>ITT: Dark Personality Test
Scores how Machiavellian, Narcisistic or Psychopathic you are
it's funny because I consider myself an ancap.
niccolo espoused nationalism and monarchy though right? idk I feel like you have to be a complete psychopath to be educated in political and economic theory and still espouse a statist ideology.
Machiavellianism is literally just a measure of how much of a detached, cynical asshole you are. Holding honest views or caring about ideological contradictions is the precise inverse of the concept.
That depends. If you only care about them intellectually and simply outwardly act however you find expedient anyway then yes it's machiavellian.
But actually caring and letting that show in your actions makes you less so.
It means basically that you at some level have decided that other people are assholes and/or that the world is unforgiving and that you need to do whatever it takes to achieve your goals.
what does this mean?
I like to imagine it as basically
Narcissism = lawful evil
Psychopathy = chaotic evil
Machiavellianism = neutral evil
This is a bit silly but it makes it easier to understand the basic concepts.
I think it means you're cunning and can perceive relationships as a means to an end, a tool to be used.
Or you could grasp the basic concept that statism is a system for societal control in an over-scaled society and it is a virtual impossibility to remove the organically emergent technological and societal phenomenon that have caused the increase in complexity.
Thinking that outside, uncontrollable forces have strong sway over your life is a strong feature in machiavellianism so in that sense it's congruent with the disturbance.
But caring about it outside of "this is as such, how do I use it, destroy it or avoid it" isn't.
I just tell people what they want to hear. I really don't want to harm anyone, but I'm absolutely willing to use them to get what I want. I'm am beyond selfish.
Uh psychopath is the only one that matters. The others are moot points. Psychopaths are already manipulative and narcissistic. Machiavellianism might as well be measuring your neckbeard levels.
I could have done better.
Is that so, good to know then.
Should I just kill myself?
I'm so fucking stupid and worthless.
Psychopathy is actually a pure measure of callous-unemotionality. This leads to a set of behaviours that are very distinct from machiavellianism and narcissism.
They're not exactly easy people to be around but generally the only reason pure psychopaths get away with things is because what they do is so outlandish.
Like tricking five guy in a row into having their babies for child support money or tricking the local government into re-hiring you when you've scammed them for millions on building the same goddamn balcony, both of which are IRL examples.
>ITT: Dark Personality Test
>ITT: help FBI gather personality profiling data to match against our IP addresses and store it in a database
You guys do realize that this website is somewhat under surveillance, and all the profiling "games" you play are pretty much supplying them with data, some of these posts may even be by the FBI, If you're smart and not an attention whore you wouldn't feel the need to prove how edgy you are kek.
Your egos are literally being used to trick you into supplying data - "Oh look at me, look at me, I'm so crazy, so edgy".
i wouldn't even say i'm manipulative at all
how the fuck am i supposed to be able to control people if i spaghetti all over myself whenever i try talking to them
All wrong. Psychopaths aren't merely just petty criminals. Psychopaths control the world. You just cherry picked some low level examples of psychopaths.
You're in the 50% percentile, e.g. you are average.
By comparison I wind up in the 100% percentile and I do manipulate a lot.
This test is a variant of a test called the "dirty dozen". There is another, the MACH-IV which is longer and more nuanced but dirty dozen does correlate very well with it.
The reason I know so much about this is because I frantically searched for a reason as to why I was such a cold manipulative asshole whenever things didn't go my way. It isn't nice to be like this and you probably shouldn't seek it out as a solution to your problems.
>>implying they don't already have enough data on you already
There is no such thing as enough data moron, there is no such thing as too much intel, just as there is no such thing as enough/too much money.
Your logic here is retarded - "Oh they already have some data on my so I might as well supply them with more", if someone stole $100 from you overtime because you walked down the same street to work each day would you continue to walk down that street based on the premise that - "they've taken enough of my money so it doesn't matter now".
>I don't care, is everyone American now?
>Implying the FBI only records data on Americans
You can't be this stupid to think government agencies aren't recording data on everyone they possibly can or even sharing data with different countries when necessary.
