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How DEEP is Pynchon, on a scale from Bret...
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You are currently reading a thread in /lit/ - Literature

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How DEEP is Pynchon, on a scale from Bret Easton Ellis to Phillip K. Dick?
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Extremely. One of the best writers you can read, if not THE best. I don't read fiction that much anymore, but I've thought about buying another Pynchon every now and then. Very technical engineering/mathematical knowledge, in depth philosophical vistas and a general appreciation for mystery and detective-esque tension.
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>>7662546
The Pinecone will go further up your ass than Dick, who was rather flaccid on the whole.
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>>7662556
If you think Pynchon has technical material, you most likely haven't taken a mathematics course beyond Derivatives. His tech knowledge is pedestrian at best, and only introduced to make plebs nod and stare.
His philosophical approach to life is pretty awesome and his satire is top notch, however.
t. Math phd
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>>7662546
I like him, but compared to his contemporaries--Gass and Gaddis, DeLillo, Hawkes, Barth, Orlovitz--he is fairly shallow.
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>>7662546
This is a pretty deep post.
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>>7663281
>DeLillo
I keep seeing people refer to the complexity of DeLillo, but I've read White Noise and it wasn't really challenging at all. Are Libra and Underworld noticeably more 'difficult' or something?
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>>7663299
Libra's not, Underworld bored me so I didnt finish it but Mao II is superior to anytihng he's ever written, probably the greatest work on terrorism of the 20th century.
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>>7663314
Bingo
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>>7663299
I can't speak for the whole of DeLillo's work, but Underworld isn't particularly difficult. The structure is a little fragmented but nothing groundbreaking. There is a lot of stuff left unexplained, but DeLillo, being a bit of a modern mystic, can't explain it either, so you're on equal footing at least.
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>>7663314
>>7663325
Well that confuses me then, because Gravity's Rainbow is pretty confusing at times, to the point where I would think it would warrant being called "difficult" yet DeLillo is often considered in the same tier as ol' Tommy. I just purchased Libra recently, alongside Pinecone's apparently shitty Vineland, and I have the kinda-awful feeling they'll both be of the same (low) level of complexity. If D.'s supposed magnum opus, Underworld, "isn't particularly difficult", then where do academes (incl. Harold Bloom) get off calling DeLillo a deep thinker? As for the authors >>7663281 mentions, I know Gass, Gaddis, and Hawkes are pretty damn challenging, but why include DeLillo of all people in this same tier?
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>>7663337
Difficult =/= deep
DeLillo covers a large spectrum of themes, and he covers them well, and his prose while he does so is fantastic (the dialogue isn't for everybody though, everyone generally speaks in the same voice imo). But what he doesn't do is make the narrative overly complicated or opaque, as it can be in GR for instance. Though maybe I am not doing Underworld justice, it's not a childrens' book, but it is a breeze when compared to (classic) Pynchon. I definitely wouldn't lump him in the same category as the others you mentioned, but he is arguably one of the most important American authors of the last few decades.
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I am ordering Inherent Vice and the Gravity's Rainbow, my first Pynchon novels.

What publisher should I choose?
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>>7663351
Crying lot of 49 or V. first, then read the other. If you got through those, then read GR.

Penguins Classics GR has typos and such, the vintage edition is the best IIRC, also the cover is pretty.
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>>7663357
Pretty sure the vintage one is supposed to be worst?
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>>7663357
OK, do I need to be wary of other Penguin books? They're almost always the most popular ones in Adlibris, online store I use.

Adlibris does have Vintage publisher's version of GR, but only Turtleback Books or Random House UK for IV. Any suggestions?

>CLo49 or V first
I want to read IV because I liked the film (I know, they're not the same) and GR because I've read so much discussion about it.
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>>7663369
Oh wait, the Gravity's Rainbow is also Random House UK (but Vintage series, whatever that means)
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>>7663337
I wanted to give an example that more people have read.
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>>7663369
Inherent Vice is an okay starting point desu, not GR though. Optimally you should have some knowledge of Pynchon and how he writes/what he writes about. I hear he wrote large parts of GR while tripping balls on acid, so knowing the place of mind he's coming from makes digesting it easier (or even possible in the first place)
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>>7663378
I've read plenty of threads about him and his books in here.

I just need to figure out which publishers book to order.
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>>7663382
There's a flowchart going around, basically avoid the Where's Waldo covers, they have blurry text and apparently there's a line of text missing from GR (as if anyone would notice lol).

Random House should be fine, but speaking from experience (got M&D and IV from Random House), the hardcovers are pretty big, as in the dimensions of the actual book. A little unwieldly if you read on the go. Mb try the paperbacks?
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>>7663396
>>7663396
>basically avoid the Where's Waldo covers
http://www.adlibris.com/fi/kirja/gravitys-rainbow-9780099533214

So dodge this? It's by Vintage and has WW cover.

http://www.adlibris.com/fi/kirja/gravitys-rainbow-9780099511755
This is by Random House but is Vintage series (the top one is Vintage publisher)

So the bottom one should be a good version?
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>>7663369
Here's what i'd advise.

Start with Mason and Dixon and give up because it's dense and astoundingly original. Absolutely a gut-punch. Do this. Read around 100 or so pages. If it still grabs you, you're on the train and can read in any order. But if not then go straight to Against the Day. It's easier and a fucking masterpiece.

Rest come later in any order you like. And GR comes last.

Enjoy.

But don't take my advice. Go do it in your own style because with Pynchon you can't go wrong.
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>>7663420
C-can you give advice with regards to which publisher to buy from?
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>>7663420

against the day? really?
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>>7663401
Where's Waldo is the first one, so avoid that, yes.

Not sure about the second one, but since there seem to be very few versions of GR around, and that's not the WW one, I think it should be fine. Most people have that version I think.

If you're willing to spend a little more money, you should go for the Viking Press version though, they're the ones who published the first edition. It's almost guaranteedly mistake-free and has the bitchin' original cover
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How TALL is Jeff Goldblum, on a scale from Danny Devito to Tom Cruise?
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>>7663464
thas pretty funny joke
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So is the penis controlling the bomb a pro-feminist argument (aside from the obvious satirical viewpoint)?
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>>7662546
john green, honestly

a juvenile memester hack
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>>7665842
No, it was a commentary on poor statistics. There was no correlation between Slothrop's dick and the rocket strikes. Slothrop was fucking so many women and so so many rockets were striking London that within the time span they chose for significant correlation, statistically, a rocket would have to strike down within the general area of where he boned. I think they said that it was between three days and two weeks for a rocket to strike within the same grid square as one he fucked in. Depending on the grid used, that could be within the same square kilometer or the same 250000m2 area, which is a huge area in London to account for V2 landings.
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>>7663369
For what it's worth, I went straight from CoL49 to GR and I'm doing fine with it so far, about 1/3 of the way in. In fact I'm really loving it.

CoL49 is an excellent first step mainly because of it's length compared to other Pynchon novels. If you make it through that and are hungry for more, GR will most likely be fine for you.

I skipped V. because I wasn't following a /lit/ chart, maybe it would be better to do it before GR, but in my opinion it's not necessary.

I'm probably going to go Slow Learner>V.>Inherent Vice after GR, then take a breather before tackling Mason & Dixon or Against the Day.
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