Reminder that libertarian is a white middle class ideology (+ a few token others)
Every other group of people either come from third world peasant cultures where they vote for whoever gives them handouts, or they're islamists, or they're pragmatic nationalists are fine with a big government (japan/sk would be considered 'fascist' by sjw standards'.
Libertarianism is the ultimate cuck ideology. The only thing that is important to the libertarian cuck is money, every other value, his race, his traditions, his heritage, thrown out the window.
The reason why the republicans never do anything to win in the long-run is because they're infected by braindead jewish goldwater libertarianism, which reagan also inherited and act as another conman as a diluted libertarian. That's why even their judge appointments who are infected by this retarded ideology often end up flaking out. Neocons are basically diluted libertarians, who favor slightly larger governments and more interventionism but are otherwise exactly the fucking same.
Reminder that "libertarianism" is a reactionary ideology and as such has almost no concrete definition. A lot of people in America claim to be libertarian but are actually anarcho-capitalists/left-leaning conservatives.
libertarianism = no faith in one's national heritage or culture, only money/low taxes.
It's a religion based on low taxes, which turns off normal people.
Neocons are libertarians with an added religious pandering element + slightly more interventionism and bigger government.
Reagan loved Goldwater.
Libertarian is a broad position. There are left and right libertarians, and ones that believe in strong private property rights and others that believe in socializing the means of production. All of them however believe in minimizing the state.
>libertarianism = no faith in one's national heritage or culture, only money/low taxes.
This posits that libertarianism is incompatible with heritage or culture which is false.
>It's a religion based on low taxes
Not necessarily, anarchism is a subset of libertarianism which implies no taxes.
>which turns off normal people.
No, it does not turn off most people because of economic freedoms, but because of other ideological misunderstandings. It really is just a fringe position that few people even dare to entertain but rather would precede it with "lol".
>Neocons are libertarians with an added religious pandering element + slightly more interventionism and bigger government.
Bigger government is contradictory to libertarianism and therefore is incompatible.
Not necessarily, it depends on the morality of the individuals.
Yes Libertarianism is defacto leftist. It's one of the tenants of the root of all the garbage we endure: the french revolution. Liberty, equality, fraternity.
It would only be good in a white state with enforced borders which is ironically against their own position.
It's called a logical fallacy nigger just because something has always happened one way doesn't mean something else can't happen.
Flipping a coin 50 times and coming up heads every time doesn't mean the coin can't land on tails.
It is, that's why you don't support equality in the first place, because it doesn't exist. So what happens is that you cucks support it, while others don't, and the others who come from more primitive societies (non-white middle class) get their way.
Libertarianism in its purest form requires free exchange of labor in order to ensure a truly free market i.e. no borders. Libertarianism is anti-nation, individualist fedoralord bullshit. Almost as bad as atheism in terms of the cringeworthiness of its proponents.
go suck uncle adolf's cock bootlicker
That's the point, that's what you support, but those people from more primitive cultures don't, that's why you lose, because like I said, libertarianism is very much so a white middle class thing.
>It would only be good in a white state with enforced borders which is ironically against their own position.
Not necessarily, minarchism would maintain a government to ensure military protection and security such as enforced borders to keep undesirables out.
>Libertarians support equality of opportunity
Not necessarily, for instance in a private school system some schools would be of lesser quality.
>Libertarianism in its purest form requires free exchange of labor in order to ensure a truly free market i.e. no borders
Not necessarily, a minimal state can enforce borders.
>Libertarianism is anti-nation, individualist fedoralord bullshit. Almost as bad as atheism in terms of the cringeworthiness of its proponents.
two memes in one post, congratulations
Equality of opportunity is inherently leftist. Truly conservative ideology seeks to preserve an inequality that is overall beneficial to the people. For example a border is a preserved inequality, the rights of the citizen are put over that of the 'human rights' of the average human.
You can see this in the fact that the extreme of left wing is communism, pure equality. While the extreme of right wing is oligrachy or Facism, inequality taken to the extreme.
See the contradiction? That's exactly how sjws win over moderate libertarians in appeal-to-emotion arguments. Who they can't win over are fascists, which is why the 1930s is the only period in history in which sjw values were actually reversed.
This is true, and brings a more crucial point that forcing equality of opportunity is both futile and detrimental. Letting the free markets serve the best needs of its customers is practical and effective.
Yeah but Microsoft armed with nukes sounds really cool.
>My dubs are higher than your dubs
But it does justify some sense of nationalism and community. Such as border controls, regulations, standards for media, cultural reinforcement....etc.
Libertarians don't want cultural issues enforced by the state
Humans are pure individuals. Do the people you're associated with think for you? Do you have a sense of self? Just because one form communities and lives with family does not mean that we are not pure individuals. We form groups out of necessity and convenience, not because we can't function without them.
