Music Production Thread: Late Night Edition
>autistic "HURRR Y DON'T YOU USE X DAW / VST" faggots need no apply
Post work in progress, critique, ask questions, share tips, pretend you're a "noise artist" because you run recordings of your farts through some effects
made this weird shit really really late last night. I don't even know what to think of it. Thoughts?
Here's a half assed screenshot of the session.
Not bad but it isn't too exciting....you obviously know what you're doing, so mad props to you if that's the sound you're after. You're one of the producers I've seen here that has consistent quality work, even when its not my cup of tea
Also, as someone else told you yesterday, go easy on the sidechaining. It sounds a bit outdated
Thanks man, I really struggle with getting something exciting happening on my songs, I mean it's never really my intention. I really love the pulsing sound of a massive sidechained kick haha, I guess it is a bit outdated but a few of my favourite artists like to use it a lot and I just love the movement it puts in a track. It's a bad habit I know though.
Yeah I feel like my "production" knowledge is decent, I just struggle with composition I guess.
Something to work on.
>I really struggle with getting something exciting happening on my songs
This used to happen to me until I started to have my "jamming" sessions after smoking a joint. It doesn't make you a better artist but at least for me, it allows me to hear a lot of intricacies and I can easily find interesting stuff that I highly doubt I would've ever noticed while sober. I do my edits/mixing sober tho.
Another thing that helped me was to change my workflow. When I got sick of programming drums I went ahead and recorded my own drum sounds by banging pots on my bathtub. Or recorded jam sessions on tape then re-arrange them. Anything to challenge myself. I honestly think when you "know" what you're doing is when production becomes boring: to me the unexpected is what makes it worth it.
I produce very different stuff from yours so there's that....
All good points.
I love doing field recordings then chopping sections out that i think can be used as percussion or ambience. I program my drums using the Ableton Push so there's an element of jamming with my music but yeah, I have made more intense appealing stuff in the past with much more synth work and intricate drums, I enjoy it but i am never even close to happy with my music, It always feels cheap and tacky to me.
I don't really get high or anything so I guess I can't really relate to that haha. I'll just keep pushing to learn new things I think and see where it takes me.
Are there certain aspects of sidechaining that will make a track sound outdated?
I wasn't aware of this until now, and I'm just curious as to what you guys were referring to
What do with vocals? I'm not happy with how they fit into the mix right now.
Any other suggestions are welcome.
i find the piano roll in fl studio to be god tier. its so easy to draw drums and compose shit. its the only thing that keeps me using fl studio.
besides learning how to create my own plugins.
anyone here just does better using the mouse and laptop keyboard rather than the midi controller?
i wish could go back in time and tell myself to just stick with the computer and learn how to make music using programs rather than begging my parents to by a 4k sampler daw keyboard.
but i guess in 2002 there wasnt much options in the computer department as there are now.
Have you used Ableton before? I find it much easier than the FL piano roll.
I use controllers whenever possible, however when im travelling or not at home I use keyboard and mouse and it works just fine, just less efficient.
i thought about it though.
but i do everything in one pattern. and move on to another idea in the next. by the end of it all, ill have like around 100 patterns of finished songs, alternative versions, unfinished songs, ideas, and ect. ill just put the ones i want on the playlist and it will end up being around 28 minutes or 30 minutes of material and i export them individually. that way every song is consistent in the mix.
fl piano roll is pretty flexible, i can copy paste, shift notes.
That sounds really fucking messy.
>fl piano roll is pretty flexible, i can copy paste, shift notes.
Literally every piano roll should be able to do this.
Never could get them to sound good.
if you like trackers instead of piano roll, then its good.
what stands out is the native vst effects and the hexidecimal programming. it caters to programmers more than musicians. if you like mangling samples and entering code. its pretty much an instrument since it already has a sample slicer assigned, and its pretty instant in assignment regards.
but if you prefer using gui knobs or recording your automations, try other daw.
I'm on linux so I am pretty much stuck with Ardour
i've been using renoise 2.8 for a bit, and i like the tracker interface a lot. how are the sample editing capabilties in 3 different from 2.8?
get better softsynths/effects
I've been producing seriously for about a month or so now, and I have released my first track.
