This episode was beautiful. It was not shitting on the fandom;

HHAHAHAHA
SALTY

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>>30755132
> "Here is my deep and complex analysis of a cartoon for little girls! Now stop disliking what we do"

>>30755132
Nice.

>>30755136
I am the opposite of salty.

No desu, i liked the episode but the song was very disconnected.
More attention should be paid to the very end when they explicitly spell out the lesson
Sometimes you can't change someones mind no matter what you do but you can change how you let it effect you.

>>30755136
HAVE SOME SUGAR

>>30755132
I support every single word you've said, and you're completely right, but sadly that won't save you from being called Hasdrone by some people here.
Anyways, going a little meta on the meta-critic... In all seriousness, do you think that logical/argumental flaws in a series makes it more valuable for discussion, or ruins the inmersion and breaks the ''willing suspension of disbelief", for autistic views like us?

>>30755222
> T.AnotherHasdrone

>>30755227
Did you even read my question? I'm trying to talk in an unbiased position.

>>30755222
>t. pseudo-intellectual hasdrones asking dumb and badly worded questions, everyone

>>30755237
You are 100% on the Hasdrone side since you claimed to be 100% agreeing with him and tried to poison the well against whoever called him out as the Hasdrone he is.

Now go back to Derpibooru where your kind belong.

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>>30755147
It's not deep or complex. It's the focal message of the episode. Most of the fandom just couldn't see it because they got wrapped up in feeling insulted rather than hearing the beautiful message of the episode.

>>30755195
That development was just an afterthought, a development in the final minute. The episode as a whole was about OP.

The song is almost completely disconnected from the episode.
None of their in-show fans ever said or implied that the mane6 were flawless or perfect or anything like that.
The episode copy and pasted various criticisms that have been levived at the writers over the years and were then brushed off as background ponies being silly.
If they simply REFERENCED said criticisms, you might have had a point, but they literally threw in a "Twilight was better without wings" joke despite the journal being written AFTER she got them.
The thing that most pisses me off about this episode is that it's either non-canon, or ponyville is canonically filled with assholes.
I watch the show to have fun, to see a world thats cute and interesting.
This episode was just depressing and felt like a giant middle finger.

>>30755237
>I'm trying to talk in an unbiased position.
Nigga, you agree with everything OP said, that's not unbiased in the slightest.

>>30755278
> "This cartoon for little girls is very deep and complex when I defend it, but it's very simple and only for little girls when YOU critcrize it!"

The episode was so fucking bad and mean spirited that nobody wanted to take credit for it so they tried to stick the blame on Larson.

>>30755256
It's weird that you say he's poisoning the well as if called someone a hasdrone and reeing about derpibooru is an actual argument.
>>30755278
Nothing in the episode reflected that song though, none of the m6 apart from fluttershy were being picked on for their flaws and some were even being praised too much. The song had no effect on the crowd and was used to nail down the lesson i mentioned earlier.

>>30755132
I want ponies to bully me for liking their show.

>>30755136
HAHAHA
TRIGGERED

>>30755285
> it's either non-canon, or ponyville is canonically filled with assholes
Just a little correction here: most crazy fans there weren't from Ponyville, but mainly travellers from all Equestria. Ponyville natives were the minority there, at least from a far sight.

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>>30755312
> "I will say NO U to his arguments so I could win and defend an episode that was made as a petty revenge against people who didn't praised them!"

The episode wasn't written by Larson and none of the writers had the courage to step forward and say "Yes, I wrote it"

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>>30755285
I understand your position, and I agree that lines like "Twilight was better before wings" were deleterious, but they served a purpose (see below). As for the song, it was the culmination of the episode; everything before it was setting the scene, pic related.

>>30755294
Look past the barbs and see the point. The barbs, while some in bad taste, were to indicate that the episode was speaking directly to us via the proxy MLP-universe fandom, that the song and message were addressing *us*.

The fact that the song did not affect the crowd was meta for that it would not affect us.

>>30755353
Are you actually this stupid or are you just baiting for (you)s?

>>30755285
>This episode was just depressing and felt like a giant middle finger.
More like the entirety of seasons 2-7. When it doesn't feel like an insult meant to offend, it feels like an incompetent attempt at being an interesting and enjoyable episode.

>>30755408
In any case, do you think than the show's logical/argumental flaws are rather something to value (because it makes the series more 'discussionable'), to ignore (because the lessons are emore important than the context) or to be pointed/mocked/hated (because they ruin the inmersion and break the "willing suspension of disbelief")?

>>30755408
>>30755443
Can you two talk in a non retarded manner? Your diction makes me vomit. Your syntax is even worse.

