Age of Sigmar General /aosg/

Can't wait for the Vanguard-Hunters warscroll.

Anny infomation about new points cost of Sylvaneth in new handbook?

>>51641035
Not yet.

>>51640916
Pestigors when?!

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>>51641019
Nothing will ever beat my love for Extremis tho.
GW really did the best they could.
Looking for a nice point drop off the vexillor to field more Extremis

>>51641076
Please tell me this is sarcasm?

>>51641076
Hi lawyer-anon! How's the practice going?

And how many games have you stomped your opponent's army?

>>51641076
Extremis could do with a conditional battleline. Something like Dracothian guard becoming battleline under Extremis Chamber allegiance with a Lord-Celestant on Stardrake warlord.

>>51641243
Example list...

Celestant on Stardrake - 600
Concussors x2 - 280
Concussors x2 - 280
Concussors x2 - 280
Fulminators x2 - 240
Fulminators x2 - 240

Would a list like this even do well? I'm having my doubts.

>>51641299
Sounds boring as fuck to paint and play with...

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Hey guys, I just won this at the LVO, and I never planned on starting a seraphon army, but I am seriously considering starting it now.

What would you all recommend I get to expand it? I like the idea of a saurus themed army, over skinks, but I do like bastiladons too. Would the bloodclaw starhost be a good goal to build to? What would you recommend it's comprised of?

I am also thinking of a theme to do them in. I like the idea of a heavily aquatic theme. I have an idea for a drowned slaan, or one who is trapped underwater. Being trapped there for so long amongst sea-life has altered his memories, so all the seraphon take on sea creature appearances. Like the bastiladon will be converted to look like sea turtles, or the carnasaur will have flippers and fins instead of limbs and claws like a kronosaurus or basilosaurus. Saurus will have additional fins running toward their tails, and cold-ones will be posed like they are swimming. I'm thinking of calling it Memories of the Drowned Slaan, or something like that. I know frogs are amphibious but work with me here. Everything will be covered in barnacles and bases themed with coral and seaweed

>>51641485
Am I the only one who really hates the normal Saurus? 0 Ferocity in those miniatures. The Carnosaur Scar Veteran is what a Saurus should look like imo. They also suffer from being a bit small, not sure what scale they should be maybe a bit smaller than Orc Brutes?

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>>51641537
Forgot to include pic related.

>>51641485
Theme sounds cool if you can pull it off.

>>51641485
Try looking at aquatic reptiles for inspiration. Sea snakes, saltwater crocodiles etc.

You might also want to go with a marine Mesozoic theme, what with the rest of the Seraphon basically being humanoid dinosaurs. Perhaps Terradon/Ripperdactyls replaced with icthyosaurs, or a plesiosaur or Liopleurodon Stegadon.

I dunno, I'm just throwing ideas out there.

No.51622834

Have you posted anything on there? no ones even commented on my shit, they just keep liking, which is confusing.

>>51641619
>>51622834
fugg, i fucked this up

>>51641537
I think the warriors can be improved, but mostly in posting and some greenstuffing

>>51641597
It's going to take some effort for sure. Coral and barnacles can be easy enough to do with greenstuff. For flippers and additional fins, I am thinking of making them with cardstock, cut and shaped, then more greenstuff sculpting on top to make them seem part of the creatures.

>>51641614
That's actually pretty close to what I'm thinking. I'm looking at all the aquatic dinosaurs for ideas

Right now I need ideas on what to add to my force so I can plan out purchasing and conversions

>>51641681
Also imagine the big sea dinos swimming with little fish and remoras hovering around them. The more I think about it the more excited i am to try it.

>>51641076
A 100pts drop for the Lord-Celestant on Stardrake wouldn't be out of place. The Drakesworn Templar already costs 500 to the LC's 600, but is better or equal in pretty much all regards.
The rest is priced nicely and doesn't really need changing.

>>51641681
They need more bulk and better expressions. The Scar Veteran is perfect in that regard IMO.

>>51641692
>>51641681
If you want to do the fish, be warned that GW doesn't make much in the way of fish. You'll have to make them from scratch or find 3rd-party model bits, and if you do the latter, actual GW stores may not let you in. You'll need to talk with the manager beforehand if you want to do that.

Just a heads-up in case that's relevant to you.

So there's this retard speaking of AoS and I'd need tips on how to deliver the most savage burn ever.

https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/717049.page

Last comment in the thread.

>>51641804
Why do you care? His opinion is misinformed and stupid and he ties game quality directly to amount of pages but in all honestly letting his thread die without making it to a certain amount of replies is a way better 'burn'.

What makes you think you need to soapbox your game? The only good question you could ask is: have you played it?

>>51641804
Morons gonna moron. Just let him be, he's probably already suffering enough, considering that entire post.

>>51641804
>I'd need tips on how to deliver the most savage burn ever.
Don't. He's just an idiot. Another suicidal moron that's willing to quit the hobby if things don't go his way. There's nothing you can do to change his mind or deliver a 'sick burn'. He will just reply with the usual anti-aos bullshit we have seen ad nauseum since the beginning, getting nowhere.

Just avoid it, and delight if 40k get's an aosification knowing he won't be part of it anymore. If not, just enjoy the hobby as you always will.

>>51641804
Why bother? It's not even a particularily egregious example of stupid and even if it were, what do you get out of it?
It's not like you're going to change his opinion, dumb as it may be.

>>51641804
If you don't have a 'sick burn' ready upon reading something *and* can't even come up with one on your own, chances are that thing is not worth the time it takes insulting it.

It's really just the usual simplified=dumbed down mentality that plagues 40k players. They see what happened to whfb and from all the knee-jerk reactions and bitching that has come from AoS' reception, they think 40k will become babies first wargame as well, not realizing that even though AoS has a simplified ruleset, i still find it as tactically challenging and complex as whfb ever was.

But morons like this will continue to think complexity correlates solely with number of pages.

>>51641804
Just let them stew in their stupidity and, if 40k doesn't get AoS-ified, their awful rules.
And if it DOES get the AoS treatment, laugh even harder, because it'll probably give them an aneurysm.

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How would i fluff tyranids into AoS without being setting breaking? Is there anything that needs to be changed about the nids to look more fantasy?

>>51641878
Shits and giggles.I know the guy and he gets his panties in a twist with extreme ease (though right now I ain't have time to write down the tirade nor think marginally of it).

>>51641966
Should we add that to the bingo? It comes up often enough to warrant inclusion, I think. Not to mention it matches the level of stupid of the other slots.

>>51641988
I think it's the same retard over and over again. Oil your gryphons (by the way, have you guys done so already) at least was uttered by a couple of jackasses. This most likely is the same autist over and over.

>>51641966
Play Deamons faggot.

>>51641796
I was originally going to go with sculpted fish. They were meant to be small and low definition anyway, Just simple little shapes painted vibrantly, heald aloft of the models pinned using wire.

>>51641988
>>51642011
Not the anon who posted that but Nid players probably just want a rule set that doesn't completely make their army shit-tier and I don't fault them for it.

>>51641966
The Daemons are the same in both games and they're taking on the Nids so I don't see why the other races from AoS can't do the same since they themselves fight Daemons on a regular bases.

You don't need to change much about them desu. They are an alien race. They can fit in most settings by the sheer fact that they are alien. They don't need a specific look.

>>51641804
He has a link for 9th age in his signature, and making a 40k thread. I'd say he's made up his fucking mind about AoS. Don't bother.

>>51641966
What are beastmen

>>51642151
And they are even just as shit as Tyranids are. It's a perfect match!

>>51642034
Oh, okay. That'll be cool with GW shops then, in fact it'll be an asset (they like advertising the modelling and customisation aspects of their games) provided it's done well.

Good luck.

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What do you guys think about this list? Traits and artefacts are randomised. Thinking about should I use bows instead of swords on kurnoths. Riders are flankers.

>>51642277
It will be a challenge, but I've been looking for an excuse to practice my greenstuff skills and this might be it.

>>51642308
Branchwraith is garbage without access to Sylvaneth stuff.

>>51642535
Even with access to those it's overshadowed by the branchwitch

What rules, if any, would you like to see adopted from 40k?

I personally would love to have templates back and maybe consolidation.

Templates would probably nerf thanquol & boneripper against single targets but at least it would mean the warpfire throwers aren't auto take.

>>51642746
None, preferrably.
Templates only mean you'll need to spend ages making sure your units are at maximum coherency, which is boring as sin. Damage values work fine the way they are.
If I *must* pick something, I'd pick Challenges. It has little impact on the game and might be cool.

