>The weirdest star in the cosmos just got a lot weirder. And yes, it might be aliens.
>Known as KIC 8462852, or Tabby’s star, it has been baffling astronomers for the past few months after a team of researchers noticed its light seemed to be dipping in brightness in bizarre ways. Proposed explanations ranged from a cloud of comets to orbiting “alien megastructures”.
>Now an analysis of historical observations reveals the star has been gradually dimming for over a century, leaving everyone scratching their heads as to the cause.
Not saying it's ayy lmaos, but it's ayy lmaos.
Even if it was ayy lmaos, would that be so surprising? knowing how vast the universe is, believing we are the only special snowflakes in this vastness just proves how retarded everyone is.
In science the answer to the most difficult question is usually the simplest answer, and they are trying too hard with the comet bullshit
>there is something I don't understand
>IT MUST BE AYYLMAOS
the God of the gaps has become the AYYLMAO of gaps
THEY KNOW WE'RE WATCHING THEM
THEY'RE CHARGING THEIR LAZER WITH STAR POWER
Did you read the article? They say that every explanation so far has holes in it. They simply have no idea what is causing it to dim. They did say, however, that many natural explanations have been ruled out.
Everyone that has reached ufos for some time agrees that ufos are spiritual/demonic, that the description of them matches perfectly with ancient and medieval accounts of spirits/demons, including the "alien abduction" accounts which resemble demonic obsession/possession.
Ai-chan is love, Ai-chan is live.
Alien waifus by October.
Remember to pay your respects to Ai-chan if you want her people to come here.
>Ancient people with limited technological understanding said it was demons, therefore aliums is demons
Pre-aristoteleans also thought the world was flat among other stupid shit.
Since when did obsolescence become authority?
>aliens notice we've spotted them
>decide to destroy us
Reptilians have taken over and infiltrated every level of human society (including our governments) for many thousands of years. The reason they've gotten away with it for so long is that they can assume a human form. They don't come from another physical planet per se, but from another band of frequency that vibrates very closely to this one (which enables them to flit back and forth from their dimension to ours).
Credo Mutwa called this frequency band/dimension 'the heaven between heavens'.
Their 'food' is our fear, our hatred, our suffering, our anger and our despair.
Shifting into a human form and entering into our dimension takes a lot of energy for them, so they can't stay here for long unless they possess the body of a human who is in vibrational resonance with them.
These humans are of a hybrid nature, their DNA is different from ours in that it is compatible with the reptilians (which is what allows them to be possessed). These humans are your kings, your banking dynasties (like the Rothschilds, for example), your presidents, etc. They have certain traits in common, like a lack of empathy, an obsession with being in control, lack of imagination, etc.
Oh, and they love lolis and gold.
These reptiles are pedophiles.
Except that ancient peoples actually learned how to communicate with these things. They were taught how to summon them ceremonially/ritually, and how to get favours from them by offering them sacrifice. They were in communication with them.
>hurr our ancient ancestors were all dumb
The idea that these things are organic creatures from a trillion light years away that have come on rocket ships and all they do is float around and spook people is the dumbest shit I've ever heard. People are only able to believe it because of sci-fi films and books.
Because it is surrounded by some huge fuckin structure distorting the light and gravity.
The explanations so far - meteorite belt, a huge planet, unknown anomaly and shit.
But so far everything points to a Dyson Sphere.
Thinking about it, though, Ai-chan isn't exactly an Ayylien, or Ayylien related.
And, if I remember the thread correctly, she was meant to be veiled to symbolize the doubt and the mistery surrounding the star.
>Except that ancient peoples actually learned how to communicate with these things.
Except you're completely wrong, and I've learned how to communicate with demons as well.
In fact, I'm snap chatting with several demons as I write this right now, and they said you're a dumb faggot who takes the words of sheep fuckers. Because claiming those strange lights are magical makes far more sense than any other explanation.
If its lmaos, then this is big.
If its anything else, its also big. Nobody knows what is causing this, it could be entirely new phenomenon that could radically alter our view of the universe.
Or it could be nothing at all.
How is saying that they are spirits the same as saying they are magical?
All societies all over the world at all times have acknowledged the existence of spirits, and of wicked spirits. Our society is practically the only exception.
It's 1400ly away. Meaning, even trying to communicate with aliens there would take 2800 years. Traveling there at the speed of light would take 1400 years. Except we can't travel that fast and won't ever be able to. The power required to travel even half the speed of light is about as much as a 1GW nuclear reactor running at 100% efficiency for 350 years. And then you'll need to same amount of power to stop the spacecraft. If you think time dilation solves the problem of time, think again. You'll need to travel upwards of 3/4 the speed of light for any significant time dilation effects that would make it possible for people to reach the planet in their lifetime. So, you'd need exponentially more power. And even then it will still be 5000 years later on Earth and everyone will have forgotten about you.
There's apparently somethings blocking the star's light. If course, if you look at the sky you'll see the stars flicker due to particles in the atmosphere blocking their light. There could be something blocking the light anywhere on the lightyears of distance between us and the star. Possibly a very slow moving mass out in deep space?
Our society also happens to be one capable of space travel and has established at the very least that canned meat balls hurdling through the vacuum of space is at least plausible considering we've taken steps at accomplishing it ourselves.
Frankly, I'm not against spiritualality. I think it's a beautiful thing and more people should endorse it. But your assertion that aliums is demons is fucking stupid, as are your assertions that these ancient people aren't wrong or lying. There's no real evidence outside of flawed testamony.
