Who had the better defense? The 2013 Seahawks or the 2015 Broncos?

Secondaries will always have more value to me than defensive lines, I'll take 13 Seattle over 15 Denver

Broncos. At least the Seahawks had a competent offense that could stay on the field and not go 3 and out every possession. The Broncos defense played for 99% and despite being exhausted still held the league MVP, who put up video game numbers in the regular season, to just 10 points.

>>65476085
>secondary is more important than defensive line

New to watching football? What's it like watching your first super bowl?

>>65476067

Broncos carried what was statically the worst offense to ever win a superbowl so they get my vote.

>>65476085
You say that like the Broncos don't have a top secondary.

Denver

>>65476067
the broncos LITERALLY FUCKING DEMOLISHED the best 2 offenses and pretty much the best 2 QBs in the league this year back to back. the panthers couldn't do shit and the pats were only able to REALLY make any noise by crutching on gronk, who is an insane freak of nature with a goat passing to him, and they still didn't win.
this and the afccg are some of the best defensive football i've ever seen, kind of eating it the fuck up fampai. love that big strong D.

>>65476163
this. shitty offense means worse field position and less time to recover for the defense. picture this d for a team with a competent offense. it wouldn't even be fair

>>65476250
They also made Aaron Rodgers look like a benchwarmer and the Packers were undefeated at the time.

Talib and Harris pretty much called Rodgers a literally who? after that game.

did someone mention the 85 bears

i think someone mentioned the 85 bears

>>65476198
Seattles in '13 was better

Snapcountbabby tbqh.

>>65476278
Packers offense was shit throughout the season

>>65476293
>an era of football where teams ran the ball 40 times a game and defenders were allowed to headhunt

Please don't make me laugh.

>>65476293
Bears didn't have to play in the era of neutered defense like the Broncos and Seahawks. It really is amazing that those teams have produced such great defensive teams when every season they announce more and more rules to allow QBs to put up arcade numbers.

2013 Seahawks were better. They held opponents to 14.4 ppg and 273 ypg, and had 39 takeaways in the regular season. The Broncos gave up 18.5 ppg and 283 ypg, with 27 takeaways. Seahawks also had a better Super Bowl defensive performance, holding the statistically greatest offense ever to 8 pts. The Panthers offense was great but not as good as impressive as the 2013 Broncos offense.

>Field Yates @FieldYates 4h4 hours ago

>In 3 postseason games, the Broncos allowed 1 TD pass to Cam, Brady & Big Ben combined. They threw 92 this regular season.

impressive tbqf

>15 Broncos
It's not even really a fair question DESU senpai. Seattle had an excellent offensive line that year, a young mobile quarterback, and the best running back in the league. Denver had average backs, an old immobile quarterback, and a poor offensive line.

I dont watch nfl at all but as the game was ending the cameras kept showing a black dude on the panthers basically crying. Who was that?

>>65476411
Michael Jordan

>>65476393
average backs is generous senpai, cj is alright, but hillman has been garbage all season

>>65476385
This, ladies and gentlemen, is why fantasy football has dumbed down the average NFL viewer.

>>65476411
Corner back Josh Norman (#24).. he was obviously upset after losing

He was elite this year

Worst QB to ever win an owl
Dilfer or '2016 Peyton'?
forget the fact that he's one of the GOAT's, he has not been good this year

>>65476385
Give us some stats about how the '13 Seahawks had an actually competent offense that didn't constantly turn the ball over when they weren't going three and out and always put their defense in poor field position and made the defense play 90% of the game. It's a real testament to how good Denver's defense was this season that they were still able to lead the league in nearly every category despite having an offense that was doing everything they could to lose games and make their job harder.

Anyone who says the Seahawks doesn't understand how BAD this offense was this year.

>>65476250
>brady with no health offensive linemen
>rest of his offense all banged up
>still barely fluked a win because his kicker choked
Nice selective memory faggots

>>65476120
This

>>65476278
This shit

why is the defensive line called the defensive line. they arent defending anything. if anything they are attacking their opposition the entire game. its the defensive backs who are defending

>>65476527
2013 Seahawks had the 18th ranked total offense, and scored 26.1 ppg and had 339 ypg. 2015 Broncos had the 16th ranked offense 355.5 ypg and 22.2 ppg. It's not like the Seahawks had a great offense that year.

