/srg/ Shadowrun General - Manaspheres In The Dark

First for trolls

FBR builds. Shit, or not shit?
In comparison to other Sam builds, of course.

>>53373629
Unless you have absolute piles of money, don't bother.

>>53373206
Revenant Adept. Finally a mechanically sound way to have a character that starts the game with immunity to ageing (without being a bloody vampire). 90 year old 'Runners here I come.

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>>53373629
With german aka "no need to bother with your normal physical stats" rules = yes please

With the others: meh, maybe.
You can create very beefy tanks with high WIL thanks to cyber singularity seeker and have plenty of rooms for gadgets, but if your GM forces you to take the Cybertorso (which has no ground in the rules, but some do), you are lacking essence for INI improvements

To the anon from the last thread who asked where you could find the german rules for upgrading Cyberware:

Bodyshop Seite 87 or pic related

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>when the street sam and the infected in heavy combat armor fight each other
I swear it was few solid minutes of me and this lobotomized guy shooting, dodging and soaking at each other with no damage taken whatsoever
Meanwhile everyone else around was trying to throw some potshots without dying in a single hit.

>>53372825
Drugs and ware initiative bonuses do not stack, with the possible exception of move by wire (but that may as well be only due to poor cgl editing)

>>53374547
Accelerator explictely stacks

>>53374547
Wait. So I can't take Jazz and use a Synaptic booster?

WHAT THE FUCK IS THE POINT OF DRUGS IN THE FIRST PLACE THEN AAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

>>53374593
being cheap and cheerful alternatives to having your body chopped up/open?

It leaves you more essence to spend on other stuff that you maybe want more/can't get via Drugs, too

Like large smuggling compartments to smuggle your smaller chummers, if you are a troll and your GM is a good guy

>>53374593
>>53374624
also, only specific effects like boosted REA/INT or additional dice wouldn't stack. At least that's how I read it

So say you crank some Kamikaze but still have reaction boosters. You'd get the other stuff from the drug, for better or worse

>>53374593
According to MissionsFAQ?
You can't.

If you stick to the printed rules?
You can.

I actually prefer the missions way, makes Drugs more of a third way.

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>>53373775
There's nothing in the rulebook that says I can't play Daniel Howling Coyote in disguise

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Spiritual Pilgrim in Chummer is not working. I'm meeting the requirements (Assensing 4 and Academic Knowledge: Magical Theory 3) and this is the message I'm getting.

Yekka, bug in 5.193.36: Suprathyroid Gland is not in Bioware.

>finally made a mage hunter-killer who can hold their own in combat.

Mysad Samurai OP.

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I'm trying to homebrew some Jet Set Radio skates into my Shadowrun game, anyone got any suggestions?

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>>53376284
Skimmers?
Skimmers but gear not ware?
Cyberskates?

We already have this stuff, what are you looking for that's not in the gear we have already?

>>53376284
Skates allow you to go 1.5x speed base walk/run, with a pilot ground (3) to double that speed for Body Rounds.
Failure means you fall over and take 2 stun resisted by charisma only (it only hurts your pride.)

Gecko upgrades allow you to ride walls.

>>53376187
Post it on chummer

>>53374593
>>53374648
>>53374547
>Drugs and ware initiative bonuses do not stack
>Missions FAQ
Bingo. If you're not playing at a convention, then Missions based advice is about as RAW as saying, "You can't use Code Of Honour, it's banned."

Not to say it's all bad.

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Was looking through the weapons book when I saw the onotari arms ballista and got a really cool idea for a rigger. Trying to think of a way to design a drone my rigger can wear like a backpack. Give it a mechanical arm, a drone rack for some minidrones, and other assorted goodies to make him a gadgeteer of sorts. I suppose I could just fluff it as a proletariat drone that can compact itself to look like a backpack.

>>53376284
Have you tried VeloCity by chance?

>>53374593
You can take Jazz, but the reaction/init bonuses do not stack. So effectively you get only +1 physical limit. Of course, if Jazz's initiative bonus is greater than whatever you get from ware, you can use that instead.

>The synaptic booster cannot be combined with any other form of Reaction or Initiative enhancement.
>any other form
It's pretty explicit.

>>53378228
SYNAPTIC ACCELERATION
This gene augmentation improves the functioning ner-
vous system’s sodium-potassium channel depolariza-
tion and repolarization efficiency, thereby increasing
reaction speed. The character gains +1 to their Initia-
tive rating, +1 Initiative Dice, and a +1 dice pool mod-
ifier for all Ranged and Melee Defense Tests. If a char-
acter has an augmentation that increases their Initiative
or grants any Initiative Dice, synaptic acceleration has
no effect, and they do not regain Essence lost for taking
the treatment.

Retarded nigger says what?

>>53378516
If you look closely, you'll see that people were talking about synaptic boosters, not synaptic acceleration.

Retard.

What's best for hard to detect lethality in close combat? I'm debating between an adept and a biosam.

>>53378558
see
>>53372825

Actually, you fucking kike, they were talking about Accelerator.

>>53378646
See: >>53374593
>Wait. So I can't take Jazz and use a Synaptic booster?
>Wait. So I can't take Jazz and use a Synaptic booster?
>Wait. So I can't take Jazz and use a Synaptic booster?

Idiot.

>>53378646
see
>>53374593
>Wait. So I can't take Jazz and use a Synaptic booster?

So how would you guys talk a new player through making they're character as a GM?

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>>53378689
Well, first of all I'll boot Chummer/Chummer5 because that shit is dope as hell
Second: I'll ask what kind of character they want to build. Will they focus on the Astral, Matrix or Physical? Sneaky or Obvious? Support or Main?
Third: Build the actual character. Discuss Attribute and Skill allocation. Go through gear and ware. Round off the character if BP/Karma/Points remain.
Fourth: Fluff discussion. How do they look? How do they act? Are they open to others or closed off? Glass half full, half empty or something else? Where do they come from? What family/friends/acquaintances do they have? How did they become the person they are today? Why do they run? What are their Goals? and other questions. Basically Pic Related
Fifth: Final discussion. What do they see in their immediate future? What would they do for money? What would have to happen that they would retire from running?

>>53378689
Oh, and just noticed the "new player" part
Explain to them what kind of game SR is in your opinion. Give them a short summary of events and current state. Tell them where your game lies on the Black-Pink:Mohawk-Trenchcoat graph. Talk them through basic house rules (Chunky Salsa, gas grenades, other stuff) you have. Clear the question whether they fit your game or not. If they want wacky adventures and action scenes and you want to have a grim future where hard decisions have to be made then neither of you will be happy

Oh, and check the first link in the OP Pastebin. It's called that for a reason

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>>53378821
>>53378899
That's good advice, sorry I'm very new to this. So when chummer offers to take up additional source books, I'm guessing those are expansions which I could read ahead of time. Are there any in particular that warrant me doing so? Or should I just stick to 5e default for my first attampt at GMing?

>>53379100
As I always say: Running SR with just the core book is like running a marathon with one leg
Possible, but tedious
Personally I only allow books once I've read them and found them to be ok

If you allow all the books then the first thing there you should read are the rules, gear descriptions can be read later. Because small rules may really hurt your shit and you should get a clear view which rules you use, while the descriptions usually are self-contained

>>53379266
So any additional books you would recommend for me to look into? There's so many I wouldn't know where to start.

>>53379365
Run Faster, Run & Gun, Chrome Flesh, Street Grimoire, Forbidden Arcana. Cutting Aces and Hard Targets are good to have I suppose but far less important.
Don't know much about Rigging or Decking so I don't know how vital Rigger 5.0 or Data Trails are considered to be.

>>53379365
Well, my experience lies with 4e but here's what I know
>CRB
duh, get the Master Index version from the Pastebin
>Chrome Flesh
Augmentations, Toxins and other stuff
>Street Grimoire
Stuff for Awakened
>Data Trails
Decker stuff
>Rigger 5.0
Vehicles, Drones and Mod rules
>Run Faster
Various stuff. New CharGen methods (Sum-To-10 and Priority), Metavariants, Metasapients, new qualities. The CharGen methods are nice (they are good if you want specialist characters that grow horizontally rather than vertically), but most people ban metavariants, -sapients and infected. If you take stuff from it you'll be well advised to check it before allowing it
>Cutting Aces
All kinds of spy stuff.
>Run and Gun
Lots of gear of all types, plus new rules and other stuff. This one is IMO always good to take
>Bullets and Bandages
Various stuff about MedTech
>Howling Shadows
Critter book with stats and info about critter augmentation. Too bad the developers don't like runners having pets so no prices or availabilities for any critter.
>Shadow Spells
More spells
>Hard Targets
Various stuff about wetwork, with some weapons, adept powers and spells

Fluff-Wise you should take the stuff from 4e and before. Most important is the Sixth World Almanac (4e), which has the entire history of the setting up to ~2072 and gives an overview of all the various countries. Additionally you have Vice(4e, criminal underworld) and Shadows of [North America/Asia/Europe/...](3e) which has deeper info on the various places

Though some 5e player should look over this

>>53379589
I'll check those out, thanks! I'll probably prioritize them on the basis of what each of my players expresses interest in.