>What about those alien megastructures? Schafer is unconvinced. “The alien-megastructure idea runs wrong with my new observations,” he says, as he thinks even advanced aliens wouldn’t be able to build something capable of covering a fifth of a star in just a century. What’s more, such an object should radiate light absorbed from the star as heat, but the infrared signal from Tabby’s star appears normal, he says.
>Sentient swarms of bimolecular particles from KIC 8462852 drift into Earth's atmosphere, attracted by peculiar radio frequencies they had sensed
>Observe Earthlings for the first time ever and witness
>Quarantine the planet
>Return to homeworld via stabilized wormhole
>Continue to harvest 80% net resources from their host star
>We never really meet them
How the fuck could they not? If life could form on this shitty planet under the conditions this planet has, and if the universe is literally just throwing pennies at a wall and seeing what comes up heads, it makes sense that eventually there would be another "Earth" in a similar orbit around a similar star with similar atmospheric and moisture conditions.
Everything is chaos in this universe. It is just pure chaos and random chance. Our lives are fairly ordered (or, at least to our perspective they are) so we don't see it. But it's true.
Or alternatively, is it chaos? Or does it just look like chaos? Can we trust our perspectives? Are we just applying an interpretation of order onto things that are inherently chaotic? Are we biased because we have sentience?
I hate this reality anyway.
>yfw it's picrelated and it will find earth after we send a probe
>as he thinks even advanced aliens wouldn’t be able to build something capable of covering a fifth of a star in just a century
And why not exactly? If they are 'advanced' we can't even speculate what kind of technogy they invented.
I'm sure all intelligent life goes through several periods. We're just going through the early formation of our species, really. We're still very much in the opening stages when you consider the vast cosmic theatre that is playing. 100,000 years is nothing -- to the universe it's a blink of an eye. And even after all that time, we're still only at the "fairly barbaric" stage. We're not unified. We haven't solved problems for our species. We don't have space travel. We haven't solved the energy problem. We need a pressing solution for over population. We need to re-acquaint ourselves with eugenics... using science for the betterment of the whole species. That last one is particularly a squeamish subject for us right now, especially politically.
So an alien race passing us by might understand this, and instead of just shunning us as an immutable fuck-up, they may observe us to gain a better understanding of early sentient species development. Like anthropologists.
>the modern, political theory of nationalism
>existing for 800 years
Son please. Thats tribalism, savagery and later imperialism. Nationalism formed in opposition to that. A nation must be for its people, it cannot exist because of a monarchy, a religion or an empire. That is the basic tenant of nationalism.
But you wouldnt know about any of that because you just spout shit you hear on tv.
Let me guess, you blame socialism for what Hitler did too, it was just as an important part of national socialism as nationalism.
Do you also blame darwin? Nietzsche? They all influenced national socialism as well.
Nationalism existed long before Hitler seiged his first heil you ignorant fucking Russkie.
We exist in a low entropy world as a fluctuation within a higher entropy universe. Even in a near-equilibrium state, there will be stochastic fluctuations in the level of entropy. The most common fluctuations will be relatively small, resulting in only small amounts of organization, while larger fluctuations and their resulting greater levels of organization will be comparatively more rare. Large fluctuations would be almost inconceivably rare, but are made possible by the enormous size of the Universe and by the idea that if we are the results of a fluctuation, there is a "selection bias": we observe this very unlikely Universe because the unlikely conditions are necessary for us to be here, an expression of the anthropic principle.
If our current level of organization, having many self-aware entities, is a result of a random fluctuation, it is much less likely than a level of organization which only creates stand-alone self-aware entities. For every universe with the level of organization we see, there should be an enormous number of lone brains floating around in unorganized environments. In an infinite universe, the number of self-aware brains that spontaneously and randomly form out of the chaos, complete with memories of a life like ours, should vastly outnumber the brains evolved from an inconceivably rare local fluctuation the size of the observable Universe.
In all likelihood, you are not even reading this anonymous message board. You're simply a self aware observer that spontaneously appeared in the depths of the void, 'experiencing' a memory, all your memories in an instant, before your spark fizzles out at quickly as it appeared.
That's just plain heresy. You must be purged.
trying to empathise with superior races and minds is difficult
i expect if they exist they are so powerful they could eliminate us at any moment, and also that they are protected from anything we could do to them - for now
they would easily be able to monitor our development and see what we're capable of releasing from our atmosphere. they'd have a general idea of how far away we are from developing something that might be a problem to them.
by the time we're a problem to them they can contact us and say don't be a problem or we will make you disappear
what do we do then? fight? it'd be lunacy, we'd accept we won't be a problem and then try and learn what we're allowed to learn
How crazy would it be if the gods of religions came back down from the sky. Everyone btfo
Socialism is an ideology concerning strictly the inner workings of a country. Nationalism can't exist without a war machine.
And no, I don't blame Darwin, a fucking monkey zoologist, for Nazi genocides!
Emperor damn these heretics ITT
its been progressively getting dimmer/more covered for over 100 years
could it be that it's a new way of sun death/life cycle we havnt yet seen? although it'd be the first and incredibley rare, there's always anomalies and in a big enough universe you're going to see some unexpected shit happen like a sun going out slowly like a lamp
I reject your proposal on the grounds that life is replicative and as a result, non-stochastic. Furthermore, you fail to address the difference between true intelligence and the qualia that gives rise to thought, memory and experience.
Any stochastic intelligence that naturally forms will not necessarily have the sensory abilities necessary to gather relevant information and furthermore the means to propagate information beyond itself.
