So like, when the Moonlight Butterfly nanomachines destroyed all the metal above the surface of the Earth, does that mean the buttons and zippers on everybody's pants were also turned to dust?
That must have been weird.
They don't destroy metal or electronics, they destroy all technology. Which meant all clothes. And is no weirder than tribal societies that don't have them in the first place considering you'd be acting tribal just to survive regardless. The only things that survived at all were those that were stored underground, most of which were protected with nanoskin. The Turn-A and it's weapons weren't, which is why the rifle melts after a few shots in the opening fight, because the Turn-A's nanomachines never bothered to repair the external weaponry. The stuff in the DOC base had no nanoskin protection either, the hammers were just simple and rugged enough to survive the test of time compared to the rifles.
Wouldn't the MB kill them like Gym in the last episode?
My headcanon is that they hid in underground shelters or something.
Don't watch it, don't talk about it, move on with your life.
Yes. It honestly does get better after they finally get into space.
Of course, that's not saying much when it's fucking garbage beforehand, but still. Finish it so you can shitpost properly with the rest of us.
>I dont think gym's katanas were electric anon
...Neither was Gym himself but that didn't stop the nanomachines from absorbing/destroying him.
>Should I try pushing through it?
If you don't like it by episode 15 then just drop it. It's not for you.
The worse that would happen is that you will have to resort to shitposting in Turn-A threads.
>Flay at her worst > Sochie at her best
Get a load of this edgelord.
>you'll never cuck your wife with your young-grandma queen
He's an adolescent male. He probably just doesn't have pubes yet.
I just came to this thread to say this:
Sochie is a goddess
Check the 23
Sochie can be annoying at times
(especially when Loran has to save her butt multiple times and she remains ungrateful). However, her motives are pretty simple to understand and she doesn't turn into some manipulative cunt for no reason unlike so many other female characters in the Gundam franchise. She also gets developed a lot through the course of series despite being in a supporting role.
I don't get why people get so hung up on characters being disagreeable to themselves personally. Who cares? It's not like you have to hang out with them. Any moment where a baby cries in one of Tomino shows is easily far, far more annoying. Fuck that shit.
Not really. Loran was fiercely loyal to Dianna and Sochie showed no signs of interest in Loran until the very end of the series. You can't just admit to the person who've you taken for granted for 2 years that you've been wanting that D all along and expect to get it the minute he walks out of your life. Real life doesn't work like that.
I don't get it
why didnt they just make a second turn a to defeat the turn x?
>A tundere character I actually like for once.
>Gets cucked in the end.
That was a relatively benign MLB. When Merrybell uses it to attack a town we can see how destructive it is even with a fraction of its power and in the Black History videos the Turn A actually leads a literal storm of darkness across the Earth.
A cocoon generally means that when the thing inside it emerges, it will have evolved.
This is how artificial Newtypes are born.
If he did care about her, why is he completely stone-faced when he kisses her? Why does he walk away without even looking back immediately afterwards? Why did it take him 50 episodes to show even that sliver of interest? Why did he not show the slightest bit of jealousy or interest when she was getting married? Why did he not try and deny it when Sochie said he'd be happier if her sister were around and not her?
Loran is one of the most emotionally stable and open characters in the entire franchise. If he's kissing a lost love or someone he regrets having to leave he's not going to be blank faced or bottle it up, but that's what he does when he kisses Sochie. He kisses her with no expression and then walks away without a word or a look while she breaks down crying. And then she chucks the single remaining possession of his she actually owned while still crying. Nothing about that scene suggests that it's the parting of two lovers.
My personal feeling is that Loran is supposed to end up with Dianna but that Tomino just didn't do a great job of it, because they don't really have much in the way of romantic interaction during the show and even the finale suggests more friendship or servitude than romance but it's not like that'd be a first for Tomino. It wouldn't even be the first time he's bungled the romance element of a Gundam show and just kind of winged it in the finale, since ZZ did the exact same thing with Judau and Roux. On the other hand, I can totally see that it might be a knight and queen thing where he's just supposed to be her servant and was never supposed to be more and there's just some scenes that suggest more by accident. I can't see Loran ever ending up with Sochie though.