>>51642746
>wanting to import inferior rules

>>51642746
>>51642785
Getting rid of template was the best idea of AoS. So much time gained. That and multi damage wound going over to the next model.

>>51642746
>>51641966
40k refugees, I assume. So it is really dying?

>>51642843
Big time. Not only from model positioning, but also from not having to fuck around finding the best template position.

>>51642830
How are they inferior? One allows you to move d6 after combat which helps slow armies a bit while the other adds some much needed flavor when it comes to the way you attack things.

How does it make sense that you shoot one cannon let's say and you hit but one save nullifies the damage EVERYONE in the unit takes? It's completely retarded.

I know you AoS players are afraid to add anything into this game but come on...

>>51642868
Templates are absolute cancer, just like tlos. The only template I think is ok is the breath/flame template, because it really adds flavor. But I'm glad they are gone.
Abstraction>Simulation tßh

>>51642868
You wont ever quit 40k or play AoS.
So why bother shitpoting ?

>>51642903
Whatever, guess there's no changing your guys' minds. I think it would bring a lot more flavor but I guess an extra 5 seconds per artillery attack is just too much for you guys.

>>51642936
more like 10 seconds per shot PLUS the whole moving and spacing out your minis.

Also, lovely autism.

>>51642936
Five seconds per attack and ten minutes per movement phase to make sure your units don't get fucked over by templates and shitty positioning.
That shit adds up.

>>51642936
If you want templates you'll also need to add repositioning after combat, at which point you'll need way more time for movement.
Also, here's your (You).

>>51642993
10 minutes? Come the fuck on.

You guys are exaggerating this shit so much it's laughable.

Do you literally measure every model in a unit to make sure they're absolutely within that 1 inch coherency? No probably not. So you won't be doing it when spreading out. most people eyeball that shit in friendly games.

Most 2k games have maybe 5-7 units with multiple models. So spreading that out doesn't take as long as you think. Unless you're playing with 300 grots or some shit then time really isn't an issue if you've found an opponent who'd play against that.

>>51643046
>Do you literally measure every model in a unit to make sure they're absolutely within that 1 inch coherency?
2", but, yes, at the very least I used to do that in 40k. Template spam is a thing and can fuck you hard.

>>51643077
>>51643046
>>51643026
>>51642993

Isn't the whole point of the imperial system that it's easier to eyeball distances? Friendly reminder that an inch is about the width of your thumb as well...

>>51643026

Yes, I would like consolidating. I mentioned it in my original post.

No I'm not fishing for (you)'s and I'm not shit posting.

It's like you guys are shell shocked from all the 40k players coming in here shitting on this game or something. You guys think everyone is trolling or out to get you. Calm down folks.

>>51643077
It's 1" in AoS. Page 166 of the GHB (not sure if they updated the rules in the GHB compared to the free rules).

>>51643107
>It's like you guys are shell-shocked
We kinda are. Every thread, like clockwork, we have some asshat barge in and demand this game be more like WHFB or, as of recently, 40k.
Here's the thing, despite all the quibbling most of us are fine with the way AoS is, bar some minor shit or point values.

hey guys i got spire of daw for my birthday. this is my first aos set so i was wondering what units to add for rats and elves

>>51643173
If you add a Warp Lighting Cannon to the Skaven set its precisely 1000 points. And I would try to get 10 more Spireguard, to round that force up to 980 points. Two nice forces to play matched games with.

>>51643173
Would be nice if some people here could dial down on their victim complex. This is 4chan, trolling and such is part of the culture.

>>51643173
i feel you man. i dont know why people constantly try to compare it with 40k.

https://mega.nz/#!LogA2KJL!Xrejp3mSGsKIT36v6xbwueYU98UUV-FjRM5FtwIF7oQ

White Dwarf February, enjoy!

>>51642746
AoS has already many "area" effects, that for some reason weren't used for Skaven flamers.

See both of Drycha shooting attacks, the breath of the stardrake, the spell of the Gaunt Summoner, the breath of the three variants of dracoth, the scepter of the Celestant Prime.

>>51643307
Thanks!

Ok guys as dwarf player with 1000 pt how can i beat Sylvaneth with 3 forests, 2x driad, 2 x Kurnoth Hunters ,Branchwych, Treelord Ancient, cuz i got crushed 2 times

>>51641966
Why not Flesh eater courts, do you have the models already? Could be a really cool conversion army if you do a race of horrible bug people

>>51641299

concussors and fulminators, point for point, soak damage and put out damage at an efficiency so high that it blows almost everything else in the game out of the water by comparison.

that list would be fine

in b4 but dice are random
in b4 in a vacuum is meaningless

>>51643476
>Ok guys as dwarf player with 1000 pt how can i beat Sylvaneth with 3 forests, 2x driad, 2 x Kurnoth Hunters ,Branchwych, Treelord Ancient, cuz i got crushed 2 times

as a dwarf player you can drive to your local game store and buy a new stormcast army in order to beat sylvaneth. That is probably your best, if not only, option.

>>51643334
Because a lot of those units have the breath weapon as a second or tertiary option. This is literally the only thing a Warpfire Flamethrower does, plus it's attached to a very fragile body.

Stormfiends and Boneripper are a different story but do take in mind that those are expensive units.

>>51643334
>>51643796
That said, I do think the WLC and Stormfiends could have some more engaging misfire/randomness options. Alongside a point reduction as well, since the WLC is already expensive enough for a Large Warmachine that can only deal a maximum of 6 wounds a turn.

For the WLC they could add a rule where if you roll a 1 for the 'strength' test you suffer an X amount of wounds or something along those lines.

>>51641966
Will you stop posting this if you get on the bingo?

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>>51643307
Combing through the stuff, there are some nice new material.

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Nurgle tome and GUO when?

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>>51644632
[Never]

>>51644472
Hm I might paint my citadel wood with that green colour scheme. Will that look very out of place next to a Garden of Morr?

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Hows this for a starting mortal nurgle army? Wasn't 100% sure which weapon to take with my knights.

NOTE: I edited the godamn image this time

>>51643729
Well, Kurnoth are also up there.

Also Vulkyte berserkers

>>51644879
Sorry, that should say mortal nurgle allegiance

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In contrast, heres my idea for my nurgle daemons 1K (I didn't just take a pic of my screen this time)

>>51642147
Speaking of the devil, has anyone read the lore of those buggers? Apparently they are "fleshing" the setting of theirs and wondered what kind of shitty fanfictions they were making (without exposing myself to them).

>>51643492
This is a good idea.

>>51642844
Considering that the eldar just got BUFFED, I'm not shocked

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My predictions for GHB 2:

It is too difficult to justify running anything but hard hitting power units because they rarely get value. Large offensive powerhouse units like Thundertusk, Necrosphinx, Celestial Hurricanum, Necropolis Knights, and Stormfiends are the default units to put in your list and everything else is there to support them. It seems like most games are resolved by smashing into the enemy with a large unit at the right moment (or denying your opponent the chance to do the same).

I foresee a trend of increasing the cost of MOST behemoths and by 10-20%, possibly more. I also see them cutting the cost of most basic infantry (ie: infantry that gets stronger as the unitgets larger) by 10-20 points per min size. With these changes you will see more infantry-based armies, which in turn makes counter-infantry units (Drycha, Stegadon, etc.)more valuable, which will in turn make high mobility/teleport units more valuable, and so on. The ultimate result would be larger variation in list building and a more diverse and enjoyablemeta game, especially for people that can't afford those crazy expensive monsters.

The last thing I see them doing is cutting the cost of many battalions by 33-50%. Battalions should be more plentiful because it's fun to use a themed list and build within restrictions, but many factions - likeSeraphon -have battalions that cost way more points than they are worth using.

>>51642746
I would like to see a look-out-sir rule implemented. I like that heroes can't join units, but I want units to offer some protection to heroes. Because hero sniping is a thing, and it's about the only unfun result of this game. I'd like just about everything else to remain as-is though.

after reading this i see i can use leadbelchers as battleline for gutbusters and then still take the grand allegiance of destruction special rule.
http://www.tga.community/forums/topic/2580-ironjawz-and-destruction-allegiance-how-does-this-work/

in this case. would i even get bulls? or just take all leadbelchers and ironguts with some gnoblars.

>>51645653
Is like those points to be true. Hell, it's actually kinda difficult for some armies to maximize the unit buffs of standard Battleline when they're actually relatively expensive. Hard to fit them plus the "elite" units, while maintaining the Battleline minimum.