Thus your proposal re: stochastic natural intelligences somewhat misses the point. "Artificial" living intelligences may be limited by the filter of biological limitations, but will rapidly increase in numbers and will be equipped with the sensory and mechanical faculties necessary for knowledge propagation.
What good is intelligence if your brain is empty?
the only problem with this. 1:most intelligent creatures in the universe are going to be bipedal huminoids with short necks, and large craniums.2: is that I doubt any species in the galaxy could become a top tier intelligent predator capable of making fire without learning to befriend one another and having developed sense for emotion. As on our planet all intelligent creatures are also very emotional. 3: on earth, our enemies have become worth more alive in terms of potential trade and human labor than the cost of war + little plunder ever acquired. Thus leading me to the conclusion that if an alian species could travel at the speed of light, they wouldn't hesitate to stop by for a peaceful visit to trade technology. Even if an alien species's technology is thunderheads of leagues above our own, our different cultures and circumstances might lead us to make different innovations and inventions. They might wish to colonize part of our planet, then exterminate us. However I really don't think they'd just blow up the whole planet
>Humans discover ancient stargate inside a previously-undiscovered Mayan temple
>Travel through it to a world much like Earth
>See advanced Mayan culture there
>See advanced Mayans make a sacrificial offering of a 17yo virgin to their gods
>Nationalism can't exist without a war machine.
Nothing can exist without a 'war machine' you fucking idiot. Every country has one, every country requires one. Whether they're communist, fascist, socialist, capitalist, every nation has had a standing army, a 'war machine', or they've relied on the protection of another nation with its 'war machine'.
To say something is bad because it 'cannot exist without a war machine' means that everything western civilization has created is bad as well. The artist cannot create when the barbarian is balls deep in his asshole.
Let me give a potential example.
This megastructure we are witnessing could be the result of a species on a planet creating a dyson sphere. So why did they build it? Perhaps their planet is only 1.5 billion years old and not 6 billion like ours. They simply lack petrol and had energy created from sun, wind, and geothermal. After population grew so big they had to remove wind farms, and put their solar panels into orbit to save precious space. They might not have any clue as to how or what petrol is or its uses. Thus meaning that our planet harbors both natural resources, and untapped technology by many already advanced intelligent species. And other intelligent species realize this, and we realize this about them. They are also willing to build a massive billboard that says "WE;RE RIGHT HERE FUCKERS" so they probably don't fear destruction as
>And now you reddit tier dingo fucker will explain how a conscious brain can spontaneously "appear" without being part of a living creature and evolving for thousands of years to become bigger and smarter.
>Years being of any significance at all
Time is relative.
Your years are a universes femtosecond.
It is simply a matter of probability. In an infinite universe, what is more likely to occur and with what frequency?
A planet that can not only support life, but has life, intelligent life, capable of reading this anonymous message board.
Or, a system of particles and gasses that exists somewhere and at some time in the universe, spontaneously fluctuating into an organized system that can mimic the activity of a human brain, complete with memories, including the memory of reading this anonymous message board post.
In all of time, all of space, which is most likely to occur and with what frequency?
Well, actually I meant the kind of war machine that actually wages wars, because a true nationalist economy cannot be sustained without threatening, attacking or conquering other countries. But anyway, I wonder what kind of a war machine does Australia have? Infantry dingo gunners? Armored kangaroo mounts? Air-land tactical koala nukes?
>star goes dim
You now realize movie Battle of los angeles was a warning
Or they are neurological phenomena which explains why their have been accounts of it with various cultural clothing throughout the ages (demons, ghosts, gods, fairy people, aliens).
Magnetic fields, carbon-monoxide poisoning, sleep paralysis, night terrors, epilepsy and various psychiatric conditions can cause the sensation and even concrete illusion of others, or being taken and examined/tortured.
Even being alone in a quiet dark place can lead to otherly sensations as the brain fills in the lack of external information with internally generated material.
Ok, while I agree there is a highly probable chance they exist, there is almost no chance they have or will ever interact with us.
Face it. Space is too large to conquer, it will probably be impossible to reach other beings without dying of old age in the journey.
Chances are, they're in the same boat.
Mega structure harnessing energy from a star. How do you think aliens power their shit? Gasoline and combustion? It's all light energy, humans will learn how to do the same too eventually.
>space is too large they said
If there is a sun so big compared to our sun, there is a planet so big compared to our planet, and there are living things so big compared to us.
A true nationalist economy requires 'threatening, attacking or conquering other countries'? you really have no idea what nationalism is do you?
The modernist interpretation of nationalism states that nationalist economies are capable of self sustaining a society with a central authority to maintain that self sustaining nature. Thats it.
You've been bitten by the 'all nationalists were just like the Nazi's' bug.
Look, a lone sentient flying penis theoretically is also more likely to occur than a male human with a penis - doesn't mean that a penis can just support itself without a body. You would need to prove that: a) such a gaseous construction can exist at all; b) it would actually be less complex than a guy with a brain made out of meat and tissue.
This star is actually the first observation of a previously unknown event. In between the star and our line of sight, there is a tear in the space-time continuum. It's not a black hole as it is not a gravitational phenomena. With that said, physics won't be able (or willing) to directly state this for a decade or more. They may never admit it.
You're missing the point.
You know how big of a freak of nature (on earth) humanity is?
The chances of that happening again would mean that comparable life wouldn't be in any close surrounding galaxy to us, let alone our galaxy.