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>>30755132
You're right, but has anyone actually argued that the episode was shit because it admitted the main characters have flaws? I don't think anyone trashed this episode because it showed that the M6 aren't perfect.

The problem is how they decided to tell the message. Instead of tackling it in a more mature and reasonable way. For example, ponies could have complained how a specific lesson is actually wrong or how it doesn't work, or ponies interpret an entry the wrong way, with the M6 having to explain that yes, the entries can't solve everything, context is important, or that handling a situation in a wrong way is what helped them grow as characters. A character could've shown up, thanking the M6 because it helped her solve her problems, or make her realize that she was in the wrong. Could've even been a pony we already know from the show for some continuity points.
It would have some sweet moments, and it would have handled the meta issues in a better way, explaining and showing with specific examples.

Instead, we get a bunch of random mad ponies spouting cheap meta one-liners, some of which don't really even make a sense, only Fluttershy's issue is addressed, and at the end Glimmer (I don't really mind, but it's funny how pre-S6 it would've been Spike in her place) brings two fillies whose problems were already solved in the cold opening of the episode, and all is good. Ignore the haters (and obsessive fans), as long as you helped some fillies. What's that? There's still an angry mob outside the castle? Rarity's boutiques are still boycotted and AJ's farm is still full of squatters, and nobody has any idea how to fix any of that? Eh, just ignore it and roll the credits.

It sucked on almost all fronts. The meta humor was very basic and uninspired, so was the song (felt like I'm listening to EqG), there was no thrilling story, and there were no (or very little) strong character moments, the only thing that the episode had plenty of was wasted potential.

>>30755456
Sorry for not being a native/fluent English speaker, you damn retard.

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>>30755349
Thats better i guess, but the fact there's that many assholes in equestria at all is still anger inducing.

>>30755408
Except it wasnt 'setting the scene' at all, the song did nothing to actually reference or resolve anything their fans were saying, it came out of nowhere to address a problem that didnt exist.
Even the synopsis was completely at odds with the episode since the ponies dont actually argue about which lesson was better.
If you think about it, both the synopsis and the song were written for a completely different episode than the one that made it to final production, and were likely more in line with what larson's original draft was.

>Ponies argue about which lesson was better and how their favorite pony is the best.
>Song points out all their individual flaws and resolves the conflict.

That could have been a fun episode with some meta commentary that didnt feel like a slap to the face and now i'm sad it'll never see the light of day.

>>30755487
Ignore the syntax and diction autist. He's been doing this for a while.

>>30755408
>Look past the barbs and see the point.

More like "I-Ignore the bad things and p-praise the rest, please!"

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>>30755443
I agree with the namefag that your syntax and phrasing are awful, but if I'm understanding you correctly, I think it's ok that aspects of it break immersion because the point was to break immersion to directly teach us a friendship lesson. The episode is flawed, but the lesson here is far more important than the mode. It changed the way I look at the characters. Now I love them all.

>>30755477
Yes, that was the problem, and it created the secondary problem of most of us being unable to look past it and see the beautiful message this flawed episode was trying to tell us.

>>30755500
>That could have been a fun episode with some meta commentary that didnt feel like a slap to the face and now i'm sad it'll never see the light of day.
It could have been a really great episode if it had been handled by a competent staff instead of the smug hacks we are stuck with.

>>30755529
See, this is why it's difficult to not believe the fag behind of posts like this one is Jim Miller himself.

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>>30755529
>It changed the way I look at the characters. Now I love them all.
You fucked up buddy, you're either paid to post here, are shitposting for (you)'s or jumped on the ride this season if THIS episode of all things is what changed your mind.

>>30755560
He may be Jim Miller trying to create viral damage control- after all, the man himself has admited to go around lurking on message boards to see what's being said about the series and himself.

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>>30755529
>It changed the way I look at the characters. Now I love them all.
>a meta episode that literally had to spell out for me that being flawed isn't bad
Are you autistic, or did you take all the best/worst pony shitposting to heart too much?
Are you secretly a 6 year old girl?

>>30755195
I lied here, i actually thought the episode was very mediocre, shitty pacing, no resolution, boring in general, i just didn't see at as the kick in the face a few people here did.
They mention a grand total of two fandom critiques in the episode.
>fluttershy always learns the same lessons
Which i'm sure a fluttercuck would argue against but i also think they justified it very well.
>twilight was better before she had wings
Which is stupid because character development for twilight was always going to happen either way, and after this many years you should have gotten over it. I quit watching the show for three seasons because of her wings, but i think they managed to make the best of it in the end.

>>30755147
not an argument.

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>>30755136

>>30755132
Excellent now tell Lily Peet OP.