>>53379596
It's good to have the contents of each expansion, explained, thanks!

Can someone explain to me why Chummer isn't letting a mysad take shielding?

>>53380048
You don't have the Art Apoptropic Magic.

>>53380048
To expand on this, at the third initiation grade for Mysad, there is nothing

>>53380079
I managed to get to 4, if you take harmonious defense, the one right after can only be power point, then nothing

>>53380107
Expanding further: I took power point at 1 and 2 is empty

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What kind of disguises do you guys use when you have to go hot?

My players are about to take on a motorcycle gang that's bribed a vehicle spirit to help them win street races. Any ideas for how to crank this up to 11?

If the surface area for the purposes of Dikote for a Katana is roughly 500 cm squared, what would be a reasonable estimate for the surface area for a Highland Forge Claymore built for a very large Troll?

How does Astral Hazing work with environmental background counts? Is it cumulative, like if you're in a place that normally makes magic harder you make it even harder still, or is it its own thing where if you theoretically went somewhere where magic was even worse than the field you generate, you would actually be generating a field of comparatively better conditions?

Specifically, I want to make a changeling who's an ancient egyptian animal-headed human thing, and I was thinking of fluffing astral hazing as them having a connection to the underworld and leaking its astral atmosphere into the world through their body. The idea of that actually being an improvement in extreme conditions would fit better with that, but perhaps that's not how it was intended to work?

>>53380981
Chummer, as with most of CGL's stuff:
Wing it
Wing it like the majestic eagle you are

>>53380981
If you're going by RAW, it basically sets the Background Count around you to 3, always.

I'm about to run my first real Shadowrun game, and I have a couple questions, if those more knowledgeable would oblige.

1. One of my players is playing a shaman, and likes to min-max. Is there any specific spell/spirit cheese I should be looking out for?

2. I'm running the 5th season Missions, much of which takes place in the Chicago Containment Zone. The books say that the CZ imposes -2 to all magic actions (default background count) and -2 to all Matrix actions (Noise rating 2). Is it really necessary to gimp spellcasters and deckers right off the bat, especially with this being our first time playing?

>>53381019
>Is there any specific spell/spirit cheese I should be looking out for?
Spirits
Just Spirits

>>53381019
Spirits are very powerful, but if your player is playing as a shaman, I don't believe he gets access to the most powerful kinds (Guardian, Man, etc.), so I guess just watch out for general spirit use/abuse.

>>53381031
>>53381050
Alright, thanks people.

>>53378641
Hard to detect like 'can get close without being noticed' or 'leaves little trace'?

>>53379589
>forbidden arcana

No. If they want to play an alchemist or use one of those Mentor Spirits then maybe, but the rest of it is just jerking off over the most stuffed archetypes. There's more than enough in core and SG for adepts and mages.

>>53380981
By RAW you're creating a set BC of 3, always. By RAI you make the area worse, like you're generating noise. You aren't aspecting it to anything, you just have a general negative effect on mana.

>>53378641
Whichever one has a finger compartment with a monowhip in it.

I'm back for more, chummers!

What are some rules that y'all just don't care enough about to use? Things that if the GM just made some shit up instead no one would care?

>>53381008
Even if the background count for a whole city is 3, you acclimate to that, and then you only need to worry about brief, isolated, and atypical incidents, or more smaller and more persistent situations.

>>53380981
>How does Astral Hazing work with environmental background counts?
Independent overlapping shapes.

A question for the famous runners: What are you famous for?

>>53382224
Once had a decker who would hijack KSAF broadcasts to speak truth to the masses. People loved 'the Other Weatherman', even if they never really acted on what he said.

>mysad samurai has 25+ blades dice

This is beyond overkill.

>>53381518
I'm looking mostly for can get close without getting noticed, and then being tough enough to leave.

>>53382663
Post the character?

>>53382224
Trying to make a Ex-Urban Brawl Star, famous for winning a championship

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>>53382980
I'd go biosam, personally. Discreet 'ware that can go anywhere, bone lacing, platelet factory and orthoskin are good armour/ways to keep standing that an adept can't have, and doesn't get fucked up by background counts/people spotting your fetish in the astral. Make sure to get Agile Defender. Also, have a visible datajack - it's useful 'ware, and it explains everything in an assensing test which gets less than 4 hits, because all they know is you have less essence.

Plus, cool shit like hidden poison glands/stingers. Make sure to check out geneware. Nacro/Nephretic Screen are your bread and butter for initiative- Cram/Psyche or Kamikaze, depending on how you want to do it, or see if you can get a gland to produce a custom combat drug (obviously needing GM approval).

>>53382980
Bioadept.

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>>53380048
Unless you disable the house rule that you don't need to initiate into Arts, metamagics with Art requirements are filtered. Toggling the option to hide items you can't take and attempting to take the appropriate item should tell you why you can't take it.
>>53376000
Suprathyroid is 20R. It's being filtered by the availability limits. Take restricted gear or untick the checkbox to hide items over your limit. >>53375404
Hrm. Can't replicate it. Can you confirm the karma/base values of the skills for me or upload a copy of the character? Skill requirements test your LearnedRating, not the dicepool.

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>>53383602
Excellent taste per usual.

>>53383602
Yekka, can you address >>53380142

My gm said to reflect our 4e character's skills to just double whatever was on our sheet when we converted;

Is this wise?

>>53384361
No.

>>53384702
Why?

>>53382663
When you have plus 20 dice its not about winning, its about winning with a back flip slam dunk.

>>53384983
Because it doesn't add up.

There was a bit of discussion on it in the last thread.

>>53385017
Can you give me the Cliff's Notes

>>53385109
No.

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>>53384227
It might be fixed in the latest commit, but I couldn't replicate the problem you were having precisely.
>>53384361
Tl;dr even Harlequin was limited to six dice in 4e. The official conversion guide recommends you convert 6 to 10, but given the scope of the changes from 4e to 5e and the amount of character concepts that have radically changed in their viability, let alone the different qualities that are available, I'd suggest just asking your GM to start over from scratch as prime runners. That way you can keep the concept of your character without being lashed to skills and mechanics that you wouldn't have picked if you'd known there were alternatives.

>>53384983
Lets say you had 6 in a skill from 4e
This means 12 in current edition
Or being one of the few best in your field.
With 12 in Cybertechnology you are the guy who is developing unique deltaware prototypes.
12 in Unarmed Combat means you are almost on Ip Man level. It means there is only 1 guy in the world who is better than you.
It simply does not translate

Does anyone know where I can get my Hands on german rulebooks?
I know the pastebin in the OP has some, but it seems to have not been updatet recently.

>>53385831
From your friendly local game shop, probably.

>>53385880
>>53385831
I think US do actually sell PDF versions of them, too.

>>53385536
>With 12 in Cybertechnology you are the guy who is developing unique deltaware prototypes.
Nah. With a 12 in Cybertechnology, you're an extraction target for making Chrome Flesh's "murky future" a reality. Poly-functional auto-adaptive cyberware, personally customised cybersuites, etc.

>>53386034
>Poly-functional auto-adaptive cyberware, personally customised cybersuites,
Extra arms

>>53386057
Lets not get too crazy, man.

>>53385536
Also;
>It means there is only 1 guy in the world who is better than you.
People get confused over each natural maximum, as though that's where the actual limits lie.

After you factor in Aptitude for 13 max skill, augmented skills, magically enhanced skills, etc - then you can start looking at the related attribute. Exceptional Attribute, Genetic Optimisation, Metagenetic Expression, etc. Then dice pool modifiers - qualities and gear.

>>53386057
The only reason these don't exist right now has nothing to do with the rules as written, but peoples' interpretations.

>>53386034
>Nah. With a 12 in Cybertechnology, you're an extraction target
Chummer, you're an extraction target way before that. Rank 12-13 guys are at the level where megas would risk war over their control.

>>53386112
I was taking only pure skills in consideration.
Since a skill 6 human can enhance and specialize to 12 yes but so can the rating 12 skill human. It would actually be easier for the 12 cybertechnology researcher to get himself upgraded with ware than for 6 cybertechnology assistant

>>53382224
Chromewolf,
Was framed for nervegassing kids, but was later proven innocent.
European Pitfight champion.
Designed the Steel Raptor fighting style which was a fighting style focused around cybernetic legs with spurs, grappling hook in the arm and in general high-speed tackles.

Complete fucking shit in still standing fights, but nothing survived a charge.