I've gotten good reception from my peers, but I would also love /mu/'s opinon/advice for future projects.
i think they added more macro edits and group edits, take a look at the documentation.
again i wish i could go back to like January 2003 and tell my little 14 year old self to not bother my parents in getting a 4k daw keyboard because trackers were efficient back in 2002. even when finding samples and soundfonts were hard I couldve told myself to just invest in sample library disks and dvds and use those and check out freeware plugins if there were and just wait it out until vsts got better. Instead i learned the hard way that in the end, the computer or laptop is the final stage to export to a medium.
With trackers, i couldve just bashed my querty keyboard around if i didnt know midi and call it breakcore since breakcore was the scene back in 2003.
renoise is cool because the octave control, automatic assign, and the effects it comes with as well as the native sampler. But i wish i could incorporate the piano roll from fl studio and ditch the tracker. I also found out that renoise doesnt support some plugins so be careful. also you gotta hold down the right mouse button to record automations, its not good if you are drunk and wanna fuck around.
i started fucking around with fruity loops near the end of 2004 and decided that i should just sit down and learn it and now im too comfortable to with it and dont want to waste any time with other daws. The piano roll is what i need since i can just brush shit down and could possibly export it elsewhere.
as for softsynths, maybe they suck, but its just alot more mobile for me to fuck around. I can update my library and bring it quickly. I bought a korg krome for like 800 at guitar center because i thought my laptop was unreliable after a usb crash and blue screen from the m-audio interface. I was fooled again. korg should be fucking ashamed: the korg krome takes a minute to load up, the pcm sound banks are cheap, the sequencer doesn't allow export to wav to the sd card, it cant sample or read wav samples, you cant make your own pcm banks from samples, and you can only use 5 insert effects at a time or for a full song. I even locked up the keyboard from doing too much automation so i guess the ram is very low. I want to get rid of it. i think ill go back to guitar center and sell it or trade it for sampletank 3 or vienna upgrades.
the only think cool about the korg krome is the arpeggiator: you can control the volume, gate, speed and velocity of the arpegiattion. Like you can hold some random cord down and bring in the arppegiation and its gate, velocity and speed, in and out while the chord you pressed goes uninterrupted; its not monophonic or legato to the arp but you can set it to be too. I don't know any plugin that can replicate that and i doubt any daw does it either because i looked everywhere, ill probably have to study it and make a plugin for it.
if i had the extra wires, wooden housing, and midi keyboard i could probably design and build my own daw that would be alot cheaper, faster, and cooler than what roland, korg, yamaha, ect makes. Ive got a working toshiba satellite laying around to use as the sound module.
dude, i remember getting TAL along timeago and didnt understand what i was doing. i got it again awhile back and they are an underrated plugin.
alot of freeware plugins are better than what you can buy at a vendor.
yeah, renoise is pretty much an instrument a la MPC more than a daw. But you can bring in vsts and plugins but some dont work well. I got good at the piano roll, so i can draw drums faster and compose with more visuals.
when you mean softsynths you mean software synthesizers and not samplers right?
vst samplers are just multisampled instruments that are convieniently packed up and programed to respond to keyboard inputs or sequenced automation. you can make your own in direct wave by adding forte and pianisimo samples on top of eachother. But what stands out is the audio engineers workmanship and the mix. i.e. a realistic piano doesnt have everything tuned exacly the same.
as for synthisizers, alot of them can replicate what analog does. its just how you mix them.
in the end. your final mix will be digitized to get to the masses. even when vinyls are pressed, they use the digitized final mix waveform exported from pro tools or whatnot. Though, vinyl would be great for handcranked players if there were an emp blast or no electricity.
yeah there are a ton of great free vsts out there
some of my favs:
>when you mean softsynths you mean software synthesizers and not samplers right?
Yeah, although I don't use either. I record a bunch of samples, piano, guitar, drumming, whatever, and mess around with them in ableton.
Was talking about >>51844828 though.
piano and other shit is pretty much in the bag as far as virtual instruments go, you can even get an effect pedal simulator thats really good. But guitar and drums seem to be almost as good. there are Drum samplers that are good depending on your taste. But guitar virtual instruments are not there yet, almost. then again they sound like this when you play it on keyboard: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mfjotHLozt4
so guitar virtual instruments are probably as real sounding but its in the way you play it; to sound like a guitar, you gotta limit polyphony to 6 keys and play accordingly.
