deck to go.

>>53631429

Oh right, I almost forgot...

>>53627486
What else would you suggest in terms of defensive upgrades in this case? My influence is already pretty tight and Weyland doesn't really have much in terms of in-house options.

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>>53631472
>Weyland doesn't really have much in terms of in-house options.
That was my point.
You either import in defensive upgrades, or work around it - depending on the deck that could be by making a kill threat (you'll need lots of money, and it'll likely work well with Graft) or by using advancable assets as bait

>>53631268
"Seeing" where? Stimhack?
I'm intrigued though, sounds cool.

You could tell a story with matched decks
You could make some custom requirements
You could unlock Data Packs or big boxes
You could create a handful of custom cards

>>53631631
The Watchdog campaign, apparently inspired by Monitor, there is a streaming of the first few chapters I think.

>>53631268
>How do you think a campaign should develop?
AHLCG type advancements might be good. I don't dislike the current "have X in score area or win Y times" method, but having to work towards a goal that isn't something you're doing anyway feels good and helps with immersion. Not a fan of how they laid out the story either, as the end of each one is implied rather than you having done something to end it. Compare to AHLCG's ending for the core set's first scenario, which really makes you feel like you're a part of things happening outside of the games, and you're not just trying to score a certain card or win more games than the other.

>What mechanics are good and which ones are detrimental?
Mid game set reveals are the absolute best, as are the corresponding conditional triggers. Just the feel of being limited to avoid the potentially bad triggers and working towards good triggers is really interesting and fun. Also, if the card pool is small enough I'd include certain event triggers either mid game or at the end for certain cards, like a "whenever you score 2 Hostile Takeovers or play Aggressive Negotiation during a single game, immediately reveal set 5", or "if you installed Data Dealer during a game, at the end of the game, reveal set 4".

The big problem with a narrative campaign in a competitive game is one side steamrolling the other, however. Negative triggers and aftereffects could help here, as are catch up mechanics, though I'm a bit wary on the latter as the balance there is a lot more unpredictable.

>>53631429
Going to throw out that Data Raven and Kakugo are pretty damn good at discouraging RnD digs, which will probably leave HQ open to Siphon spam though.

>>53631631
CodeMarvelous played one on YouTube, it was interesting if unwieldy to play on Jinteki.net. Still suffered a bit from the "story ending with no input" bit I mentioned above, but the video ended on an amazing note.

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>>53631901
Nice - I'm just checking out the stream video, yeah it does look like it's based on Monitor - Lana and Bex mentioned in the beginning certainly are

>>53631922
Mid-game reveals sound fun

>>53631631

The kill threat in this case is Red Herrings with Lynn and Ghost Branch thrown in for good measure. It's usually six creds to nab the Agenda in and of itself. They're usually too poor to trash Lynn but they will go after the Herrings when they can which is what Friends is for.

>>53631922
>Going to throw out that Data Raven and Kakugo are pretty damn good at discouraging RnD digs, which will probably leave HQ open to Siphon spam though.

Kakugo's a good one. Siphon spam is precisely the reason I'm running Pop-up+Bailiff though. Helps keep you afloat when you can make a credit or two off of those HQ/RnD/Archives farming runs. That said Pop-up would probably be the first thing on the chopping block if I wanted to free up influence. Tapestry seems pretty taxing but I'm not sure if it's enough. Though if the Runner elects not to break it it does let you shuffle around some stuff in HQ/RnD to try to pad the multiaccess.

I can't decide if IP Block is a good include. Other than an AI heavy meta and the Data Raven combo, any particular reason to include such a porous piece of ice that isn't particularly taxing? Considering switching to Seidr Adaptive Barrier instead, or another type of ice and using Fire Walls instead.

>>53632677
Huh, interesting that Tapestry is only 1 influence. Had fun with it in my Seidr TD deck, definitely great over RnD, funny interaction with Medium digs if they don't break it. Might make a good candidate for my IP Block influence.

I saw the general and thought I'd drop by.

I haven't played since...I think the first big box after the core set? It's been a while.

What's changed? The game any different? Power creep, etc?

>>53633342
I love IP block, why do you think it's not taxing? A 4 strength 2sub barrier that hates AI for 2c. By itself it's only a trace3, which is decent considering everything. But if you're playing Colossus and Mausoleus that gives away tags like candy, it's pretty good.