Every Libcuck should watch this
Libertarianism implies the end of the welfare state.
It is an ideology related to law and order. The fact it doesn't care about other things (agriculture, culture, energy, industries, etc.) does not mean it is against those, or even has a particular opinion about them.
It just means: the government shall defend justice, and nothing more.
In fact, libertarian societies would tend to be conservative, since without the welfare state the main source of welfare would become the family again, and then immediate neighbours, etc.
So people would defacto organize themselves along ethnic lines.
And if you don't believe me just look at which countries are the most cucked: Sweden, Germany, etc.
The ones with extensive welfare states and strong, powerful governments.
Switzerland is more based and much closer to a libertarian society, for example (in relative terms).
If I were to rip you out of your community, you would be lesser. You would not reach your full potential as a human being.
If you were to grow up in Saudi Arabia where the people are totally different than you and you are an outcast, your children are outcasts, you have no community or nation, you would be like a vagrant.
>Culture and the state are completely independent
You're fucking retarded
What? So aware you going to remove me as I am now or would I have been born that way? If you were to do it now, I'd obviously already hold the values I do now and would do everything in my power to excel by my own merit. I don't need 'the nation' to hold my hand and if I do then I don't deserve anything. If I were an outcast, I would leave. That's it. You're acting as if people can't move or find places that cater to people like them.
It could be worse, but there are a few significant issues:
* the implicit bailout of banks and even large corporations like GM removes a fundamental control mechanism of a free market (bankruptcy)
* the extensive powers of governments mean they are being lobbied by large corporations; another fundamental control mechanism (competition) is damaged
* central banks interventions affect decisions on a very large scale basis (to the point that investment decisions in countries like Australia are influenced by policies of the Fed)
But, again, it could be worse. We still have relatively free markets and capitalism.
They are. Are all German people supportive of refugees? Are all Swedes progressive feminists? Their states are so they must all be then. See how you're not making any sense? Jews held together their culture and traditions even when they literally had no state.
Shit man I gotta sleep tonight
How many people died in the console wars?
The only corporations interested in war are ones producing weapons of war. Their only client is the government.
No they are not.
>if the old government doesn't hold a gun to my head, the new government will hold a gun to my head waaaah
I read that as "I have given up living, so I don't care if I live in an Islamic shithole of a country".
If everyone was afraid if new thins like you are, Donald Trump would be dead in the water and USA would have no hope just like EU.
>The only corporations interested in war are ones producing weapons of war. Their only client is the government.
Hanz please, light small arms sell like hotcakes worldwide to civilians.
> We need a permanent centralized authoritarian ruler to take decisions for all of us !
Wait do you want to use the Nazis as an argument AGAINST libertarianism?
>civilian small arms
I know you probably smoked like 59 bongs today but please try and read. There is a difference between companies producing tanks and warships and companies producing AR-15s with tacticool accessoires.
Microsoft goes to the US government to complain about trade issue with [x] country --> US government sends Navy over to [x] country's waters -->Microsoft gets better agreements. Seriously, why do you think governments and military exist? Just to give officials big pensions? They are the executive and military branch of the nation's corporations.
> A smaller goverment = mateprialism, destroy your heritage and your culture.
> Big goverment= Decency, spiritualism and preserving values.
Implying this means that you know nothing about history. The lost of traditional values has happened under big goverments mostly.
No wonder only beta and degenerate cucks are natsoc nowadays. It is just an ideology meant for sissies that hide their own inferiority on their heritage, implying that it makes them stronger
>no faith in one's national heritage or culture
Libertarians believe one's heritage and culture can prevail without government support. In comparison, you seem to lack faith in the strength of your "culture".
>There is a difference between companies producing tanks and warships and companies producing AR-15s with tacticool accessoires.
Not to the liberals.
Microsoft gets in wars in it's own way (they aren't allowed to be violent).
Anyway, you're operating under the assumption that "all war is bad". This simply isn't true, sometimes wars are necessary.
When two competing ideologies clash, it's necessary to have a trial by fire to determine which of the two is stronger and has the right to live on and reproduce itself. This process has overall resulted in much progress in human history. The Romans were the strongest, and therefore managed to spread their values all over Europe, resulting in Roman law being flung far and wide, and Europe advancing out of it's primitive state.
Libertarianism is probably the most organic political system there is. It is based around property and voluntary trade. Saying that something like socialism, that is basically the control of burocrats over everything is more natural just shows how misinformed you are.
The point of libertarianism is to make that impossible.
How can you not grasp that simple concept? I know Greece can't into economics but you must realize that a small government would not be lobbied by corporations because it would have no power over the economy.