Then you think about how big our solar system is, how huge the distance is to the next star, then the next, then picture the size of the galaxy.
We are not alone, but we are definitely isolated to the point we'll never contact a species like humanity.
Hence why we haven't met with one yet.
A central authority... A strong leader... Hmm, where have I heard this before?...
But the universe is not infinitely large or infinitely old.
It is 14 billion years old, and not infinitely large. The chances that a random system mimics human thought is so absurdly low it simply cannot have happened even a single time.
Similarly, over 100 billion human minds have formed on Earth alone through the last 100 million years.
Your idea is nonsense since you're basically claiming that there have been more human intelligences in the universe forming randomly alone in 14bil years than humans on Earth.
To a race that was bigger than us by an incredible factor travelling distances would be reduced by an incredible factor.
Look at the image and compare our sun to some ones we have seen (and imagine those we have not yet) and then consider it is no big deal for some advanced giant race to travel incredible distances in our eyes.
Literally ants watching men fly planes. An ant can't fathom how a human can travel such great distances so quickly, but we do easily.
They better hurry up and invade us so I can invade their women
Something huge or a lot of very small somethings. Small somethings capable of turning the light energy into something other than heat. Something like... hordes of self-replicating machines.
Holy shit... I've never actually thought of that. What if a star like VY Canis Majoris has a habitable planet orbiting it, and the creatures from there are like 1000 times bigger than humans?
>Look at the image and compare our sun to some ones we have seen (and imagine those we have not yet) and then consider it is no big deal for some advanced giant race to travel incredible distances in our eyes.
Are you suggesting atoms, that make up the proteins required for life, are bigger in some places?
Because you sound like you have no understanding of fundamental physics.
If life occurs, there is little chance they'll be any bigger or smaller than us.
>Comparing ants to sophisticated life like humans, mentions ants watching planes
again. Physics is UNIVERSAL.
The us watching aliens = ants watching us; argument does not work out.
That's why we need to utilize cloning.
We set up automated systems and send massive probes towards life sustaining planets.
We set the cloning process to start 12 years before the probe approaches. We have automated systems to educate the first generation and they become the pioneer founding fathers and mothers who colonize the planets with the assistance of the second and third generation of clones. Then they are left to natural breeding and their own devices. But we instruct them to send signal back to earth of a mission successful through whatever means they can. Hopefully their message gets back before we are gone but the important thing is human life goes on.
There is no reason for humanity not to focus on spreading humanity to all habitable planets.
Perhaps we can at the very least create artificial life capable of succeeding where we fail.
>i will surrender
>humanity, ever surrendering
You sound really stupid. You think I'm talking about atoms?
Or do you think I'm saying VY Canis has bigger atoms? Or are you just enjoying arguing and not using your brain to think?
The brain might only exist for a split second. It might be constant.
It merely thinks that it is an evolved life form on earth that requires a body. It is simply dreaming an unreal dream about the environment around itself.
Consciousness that operates in a space we would consider extra-dimensional is certainly not out of the question, and anything that could exist in dimensions we can not observe can not be proven to obey the laws as we know them.
Let's list some of the reasons why this idea is idiotic.
How would giant aliens evolve?
How would a single organism of that size travel in space?
How would a single organism be able to coordinate biological functions across millions of miles?
How would it survive? What would it eat? How would it breathe or take in New nutrients? How would it avoid black holes?
>yfw its all just aliens covering trillions of suns with dyson spheres that are too dark to see.
It has to be something orbiting the star causing the light blocking, because it happens on a regular interval.
Remember, they are also confused because comets and planets are incapable of the light blocking we are seeing.
The only non ayy theory I see as being plausible is perhaps a brown dwarf orbiting it? But, if it was really there and that massive, we would probably be able to know that by now.
A giant star is gonna have bigger planets orbiting it. Bigger planets = bigger and stronger creatures. Aliens would have to be miles long and have a thick stone shell in order to survive on a planet 1000 times bigger than Earth.
The distances involved in space travel are so great that even were it possible that creatures the size of the earth existed, it would not measurably change how fast they could travel from one star to another.
More importantly, as far as we know The Universe has a hard speed limit: The speed of light.
So even if we ignore that more massive objects are going to need a lot more energy to get moving, they can't got any faster than a photon.
You seem to think intelligence is linked to brain size rather than neuro-connections.
Do you think that the ENIAC was a better computer than the modern smart phone just because of it's size.
It's possible there could be beings made of more atoms than humans or with atoms more spread out than ours.
It's equally possible ants, or even micro-organisms like viruses possess intelligence. We just see them as small and insignificant and therefore incapable of intelligence.
>You sound really stupid. You think I'm talking about atoms?
You're not talking directly about them, but they play an important role in what you've said.
You can't just have organisms on a giant scale like that. Sure life on earth got reasonably big, but nothing on the scale like you're suggesting.
It breaks the laws of physics to have organisms that large, when it's almost certain they'd have similar makeup to ours, (or in the case of those in methane filled environments like titan, smaller makeups)
Bigger is almost not possible. Well not on your scale.
>he thinks even advanced aliens wouldn’t be able to build something capable of covering a fifth of a star in just a century.
This is something I've never understood. There's a possibility that there is a species of alien out there that is MASSIVE compared to us. so to them building something this big might not seem like a challenge.
Anyway it's probably comets.
