>>44714571 3.PF and all those that build off that foundation. Too abstract to satisfy the crunchy detail crowd, too slow and complicated to satisfy the roll-and-shout gamist/narrativists crowd. It fails on both approaches.
>>44714668 >>44715310 Raping in FATAL is never mandatory. If you are a human male and your target is female (of any species, RAW), and you get an Overbearing result on your grappling roll, you may choose to rape. It's not a forced choice, it's not a potential accident.
>>44716700 And why wouldn't you trust them, after all it is the most detailed, realistic, and historically accurate RPG available.
In other news, according to FATAL, menstruating gives 40% of women a solid chance to become as choleric or melancholic as humanly possible (or beyond, technically), no matter what their personality was like before. Perfectly normal one day, instant suicidial depression and/or berserker rage the next.
>>44718177 Which system does it best is a good question. No RPG has a good grappling system. In Exalted 2nd edition, if one person is trained in grappling and the other isn't, the grappler wins as soon as they get a hold. Exalted 3rd is similar. So definitely not those games.
>>44718486 Riddle of Steel's grappling system was complicated, but so was the entire system. And once you figured it out, it was pretty flexible and while abstracted, generally provided some realistic results.
The problem is that grappling is simply too complicated a concept to represent in a fluid fashion while still having the kind of results you'd expect.
>>44718177 GURPS Technical Grappling is the most in-depth grappling system I've seen, but it's written in a by-wrestlers-for-wrestlers way where someone with no idea how wrestling works (most RPG players) will struggle with understanding the system. On top of that, there's so much math involved that you'll want (and the developers provide) a spreadsheet calculator to play with it. Lastly, the book is an example in how NOT to layout a book for readability.
>>44718631 I'm not talking about most accurate here, because GURPS or Pheonix Command will usually almost always win. I mean what game has a system that when you say "I'm gonna do x move related to wrestling" and the GM doesn't have to look something up, but is still able to provide a semi accurate answer.
>>44719066 >Perhaps the user can choose AG or STR depending on what he favours? That's not how wrestling works. Agility/Dex/speed/whatever is only a small part of it. Strength, size, and weight make a much, much bigger deal than any other factor. After that it's skill in your wrestling techniques.
>>44719091 It depends what kind of wrastlin' we're talking about hero. If it's the kind of wrestling that's about overpowering the person at the other end then it's definitely strength. If it's about off balancing your opponent then, well, strength isn't really that big of a deal:
>>44718631 >On top of that, there's so much math involved that you'll want (and the developers provide) a spreadsheet calculator to play with it Bull fucking shit stop lying out your ass. In TG, you roll for control points and track them, it's literally the same as rolling for damage and taking off HP. Higher control penalizes DEX and STR to the point of uselessness (pinning) or can be spent to help your roll/set damage cap for wrenches, locks, and throws. That's fucking it. It manages to be less abstract than most grappling systems while also being more intuitive due to it being more like regular combat with control point rolls ≈ damage rolls instead of weird binary conditions.
If you want to bitch about mass-based moves being too crunchy and being only for people more knowledgeable about wrestling, that's fine; that's why those rules are extra optional in an optional splat. But pull your head out of your ass and stop giving a system an undeserved bad reputation for MATH: TEH GA3M using outdated memes that applied to vehicle creation rules an edition and two decades ago.
>>44719829 >In TG, you roll for control points and track them, it's literally the same as rolling for damage and taking off HP. Higher control penalizes DEX and STR to the point of uselessness (pinning) or can be spent to help your roll/set damage cap for wrenches, locks, and throws. That's fucking it Nice summary Doug Cole, but you've oversimplified it. You roll for control points but then you also have implied control points based on areas you aren't grabbing, all of which are found with different formulas and thresholds; you track the individual limbs you use to grapple and adjust your STrength according to a table; each way you listed to spend control points is different. You're real fucking mad Doug, stop defending your game on anonymous image boards. >stop giving a system an undeserved bad reputation for MATH: TEH GA3M using outdated memes that applied to vehicle creation rules an edition and two decades ago. This isn't an outdated meme, Doug. This supplement earns its reputation for being too mathy.
>>44714687 >fails to hook the legs or sweep and instead allows her to sprawl >allows girl to gain a mounted position over his head without making any attempt to buck her or escape from that position. >allows her to control his arms and eventually pin his arms.
>>44717754 >Which system has functional grapple rules at all?
Well, in Mongoose Traveller it's pretty simple to do and pretty effective. If you're attacked and don't have a gun on you, sometimes your best bet is to rush the dude and hope to grab him before you get shot.
>>44716405 >Raping in FATAL is never mandatory Raping in fatal is like being flashy in anima, grimderp in 40k and overpowered in exalted. If you ain't sticking your dick in holes you ain't playing fatal.
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