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>>53633409
We are on the verge of power crepes, rotation is hitting the first 2 cycles and some cards are appearing to replace the old ones.

>>53633449
Mostly due to the trace 3 thing, since I only have 2 copies if I don't find them early enough then only that sub will ever matter. Colossus and Mausolus will almost always get broken anyway, so they don't really improve it's effectiveness. Atleast with Seidr Adaptive it's a decent install whenever. And for 1 influence there's Tapestry for super tax, and Authenticator which is a fine 2 cost hard ETR Code Gate.

I'll admit I haven't actually played the card in a proper game though, so could be my worries are unfounded.

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>>53633409
Power creep hasn't been too bad, core and early set stuff still sees play, but it is notable - mostly for the good (assets are much better), occasionally for the worse (some assets are ass to play against), and some "improvements" were heavy handed to the point of being a bit broken

Still a good game though

>>53633409
Biggest thing in recent times would be the new Terminal Directive campaign, which tells a narrative storyline as two players - each playing the corresponding sides - play through games.

As for meta changes though, there's a pretty good post over at reddit

>>53633505

I sure hope not. In spite some of the controlled power-creep I'm pretty much liking the power drop we've seen on some of the game mechanics (multi-access, card swapping tricks)

Also, power crepes sounds like a yummy rebalance of pancakes decks.

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>>53634354
>power crepes sounds like a yummy rebalance of pancakes decks.
This is goign to have to be a deck name at some point, it's just too good not to.

Also yeah, the more nuanced multiaccess is nice (though pic related is still around, giving R&D the finger)

Does anyone know what the 'controversy' the FB group is simultaneously both up in arms about and covering up? Something about the European Champs stream?

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>>53634459
I heard Dan issued an apology. I know no more.

>>53634457
Medium and parasite should get easier to deal if we get some more anti virus techs. Macrophage and CVS are pretty nice for different niches.

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Ahhh, Inf problems in argus - MCA informant seems so much more usable than Contract Killer, but muh snares, muh ravens

>>53634459
As far as controversies go I think it's a little overblown. Dan and Terrificy commentated the grand final game of Euros smash drunk, literally drinking from a bottle of vodka during play, and were just obnoxious drunks. Dan at one point said that clearly the Corp didn't have the 24/7 Boom combo because he "hadn't dropped his pants and slapped his dick on the table". Terrificy basically just wanted to tell everyone how he'd hooked up with a girl the night before, then started a game of Fuck/Marry/Kill with Netrunner cards. Which lead Dan at some point to say he'd marry a card, kill it, then fuck the corpse.

To a lesser extent they also spent most of the game complaining about how boring the decks at the grand final table were. Didn't show the players who'd made it all that way much respect, although to be fair they all know each other so I don't think I was a deliberate attempt to put them down.

So yah, not the best look all round, but the outrage seems a just a touch overblown. The people I really feel sorry for were the NeoReading Grid guys who'd let them on stream.

>>53638103
This is why we need professionals and guests stays as guests. Anybody who've seen Dan streams would see it coming.

>>53638103

As far as controversies go, that pretty meek.

>>53638103
Thanks, thought it'd be something like that. With all the talk of inclusivity being thrown around on the FB I expected Dan to have drunkenly made a comment like 'Hitler did nothing wrong' or saying someone got metaphorically raped.

Given the conversation we've had for a few threads, I'm thinking a campaign heavily based on BP could prove cool.

>>53643549

A runner objective to give 7 BP in a game? Or perhaps a running total over the campaign (counting runner given BP specifically)?

>>53633409
It's weird.
Apparently there's some guy in FFG who keeps wanting to sexify cards so they're powerful enough to sell data packs, but then people complain a lot and the cards end up being chucked on the most wanted list (basically a nerf list that basically chucks extra neutral influence onto cards) to balance it out.

So there have definitely been instances of attempted power creep, but they've been knocked into line somewhat.

Still concerning though.

>>53643596

I was more thinking BP being accrued/reduced across games, with both positive/negative effects depending on their number and gain/loss during the previous game.

Reach/give X bad pub as alternative win or lose X games trigger could be interesting too instead of the agenda.

Reina trying to expose Weyland and having to go at it layer after layer....

>>53644206

Perhaps the corp getting more kill-related stuff for free the more BP they accumulated might be appropriate? A desperate beast is a dangerous one after all.