Oh wait I forgot planes and boats don't exist, so there's no need to record data on foreigners, because its not as if they can come to America.
That's actually wrong - assholes "control the world" and high-functioning psychopaths happen to be among them.
This is the core concept of the dark triad, that even if a psychopath is a callous asshole because he/she doesn't care, the machiavellian is a callous asshole because it's "necessary" and the narcissist is a callous asshole because they think unusually highly of themselves they are all still vicious assholes.
There is one thing that correlates inversely with all of them though, the honesty-humility scale on the OCEAN test which is a variant of the big-5, making it a kind of "universal asshole meter". I score zero on that test but am still not the least bit callous-unemotional.
>Lay off the weed, dude.
>Don't cut myself
Don't do any retarded shit like the typical r9k anon who really just practices self destructive behavior because they're emotional like women or want to feel like a special snowflake - "Oh I'm so damaged, look at me, I can't stop hurting myself, so edgy" (Linkin Park - In The End plays in the background).
2.7 narcissism and psychopathy
I honestly expected to score lower in Machiavellianism and narcissism, and higher in psychopathy. I don't do well with empathy but I don't consider myself particularly amazing or godlike. I also didn't realise I was apparently so manipulative.
I figured as much. My problem isn't that I'm a psychopath it's that I'm a hikki.
I just showed you the dark triad is bullshit since psychopath encompasses the other two. You are trying to make psychopathy one dimensional to fit but it doesn't work.
You are probably an INTJ. They are hung up on machiavellianism because it involves morals/feelings while still being manipulative. If you want to go deeper narcissists are enneagram 3s which any person can have.
It actually doesn't. Psychopathy and narcissism are two very distinct mental traits.
Psychopathic lying and manipulation is distinct from machiavellian lying and manipulation by timescale and aversion to consequences.
Machiavellian behavior means aversion to punishment and long timescales. Psychopathic behavior means ignoring punishment and acting on short timescales.
Now, if you combined them I guess you'd in the best case get a high-functioning psychopath that can weather bad outcomes much better than a machiavellian yet is capable of planning ahead and being cautious.
And if you also where narcissistic I guess that would counter the despondency and callous lack of care for anything that the other two traits bring to the table.
Otherwise no, there is indeed no difference as far as I'm capable of judging - but what you're perceiving is that there is a shared core of "dishonesty" between these personality traits, just.
It does, in that you get inherent drive I think.
Believing in yourself and actually putting value in what you do is valuable in and of itself. It means that you can say "yes, what I do is inherently valuable and therefore I should put in effort into doing so."
It also seem to provide a drive towards being social and assimilating social norms.
You don't get drive at all. Narcissism is a defense to self esteem, it manifests in losers. People who wholeheartedly believe in their superiority don't tend to work hard. Look at Elliot. Textbook narcissist. Would rather go on a shooting spree than actually talk to a girl and in the process have his delusions shattered. It's why I always laugh at self described narcissists on here; it's like bragging about having low functioning autism.
Yes. He was admittedly an extreme case, a textbook over-the-top narcissist.
It's frightening how he just couldn't process other people's perspectives, period.
But in any discussion about a functioning dark triad individual you have to assume that the person isn't utterly extreme. Otherwise it will always be dysfunctional no matter which trait is "too much".
Even machiavellianism can go too far, to the point that you start acting like a Edmund Blackadder cosplayer.
I honestly don't like the dark triad at all. To me, narcissism and psychopathy should be mutually exclusive. Psychopathy often comes with narcissistic personality traits, but they manifest for different reasons. Dark triad tests tend to show this flaw when the majority of people get very close psychopathy and narcissism scores. For psychopathy, I think the levenson self report is the best test available.
Well it gets muddled of course. Personally I don't understand how someone can be both machiavellian and narcissistic since to me machiavellianism means a total devaluation and relativization of all things including the self.
I score 3.7/3.6 on the Levenson test but it does include elements that I feel belongs to machiavellianism and not strictly callous-unemotionality/primary psychopathy. On the other hand the test purportedly measures sociopathy/secondary psychopathy which does complicate things.