Anyone know how to add an EQ by default to samples dragged into ableton's drum rack? I've tried adding EQ to an empty simpler instance and then dragging it into the default folder in the browser but it doesn't register that there's an EQ added.
Are there anybody there experienced with international shipping and handling for their self-released CD's?
I'm planning to press Digipak CD's for a future release and do all the s&h myself via bandcamp, but I don't want to have them break when shipped overseas. I'm a complete noob at this, there's an option with the pressing plant to add wrapping, but I don't know if that's a safe bet, are there more things I should consider? Do you package the CD and case ceparately, encase it in cardboard or something? Class 1-letters typically have some form of bubble wrap with the post office but I hear bending can be an issue.
Secondly, what kind of weights do you deal with? I hear digipaks are around 100g, but the pressing plant claims they're 300g a piece (I assume for a 4 panel with plastic, CD inside and all that jazz), together with further protection this could rise rapidly and I don't want to ramp up shipping costs too much.
I've tried googling my way around but haven't found enough details, it's just a mess of pressing plant ads and people discussing their favorite japanese expert jewel cases.
Click simpler, click shift EQ, right click -> group instruments, click show chain list or macros (far left, under the power button), click save button
if you want to tie EQs to specific samples you need to create chains in the chain list
are you one of those dudes that writes whole drum phrases in one piano roll? i would hate to do that, even if i do put the drums into the piano roll i still throw them into different patterns
is the cd manufacturing plant shipping them out, or are they sending them to you to ship out? If it's the latter, just put them in one of those bubble mailers. they're a couple of bucks at the post office, but i'm sure you can get a better deal somewhere else. they're 50 cents at my local dollar store.
the idea is that i dont have to switch between patterns as much and i can look at where i am when i enable "see all other instruments".
i can make a 5 minute drum track using midi controllers and go back and fill it in more.
it probably depends on what kind of music you make
i'm always layering drum patterns and shit so working like that would drive me nuts
but if you were making breakcore or something it would make more sense
you guys mind explaining which parameter is which? im assuming depth is threshold but i can't be sure
so this is kind of the first time making anything without a sub, i cant really judge the low end to well but how do the kicks sound? keep in mind i know the synths are a little cheesy, but i didn't want to upload just some kicknsnares
I've been working on this about 4 hours now, really like my progress so far. I'm pretty new at this though so any advice or critique is appreciated.
Trance and metal hybrid, made this for the videogame XenoRaptor. I use FL Studio as my main DAW, and the guitar tone chain is TSE 808 > Poulin LeGion > Poulin LeCab2 > Limiter.
Could use some heavy sidechain compression during the drop. I'd add some top end reverb to the drum bus to create the impression of space and layer synths and percussion a lot so it doesn't feel empty. Keep it up!
Thanks man! I actually am not very good at drops per se, I usually make very ambient trance music but I've been meaning to get into house/pop music and this is really my first attempt. Thanks for the advice man.
ps. your track sounds awesome.
A sketch I've been fooling around with in Logic. Not sure how to develop it, any feedback appreciated.
Any FLfags online?
Every time I accidently delete the blue line between "from FL Studio" and a VST in Patcher, there's no audio coming from it. The only thing I can do to bring it back is add a new VST with the same settings. How to fix this?
I would like to control arbitrary instruments with custom tunings
>Yeah I wanna know to
So far I'm pretty sure there is nothing like it. The closest is "Scala", a program that retunes MIDI.
That works but a real xenharmonic piano roll would be much superior.
if you really wanted to write 21st century music you'd be best off using a programming language like pd, max/msp or supercollider. I haven't tried working with xenharmonic stuff personally but I imagine it would be trivial compared to using a traditional DAW
sounds alright - pretty interesting sounds and texture. the middle section gets a little repetitive and the mixing seems kind of weird, though. that reversed synth or whatever it is sounded really strange to me panned so hard to the right
I want a piano roll that's configurable for arbitrary tunings.