>Schaefer saw the same century-long dimming in his manual readings, and calculated that it would require 648,000 comets, each 200 kilometres wide, to have passed by the star – completely implausible
It's probably a really far out asteroid belt around the star. At least that's what I imagine which would explain why there's nothing for a long time and then all of a sudden a couple thousand of these rocks (and a planetoid) can dim the star. No way it's aliums lads. One explanation for the lack of aliens is the belief that more advanced species become microscopic and enter black holes to hide.
Do you need a schooling in evolution? You don't know why dinosaurs were bigger than animals today?
You can't see how if a planet with more oxygen due to being larger existed then larger organisms could and would evolve from microscopic lifeforms?
>Consciousness that operates in a space we would consider extra-dimensional is certainly not out of the question, and anything that could exist in dimensions we can not observe can not be proven to obey the laws as we know them.
I am sceptical about that. I don't think a species in 3 dimensions will be able to develop technology involving more. I think it's far too impractical.
>How would a single organism be able to coordinate biological functions across millions of miles?
Gee I don't know. How the fuck does a jellyfish become immortal? Nature finds a way.
good thing wee have strong BBC to compete with them :^)
Planets ten times our size have too much gravity and pressure to support complex life. Most of them are gas giants.
Life is a very fickle thing. If you want truly large you'd have to check lightless oceans on small moons. Then you would get some fucking freaking shit that could be gargantuan. it would be unable to do anything complex for lack of biomes, however, creating an inability to manipulate resources. Much like the dolphins are very smart but cannot do shit compared to us.
>How would giant aliens evolve?
Same way as humans evolved alongside bugs and fleas.
>How would a single organism of that size travel in space?
What size? An alien from Canis Majoris system would theoretically be 3000 times bigger than a human. So... like a crowd of people at a concert, only a few miles long/tall. They would build giant spaceships out of the plentiful resources on their giant planet.
>How would a single organism be able to coordinate biological functions across millions of miles?
No, only about 1-3 square miles...
>How would it survive? What would it eat? How would it breathe or take in New nutrients? How would it avoid black holes?
Easily - it would be only like a mile tall. Still enough to terrify the puny humans and stomp their planet into dust.
Just read the article. The star is dimming, that's it. That is all we know. All this mega-structure bullshit is just thrown in to sell papers.
You increase the overall capacity of oxygen by increasing the size of the planet and you increase the potential of the organism to grow.
Like >>61168272 said you scale us up and just follow accordingly.
Why do you think a 10x bigger earth wouldn't have 10x bigger humans?
Would have to be huge numbers of huge objects to cause that level of dimming at any sort of great distance from the star. If those sort of numbers of those size of objects exist we'd have seen evidence for them elsewhere by now.
>1480 light years away
>we are seeing what was technically happening to that star 1480 years ago
>the star is already dead and the anomaly has moved on
>maybe towards us
Lube up your anuses and prepare to fire all your nukes, ayy lmaos are coming.
square cube law, they'd be giant fucking balloon-noodles with the entirety of their neural mass making up the whole of their body, skin, muscles, and guts all told
get your colanders out, lads
So would you say that 100 billion human minds is typical of the universe, or a rare occurrence?
Would you discount the idea that a disembodied brain could spontaneously appear in a region of the universe, at some time during the 'life' of the universe.
If you consider the theory of eternal inflation, which loosely speaking suggests that our universe constantly sprouts new self-contained regions, like bubbles popping up in a bubble bath. We live in just one of those regions and have no access to the others, which could be very different from ours.
What are the odds of a disembodied brain appearing now?
It's completely plausible that this is an advanced race of aliens harvesting energy from a star, it could even be alien AI whose creators perished some time in the past.
From the article
>as he thinks even advanced aliens wouldn’t be able to build something capable of covering a fifth of a star in just a century.
This is the problem, people have no idea what talking about, these ETs could have been around for millennia and have broken all scientific barriers to - everything.
You can't compare them to us and try to come up with a hypothesis because in the grand scheme of things we're still extremely primitive.
>100 years ago was using horse and buggy
>2016 barely put toe in stellar waters.
>only stepped foot on our moon.
>speaks with such authority that we'll never go as fast as light.
Get out of here with your defeatism. We will go lightspeed
>Planets ten times our size have too much gravity and pressure to support complex life. Most of them are gas giants.
Any source on this? I expect a 10x larger sun would solve that problem
>Bigger planets = bigger and stronger creatures. Aliens would have to be miles long and have a thick stone shell in order to survive on a planet 1000 times bigger than Earth.
Seems logical right? Wrong - the proteins required for life wouldn't sustain life like that.
Proteins are 100% confirmed needed to have life, whether in oxygenated atmosphere or not.
You guy's aren't thinking on a biological level enough.. i'm talking about the nitty gritty about the building blocks of life and mixing it with the universal laws of physics. What is right here, is the same everywhere.
Don't even get me started on how such a planet would hold itself like earth with such intense gravity - how would atmospheres stay above a solid mass? wouldn't they all end up like jupiter?
Sure, some larger earth like planets may hold life, but again, not a scale large enough to make space travel that significantly better.
>Why do you think a 10x bigger earth wouldn't have 10x bigger humans?
Do you even have to ask this?
Why are creatures at the bottom of the oceans, the very bottom, smaller than the creatures at the top and middle?
You can;t just have infinitely large creatures, gravity and air pressure play a pivotal role in the evolution of any respirating creature.
>Why do you think a 10x bigger earth wouldn't have 10x bigger humans?
Because a 10x bigger earth would be unlikely to sustain itself like earth. It'd start to form more like jupiter or other gas giants.
>What are the odds of a disembodied brain appearing now?