I don't even see why you'd want them to though personally since I think they'd make a terrible couple. Sochie is very demanding and aggressive and needs someone more akin to Gavane to challenge her and know when to push back against her, because Loran never did in the series and really never would. He'd just do what she ordered for the sake of some peace and they'd both be miserable and start quietly resenting each other, since neither is getting what they want out of a relationship. The same thing already happens in show, because Sochie can never understand why Loran does what he does and shows constant frustration at his decisions despite her attraction to him while Loran just kind of does what she orders when it's convenient or necessary, ignores her most of the rest of the time and occasionally grumbles about her in private when she gets unreasonable. That's not the basis of a good or healthy relationship.
Holy shit, this is the most sense anyone has made explaining that rushed ending to me. Gonna save this for future use.
>If he did care about her, why is he completely stone-faced when he kisses her?
>Why does he walk away without even looking back immediately afterwards?
Because he had to steel his resolve to leave her. Such weakness would only make it harder.
>Why did it take him 50 episodes to show even that sliver of interest?
You should rewatch Turn A
>Why did he not show the slightest bit of jealousy or interest when she was getting married? Why did he not try and deny it when Sochie said he'd be happier if her sister were around and not her?
Because he always felt a deep regret for lying to Sochie who had her father killed by his people. Loran is very loyal and felt like he betrayed her, so he took his own feelings out of the equations to do what he thought would be better for Sochie.
>Loran is one of the most emotionally stable and open characters in the entire franchise
Loran constantly ignores his own desires to do what he thinks is better for everyone. That's a core part of his character.
>Nothing about that scene suggests that it's the parting of two lovers.
Loran would never kiss someone for no reason.
>My personal feeling is that Loran is supposed to end up with Dianna
Except nothing about the ending implies that. Loran is duty bound to his queen, especially since he's one of the few people who knows about the switch. So he takes it upon himself to take care of no matter what.
>I don't even see why you'd want them to though personally since I think they'd make a terrible couple. Sochie is very demanding and aggressive
Which is why Loran, who is exceedingly patient and understand, is a perfect match. They always had that dynamic throughout the series.
Learn to think.
> Because he had to steel his resolve to leave her. Such weakness would only make it harder.
He did a remarkably good job then, since literally nothing in the entire ending suggests that he's sad about doing so.
> You should rewatch Turn A
No, you should list some actual examples if you think they exist.
> Because he always felt a deep regret for lying to Sochie who had her father killed by his people.
That regret reached a head around episode 8 when he reveals his ethnicity because he's gotten tired of lying to both sides. There is nothing to suggest he feels any further regret to Sochie specifically regarding the incident after that point and he's not the type to blame himself for everything, including stuff that clearly isn't his fault like the firing of a gun by someone else that he had no command over or relationship with.
> Loran is very loyal and felt like he betrayed her, so he took his own feelings out of the equations to do what he thought would be better for Sochie.
If that were true then the show would suggest at some point that he was putting aside feelings for her, which is normally done by showing lingering feelings of some kind that a character has to quash. There is no scene like that with Loran.
> Loran constantly ignores his own desires to do what he thinks is better for everyone
Keith calls him on that during the show, which is why he starts to try and assert himself a bit more during the back half. It's why he says he doesn't want to dress up as Laura to steal back the Turn-A when they return to Earth for instance. That also doesn't make him emotionally unstable or closed off by the way.
> Loran would never kiss someone for no reason
It isn't for no reason though. It might not be the nicest reason in your opinion, but kissing someone to give them the one thing they've been hoping for all along even if you have no stake in it is still a reason.
> Loran is duty bound to his queen, especially since he's one of the few people who knows about the switch. So he takes it upon himself to take of her no matter what.
Except she doesn't need taking care of. She could live in a city and hire servants, she could live in the sunbelt on a big estate as a recluse and just have one or two servants if she wanted solitude. As far as anyone is concerned she is Kihel and Kihel was young and private enough that no one could naysay her beyond Sochie, who has no reason to. If he wanted to live with Sochie, he absolutely could. Hell, he could have Dianna live with them and take care or her as a duty while loving Sochie if he wanted. There is no reason the ending could not have been that if Sochie was any kind of a priority for him.