You are using things happening right now in our authoritarian big government world to argue against a system that would make those very things virtually impossible.
Wtf are you doing
>americuck thinking he has traditions, heritage or has anything left from his traitor ancesters who fled to americuckistan
lol fatass, protip: you have no culture, flipping burgers and drinking big gulps excluded, you're as much related to god tier europeans as much as nigs to wewuzkingsandsheeeeit.
americucks are like zebras in a zoo, on a continent they don't belong to. all your culture and "heritage" is artificial, a mere dream of what god tier europeans have.
now look amerifat, start accepting that your shit tier country will be ruled by spics because it actually belongs to them.
>very other value, his race, his traditions, his heritage.
> Has literally nothing to be proud of
>Uses the achievements of people that he will never meet to validate is meaningless existence
You can refuse a government authority, it doesn't mean you would gladly live with muslims or support race-mixing.
You can decide to and use your purchasing power to live with like-minded whites if you so wish.
Living according to your ideas is actually easier without a government to force its own progressive ideology on you.
Are you a liberal?
I never said war was bad. Libertarians can go to war to defend themselves, their nations etc.
My point in this chain of arguments was that is idiotic to support a big government because you are afraid of Microsoft buying nukes, because it's big government who has started wars all over the world, not Microsoft.
It's like saying: "I support being a slave to this violent tyrant, because that guy with the horses might buy a weapon sometimes"
you mean a world with photshop.
Sadly this is right, America isn't a real nation, not even whilte america because it sucked up so many immigrants from different nations of europe and homogenized them into one group of consumerist cultureless suburban goyim. That 50's dream was a big deception.
If anything only certain regions (Texas and the south for example) have real "national identity" due to being largely anglo founding stock descendents. Seperatism would be the only way to have a real traditional society in America
>you have no culture
We do, it's just been forgotten.
When did I claim that libertarianism was supposed to be an eternally stable system that could never be disturbed?
'The tree of liberty from time to time must be watered with the blood of tyrants and patriots'
Are you the type of person who doesn't get on a plane because it MIGHT crash?
No, no. The thing is we already know what will happen with this plan. It happened 200 years ago. Remember when Germany was dozens of smaller Kingdoms who competed with one another? That evolved into the Big Government. Why? It was more efficient. The same will haplen again.
Exactly. That is why more libertarian societies fare better than ones controlled centrally by bureaucrats.
You can't reduce people to statistics.
Governments should only ensure law and order.
But it should not intervene in how people want to transport themselves, produce energy and so on through taxes and subsidies.
Same thing regarding culture and traditions. You can't enforce them through government, almost by definition.
>The corporations themselves would form a government to protect their interests, goy. You just want to re-do what has already happened. Good job.
If the people don't support the government, it won't last.
Yeah humans were functioning really well when they were under the suffering of nature: natural disasters and disease. The agricultural and industrial revolutions were emergent creations from humans in order to get as far away from the shit nature is.
Everything except police, justice, defence and diplomacy. And tax collection to support those.
We're not doing too badly here actually. We continue to privatize infrastructure like roads, electricity generators, electric grid and so on.
I don't see why governments should get involved in schools, hospitals, etc. except obviously in matters of law and order (i.e. a school cannot endanger its students, a hospital has a responsibility to protect life, industries cannot pollute the environment, etc.)
But otherwise I'm fine for industries to set their prices and decide what and how they want to produce goods and services.
>afraid of what will happen when big brother isn't there
Because there is nothing to fear in nations where the government has weakened to the point where outside interests have been able to move in and carve up what they want/destabilise everything right?
Small goverment=/= weak goverment. Having a goverment that regulates hate speech wont make military stronger
Having a goverment that fixes prices wont make military stronger
Having a goverment that regulates what you can do wont make military stronger.
A smaller government does not necessitate a weaker government just as a larger government does not necessitate a weaker government. They are independent. That was a strawman, and your reasoning skills are piss poor because your IQ is standard deviations below mine statist shill.
>The ones with extensive welfare states and strong, powerful governments.
on the flip side of the coin so was nazi germany. just because there is a strong state doesn't mean the country has to be cucked.
A smaller government that also permits mass immigration, eliminates all checks on corporate power/activity and minimises taxes, military spending, social programs and infrastructure spending is weaker.
Yeah, and they were doing so without government interference. America was already the largest economy in the world by 1900 and was undisputed leader by the 1920s. Tell me more about how horrible we were before the advent of state worship.
Industry grew exponentially in the mid-to-late 1800s in America, at a time where all of the things you mentioned were rather scarce and government control was basically non-existent. You're just making uneducated assumptions here. Businesses, private individuals, churches, etc could provide these services, and in a more efficient way than government. It's what was happening at the time, then government fucked it up.