>>53385000
Well, one could just start making more attacks rather than hitting limit over and over.

>>53386151
/shrug

High priority extraction target.

>megas would risk war over their control
I don't think that's as common as you seem to.

>>53386187
>It would actually be easier for the 12 cybertechnology researcher to get himself upgraded with ware than for 6 cybertechnology assistant
Which is fine if all I were talking about was augmentation. It's not. What I'm talking about is "there is only 1 guy in the world who is better than you".

While the topic is on skill 12/13; it's also curiously easy to get a sensei at that skill rank.

>>53386319
Well fair enough
The fluff and mechanic break apart there, I have to admit

>>53386220
RAW, spurs go in arms. Foot blades are for legs.

>>53386278
There are a handful of these individuals in the world, they create entire new techniques and technologies. Whoever gets to pick the fruits of their creation is going to make a serious profit. So yes, it might just be worth risking war over.

Why do non-run skills like cybertechnology suck so bad in actual play?
Like, you'd think you would be able to bodge together some MAD SCIENCE arms, but it isn't a thing I think.

>>53387180
Because of the efficiency of bulk and teamwork.

Even as far back as 1e (possibly 2e), it was better to buy then make, despite what the fluff said.

I forget the exact example I saw, but it was something like a few months and a few times the cost to make a deck that hung with the slightly-better-than-worst crowd.

>>53387180
Because they fucked up on doing anything well, craftwise, in 5e. Software, Mechanic, Cybertechnology, etc. all lack anything but the most vague and useless rules.

>>53387255
>>53387233
this sucks because I really want to play some kind of mad inventor, but cannot.
I wanna get to 12 in something and start goddamn plotlines because my prototypes are getting huge amounts of attention.

>>53387313
>I wanna get to 12 in something

You can go right ahead and flush that dream down the toilet. Unless your GM babies you and you play hundreds of sessions, you'll never get that high. You'll probably never get to 8.

The only way you can fulfill your dream is to work out some shit with your GM and start chargen with 12 in a skill.

>>53387313
Honestly, get to 7, a specialty, and you're almost at the level where the corps would probably try to court you for your work.

They might do it anyway since you're working (effectively) solo and that's a bigger limit than anything else. If they find something interesting, they can either pressure you with the threat of a datasteal run or apply the carrot and offer the things you need most.

Underlings, budget, and (more) knowledge of what doesn't work.

That's the biggest reason why Advanced Alchemy preparations and new and novel ware are basically unknowable if you don't have a source that already knows.

Takes too much time on each bad one, and you probably won't know that you've got a bad one until you're already done.

>>53387313
No way
This would mean somebody have finally started sensible inventions
Like looking through nathraki/changelings cerebellum for how they operate extra limbs and applying it to normal humans. Its not like cerebellum booster and knowledge infusion are not a thing.
Or mass produced power armor. And now milspec is not power armor. The Armadilo Spacesuit comes closer with increased STR it gives.

>>53387498
>Like looking through nathraki/changelings cerebellum for how they operate extra limbs and applying it to normal humans.
>implying they can't already

>>53387709
where are my extra cyberlimbs then?
I want them!

>>53387409
>Play an Adept
>Aptitude
>Base rank in skills is 7
>Reflex Recorder to 8
>Improved Ability to 12
Tada

>>53387805
Core book.

Alright, /srg/, I've got a new batch of players from work. I've already given them the rule books, introduced them to the setting and talked with them about what kind of runners they want to make. However, I'm giving them a little bit of time to fiddle with character creation on their own and make something they're happy with.

Point is, I'm gonna run a one-shot with HTR teams, and I need HTR archetypes to make pregen characters for. Give me your weird specialist ideas.

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Is it possible to create a playable Enchanting-based mage in Fifth Edition? Looking over the rules makes it seem like they tried hard to make Artificing and Alchemy sub-par, but I wouldn't want to have to abandon a character concept because one branch of magic is just inferior.

>>53389436
As a fan of alchemy, I have to say this. You're going to have the cheese things and take advantage of the new Vault of Ages (and probably some of that other stuff in FA) to get to okay.

You can do better, but that gets into the dangerously cheesy level of stuff. Like, using a few reagents to prevent phys from a force 8 preparation is a little cheesy, but it still gives you a good chance of getting an okay die pool and strong effect.

Doing it to a force 10 (the best you can preserve in the Vault) is moreso with the right choices. For example, get a few steel balls, make them into preparations of Blast (an indirect AoE stun doing combat spell) and have a flying drone carry them.

For the less cheezy that's 8S -8AP, 8m area, and probably around ten dice to cast with. More cheezy is 10S -10AP, 10m and casting a bit competently.

Add in the right qualities from FA and you can even get some extra dice when using it. Oh, and don't forget that if you astrally travel, Manifesting lets you activate preparations in the real world.

>>53389436
Enchanting is shit. SHIT.

S H I T
H
I
T

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>>53388324

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Next time I have the spare karma I'm looking at learning Fling. I've worked out with one of our street sams that if we coordinate we can use his grenade launcher to get distance, then let me correct the grenade's course when it gets close using Fling. Long range 'nade sniping.
Not only that, but we can use it to shoot grenades around corners, too, and Fling away enemy grenades that get thrown at us. Anybody else ever got super creative using Fling before?

>>53389739
I think you want Magic Fingers, not Fling. Fling is just for shooting objects at people with magic, Magic Fingers is for manipulation of objects.

>>53389821
Excuse me, Fling is for shooting objects at things* with magic. You could Fling as well, but I still think Magic Fingers is more what you want, since Fling is intended to be some weird combat action and Magic Fingers is for actual manipulation.

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>>53389527
>Vault of Ages
So that will at least remove the degradation problem. It seems like 90% of expansions to alchemy are focused on reagents, despite them not being important to the alchemical or artificing process.

What spells are worth taking as preparations? Illusion and Detection spells seem naturally right-out, so all the ideas I had were either lots of big, AoE Combat spells and possibly Health spells with an Atomizer.

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>>53383602
Here's the Spiritual Pilgrim problem character
my.mixtape.moe/zhbhuc.chum5

thanks

>>53389856
Ask your GM about Vault of Ages sizes, and whether you can tie the ratings to the similar rating sizes for medkits in Bullets and Bandages. Having fresh preparations in the trunk would be a godsend.

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>>53389882
Urghhhh. God damned Academic/Street split. Okay, I'll have to work around that. Will be fixed soon.

>>53389856
If you cheeze some, there's a few AoE combat spells that are useful. You just need to reagent limit them so that you don't take physical drain from making it at a high force.

Powerblade is okay, as long as you limit it to mild cheezyness. It's mostly for letting allies hit spirits hard, but has other uses. Don't use Manablade, because even at low forces it can be Too Cheezy.

Some of the incidental buffs are okay, like say Armor or Combat Sense. Even a bad roll isn't that bad since it's still extra armor or defense dice, but they're not exactly really good.

You might want Stabilize on there, because potency 5 should hopefully be what you need, and it even fits in the Vault. If you have actual casting abilities, buff that with Healthy Glow at high force. If not, use a mid level preparation and don't expect more than a die benefit on healing. Albeit one that lasts all day and is a bonus to all kinds of healing.

Ice Sheet, if you're lucky, can also be useful, but at that point I'd say just spend the money/time and attempts and get a Force 7+ Ice Storm preparation and do it a few times till the reagent limit doesn't screw you over too much.

Oh, and reagents got a new straight up limit raising feature in FA, but that's not really helpful for the cheeze needed to use alchemy well.

>>53389821
>>53389849
Oh no, I mean Fling. The intention is to completely redirect the grenade in mid-air at high speeds.

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>>53390177
Fling only works if the goal is 'send something off at a different angle'. If you want to do things like correcting an overshot grenade so it drops down directly behind cover, catching a grenade to throw back, anything that requires any degree of finesse, you want Magic Fingers. All Fling will let you do is make another roll to throw it, and you're unlikely to get more hits than the sammy did originally in terms of scatter (making it not 'long range grenade sniping' and 'average accuracy grenade sent approximately twice as far as normal'), while Magic Fingers gives you both STR and AGI scores to do precisely what you want.

Shoutout to Forbidden Arcana's Alchemy section, for including run hooks for teams without alchemists. Did someone replace Hardy with a competent RPG editor when no one was looking?

>>53390991
Seems to mostly be Wakshaani's doing; he's certainly crowing like it's all his baby. >>53389882
Fixed in the latest build.

If a TM uses puppeteer to perform a malicious matrix action (e.g. data spike yourself, or garbage in/garbage out) does the defending device resist its own attempt? Just wondering

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>>53391005
Thanks for fixing it.

>>53391793
I would say it resists its own action

>>53391793
Yes it will resist the damage but no dodge will be allowed

>>53373206
Thinking of making my players encounter a cyberzombie. How are they built? Just make a street sam but ignore essence costs?