> Which is why Loran, who is exceedingly patient and understanding, is a perfect match.
Loran is patient, but even in show he gets frustrated at her and vents in private because he's simply too polite to do it to her face. There is nothing perfect about that, because after a couple of decades you end up with a domineering wife who can only get satisfaction from pointing out her husbands failings (and probably openly cheating on him) along with a henpecked husband who is just a simmering pot of impotent rage looking for an outlet.
>but kissing someone to give them the one thing they've been hoping for all along
A kiss was not what she was hoping for. Are you autistic?
>Except she doesn't need taking care of.
She was living out the last of her days.
>because after a couple of decades you end up with a domineering wife who can only get satisfaction from pointing out her husbands failings (and probably openly cheating on him) along with a henpecked husband who is just a simmering pot of impotent rage looking for an outlet.
Stick to the show and keep your fantasies out of it.
Also, Japan already confirmed why Loran was living with Diana. Even if they didn't, it was obvious by the ending that they were not a couple at all.
>Japan already confirmed why Loran was living with Diana.
And when was this nationwide referendum held? I was under the impression Turn A was very poorly received, I had no idea Japan had to come together to confirm it for us.
> Are you autistic?
Are you? I obviously didn't mean a single kiss is the only thing she was interested in, but that it was as close as Loran felt he could give her and wanted to before he left out of friendship.
> She was living out the last of her days
Oh, you're one of those guys. Well, I'm not going to argue that here, but let's say that's true for the sake of argument: so what? It still doesn't change that he doesn't actually need to leave Sochie to take care of her if he actually feels that need.
> Stick to the show and keep your fantasies out of it.
Ironic words coming from someone who's willing to make up motivations for Loran about feeling regret for hurting Sochie by lying to her about his birthplace.
> Also, Japan already confirmed why Loran was living with Dianna.
Yea, in Super Robot Wars. A fan made game where the writers regularly change shows to reflect what they want instead of what the show did.
> it was obvious by the ending that they were not a couple at all.
If it was obvious people wouldn't still be debating it 20 years later across a large part of the community that discuss it at all. The engagement ring doesn't help.
Still waiting on that list of scenes where Loran shows attraction to Sochie by the way.
And I'm sure you're the same Sochiefag that always shits up these threads with the same arguments.
>but that it was as close as Loran felt he could give her
No it wasn't. Feel free to post proofs.
>Well, I'm not going to argue that here
Because you've proven wrong so many times.
>Ironic words coming from someone who's willing to make up post-marital drama fanfiction as an actual point
>A fan made game where the writers regularly change shows to reflect what they want instead of what the show did.
Like what? SRW follows general canon, but adds in other shows and plotlines.
>If it was obvious people wouldn't still be debating it 20 years later
You might have a valid point if you weren't totally wrong. People argue against things that have proven all the time (flat earth, climate change, moon landings etc)
>Still waiting on that list of scenes where Loran states his goal of trying to give Sochie romance before he leaves, his romantic relationship with Diana and how Tomino just messed up which is why it's not obvious that Diana and Loran are romantically involved
because his thing with dianna wasn't sexual, dianna had health problems from being frozen and thawed over and over, she didn't have much left to her life, loran was going to spend time with dianna until she died fulfilling her dream of dying on earth, then he was going to go back and be a family man with sochie
he wasn't constantly being frozen and unfrozen like dianna was
and we don't know that corrin is unhealthy, as dianna doesn't look particularly unhealthy either, the problem with the freezing is less in a physical change and more a magical you will die much younger than you normally would've disease
> Feel free to post proofs
If there was proof of either side there wouldn't be a debate to be having in the first place. Asking me to post direct proof is a toothless argument designed to side step the issue entirely. I might as well ask you for proof that Loran loved her. A kiss doesn't prove that, since people who don't love each other kiss all the time in reality.
> Because you've been proven wrong so many times
I was willing to make up an extreme case extrapolation that occurs often enough in reality to be notable as a show of why it was far from perfect, yes.
> SRW follows general canon, but adds in other shows and plotliness
And they change what they don't like to reflect what they want: like SEED and especially Destiny for obvious Gundam examples.
