The /btg/ is dead, long live the /btg/!
Xin Sheng edition!
TP: Epislon Eridani is out
Old thread: >>44623669 →
>/btg/ does a TRO.
http://builtforwar.blog(not spam) spot.com/
>What's Happening In the Future
>How do I do this Against the Bot thing?
>Can I get an overview of the major factions?
>How do I find out what BattleMechs a faction has?
>Map of /btg/ players (WIP):
>BattleTech Introductory Info and PDFs
>Sarna.net - BattleTech Wiki
>Megamek - computer version of BattleTech. Play with AI or other players
>SSW Mech Designer
#battletech on irc.rizon.net
For a change of topic, what configs of the Mad Cat and Thor would you guys recommend for newer players?
The thing will probably get paired up with another light or medium to face off against a comparable force.
It seems a bit strange that nobody ever made this mech.
reposting from the last thread:
Mechwarrior 1-4 working on Windows 7
fun fact: You explode if you generate too much heat. All these years and this is the first time I managed that
Ideally, the Mad Cat Prime is a solid all rounder, but its shallow LRM bins and the overheating potential if it fires the missiles and ERLLs can hurt it. Though if it's a new player it wouldn't be bad. The Thor? The A with flipped ammo tonnages since at no point do you need 15 SRM rounds more than you need 8 more Gauss slugs.
I'm increasingly falling in love with the Falcons' lol fuk u fire BA doctrine. It shits all over the easiest ways to clear BA and it goes nicely with their recent use of scorched-earth terror tactics.
Basically, it sucks fighting BA in a city, but it sucks way harder when the city is on fire and the BA are Fironholds.
Actually, I want to amend this to all the Lyran BA from 3145.
Well, half the reason Fironholds are so horrid is their four fucking APGRs. That's 60 damage per squad. SIXTY.
How does Inner Sphere Standard BA hold up over time?
I'm running a FWL BA force for the first time and wanted something that can mount a light recoilless rifle. Era is early Jihad. As far as I know none of the other FWL suits can mount one.
>How does Inner Sphere Standard BA hold up over time?
Not very well. It gets outclassed by at least the Longinus and probably by the Achileus, and those were in the first Field Manual to follow the introduction of Standard BA.As time went on and more Medium-class BA came out it fell further and further behind.
It probably still has some plus points for units a long way down the supply chain or for mercs, but the more specialised BA types offer substantial advantages, often only at the cost of 1 armour.
>I want a light recoilless rifle
OK, but why? Not sure if the Longinus can mount one, but it can mount all the other standardised BA weapons, as can the Achileus. You've also got the Phalanx and while I don't know about the LRR situation it does have field mortars and (King?) David BA GRs.
If you really want to field IS standard BA I won't say not to, but I will point out that you have other options that will likely work better.
The King David is a piece of shit no matter how you look at it. The Magshot is basically objectively better, and the LRR is lighter, still deals more damage, and gets the extra infantry damage.
The King D is only really ever used to give something FWL flavor.
The problem David/King Davids have is that the transition from RPG to BT stats neutered them. They get better again if you use TacOps rules, but those are optional and not everyone does.
They do have a range advantage over the LRR even if the damage is lower. Still I'd suggest using a MagShot unless you're planning on using specialty ammo- I think LRRs can fire Inferno equivalents or something? Though again that might not be Tournament-level rules.
I had a look at the mass for the LRR on BA, and it's 175 KG. Anything that can mount an IS Small Laser can equip an LRR, it's just that there's no official sheet for units in a lot of those cases. Both the Achileus and Longinus have enough mass, as does the Phalanx.
Because it's a fractious clusterfuck of go-it-alones loosely stapled together by the Marik family. Most of their concerns are civilian and local, and major corporations like IrTech do their own thing rather than the bidding of the Captain-General.
The Capellans are a ultranationalist authoritarian state that can easily marshall its intellectual resources centrally and get them to work for military purposes. Companies like Ceres Metals are pretty much under the Chancellor's thumb.
The CapCon after Sun-Tzu took over is like what the hardcore, Medron-tier Taurianfags think the Concordat should be like: magically stronger than everyone else, richer, capable of building all this shit they're incapable of, with the added bonus of all these people that shouldn't want to help them deciding to help them become even stronger.
It's like fanwank manifest tbqh.
I still main them.
This tbqh familia
>The Capellans are a ultranationalist authoritarian state that can easily marshall its intellectual resources centrally and get them to work for military purposes.
Historically, that merely cripples the nation that adopts it
This is the first time in years (first time I have seen this link and downloaded the games was late 2014) someone says it has virus. If you are afraid search for the link on the archives and read the opinions yourself.
I didn't had any problems with viruses and the games run just fine. I had minor problems with audio in Pirate's Moon and Ghost Bears Legacy, but the games work just fine.
Nothing I said was pro-Capellan. Their centralized authoritarianism might mean they can concentrate minds on military research, but other areas (e.g civilian welfare) suffer as a result. In military tech they're still behind the NAIS btw, and the Republic, and the WoB, and the Clans, and...
I note a complete lack of any argument on your part other than "hurr must be bias author durr".
You lazy-minded, disgruntled shits need to get over yourselves. You think you're clever people who can read between the lines, and that always makes me laugh. You're not smart. You're not insightful. You just take the laziest, easiest, most superficial look at the setting and then make the laziest, easiest, most unfalsifiable claims about authorial bias to rail against what you don't like.
>magically stronger than everyone else
>capable of building all this shit they're incapable of
That doesn't even really make sense, but if it means what I think you mean, you could level that at any IS or Periphery faction, like the Taurians producing advanced new PP variants and entire new chassis during the 3080s.
>with the added bonus of all these people that shouldn't want to help them deciding to help them become even stronger.
Like who even?
The alliance with the MoC has helped the MoC immensely.
The Taurians weren't rational at the time of the Trinity Alliance, and in the DA have actually tacitly helped the Davions in minor ways (letting Davion jump fleets go through their border systems unmolested)
The Anduriens have a choice between having two dangerous powers nearby - CapCon and Wolf Empire - or having one dangerous power and one strong ally.
>inb4 b-b-b-b-but all Anduriens genetically hate Capellens 100% forever!!!! xD
>I note a complete lack of any argument
Different anon but traditionally moronic posts aren't given real arguments in return. But hey they got you crying so their counterb8 seems to have worked.
>don't have an argument
>better pretend we do have one but that we don't want to use it, and add in a "umadbro"
Sure kid. Whatever you say.
Also, you realize your comeback doesn't even make sense, right? If it was b8 then I wouldn't care what people said. I were mad, that would mean I was earnest. You fail even on your own terms.
Always makes me laugh how /btg/ thinks it's so much better than the OF, when in some areas - like the kneejerk "fiat" mindset, and general stupidity like yours - it's even worse.
Tell that to the two dozen plus AFFC regiments they defeated in Guerrero. You know, the war we'll never get a write-up on because they can't make it make sense on the Capellan front.
Yes. FASAnomics but yes Sun-Tzu enriched the Confederation using... nothing. Just hand waving.
>That doesn't even really make sense,
Maybe read the fluff next time and like others here you'll wonder how the nation described as the "technological stepchild of the Inner Sphere" is magically innovating technologies no one else is and is pumping out multitudes of new mech and other designs.
>Like who even?