0, because human beings have never witnessed the spontaneous creation of any large object. We have only witnessed virtual particle creation.
Seems like you have misunderstood the energy requirements necessary to spontaneously generate matter in a vacuum - pro tip: it's very high.
Not necessarily. We would certainly be stockier in order to move in the stronger gravity. Bigger size would be a good way to accomplish this but so would lowering our center of mass by having shorter and more muscular legs for example.
the local universe might be a gaseous spontaneous brain for all we know, and our biological selves are just it playing out its many thoughts and remembrances of a former life that didn't exist
If you are a disembodied brain then all your ideas about history, your memory, the laws of physics and the rules of logic have all just fluctuated into your brain. And therefore you have no right to believe them because other laws, incorrect laws, could also have fluctuated into your brain.
>Any source on this? I expect a 10x larger sun would solve that problem
>size of sun, made entirely out of gas and with any sort of size BECAUSE IT IS GAS has to to do with the gravity issues of such a large planet
if anything, gas giants prove larger life is impossible. I don't see why a bigger sun will do anything but make it less likely that there are large planets able to sustain life.
Atoms are the same here as there. The bond issues for the atoms on such planets are the same.
Hence why jupiter is a gas giant. The gravity is so great it won't be anything but a gas giant.
Well originally we were shorter and stockier, we evolved quite recently to be taller . so we could both be right. the point is, bigger life forms could evolve on a bigger planet. Obviously mass is relative, gravity, atmosphere etc..
Why does alien life have to be how you all define it?
Maybe its nothing like us.
Maybe its a shapeshifting blob made up of nothing resembling the structure of life on earth.
Why not?? Maybe there are intelligent airborne particles.
>Even if it was ayy lmaos, would that be so surprising? knowing how vast the universe is, believing we are the only special snowflakes in this vastness just proves how retarded everyone is.
Obviously intelligent extra-terrestrial lifeforms exist somewhere out there. But for them to be close enough to observe would be both unheard of, and terrifying.
Do you realize that right now there are Whales that can survive insane amounts of pressure AND pressure change without any issue? In fact the surface pressure you would experience on a massive planet would be a lot easier to accommodate for than the deep ocean.
>>Change the entire environment in which an organism lives on
>>still expects a human sized thing to show up
This argument again?
Atom size does not change, at certain temperatures it's impossible for certain atoms, molecules and compounds to form an atmosphere.
This means that molecules in amospheres cannot be significantly larger than out own atmosphere molecules. It's not physically possible..
Stop believing the chance for contactable intelligent life, it's just so fucking unlikely it's depressing.
We are freaks people. Freaks of nature.
I don't have time, just look into planet formation. There will be exceptions to the thought process but there are, barring extremely rare scenarios, limits to the growth of any planet, especially with regard to atmosphere that can sustain life vs choke it to death.
I'm going to buy a powerful transmittor and transmit "WEW LADS AYY LMAO" to them nonstop for the next hundred years
Expect them to come to us bringing memes within whatever amount of lightyears they're away x2
Square cube law is about increasing the size of a pre-existing object. Like growing a mouse into an elephant - of course it would die from being squashed by gravity. But if such a creature evolved through thousands of years, gaining mountain-like legs and titanic skeletal bones... well, the existence of 3 km^2 crabs in the VY system still cannot be disproven...
>So a black hole got in the way. This doesn't mean ay lmaos.
"Black holes (besides hypothesized primordial ones) have a minimum mass a few (1.5 to 3) solar masses, since they form by overcoming the Chandrasekhar mass limit for neutron stars (Tolman–Oppenheimer–Volkoff limit). A Black Hole sufficiently close to a main sequence star to accrete its outer hull would form a fast-rotating binary system with the star, usually causing high radial velocities relative to Earth. This would cause a considerable oscillation of the Doppler shift of the spectrum of the star, and would hence be immediate by spectral observations. "
So not a black hole either.
He's right of course. Different gravity (or as old mate says 'physics') will change how much pressure an object can sustain. You are literally applying earth gravity to other planets where the results would change.
You probably don't do science you moron, why you're talking.
To prove life could appear somewhere else, we have to create it in labs from A to Z, or whe have to find it somewhere else. And that's science discours, not a fucking belief like religious morons does it blindly.
>muh 6 gozilliards galaxies
Science isn't dogmatic. There could be 10^189 galaxies, if we don't know the scale of parameters to make it happen, we can't fucking say it.
Conclusion, we don't know for the moment.
It's not possible for creatures that size to exist in this universe but say a creature that size exists, then time relativity comes into play. If that creature say takes millions of years to travel few thousand light years, from its perspective it takes it a lot less time.
Earth physics, universe physics, same thing. Unless you discover another universe created differently, you won't find different laws of physics.
stop shitposting australia
Massive planets like that cause their gaseous atmospheres to go supercritical, which makes it impossible to have any organic earth like animal live there.
Look at Venus, it is a failed gas giant, now imagine Venus with 10x the gravity, it would become a gas giant.
I don't feel like doing the calculations right now but I'm pretty sure amplifying earths gravity 10x would make the atmosphere supercritical, or otherwise reduce all organic life on the surface to that of deep sea creatures if we ignore the fact that the temperature would rise to unsustainable levels.
>Atom size does not change
No one said it did. Are you retarded? Give an example of of said molecules and compounds and then explain why not only would you need that specific compound to make life but why it not existing now makes it impossible.