>>65476554
Panthers kinda needed NE to win desu, in a kinda rock paper scissors way, Panthers were likely gonna get BTFO by Denver but probably coulda worked their meme magic against the pats D

>>65476527
They still didn't manage to get as many turnovers even if they were on the field more often.

>>65476120
I go back to the week 17 game against the Chargers. 5 turnovers in the first half and the defense only gave up 6 points. As weak as the Chargers offense was, it's almost impossible to prevent a team in today's NFL to score based on that kind of incompetence.

>>65476554
>rest of his offense all banged up
Yeah no. He had all the same weapons you faggots kept saying were going to shred the Broncos in the AFC championship.

>>65476554
>banged up offense
You mean the one that had Gronk, Edelmen, and Amendola? Yeah, enough with the excuses. The Chiefs defense couldn't do shit the previous week. The Pats were just fine.

>>65476446
Seahawks were more dominant, plain and simple. Shit on the best offense ever, and had way more takeaways. The stats add to the credibility of the statement. Looked better on film, too.

>>65476633
Panthers probably would have won 34-27

>>65476127
I've watched football for 25 years. A great secondary is more impressive and harder to accomplish then a great defensive line.

>>65476250

>the best 2 offenses

>Panthers SOS was 27th

lol

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>>65476722
>this delusion

thats hilarious

denver fans still this blasted over the 43-8 loss. i get that it you are feeling a little euphoric over tonights win but lets not get crazy

>>65476722
Denver literally only had one good offensive series tonight. Go home little man

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>>65476747
>I've watched football for 25 years

Stopped reading right there.

>>65476757
>>65476807
denver literally had 0 good offensive series in super bowl 48 against the greatest defense of the '10s

>>65476554
>gronk healthy
>edelmen
>amendola

Maybe you have the selective memory.

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>all these teenagers forgetting the statiscally best defense in history
>literally "who needs an offense: the defense"

"Ray! How many touchdowns does your offense need to score to win this game?"
"Zero!"

>>65477019
we know how good the ravens were. this is about who is the best defense of the '10s

>>65477019
Ravens fan here, while that was one of the greatest defenses of all times this isn't relevant. the discussion is broncos vs seahawks defense, not about the greatest ever.

for the record I think the buncos had the better D.

>>65476385
>the statistically greatest offense ever
Check the starters, kid.

Statbabbies I swear

Seahawks handled a meme offense with superior secondary and had a well rounded attack that gave their defense time to rest.

Broncos went 0/12 on third down to finish the game and their D lived on the field all game. Without the D Denver wouldn't have scored anything but that first field goal. Advantage 15 Broncos for sure.

>>65477312
I agree. The 2015 broncos are the best of all time and it is not close

>>65476198
Talib was trash today. He was solely responsible for the majority of Carolina's points.

>>65477477
*cough cough*
>>65477019

>>65476085
Seahawks this year showed why you need a passable line no matter how good your secondary is. There is no point in covering receivers if no one gets to the QB.

>>65477485
if i recall he had one good tackle in the first quarter to stop a first down (I think it was on Olsen)

other than that though he had an ordinary game

>>65477485
Didn't matter Miller was on his shit today. Fucking beat Cam Newtons ass tonight psychologically and physically.

>>65477517
He took his helmet off to give Carolina a 1st down instead of a 4th and long (that drive resulted in points). He had another stupid penalty on another drive that kept the Panther's O on the field. He got beat a lot, but Cam is a terrible QB

>>65477547
Miller was on another level today. He was held nearly every play. I love seeing a d-line take over like that

>>65476120
You're wong. The broncos had 50.83% TOP this year. The Seahawks had 50.83% TOP in 2013. Same amount of time on the field.

>>65477548
I don't think you can say Cam is terrible. It doesn't matter who you are, if you're getting pressured that much you aren't going to have a good game.

>>65477567
Literally the Defense and special teams saved the day the D-line Scored more points then peyton today.

>>65477019
Realtalk, the 06 Ravens D was better than the SB winning D.

So can we all finally agree that Peyton is a choker who only wins super bowls when he's carried by a fantastic defense?
Same thing happened with the Colts

>>65477638
He consistently overthrew his receivers, did not have good vision and made terrible decisions out of the pocket. Most plays he had enough time to get the ball out.

He's an amazing athlete, but he is not a good QB. Not being able to scramble, he was not able to do anything. Unless he works with someone over the summer, he's in the same situation as Kaep in 3 years. Mark it as another fatality to the meme option

>>65477757
I mean 50 TD's is 50 TD's.

