No, it's not going to Just Go Away edition
>What is AGP?
Autogynephilia, from Greek, αὐτό- ("self"), γυνή ("woman") and φιλία ("love")
Broadly, sexual arousal to the thought of oneself as a woman
>AGP questions & answers
>Thoughts & feelings / emotions
>Help, advice and / or guidance
>Be cozy and chill out
>Post fits, inspo etc
GTFO of this thread, you useless shit, you see people here having faggotry and this stuff neatly detangled, and there you go attempting to re-muddle them with some dumbshit populist lingo. Go away and die!
Do I have AGP if I'm not interested in dressing in women's clothes, have no sexual fantasies about being woman but have massive jealousy of girls? That was mentioned as on of the AGP symptoms. Also I've been taking hormones for a long time now but still in boymode and have no plans to live as woman or something like that. I have no definite gender identity as well.
Jealousy of women is a symptom of gender dysphoria, which is commonly aquired after becoming attached to the fetish. Are you homosexual? If not, I don't know how this is possible unless the fetish has lost its sexual power over you.
>Are you homosexual?
No I'm not. I am strictly heterosexual but never had much sex drive. I had crushes on girls since childhood but for some reason idea of having sex with them always seemed unappelaing for me. I used to think then that i had some kind of sexual dysfunction. Now beeing on hormones I've lost interest in sexual interactions almost completely but still can experience sexual arousal sometimes and masturbate.
>Do you feel better on hormones?
I'm not sure but thoughts of becoming more masculine frighten me.
What if I don't fit the agp/truetrans dichotomy? I've kind of accepted that I'm trans (no hrt yet), but my sexuality is so confusing I don't know if I'll ever be able to love or be loved.
>Always had fetishes about being dominated, and when they involved people, always saw myself as a girl
>never wanted to fuck women, never aroused by tits, butts or vags, just never ever
>never attracted to men either, until two years ago I started fetishizing cock and my interest has been growing since, still don't find men "hot" as a whole
>sex with women, using my cock, being a boyfriend, a husband etc. feels completely alien and unappealing
>sex with men feels appealing but only if I were a girl, as a guy it feels like it would be very uncomfortable. I can totally imagine a man playing with my (hypothetical) tits, pulling my hair, etc.
>yet again I don't find men "hot" and I'm too uncomfortable to intimately touch another human being with a ten foot pole.
Seriously what the fuck. Am I unable to develop a healthy sexual/romantic orientation due to dysphoria? Or am I just doomed to never being happy? I'm feeling like total shit all day because every normal person I cross path with reminds me that I'm utterly dysfunctional while they get their normie-ness for granted. For one thing I feel envious of the girl whenever I see a heterosexual couple my age, but I'm at such a level of confusion that I can't just take anything at face value.
Yes. I don't have AGP, in spite of having a extremely non-trivial percentage of my fantasies being sexual ones situated as a woman, and have been very interested in living as a woman and dressed in women's clothes a lot.
But I haven't been jealous of women. I've always seen myself on-side with women. When women compare to me favourably, I just feel like a failure.
And everyone would just insist that I must be jealous of *men*. Even though there's no reason, nothing enviable about those smug bottomfeeders, they'll still mouth that kind of shit off at me.
>And everyone would just insist that I must be jealous of *men*. Even though there's no reason, nothing enviable about those smug bottomfeeders, they'll still mouth that kind of shit off at me.
Who's everyone, and under what circumstances would they say that to you?
Everyone around me, the groups of people I find myself in, usually it would be led by a vapid posturing-male, one that probably learns how to act like a "man" from movies, and then the rest would fall in line, with what petty vicious pack animals people are.