It's awkward to use standard 12-TET piano rolls and retune the MIDI afterwards.
It's astonishing that none of the expensive DAWs support this out of the box.
>It's astonishing that none of the expensive DAWs support this out of the box.
It really isn't. Most people aren't going to want or need something like that. So why add it?
My best advice is to git gud at programming and buy one a them haken continuuthingies.
it's not really surprising given that just about everyone who works with microtonal or xenharmonic music uses stuff like csound, supercollider, max/msp etc. if you're serious about exploring xenharmony or what have you, you should learn how to use one of those languages
>if you really wanted to write 21st century music you'd be best off using a programming language like pd, max/msp or supercollider.
They can completely free you from the constraints of note events, etc. if you want. But they're not like DAWs.
>I haven't tried working with xenharmonic stuff personally but I imagine it would be trivial compared to using a traditional DAW
You can just scale pitch to whatever you want. For n notes per octave, multiply by 12/n. For non-equal temperaments, write it to a table.
The thing is, MIDI (and VSTs still use MIDI messages) is inherently problematic for microtonal stuff. MIDI note numbers are only 0 to 127. That range isn't really suitable for, say, 72 equal. You can retune via pitch bend, etc. but there can be problems with modulation depth and controller resolution, etc. These things aren't fundamentally conceived to support arbitrary tuning. Nearly everything is just a hack or workaround.
Are there any good programs that aren't too complicated? I have Ableton Lite, and can usually use it for about an hour before something screws up and then everything screws up.
I don't think I have any errors with the program, but it's just hard for me to figure out.
ive started learning ableton, but all my drums sound like shit?
Thoughts on our latest? Receptive to feedback and constructive criticism.
listened to this last night high as fuck. I liked it even though I'm not into these types of compositions at all, it's tastefully done. how much time did you spend on it?
^ somebody give me feedback on this demo I recorded last night, I fucked up near the end but at work so can't fix it right now
FL does microtones, to the nearest 10 cents.
behold some microtonal synth:
pic related is all the fine pitch tuning from another track (in the automation window below)
most DAWs do support it.
Thank you very much! The fact that you listened to it with an open mind means a lot to me. Worked on it for a couple of weeks, after a brief hiatus. Had to get those tones in the ambient sections just right, y'know?
>spend an evening tinkering with a track
>sounds okay, but there's always something missing
>run out of ideas, go back to listening to stuff
>god my stuff sounds like shit compared to the music I love
>tfw bittersweet enjoyment
Probably just because you aren't working with million dollar studios and professional recording engineers/producers.
Means you have to work harder to get a similar level of quality
wiki says this was made with midi's, how do they achieve those sounds? (not the choir, obviously, also this post is unrelated to the other one I made with this song)
Logic Fag, reporting in.
Latest tunes I'm working on.
Very few elements so far, it's probably gonna stay this way.
Drums, Rhodes, Sub, Noises, that's pretty much it.
Plug ins used :
zplane Elastic Pitch, amazing pitch shifter
Soundtoys EchoBoy, I just love it.
PSP Vintage Warmer on those drums + a Fair bit of SSLComp
TAL Reverb III (free), amazing simple reverb plug in
I'd love some feedback and shit you know
Heavy sidechaining of the whole track or a large synth/vocal part was a technique that was incredibly popular in the 'beats scene' around 2006-2010. People like Flying Lotus, Samiyam, Nosaj Thing, Shlohmo, Onra, and many many more made it a signature technique and this influenced a lot of the music that drew inspiration from these artists (not that these people were the first to ever use the technique). A lot of electronic music from that time used it excessively because it was easy and it sounded nice on pretty much anything.
Nowadays you don't hear it as much, but some people still use it from time to time. Off the top of my head FlyLo used it on Never Catch Me very noticeably, but its use tends to be a bit more subtle these days.
It was very much a trend during a time when a lot of electronic music's main goal was just to sound nice. Nowadays I feel the experimental part of electronic music has taken the forefront in purely instrumental tracks and relying on old fads such as heavy sidechaining or LFO'd bass à la dubstep is seen as stagnation and disregarded as uninteresting.