The real question is who should want to help them? The MoC did a 180 politically and socially and seemed content to bind itself to an Inner Sphere state, the Taurians had to scripted to go full retard, the WoB gave loads of assistance and then five minutes later said "oh boy that was a mistake we couldn't see for no reason even though Sun-Tzu was against the agendas we now have been ostensibly working towards all along for the plot of the Jihad."
>>inb4 b-b-b-b-but all Anduriens genetically hate Capellens 100% forever!!!! xD
So you're pretending to be retarded?
>citing the OF
> I were mad
>implying I have to add in "umadbro" when we were treated to: >>44699955
>You lazy-minded, disgruntled shits need to get over yourselves. You think you're clever people who can read between the lines, and that always makes me laugh. You're not smart. You're not insightful. You just take the laziest, easiest, most superficial look at the setting and then make the laziest, easiest, most unfalsifiable claims about authorial bias to rail against what you don't like.
Wow. Hey, you said it first, but pic related. Try not to take this game that seriously, anon. Or get some other hobbies so you don't get so worked up.
>in the DA have actually tacitly helped the Davions in minor ways (letting Davion jump fleets go through their border systems unmolested)
Let's be honest here, the Concordat really doesn't want to make trouble with the FedSuns.
Even a FedSuns getting reamed as badly as they are in 3145.
Actually yes. The Capellans hid more stuff than anyone else because reasons and rebuilt faster than anyone else because reasons. And this was after coming through the Jihad in the best shape of any IS faction, because reasons.
In a one-on-one fight the only faction the Cappellans can't mop the floor with is the Ghost Bears. The Bears are stronger on the ground and in space but a Capellan victory still wouldn't surprise because of the Coleman factor.
What >>44700942 said. They've shovelled the Sloth and Infiltrator suits off mostly by the Jihad, and the stuff they've gotten since is borderline obscene. The Grenadier II is 100% bullshit.
And it's midnight. Here's my entry, such as it is. Verily, I missed my true calling with CGL, right?
I think I did throw a "cerulean" in there somewhere. In fairness, though, there (was) actually a semi-serious requirement for authors to use it in battle scene descriptions. Herb mentioned it during the first Master&Minions game between the Masters and Demo Team back in 09.
It's pre-CapCon Cucking, though. By 20 or so years?
And I agree on the editorial. I actually really liked the combat sequence. It flowed well, and I could follow what was happening, which is something I can't usually say about the current short stories. I also liked the opposing viewpoints. That was well-constructed.
>No Magistracy officer would be caught without at least one
That actually snapped me out of it for a second, but then I thought about it, and if the MOC chick had the chemical handy, it would stand to reason that she'd have the toys to take advantage of it ready as well. So even disallowing MOC sterotypes, I have no issue with it suddenly being available.
Nobody knows. TR: 3150 teased a bunch of shit but CGL thinks hard facts are for chumps and we're likely to get 1st Succession War products before they develop the Dark Age era any further.
Field Manual 3145 from late 2013 is still the most recent sourcebook to advance the timeline. TRO: 3150 came out at GenCon 2015 and contained passing references to stuff that happened between 3145 and 3150, but without an actual sourcebook detailing that time period, we're not really sure what actually happened. Basically, we're still not sure, but it doesn't look good for them.
s-dcest guy here, literally almost done, but a dumb postscript scene just popped into my head and I'm wondering if I should include it
so three months after the aforementioned bit, victor gets a call from one of his classmates telling him to pick up a certain tabloid. of course, this leaves him and kat shitting cocks in terror. they go to get it and it turns out it's just rumors about him being gay for Kai
don't bother or throw it in?
up to y'all
She's a professional interrogator from a faction that's noted for femdom. What the fuck in you think was going to happen? Would you have preferred somebody from the Concordat coming in and fucking a cow?
Please write the rest of this. You can write lewds well, and I'd really like to know what happens next, what with the invasion brewing. Does Marlene get Artos in trouble with his superiors or not? I'd like to know if Artos and Kyrie end up together or killing each other, because they're still on different sides of the fight.
Also, evidently amyl nitrate is a real thing, and it actually does that. That's pretty cool you worked it into the timeline (check Sarna) and used real-world stuff like that. How the hell did you learn about that?
man, fuck. I take back everything I ever said, the MoC deserves the CapCon. that's some nasty fucking shit right there
As long as they celebrate their relief by heading back into the secret room behind the throne where their Taurian master/mistresses are waiting for them. If we can't conquer the Suns via nukes, we just co-opt the Davion kids who are probably sub bitches anyway.
>Kanata in the Duchy of Andurien in the 31st century
>"Leaguer" instead of "Free Worlder"
>surprise in 3035 of the FWLM attacking when they'd been staging raids on Andurien systems since 3032
>typical Andurien independence arguments
[purple bird cries intensifies]
I still like the faction, even though it has quite a bit of villain potential.
It burns things from farther away, I'm not getting where your question is coming from.
There HAVE been worse /btg/s but, not in a while.
I think we need to discuss RISC Hyperlasers and how we would use them.
Anything with both 'Hyper' and 'Laser' in it is a recipe for good times.
Ok maybe I'm just off because I'm looking in FM:FWL at the suit and available weapons. Pre-magnetic what are some good FWL BA builds/variants? How are they against their neighbor's BA?
The vanilla Longinus and Achileus are fine, both stay fairly relevant even into DA. You said Jihad era which means you have magnetic though, so stick your men on your spiders and go to town
Kirnovs are always also an option
Can't believe I didn't think of sticking them on Spiders before.
I thought maybe magnetic came later in the Jihad but I'm seeing now its a 3069 thing so no biggie. Pre-magnetic they probably need VTOLs or APCs to move. At least the Longinus suits.
I was thinking of BA platoon with one Achileus squad for recon, three Longinus squads for line action, and either (pre-3065) an IS Standard squad mounting LRRs or a Phalanx squad with magshots.
Non magnetic Longinus can still ride on FWL omnis like the Perseus and Owens.
Also a bit later in the Jihad you get the Kopis, which is absolutely brutal. Two ML per suit.
This is now a thing I'm planning.
Yeah I'm reading up on Jihad and post-Jihad era FWL produced armor. The Kopis looks pretty solid.
I don't think I've ever seen them discussed here but opinions on the Ogre, Leonidas and Xiphos, respectively? The Leonidas looks cool but I'm not sure about no jumpjets.
Yup, it does what I said it does, still, I'm at a loss as to why that anon thinks that's not worth a weapon existing.
The NTR portion honestly doesn't last long at all and it gets to good old vanilla lewdness.
I'll admit, I'd be just mildly hype for a second chapter. Hopefully with at least as much
combatas the first, that part was quite good.
>Two ML per suit.
Well damn. I had forgot about that beast. A squad of that is basically a 1mp Swayback. Alas, it cannot ride on omnis.
Technically I think the FedCom was retconned into already having been developing battle armour right before the Clan Invasion. Might be wrong about whether it was actually a retcon.
>The NTR portion honestly doesn't last long at all and it gets to good old vanilla lewdness.