> You might have a valid point if you weren't totally wrong
Right back at ya I guess.
> Fix'd x2
Again, you're just side stepping the issue and trying to remove yourself from it entirely. You said that I should rewatch Turn-A if I felt that Loran never showed interest in Sochie. So tell me where he shows interest in her.
>people who don't love each other kiss all the time in reality
This isn't reality, fucktard, it's a fucking cartoon. It's not going to be some densely layered "he kissed her so that she doesn't feel bad but really he didn't feel anything for her, he wanted to be with her sister's clone". In anime a kiss is a kiss.
>Asking me to post direct proof is a toothless argument designed to side step the issue entirely.
Even though you've been doing the same thing? That's right.
>hurr you're sidestepping
No, I'm pointing out flaws in your highly flawed arguments. Don't be mad.
The problem that you're making up and just want people to accept is a real problem you mean? Because the show never says any such thing. The very most there is is Dianna saying "I can't be as energetic as you Kihel". Which is a far leap from "I'm dying".
it's implied within the show, if not simply outright stated, I don't have a cap of it, because I didn't expect stupid fucks like you to have not paid attention then to get argumentative about it.
Here's Will Game's "proposal". He never asks for marriage, only says that he will. And then dies while on the trip, so he cannot have had a ring left to an ancestor because he never had a ring to give in the first place.
If you're so desperate to explain the ring you have to make up an entire subplot to explain it, then maybe you should just admit that at the very least the ring makes the ending rather confusing. If you do think he got a ring to Dianna though, then maybe you'll be kind enough to post a screencap of it.
I don't have any episodes on hand, but this perspective is widely accepted.
>At the end of the series Dianna permanently switches places with Kihel, and it is revealed that Loran took on a mission to leave Sochie behind, (hence the kiss) out of loyalty to Dianna and accompany her to a small peaceful cabin on earth, where he will dutifully watch over her until her inevitable death due to illness caused by long periods of hibernation (which is hinted at by her walking stick). The ring Dianna is shown wearing was not a ring of marriage to Loran but a memento of the orginal Will Game.
A wiki isn't solid proof, but unless you think there's some conspiracy going on then it's good enough to see that this wasn't an isolated interpretation.
Well, there's a few immediate problems with that. For one, Will Game never gives her a ring, nor is it ever implied one was given to her by someone else on his behalf. Secondly, using a walking stick when walking in snow countryside isn't a sign of sickness, just of simple practicality. If it's just going to make stuff up to support it's hypothesis, then it isn't worth relying on at all as any kind of interpretation.
>For one, Will Game never gives her a ring, nor is it ever implied one was given to her by someone else on his behalf.
That's just you denying it.
>Secondly, using a walking stick when walking in snow countryside isn't a sign of sickness, just of simple practicality.
No. You need a wide area to get better traction in snow, not a narrow stick. It wasn't for traversing snow.
>If it's just going to make stuff up to support it's hypothesis
> That's just you denying it.
Go on then, tell me where he gives it to her? Or are you just going to tell me that you don't know and shouldn't have to remember to tell people in denial of reality. I've been asking for someone to tell me where it happens for over a year now and I've yet to get a single reply of substance.
> You need a wide area to get better traction in snow, not a narrow stick.
Strange then that you can buy walking sticks specifically for travelling in snow to this day.
> Like you?
I've never made up an entire subplot for the show and insisted it was a real thing that happened. Where something was supposition or extrapolation on my part I've always tried to make it clear.
>But how does it trigger the rockets?
Who knows? It's not explained anywhere where in the franchise how Gundam Hammers work. Probably a mechanical trigger that ignites a primer. Kind of like how firearms shoot bullets.
It would be really easy to just make an impact-based ignition trigger. Without any electronic bits it would have to be solid fuel and thus burn out completely before stopping, which would be unpleasant if you've already hammered through something and want it to stop, though.
And remember: that hammer disintegrated too, just after some usage. The other hammers (presumably excavated from other locations) never do, despite Loran putting tons of stress on them. Perhaps there were electronics still intact (but what was powering them) simply due to... whatever happened not making it through the giant lump of metal. The MLB in full doomsday mode just annihilates stuff (like the town already mentioned), and the armory goodies held their shape until someone popped the freshness seal.