Robert Hare who first coined the term often talks about the psychopaths capacity for manipulation, so it's pretty legit. I think someone further up the thread did a decent job of explaining the difference between typical psychopathic and Machiavellian manipulation. I took the test for the first time a few days ago and scored 4.6 and 4.5 respectively. I'm actually quite shocked by it, I consider myself a relatively introspective person and didn't consider that I might be a psycho.
> I think someone further up the thread did a decent job of explaining the difference between typical psychopathic and Machiavellian manipulation.
Yes, that'd be me.
> I consider myself a relatively introspective person and didn't consider that I might be a psycho.
Well, you'd be born that way so it wouldn't be strange to you.
But aren't you also chronically under-stimulated?
As in I'm bored a lot and tend to flit from thing to thing? Yeah, it's a big problem for me. I'm becoming much better at it though, as I realised recently that it's what's causing me to not be very successful in life. For example, now (as in the past month or two) if I start reading a book that I don't particularly like, I force myself to read it to the end. Then again that's not very hard at the moment, I just got into reading last month so it's currently new and exciting for me. I hope it stays that way. The only thing I consistently get joy from is petty theft.
> The only thing I consistently get joy from is petty theft.
Yeah, that fits the diagnostic criteria. I don't judge you, personally I find computer hacking (/cracking, intrusion, whatever) perversely enjoyable and I also fantasize a lot about complex fraud and breaking into places. But generally I'm way too cowardly to do anything where I risk getting caught, not even computer intrusion.
As for the negatives, I have to try really hard not to think about things in an external "what's in it for me" context because eventually you hit that point where things just stop mattering. Also I can't stop plotting and counter-plotting against everyone I meet, it's not even funny even if it works and people think I'm "such a nice boy".
If I could just suppress it to the point that it could be of use for my internal goals and no further that'd be ideal.
>plotting and counter-plotting against everyone I meet
>too cowardly to actually do any crime
Honestly, that actually sounds a lot like paranoid and avoidant behaviour to me. It can be cured or at least managed with CBT.
Nah, not like an avoidant.
I think, if you wanted to simplify it, I use other people's empathy against them by making them take my perspective for a while. And then, because most people do not process that perspective readily they are sort of just along for the ride. And then I can puppeteer them via their own "negative" emotions and views that they can't really fully process. Kind of like what FOX News does to people.
But at the same time since I'm not callous this does make me more and more neurotic the more I do it. So I'm trying to seek out situations which makes me not do that.
Programming is nice in this way because it's "pure of intent".
I'm a well-balanced adult, please put me in the "not a threat" category in your database.
Yep. At the core of me is a hurt 14-year-old kid trying to fend off a very cruel world. I feel very strong emotions that never reach the surface.
It's what differentiates me from a psychopath. A psychopath /must/ steal because he is bored, simply. Just as you /must/ insult me because you understand on some primal level what a toxic asshole I am and therefore nature brings you to attack me.
I can't tell if you're a faggot or if your being sarcastic.
>tfw walked into a casino drunk and stole 300 pounds in chips without doing any actual gambling
>cashed it in the next month
>no questions asked
For someone who constantly looks in the mirror for no better reason than that I like looking at my attractive features, I'm surprisingly less narcissistic according to this than I thought.
Vanity is pretty normal. If I was exceptionally good looking I would spend a lot of time in the mirror too.
You can be none of those things and still not be a good person. You strike me as mentally well but should probably work on being more assertive/confident. You might have low self esteem.
What does it mean?
Very original post tbqh
>You strike me as mentally well but should probably work on being more assertive/confident. You might have low self esteem.
Well, I'm agoraphobic and haven't had human contact in half a decade, so there's that. I have no confidence/assertiveness whatsoever, I don't see value in communication.
Not sarcastic at all. It's simply fact.
Machiavellianism is in this sense a kind of stable version of secondary psychopathy or "unstable neurotic petty criminal drug-user with no impulse control", if you can imagine that.
I'm a chronic asspained faggot to an unbelievable degree and I know this but at an early age I just learned to suppress it and lie through my teeth instead.