Indifferent about Battalion cost cuts, however.

>>51645653
I certainly hope battalions don't cut costs. Them costing what they do make bringing one a tactical decision over a blatantly obvious one, which is how it should be. Halving their costs nearly puts them on the level of 40k retardation.

>>51644632
>skaven Pestilens
>Glottkin
>Morbidex

>>51644680
Depends on how your garden is painted. Probably should be fine. If it looks out of place, you could always go back to your previously painted scenery and add some spot colors from the new piece to help tie them together.

>>51643476
Out of curiosity, what is he running the Kurnoths with? (also I'm going to assume you meant 20x dryads) What things seemed to hit you the hardest/cause the most problems?

>>51643476
What do you have in the way of artillery?

>>51645830
Honestly, as a skaven player, I REALLY don't want to see pestilens merged with nurgle.

I love how vehemently people argue possible rules changes on here like it could matter. GW doesnt come here, and if they did, they certainly wouldn't listen to a single thing we had to say.

>>51645830
>Implying Pestilens will get a second tome
>Implying we want anything to do with fat scabby man-things

Great corrupter 4 lyfe, fuck off rot-brains

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>>51645848
Pic related

>>51645653
Battalion? what's that?

- Nonfleasheater death player

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Looking to pick up Tzeentch for the new year, but I feel overwhelmed with all the options in the book (as an Ironjawz player, lists built themselves). What's a good starting point? I've got a box of Tzaangors, Pink Horrors, and the Silver Tower stuff. How are flamers and the other tzaangors? Are any of the battalions good or are they traps?

>>51645935
Go for it my man. The leaves' color shouldn't cause an issue. Just make the ground consistent between all the pieces, so they look like they belong together.

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>>51645934
Yes yes. Want nothing to do with fat-bloat man things

>>51645764
Tzeentch and Sylvaneth battalions are appropriately costed, paying 20-80 points for bonuses is fine.
But Seraphon battalions are complete trash for how much they cost. Let's look at a few of them:

Sunclaw Starhost
Gives Saurus Warriors Rend-1 and +1 bite (5+/4+/-/1).

That's not bad, right? It costs 80 points.

But compare that to the 80 point Sylvaneth Gnarlroot Wargrove which lets their wizards cast twice as many spells, allows them to include ANY order wizard (loremaster + durthu with sylvaneth allegiance? Amazing), and gives you access to a spell that ressurects Kurnoths.

It's not a perfect comparison because it's comparing battleline to wizards, but it's clear to see that the Gnarlroot is worth far more than Sunclaw for the same point value.

Let's look at another example:

Thunderquake Starhost
Lets you reroll Run/Charge/Hit or Wound/Save for 3 monster units and an additional elite unit (artillery or kroxigors), and those units heal in the hero phase.

This seems like an amazing battalion on paper; getting to reroll Wound rolls and Save rolls for big monsters, AND healing them? Awesome!
However in practise it falls short of expectations because it requires building your ENTIRE force around the battalion but it doesn't include any battleline and to get the most value from it you need to bring a Slann (+260), neither of which will benefit from the bonuses.

The bonuses are also marginalized heavily by other common Seraphon units that let you reroll hits (Astrolith Bearer) and saves (Skink Priest) already.
It also requires you to bring a Troglodon or Engine of the Gods, two very underwhelming units.

Essentially you pay 120 points to reroll wounds, and only for a few units.

Compare this to a battalion that also requires building an entire list like the Warrior Brotherhood. The WB gives amazing bonuses you can't find anywhere else in the Stormcast army, and it gives it to every unit in your army, and it is appropriately costed at 140.

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>>51641988
>>51642011
Shit I didn't realize this was on the level of fantasy fag kneejerk shitposting.
>>51642043 has the right idea. I want a rule set that isn't complete shit and I already like the tyranid fluff and models. >>51642087
I see, tyranids are meant To be alien anyways, they dont even "fit" in 40k so them in AoS wouldn't look too bad. Might have to tone down the guns a bit and use units who seem like they were adapted to fight fantasy races rather than futuristic tanks and super soldiers

>>51642151
Beast men are chaos and absolutely nothing like tyranids. The whole point was to have them as a 5th faction that doesn't fit into any of the 4 grand alliances and complicates everyone's plans.

>>51641243

Apparently the new battle tome has rules for making dracothians and Paladins battleline in certain armies

>>51641746

I used to think as you do but I realized the true power of the LC on stardrake comes from 1) his buddy cop lord castellant buff and if you want to be a douchebag: 2) a hurricanum to give him a +1 to hit and another arcane shield

The LC gets absurd when he has a 1+ rerollable armor save and gains wounds back on a roll of 5 or 6.

In the same vein, if he has any sort of +hit modifiers his sword (especially if relic'd out) becomes absurd.

I've had him fly in the face of 15 blood Knights plus their lord and come out at full health. He's not super intuitive but when he works, he really works.

Drake Templars are good too but they're more like conditional artillery than the golden brick that the LC is

>>51643476
Does he have any range at all? Seems like it would be magic and/or possibly Bows on those Kurnoths.

If he has to come to you anyway with majority melee, wouldn't it be feasible for you to just stay out of/away from the Wyldwoods, negating some of his buffs?

>>51646408
i mean you still have the not that small chance that the melee player gets 2 turns in a row.

>>51641966
>How would i fluff tyranids into AoS without being setting breaking?
They, like daemons, aren't meant to match the aesthetic of 40k galaxy, its how they seem so out of place and alien. Their lack of technology makes it really easy for them to blend right into AoS, like the daemons. You may have to refluff some stuff like Changing bio plasma and things focusing more on close ranged weapons, But overall just use the exact same tyranids. Its just as weird to have the exact same daemons fight empire soldiers and Necrons as it would be to have tyranids fight Space marines and sylvaneth

They're predators from the void between the realms that have just started invading. they're like the destruction faction, except they can't be reasoned with at all and only care about the consumption of the realms.

Would this game be better if random turn order was ditched in favor of a different system?

Doesn't even have to be the strict "I go, you go" turn order like most games use. Even something like the game turn is taken concurrently and each player goes back and forth activating a unit during each phase.

The double turn is just so backbreaking due to double the hero and shooting phases.

>>51646782
No, random turn order is fine. It adds a ton of strategy and depth to the game.

Learn to play around it instead of over-extending and getting caught with your pants down

>>51646645
Yes, but I just wondered from the point of, if both sides are all melee you can more or less turtle? If he has range and you don't, sitting still just equals slowly getting shot to pieces.

>>51646782
New players hate the random turn order. Veteran players like it and know how to deal with it or use it to their advantage.

>>51646809
>It adds a ton of strategy and depth to the game.
Not really. It's sheer randomness for randomness sake.

>>51646820
I abuse the fuck out of it, and it's hit the point that I've become a sort of boogey-man locally.

It's not even that I'm some amazing player, more a statement on the local players.

I just run Skaven with clannrats up front to tarpit with a Chieftan with standard to mitigate battleshock, and ranged stuff behind them.

The clannrats can generally weather a double-turn, but me getting two shooting phases in a row generally deals an unrecoverable blow.

>>51646863
>Not really. It's sheer randomness for randomness sake.
Only if you and/or your opponent are shit at this game

Double turn is great because it punishes alpha strikes and gives the player behind a chance to come back

If your opponent lets you get two complete rounds on shooting on their key units then they deserve to take all that damage.

Typical shitter that hates the double turn:
>probably playing something shitty like Khorne bloodbound
>goes first when given the choice
>moves up 10" up the board
>hopes his enemy engages him
>gets shot up
>enemy gets double turn
>rest of his army is shot to pieces
>goes online to complain

>>51646906
>If your opponent lets you get two complete rounds on shooting on their key units then they deserve to take all that damage.
So they're supposed to keep their key units at least 12" (or more depending on the enemy's ranged shit) away from the fight at all times?

>>51646782
I like the random turn order.

I highly doubt it would work for AoS, but I'd love a game to use the activation system from Heroscape. It seemed dumb when I first played the game as a kid, but it grew on me eventually.

For those who don't know, it works like this.
You have 4 markers : 1,2, 3, X. The back of each is blank. At the start of the round, you place your markers on units however you want (all on one unit, spread on 4 different ones, any combination). Roll off for who reveals first. Winner turns over their 1, and takes a turn with it. Then the other player moves their 1. Then 2s, and 3s. The x is for bluffing. If a unit dies before it's activated, too bad. After 3s, it's a new round and you start again.
I thought it was interesting because it forces you to plan ahead, but your plan can be foiled if your OP opponent goes first or kills something important.

