Were there any books that helped you out of crushing loneliness and insecurity?
On another note (and to help you make recommendations), high school drop out, dissapointed parents, physically (technically mentally) deformed (not a troll it is quite likely when you realise all of those three correlate).
Should I an hero? I'm 21, will life just get worst? I hear people start becoming progressively unhappier beyond 30.
You come off as someone who has an inferiority complex likely due to being surrounded by much more successful people and the fact that you've never made peace with the face that you're a lazy underachiever.
Are you the kind of person who stops using contractions and informal uses of words when you get intimidated? I wouldn't be surprised if you were terrified of ever being seen as inferior.
You could probably chill the fuck out with the commas and parentheticals anyway
Well, yes that's about me except I dont stop using informal words (at least not conciously), I guess I assume people will judge me on my background anyway and dont bother to change the way I speak.
I didn't enjoy the book, didn't quite find him very agree able.
Seneca and epictetus were good though.
Also, wasnt marcus addicted to opium?
It's easy to be so brave when you're high off your tits.
>Do things because you enjoy them instead of to achieve status.
I try to do this, I enjoy reading philosophy (Kant hasn't done any good to my language).
>Work towards status and respect in the field you have a passion for.
Hopeless for me and anyway, I've been trying to overcome my need for status and respect.
Also, isn't your advice contradictory? Thanks anyway though!
>You're focusing on having a thing you haven't earned yet instead of focusing on earning that thing.
How did you get all of this out of my posts?
>Do things because you enjoy them instead of to achieve status.
This implies the reason for my doing things should be enjoyment and not status.
>Work towards status and respect in the field you have a passion for.
Presumably working towards status and respect in a field involves doing things.
Which means I would have to do things to work towards status and respect in a field, but you told me not to do things for the status and respect?
Not him, but I'll answer instead: "Status" and "respect" are meaningless terms and ideas, that only have value if you subscribe to the prevailing social system's ideology.
And if he did have passion for anything, he would surely be doing something already, wouldn't he?
>Were there any books that helped you out of crushing loneliness and insecurity?
No. I don't think those things helped anyone directly. I'd honestly be very surprised if it did. I think that true change requires action of some sort, not just passive reflection. What actions -- I don't know, I'm in a similar situation myself.
I think it actually compounds the problem in some way, because I realize that reading is just another form of escapism. What's the point of reading if you don't have money for food or rent?
That's why capitalism is bad. It's when you have to think of terms of what is "profitable", and that profit is valued more than your life. If you're not profitable, you have no right to live.
I would agree with you if Aurelius was an imbecile, though I cant say much about his opium addiction, he is considered one of the few true philosopher-kings in history, and I like to think that speaks volumes for the methods he used.
>I'm in a similar situation myself.
I think a lot of people on /lit/ are, I remember some dude asking if anyone who has ever made a thread like this got better, no one replied.
>No. I don't think those things helped anyone directly. I'd honestly be very surprised if it did.
I don't know, a lot of people say a lot of good things about some books, and how they helped them get out of a bad phase in their life.
Of course, it probably wasn't the book on its own, but I doubt reading can do more harm than good?
>I think that true change requires action of some sort, not just passive reflection. What actions I don't know
Don't a lot of self-help programmes involve fitness and meditation, I try those, they help on the days I get the time/motivation to do them.
Maybe a more routine framework will help, I am thinking pretty small though, did you mean bigger things when you said "action"?
>What's the point of reading if you don't have money for food or rent?
Oh, that must be rough if you aren't exaggerating or speaking hypothetically.
I'm not that financially insecure, it's more about a sense of self-respect for me, it hurts to know many people look down on you but at the same time I don't think it would be as fulfilling to work toward people looking up to me, which is why I try to overcome my need for external validation.
Most days though, I feel I'm lying to myself by saying that it's possible to be happy on my own own accord, it would be quite a convenient lie given how it's easy to look down on external gratification knowing that you can't get any.
Schoppy said this, but then again he seemed fukin sad (on that note, does anyone know if Schopenhauer was actually unhappy, or if he just seemed that way?)