I don't think you understand how much pressure impacts a QB's play. It didn't matter if it was Joe Montana or Trent Dilfer in that pocket. No one would be able to get something going under that much pressure.

>>65476067
The 2013 Seahawks blew the greatest statistical offense of all time the fuck out

it's close, but the seahawks get the edge because they had the better secondary in this passing era.

>>65476442
hillman had his moments

If the broncos defense was anything I would say it's the clutch-est defense of all time, i mean holy shit i can't even believe they made so many last minute plays to win. If you didnt watch the broncos this season it was really shocking how many games came down to the wire.

>>65476627


Seattle had a turnover diff of +20. Broncos had a turnover diff of -4.

>>65477950
A shitty turnover diff says more about the offense than the defense. Any novice football fan would understand that.

>>65476067
>2015 Broncos
1.43 points per drive allowed (1st)
24.47 yards per drive allowed (1st)
with an average opponent starting field position of 29.49 (29th)
.123 turnovers forced per drive
5 defensive TDs

>2013 Seahawks
1.22 points per drive allowed (1st)
26.14 yards per drive allowed (3rd)
with an average opponent starting field position of 25.85 (6th)
.201 turnovers forced per drive
4 defensive TDs

>>65478126
>that disparity in starting line of scrimmage
the broncos offense should get a magical award for being so fucking inept.

>>65478126
This makes it pretty clear Seattle was better. Broncos gave up 17% more points per drive, and were only 61% as likely to get a turnover (which is ridiculous). Even if you factor in the starting field position to account for the extra points, the turnover differential is just insane. Seattle averaged better than a turnover ever 5 drives, Broncos less than one every 8.

The 1 extra Def TD is irrelevant, as def TDs are fluky.

>>65476554
>muh health
Every time with Bawwwwston

Every team gets banged up, deal with it faggot.

>>65477632
TOP is a retarded stat for retards. Look at plays run.

>>65478189
Seahawks were much more exciting to watch with their turnover potential

>>65478126
>.201 turnovers forced per drive

That's fucking ridiculous.

>>65477989
Shows how little the Broncos made game changing plays. Maybe if they could get more takeaways, they would be 1st in ppg and not 4th.

>>65478367
They're first in points per drive, nerd

>>65478385
please refer to
>>65478126

Seahawks allowed 1.22 points per drive, largely due to their high propensity for takeaways. My point still stands. The Broncos just didn't have the takeaway ability which would have resulted in less ppg.

>>65478302
How is time of possession a stupid stat to use if you're trying to figure out how much of a break your defense gave the offense? The offense won't get any more rest during a 7 play 3 minute series than they would during a 12 play 3 minute series

>>65478367
They're not first in PPG because they faced the highest number of drives in the league.

195 drives faced. League average was 180 this year. They faced one more drive than Philly with their meme offense. Seattle this year faced 166, tied for the least. That's almost three full games at the league average number of drives. Their offense just chews so much clock.

Remember when Brady punted and Von Miller had a silverback tier chimpout?

Fuck this nog.

>>65478363
It's good, but there's plenty better just in terms of turnovers. Here's all the ones over .2 since 2000.

>Team - Turnovers/Drive (Points/Drive rank that season, Yards/Drive)

05 CIN - .244 (24, 29)
00 BAL - .243 (1, 2)
07 SD - .230 (2, 11)
03 STL - .223 (7, 8)
02 GB - .222 (8, 9)
07 IND - .222 (5, 16)
12 NE - .215 (12, 21)
00 DEN - .214 (20, 22)
01 NYJ - .213 (14, 19)
09 GB - .212 (6, 3)
10 NE - .211 (16, 30)
12 CHI - .208 (1, 5)
11 GB - .208 (23, 29)
04 CAR - .207 (17, 25)
06 BAL - .206 (1, 2)
01 CLE - .206 (8, 10)
04 NE - .203 (4, 15)
13 SEA - .201 (1, 3)
05 CAR - .201 (2, 2)
00 MIA - .201 (3, 9)
06 CHI - .200 (2, 1)

>>65476067
The 1985 Bears and 2000 Ravens.

>>65476554
>literally winning 0 superb owls yesterday
>still talking
stop being a bottom bitch tom

>>65478808
How have the Bengals never won an owl?