I'm kinda rambling at this point, but I guess I love seeing interesting ways of deciding turns/activations

>>51646949
Yeah, its called "playing defensively". If you know your opponent has a lot of shooting power and the possibility of a double turn then you need to minimize the potential damage he can do by keeping key units out of range and out of sight. Don't just blindly move forward and then wonder why you lost.

If your opponent brought a whole bunch of footslogging slow melee they deserve to lose

>>51647005
This. A rule of thumb that always seems to help me about random turn initiative is:

If you go first in a round, play defensively.
If you go second in a round, play aggressively.

Again, veteran players know how to capitalize on it and minimize risk from it. It's part of deployment, tactics, even list building.

>>51641076
dey arr rrook same

>>51646957
I loved that game so damn much. Pissed me tf off when WotC bought it and promptly discontinued it.

Probably what got me into tabletop gaming, honestly.

>>51646949
There's only one scenario where you can start scoring on turn one. Playing defensively on top of one means that you'll have to endure a round of shit but you can easily threaten charges if they try to score too aggressively. It doesn't make sense in a vacuum death match but scenario changes the strategy drastically.

>>51646863
>Not really. It's sheer randomness for randomness sake.

I play Silvaneth. I play them in a single battalion so I basically always have the choice of going first, and going first allow me to not only teleport around the table where I want, but to launch an alpha strike against my opponents.

With the random turn that would also mean that my opponent has a chance of a double turn, and the certainty of having a double turn before I could have it. So all the previous points have to be evaluated against how much devastating would be for my opponent to go twice. Against things like stormfiend it would be a suicide for example.

But If I allow him to go first now I can have a double turn, but he can do an alpha strike instead and by moving well he can seriously limit my teleport.

Without random turn order I just always go first, because why would I ever do anything else?

>>51647594
>Without random turn order I just always go first, because why would I ever do anything else?
And this is the problem facing 40k. Going first gives you a pretty distinct advantage for the entire game, barring a few scenarios. Random turn order means I generally have a chance of turning the tables on my opponent

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>>51641485 here

How does this look for a goal list? I like the idea of the bloodclaw starhost with some support. Anyone recommend any modifications?

>>51647698
I think that an alternating activation (like in SW Armada or Imperial Assault or Battletech) would be the best solution since it has an incredible strategical depth without having the randomness of random turn order.

>>51647725
Never run 2 bastiladons. I would swap one for a Stegadon to give you more offense.

Why bring the 10 Skinks? You have enough battleline already, use those points for something else.

I think a Skink Priest is a must-have in every list. Rerolling saves is too good to pass up.

>>51648171
>Never run 2 bastiladons. I would swap one for a Stegadon to give you more offense.
Interesting, why do you not recommend 2 bastiladons? They seem pretty good and provide plenty of offense in the form of some decent shooting.

>Why bring the 10 Skinks? You have enough battleline already, use those points for something else.
Like what? I literally had 80 points leftover and it was either a unit of skinks for some extra shooting and general objectives, or a razordon.

>I think a Skink Priest is a must-have in every list. Rerolling saves is too good to pass up.
Good point. I most am taking the starpriest for some casting, like mystic shield and whatnot, but the priest is a good option. Would you recommend priestly trappings or cloak of feathers? But also the priest power going off on a 4+ doesnt seem reliable, unless i am missing something.

>>51648289
>Interesting, why do you not recommend 2 bastiladons?
You can only put Mystic Shield on one of them at a time, so the one that doesnt get MS will be vulnerable to enemy focus fire.

Bastiladons are only good at defense, their offense is poor for how many points you are paying. A Razordon (60 points) does half the damage at only 1/5 the cost of a Bastiladon (300), albeit with a shorter range.

Bastiladons are only worth their points if you can get a 2+ rerollable save because then they can become an unkillable wall and tie up a huge amount of enemy attacks. Without mystic shield and a rerollable save the Bastiladon dies pretty quickly because it only has 8 wounds.

Cut the 2nd Bastiladon for a Stegadon, cut the skinks, and bring a Priest instead.

>>51648429
The priest just doesn't seem very reliable with his 4+ power. I've had bad luck with single 4+ rolls. They never seem to go off when you need them the most. Also trappings or cloak for priest?

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>mfw Slaanesh is kill in AOS, and 40k will follow
Tell me, why even game anymore ?

>>51648623
Slaanesh is not kill. Zhe is still very much a part of the story. What part of missing and not confirmed dead do you not understand?

>>51648623
Did we have a bingo slot for retards yelling that slaanesh had been squatted??

>>51648623

and nothing of value was lost.

slaneesh is worst god.

>>51648623
daily reminder that if GW would be squatting slaanesh entirely they wouldnt have made a big metal daemonette sale in december

>>51648569
It becomes more reliable if you run a Skink Starseer alongside the Priest

Definitely trappings. I've never found a list that can use the cloak well - maybe in a 500 point game?

>>51648770
You could just as easily argue that they made a big metal daemonette sale in december precisely because Slaanesh would be squatted and they'd wanted to squeeze out a little more dosh.
I mean, I don't think so, but it's another obvious conclusion to be drawn from that.

Anyone care to speculate on the points costs for the new storm cast units?

My guess is 140 for 5 vanguard

280 for 5 chargers

160 for hero

220 for 3 crossbow guys

No idea on aetherwings

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Ok I want to get into this, but I have an issue with reading the rules due to past childhood trauma that I won't get into.

What's stopping 1 player from using 150 minis compared to his opponent who only has 25 minis with him?

I kinda want to get into this game, but it seems like a complete mess lore wise not just gameplay wise.

Thank you.

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>>51648770
Also I think squatting has been so overused it lost it meaning.

Squatting originally meant that something would get lost completely in the transition to new edition/story. The term derived from the old squat army which pretty much go no mention at all in fluff after the new edition which decided to abandon them. The only word about them is a dev saying they got eaten by tyranids. The rules never got an update and they stopped selling the model. That is a squatting. It's almost as if they never happened.

Technically, Tomb Kings and Brettonia could be considered squatting because they are not mentioned in new fluff, nor are they selling models anymore. However it's not entirely a squatting because their points are getting updated in the GHB2, which means they are still playable in the new edition.

Slaanesh is not squatted. To squat slaanesh would mean all mention of her is removed outside of a few sidenotes. This is not the case. Just about every major fluff novel and book mentions the hunt being on for her, and it is heavily implied the coming aelves updates wiill be tied directly with the slaanesh storyline. Also if slaanesh was squatted, GW would have discontinued all slaaneshi models, which we can obviously see is not the case, and again, in order for it to be a true squatting, they would go unsupported, and we see colorful warscrolls reprinted in the GA:Chaos book.

>>51648881

>What's stopping 1 player from using 150 minis compared to his opponent who only has 25 minis with him?

i dont get the question.

>>51648881
In narrative, social contract.

In competitive, points costs.

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>>51648905
>because they are not mentioned in new fluff

>>51648881
Minis now have point values. Balance the game with your opponent.

>>51648861
Chargers are sold as 3 dudes, so they will be costed according to that.
And beyond that, we don't know jack about any of the new units beyond tiny tidbits, so what are you basing those guesses on?

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>>51648881
2 words:

General's Handbook

Also the setting isn't for everyone. But there is a lot more to it than people see on the surface level.

>>51648999
Well there you go. If that is indeed referring to tomb kings, then they are not completely squatted. But my point is slaanesh is getting way more mention and story than that so she is definitely not squatted/

>>51648881
>Ok I want to get into this, but I have an issue with reading the rules due to past childhood trauma that I won't get into.
Do you realize how incredibly retarded that sounds?

>>51648999
Those trips, what is that from by the way?

>>51649016
We know one of the crossbow dudes have a 36" range shooting attack, and that the vanguard hunters have super Outflank

>>51649016
Ah I thought chargers would be sold as packs of five seeing as they showed larger units in white dwarf.

My basis comes from the costs of other storm cast units and what I've learned these guys can do.

Vanguard probably have liberator stats (2w,4+) but can outflank, have ranged attacks, and might be able to run and charge. The probably lack the killing power of judis or libs, so I put them at a middle ground

Chargers I suspect are a medium between dracoths and gryphs hounds. They are fast, probably have bonuses on the charge (more damage, rend ,etc) and I'd imagine the graph hounds have either a darting attacks type ability or a mortal wound on 6's type thing (the charger pecks out the eyes?). I'd cost them a bit less if they are units of 3 though

Hero because that redeploy ability sounds crazy, depending on its range and if the unit can move afterward. He probably isn't as strong as the constant discotheque in combat but his command ability seems much better.