>you will never be a space explorer
>you will never discover an alien species
>and fuck it
hold me brehs
>You seem to think intelligence is linked to brain size rather than neuro-connections.
I never even suggested that..
>Do you think that the ENIAC was a better computer than the modern smart phone just because of it's size.
Stop this logical fallacy shit, there is a point where bigger is impossible
>It's possible there could be beings made of more atoms than humans or with atoms more spread out than ours.
correct: see dinosaur, but im talking about the size suggested earlier which would make space travel insignificant for them - impossible with our physics.
>It's equally possible ants, or even micro-organisms like viruses possess intelligence. We just see them as small and insignificant and therefore incapable of intelligence.
also correct, but it is unlikely they think to our degree of intelligence. That'd take ALOT more natural selection (and I mean an impossible amount) to occur.
Daily reminder that we already know 17 Dyson Sphere candidates besides this one
sing the Low Resolution Spectrometer yielded 17 ambiguous candidates of which four were slightly amusing but still ambiguous and questionable. The largest one sun bolometric distance in the 17 source sample is 118 pc. The 11000 source Calgary sample extended down to 1-2 Jy which would have given a maximum bolometric distance of 300 pc for LRS sources. This region includes something like a million stars.
I think you are straight up fucking retarded.
With a larger sun the gravity on the larger planet does not put the same pressure on the same sized large planets in our solar system.
Explain why you think a large planet, relative to a large sun, would be unable to be like earth
Because of the distance of this star and possible planets near it, time dilation and time distortion would play a role. They could have visited us already and we wouldn't know because of closed timeline curves and the fact each timeline is protected. Meaning a time traveller or space traveller that travels near speeds of light, goes back in time and visits Earth would not be able to interact with anything, they could only observe, they could theoretically be watching us from their future but we can't see them on Earth yet because they don't exist.
But if this is a Dyson Sphere or some sort of advanced technology then you can bet we're being spied on because if we can see their technology, they can fucking see us.
>That'd take ALOT more natural selection (and I mean an impossible amount) to occur.
>there is an ape right now on an watery rock hitting a piece of plastic trying to tell everyone how impossible and unlikely sentient life is and how it can't evolve in anyway except for which he did
toppest kek of 2016
>No one said it did
I know, that's because every fucking poster except a few are not realising it's importance and how it's intrinsically connected to your argument.
As for the molecules?
The only examples i can think is the make up of titan, mars, several smaller moons and venus as objects with a solid mass with an atmosphere. They have smaller or insignificantly larger molecules in the atmosphere, nothing with metals or whatever in the atmosphere (large HEAVY metals that is).
Large heavier metals would occur at such large masses or at least ALOT of smaller molecules/atoms (like jupiter)
Nothing I can think of, with of has a mass the size significantly (by a humongous degree) larger than earth
H20 : most common liquid in visible universe.
Carbon : with silicium, only element allowing 4 bonds respecting VSEPR rules, except the silicium is very different according to the stability of molecules it forms.
The probability we meet a life based on ADN system is much higher than the opposite.
Structures change, but not the rules.
>>there is an ape right now on an watery rock hitting a piece of plastic trying to tell everyone how impossible and unlikely sentient life is and how it can't evolve in anyway except for which he did
>There is a nobhead who can't understand why it is only an ape, and not an ape the size of a star.
Seriously? Just because there might not be life just like us, doesn't mean they'll differ that much to us when it is physically impossible to have beings of that size.
Atmospheric Pressure caused by gravity.
I think you believe that atmospheres just scale upwards and grow thinner and thinner, which it is true that they do.
There is a way to calculate this, I'm just lazy. But to have an identical earth atmosphere on a planet with 10x earths gravity would fuck everything, the biosphere would end at less than a 1000 feet and every single rock bigger than 10 feet would be an extinction level impact. Everything above 1 foot would be devastating
>doesn't believe in sentient gas clouds
>tfw you realize we are the space gyppos
Living on outskirts of galaxy, nigger tier culture, we breed like rabits, uneducated, primitive language, we fight for anything and every shitty excuse, whole environment is a fucking mess, shit ton of debris floating around our system and planet, worst slum on outskirts of a city and we are fucking IT.
No I do not. Natural selection has this thing called 'covergent evolution'
Meaning there are infallible patterns to how life originate.
Now maybe if life did life like us and then became such beings, maybe. But even then, there are so many physical problems I don't know where to start.
>yes I realise you're taking the micky, shame on me
Not if we could utilize wormholes. Casimir effect to create negative energy to open up a wormhole.
But you would need an immense amount of energy to do this but it's not completely physically and mathematically impossible as you say. Just very, very difficult with current technology.
Earth is very near to the scale where any planet with much more mass reaches the point that it is too much for a chemical rocket to break orbit. Any giant aliens are either super non dense or stuck on their planet.
Sorry bro, no Zentradi for you.
>not more than a few centuries ago people feared going on trains because the smartest minds back then told them that the speed would, atleast, decapitate them
>people thought flying was impossible, now its the most used way of transportation
>people thought we would be incapable of making a space rocket that could re-land and therefore be re-used
>it would take decades before we had the technology
>fucking Elon did it a few weeks ago and nobody cared
It's special snowflake syndrome. The monkey brain wants to be the most special little thing there has ever been, so therefore everything more advanced than what we have now is stupid to them, because they cant control their egos.
We humans came from the chaos. By WW2 we tamed the atom. Few years later we conquered fission. We can make what is essentially miniature stars, and people say we have reached the top.
You are so fucking dumb.