That's like saying "there's only shit on the top piece of bread, the sandwich is fine"
Also, if you call that shit vanilla, I would be legitimately scared to see what you consider not vanilla
if we're talking about first to produce something recognizable as battle armor, i'd actually have to say the taurians, not trolling or medroning.
think about it, they have a entire branch of their military that specializes in combat exoskeleton spacesuits, which is a thing that nobody else does. I could see them developing a version that people would look back at and say ''yeah, that was the first suit of proper BA'', kind of like the C-93 borchard pistol, though aside from the SASF and maybe a ground model in use with a handful of units, said proto-BA would almost certainly not change things much when it came out
now, the first mainstream battlefield design?
probably the fedcom; they've simply got the most resources and NAIS. I could see them looking at exoskeletons, PA[L] and such or else somebody else's proto-BA and thinking ''we could do that, but much better'' and coming up with something vaguely akin to the IS Standard
Although, Kurita is actually also an option; if their pals at comstar slipped a suit of Tornado armor in with their shipments of stuff, I could see them looking at it and saying ''let's build a heavier, better version'' and eventually developing something along those lines
I've always kind of assumed that, being as otherwise the turnaround from 'see elemental' to 'build IS standard' is a little TOO short. them rushing to finish their existing BA project in the face of the clans makes a lot more sense than managing to completely knock-off a never-before-seen technology in a matter of months
The Ogre looks like a mediocre suit at first glance, then there's 13 shots for the SRMs.
Xiphos is pretty mediocre for a Heavy suit, Leonidas is not a lot better, but is light enough to hop onto an omnimech, so it gets points.
>I would be legitimately scared to see what you consider not vanilla
Tornado looks pretty damn cool too.
If they ever made a movie I'd want a scene or flashback or something with the Blakist commandos dropping in to seize the SDS sites. Coolest bloody part of Odysseus.
I am reminded of why I visit btg less and less as time goes on. Literally half the thread is a faction shitfest. Nobody actually fucking plays the game anymore, they just come here to bitch about whatever little bit of lore is stuck up their bum today. The ONLY thing that keeps this place different from the official forums is the lack of (corrupt as fuck) moderation. So fuck you all.
And yes, the Sloth, IIRC was being researched before the Clan Invasion, but a long way from completion. This was in the original description of the suit, no retcon needed.
If you want a retcon, the Star League had the Nighthawk BA waaaaaay back in the 2700s. The Tornado was retroactively based on it, but it was too black-ops for anyone to remember and it became lostech.
The Elemental still gets to stay the first real front-line suit, but that's accredited to the invention of the omnimech than the actual suit itself.
How do you run your BA in games? Do you stick to factions or do you play as a merc company with a less factional selection?
Coincidentally that's about my favorite timespan too (extending to '67 for me).
I typically play mercs, because it's the most flexible, both unit selection and tech-wise; my preferred factions are generally fairly low tech (aside from the FWL), and some of my favourite units are merc general and lyran, which is a little bit of a problem
also, my preferred factions aren't exactly heavy on BA in that era, again except for the FWL so there's also that
That was why I picked FWL for BA. They seemed to have a pretty neat selection that rises up in that timespan. That and I was given some Longinus minis by a friend.
What are your preferred factions? Periphery powers or minor IS states?
>Outworlds, Taurians, Rim Collection
I couldn't find a thumbs up pic in my folder so have this instead.
A lance of Able's Aces is one of the first units I ever painted myself.
To be fair, the ISS predates the Longi and Achileus by quite a few years. And, like the Cavalier, Grey Death, and Raiden, they're really just "ISS, but..". The first-gen BA in 3058 are only there because they decided to put the Solaris and '55 Reseen into '55 and consolidate the BA.
That said, the Grey Death is sexy as fuck but I can't stop loving the Kage.
Kind of a lore question, but what do you guys think of the "training cadres in battle" thing the AFFS and DCMS do? (I'm guessing the Lyrans adopted the Davion system after the AFFC merger in the 3040s)
It seems really unusual to me, concentrating green cadets in battalions/regiments that could get wiped out instead of just assigning them in penny-packet groups through regular units.
Meh. Given that I wanted to write a story about two people separated by the Andurien succession, and given that the entire point of the contest Anon asked for was that it was a *lewd* contest, that was pretty much bound to happen. NTR isn't very definitely not my fetish either (what's my fetish? None of your damn business is my fetish), but if you're going to frame the story whose entire purpose is to be lewd like that, it's pretty much going to have to happen. I don't actually think it qualifies as textbook NTR anyway, given that the purpose was not to elict jealousy in the loved one.
For what it's worth, if I were to ever write future chapters (again, keeping in mind it's a lewdfic *as was specifically asked for*), that wouldn't be a focus on that. I'd probably end up with a friend "comforting" Artos, who thinks Kylie died in the raid. You'd have Verthandi-style guerilla raids by the 1st Dragoon's remnant. Kylie gets some of her own back on the battlefield, and some Andurien prisoners are allowed to return ("see, we're not total monsters"), and Artos finds out she's alive. Kylie and Artos meet during another raid, and he chooses not to pursue. Marlene makes trouble at that point, because he's clearly a compromised security risk. Before she can get anything done on that, the invasion happens. Thanks to the intel they got from Kylie, the understrength 1st and 5th Defenders are able to withstand the initial assault from the 3-regiment invasion force (as is canon). The guerillas link up with the invaders, and Kylie ends up being temporarily in command of a First Marik Militia company. Most likely she gets an in-cockpit "rumination" scene (pic related). The campaign bogs down, and the Defenders withdraw to their DropShips, leaving Artos's company - as a rearguard. The DropShips lift off for Ryerson, and Kylie and Artos meet on the battlefield again. How that turns out, I'll save until I actually write it, if ever.
>Kind of a lore question, but what do you guys think of the "training cadres in battle" thing the AFFS and DCMS do
It never made sense in the old, FASA-era "Mad Max" fluff where Mechs were essentially no longer produced. Under that framework, even a Light Mech was too valuable a thing to entrust to somebody like that.
Given modern fluff standards I actually think it makes a certain amount of sense, in a brutal sort of way. I get the impression most of the cadets drive obsolete Mechs, very light Mechs, or both, in those formations. Since something like a Wasp -1A has next to no worth on a modern battlefield after 3050 (and questionable worth prior), you may as well give them to students so they can get practice in and will be better off when they get a Mech that matters.
What does kind of "not make sense" is the AFFS accepting the sort of casualty rate that training battalions must have when they actually *do* go into combat. I don't think it's a bad thing that they do it - I think it's inconsistent with the fluff. Clanners "blooding" their sibkids with raids? Absolutely. Dracs doing it? Sure. Doesn't much fit with the AFFS fluff, though.
>instead of just assigning them in penny-packet groups through regular units.
I swear I actually read why this wasn't a good idea, but I can't remember where. IIRC it had something to do with the logistics of the BT universe. I've gotta go pick up my kid from preschool, then I come back and see if I can hunt it down.
>not doing both
I'm not disappointed in you, anon. I'm disappointed for you.
As long as you're a good Christian it's ok, I accept you.
The Dracs do it to toughen up the cadets, because only the best deserve to survive; the Feddies only let their cadres see light action, and are quick to withdraw them if casualties seem likely
I'm not going to lie, I'm the anon who kicked off the whole lewds thing and what you produced was WAY the hell farther than I expected things to go; I've always kind of understood 'lewds' to be fairly moderate compared to "smut" which is more like what you created.
I'm not trying to be ungrateful, I just wasn't ready for what I got
I'm kind of disappointed that incest guy didn't make it on time, for that matter
>It never made sense in the old, FASA-era "Mad Max" fluff where Mechs were essentially no longer produced.
The cadres were never part of that fluff. They were introduced in the '80s House sourcebooks, which is where the modern fluff standards started.
>I get the impression most of the cadets drive obsolete Mechs, very light Mechs, or both, in those formations.