The crossbow guys because holy Shit 9 shots per model is a lot. And storm cast ranged units (except prosecutors) are decently expensive already.

>>51649073
Godbeasts, I think

>>51649110
Hmm, fair enough. Not sure I'd agree, mind you, but you make a compelling case in many regards.
Supposedly Vanguard Hunters are worse then Liberators in melee, but better than Judicators, so I'd put them at 2 attacks at 4+/4+, which matches your estimate.
And the crossboy guys in the WD pump out crazy amounts of shots, but apparently they do jack overall, killing like three Tzaangors with 27 shots, so I assume they have a terrible weapon profile. 220 seems pretty excessive. 180 maybe.
On the other hand, 160 for the Lord-Aquilor seems crazy low for a dude that supposedly has as many wounds and the same save as a LC on Dracoth.

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>mfw I've been temporarily banned for posting lewd, because my last shitpost had a censored slaaneshi pic

I genuinely love mod's sense of irony. Please, hold me.

>>51649057
especially because we need to assume now you are underage and not allowed to post.

>>51648791
Ok I can see that.

Now, I really don't want to do a stegadon. I am willing to drop a bastiladon though. So if I drop the bastiladon and skinks, I get about 380 points. Would you recommend something else like teradons or ripperdactyls? Howabout kroxigor?

>>51649534
I would run a Stegadon. Combined fire from the Bastiladon and Stegadon is enough to drop most 5-7 wound heroes. The height of the Seraphon dinosaur shooting attacks is very important, since enemy heroes can't just hide behind standard rank and file troops to avoid getting shot.

You can also run Sunfire Throwers instead of the great bow if you need help dealing with horde units.

The Stegadon also has a powerful Rend-3 horn attack that is great on the offense and defense when you counter pile-in after absorbing a charge with a screen.

The Stegadon can also move the bastiladon an extra D6 inches every turn, which is amazing since the Bastiladon only moves 5" per turn. Many people will move heroes more than 25" away from the Bastiladon (20" range + 5" move) and neglect to remember that the Stegadon can make it move an additional D6, which usually puts it in position to fire the laser.

Ripperdactyls are not good. Lots of attacks (assuming you fight near the toad) but no rend means they can't do much more than harass light units, and there are better choices for that like Chameleon Skinks and Terradons. They need to survive multiple rounds of combat to get more value than Terradons, and they don't have the defenses to do that with a 5+ save and 3 wounds each.

Kroxigors are decent but the Stegadon is only 80 points more and hits much harder, and gives you a shooting attack. Kroxigors are a great unit to pick against hordes of clan rats or any large unit of 10+ models.

Stegadon + Bastiladon is a staple in Seraphon lists.

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>>51649047
I want them to reference Chaos Dwarfs so FUCKING bad

>>51649271
>so I assume they have a terrible weapon profile

They probably are the same as the crossbow judicators.

27 shots at 3+/4+ means 9 wounds, the Tzaangors have 6 wounds and a 5+ save so it makes sense.

>>51645534
>>51644879
Which one of these is better? I have all of the daemons atm, but I do have a shopping list

When I'm sad, I just like to think about how Orghotts Daemonspew came into the world.

>>51641966
There's already a home brew Cosmic horrors

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Lemme smash

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Do we know something more about GHB2? Will it be a GHB1 + extra stuff and new points or maybe I will have to buy both of them to have all rules on paper?

>>51651451
All we know is it will have updated points, rules, and battleplans. Probably an expanded path to glory campaign system as well.

It is wholly meant to replace the old one.

>>51651451
Supposedly each new GHB is meant to make the older versions obsolete.

>>51643307
Just wanted to say "thanks".

>>51651463
>>51651467
Oh, that's fine. I was thinking about buying a GHB just to support my LGS but I will wait for GHB2 - at least I will buy more paints from them

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played a game of hinterlands
2x battlemages and 6 freeguild guard vs
1 rotbringers sorcerer, 2 nurglings and a toad vs
two ogres, two lizards and the immortal Red Grot

>>51652118
Who won?

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>>51652141
ogres.
I as the nurgle player beat the shit out of the human player, and the ogor player and human player made a pact against me since i looked immortal.

then the ogor smashed me and just cleaned both of us up.
he'd made his warlord the little red grot and kept him safe all game, but on the final turn the human players one archer managed to pick him off, so it was a bitter victory.

>>51652167
I'm going to play hinterlands tomorrow, wish me luck!

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>>51652183
good luck, keep your wizards safe.

>>51649271
Kairic Acolytes, not Tzaangors.

>>51651463
>>51651467
I just hope Border War gets fixed or replaced. Scenarios you can score on turn 1 combined with being able to win despite being nearly tabled means you can get some shit games when you roll it.

>>51652183
We're having a Hinterlands trial run at the flgs this weekend as well. I am kinda desperatly trying to get my Knight-Questor conversion done for that, but I keep removing the sword arm again and again; none of the poses look any good...

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gratuitous picture of my elves cause bored

>>51652966
>combined with being able to win despite being nearly tabled
You see, I really really like this. I like that I can win a scenario even when I get tabled. This penalizes players who build lists specifically to ignore objectives and table opponents. It rewards smart flexible players. I really hope 40k adopts that. It makes sense from a fluff standpoint too. Often battles can result in annihilation of one side, but as long as they achieved the objective, it helped in the war effort. It's like one of those last stand/suicide mission that are necessary.

>>51648680
We should

>>51649774
They have referenced Hashim twice. He's having his followers make weapons for khornes.

>>51653250
We already have 2 other extremely live, explosive scenarios. This one is the worst of the 3 because it's pretty easy for some armies to play for 3 rounds and then never have to roll another die for the rest of the game. It happened on Sunday at the LVO where a player on stream got jammed out and conceded on 3 because coming back was mathematically impossible, despite having a good amount of models left and not really making any mistakes. There needs to be some way of contesting the middle objectives or it needs to count units rather than models for capturing, because right now there's too much potential for non-games.

>>51653589
You do know escalation was changed in the FAQ, right? With the faq it's merely an objective mission like any other.

Anyway, I like them the way they are. I prefer objective missions over kill-point missions any day.

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From the page:

"After the excitement of Friday night had worn off, the hard work began. The first task was to look at every Pitched Battle profile in the game and identify any changes we wanted to make. Some points went up, some went down; you’ll have to wait until the book is released to see the the full fruits of our labor...The guys worked into the night, led by Jervis Johnson himself, looking at list after list of numbers in conjunction with feedback from all over the Warhammer Age of Sigmar community including thousands of Facebook comments – from when we asked what you’d like to see changed – as well as hundreds of emails from players and tournament organizers from all over the world."

literally 5 guys spend one day reading feedback from the community and spent one day doing test games and that was the total effort they put into the rebalance for GHB 2.0

the disappointment is very overwhelming.
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/02/09/generals-handbook-ii-behind-the-scenes/

>>51653699
You're dense. This is not the total effort. Does it say in there that they are done? That the book is off to the printers? That was the initial discussion for the book's direction and what resulted in the PLAYTEST image we saw earlier. Get a grip, man.

>>51653699
Wow. And the way they said that makes it sound like they thought that was a long time.

>>51653677
Escalation wasn't on my list for live scenarios. Places of Power and Gifts are way more potentially explosive.

>over kill-point missions
I didn't propose kill points, anon. Simply wondering if there is a better way to change the control system on Border to prevent situations like the LVO game (where the player caught flak for conceding an unwinnable game).

>>51653726
>Does it say in there that they are done?
yes it does

>That the book is off to the printers?
may as well be see above

>That was the initial discussion for the book's direction and what resulted in the PLAYTEST image we saw earlier.

I would love to believe you but that's not what the web site says.

>>51653732
>Wow. And the way they said that makes it sound like they thought that was a long time.

I know, right?

>>51653098
Shade yo shit bitch

>thinking about going with Harvestboon for my Sylvaneth
>St Duncan does a how-to on Harvestboon today

Is the Dunc telling me to go with the Harvest?