>>30755593
> "Not an argument because I said so"

I think it's already time for your medication.

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>>30755560
>>30755570
That was a bit hyperbolic; I don't love them all, but I see the value of each one.

Before, I disliked Pinkie Pie and Rainbow Dash for the standard reasons, thought Fluttershy was a weak character, and found Rarity a haughty poseur.

RD:
>"My arrogance comes off as cocky, but it gives me the courage to fail."

Pinkie Pie:
>"Ponies think I'm all bubbles and laughter, that I don't seem sincere. I might joke around a little too much, but I'm just so happy you're here."

What beautiful characters, and the RD line has depth. But moreover
>It's their flaws that make them work, give them life and depth, brought them together, and yields the friendship that strengthens every one. It's what friendship is all about.

I've never cared about best/worst pony shitposting, but I was among the 98% of /mlp/ who had a best/worst pony and disliked the worst pony as a character, and it is we who the episode addressed.

I needed the break of immersion with the episode directly addressing us to hear it.

Reminder to report the janitor impersonator >>30755637

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>>30755570
Also, the lesson wasn't that being flawed isn't bad. It's that
>it is only due to flaws that characters can learn and grow in friendship, and flaws are what make friendship work through friends complementing each other's strengths and weaknesses like engineering pieces fitting together to form something stronger than the sum of its parts. It's their flaws that make them work, give them life and depth, brought them together, and yields the friendship that strengthens every one. Love each character for the beautiful, imperfect being she is. It's what friendship is all about.

>>30755588
Are you me?

>>30755642
That's slightly better but still retarded as fuck, anon.
You're saying it took a song seven seasons deep where Dash tells you "I'm not so bad" to realize this? Like, that was enough to start appreciating her character? You couldn't figure that out on your own?
Honestly, I'm baffled. You seem to appear like you think about the show, because you seem to have reasons to like and dislike characters, but somehow those seven seasons of episodes weren't enough, and you had to have it spelled out that flaws are what makes characters interesting and more real in a song. I don't know what to say.
If the next episode had a song called "Flaws Suck", would you spin on your dime again? Is that all it takes for all your reasons and opinions to fall apart?

>>30755669
Yes thank you, I watched the episode. The lesson, when summed into a one line greentext, is pretty much that. Being flawed isn't bad, because "it is only due to flaws that characters...", you know the rest.
I still don't understand how this is a revelation to you. Have you never watched a movie, read a book, saw a play, or watched this very show? This is a lesson for little kids like the rest of them. Were you also blown away when Pinkie sang about how sharing is caring?

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>>30755624
Thanks, but you please send it; I don't watch Lily Peet.

I would appreciate it because I think it's one of the best friendship lessons in the show and that we need to hear it >>30755669.

>>30755727
Again, the lesson of the episode is not that flaws are what make characters interesting, or that flaws aren't bad. Some character flaws endeared particular characters to me and made them fascinating analyze; it is obvious flaws can be good and that flaws are necessary to make an interesting character. The lesson was >>30755669, that it is only due to flaws that characters can learn and grow in friendship—all flaws—and flaws are what make friendship work in the first place through friends complementing each other's strengths and weaknesses like engineering pieces fitting together to form something stronger than the sum of its parts. This is what friendship is, fundamentally based on flaws, and that's a substantial revelation.

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>>30755787
We're circling around the same thing calling it different names.
Yes, flaws and ultimately our strengths and weaknesses are what defines us, our characters. It is what can complement us or draw us apart. Nobody is perfect, everyone has a certain flaw or a kink to them. When designing characters, nobody wants to read about the perfect Mary Sue. People want characters who are like us. Flaws aren't bad, because they can create relationships or make for interesting characters. Of course we need flaws to learn from them. I'd challenge your claim that "flaws are what make friendship work in the first place" because I am pretty sure you can have two people be great friends even though their flaws don't come into play in their relationship at all.

But again, the fact that you realized this only now and only after being explicitly told in a children's cartoon is a little staggering to me. It would have been less surprising if you were the target audience, but I'm assuming you're at least 18. And if, as you say, you needed to be told this lesson, then I worry a little.

>>30755132
Bravo!!!

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>>30755862
>I'd challenge your claim that "flaws are what make friendship work in the first place" because I am pretty sure you can have two people be great friends even though their flaws don't come into play in their relationship at all.
Friendship exists at all because alone we're incomplete.

I still don't think you're understanding; friendship is like engineering pieces coming together to form something stronger than the sum of its parts that distributes down to strengthening each constituent which in turn holds the structure together. The strengthening of each component can happen only if each is not already maximally strong alone, and it is the fact that the edifice and each component are stronger together than apart that holds it together under gravity and stress vectors.