>>53645245
And viceversa, the Corp could locate the Runner and make it easier for him to trace him or giving him tags. For instance, traces give an additional tag plus whatever the trace is about, or every runner turn we have a trace 1 if he's not tagged and made a run the last turn, virtually Door to door.

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>>53645245
How heavily do you think a thematic deck could/should be stressed?

Thinking back to CodeMarvellous's video, when he built a deck for running, he just went straight for Faust DLR because there were no restrictions (he even admits he's being a bit shitty by doing it) - it did work out in some cases, and as he was a runner that's been inside NBN it sort of works thematically as well, but he was definitely thinking with power first

>>53644206
>>53645245
>>53646388

Definitely something there to help make spin the campaign it so much wanted to be.

>>53647854

Another another , but depends on who I'm playing with. If I know I'm playing with civilized people who will do the same, I just go all theme.

What's the point on making theme deck if you plan.have to fall back on the same things you're already playing all the time?

>>53647854
I wouldn't stress on it any further than forcing the inclusion of certain cards. After all Netrunner card are so thematic you could always explain them away after the fact instead of building around a scenario (CodeMarvelous' Lana Rael wanted to get the deed over and done with quickly, which is why she opted to dig through RnD as quickly as possible, looking for any scraps of information). It's flimsy, but that hasn't been detrimental to most other narrative games (though some would disagree).

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>>53648532
Yeah, I'd say that's fair, though >>53648430 definitely has good points.

Also, yes, Spin clearly wanted to be a bit of a campaign (and Monster Slayer is clearly one version of it - it's basically Spin + all the non-rotating cards)

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>>53648569
Yeah, Spin and Lunar have this campaign feel to them. I'm not sure about Mumbad and 23 seconds, they feel less campaign and more "This happened and everyone is affected by it". I guess that could also be a campaign. The rest are just places and people.

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>>53649660
To me Flashpoint and Mumbad feel like there's bits of campaigns in them - you could play Nero's push for power or Jes's mission to protect her sister, while Jinteki tries to win over the populace, or HB/NBN trying to come out on top, but there is a bit of a sense that they're telling a full story of events.

Speaking of events, if you compare corp and runner Currents, it becomes much more stark that in almost all cases it's the corp launching an operation (I think the only exception is lag time, and even that could be based on corporate actions), where as the runners' Current Events are mostly what you'd normally think of as current events, with just a little push by the runner to help them, especially the neutral ones (and tellingly there's twice as many runner neutrals as there are corp neutrals)

>>53649660

Lunar's plot as it were is pretty much Nasir's trip to free that unknown AI, with no explicit corp interference.

>>53649969

Mumbad could easy have been shaper/HB vs anarch/Jinteki if team matches were possible.

>>53651312

Anarch/Jinteki?

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>>53653003
Well there are a lot of riots and things - Fear the Masses, pic related, EMP, run amok, but I wouldn't have put them on the Jinteki "team"

Actually, despite some flubs and some unfortunately powered cards (on both ends of the spectrum), I do really like a lot of Mumbad and the themes and cards there.

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>>53651312
>with no explicit corp interference.
He did get shot at though

>>53654019

Mumbad is a weird cycle. On the one, hand, I *really* dig some of the cards and I love the fluff. There's some real interesting/fun to play stuff in the cycle. And then, even when it didn't pan out, I really respect the designers going out of their comfort zone and taking some risks - after all the complaints of cards being too conservative, one would be hypocritical not to.
But then, and that's the sad thing, those cards/design that didn't pan out? They hit the game hard I think - especially corp side.

And last, since mentioning corp side, I think something happened with the cycle that hurt regardless of the design issues (however much they magnified it): we hit a critical mass of (must-trash) assets.
Regardless of the quality of the cycle itself, I wonder to which extent it couldn't not have been a problem cycle anyway.

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>yfw when what should have been a beautiful kill backfires horribly
>runner has been checking all my remotes
>Put down a snare and a DRT - I use DRT's anyway, and the snare might get lucky (I aslo have scorch in hand)
>runner runs the snare
>not just any run, a fucking Mad Dash
>I'm grinning (Jnet, it doesn't matter), here comes a sweet kill
>Snare hits IHW
>DRT hits a second IHW
>Oh, and one more thing
>The runner has 2 Clan Vengeance
>They've just had 3 instances of damage
>Same number of cards in hand for them
>And now they can trash 3 of my hand, twice
>Fucking clans

>>53656796

Nice one.