List possibly related:

Allegiance: Sylvaneth

Leaders
Drycha Hamadreth (280)
- General
Branchwraith (100)
- Artefact: Warsong Stave
Branchwych (100)
- Artefact: The Silverwood Circlet
Branchwraith (100)
Treelord Ancient (300)
- Artefact: Briarsheath

Battleline
5 x Tree-Revenants (100)
- Sylvaneth Battleline
20 x Dryads (240)
10 x Dryads (120)
10 x Dryads (120)

Units
3 x Kurnoth Hunters (180)
- Greatbows
5 x Spite-Revenants (100)
3 x Tree Kin (100)

Battalions
Harvestboon Wargrove (100)
Forest Folk (60)

Scenery
Sylvaneth Wyldwood - Sylvaneth Allegiance (0)

Total: 2000/2000

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>>51653810
>yes it does
You're still dense. Look at this image. They called the preview a WIP. A playtest document they will be trialing during the SCGT, which was also the tournament that set the basis for the matched play points we know now.

The article that's got your panties in a twist specifically said it took place around christmas time, at least 2 months before they showed us the little preview.

So those 4 guys hammered out a beta to be used during the SCGT, then the design team I imagine will make further adjustments based on the TO's feedback of it.

So chill out, you're skipping a bunch of vital context there sport.

>>51653470
I know they mentioned him once but where was the second time?

>>51654235
>You're still dense.

I don't know. Your link shows 02/07/17, mine shows 02/09/17 and is on the official community web site.

you could be right but it would require believing the GW community web site is lying for it to be true.

>>51654361
Look closer at the bottom of his pic. Y'know, the bit that says "WARHAMMER-COMMUNITY.COM".

So if the second article is lying, it is being suicidally bad at it.

>>51654361
What are you on about? The dates further reinforce my point.

First on the 7th they release the preview showing the TK nerfs and fyreslayer buffs. Then 2 days later they released the article showing the design process they went through to make that. I don't get what you're confused about.

>>51653810
>yes it does
No it doesn't. they are 'done' compiling all the changes they feel they need to make, now they are going to go through and make those changes while play testing (the next dy they came in and started this)

The book is no-where near complete and you're an idiot for interpreting it as such.

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>>51654415
>>51654592

it literally says they will be trialing some of the updates they came up with at the tournament.

Then the main article two days later clarifies that 5 guys spent two days coming up with all the updates for GHB 2.0.

I think you're doing some impressive mental gymnastics to come to any other conclusion based on the available information.

>>51654687
>it literally says they will be trialing some of the updates they came up with at the tournament.

tin foil hat time: they pushed the Tomb Kings points changes early to prevent another Tomb King army from placing high at the next tournament like the fiasco last time.

>>51654687
>two days later clarifies that 5 guys spent two days coming up with all the updates for GHB 2.0.
which will be used during the SCGT where it will be playtested and adjusted based on TO feedback.

>>51654733
Possibly. Also it is likely any army commonly topping tournaments may be under subject to points adjustments, which was the case for the tomb kings.

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>>51654777
>it will be playtested and adjusted based on TO feedback.

the main article doesn't say anything about these changes being pushed out to the wider community for play testing. It says they are done.

I hope you're right but lets just say I'm not optimistic.

>>51654687
Look buddy, you can continue to cry that the sky is falling, even though you seem to be the only person seeing it. It doesn't make it true. Literally nobody else has come to the conclusion that only 5 dudes wrote the ghb in one night and its off to the printers. It's pretty clear what is going on.

>>51654838
This

>>51654687
They came up with the changes in 2 days, that's fine. They are now play testing those changes, these changes aren't final, they aren't set in stone and they aren't being printed. You're an idiot.

The GHB is pretty decent as is, it's not hard to think up some changes and then brainstorm them with other people.

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>>51654838
>even though you seem to be the only person seeing it

fucking read the article then and see for yourself.

Maybe take off those rose tinted glasses and actually read what the article says and take it at face value.

Besides, I'm not saying the sky is falling. I'm saying I'm disappointed that the entire "rebalance" for GHB 2.0 was done in two days by five guys in an evening and a handful of test games the next day.

The sky isn't falling but I was hoping for more.

>>51654814
That's not the main article. The main article is this one:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/02/07/the-generals-handbook-ii-wip-points-sneak-peek/

The one that says they will be playtesting the first draft of the GHB at the SCGT. The one you are so riled up about is talking about the event that took place 2 months prior. Perhaps they could have been a little more clear for people with nervous dispositions and like to come to wild conclusions, but we see what's happening.

The GHB2 will be paytested at the coming SCGT, which hasn't happened yet. During that I am sure the points draft will get leaked on the internet, then after much outcry and bitching, it will get adjusted again, THEN off to the printers. The SCGT is happening in April, btw.

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>>51654865
>They are now play testing those changes, these changes aren't final

NOT WHAT THE FUCKING ARTICLE SAYS DUMBASS

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/02/09/generals-handbook-ii-behind-the-scenes/

>>51654876
I'm done. This is arguing with a child. Can anyone else take over?

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>>51654902
>The GHB2 will be paytested at the coming SCGT

No, only the points changes they pushed out early to prevent more embarrassing compendium lists from dominating the tournament and giving a boost to one of their main production armies that didn't even show up in the last tournament were pushed early.

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>>51654907
What the fact that 5 guys wirte changes trigger you that much ? did you get gangraped by 5 guys earlier this morning ?

Most rulebooks for most games are done by 5 guys or less.

Hell, i'm pretty sure updating the GHB point cost can be a one man job..

I could do ut by myself in a week by compilling data and my tournament experiences.

>>51654907
>YUS THEY ARE DONE
"many notes were taken to be hammered out during the design and editing part of the process"

Righto champ.

>>51654964
Slav is right.
It's a one man job at best.

>Khorne gets giant warriors with blood fetishes and huge axes everywhere

>Tzeentch gets retarded birdmen and AWAKEN MY MASTERS infantry

I like the Kairics, but I wish we got something cooler than Tzaangors.

>>51654964
>Hell, i'm pretty sure updating the GHB point cost can be a one man job.. in a week

then you would be a moron

or maybe I just expected a serious balance pass and am disappointed it won't be happening.

>>51654990
Any half serious and unbiased tournament player could do it in an evening with enough data.

>>51654969
>Righto champ.

"Finally, they were done, and it only took a few gallons of coffee and a quick pizza break to see them through to the finish" and "The following day, it was time to see how their hard work actually played out on the table top."

okay dumbass

>>51654990
If anything, you can complain that they wasted money by having more than 1 designer on the balance pass.
More than 3 people on that is total overkill already

>>51655006
>Any half serious and unbiased tournament player could do it in an evening with enough data.
>>51655026
>If anything, you can complain that they wasted money by having more than 1 designer on the balance pass.More than 3 people on that is total overkill already

I guess a monkey could do the job in an hour too if that was the level of quality of work you wanted to get.

>>51654990
Ok, grand game designer, what would it take for a balanced pass to go over all the points? Please enlighten us.

>>51655020
They were done with the preliminary changes moron. Fuck how are you actually this stupid??? My quotes is literally the more important one and speaks volumes against you. Your quotes says they were done with "these are the changes we should make" and "lets test out these changes we are done making" And then as i stated they took notes of what didn't work and what needs tweaking during the DESIGN part of the book. They wouldn't just take notes for no fucking reason you giant thundercunt.

>>51654990
That's what they did for 20 years tho.
For some reason, this time, you're triggered like a feminist over a fashion magazine cover.
Do you think they were brainstorming with 10 people for months for any updates in those 20 last years ?

>>51655051
you're delusional and ignoring the words as they are written in favor of your fantasy about things being the way you hope they will be.

God damn it I don't know what I expected here. A bunch of GW dick suckers who have rose tined glasses so thick they cant even have an honest conversation about what was actually disclosed in the articles.

>>51655065
Then you're doing exactly the same thing. Okay if what you quoted means they are finished what does my quote mean?

>>51655114
if means they have to hand it off to back office for typing their notes and changes into the new book.

>>51654990
Most games are balanced by 1 or 2 Guys.
As was Warhammer since ever.
Jervis was one of the guys writing most of the 8th rulebook as per some early 2010 old white dwarf interview.
They never put more than a couple guys usually.
You think GHB 1 was written by more than a couple designer ?

Even Ultra cpmpetitive video games with near perfect balance like Starcraft 2 are balanced by David Kim alone and some playtesters.
And we are talking products from companies 100 times the size of GW.
If you think it was ever different you are wrong.
Welcome to the reality.

>>51655137
That's not what design means in this case. Editing sure. But not design.

>>51655087
And I don't know what I was expecting. You're just a moron who refuses to look at something in an entire context and comes to a wild conclusion based on his warped perception of an article.

The sad thing, I believe you are genuinely honest in your ignorance, and that makes it worse.