>It is difficult to find happiness within oneself, but it is impossible to find it anywhere else.
>If you really are a bourgeois trustfund kiddie with a comfortable safety net and no actual financial worries or responsibilities you would find a way to be involved in it even it wasn't a viable career.
The obvious solution is get high and stay high for the rest of your life, then.
Anyway, read Zhuangzi and revel in your lazy worthlessness. Or maybe get your GED and start taking steps towards living a life that you think is worthwhile. Either way, quit clogging the board with this shit. There should be a general for "I hate my life, what should I read?"
Pro wrestlers survive for years on the indy circuit getting paid $20-50 for getting hit by light tubes and doing high spots in gas station parking lots before getting to a real promotion and most of them never get that far.
OP here, that 'aint me but, personally, literature is a risky game if you're playing it for the prestige.
If you need money, it's also risky (and you need it for food and rent, if we're speaking luxuries then who cares, but if you're barely meeting end's meet, might want to play it safe).
Most of my literary friends are ending up as housewives so they have their husbands supporting them (they were all pretty).
This is a small sample but from the two men I know one of them changed careers and the other one is still working on his dream but he's a very humble sort (doesn't care to be "patrician"/enjoys what he's doing) also, his family is quite well off (about a million or two in net worth) so they support his bachelor lifestyle, note I am from a third world country and I believe food is relatively cheaper for us.
He had to sacrifice on a house and kids though.
>There should be a general for "I hate my life, what should I read?"
I'm OP, I'd actually one up that, there are a lot of threads like these I've seen.
And thanks! How's the Dao De Jing by the way? (Don't know if I'm typing it right).
Sorry, I was speaking quite light heartedly, I know he's revered by many academics and such, I'm sure he's not objectively bad, I just found it very "be a good citizen, do your work citizen" I didn't find him as practical and useful as Seneca.
I disliked Beyond Good and Evil.
Wasn't the Will to Power compiled by his sister for Natzi propaganda or something?
(Or were you referring to the concept and inb4ing the obligatory Nietzschian encouragements?)
Perhaps I am, alright, I have some stigma against Ayn Rand but I will check it out anyway. Thanks!
Zhuangzi is different from the Dao De Jing. I'd actually recommend reading the Dao first so you have some perspective, now that you mention it, but the Zhuangzi was composed much later and is much more surreal in its style and the lessons hit a bit harder imo.
I quite like the Dao De Jing, but your mileage may very with it. Re: Meditations, "be a good citizen, do your work citizen" sounds exactly like the kind of advice you need, desu. Don't read Anthem, Rand's philosophy is paper-thin and barely qualifies as such, and her prose is a slog.
Don't just an hero, homie.
Life was probably at its worst for me around 19-21, and it didn't get much better for a few years after that. I'm guessing you're probably a weirdo in one sense of the word or another. That's cool, and it's hard in its own self-conscious sort of way. But whatever you have going on right now, and maybe more importantly, whatever you don't have going on right now: know that it will change.
There's more in front of you then there is behind. That can be scary because it can sound like I just said: "There's more bad in front of you then you've already gone through" and there will be. But there will also be good that will outshine the darkness.
Don't an hero, homie. It's going to leave behind a scar in people's lives and you have no idea what 5 or even 10 years can do to transform a person from the inside out.
And honestly, you need Jesus.
>but I doubt reading can do more harm than good?
I don't really know. It will do as much harm as sitting idly doing nothing will, because that's what it is basically. Reading can't change the external situation of your life, it can't change the world around you. And if that's what you're having trouble with, well, too bad.
>Don't a lot of self-help programmes involve fitness and meditation,
I haven't tried any of those, but I guess I should. Seems like self-delusion to me, in a way. But whatever makes you feel happy. Is there anything you'd recommend?
>did you mean bigger things when you said "action"?
Yeah, but then again, I have no idea what that might be. In the end, no matter what kind of scenario I come up with, it always comes down to me not being able to enjoy life as it is and for what it is. It all seems like a stupid mistake that should have been prevented.