>>53394408
Aren't they dual-natured, too?

>>53394408
here's the basics:
>You take a person and get them to one of the 10 or so black clinics in the world
>The mages involved (which need a F12 lodge) go on a metaplanar quest to a deep metaplane and have to succeed
>The body is filled with Delta Grade Ware until the essence goes beneath 0 which creates a Essence Defect (my words)
>You also implant an Invoked Memory Stimulator. This jogs the emotional centers of the brain and keeps a small veneer of sanity
>This also raises the background count so you need cleansing
>Afterwards they go into stasis for a week +(Ess. Defect) days after which they make a INT+WIL test with a threshold depending on the Defect. If they make a single hit they stay, otherwise they fail

A cyberzombie is characterized by
>All Delta grade Ware
>an Invoked Memory Stimulator
>A MAG rating of 1 and being dual natured
>A constant background count that increases in range if they keep in one place
>hardened armor of 2x(Defect), rounded normally
>All max attributes increased by the essence defect (So a human cyberzombie has a maximum natural STR of 6+(Ess. Defect))
>Madness

Keep in mind this is from 4e, but since 5e hasn't rules for them AFAIK this is your only way

>>53394526
Are they?
They have negative essence, so they have to absolutely bizarre to look at on the astral plane, but I don't know if they can perform magic or act in the astral plane.

>>53394827
They can't perform magic AFAIK, but they can bypass Spirit ITNW and attack them on the astral with their bodies

What's your opinion on Jarheads?
Definitely not?
Maybe?
Definitely yes?

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>>53396983
I think they're pretty cool.

>>53396983
I got nothing against Marines, really. At least not the UCAS or CAS ones. Japanese ones are kind of dicks.

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>>53397097
>>53397102
haha, chummers
but seriously, what's the current opinion of them, given that they haven't been seen after 5e began.
I know that a few years back popular opinion on them here was largely negative
Has that changed?

>>53392130
Where can I get myself a cat like that

>>53397179
A zoo. Clouded leopards are kind of rare. If you got a contact that's into cloning, could make for an interesting run.

What is the best rifle, and why is it the Springfield 2003?

>>53397618
Sporting rifle, assault rifle, or sniper rifle?

Personally, my favorite rifle is the AA-16 with handloaded Ex-Ex.

Yekka, got a bug. AIs on Priority E: Magic receive a 2 Depth, rather than 1 Depth.

>>53394845
Can you spell out your abriviations there chummer? I'm a bit new to the lingo.

>>53399858
AFAIK- "As far as I know."
ITNW- "Immunity to Normal Weapons", ie, one of the more imbalancing matters in Shadowrun regarding magic vs. mundanes.

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>when the face goes to buy some Laésal Wine so you can spike some lesbians wine to get nude photos for a decker you owe a favor to and also steal their engagement ring, but the face drinks some of it because he's a fucking alcoholic so he forgets why he bought the wine, our entire johnson meet and planning session, and wakes up with some wine in his hand so he drinks it all and forgets he drank it all and ends up at the weaboo street sam's house where he crashes, then wakes up at 6AM and drinks the street sam's limited edition Naruto Sake™ and then he gets thrown out of the weaboo street sam's apartment so I have to go with him to get more of the wine and have to spend edge to resist the bartenders attempt to persuade me to drink some Laésal Wine

>>53400347
Holy shit chummer.

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>>53400439
This isn't even legwork for the actual job
this is just a side job we're doing at the same time as the main run

>>53400347
>have to spend edge to resist the bartenders attempt to persuade me to drink some Laésal Wine
Social skills are not mind control.

>>53400347
Jesus, that reminds me of the time our decker started day drinking in the van MID RUN "Because I hack better when I'm tipsy. These trogs can't write a line of code anyway." Cue that Slavic jackass drunk driving us away at 100+mph; biker gang hot on our asses.

>>53400603
COMMANDING VOICE
Cost: 1 power point
This power channels the adept’s magic into his voice
to enhance the modulation and pitch, subliminally in-
fluencing the actions of any listeners. The adept takes a
Complex Action to give a simple but forceful command
(five words or less) to the target, making an Opposed
Test with Leadership + Charisma against the target(s)
Willpower + Intuition. If the adept succeeds in the test,
the target uses his next action to either carry out the
command or stands confused (gamemaster’s choice,
but the more net hits achieved the more likely it is for the
target to obey the adept’s command). Such commands
carry no weight beyond the immediate impetus, and
the affected characters will quickly reassert their wits,
returning to their original course of action. If multiple in-
dividuals are targeted, use the largest dice pool among
the defenders and add 1 die per additional target (to a
maximum of six individuals). Commanding Voice may
only be used on metahumans who can directly hear and
understand the adept’s words. It has no effect when the
voice is amplified or broadcast via technological means
(e.g., wireless transmission or loudspeaker). It is also less
effective on subsequent uses against the same target.
Apply a cumulative –2 dice pool penalty for each use
within the preceding 24 hours.

?

>>53400714
Social. Skills. Are. Not. Mind. Control.

>>53400780
But magic is. Commanding Voice isn't a social skill chummer.

Doubling. Down. On. Being. Wrong. Is. Retarded.

>>53400780
>>53400714
Either way he wasn't using commanding voice, it was just an opposed negotiation roll, the bartender was trying to persuade my character to sit down and have a drink. I knew it would be spiked ahead of time since thats also what happened to the face, but I don't see anything wrong with a sleazy barman being able to con somebody into having a drink when they otherwise wouldn't.
If you guys play it different that's fine.

>>53400780
Am I the only one who got the joke?

>>53400828
He was giving a "forceful command"

>>53401066
Probably. Injokes don't translate well among strangers, chummer.

>>53400828
>Doubling. Down. On. Being. Wrong. Is. Retarded.
So why are you doing it?

>>53401070
That wasn't an in-joke.
You're just autistic.

>>53401074
No one did except the tard who tried to say Commanding Voice was a social skill.

>>53401077
Sorry, but telling unfunny jokes to strangers that depends on a specific context to be ZOMG SO HILARIOUS sounds more like the work of an autist than not laughing at said joke.

Context or gtfo.

>>53401133
See >>53400969
>Either way he wasn't using commanding voice

>>53401214
Which was posted after >>53400780, not before. So what's your point?

>>53401357
>>53400714 brought Commanding Voice into it. Before that it was just a bartender. No magic. After that it was just a bartender. No magic.

So what seems to be your boggle?

>>53401552
Adept Bartenders aren't a thing? Really?

Can spirit friendly traditions consensually bind spirits by making an offering or similar?

Hey guys, just a heads up. I accidentally solved Aliester Crowley's Liber al vel Legis riddle and broke the veil, imprinting my own psyche into the noosphere, which was mostly dominated by a sort of discordian chaos magick paradigm lazily patched with shadowrun tropes. I have no idea wtf is going to happen but I'm pretty sure there will be dragons. I tried to negotiate a system of consent with astral for everything but they seem to have decided it would take too long and that perfect consent was impossible anyways. Oh well. Stay frosty I guess.

whats a good character to play for your first time playing Shadowrun? I don't want to get too lost in trying to make a character.

>>53400603
>>53400780
>>53400969
Some people are really submissive Anon's. Maybe they just have a hard time resisting that sort of request?

>>53401595
I'm sure they can be, but there's no reason to assume the bartender was an adept, as they were simply described as an bartender, they were most likely, just a bartender.

>>53400603
No, but they are skills and persuading someone who is receptive to it to have a drink is part of the bartender's job.

Hey Chummers,

I really want to get my friends into Shadowrun, but I honestly have no idea where to even start. You guys got anything to help out? Anything I should know before getting into it?

How would you guys go about making a proper trucker?
I'm thinking some mix of rigger and street sam.
A guy who's tough enough to punch out the window and return fire when the between-city raiders get on him, but also good enough at driving to run their war buggy into the ravine with his truck.

>>53401997
This isn't /x/ friendo.

So just recently got into Shadowrun lore and something about the background lore is bugging me. All of the listed volcanoes that the Great Ghost Dance erupted were in the Pacific Northwest (Rainer, Hood, St.Hellens, Adams). While this would obviously cause widespread ecological damage and devastation why would it cause the U.S to surrender? The worst of the damage would be concentrated in areas which would later be ceded to the NAN, while everywhere from Cali to the Great Plains would be fucked the East Coast should have been relatively untouched. Also does anyone know why Alaska got ceded?

>>53403973
It was more a wave of the dick than an actual ecological attack.

"Wow holy fuck they can detonate volcanoes with magic, maybe we should seriously rethink what we're doing here."

>>53403973
It's military strategy as defined by liberal arts majors in the early nineties. SR is better if you don't think too hard on it, or just make your own geopolitics.