We don't need to be 'GW dick suckers' to understand what's going on. Do we believe this will be the most balanced points system in existence? Of course not, but your strawman argument seems to believe that we do.

>>51654990
How does balancing a game works in your fantasy world ?
Just how many people for how many months do you think it took until now ?

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>>51655170
This guy knows whats up

>>51655087
>A bunch of GW dick suckers who have rose tined glasses so thick they cant even have an honest conversation
Nice fallacy.

What's happening here is you realize you were mistaken after being called out on your unwarranted panic, realized you were wrong, but are to stubborn to leave it be and dug your toes in your argument. Now you are using circular logic and strawmanning to continuously argue the same points we've refuted. It's all you know how to deal with being told what's up. Life for you must be so frustrating.

>>51655283
You are a faggot anyway.

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I wanted more than for 5 guys to glance over a few emails and come up with all the points changes over some coffee and pizza in one evening, then play test the changes in a handful of games the next day.

I don't think that's enough time to do a good job but clearly the internet disagrees with me.

Winterleaf or Harvestboon for Sylvaneth?

I have fluff ideas for both, but I'm not sure which to go with.

>>51655311
We don't disagree. 5 guys, some coffee and pizza and 2 days is not enough time to playtest a book. WHICH IS WHY THE BOOK WASN'T COMPLETELY WRITTEN AND FINALIZED!

I'm not using all caps because I'm mad, but to drive the point home. Your whole argument as you started was the book was being sent to the printers from that fateful 2 days effort. Our argument is they are far from done as said in other articles and clearly written in the SCGT player pack. The playtest for this shit is going clear out through April, and from that point it will be a few months before we even get the book.

We are saying you are flipping out over nothing. You don't seem to understand how this stuff works. 1 to 5 guys are usually responsible for hammering out a draft. In this case they are doing it using a wealth of resources and comments on their FB page and emails from TO's. Then after the rough draft happens (which is what your key article is about) then it gets playtested. The big playtest coming is the SCGT.

Dude, I am pretty finished with this. We keep making the same points and you keep ignoring them. Good luck with your frustration. I'm done typing the same thing over and over again.

>>51655375
Lay it on us. What's your fluff ideas?

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>>51655442
>The big playtest coming is the SCGT.

that big playtest is only the changes for the TK and FS, and only because they want to avoid another embarrassment like having another out of print army place high like last time and give a boost to one of their main production armies that was no where to be seen in the top rankings.

there is nothing, nothing what so ever, to suggest any further points changes are going to be released for play testing prior to the finalization of the changes they made during their 2 day 5 man beer and pizza party.

Believe me I hope I'm wrong but there is nothing in print to suggest I am wrong.

>>51655087
some pretty powerful autists dwell om /tg/ they lost their virginity riding GWs dick.

Gunliney Freeguild army. Trying to figure out the optimum ratio of sword+board guard, handgunners and greatswords.

Also weighing the pros/cons of running using the empire legacy lists and spending 200 on formations to get vintage knights or spending 100 for a Freeguild Regiment and shitty taxes

What say you?


×
List Summary
Allegiance: Order

Leaders
Freeguild General (100)
- General
- Trait: Strategic Genius
- Artefact: Relic Blade

Battleline
20 x Freeguild Handgunners (200)
20 x Freeguild Handgunners (200)
50 x Freeguild Guard (400)

Units
20 x Freeguild Greatswords (320)
5 x Empire Knights (140)
- Lance and Sword
5 x Empire Knights (140)
- Lance and Sword
5 x Empire Knights (140)
- Lance and Sword
5 x Empire Knights (140)
- Lance and Sword

Battalions
Brotherhood of Knights (80)
State Troop Detachment (120)

Total: 1980/2000

Select All

>>51655678
what results are you talking about where TK placed good ? Can't find them

>>51655539

The fluff in short is that a treeman ancient was slain a long time ago, shattered into countless splinters by a great warlord [not sure what yet], and a Branchwych and Branchwraith were born from the two largest. The two then go on to lead followers based on whichever house I go with, which includes a Treeman who fought under the felled ancient.

That's the basic idea, at least.

A Winterleaf group would be born of vengeance and hatred. The sisters arrive at the clan and gather followers to stalk the realms for the scattered splinters, killing those who would stand in their way. To find such a splinter is to risk their wrath for it is the embodiment of their ferocity.

A Harvestboon group would be born from a new beginning. A small grove marks the place of the ancients death, tended to by the sisters, who are guided to their house by a splinter at the grove's heart. There, they gather followers to find the lost splinters, leaving verdant bloom in their wake. To find a splinter is to risk the wyldwood, for it is the embodiment of life.

>>51656075
Looks good. So are you asking which grove would suit that best?

>>51656411

Yea. I'm not sure which version I should go with and ultimately which battalion.

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How many points do you think the steelburner pack will be ? hoping for 80 or less.

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>>51656588
Have they even confirmed if it is getting a point cost?

in hinterlands games, do you think nurglings healing every turn is too strong?
what about healing to full once out of combat?

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How can anyone stand playing Skaven? They have to be the most retarded fantasy race ever conceived.

Does somebody at GW have a rat fetish or something? There's no excuse for this trash

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>>51656942
Baby's first troll, how cute.

>>51656712
Meh, they are midtier at best.

>>51656588
I hope for something like 20 to 40. I mean it's not stronger than a wytchfire coven and only deal 3d3 mortal wounds most of the time.

>>51654235
Besides points is an excell sheet, the rest of the book probably needs more work

>>51656075

>Not calling it Wynterleaf

Not AoS enough in my book.

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>>51657292
>I'm so sad my containment thread is as dead as my game so I feel better trying to troll people playing in the superior setting.

>>51657365
>not realizing this is the containment thread

40keks

>>51645534
>>51649924
i had a fight with a demon list which was really similar to your demon list, except with a gaunt summoner instead of epidemius, and it was dead ard' killy

>>51656644
Fuck. Now I need to go fix my model...

>>51657428
>fantasyfags actually believe this

>>51646003
A good starting place for a 2000 army are the main battalions for Daemons of Tzeentch. The Changehost and Cohort of Tzeentch. From there you add Slaves/Arcanites to your liking, base it on whether you are looking to be magic heavy or troop heavy. For 4000pt armies, if you are going troop heavy, look at the battalions that buff Tzaangors, or grab the Chaos Warband battalion if you want more slaves of darkness for the higher bravery. If magic heavy, the world is really your oyster here. If you're fine with the 2000pt army, moving into a 4000pt you can just leave points for daemons to summon given Cohort of Tzeentch allows a second spell for all wizards (most of your units are wizards), given whatever the scenario needs. Another option is to finish out the list by getting Overseer's Fate-Twisters battalion. This essentially guarantees summons and effects and is godlike.

>>51646003
>>51658212
Also, if your looking to save money, get the Herald on Chariot box. Its pretty much a herald + exalted flamer + extra units (pink horrors you can pain blue for blue horror doublets). Flamers are kind of a mix between an archer and an artillery piece. Get the Flamers and not exalteds (better for summoning). Tzaangors are like low bravery chaos units (warriors and marauders) with extra effects thrown in. Go to the 1d4chan page for Disciples of Tzeentch for a quick rundown.

>>51658243
Wouldn't getting the Start Collecting be better considering it's the Herald on Chariot kit featuring Horrors/Screamers/Flamers?

How the hell am I supposed to play Khorne competitively when most units are slow without completely butchering the feel of the army? Spam Flesh Hounds, spam Bloodthirsters? I need help.

>>51658137
It's hard for a group to accept that they have become the loud annoying minority

WHFBLM! Warhammer Fantasy Battle Lives Matter!

>>51654932
You mean the worst offenders of balances issue?

>>51656057

He's referring to tomb kings winning the UK Masters.

Which still is retarded because they outright stated this was just a sneak peak and these autistic braindead abortions of retards are thinking that's all that will be playtested.

>>51658365
Bloodthirsters, Skullcrushers, Chaos Knights, Flesh Hounds, Skullcannons, Soulgrinders.

>>51658365
Like every other khorne player in the world.
Skaarac and sayl

>>51656075

Anyone else? Not sure if I should go with Winterleaf or Harvestboon still.

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Speaking of Khorne, here's another Khorne daemon prince, courtesy of Forgeworld.
Looks kinda dumb, but his warscroll is fairly substantial.

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>khornates, masters of the stupid pose

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Not a fan of those face-shields, but it's techically well done.

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But, seriously, that pose...

>>51658917
>>51658933
>>51658939
>>51659006

Nobody cares about khorne, man.