That makes sense for the AFFS Training Battalions, though I'm pretty sure the Sun Zhang and NAIS Training Cadres have a more normal distribution of 'Mechs.
I scanned the files with my AV solution, and didn't get any warnings.
Even with the factional contentions around here, most the people in BTG seem to be a pretty decent sort. If this repacking of the MW games was full of bad mojo, I don't think people would be spreading it.
YMMV however, so be safe if you chose to install.
Lewd on 4chan means the entire range, from gentle consensual hand-holding, to shit that would make Sasha Gray take a step back and say "hold on a second, there, let's think this through." You have noone to blame but yourself.
With that said, I'm amazed at the quality of the story NEA turned out. In a good way. I agree with him that it's not cucking. Jealousy wasn't a part of it at all and it flowed logically from the story: get info via interrogation -> you can't hurt her -> use pleasure instead of pain to overwhelm the will ->lewd. I'd really, really like to see the rest of story as explained >>44715579.
I apologize, I totally forgot.
My only plan tonight is to prime commission miniatures, I'll break that down. Remember, as always, Warship comparisons to historical orders of battle are only valid within that specific battle. If I'm ever talking about Dogger Bank, and say that a Luxor is a good equivalent of the SMS Moltke, that doesn't mean that a Luxor is a good match for the SMS Goeben (same class as the Moltke) in a hypothetical "Battle of the Mediterranian" between the Goeben/Breslau and the British battlecruiser division sent to hunt them down.
For the FCCW and Jihad, my (vague and uninformed) impression is that the cadres were either taken by surprise, or that they were sent into action because they were the only ones available. Have they showed up in Dark Age fiction now too?
5 years isn't really all that long.
Having cadre units makes a certain amount of sense. You can look at them as being places to send people who aren't in the top 10% of their graduating class for further training before they get deployed for real (or whatever position in graduation is where you think the average military graduate is too retarded to be sent to the front lines straight away with gear as high-tech, expensive, and rare as a 'Mech).
Treating them as legitimate line units and deploying them against the Clans? Fuck no.
If I were Theodore Kurita one of my reforms would have been stripping the Sun Zhang Cadres of their equipment and using it to form new Galedon and Benjamin Regulars units since those are the reserve districts. All of the MUH TRADITIONS people hate the fuck out of me already, what's one more thing?
The Dracs use their SZMA Cadres as line troops, to varying degrees of success. Some of the AFFS ones are glorified planetary militia (which is about where they should be, really) but I think they use the NAIS Cadres as though they fell somewhere between the "offensive" units like the Kestrel Grenadiers and "defensive" units like the March Militias, swinging more towards the former during times like the 4th SW.
all I have to say is that I don't disagree. I didn't think through what I was asking for and I regret my words and deeds for it
also, in my defense and NEA's, I just finished replaying MGS V Ground Zeros, which features a more ....realistic version of his story plot, so that particular plot was no bueno, though there's no way to blame anyone for that
I feel like most of the AFFS training battalions are deployed to fairly safe areas. lots of them are on the periphery border, right? makes sense that you'd put them up against opponents who have a couple of fried-out bugs and vedettes and not much more, so as they can fight actual enemies, just ones that are too sucky to threaten them too much
>5 years isn't really all that long.
Which is why all the second-gen suits are pretty much "ISS, but.." and/or derivations on the Waddle and Sloth (the Zooch, for example, takes a lot of ideas from both, suggesting "Franklin" took a lot of info back home with him).
The AFFS also deploys small Cadre formations into larger, combined-arms battles along side experienced units - rather than relying on them to carry the day. It's as much to teach them about integrated command and operating as part of a whole (as well as the realities of supply and unit politics in the field..) as it is about blooding them.
That does make sense, I just wonder why they don't attach them at smaller levels to regular mech regiments. As subalterns for lance and company commanders. I wonder if there's an in-universe reason.
I mean two of the cadre regiments are entirely heavy and assault mechs. That's pretty amazing.
I thought I'd hate the new QuadVees in the new RotS XTROs. Then I started to like them. The designs were kooky but interesting.
Then I saw the Notos, and then I knew that I was right to hate them. Why, Hell's Horses. WHY. For its BV and tonnage it's under-armed and overpriced. 5 Clan-tech Medium Pulses and no follow-up weaponry for the Prime config? And at 5/8? Really, Hell's Horses? And I thought that one medium QV in the Clan 3145 XTRO was bad.
It also looks like an anorexic APC decided to stretch and then grow legs. I mean, the fuck, man?
Doing the math pretty quick, and using 3025 as a basis, if they used the equipment for the five cadre regiments to instead raise five more regular line or march militia regiments, and spread the cadre personnel out, each regiment would average 7 or 8 cadets. So maybe one a company.
For the trade off of five more regiments better suited for combat, I think that would be a decent tradeoff. Plus the training battalion program could go on.
Tracked QVs are your best option, and even they spend too much on mass and crits. Meanwhile, Wheeled QVs drop 15% of their tonnage right off the bat. Almost a fifth of your mass to be crap.
>Wheeled QVs drop 15% of their tonnage right off the bat. Almost a fifth of your mass must be crap.
>fifth of your mass
>must be crap
...The hell was CGL smoking when they thought up the Notos? And how did it make it to publication without vigorous playtesting?
From what I can tell just by looking at the TROs and reciting from my (rather shitty) memory:
>tank and a Quad 'Mech!
actually a con but eh
>switching between Quad and Vee modes means you can mindgame opponents easier than you could before
>relatively cheap for the BV they cost
>look like ass most of the time
>tries to mix and match; fails miserably
>tonnage distribution is fucking abysmal
>tend to be too focused on being both modes at once
>weapons tend to be too specialized and are often crap
>Which is why all the second-gen suits are pretty much "ISS, but.."
Yeah, "but... better and more complex." To put it in perspective, by the time the FWL was graduating its first military academy trained BA operators, they had to go back to the drawing board and come up with a hybridised SpecOps course for people who were going to be assigned the new Achileus suits.
>I only glanced at quadvees, what are the pros and cons of them?
The pros are that they're tougher vehicles that don't wreck themselves if you want to mount Jump Jets and which can have DHS.
The downside is that they're not as good as a 'Mech, so they only look good at their mass compared to vehicles.
Alex Knight is evidently part of their playtesting team. It might be better than that, but that will be a matter of degree rather than absolute.
>To put it in perspective, by the time the FWL was graduating its first military academy trained BA operators, they had to go back to the drawing board and come up with a hybridised SpecOps course for people who were going to be assigned the new Achileus suits.
Was that at their Athene Infantry school? I'm getting into BA and I'd like to read more about this SpecOps course.
It was just an example.
General BA training is the Basic Training field followed by the Armoured Infantry field.
Troopers who are in Achileus, Infiltrator II, and Kage suits or similar really need the Special Forces field as well.
Bit pointless to have a cutting-edge Stealth suit and NO FUCKING CLUE how to sneak around in it and all.
Tornados and Nighthawks are good for RPG stuff. They're not really useful at the BT scale- too many things one-shot them, and they don't even have the firepower to scare off light 'Mechs. Same problem with the Kage.
The Achileus, Infiltrator II, Grenadier, and Hauberk all faceroll for BT stuff though.
Anyone mind giving some feedback on this quick 3025 campaign ruleset? Just noticed I forgot the xp gain rules, which are:
+1 for surviving battle
+1 for winning
+1 for each kill or part of kill (At least 20 damage)
GM can give bonus xp for roleplaying as he wishes.