>>53403823
If they play video games, try to convince them to play Shadowrun Dragonfall. If you're a richfag, wait until it goes on sale for a dollar like it usually does and just start handing out copies of it. It's one of the best ways to convince people to actually give Shadowrun a shot. Returns is mediocre and Hong Kong is fantastic, but requires double the reading compared to Dragonfall.

If they already play tabletop games, it's a little bit easier because Shadowrun allows people to make almost any concept as a character and make it decent, so if you have really imaginative friends this can be your ticket. If you are running online or everyone you know has a laptop/tablet use Chummer for extra-easy chargen.

The best thing you can do is simply ask them to give the game a couple of sessions. Ask your players if they want to run something where there's either a lot of planning and roleplaying, planning and shooting, or just balls to the walls non-stop combat and then just work off that.

If you do start running it, avoid the current meta-plot. I don't know about anybody else, but CFD is pretty meh imo. Any more questions?

I have a question for you, /srg/
Why is it impossible to find a text or IRC based Shadowrun game? I realize that text is a rare format in general but SR seems especially adverse to it.
Is cyberpunk as a genre that much harder to narrate via text? Is it the dice? Enlighten me here.

>>53403856
Honestly just make a standard rigger and then use two Arm of Gods so that you can shoot well. You'll have like, .4 essence but you'll be a tough son of a bitch.

>>53403823
Make them watch Ghost in the Shell and Cyber City Oedo 808?
There's also this fan trailer:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q43h1zHpjqc
And a few shorts floating around like this one:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gR3lXEH80Nw

>>53397170
Just use the rules for E-Ghosts with Pilot Origins, but fluff them as brains in jars rather than AI's. Not perfect, but probably the best we're going to get until 6th Edition.

>>53404040
I'm pretty familiar with the setting, and played some of the video games already. I'm more concerned about finding rule books and what edition is the easiest for new players to pick up?

>>53404147
Thanks! I'll show these to them to help them get a better idea.

>>53404453
Read the OP carefully. You'll find some useful links.

>>53401941
Just fluff it as a contract between you and a spirit
that gives me an idea: Lawyer Tradition

>>53404090
I dunno mang, I'm in one right now.

>>53390961
The way I see it, the range modifiers are from where the item is launched, not where you are. Since range of the spell is LOS, you can cast it on something far away and only cop modifiers for how far the target is from its starting location. Thus, we have our sammy shoot it from his launcher to get it close to the target, and Fling the grenade in mid-air when it's nearby, so we get my whole spellcasting pool to hit without the range penalties if I had used Fling when the grenade was closer to me. That's what I meant by "course correction". Completely redirecting it in mid-air.

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Starting a new campaign in the near future. Problem is I'm completely lost on what character concept to go with.
Give me some interesting/out there runner concepts, Chummers. I will say that I don't mind the weirder metatypes (or even metavariants), usually.

>>53404890
Gnome SURGE that headbutts people with his goring horns really hard

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>>53404890
Naga Surge bunraku doll with arms and tiddies. Play as an physical infiltrator

>>53404964
>TFW it's impossible to reasonably play a Naga because you have fucking 4 max Agi and you're TEN GODDAMN METERS LONG

>>53404976
Cyberarrms and liminal body to get them stats up!

>>53405013
Anon, they still keep your racial stats.

>>53392130
That's a cool looking doggo.

>>53402153
Tech guys are pretty straightforwarf and newb-friendly. Try playing a technomancer.

>>53405242
You're a real piece of shit.

>>53405242
>technomancer
http://shadowrun.com/forums/discussion/comment/181431/#Comment_181431
Every time, until you like it
and yes, it fits because the first in the reply chain asked about archetypes

>>53405499
I wouldn't recommend playing a Techno to someone playing Shadowrun for the first time, even with that build.

>>53405615
sure, but should they still decide to play one it would help to know how to play one

>>53404976
Well their STR is high and pretty good Body
So Surge for pair of arms
Put pair of standart cyberarms with maxed AGI and STR.
Put STR, AGI and Armor enhancer.
Why not add Aluminium Bone Lacing, Orthoskin and some Ini enhancers.
So you have 7 AGI for shooting and around 12 str for grappling.
Spec in unarmed. Move towards people while firing or subdue and deal STR stun damage each pass.
Its not that hard

>>53405710
Anon.

They are a Metasapient.

If your Magic hits 0, you lose Sapience.

That's KIND OF AN ISSUE when making a player character.

>>53405720
Burnout Adept

>>53405725
Does absolutely nothing of use and costs 15 BP, and we're talking about creatures that are damn-near literally made of magic. It makes zero sense from a character perspective for them to take 'ware, when they LITERALLY can feel their soul ripping away as they do it, even worse than normal people.

>>53402586
>someone who is receptive to it
Key point. Someone who is playing designated sober person to the other PC post drug fuelled mind-wipe ... isn't.

>>53405218
That's the Face infiltrating the KE precinct, omae.

>>53405720
PC options do not use the Sapience power.

IOW, literally never an issue.

>>53405803
Assumes it was voluntary. I wasn't suggesting a bunraku doll just for shits and giggles.

>>53405803
1st it makes standart cyber cost as much essence as alphaware. Meaning cheaper cyber at lower essence.
Second welcome to shadowrun. You dont stuff yourself wit cyber because you like it(well not everyone), you do it because it gives you an edge. It makes you take just one more bullet than the other guy. It makes you act just a second faster than the other guy. It makes you last just little bit more than the other guy.
And its fast. You may have no tallent for improving you magic talents but the ware doesnt care. It may cost your soul but will help you push back the invaders that destroy your forest.
Now from mechanical point, yes there is to play a naga stop complaining.

>>53405919
>Oh no it makes it give the benefits of Alphaware!
Too bad it does literally nothing for anything else and is 100% pointless.

>>53406019
It's a decent chargen tool for specific gear options; usually taking any aug that's already at Availability 12/24 without pushing it higher with Alpha Grade.

Around what Essence level do you think people stop being what you'd consider 'normal' and would probably have some form of psychosis or condition? I was hoping to make a 'ware character that didn't really have crippling issues and felt that he was still 'whole' and a person, despite the metal parts.

>>53408158
>Around what Essence level do you think people stop being what you'd consider 'normal' and would probably have some form of psychosis or condition?
No.

The difference between 6.0 and 0.01, socially, is -1 Social Limit. Cyberpsychosis requires Antipathy and 5.0+ Essence lost to augmentation. Your charisma, personality, augmentation visibility, etc matter more than your essence score.

>>53408158
Around 5.9 Essence you get the condition of having weird unnatural shit in your body.

Losing essence doesn't make you crazy, it just exacerbates the crazy you already have.

>>53408158
At the point that you're both below 1 Essence and take or acquire the qualities that signify having a problem.

Unless you were also a Cha 1, Will 1 person. But then even at full Essence you probably weren't really communicating much.

>>53408297
>Around 5.9 Essence you get the condition of having weird unnatural shit in your body.
No you do not.

>>53408319
Not all the negative qualities that signify problems require low essence. ie; Superhuman Psychosis.

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>>53397618
Because it's legally inconspicuous, more accurate than all those electronic-loaded modern pieces, and stylish af. assuming you get one with proper wood furniture

>>53408356
Oh, so you think bioware and metal are natural metahuman anatomy chummer?

>>53400969
>I don't see anything wrong with a sleazy barman being able to con somebody into having a drink when they otherwise wouldn't.

If he put a vial of cyanide down in front of you, could he still convince you to drink it, because he's used to selling drinks? It's retarded to say he could convince you to drink something you know is drugged, instead of it being him trying to sell you some other booze.

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>>53401941
Yes, provided you don't have one of the qualities that ban binding. Read the Shaman's Code in Run Faster.

>>53408402
Well, not him, but I could see Bioware being a bit more natural in the sense of a lot of them are just giving boosts to your natural form like a Supathyroid gland.

>>53408402
>adjective, weirder, weirdest.
>1. involving or suggesting the supernatural; unearthly or uncanny: a weird sound; weird lights.
>2. fantastic; bizarre: a weird getup.
>3. Archaic. concerned with or controlling fate or destiny.

Augs are mundane, common, and only somewhat outdated (at worst) in the 2070s.

>>53408469
Down to arguing semntics eh? Do note that the #2 definition is spot-on.

>>53408356
True, not all of them do need low essence. But unless you're obviously well chromed and showing some kind of crazy, it's really not a thing you can tell without already knowing the person well.

And even then, the circumstances could give just as good a reason for the changes in sociability as the Essence loss would.

>>53403973
>Also does anyone know why Alaska got ceded?

Because the Canada and the USA were collapsing. They gave up Alaska in negotiations, along with pretty much everything else north of the 49. The reasons they had for keeping it are the same reasons the natives would want it, and as Hawai'i proved the USA was no longer capable of projecting power across any kind of distance to force it to stay.