Thus, the complementation of flaws is not only what creates something stronger than the sum of the parts, but is also what glues it together, and this combination of both distributed strengthening and gluing is friendship.

>>30755500
Seeing as Equestria is a pretty big place, even if just 1% of all ponies, were assholes that'd still be a pretty large number of assholes.

>>30755891
> t.shill

>>30755150
HHAHAHAHA
SALTY

>>30756427
HAHAHA
TRIGGERED

>>30756306

Is it bad that my biggest complaint about this (aside from Comrade Glimmer attempting to enforce the right political ideals) was that these fillies are being abused by being allowed to wear such clashing mane and tail colors?

Holy mother fuck. You can't ever say anything positive anymore.

"Shill" is not an argument.
"Hasdrone" is not an argument.
"Hi Jim" is not an argument.
I get that hiding behind anonymity means you can bring out your inner 12 year old and baselessly namecall people you disagree with, but if you're going to engage, the least you could do is defend your accusations, and bring some sense with you. Seriously, I thought 4chan's age requirement was 18.

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I thought the episode was alright and if you take out the idea that someone with an agenda wrote it. Then the episode stands on its own two feet by from my perception putting down the idea that fame is everything. It was also meta because it addressed critics and the fandom? But that feeling I think was because people decided to take offense. UNLESS some can show how this has been a blatant trend to give offense to the audience or if it continues with more episodes being as blatant as last weeks.

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>>30755132
I agree, so did most people

>>30755132
Except it is not flaws that people have a problem with, it is shit writing. Unlike what Twilight claimed, they are not real ponies, they ARE fictional characters, and their development is not portrayed realistic.
But that is par for the course with how american show writing works, having a gazillion writers for a single show is just plain dumb

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>>30755132
I mean, yeah, sure, mares, go on.

>>30756476
>t. shill hasdrone

There's no point in caring anon. Move on. New episode in 6 hours.

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>>30757603
Yeah, because having a single writer prevents bad writing.

>>30755132
Nah, it was shit.

>>30757603
That's why I judge each episode on its own merits.

>>30757456
Glad to see it's just a vocal spiteful few as usual.

>>30755161
Reminder that "love and tolerate" originated as a meme used to respond to haters, it was never meant to become a slogan/mantra.

>>30761538
>489 people is an accurate representation of the fandom

w e w l a d

>>30761538
also,

>not liking something = "spiteful"

Hi Jim

>>30757603
>Unlike what Twilight claimed, they are not real ponies, they ARE fictional characters, and their development is not portrayed realistic.
The point is not that they are real, the point is that they are established characters with their own lives, while that guy complaint is just asking for a different type of story and character altogether. That might seem like a weird thing to address, but it's actually a rather common complaint amongst fans. Like, take the Daring Do hate: people still cling to the concept of DD not being real despite it not being relevant for 3 years already and automatically label any following DD appearance as shit, even though those are different stories and should be rated by their own merits.

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>>30762861
Are you completely ignorant of even conceptual statistics? It's a large random sample.

We have that 291 of 489 rated it 8 or higher.

Therefore the probability that >50% of /mlp/ rates it 8 or higher is 99.9987%.

>http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=(integral+.5+to+1+x%5E291(1-x)%5E(489-291)dx)%2F((integral+0+to+1+x%5E291(1-x)%5E(489-291)dx)

In other words, we can be 99.9987% confident that >50% of /mlp/ rates the episode ≥8.

>>30756476
>Holy mother fuck. You can't ever say anything positive anymore.
So go elsewhere? Why are you still here?

>>30762981
And we can be 100% sure you are a fat virgin trying to feel useful by playing Internet Shill.
For free.

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>>30763040
It's funny. It is literally impossible to argue against mathematics—what I said is as true as 2+2=4, assuming it's a random sample—so you call me a shill. How can I shill mathematical truth? >>30756476 was right.

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>>30763023
>>30763040
ebin

>>30763124
> avatarfagging

Ah, it's this guy again.

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>>30763160
What's my avatar?

>>30755132

>>30757456

>>30756436
I'm thinking they're OCs of staffer's kids or something.

Wouldn't be the first time it happened.

>>30757456
>>30761538
This is the only episode in a long while that I ever voted below 6 on.
>Every single episode sans the REALLY bad ones for the past three seasons have been getting tons of 8's, 9's, and 10's
I'm not one of the usual doomfags, but I'm starting to consider whether or not the board really has been infiltrated by outside groups that levy much less criticism than what was usual beforehand or that the people left on this dying board may have developed stockholm syndrome.