Basically, quadvees in the best light are tanks that don't take crits like tanks, can carry DHS and thus boat energy weapons well, and go quad mode to traverse terrain their vehicle mode can't with torsos that are turrets so they don't have the normal quad firing arc issue, as well as some benefits due to having two pilots. And wheeled ones get 2 bonus MP on pavement instead of just 1.
Unfortunately, they lose a lot of weight due to conversion equipment and tracks, 20% total weight for tracked, 25% for wheeled, and they lose space too as the legs will be totally filled with conversion gear and tracks, and quads already are short on crits.
The weight thing hurts bad, and in some cases can probably offset the weight saved by having DHS, and overall the canon ones they've made aren't good, which isn't helping them any.
So if you think of them as mechs, they aren't very good. Think of them as tanks, and they have the potential to be okay. But only if you make your own, or they make some more that are better.
As a rule, I'd prefer NPPCs or NACs as a primary armament, backed up by a healthy NL battery. Everything should be triple-mounted in bays when possible at least, so you can take advantage of bracketing fire (NLs *MUST* have this happen, so they can be useful in AAA mode).
Capital missiles don't really do anything for me, except load nukes. Barracudas can hit ASFs, but they don't do enough damage to even fighters to matter much (I had a Rattler smack a Phoenix Hawk LAM with 2 'cudas, and the LAM was fine). If a Barracuda hit outright killed one fighter, it'd be worth it. The other missiles are just for nukes. They do pathetic damage otherwise, and I don't ever seem to get lucky with the bonus critical chance missiles generate.
NEA's not the only person who's knowledgeable about the space game. There are a few of us here. I had this ready to roll before the 4Chan outage prevented me responding for an hour.
as one of the other handful of navalfags about, I kinda want to hear your ideas: How do we nerf NACs and buff Mass Drivers? I was thinking to make NAC rounds weigh damage in tons PER SHELL, plus maybe some range nerfs.
as for mass drivers, I'd dump the +2 and significantly reduce the tonnage minimums for the various classes of Mass Driver, maybe also reduce the tonnage of the gun itself.
what are your thoughts, fellow navalfag?
>Right now: YES! DO WANT!
>During and after the game where their opponent has ER TAG on a Stealth/Chameleon LPS+Null-Sig design: WHOSE IDEA WAS IT TO LET THIS BROKEN AS FUCK SHIT INTO THE GAME GOD DAMN THIS IS WORSE THAN THE HELLSTAR
Ehh... I think we can do without it. It might *seem* like a good idea in theory or in a vacuum, but it's likely to be rage-inducing in practice.
>How do we nerf NACs
We... don't? I kinda like them as they are. But then, I also like nuBSG, so NACs are my fetish.
>and buff Mass Drivers?
Well, there are two obvious ways.
Eliminate the to-hit modifier. The arc restriction is already enough of a pain in the ass, nobody is going to be dumb enough to sit in the Nose row of anything they know or suspect to have a Mass Driver and players who do have one will probably be trying to get the nose + fore-side (+broadside) arcs onto enemy ships so that rules out the Mass Driver row most of the time any way.
Secondly, you have them do -10 or -5 damage per hex of distance from the target hex when used for orbital bombardment. That would make them frightening enough to pass up the potential three-arc orbital bombardment in favour of a Mass Driver shot. Under rules as written even things that do have a mass driver are better turning a few hexes to the side to get more arcs onto the target hex than they are using the Mass Driver.
>battle of Tsushima in space warship breakdown?
OK, this was WAY harder than I thought it was going to be.
The single largest problem with re-creating the Battle of Tsushima via WarShips is replicating the effects of all the coal stacked on the decks of the Russian ships, which reduced their stability and maneuverability badly. And that was on top of the fact that they’d undergone a VERY long voyage and were quite slow as a result; capital ships speeds of only 10-ish kts sustained (bursting to 14) versus the Japanese 15kts sustained. Oh, and we’re ignoring the advantage of Japanese wireless comms over the signal flags/lights used by the Russians. So with that in mind, I don’t think there’s a *good* way to recreate the fight – the peripheral factors influenced the outcome hugely, and AeroTech simply doesn’t model those peripheral factors.
Cameron-class. A good number of big, scary guns on a slow, fairly robust frame. Do note the Cameron-class I have in mind to map over to the Russians is the pre-refit Camerons that break down and lose power at random intervals. Which is a pretty good summation of the Russian fleet, actually.
Davion Block-1-class. There’s a TON of Russian cruiser classes at Tsushima. Of the 9 cruisers, 5 of them were essentially 1-offs. In general, though, they were built as primarily commerce raiders, meaning skimping a bit on armor, having relatively light firepower (a half-dozen or so 4.7-IN or 6-IN guns, compared to an equivalent number of 6-8-IN guns on the Japanese ships), good speed (several were capable of twice the capital ship speeds) and big fuel bunkers. The Davion Block Is are relatively lightly armed and armored, 5k-ton fuel bunkers that move 4/6, compared to the Cameron 2/3.
Russian Costal Defense Ships
Athena-class. I can understand the reason why the Russians sent their costal defense ships around to Vladivastok. Why they participated in the battle, though, instead of running away (such as they could) and maybe drawing off some Japanese capital ships so that the Russian Battleship divisions faced better odds, I have no idea. These ships were fairly slow (16 kts rated versus 18kts rated for the Borodino-class BBs), with a heavier armor belt than some of the BBs and with decent 10-IN guns, on a 5000-ton frame. Basically, their analogue needs to be slow and punch well above its weight, with a roughly equivalent armor belt to the Cameron-class. The Athena does all that, especially given that it’s 350k-tons lighter than the Cameron.
Inazuma-class. Russian DDs at the time were built as torpedo boats, and were very close to the British Yarrow-class. Unfortunately, they mounted 15” torpedoes at this time (they switched to 18” after the Russo-Japanese War), so they should have very light throw-weight. IIRC, they had a degree of resistance to damage that was higher-then-normal for their rate. I’m unsure if this was due to compartmentalization or something else. The Inazuma’s weapon mix (a few MNPPCs on the nose and stern, plus a bunch of NACs on the broadside) matches up well with the Russian historical standard armament of a few small-calibre QF guns on the bow and stern, plus broadside torps.
Feng Huang. This was actually the last one I did, because there isn’t a good answer for this one. It has to be a ship with equivalent firepower to the Russian equivalent, roughly in the same weight category, that has an extra movement point of speed. There isn’t a good one, but I consider the Feng to be the “least bad” option. The fact that it mounts mostly extreme-range weapons represents the superior Japanese fire control systems during this time period.
Narumaki (block doesn’t matter)-class. Japanese cruisers, taken as a whole, hit really hard compared to their Russian counterparts. This is partially due to the submerged 18” torpedo tubes, but mostly due to the fact that the Japanese ships were using 8-IN guns as their heavy armament, rather than the 4.7 and 6-IN guns the Russians used. The Narumaki is a very solid brick that mounts two HNPPCs in the nose, matching the layout of many Japanese ship classes. It also has relatively short legs compared to the Russian ship; the former is a fleet vessel, while the latter is a commerce raider, so that makes sense.
Fredsa-class. Japanese destroyers are all about jumping in up in someone’s face and mugging them, preferrably a capital ship. The Fredsa’s NAC/40 gives that effect pretty well. Plus its low-slung look reminds me of the pathetically low freeboard on the Japanese DD classes (at speed, the entire forecastle and bridge were soaking wet).