Studies actually confirm this pattern of behavior, that if high machs show who they really are people hate them and perceive them as very hostile and immature.
I wouldn't dare do something like that, even while drunk.
Avoidance is a top tier robot illness. at least you belong here.
Stealing is actually incredibly easy. I'm a student and don't have a job so I use it to supplement my income.
Yes, it is easy but I fear getting caught too much.
I can bend the norms in terms of things like dumpster diving or going to a party with booze and then skimming twice as much as i brought but outright theft would leave me paranoid for weeks afterwards.
The original study is simply called "a study in machiavellianism". I think it's on Scribd.
Otherwise you're going to have to start to go through google scholar I'm afraid unless you have access to a university library.
>going to a party with booze and then skimming twice as much as i brought
People realise you do this and resent you for it. They probably talk about it all the time. You won't be getting invited to as many parties as you could.
Thought i will score high on narcissism but i must have misunderstood the definition...oh wellzies, gotta rot a little longer on the board, maybe i will git gud
Forgot to cap it
>low narcissism, 7th percentile
>92nd percentile Machiavellian
>30th percentile psychopath
I have no empathy yet was rated low on that because apparently having blunt emotional responses means you have to seek out fights and be impulsive ie be a stupid shit
You'd be surprised what you can get away with in an environment where "things just happen, dude". And if you build up a debt towards someone they're always even more grateful towards you when you pay it off. Socially it isn't a simple matter of +-0 on a bank account.
It's helped me a lot desu in making me realize what on earth I was doing wrong. I mean I knew I was a negative person I just couldn't put it in a framework that let me keep a handle on it.
>mfw all of r9k is high Machiavellian
>they "tell others what they want to hear" by being beta doormats and circlejerking here posting menes
>they "manipulate others" by trolling with ebin shitposts all day
Late in replying to this. Long time scale manipulation is more attributed to INTJs being long term thinkers.
Speaking as a psychopath it is true I prefer shorter term stuff but I am capable of long term stuff too. Long term strategies are just seen as another tactic if they are needed. What's important is the accomplished goal at any means necessary. I'm not some mindless retard that goes around fucking everything and stealing. But I am entirely capable of it if the environment permitted it.
Not responding to punishment is attributed more to the shallow effect. I might not care about the punishment but I can logically avoid the same situation from happening again.
Psychopathy has grandiose sense of self worth. It's similar. Narcissism is more image and approval based. The average person can't tell the difference.
Narcissists usually have a very strong drive to achieve.
People who beat up other people is not the kind of people I associate with. It's a mixture of white, upper-middle class college students on one hand and artist types on the other.
And I don't steal. I give and then get given more than I gave if that makes any sense. It's a very good model for the rest of my "problematic" behavior desu.
I play a game and then I end up with more than other people. Not because I cheat, just because I'm playing a game and the others aren't. And then when I sense that I'm playing it too close I "duck" by acting prosocially.
You honestly just sound like a regular person who's trying to twist his every day interactions into something special. You might actually be narcissistic, given how much you consider yourself a special snowflake. Either way you sound incredibly dull and likely need to get out more, and post on 4chan less.
Then you are indeed one of the rare ones because every psychopath I've met has in fact gone around fucking everything and stealing as if their life depended on it. On the other hand I'd obviously not notice those who didn't.
How do you score on the Mach-IV?
Actually no, I'm just an asshole. There's nothing special about being an asshole, we're just discussing psychological models about different ways one can be an asshole here.
And perhaps how one can /stop/ being an asshole if one wants to.
Not rare at all. It's just you can only uncover a psychopath if they get caught and end up in jail. The smarter psychopaths don't end up in jail. My brother is one too and he is pretty mild. He has a caring MBTI type. For some psychopaths their job is a form of legal crime. It has an anti social element to it. Business men, lawyers, cops, disrupting entrepeneurs, stock brokers, strippers ect.
This is the main reason why we don't get spotted. People expect somebody with crazy eyes.
For example did you know donald trump is a psychopath? Steve jobs too. What gives it away is they have an abusive streak. At our core we are sadistic.