Did they make plastic flesh hounds yet?

>>51659044
>I don't care about Khorne that means no one does!!

Fuck off, man. Let people discuss what they like.

>>51640916
Wow, that guy looks a LOT better in the artwork.

>>51659044
This.
Most overdone, most fucking boring, least original, Chaos God. Period. Full stop.
Let's work on Tzeetch and Slaanesh please

>>51658917
Of course it is.
FW sells models that have rules to match their ridiculous pricing.

>>51659044
I don't give a shit about Khorne, but it is a new release and as such deserves to be discussed.

>>51659137
Except the part nobody discusses it.

Its Khorne demon#6382899
Bland rules, bland models, will probably never see any tabletop if he cost more than 180 points.
Any more point and you just take shartor, a BT, or something good like Skaarac, not this shite.
Theres so much khorne overlapping that 90% of khorne models dont see play and new models wont see play either.

>>51659168
Exactly.

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>>51658554
>thinking that's all that will be playtested.

they outright stated they did a day of play testing. Their balance changes already in this article.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/02/09/generals-handbook-ii-behind-the-scenes/

quote from article: "The following day, it was time to see how their hard work actually played out on the table top. There was more coffee and a bit of breakfast, and then out came the models, and the dice started to fly."

The other article doesn't mention they will be doing an early release of any more points changes than the short list in this article.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2017/02/07/the-generals-handbook-ii-wip-points-sneak-peek/

Quote: "Today, we’re happy to announce that we’ll be trialling some updates at the independant South Coast Grand Tournament event here in the UK." and "We know that not all of you can get to the event, so we thought we’d give you access to the updates we’re trialing here too:"

I want to believe you are right about them doing more play testing on the balance changes but I don't find anything in either article that says they are. Do you have anything in print saying they are going to or are you just assuming that they will?

No need to get pissy, just post the links and the quotes if you have them.

>>51659843
Are you seriously just incapable of inferring information that was not outright stated?

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>>51659855
>inferring information

what quote in either article infers they will be releasing more balance adjustments to the community for play testing?

No need to get pissy, just post the links and the quotes if you have them.

>>51659855
Don't you see it? Of course he can't.

>>51660043
Yeah, that much has become apparent. I feel like I'm fighting against windmills here.
Though I have to wonder if it's the same guy that was adamant out the sky falling when the first stormcast leaks a week ago happened. The posting style is similar.

>>51660103
I think he's either the recurring slav shitposter or a WHFB grognard here to 'kick the piss out of us' yet again. Either way people should stop replying to him and just ignore his idiotic hyperbole.

>>51658933
>Dance! Dance with me!

Mazarall the Butcher is yet another OP Chaos unit.

Fuck you GW.

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>>51660183
>not owning a Shartor

>>51660142
>slav shitposter
I think the dude from Lithuania (the one ass-pained about the Start Collecting SC only containing two retributors) was a different guy. His English at least was far worse. Though maybe it's the 'playing for cash prices' genius.

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>>51660202
Difference is, Mazarall will probably be 150 points max. The dude has 4 attacks, 3+/3+ with 3 damage with -2 rend.

He's likely to kill at least one model every turn he melee's something, so that's another attack added. He can easily end an average game with 7+ attacks. He will smash through most chaff infantry.

>>51660214
There are several slavshitposters. One who does the "HUR DUR FUCK OFF GW SHILL/MANAGER" see pic related is a mix of the usual. Only one of them is the slav. I gave up collecting the shitposts. These were in a fucking 40k thread.

>>51660183
Eh, without a point cost I'm not sure yet. His rerollable 4+ is nice to have and a barely decaying main weapon has potential, but he needs a little to really ramp up.

>>51660228
>150 pts
No way. If that asshole doesn't cost at least 240 I'm calling shenanigans. I mean, yes, his command is kinda meh, but
>unbind
>flat damage axe
>rerollable save
>can gain attacks during both own and enemy combat phase
>mortal wound charge
are all pretty hefty.

>>51660285
This is forgeworld we are talking about, they are pretty shit at AoS points.

Are Chaos dwarves legacy models?

>>51660307
Shar'Tor himself cost 240 points, no way this new guy will be cheaper

>>51660315
Nah, FW only models

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>>51658939
>More Khorne.
Khorne is worst Chaos God by far.

>>51659044
>>51659168
>>51659269
>>51660445
Oh boy can't wait for the khorne dragon release just to see you faggots triggered again

>>51660611
I'm just sick of Khorne. Hell, that one Khorogorath model was originally supposed to be a K'Daii from what I understand

>>51658939
That looks laughably terrible

It's like the warcraft Gnoll-tents with the crap texture of a skinned human face, shit is awful

Not to mention this faggot looks like a Saurus, but Khorneshit will always be trash typical 2/10 FW Aos model

>>51660611
> you faggots
It's probably just one poster who is insanely mad about khorne. So much whining about a forgeworld model ffs.

Are khorgoraths ded?

>>51658917
I want to use these rules but I really don't want to buy that ugly fuck. What could be a good proxy?

>>51661092
A different daemon prince, it's really not hard.

>>51661079
Until they get a actual kit with some options, yes. The idea of a Monster unit is fine, but their output is pitiful and that one ugly monopose fucker isn't helping matters.

That said, in Hinterlands they are actually not that bad. A 8 wound creature for 80pts is fairly nice.

Man i really want to play hinterlands, but ive only one other player. Would that still work? A rolw playing element for AoS sounds amazing

>>51661136
- the other FW Daemon Prince
- Bloodthirster without wings
- banelords from Mierce Miniatures

>>51661305
>have 50% staff discount
>actually considering ordering this
Am I making the right choice

>>51661266
If you're just playing it with another guy, it's like playing a skirmish game. Think of it kinda like Kill-Team but for AoS. It really shines in campaign play though.

>>51656588
80 points is absurd when I'm paying 120 for hammerstrike force

I love Making my modles multi use, I gots a question, I'm thinking of getting some sylvanneth modles, initially it was to convert some spite revenants into bettee flayed ones and to get Drycha as a C'tan shard, painting all the bark metallic to look like peeling malfunctioning necrodermis, but I'm thinking they could also just be sylvaneth allies for my seraphon, what would be the best way to fluff metal trees?

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>>51661521
Back to your containment thread
Take the tyrannid bloke with you

>>51661521
Tzeentch being a dick

>>51661540
The guy isn't porting necrons into the setting, he's asking for help with an alternative fluff for his modles to be used for their original intended use

>>51661549
Well that would match up with my tzeentch plans, and they Are cross setting for the most part too....

>>51661521
Metal trees sound pretty cool. Maybe just sylvaneth in the realm of metal?

>>51661569
Hmmm, I like the simplicity, kinda makes me think of the ending to beast machines, could have them with a rivalry with the dwarves in the realm for perverting their tech into another form of nature to be cut down and tamed,

>>51661590
>By Grugni! The woodish creatures cant even let us have an entire realm to work in without causing troubles! Realm climate changes mah hairy arse!

So after completing my 2000 point Stormcast, I was thinking about doing some Destruction. Any of you know if Greenskinz/Bonesplittaz are good?
I like the idea of -1 rend choppas.

Is this list any good?

Allegiance: Death

Leaders
Neferata Mortarch Of Blood (440)
Wight King with Baleful Tomb Blade (120)
- General
- Trait: Ruler of the Night
- Artefact: Cloak of Mists and Shadows
Necromancer (120)
- Mount: Nightmare
- Artefact: Black Amulet

Battleline
30 x Skeleton Warriors (240)
- Ancient Spear & Crypt or Tomb Shield
10 x Skeleton Warriors (80)
- Ancient Spear & Crypt or Tomb Shield

Units

Total: 1000/1000

The big skelly unit gets buffed by the WK, Neferata's signature spell and by the Necromancer, the other unit acts as a shield for the other one

>>51662088
Looks good. That Neferata is a point bloater though

>>51662183
I really like the model and i plan on starting by purchasing the Start Collecting Spookyskellingtons box. Also i'm a big fan of big fuckyou monsters.

>>51662088
My worry is you'll be fine in straight face-smashing, but skellies only move 4" and I wouldn't want to use neferata unsupported for contesting objectives

>>51662242
Would a straight up Deathlords list be better? Morghasts move more than double that and they look like they can smash a couple heads in without a problem

>>51662088
no trait / artefact on named characters.

>>51662347
Neferata doesn't have any though

>>51661348
I wish i got the limited edition loathsome ratmen, if u like the army go for it