Not him, but a neat analysis as always, NEA. If you've got some time, would you mind commenting on this slapdash thing for some newbies looking to do a quick and dirty BT RPG?
Meh. By the time it finally made it into BT there were already a number of ways to counter it.
If you really want cheese, I was around way back when TR 3058 first came out. The FedCom Gausswall designs caused a lot more trouble for non-FedCom IS players than the Hellstar eventually causes for anyone with what was around during that time.
I see. What about naval gauss rifles?
>NEA's not the only person who's knowledgeable about the space game.
I know, but I see him doing long write-ups every so often so he seems like the go-to guy.
Your pic is helpful though, thank you.
>The single largest problem with re-creating the Battle of Tsushima via WarShips is replicating the effects of all the coal stacked on the decks of the Russian ships, which reduced their stability and maneuverability badly. And that was on top of the fact that they’d undergone a VERY long voyage and were quite slow as a result; capital ships speeds of only 10-ish kts sustained (bursting to 14) versus the Japanese 15kts sustained. Oh, and we’re ignoring the advantage of Japanese wireless comms over the signal flags/lights used by the Russians. So with that in mind, I don’t think there’s a *good* way to recreate the fight – the peripheral factors influenced the outcome hugely, and AeroTech simply doesn’t model those peripheral factors.
Great points. Personally I think one scenario timeline-wise that could have emulated such a battle politically and with the same amount of surprise is it were a Reunification War era fight between the SLDF or AFFS fleet against a Taurian fleet. To me it fits then since the Taurians actually had a fleet and were technologically impressive, but like Europeans with Japan everyone assumed the Peripherats (sic) were backwards hicks.
Anyway, great job.
To be honest, any real-world naval engagement that had a relative difference in speed as a decisive factor is going to be very poorly modelled by the BT rules. 2/3 thrust is fine, 3/5 is more useful for the SI and armour that allows than for the actual speed you get.
This is one of the things that makes me chuckle when I read Marauder648's WarShip of the Month articles, he's assuming the differences between 4/6, 3/5, and 2/3 movement profiles on the ground will map to space battles, and they really won't. Other factors like armour and weapons are a lot more decisive.
This aside, CASE AMBER (IIRC it was AMBER) did have the Taurians doing what you're talking about to the Suns. It was one of those "win the battle(s), lose the war" moments though, since it pissed everyone else off enough to come after them all guns blazing.
And when the SLN has like seven times as many Battleships _of one class_ as you have WarShips total and each one of those is just part of a Squadron, this turns out to be a phenomenally bad idea.
Got a militia company.
Phoenix Hawk -1
Hermes II -2S
I was going to run with the Hermes II as the recon lance leader, but should I switch out it out with the Javelin or Firestarter? Maybe if its a wooded map I the Firestarter could light up their withdrawal?
Rookie question here BTG. Is there some sort of how to for battletech tactics somewhere?I've played a few matches in megamek against the bot, and I feel like I go from 0 to potato at very high speed.
>playing a couple light skirmishing matches this last weekend at LGS
>new player pulls out his custom paint jobs
>one of his Hammers is painted as Umaru
Anyone else here have funny custom paints?
I will get a pic of the Hammer next match
I wish WarShips had vanity bows.
Hammer? More like Hamster amirite?
I feel like a lot of the SPAs could be replaced with "before making a roll, you may spend 1 XP to reduce the TN by 1, or (for enemy rolls which affect your 'Mech) to increase the TN by 1."
Not sure how I feel about using C-Bills for 'Mech purchases, but I don't know enough about pricing to comment.
If you have a bunch of new players, it might be worth spelling out explicitly what the weight classes are.
Would mechwarrior families be allowed to purchase mechs that aren't sold on the open market? Like say the Nightstar or Albatross or
I'm just looking for a way for one of those kinds of mech to show up in a merc unit in the late 50s-early 60s
The 'open market' means for sale to anyone; plenty of mechs are said to be sold only to house and a very few mercenary units, and not made available to anyone else, and therefore cannot be said to be on the 'open market' I was wondering if these sales restrictions would also apply to mechwarrior families in the house where X mech is produced
I wasn't thinking dispossessed, I was thinking of one buying a fancy new mech for the second son, while the heir pilots the ancestral mech, but there's a family dispute and said second son takes his shiny new machine and becomes a mercenary.
I'm creating a NPC mechwarrior for a campaign, and I'm trying to come up with a good backstory
in honor of chink pride worldwide, im putting together a couple of lances of cappie stuff, mainly 3025-3060 chassis'
open to constructive criticisms and also sunsfags yelling at me
Any recommended variants? I'm actually looking to play jihad/dark age, so what's the general opinion of the JN-G9CC?
The Albatross is limited to prestigious Marik regiments and close allies, but it did see use during Op:Guerrero, so mercs could have captured one then.
The Nightstar seems like it was originally limited to specific regiments, but the Lyrans might've opened sales up to mercenaries in general by the early '60s.
I think it'll generally be tough to get hold of high-end assault 'Mechs like these, but you'd have to take them on a case-by-case basis.
>I feel like a lot of the SPAs could be replaced with "before making a roll, you may spend 1 XP to reduce the TN by 1, or (for enemy rolls which affect your 'Mech) to increase the TN by 1."
Going to be over MM, so that's not really doable and the SPAs are already included.
>Not sure how I feel about using C-Bills for 'Mech purchases, but I don't know enough about pricing to comment.
It's pretty much guaranteed to be broken, but this is quick and dirty and BV doesn't really work as well as a balancing metric when there's (BV-less) SPAs flying about. You're going to need a GM to actively balance things either way.
>If you have a bunch of new players, it might be worth spelling out explicitly what the weight classes are.
Good point, I'll add that in.
>Sandblaster should say +4/3/2 to cluster hit -rolls-, otherwise you start getting stuff like a SRM-2 at close range hits with 5 or 6 missiles
Thanks for catching that, I'll update the short description.
How's this look for a 3058-60 merc unit?
1 platoon SRM infantry
Looks solid. The other commentary on it in this thread has mentioned the major issues I saw already, so I won't go into it.
I particularly like your SPA breakdowns. Jumping Jack is an SPA that I *HATE*, because it's the most ludicrously powered SPA in the book for its XP cost. Some of them can be more powerful, but as long as you have a Mech with jets, JJack is *always* really good, rather than *sometimes* really good and you have to spend XP in other places to make it really good (ie, Demoralizer). So putting it in the 15 XP category gets my vote of approval.
Are CBills used only for Mech purchases, or are those being used for spare parts as well? If the latter, I'd suggest giving a 250k CB pool *in addition* to the starting million just for spare parts. Each point of XP spend to up your purchase pool gets you an extra 50k in parts, and you can keep *half* of what you don't spend on a Mech for additional spares..
Glad to see folks like them. I kind of agree about the Taurian analogue. An alternative setup would be the SLDF sending a bunch of their super-obsolete ships to stomp on the Concordat (SovSoy is the flagship, etc) and the Taurians come out swinging with modern ships. But honestly, I'm pretty much done mentioned Taurians on these boards anyway. Tired of the shit.
>any real-world naval engagement that had a relative difference in speed as a decisive factor is going to be very poorly modelled by the BT rule
Mostly true, but depends on the board size. A 3/5 with a range advantage (lots of Extreme Range guns vs something with lots of Long Range guns) can tack to the side and keep the range open for a surprisingly long time when fighting a 2/3 ship. Getting 3-5 turns of basically unopposed fire in can be a huge thing. That fact is actually a huge reason why I assigned many of the ships that I did.