Came up with this last night, I think it needs more work. Different arrangement and something resembling a lead. Also I'm struggling to come up with a bassline. Still really new to this. I'm using Reason 5
I suppose you could use automation for microtones but I still think max/msp or sc would be a lot better suited. Really, if someone is interested in making experimental electronic music they should learn at least one programming language. Imo sc is the most versatile without being completely unintuitive
This is pretty neat, especially if you're new to it. Imo this doesn't really need a baseline, and for a lead you might want to chop up some vocal samples. The vocal sample you have in there right now doesn't really seem to fit, though
recently got one of these, I just needed a controller with lots of knobs and the price was ok
decided to finally upgrade to 9.1.5 after years of using live 8 to use the presets
>mfw you can controll almost everything in live without touching the mouse or keyboard
>mfw it automaped everything
>mfw has pretty much the same funcionality of the launchpad + more and is half the price
>tfw launching clips, controlling volumes, sends, fx, and even operator without even looking at the screen
best controller ever?
You don't mind the piano roll so much and use a synth that can load .scala files
How do I master music for cassettes before I send off the files to be printed? I have no idea how to even start and I'm already pushing my budget by printing it so I can't afford to hire someone to master it. My album is almost done so I need some advice.
Also, best sites to order from?
I'm looking at getting creative cloud soon for dw, muse, ps, illustrator, indesgin, and llightroom but is Audition worth checking out since I'll have it? I'm pretty happy with reaper right now but is there anything that would make audition stand out for me?
if you can't afford to master you can't afford to print
but a few ground rules
i guess you don't even know how to compress, but tape releases need a bit more compression
you need to match the saturation to get that sweet tape sound and can't do this without having a test cassette
if you are encoding dolby b (noise reduction), boost the highs a bit
cut the lower mids a bit
don't expect it to sound the same, trying to pre-guess and compensate for the alteration before you've even heard it is like trying to make a pass blindfolded
it's a bit like encoding to soundcloud, just try to make the best sounding mix you can
your hipster friends probably won't care anyway
so i'm curious as to why audacity sounds seemingly so much more muffled and quiet than music produced via other methods. like just taking a simple stereo mix recording significantly lowers audio quality even at high sample rates
and even if i'm doing my mixing by the books and getting everything up to 0 db, it still sounds quieter than "professionally mastered" music. Obviously, I suck so there's going to be a difference between what i can make and the market brand, but I'm wondering how much of an impact this particular DAW would have on those aspects
>but I'm wondering how much of an impact this particular DAW would have on those aspects
it's all about how you use it
the fact that audacity is missing a classical 'mixer' feature that puts all your inserts, sends levels and so on right before you makes it a different approach and difficult to keep eyes on gain staging, compression etc as you would in pretty much any other DAW
>like just taking a simple stereo mix recording significantly lowers audio quality even at high sample rates
Bullshit. Try a null test and you'll find there's no difference. Pan laws, sample rate conversions, etc. may differ but otherwise the math is always the same. DAWs differ in workflows, not inherent quality.
these are kind of the first actual speakers i have had since a child, i used to work on a broken speaker system that had no output on the right side. it trips me out how much hardpanning is in most songs
why can't i hear how the chord progression is played out in some songs? most songs are about 4 chords the whole time and you can tell they're each held for a bar or two or it might be in thirds and change chords by some multiple of third, but in a lot of songs i can't really tell where they change
>spend hundreds of hours spread over months making shitty beats and the like because i just suck at music but i have fun making it regardless
>nobody is interested in it
>i don't blame them
>hate myself for not being able to sing in the slightest even though had lessons for years
that about sums up my music production feels
What would be the easiest way to find a native english singer for electronic music projects?
first full track I've done ever. I need to get better at mastering though, it took me forever to master this track lmao. feedback would be nice
Has anyone ever used Bitwig? Is it any good?