Like a game you're being forced to play, when you just want to lie down and rest.
Don't kill yourself. life is too beautiful and you are one of the good people here that can see through the bullshit of our society. That makes you better off than most people on this earth. I think you should read Walt Whitman's poetry and then go hiking or something. Feel the life that's inside every fiber of your being. Oh and read meditations some more, because Marcus will explain to you that the most pitiful people are the ones who care about the opinions of others.
Can't prove it's a projection if ended up being a correct assessment
Why would you even bring it up if you didn't want to talk about it? Besides, how do you expect people to know what kind of "help" you're expecting without elaborating on the all of the kinds of problems you have?
Also fuck the whole "ur whle lyfe iz ahed off u mang1!" thing. If you're a high school dropout with a disability at the age of 21 odds are your entire life is going to be extremely shitty. Unless your parents are rich and you stand to inherit a lot of money, you'll most likely be miserable for years on end and maybe be able to turn things around in 10-15 years minimum if you find the motivation to constantly try things and keep at them, and get lucky enough to find real opportunities.
tl;dr: as much as people will tell you life is worth living, that's not always the case
Yes, exactly. What if I don't want to participate in life, why do I still have to slog through all this shit?
Also, I think I would be fine with living off the land in a shed somewhere, but it doesn't seem very possible to me for some reason. Just wish I had some welfare.
I don't really remember. When I was a teen, I wasn't happy, but I didn't really think about it that much. Later on when I did, I came to the conclusion that life is just not worth it. Maybe 3-4 years or so. Why?
Also, are you playing a therapist, or do you feel similarly?
Not playing a therapist. I feel similarly. I don't even know why I asked that. Whenever someone talks about their experience, even if it's as vaguely as you did, I ask them questions about their journey.
Oh, yeah, I can understand that. I do that too, I like to hear other people's experiences. Care to share your thoughts on the subject, or anything at all you'd like to tell? I'd like to hear whatever you have to say. We could also talk someplace else, if you'd be interested in that, as this is a bit too ephemeral; the thread might be deleted or pushed off the board any time.
I should have figured you're not trying to be a therapist, because they usually start handing out advice before you even stop talking. I didn't really see a need to elaborate on my "story", and it seemed a bit too egotistic as it is, so I just kept it at that.
sartre la nausee
sloterdijk - weltfremdheit
this is me btw
Coming from an fucked up home, I dropped out of highschool when i was around 15, played WoW and practically every popular onlinegame there is. In one year of wow i had 167 ingame time.
I started to get into drugs when I was 11. Experimenting with them when i turned 17. molly, psychedelics, speed, coke, meth, 4mec,
3,4-mcma, opiates, benzos, you name it. I took everything I could get my hands on 24/7. Being awake for 3 days was normal.
was a "junkie" for a few years and then stopped. for 2 years. I didn´t work in that time.
Then I started working in production. i worked my fucking ass off, let me tell ya. After 4 months I got offered a job as a project manager. 2k€/month
Started to get my life back on track for a while and now I´m getting my graduation so I can go and study.
Don´t let anyone tell you life is not worth it.
Life´s good. If you want it to be.
Good for you!
Thanks I will see that again.
Never really liked poetry but I'll check it out. maybe give meditations a reread too.
Alright, Jesus would lack the feeling of social unision in my country though.
And the conventional religions I find even more repulsive.
Also I fear embracing religion will backfire in the long run.
Does Kierkegaard help?
>parents are rich and you stand to inherit a lot of money
Sort of true but it's going to be a long time before they kick the bucket.
I won't ever be starving though, or kicked out of the house.
I feel you OP.
Im 21 and i dont really know who i am. I dropped out of college two times now, and started to study yet another major this year. I've seen 2 weeks of classes and im already thinking i dont know if its a major for me. Again.