Already asked in PDF share, but does anybody here have "Datenpuls ADL"? It's a german source book about germany, and it released last fall.

Also, any tips for building and playing an android character? (AI inside of a humanoid drone)

>>53408492
Where do you think we are? Shadowrun is poorly edited enough that it always comes down to semantics - short of when you leave it to someone else to sort out.

Augs are not weird, and especially those at 0.1 essence cost are commonplace. "weird unnatural shit" is a poor choice of words.

>>53408643
Except it's not a poor choice of words. It was chosen to demonstrate the mistrust and disgust I have for cybernetics and bioaugs. If you don't like it, tough shit. Weird is subjective and only autists will try to hold subjectivity to an objective standard.

>>53408553
Pilot Origins will let you make and use your own autosofts, so as long as you have the free program slots, that's five karma for a six in a skill.

The down side, of course, being how to keep enough program slots open. You take up one or two slots, and only give one, so that's parity at best, and high pilot ratings are expensive.

Most of the advanced programs aren't going to be super useful for you, so ignore them beyond these and note that they will make you need to occasionaly reboot. WTLM (if you want to pass as human more easily) Spotter (but only if you're going to also let the drone act on its own or just like low accuracy weapons), Abduction (it's bonus dice when using the drone's Sensor to Observe in Detail and it's a soft for a skill you may want to save on anyway), and if you can load multiple programs consider the combo of Shunt (lets you take Depth damage to your track instead of the drone's Matrix track), Rust (when you or the device takes damage, lower the target's Attack by one, cumulative, until they reboot) and Medic (heal your own wounds with a complex action).

Just note that combo is vulnerable to the Deicide program. You either also take the damage the device did, or they can choose to move some or all of the damage to you.

Alternatively, take Exceptional Entity and put lots into Willpower so that when you make that drone your home, it's got a sky high Firewall+Willpower.

There's probably more, but I'd have to do some serious looking and thinking.

>>53408738
>It was chosen to demonstrate the mistrust and disgust I have
Then IDGAF. You might as well have started off with, "My character feels ..."

>>53408778
But your feels were so important earlier :^)

Your aut is showing.

>>53408757
Thanks for the write-up, these options make it much easier to build something that's not completely crap.

>>53408432
Shut the fuck up. If the character was in a position where he was susceptible to some persuasion, going along with it is just good roleplaying.

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>>53409309
>my character is an alcoholic
>oh no, he's in a situation with a lot of alcohol available
>with all this alcohol, the biggest problem is that he's going to drink the bottle he himself poisoned

That's not good roleplaying, that's being a cardboard cutout who tries to run his character off of bullet points on a cue card, without actually developing an understanding of the situation. It's early-90's AI tier retarded, walking through fire to get the keycard instead of taking two steps to the left to get it safely.

>>53409543
>get some more wine so you can spike it
You fucking idiot, the wine wasn't poisoned yet.

Hey dudes. No hate for this, but i'm letting my friend make a magic gunslinger. So alchemy bullets. I know that it's stated that damage to the lynchpin disrupts the spell, but it's a fun idea and I figured I could make an acception.

Now, I had the caveat that if it was ridiculous, and solved all immediate problems, I reserved the right to revoke that, and allow him to reassign skills and such if he wanted to move away from alchemy if he can't use bullets.

Context aside, i've done some hypothetical rolls with spells of different forces, and it honestly doesn't seem worth the effort. Am I doing something wrong, and this is meant to be the bees knees?

Assuming Force 12, and he gets maximum hits to keep, that's potency 12, which lasts 24 hours. when it casts, as a direct damage spell, he rolls 24 dice, limited by force, opposed by will or body. That's best case scenario and could cream someone, but it's in the same league and a force 12 spell anyway I feel.

Tl;DR let me player go alchemy bullets. Haven't played, but on paper it doesn't seem amazing. Am I wrong? Is Alchemy just a bunch of effort for wank?

>>53409900
Exception* I'm so ashamed.

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>>53409900
Alchemy bullets aren't great if you follow the rules of Single Shot only weapons using it. Check FA for new things about alchemy, including Alter Ballistics.

>>53409980
FA? New sourcebook?

>>53410103
Yes, Forbidden Arcana.

>>53410103
>>53410211
Cheers. Gave it a squizz and the options for that spell are interesting. I feel like he'd want more like elemental effects, which is what he will currently have. Maybe it'll be fine as basically flavoured and buffed bullets. I shall mention this option, but even for the extra damage, it's a lot of prep and potential drain for the bullets. The single shot limit isn't an issue, as he wants to use a revolver, full on gunslinger style.

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>>53408158

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>>53410342

>>53409980
>Alchemy bullets aren't great if you follow the rules of Single Shot only weapons using it.
But single shot is what you should do 95% of the time.

>>53410457
Why do you do this every time ?

>>53411027
Because it's the right thing to do.

So if you don't plan on ever using any Conjuring or Enchanting anyway, does an Aspected Magician with the Dedicated Spellslinger quality come out ahead of a Magician (Priority Prime Runner generation)?

Follow-Up: Does Dedicated Spellslinger work right in Chummer yet?

>>53412450
You lose out on the superior number of spells that full Magicians get as well as Astral Projection. Besides that, I'm not sure. I haven't seriously built a Sorcerer since FA came out to test. Aspected Magicians seem a little awkward to build in Priority though, try sum to twelve for prime runners?

Dedicated Spellslinger still doesn't work. You'll have to take the spells in career mode after finishing the character, might have to use refund Karma to do so. It's not a pretty solution but it works.

>Depleted Uranium rounds are 28F
Holy shit lads, that's as rare as a damn GFC Gryphon.

I want to play Indy. Is there any way to make bullwhips effective as a weapon? Was going to go cowboy way for my marital art if that would help any.

>>53405710
You probably won't be able to afford all that, and if you're going with the bone lacing and stat enhancers the cyber limbs are probably a waste of time and essence.

>>53406172
IT's also impossible for a Naga to take if they take class 2 SURGE (which they need to get the arms) due to the high starting karma cost of just being a naga, so this whole conversation is moot.

>>53416527
Bullwhips are shit weapons but Disarm and Entanglement are useful techniques.

>>53416630
Only if you have table rules that say naga can't take cyber arms.

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Anyone have some cyber arm art? Players stole a few prototypes and negotiated fencing one to a competitor in exchange for installation surgery and one of the competitor's models.

How much karma would you guys use in karmagen for absolutely new runners? The runners in question are college students who looked through their options for paying tuition and naively decided that running was their best option.

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>>53403973
Hell, Oregon was conquered by a bunch of eleven-year-old elves.
>>53412450
Unfortunately no, I haven't had a chance to build the improvement type yet, I'm busy with work and some other issues. It should be done in the next couple of days, hopefully.
>>53409900
Alchemy is awful for anything that uses an opposed pool, yes. In order to achieve the fluff of magic bullets, you'd be better off just using a geas of 'must fire a pistol as part of the spellcasting action' and fluff it that it creates the magic bullets that cast the spell.
>>53418184
Assuming 5e, I generally recommend 600 karma or Sum-to-8 priority for street-level games.

>>53417083
Since by default you can't take cyberlimbs to replace limbs you don't have the onus of house ruling lies in the other direction. by RAW you would need the SURGE. But if your GM will let you by all means go for it.

>>53418184
College students are probably a bit above street level, so the base 800 will probably be fine, just make sure your players display restraint in what gear and abilities they start with to reflect this, maybe put a cap on what their skills can start as, and they all start with the in debt quality.

Is there a way to represent the new magic path options in Chummer? For example, if I wanted to make an Ancestor Shaman, is there some way to signify that in the program?

>>53418683
>Since by default you can't take cyberlimbs to replace limbs you don't have
Prove it.

>>53409543
>>53409640
There may have been some miscommunication here.
The face went and bought the Leas wine from a shaddy bartender.
The bartender offered him a drink, the face accepted. Then next thing the face knew he was awake, with an unknown bottle of wine in his hands and no idea how he got it. Assuming it was normal wine, he drank it as he had no recollection of it being spiked.
Next time my character went with him under the assumption that the face had just tried it like a retard, because her opinion of him is very low.
When we got the second bottle, the bartender offered each of us a drink and tried to convince us to sit for a while, he didnt just say "dude drink that memory wipe wine"

>>53419083
Not yet.

>>53419343
>When we got the second bottle, the bartender offered each of us a drink and tried to convince us to sit for a while, he didnt just say "dude drink that memory wipe wine"
It's still the place where the face got plastered on memory wipe wine, and you're there to ensure it doesn't happen again. The bartender's roll is antithetical to your aims, and not accepting a drink is a total no brainer for what you're trying to do.