Mastering is pointless with DAW's and digital audio. Just make sure not to get over 0db and you'll be fine. But if you wanna have a good sound:
aim for getting the mix at -2 to -3 db before mastering, with everything sounding as balanced as possible.
have a mastering channel like this:
compressor: very fast attack, auto release, get the threshold so you get just a little bit of reduction. I recommend some analog modelled compressor like the SSL
eq1: cut everything below 20hz and above 20khz. Cut the stereo/side parts below 200-300Hz. This cleans up a track considerably. Use linear phasing mode.
eq2: you can boost a bit around the harmonics of the key you made the music in. Or just boost the low end around 300ZHh and the High end around 10000Hz, thats a cheap trick but it works. Also with linear phasing
saturation: use a tape saturation or a tube saturation plugin. This takes a lot of time to get it right but the difference can be day and night.
eq3: this is for just chekcup, check if any frequencies need cut down. You shouldnt push anything at this point
stereo: there are some good stereo plugins which can put your master bus into the stereo field more. Try one with the "mastering" pre-set, I recommend Nu-Gen Audio's stereoizer
limiter: The point of this is to bring your music's "average volume" up without getting problems. Try to push up your sound so you get a reduction of 0-3db at the end. If you're making any kind of music with kick/snares you should aim for the kick hitting zero.
Export to 16bit WAV, dont dither, you done
what is it with you people and these stupid bad vibes pictures
i don't know how much this is going to be useful, but mix and master is very muddy and messy
claps and snares are too pronounced in the high end and distort without having any real beef in the low mid range
the compression and sidechaining is too harsh and pumps the reverb and chords too much - this is probably the worst thing about the mix, it's like you people ride the controls without even listening to what you're doing
kick sits a bit high in the spectrum, there's no sub to speak of but that might be an aesthetic choice
i dig the chords and layout, it's quite sparse but it sorta works
this is bad advice and you should feel bad
plenty of good work being done in the digital realm. you have no idea how he records/mixes and blanket statements outside of perhaps a DC offset are useless
These are all general advice almost everyone who ever mixed a song used in their workflow.
I mix for a living and this is pretty much industry standard stuff.
Unless you mind to tell me whats wrong about general advice I dont see the point of arguing.
>plenty of good work being done in the digital realm
No one said there arent
In fact the majority of mixing and mastering is being done in digital today.
how does one go about making a kick and snare sound loud in a mix without it clipping? I like making my kicks and snares hit hard but don't know how to avoid making them clip and sound distorted
I'm not him, but do you mean during the mixing stage or the mastering stage?
If mixing: Make everything else quieter rather than making the kick and snare louder
If Mastering: Have a slower attack time on the compressor so that the attack of the snare isn't affected by the compressor/limiter
>dub techno night
>loving what I've done so far
>2 monitor screens
>coffee on desk
>snow falling outside
10/10 Best New Comfy
Guys? I've been making stuff on Fruity Loops and Ableton for maybe 2 years, it is a lot of fun but my stuff doesn't sound pro at all.
Any books you recommend on music production? Basics to make a song come together and sound... produced. Or video series, courses or whatever.
everyone who thinks an FX chain and pushing the RMS counts as mastering, i.e a bunch of idiots
>I mix for a living and this is pretty much industry standard stuff.
yes i know the industry is in a sad state
>Unless you mind to tell me whats wrong about general advice
I just told you, you don't know what audio you're dealing with, you have to work on a case by case basis and having some pre-emptive plan is pointless
arbitrary boosting and cutting is the worst advice you can give someone
RMS and LUFS standards are unreliable in the soundcloud age
some great mixes don't need much done at all, some require every bit of arsenal and repair kit you've got, but less is always more when it comes to good audio at the end of the day
cutting stereo below 300, it's like you don't even like chords
why use all that izotope harmonizer and tape bullshit on everything except stuff that actually benefits from it
stereo field arrangement requires an understanding of phasing
presets are like having recipes without knowing the ingredients
dithering is not a bad word
this kind of thinking is what is the problem in the first place: people not actually listening to the audio, listening to or having an idea of a goal sound, and then applying appropriate methods to achieve that
but i guess it takes more time than giving arbitrary settings on an izotope plugin
Torrent Lynda.com tutorials. Whatever daw you use, get their "essential training" video for that daw. They'll go over a bunch of stuff you might already know, but it's great to really learn the ins and outs of whatever program you're using. Even if you're really experienced at your daw, you'll probably find a lot that you didn't already know.
pic related is like 40 gigs of tutorials/books that I have for different programs