>>53653003
>>53654019

One of the fluff pieces in the pack describes Jes fighting off some Anarch kid hacking attack. Said kid had 'middle class' parents who's jobs are directly threatened by clones, especially if they were freed.
The reds are supposed to be for the little guys after all.

>>53659323

Oh, and jinteki are naturally opposed to their products just getting loose.
So even if they don't see eye to eye on the details, both jin and the reds have the same overall objective in Mumbad, and the direct opposite for Jes/shaper and HB.
Crims/NBN/Big W are relatively neutral in that conflict.

>>53659427
You mean orange, red is Jinteki.

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>>53659427
>NBN
NBN as a whole might not care, but there's interested parties who have invested heavily in NBN's operations in Mumbad that very much do care

Crims and Weyland are just using the whole thing to get more leverage though, that's true

>>53659827

Isn't jinteki more dark brown then red? It's also odd to think of anarchs as oranges.

>>53660241

I doubt NBN has any attachment to either side of this conflict, so that still makes them a relative neutral party. If anything, the more conflict between both sides, the better the ratings.

>>53659323

Is spite of some Anarch cards being so central theme-wise (Run Amok for the quote, Fear the Masses, Salsette Slums...), I can't but see the faction as background noise (pun non-intended but welcome) to the overarching conflict at hands.

If only: there was no Anarch ID to the cycle.

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>>53661956
>I doubt NBN has any attachment to either side of this conflict
Here, have a read of the insert from FtM... NBN may not be directly directly involved, but they certainly have an important opinion

>>53659323
Worth noting though is Jes is in the card art for Run Amok.

>>53664958
Is it? She doesn't wear any of her defining characteristics. The hair, the gear, Maya, everything is different.
I would have liked Run Amok more if it tagged you after destroying the ICE. Not for balance, but to see more interactivity with Jesminder. What cards does she have to interact? Siphon, vamp, data siphon and Maya?

>>53666883
She's left most, the one with a purple streak in her hair, though I guess beyond that and the similar looking outfit there's no real proof it's her.

Security Nexus works with Jes I think, since the tag is given during the run. Also if you can install Jarogniew Mercs mid run you can avoid the tag too.

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>>53667288
I know Bank job AA looks incredible but I wouldn't mind the original art with the championship treatment.

In fact, what if they release the core box with all cards like that.

>>53668701
Just gotta hope a Crim deck and corp deck with the remaining 2-of and 1-of cards wins Worlds!

>>53669525

We only need Desperado as that important 1-off. Virtually all other 1/2-offs not already released as FB/AAs hardly need that 3rd copy.

>>53663987

Doesn't really say Mr Salem was on anyone's side in particular, certainly not explicitly HB. If anything it's surprising he *isn't* featured as a Crim to begin with.

>>53670061

He is to Crim from NBN what Mills is to Anarch from Weyland I guess.

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>>53670061
I guess - to be fair, as far as he's concerned, he IS a side, and the whole point of Alliance cards was that the big 4 don't totally dominate Mumbad - they have to work with local concerns to a degree.

That said, enemy of my enemy might apply, seeing as he clearly opposes Jinteki

>>53670182
That's a point, though he's also setting a precedent for people like pic related

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HB IDs are cool in theme, just a shame they're all overshadowed by Core

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>>53671406
I think they're also the only faction with full sized pics of all their IDs

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>>53671416
Except for the draft ID

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>>53671432
The exception to being overshadowed

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>>53671449
Pretty much the only one though

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>>53671464
Just about counts, right?

Though like 90% of why the other corps' IDs haven't got pics is because Emilo Rodriguez hasn't updated his gallery in a billion years

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>>53671522
And lastly, the ID that never was

Anyone play much of the Chronos that won?

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>>53671553
I did, for a while, a rigshooter, it was so oppressive that my colleagues did all but asked me to play something else. And Political assets weren't a thing yet back then. I can't imagine what could happen now.

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>>53672277
>I can't imagine what could happen now.
Not gonna lie, Bioethics in Chronos is a filthy thing

Not sure how viable rigshooter would be with the conspiracy breakers about, but I'm tempted to try and find out

What did your deck look like?
Your pic was something I didn't think of, might be fun

>>53672644
Hokusai, shocks, a single Neural Emp, batty, clone retirement (bc Val was dominant), aggsecs, black list, team Sponsorships to recur everything.

>>53672738
Oh! And allele repression! Very funny card.