It was also in an armory presumed to be for Turn A's use, so that stuff crumbling at all makes no sense unless there was a faulty nanoskin on it or something. Or Turn A was too busy turning itself into a statue to give a shit, either/or.
> It was also in an armory presumed to be for Turn A's use, so that stuff crumbling at all makes no sense unless there was a faulty nanoskin on it or something. Or Turn A was too busy turning itself into a statue to give a shit, either/or.
Neither the Turn-A, it's weapons or the DOC station have any signs of nanoskin on them when we see them being uncovered that I recall. The only time you see nanoskin on the Turn-A is inside the cockpit covering the screens, and even that's relatively late in the show when they're uncovering the Will Game so may have been placed there by Horace for some reason. Which makes some degree of sense. The Turn-A doesn't need it, because the internal nanomachines handle everything, so putting nanoskin on it is redundant. The weapons and stuff in the DOC base aren't directly part of the Turn-A though, so don't get that automatic protection against the ravages of time and would need nanoskin to survive it, but didn't have it because I suppose no-one ever considered that the Turn-A itself would still be getting used thousands of years later.
The mobile suits, weapons and ships that are uncovered independently all have nanoskin on them but were presumably only covered in it to protect against the Moonlight Butterfly and provide a stash of weaponry to combat against it post disaster should it ever be used and not specifically to help people thousands of years down the line.
I initially thought weapons crumbled because their old, too. However, IRL archaeologists have uncovered metal tools and jewelry that were up to 6000 years old in pretty good shape so it doesn't make much sense that the weapons in the anime that were sealed in an underground chamber would simply just fall apart. This could mean that the weapons crumbled because of the nanomachines and the Gundam Hammers no being electronic by nature were left intact.
However the DOC station seems to be working just fine since the elevator can lower the Turn-A down to the lower level (and back up presumably) and the lights are still on. That leads one to believe that the DOC station itself is hardened to work in a nanomachine environment. Which begs two questions: Why weren't those weapons hardened, too? Why didn't the rifle the Turn-A used when it awoke (and more exposed to the elements) fall apart like the ones in the DOC base?
I don't know. You can believe either two hypotheses: A) The DOC weapons crumbled because of old age and the first rifle had enough extra nanoskin to fire off a couple of shots before melting while the Gundam Hammers were just hardier in their construction. Or B) Nanomachines only target electrical stuff and were able to get inside the DOC base and leaving the Gundam Hammers alone because they aren't electronic and the DOC base itself was hardened against nanomachines while Turn-A's first rifle was protected by nanoskin and simply just overheated.
> However, IRL
Why are you trying to apply real life standards to an anime depiction of archaeology anon? Tomino has obviously put some thought in to this, but he's not an archaeologist, nor is he overly concerned with realism and more with telling a good story and getting the internal rules right to fit his piece dramatically.
Also, the nanomachines cannot target only electronic stuff because they eat non-electronic material like Gym's sword within the show itself as already mentioned up thread. I'm pretty sure it's also been stated in supplementary material to just target anything technological, not metals or electronics.
>they eat non-electronic material like Gym's sword
Did it really target the sword though? Watching the scene again the nanomachines don't seem to do anything to swords. It looks like Loran and Gym just dropped them when they saw that the nanomachines were creeping up on them. Loran turned tail and ran for the hills while Gym got absorbed into the cocoon. Furthermore, we don't really see anything get destroyed during the Turns' death hug.
> Did it really target the sword though?
Yes, and I don't even see how it's possibly up for debate. Gym is holding it and the tendrils wrap around it first, he refuses to let go and is pulled in. Gym never drops his and that's why he's killed, because he symbolically as well as quite literally couldn't let go of conflict and the past and was swallowed for it.
Still...the sword is not shown to be destroyed.
Interestingly enough, it seems like sword Loran was using (the unbroken one) is being suspended in the air and Gym is still stuck in the position when he was in locked swords with Loran the instant the nanomachines showed up. I'm guessing that couldn't move for some reason even if he wanted to.
Anon, you really should grab EG's release of Turn A while it's still up.