Otherwise, speed doesn't matter unless you're very close, or have enough to be evasive all the time
>How's this look for a 3058-60 merc unit?
Head and Shoulders /10
Already Mary Sue. Merc's can't into DropShip ownership without special snowflakes on their shoulders..
Anyone have an idea for how to make a Fulda Gap type scenario viable? Two powers with a land border on one planet, a section of clear terrain on the border, heavy fortifications but heavier attackers?
Maybe something like a divided Tukayyid?
>How's this look for a 3058-60 merc unit?
Head and Shoulder / 10
Already mary Sue. Mercs can't into Mech ownership without special snowflakes on their shoulders. You should all be in Vedettes and Scorpions, an have financially dissolved by the end of your 6th month of existence.
Player mercs are almost always going to be snowflakey because generally speaking people want to be the exception and don't want their merc company to be 2 Locusts, a Wasp and a Stinger.
I was tempted to change the name and write a version implying that anything that that wasn't a bunch of dudes in a pub with a handful of pistols was suspect but then you replied.
I think I might pasta that review randumbly when I start seeing people looking for reviews of their forces.
>Player mercs are almost always going to be snowflakey because generally speaking people want to be the exception and don't want their merc company to be 2 Locusts, a Wasp and a Stinger.
The hilarious thing is that canonically, the majority of merc units in existence are battalion sized or larger, and most own DropShips
>starting with pistols
What a bunch of mary sues.
Though it seems there's a fair number of people who find that to be snowflakey, correctly or not.
In the end, what matters is having fun with your group. If you're being consistent with the game's fluff, good. If you're not, also good as long as everyone's enjoying it.
>The hilarious thing is that canonically, the majority of merc units in existence are battalion sized or larger, and most own DropShips
See, that's just not true. Look at the sourcebooks that matter like the original House books and 1e periphery. When they talk about merc units, most of them are 1-2 lances with maybe a platoon of infantry. About half the mechs are lights, a quarter medium, and a quarter heavy. It's just that there's so many of these tiny units, and they fold or die so fast, that they don't get talked about in any depth.
It's only the later, discredited, sourcebooks that even imply that battalion-sized mech units are even close to common. It's your game, and if you want to play wrong, I certainly can't stop you. But the traditional merc unit has always been smaller than a company, without native transport, and is almost totally expendable, with a lifespan measured most often in months.
>Are CBills used only for Mech purchases, or are those being used for spare parts as well? If the latter, I'd suggest giving a 250k CB pool *in addition* to the starting million just for spare parts. Each point of XP spend to up your purchase pool gets you an extra 50k in parts, and you can keep *half* of what you don't spend on a Mech for additional spares..
Since I'm making these rules for another guy to GM with, I'm not sure if he plans on going full accountantech or not. I'll try and find out from him.
>Look at the sourcebooks that matter like the original House books and 1e periphery
>It's only the later, discredited, sourcebooks
Huh, so you're that troll, too.
I don't suppose you also hate the taurian concordat and it's fans, do you?
Why would I hate the Concordat? They're one of the best factions in the game, they can out produce the goddamn Lyrans, and they're not afraid to be practical and use nukes. If I hate anybody, it's FASA and CGL for not making them the focus of more fiction.
I am impressed that after all the "solid heavy" meme no one recreated the Albatross as a heavy mech.
I am also impressed that a clan-tech Albatross is actually cheaper than the IS one
This doesn't account for Clantech having usually been written, in the fluff, as far more expensive than IS counterparts, at least when produced by the IS. They never gave a harder number, but I always went with a general 300% markup for clantech myself.
>It's your game, and if you want to play wrong, I certainly can't stop you.
Please don't conflate "not playing how you do" and "wrong".
Oh, yeah. The medronning is a bit new, less than a month, but he's been doing the "mercs are special snowflakes if they aren't absolute shit" thing for a very long time. The "my way or the wrong way" thing has been part of it the whole time, too
"Only old sourcebooks count, nothing in periphery 1e and MW1e has been retconned, it's all valid"; basically what medron pryde does, except last time it wasn't about "TC stronk" but some other obscure argument
Technically, there are more little units than big units, but the big units are so much bigger that more soldiers belong to them than to the little ones.
Hey, >>44627827 here. I laughed. 10/10.
I thought the medronning was funny, but maybe that's just 'cause I was involved in that conversation last thread.
C-Bills, man, plus a well-trained tech for all them new-fangled widgets.
well, here's my shot at a downsized Albatross II; I had to sacrifice the ERLL and reduce the SRMs, but two ERMLs should hopefully provide at least a little compensation for the lost firepower
also, it costs 10million less and weighs twenty tons less than the original, so at the very least it's much more economical
That was sold pretty widely to mercs. It's available to them on the MUL and Shelly Brubaker is a noted pilot.
This is more the sort of thing you mean, stuff with limited availability and limited chances for salvage. Still if you want a merc with an Albatross there's always Romanov's Crusaders where it would be somewhat unlikely but not completely impossible for them to have been allowed to buy a handful.
In terms of 'MechWarrior families buying stuff you run into the problem of 90+ per cent of all manufacturing within a given house being bought by the state. In some ways it's more likely that they'd be able to capture an enemy machine and claim it as their personal property.
Having a Lao Hu and a Thunder in the same lance seems kind of redundant. Maybe swap one of them to Lance 1 or 3, at 5/8 they can still get by and are going to be a hell of a surprise in the Light Lance.
>Anyone have an idea for how to make a Fulda Gap type scenario viable?
Operation: Flashpoint is a scenario pack that does this.
Otherwise, it could work on a number of Chaos March worlds with the established government (plus AMC) or Capellan Zhanzezangchingchong terrorist units that totally aren't trained or supported by the Death Commandos and Maskirovka fighting each other or the WoB.
it's what I'm used to, sorry
i could give it a go. do you want basically a PiP basic albatross? or do you want a comprehensive redesign of some sort?
PiP? I meant something like a redesign to fix what are traditionally considered problems with the Alby. Suggestions I've seen before are using an Endo-Steel structure and/or making it an Omni. Say designed around 3063.
I'd welcome proposed designs from anyone interested.
>HMP is just... dated is all.
well, if rick would just get off his ass...
but yeah, when i started using it, it was reasonably new and I'm just kind of used to it by now; I only got back into BT fairly recently. I keep trying to use MML and the subtle differences keep annoying me; I keep closing the program when I try to close the weapon menu, for instance
Product imProved; basically the same thing but better in some aspect
switching to endo and using the extra weight for armor is dirt simple, and takes it up to 17.5 tons; actually respectable protection.
for more involved stuff, I have some GR/LGR ideas kicking around my head, and I'll throw some up once I get them bashed out
4/6, armored XXL, gyro, cockpit, shoulders, hips, max ferro-lam, an ERPPC and Plasma Cannon in each arm, ATM-6 with two tons ammo and a ton of Plasma Cannon ammo in each side torso, CASE II'd.
If you want it to go 4/6, better to make it 95 tons.
If you want it to go 3/5, the Tomahawk II and Dire Wolf are already things.
But for the sake of argument and factoring in some (but not too much) of the usual Derp Age tech they love to use even if it doesn't make much sense, maybe something like this?