Never took that test. I don't need to I have everything on the checklists. I'm a 3rd generation psychopath as far as I know.
You don't know what you are talking about. It's possible to have an MBTI type that clashes with being a psychopath.
>brother pulled a giant knife on me when he was 6
>volunteers for a suicide hot line now
Yes a legal crime is how it should be thought of. What do you think a bounty hunter is?
Steve Jobs probably had a psychopathic streak but Trump is mostly narcissistic even if he's a lot more resilient than most narcissists.
Also, notice how I deflect criticism and hostility? It's even more effective face-to-face.
This is a rather bad example because we're actually just having a discussion but imagine someone doing this in all things, only giving in when it makes them look good, never dropping spaghetti. It's a fucking toxic reflex to be honest. I can't shut it off, it's a permanent part of what passes for my social skills.
If you want to "trap me" you need to force me to obey a rigid set of rules that ensures fairness, make sure that there's no high-strung negativity that clouds your mind (but not mine, I've gotten used to my own immature hostility and rage see) and finally try to make the situation as impersonal as possible with a minimum of face-to-face interaction.
Yea he's interesting because he's both. So he's like double narcissistic. You probably don't know anything about enneagram but he's an enneagram 3 (narcissist achiever). Which actually has it's own subtype of psychopathy.
I don't know what to say. You come across as a real roleplayer. I agree with you on Trump though. I'm not even an assblasted lefty, I'm just quite good at spotting that stuff in person. Steve Jobs isn't too far fetched either.
Trump really isn't narcissistic though, he has the narcissistic traits of psychopathy but doesn't have NPD.
>it's possible to have a personality type that clashes with your personality type
And I don't know what I'm talking about.
You must be a fellow movie lover... If a bounty hunter started committing crime, they could theoretically become the target of other bounty hunters. The word you're looking for is "white collar crime", although it doesn't apply to rogue bounty hunters. Moreso things like tax evasion and corporate fraud.
Roleplayer? I'm surprised nobody has called me edgy yet. Can't talk about psychopathy without being called edgy at least once.
I'm not sure what qualifies as NPD. I can say he is an enneagram 3 which is pretty much narcissism. I wouldn't say it's a disorder though. More of a personality trait.
The point is it just needs to have anti social shit in it or conflict. That's how we get our rocks off.
It does resemble him. He just doesn't give a shit.
I mostly use the psychological subtypes for fuzzy matching of the behavior of people I meet desu, it's nice to have some reflections on how things can manifest.
>The Success-Oriented, Pragmatic Type: Adaptable, Excelling, Driven, and Image-Conscious
This is not narcissism. Narcissism is buy definition a disorder, as classified in the DSM. If it doesn't negatively affect your life, you are not a narcissist.
>that's how we get our rocks off
It's posts like these that lead me to believe you are roleplaying. Psychopaths don't inherently enjoy violence or anti social behaviour more than any other human being, they're just not as averse to it, they'll be more likely to resort to it to get what they want. Even assuming you were a psychopath, any homicidal ideation or kleptomania you found yourself stricken with would be a separate ailment.
so all of us are basically, manipulative psychos?
that makes sense, with the amount of fake tinder threads, and trolling we've done in the past
>The point is it just needs to have anti social shit in it or conflict. That's how we get our rocks off.
Tilting my head sideways at this. Did you quote the wrong post? Are you high? Don't bother replying, you seem to really need this. Yes, yes, you and your brother and your entire family, all psychopaths! Are you happy now? Go back to the playground.
Except for one of them, of course.
Yea I agree it doesn't negatively affect his life. A narcissist is just an enneagram 3 gone bad.
I'm not roleplaying at all. You can ask me anything and you can decide if it sounds real. We do enjoy anti social behaviour. I would say it's the most telling sign of a psychopath. That's how I spot other ones because they can't control it. It happens subconsciously.
Yea I'm so edgy amirite? Mom I'm going out to kill niggers.
Are you diagnosed with ASPD by a professional? It's literally all I care about.
Which means the afflicted has a proclivity for antisocial behaviour, not that he or she enjoys it. Getting a bit hot under the collar are we?