I think this is what I was trying to say earlier, only my field of study isn't physics like this guy.
He's saying the specific outcomes that would occur with the 'insanely huge earth'
"A contraption which displays upon itself paintings that move? capable of returning the time and temperature of the day and able to access a wide archive of knowledge while letting an acquaintance across the Atlantic speak to you over tea face to face while moving nary an inch? All in a form that fits snugly upon the palm?
What poppycock. A physical and mathematical impossibility."
(You) circa 1822
7 million light years from us, same rule of physics apply.
1 and 1 will always equal 2.
Hydrogen will be hydrogen.
Carbon will be carbon.
Universe is a magical place, but in a form of speech, it's basic rules are quite well understood by scientists. You won't find 8km tall giants anywhere in universe.
Life anywhere would be similar in most ways to what we have on Earth.
>thinking our understanding of physics today is similar to the same era THAT STILL BELIEVED IN WITCHES
The renaissance only occurred shortly before that you realise? Physics has developed staggeringly.
That and most physics today have been discovered by smart people only possibly that intelligent because of the drastic population increase.
And many other issues with that argument.
It's not known why but it's theorized the dinosaurs reached their size due to increased oxygen levels.
A planet with more mass and more oxygen would have an environment that fostered a race to be much larger than us.
>A planet with more mass and more oxygen would have an environment that fostered a race to be much larger than us.
Yes, no one doubts that. But we're talking beings the size with stars.
That's pants on head retarded.
No, everything does not point to a dyson sphere
For starters, Dyson spheres are physically impossible. Such a structure not only requires materials with properties we don't even know can exist, but it is also fundamentally unstable and will impact the star it is built around.
It could be a Dyson SWARM, but even so, I struggle to believe it would be absorbing 100% of the energy without giving off any waste heat.
I find it far more likely that this is a natural dimming of the star for unknown reasons.
Yes and too much oxygen could mean something else.
8 km tall giants definitely won't exist.
I'm not a biologist or physicist, I'm just telling you the basics: you need to account shitload of factors when considering things like this.
You just took one factor.
I disagree. There are thousands of new discoveries every years in mathematics ! IN MATHEMATICS
Otherwise, we still don't know how to mix quantum mecanics and relativity. There are a lot to discover, or to rediscover.
You're forgetting the fact that the more we look, the more physical anomalies we are finding, pointing towards our models of the universe are not only wrong, but could be laughably simple minded. And intelligence is heavily biased, considering your thoughts and arguments are only deemed valuable if you've spend the good part of a lifetime and economy on a piece of paper.
And with the drastic population increase, the ideas increase too. There could be several thousands of people with the answers to all our questions who will never be heard or taken seriously because they live in an isolated village in Poo-in-looLand.
We are all retarded monkeys glorifying ourselves because we are tiny and meaningless in the grand scheme of things.
Nobody talked about a specific body travelling in the speed of light, perfectly defined by its only molecular shape, that wouldn't have any sense.
Mathematically, a small part of space could travel at the speed of light , refering to the space itself.
Here my friend.
Wow, people need to learn how to physics fast.
It is, but it's also the biggest body of water in our solar system outside Earth. Under the ice is a liquid ocean that spans the entire planet/moon/whatever.
It's not hard to imagine something living under there.
>Otherwise, we still don't know how to mix quantum mechanics and relativity.
But we don't need to, that's the point.
It's simpler physics that's the problem.
That and the logic used when asking "why haven't we been contacted." I doubt aliens would idly sit by and observe. We humans would never do that, we'd fuck everything.
That being said im open for the possibility for beings who while similar to us, came out less inquisitive as us. But I doubt such a race would be able to develop their understanding of the universe like us.
We stick our fingers into things and thats what makes our physics understanding so developed.
If there were other beings more developed than us, we'd already know about it by now. They would either do what we do and stick their fingers in, or much worse.
>a bunch of people who's job is to observe the stars, expert in the field, find something that is out of place and has never been recorded before since we started observing the stars with high technology
>/pol/ fags say it's just a black hole, sunspot, meteorite, etc.
>And with the drastic population increase, the ideas increase too. There could be several thousands of people with the answers to all our questions who will never be heard or taken seriously because they live in an isolated village in Poo-in-looLand.
I did think about that, but realised >>61171771
The physics and even the theory of evolution suggests that we are either alone here, or uncontactable.
/pol/ is a place of discussion.
People are discussing things, I know it might be hard for ex communist nations to wrack their feeble little minds around this but this is a place of freedom.
Freedom my dear gommunist the USSR is gone now, it's okay for you to come out of the closet. Come now and be free!
Lovecraft might have had an idea about that m8.
On a serious note, though: probably something microscopic.
The chemical processes that might occur in a different environment might not obey our laws we designed on Earth.
Europa has tides caused Jupiter and possibly a molten core.
If it has a molten core, it is possible extremophiles could survive, just like they do near thermal vents in earths oceans.
Simple life. It would have to rely on some form of chemosynthesis, as the sun is too far away to take advantage of photosynthesis. Pond scum, basically.
>Higgs particulate is a theoretical particle that jumps back in time and then re-appears in the present
Or something, I forgot. Like I said when we unlock the full Higgs field we'll be able to understand matter in better detail and convert it to more than the known 4 states. Ripping holes in the fabric of matter and creating portals.
Watch this space baby.
While obviously this >>61171719
Again, we're talking about beings of astronomical size that would treat europa like a small rock.
It's impossible, but i don't disagree with possible life on europa, it's significantly smaller.