What are some fun Face ideas?
Can't think of much beyond 'le smooth talker guy that doesn't fight so good'.

>>53419656
Full on body morphing adept who takes a different metatype and gender every single day.

>>53419656

I've seen a failed public defender turned Shadowrunner for the ACLU that themed his facing around lawyerly debate and citing policies more than smoothness.

Depending on the type of game, could also do an intimidation face, maybe mix in some blackmail.

>>53419684
... I miss False Front + Chemical Gland set to a constant drip feed of chemicals that would slowly change your features every 30 minutes.

>>53419829
Why? What's wrong with body morphing?

Okay, just finished Forbidden Arcana. What in the hell is the Elder God tradition supposed to be doing? The spirit set is kind to strange, I've never seen Task as a non-possessing combat spirit before. I also find the huge bias towards illusion to be strange, as surely the Elder Gods would be all over actually changing the world, instead of just making it 2spooky for your enemies, especially when gods like Moloch are included. The additional drain is also ridiculous, and really hurts you on higher Force actions.

>>53420056
It's not bioware or random, and the replacement augmentation in CF is cyberware.

>>53420363
>It's not bioware
Why is this an issue?
>or random
Just use your imagination when deciding what to morph into. Pull up a random face from google if you must.
>and the replacement augmentation in CF is cyberware.
Magic is way cooler than ware anyway.

>>53419656
A troll that shouts really loudly YOU ARE WRONG and then people realize they are wrong.
YOU DONT SEE ME
YOU SAW NOTHING
THIS IS MINE
GO AWAY
GIVE ME THAT KEY
DRINK THIS

>>53420475
>Why is this an issue?
Because this is Shadowrun, astral security is A Thing™, Cyberware security is A Thing™, and Bioware is the most likely to not be detected under any circumstance.

>Just use your imagination when deciding what to morph into.
Just use your imagination to decide what my flipping you the bird looks like.

>Magic is way cooler than ware anyway.
Nope.

>>53420518
Robin Hobb?

>>53420544
>Because this is Shadowrun, astral security is A Thing™,
Astral security is a thing, sure, but you can negate it with masking later down the road. It's a shame they won't let you pick the metamagic right out of chargen though.
>Cyberware security is A Thing™,
Don't use it then.
>and Bioware is the most likely to not be detected under any circumstance.
Before masking, sure.

>Just use your imagination to decide what my flipping you the bird looks like.
Are you so incompetent, and would your character be so retarded, that they couldn't think of a random face to use?

>Nope.
Well, you're wrong, and can fuck off at earlier convenience.

>>53420672
>Well, you're wrong, and can fuck off at earlier convenience.
Feel free to start taking your own advice. I certainly won't.

>>53420544
>>53420672
>magic vs ware
I'd use magic a lot more if I didn't feel so bad about it because magic users can be stupidly broken.

>>53421071
Adepts are fine in my opinion. Full mages are less fine, especially with quickening.

>>53418726
>college students
>wealthier than SINless slul dwellers

It is good to laugh.

>>53421585
What's a slul?

>>53421695
When the slum you live in is so bad they stole the rest of the m.

>>53421772
Sounds awful.

>>53418683
Explain the birth defects corrected by cyberware.

>>53420672
Play D&D if you want your magic cock sucked. Shadowrun is supposed to be cyberpunk, so 'ware uber alles.

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>>53421828
Nerve endings and motor ganglia still exist, they're just fucked over by the thing they're controlling. ASIST is currently incapable of injecting new sensory data that your brain isn't already configured for. Cybereyes work for ghouls because their optic nerves still exist, their eyes are just covered in cataracts.

>>53421828
>>53419228
You can't correct birth defects with cyberware, that's built into the Blind and the Paraplegic negative qualities. Basically, there has to be a Neural connection to build on, an human doesn't 4 arms Q.E.D, there's no neural connection to attach a third or fourth cyberarm to (yes, Natarki are an exception, but they have shiva arms don't they). Now granted there are two exceptions mentioned in chrome-flesh, but from context neither are standard ware, Hachetman apparently has a third arm, and there's some jerk on Mars with six, the latter is explicitly due to gammaware nanomachine bullshittery and the former is a mutherfuckin' cyberzombie.

>>53421893
>Shadowrun is supposed to be cyberpunk, so 'ware uber alles
Shadowrun is supposed to be cyberpunk WITH MAGIC. So they both are needed.

But magic is way cooler. And more effective.

>>53421922
Spence give me What is Liminal Body for 2000¥

>>53422095
Freelancer shittery, but most likely fluff for that would be that a knowbot interprets the movements you're trying to make (move forward, turn around, kcik that thing in front of me) into the actual movements required by the liminal body.

>>53421953
>You can't correct birth defects with cyberware, that's built into the Blind and the Paraplegic negative qualities
Yes you can. It's called buying off the quality.

There is no arm limit quality to buy off, therefore you can buy arms.

>the latter is explicitly due to gammaware nanomachine bullshittery
Means nothing for max # of arms.

>the former is a mutherfuckin' cyberzombie.
Has no effect on max # of arms.

>>53422095
No-one fucking knows, not even CGL. Like a lot of things in 5e it's a thought bubble that they slapped into the book to pad it out, without spending anytime thinking about how the fuck it actually works or interacts with the current setting. Don't get me wrong I don't hate the idea of liminal body, but the rules in their present state are next to useless, and the fluff barely existent.

>>53422277
What is Cerebral and Cerebrum booster. How about Knowledge Infusion.
What is stopping me from creating and moding the nerves in the brain to handle the extra limbs?

>>53422583
>What is stopping me from creating and moding the nerves in the brain to handle the extra limbs?
The rules

>>53421922
>ASIST is currently incapable of injecting new sensory data that your brain isn't already configured for.
This has been true in the past (4e Unwired Cryptosense Sculpting, for example), but is there anything in 5e that supports it and shows the current batch of monkeys chained to typewriters recognise and understand that?

>>53422590
The same rules that half of which have to be tossed to make the game playable? Weak argument for a CGL product.

>>53422590
Which rules?

>>53422583
Add Hard Targets' Bilateral Coordination Processor to that.

>>53422616
>>The same rules that half of which have to be tossed to make the game playable?
Yes, those same rules.

If you want to homebrew, then homebrew, but don't look for justification here. People get cranky even if you suggest something reasonable like making full auto a -10 penalty to hit with +2 DV, and adding extra limbs is nowhere near that reasonable.

>>53422398
Buying off a negative quality is a privilege not a right, you've got to justify it. Any GM worth their salt will tell you to fuck off if you want to buy off blind without a damn good reason. IF you had a character whose blindness was correctable by cyber-eyes(i.e their optic nerve and visual centre of the brain were intact), but was unable to get them due to being dirt poor you might be allowed to start with blind and buy it off, but that's not the default assumption of the quality and doesn't change the inference that can be drawn from it's fluff that in you don't have the neural connections to work an extra set of arms, you can't install them.
As to the other two examples it means everything, they're not standard cybernetic systems, the nanoware is handwavium that allows the adding of new neural pathways, and the cyberzombie's well who the fuck knows I working from one sentence, but it's likely to be crammed full of prototype tech that has likely never made it to market.

>>53422685
That's not the point of the argument, I've got no problem with anon running it that way, but they don't accept that it isn't strictly how the rules work and as this is a public forum it's best to keep build advice not dependent on house rules, as they won't always fly with that person's GM.

>>53422583
nothing per se It's just that there isn't such a thing commercially available at present. If you want to add them to your game, and handwave that they don't cost extra and allow people to get extra cyberlimbs, go for it - but it is a houserule, and it may not fly at other peoples tables, so keep it out of build advice, or at least earmark it as such.

>>53422750
Oh no I never meant it as such
It was more me jabbing at the explanation of why we can't have it while the technology exists to that exact thing exist
Rules are pretty clear. No extra limbs

>>53422750
It's a "house rule" on par with how before Hard Targets introduced 20F / 28,000¥ foot blades, you technically had no true cyberweapons to install in your feet / legs - blades, razors, and spurs are for your hands. Naturally, everyone ignored that, and now ignores footblades for being retarded.

Also foot anchors do cyberweapons without being called cyberweapons, but 100% legal, with the best damage code of all mentioned here, at the lowest price to effectiveness ratio. Go figure.

>>53422690
So throw in a bilateral coordination processor before you install the arms, and call it a day.

>>53423035
That's a massive overreach on what that does.

>>53423072
Everyone on the 'no extra cyberarms' is massively overreaching past RAW already. What's your point?

>>53422082
>But magic is way cooler. And more effective.
And That's Bad

>>53422082
>But magic is way cooler. And more effective.
The first sentence is subjective, and you're allowed to be wrong. Still gonna point at you and laugh though.