Machiavellianism has nothing to do with his ideology. Machiavelli was also a proponent of the Republic, The Prince was in no way reflective of his body of work and probably was not intended for publication.
Nope and I'm never going to. One I don't give a shit about you or your approval. And two only retards tell people in real life they are a psychopath.
>hot under the collar are we
I think you are forgetting about the shallow effect. I couldn't care about you if I tried. You are just dumb that's all.
Overly empathetic, "there are some things some people don't need to know" would have scored higher on mahiavellianism if they were all like that
You sure have spent a lot of time trying to convince me of your emotional retardation for a man who doesn't care. No worries son, I'm sure some video game guild will accommodate your desire to appear cool and aloof.
Yes you are. Man this thread is full of retards.
You are so butthurt it's funny. I'm just enjoying your pain.
>people with anti social personality disorder don't enjoy being anti social
I'm not in any pain, I'm just giggling to myself while watching you get incredibly more defensive about your mental illness LARPing.
Are you actually a practising therapist? Undergrad? Postgrad?
Can you define "people like me"? Anyway, it's not really important.
>ASPD is psychopathy because of the blatant disregard for others' needs combined with the disregard for rules
This doesn't make much sense if you're familiar with the contemporary concept of psychopathy (callousness, unemotionality), if you're trying to do something here, you're not very good at it.
It's possible to be diagnosed a psychopath by the PCL-R and not fit the diagnostic criteria for ASPD according to the DSM V. ASPD has high comorbidity with anxiety disorders and is associated with an increased suicide risk. In primary psychopathy, you have reduced anxiety, stress immunity and a unaffected suicide risk(actually they're thought of as immune to suicide but I don't know of any studies that support this idea.)
Anybody else who wants to pretend like they know something?
Psychopathy is actually included in the DSM V, as a added feature. ASPD with added psychopathic features. Then you also have conduct disorder with callous traits.
So you're a first year psychology student? I don't know, you seem to insist on us making the assumptions here. Nah, you don't know anything and you're doing a terrible job at hiding it. Why further embarrass yourself?
>It's used for conduct disorder, which is what children are given instead of bipolar now.
Don't you think it's time for you to leave? How many more cringe inducing posts are you going to make?
Do you have any criticisms of the DSM? It's always baffled me that you need to be convicted of a crime to be diagnosed with ASPD. Seems like a lot of potential criminals are going to slip through the net because they haven't been caught yet. Also, tell us about yourself? Where did you study and all that stuff. I'm thinking about doing a bachelor's in neuroscience and psychology myself.
>psychopaths are smarter than me and that makes me uncomfortable
Are you an INTJ? You sound like one. Can't accept any information unless they are in the official diagnostic book. I deal with people like you all the time. Better to just ignore since you can't think on your own.
I have such torment in my heart. The will to kill is unbearable. Nobody understands my psychopath pain.
Weird. All the papers I've read clearly use it as a term to designate the affective poverty of primary psychopaths.
It would be useful to have that separation. In real life, meeting a primary psychopath can be rather disorienting in my experience, much like meeting a psychotic schizophrenic, because of the profound "cognitive gap" between that person and oneself.
I've also met very antisocial petty criminals of course, but that specific form of unemotionality that primary psychopaths have is different and valuable to have a term for I think.
Cool shitpost, shadow the edgehog.
He posted his triad results and then proceeded to talk a little bit about psychology. The only obnoxious thing about him is his trip but it's arguably relevant to the discussion.
I'm okay with this. I generally thing I'm a pretty good person.
My problem isn't evil desires, it's complete lack of desire.
Nice shitpost, shadow the edgehog. Try again in 4 years.
>then proceeded to talk a little bit about psychology
Yes, but moreso psychiatry. And as I've made it clear, he's bullshitting, making things up, confusing people. I guess he wants us to respect him and be interested in what he has to say. Maybe he lacks that in his real life.
This is proof that I'm not a narcissist.
More psychopathic than 1% of people, pretty stable then.
I'm a bigger asshole than I thought
about what I expected.
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