Was messing around in SSW last night doing sensible 3050 upgrades for the TR 3039 'Mechs. Tinkered with the Banshee for a while.
>Fuck you, we're the SLDF
>XL Engines everywhere, bitches
>Gauss Rifle so it has as much ranged firepower as a normal Banshee
>Snub-Nose PPCs because it was being field-tested when the Amaris Rebellion happened
>All examples were destroyed in battle or went with Kerensky, which is why it hasn't shown up before
>The Clans kind of liked it and used some of the ideas on the Exectioner later.
Each House and the RotS got their own mini-TR. Anything in those is either theirs exclusively or predominantly.
The Clan TR for 3145 has some of the signature 'Mechs, but others are scattered elsewhere. If you need specifics we can help with those.
The all-laser (-E?) version of the Locust is as good as it gets until Project Phoenix.
The Firestarter-A is likewise about as good as it gets until the Jihad-ish era, trading the MGs in for Small Lasers and more armour.
The Raven is pretty shit until the Stealth version.
The UrbanMech is just plain bad. It's a meme machine and nothing more- OK as a disposable ambush element in a city fight, but beyond that the only thing it has going for it is an Arrow IV version that fires nukes.
For my purposes they need to be exclusive AND among the faction's most-produced mechs (not that I expect catalyst to give exact numbers). Do the mini-TRs give any sense of which mechs are the focus of production?
That's pretty much not gonna happen, anon. If something is built in high numbers it's either going to be exported to others or salvaged by neighbours when they fight.
But if they appear in the mini TRs, they're being built and fielded in numbers worth noting by the titular faction. Hard numbers are a thing of the past, because they either made no sense especially if production is being retconned in or because the supposed numbers of given shitty designs are screwing over certain factions if you're using anything approaching canon numbers of design types or rarities.
I am totally OK with things being produced at the speed of plot.
If you tell us what you're after and why we can help more, but for now all I can say is: download the mini TRs and read them.
Well, not perfectly exclusive, just predominantly like that first responder said.
I'm writing a newbie guide to factions, and I'm including one or two mechs most closely associated with each faction. Since there are multiple exclusive-ish mechs per faction that are produced in "numbers worth noting" I want to pick the ones whose numbers are *most* worth noting.
Different anon but on the same wavelength regarding Liao 'mechs designed in the 3050-3067 era, which are good and which are crap?
I started looking at the TROs and Liao built many more than I thought they could.
So what do you think the defenses of Terra are going to be like when the Wolves inevitably make their run after the wall drops?
I'd cover the place with subcaps on submarines, maybe put the Wyrm back in production. Anything tries to enter atmosphere, they eat missiles. The subcaps are on subs so it's fucking impossible to find them before they surface and fire, sorta like how the Wyrm worked.
It's already been leaked that the Wolf invasion will fail, and that Terra will fall to Clan
Ghost Bear, which will become the ilClan in accordance with the prophecy.
Erinyes is anti-planet though. Mass Drivers suck at hitting ships.
Though converting a hab into a battlestation would be interesting. Build the thing out of armor-grade metal, laugh as nothing can kill it. [Babylon 5 intensifies]
>What are you gonna do Alaric, blow up Terra?
>Actually, now that you mention it...
I mean they have, what, two Leviathan 2s, and are building a Leviathan 3. If anyone has a shot at beating whatever new SDS that the Stoners put up, it'd be them. I'm not saying I *want* them to win, just that it seems they have the best shot. Different anon here, btw.
True, true. And some of the clans have experience with that, when they took part in taking them from the Wobbies at the end of the Jihad. Maybe not any who are still alive, but they'd have battleroms and an idea of how to do it.
But yeah, that is gonna be the hardest part, unless a nutter like Alaric or Hazen decides lolfuggit, BRING ON DA NEWX!
>>inb4 b-b-b-b-but all Anduriens genetically hate Capellens 100% forever!!!! xD
Is this sperging kind of comment really what Capfags say to defend Coleman's bias, or just b8?
After reading Brush Wars, FM:U, and a lot of the Jihad-era stuff it simply seems grasping to defend the hamhanded way Coleman reversed Andurien's politics and culture entirely to be pro-Liao. I mean it's a duchy that seceded because it wasn't allowed to invade Liao systems, and celebrated its secession by invading Liao systems.
>what's the Mercy?
Given that this Anon (>>44750056) just posted the ugliest Sister of Battle I'mma guess it's the 'Emperor's Mercy'
> Raises Bolt Pistol, Squeezes Trigger. *BLAM*
Nothing's wrong with it, but there's a good deal of people who are frustrated with their current win streak and want the other clans (maybe not the wolves) to win instead, just so that it's not the Ghost Bears again. This has, I believe, so fairness to it as Ben Rome is a huge GB fanboy and I don't put it past CGL devs to try and be unbiased when dealing with the metaplot.
They had Brian Caches, which were just stockpiles of SL-era stuff, not actual forts, that they left behind on planets during the exodus. IIRC most/all of them got dug up by this point, and SL era stuff wouldn't really help that much compared to modern clantech.
What's to disagree with? They won fewer worlds than any other invasion corridor, they pulled a draw instead of a win on Tukayyid, they did practically nothing from 3052 to 3063 of note except move base, their border war with the Combine was a minor affair that they reigned in, and they hardly ran the Jihad solo.
I get it's popular to hate "winning" factions, but the Bears don't win anything significant on their own.
I disagree that they have done nothing and that not winning as many worlds as other clans somehow makes it okay, especially when the worlds they do win and rather easily integrate into are those of some of the most independent in the entire IS, who even went so far as to break away from the Combine. They may not do a ton of empire building, but generally when they do come up in a sourcebook it's them winning something. Even if they may not actually be the strongest clan out there, they are shown as doing well, which can create backlash for some people.
In other words, they may not be winning, but it at the least appears on the surface as if they are.
>have a culture of being rational and pragmatic, as well as taking measured steps and not pissing people off
>this should result in losses
Do you think it was unfair the Smoke Jaguars were wiped out or something?
I mean the generation that broke away from the Combine was in the past. People change, especially with new and different conditions and education systems. What the Bears "win" are small, measured steps within their strength capabilities.
Come back when they pull a Xin Sheng, Operation RAT or Wolf Empire horde invasion without factories.
I recall reading a short story or sourcebook introduction that has Rasalhague resistance fighters meeting up and then getting betrayed to the Ghost Bears.
Anyone remember which book that's in?
You asked what's there to disagree about. I responded with my view. You're free to disagree, but cut the shit with "come back when blah blah blah". Not everyone is going to agree with your opinion on the ghost bears, but it'd be nice if when people are being civil, you did the same.
You can disagree that 2+2=4, say it's your view it equals five. Doesn't mean your opinion can't be called out for its stupidity.
I get that you dislike them for "winning" and because it's popular to hate certain factions. We had to put up with passive-aggressive players that hated House Davion in the 90s too. If you don't like being called out, come back when you have a spine.
>You can disagree that 2+2=4, say it's your view it equals five. Doesn't mean your opinion can't be called out for its stupidity.
Not him, but when you're the one that has to make up excuses for everything the bears do in order for it to be "right", you might want to consider that YOU are wrong.
Also, from a strictly story-based perspective, the bears winning all the time is shitty storytelling. At least with the caps, feds, or wolves you see them lose once in a while so the outcome of a looming war is uncertain. Nobody has any illusions about who's going to win a war with the bears, because they've never fucking lost. It's fucking BORING.