The second sentence is a problem, and illustrates why CGL shouldn't be allowed to retain the license. Magic is supposed to be a sideshow in Shadowrun, not the bigtop.

>>53423351
One of the main themes in Shadowrun is that success takes sacrifice. Auging your body with cyber is cheap and effective, but it damages your 'soul'. Selling out to the corps grants money and safety, in exchange for freedom. Becoming an Adept grants you great specialisation, butforces you down a narrow path. Becoming a novagot decker gives you awesome power over the modern world, but you're shit if dropped into the wilderness, or when in a Matrix-coma.

But mages? Mages don't have to sacrifice a damned thing. They have great flexibility, power, they are stronger the less polluted their souls are, and corps bend over and pay them in blowjobs if they sign up. They break the dystopia setting because they have infinite potential and no significant drawbacks.

>>53423605
Mages suffer the most from background counts. This is only not a significant drawback if you participate in sucking mage cock, and if you complain about mage power at the same time, that makes you a hypocrite.

>>53423699
Problem is, that most don't use the background count for a few reasons:
>it's too loosely defined
what exactly causes a BC of 1? How do they add together? When is a BC aspected and what causes what aspect?
>it's a lot of bookkeeping
everywhere you have to keep a BC in mind and constantly determine it if the players move or the environment changes. Most GMs don't want to do this in addition to all the other crap
>it hurts mages the least
seriously, a BC of 3 might hurt the mage a bit, but not much. Compare this with adepts and they might as well just turn their powers off entirely

I'm not saying that BCs are flawed as a concept, but that their current form is ignored for a reason, and that we need an overhaul

>>53423699
>>53423832
The problem is mage weaknesses aren't so much mechanical as they are determined by the GM.
If a GM never makes use of background counts, or people gunning for the mage instantly, the mage is gonna be so much stronger than their teammates.

>>53423904
Sure, GTM should be in effect, is fluff supported and easy to do (if you cast everyone rolls perception/teamwork perception and if they see you you are their target number 1)

But again, using BC is just too unwieldy
For 6e I wish for a BC system that is clearly defined(so you can easily determine what BC/Aspectation there should be), Simple/Concise (so you can easily do it on the fly) and most importantly HURTING THE MAGES THE MOST. They get the most variability, they should get higher fluctuation in power

>>53423949
DESU background count shouldn't even apply to Adepts. They manipulate the inner mana, not the outer.

>>53423968
Eh, I don't think that their tiny mana production is enough for all the shit they do
I'd rather say that for them BCs count as BC/2 (round down), so that they get less penalties than the mage. If the mage is in a BC of 6 he loses 6 dice which is fairly big considering most have around 12-15 dice, while the Adept gets a -3 which is also harming but depending on the power acceptable.

>>53423832
>what exactly causes a BC of 1?
>Significant, but brief emotional or magical impact or small but continuous spiritual or magical influence.
>When is a BC aspected and what causes what aspect?
BC aspect when you do shit of that aspect. Shit listed under an aspect causes and aspect. Aspect.
Read, nigga, read.

>everywhere you have to keep a BC in mind and constantly determine it if the players move or the environment changes. Most GMs don't want to do this in addition to all the other crap
No more work than judging Noise or Environmental Modifiers.

>seriously, a BC of 3 might hurt the mage a bit, but not much
A BC of 3 will drop foci by 3, deactivate any foci lower than 4, and prevent deactivated foci from being activated.

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Hey Chummer Person, when I make an Elf Vampire my Primary Attributes goes down by three, as though I had spent the points.I believe thats an error.

>>53424191
The minimums on Agility & Charisma for vampires is lower than for elves.

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>>53423968
That's not how mana works. All awakened draw in more mana than their own body generates.
>>53424191
Tell that to the stats table. Vampire has a list of stats, which override your attribute minimums. Since you're in priority, it's preserving your current Base rating and consuming some of your attribute points.

>>53424270
Yes, Vampire changes your attributes, to a new and different set of attributes, which form your new baselines. This already costs you Karma and has drawbacks, and it should not be costing you attribute points.

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>>53424254
>>53424270

My mistake. I didn't realize that spending more karma than a human actually downgraded my character.

Really, thank you. I appreciate the clarification. A lot of rules regarding infected have me baffled and a bit on edge

>>53424325
It may well be that the Vampire quality doesn't actually behave that way since the description says it's mostly just for humans and it's supposed to be the same as for ghouls, but my line in the sand is that I'll always follow RAW as closely as possible. If your GM's okay with it, you could make your own version of the quality by copying the content out of the qualities.xml file and changing the appropriate entries then sticking it into a custom file.

>>53424325
You think that's bad, a troll vampire gets completely hosed.

>>53424100
>BC aspect when you do shit of that aspect
which is what? What do you do if you want the BC to be Wicca aspected? If you kill a chicken, what Aspect does it get? Do a concert, a comedy show and a gang fight get the same BC? If I kill someone (BC 2) in an strongly religious area (BC 5), what is the resulting BC? 5? 7? 6? Something else?

>No more work than judging Noise or Environmental Modifiers.
Noise is measured in KM and Environ. Mods are usually everywhere the same/change slowly. Are you saying that if I fight some CorpSec (BC 2) the entire compound gets a BC?

>A BC of 3 will drop foci by 3, deactivate any foci lower than 4, and prevent deactivated foci from being activated.
yes, which means they still cast with MAG+Spellcasting-BC
Meanwhile the Adept can kiss all his powers goodbye if the BC gets over their bonus, which often is only a few dice
A mage can still cast, even if a bit worse
An adept either loses dice or turns mundane

>>53424384
Goodman was asked ... awhile back, now, and IIRC said something along the lines of how it's logical that it should adjust for non-standard metatypes and metavariants, but RAW doesn't account for them.

>>53424523
>which is what?
The aspect of shit is read the fucking book mate.

> What do you do if you want the BC to be Wicca aspected?
Wiccan stuff. Gather your Wiccan mates for Wiccan rituals in a Wiccan pub where you talk about Wiccan things.

> If you kill a chicken, what Aspect does it get?
Why are you killing the chicken? How are you killing the chicken? What tools are you using to kill the chicken? Are any spells involved in killing the chicken? Does killing the chicken cause any emotions? Are you killing the chicken to promote any emotions? Yes, you have to think a bit here, but if the answer is "huh?", then the Aspect is probably "Fuck off, it's just a background count. Mate."

>Do a concert, a comedy show and a gang fight get the same BC?
Literally does not matter.

>If I kill someone (BC 2) in an strongly religious area (BC 5), what is the resulting BC?
Show me anything that says BCs are sum, rather than overlap.

>yes, which means they still cast with MAG+Spellcasting-BC
Without things like power foci. Which means more than just "MAG+Spellcasting-BC".

>Meanwhile the Adept can kiss all his powers goodbye if the BC gets over their bonus
Not all adept powers are bonus dice. If you're using only adept powers that are bonus dice, you will get fucked by BC with penalties greater than your bonuses, because you chose bonuse dice over the other types of powers. DWI.

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>>53424962
Which is, unfortunately, infuriating and useless to me until it shows up in an errata thread.

Honestly, the dude's running the errata team. He literally has carte-blanche to just post official out-of-book clarifications about the shitty editing and he instead spends time adding
STATUS: PROVISIONAL
'Add the following names to the writing credits'

>>53425089
A background count impose a negative dice pool penalty
equal to its rating for all tests linked in any way to magic (such
as spellcasting, summoning, and skill tests that use active adept
powers such as Killing Hands or Improved Sense). The exception
to this rule are background counts from domains, where a tradition,
person, skill group, or skill may be exempt from the penalty as they
are used to or aligned with the domain.

Basically, it only matters for tests that directly use the Magic stat or which are Active adept powers, ie they have an Activation Action. Killing Hands, Elemental Body/Weapon, Pain Relief, those are Active.

Improved Reflexes, Improved Ability, Combat Sense, or all the other passives? Untouched.

>>53422612
The SURGE quality for one eye specifically points out that you can't get a second cybereye, because your brain doesn't have the proper visual cortex.

Like all of 5e, they leave the explanations in 4e.

>>53425189
Improved Sense doesn't have an action associted with it. It's just on, although several do give you the ability to make a roll at a low difficulty to sense something that is probably either more difficult or impossible.

For the first, see Perfect Pitch. Totally doable for a human, although I'd argue that figuring out if something's off key by feel takes more than two hits. For the second, Direction Sense. I'm don't think most people could tell if they're above or below mean sea level while in a city they hadn't researched much less in a box.

NEW THREAD:
>>53425837
>>53425837

>>53423351
>The second sentence is a problem, and illustrates why CGL shouldn't be allowed to retain the license. Magic is supposed to be a sideshow in Shadowrun, not the bigtop.
The last sentence is subjective, and you're allowed to be wrong. Still gonna point at you and laugh though.