Its like i dont even know what im good for. I also have heavy anxiety, and that prevent me to go to classes sometime just because i think people are judging me, and also because my fellow classmates are doing a lot of shit and are really talented and achievers, some of them younger than me, while i've done nothing in my life and everything i started i dropped. Its like i got into my uni by accident.
I dont have a lot of friends, because i've gotten into a fight with all of them or just stopped talking. I have just one friend who i love like a brother, but he's obviously uninterested in my issues and have tell me he just feel some times like a father parenting a child when he's with me (he's 7 years older). I'm pretty sure he would stop talking to me if it werent because he fells pity for me, and i dont blame him.
I live in a third world country and in here there is this horrible pressure to be financially productive as soon as posible. So that doesn't help and my mom all the time is getting me into job applications and such.
I fucking hate myself and i spent sometimes just hours and hours reading and watching cinema, but can't seem to get intocreatimg something myself, i just feel stupid.
Im going to start going to the psychologist because my uni apparently saw i have poor mental health, but i dont think its going to make a difference because im going to drop out of it like everything else.
Sometimes i wish someone just run me over or a fucking lighting would strike me, because i dont have the courage to kill myself. I hold on to a little light of hope i still see withing me tho.
Just saying, youre not alone, there are some of us, some that just weren't built for life, i feel.
where you from?
also, that sounds harsh, best of luck.
if anything remember that suicide is highly unlikely (0.01 percent of the population in most countries do it) even more unlikely at our age so, convince yourself you're not going to end this ride the next time you use your time to fantasize about it, since that leaves you wait making your peace with the hand you've been dealt and dealt yourself as your only option.
Im in pretty much the same situation as you.
Theres a poem by Alexander Pushkin called 'Elegy'. Its not gonna change your life or anything but it might give you some reassurance that even in the 1800s people felt this way and probably since civilisation began. Its a nice little poem.
wow you hit more nerves than OPs and he didn't even take it that badly
this is attributed to Heraclitus but it's more of a paraphrase than a quote
>The soul is dyed the color of its thoughts. Think only on those things that are in line with your principles and can bear the light of day. The content of your character is your choice. Day by day, what you do is who you become. Your integrity is your destiny - it is the light that guides your way.
So many bumps, good to see there are more people like moi.
Anyway, here's a dump of books on happiness:
Science of Happiness – Stefan Klien(/Klein?)
Happiness: A Guide to Developing Life's Most Important Skill - Ricard and Goleman
The Conquest of Happiness by Bertrand Russell
Well, since human nature is not all that different, you could be projecting and making correct assessments at the same time (of course I couldn't prove you were projecting even if you did make an incorrect assessment).
>Can't prove it's a projection
Is not contingent on:
>ended up being a correct assessment
being unhappy is the key to a happy life, i'm not so much unhappy emotionally (tho im no normie) but really the constant terror of homelessness and pauperization that americans face is such a great motivator to wake up in the morning and do great work, love it tbqhw
Because being miserable is the natural state of being. Being "happy" is not a real state of being, it's temporary. When you're "miserable", or rather in the natural state, you're as close as possible to being alive, and this is only surpassed by being in life-threatening situations.
A lot of people think that Stoner is a depressing book but it actually helped me understand that your social status, what you leave behind or the realisation of your ambitions are not really what gives meaning and value to your life.
As for suicide, just don't.
I've been contemplating it many times in my life, I'm also a failure, or an underachiever if you want. Dropped out of uni 3 times, incapable of love, few friends, was a shut-in for years. I've always hated myself.
I'm 35 now, and I'm glad I never did kill myself. It's not that life got easier, but I think that with the years I felt the judgement, the social pressure to be normal and successful less and less.
I thought I wanted to be a professor, or a translator, or work in edition. Work with books, surrounded by talented and insightful people. I'm actually a nurse in a hospital now. It's at the opposite of what I thought was supposed to be my path, and yet I love it. I'm always busy at work, I meet a lot of people and sometimes I can feel that I help them, that I make a difference. Off work, I can read, go to museums, attend free lectures and conferences when I fell like it.
Life can get better, even good sometimes. You never know what might happen in the future.