That sissy fetish, AGP/Dysphoria. Fucking this man. All I can think about all day, everyday is inhabiting every girl's body I see and getting fucked by her boyfriend in a super degrading way.
i keep saying i'm going to get off the skittles and just get a gf but i'm too autism anyway so what's the point? and would ieven enjoy having gf or would ijust end up wanting to be her all the time then and fucking everything up anyway?
shoot me in the face
I'm on skittles and I can't go outside, can't work, can't stop thinking about this shit, etc. If I even see a pretty, feminine girl in public, I'm struck with extreme feelings of envy and it ruins my fucking day. Someone please tell me that hormones make this shit better... People tell me that talk therapy is impossible for this and that just kills me inside. Might just take my dad's rifle and put a bullet in my head to be honest.
well it hasn't helped after a couple months for me, it's just as bad and now basically i'ts more panic inducing because the time to decide is running out there's no pause button. it's either disgusting old man or tranny and it's killing me
>People tell me that talk therapy is impossible for this and that just kills me inside
i think i knew this already...it's like you'd have to find the one in a million of someone both willing to consider this a real thing and also knowing how to actually help you. what am i supposed to do, just keep going to them despite bing disappointed every time?
>100% passable 10/10 qt.
Are you over 13?
That's what I'm saying. I know I can never become who I see myself as in my head and hormones realistically ain't doing much to help my case. All I want to be able to do is get a fucking job without having to see beautiful women every day. I WANT to be able to be happy with what I have but I just fucking can't and it doesn't help that therapists laugh me off and make light of my problems as if they aren't real in my mind. If I could've been happy with what I had, I wouldn't have dropped hormones in the first place. Hormones legit amplified my issue, because I finally see how far off I am from how I see myself.
>it doesn't help that therapists laugh me off and make light of my problems as if they aren't real in my mind.
what the fuck? where do you live and what kind of therapists are these?
Cutting my dick off and then being humiliated by not having a dick anymore,being forced to pee sitting down, getting double penetrated, having to use a strap on if I wanna fuck a girl... bunch of stuff related to having a vag/not having a dick
And of course this all has lead to a lot of genital dysphoria so I kinda want SRS pretty bad
Wow, FUCK. I'm sorry. I too have a lot of humiliating fantasies that have developed into legitimate dysphoria over the years. I came up with that strap on fantasy on my own though. My fantasies moreso include having a vagina and a pair of boobs that a man can fuck whenever he feels the need and I'd be just a helpless housewife, forced to wear humiliating, frilly skirts and dresses to please the male eye. Also, holding hands with a man while wearing girl clothes gets me tock hard. Humiliation AGP is not funny.
Call me when you're posting ads on craig's list, whoring yourself out because you fond the thought of riding an older man's big cock while wearing girly clothes and having an erection to be the most humiliating thing ever. Yowch.
I'm not going to lie, I hope it is too. If I know anything it's that I get bored of certain fantasies and just design more and more extremely emasculating situations in my mind that I crave to live out real time.
Agreed. The shit is like a sexualized drug. You keep escalating the fantasies over and over again and never actually reach the end of the rainbow.You think "If I do x, it'll make me happy. If I do y, I'll finally be able to focus on other things in life", but you never actually end up content(at least in my case). I've spent a good amount of money on FFS and my whole life is still centered around my "transition". Nothing else seems to matter.
Yeah. It's driven by the fetish. I'm sure some would tell me that these desires have always been unconsciously there, but they weren't. What was always there was the propensity to be aroused by extereme emasculation, which I never delved into until my girlfriend decided to leave her clothes at my house. I managed to live a pretty damn good 25 years of my life before discovering my fetish that manage to eclipse my heterosexuality. After conditioning myself to this fetish for a few years, I woke up to realize that it became a legitimate part of my emotional health. I felt the need for people to see me as a woman to feel whole.
I used to think I was asexual AGP... I'd always flick through the over-the-top sissy captions that included servicing cocks... I just wasn't interested in them. Low and behold I'm now a full-blown cockwhore. We all join the cocksucker/rider club eventually whether we like it or not. We're aroused by imagining ourselves as those pretty women we see walking down the streets in stilletto heels, right? Newsflash, those girls suck cocks and you will too.
Solo or lesbian porn, no men, no cocks. I fap only couple times a month.
>We're aroused by imagining ourselves as those pretty women we see walking down the streets in stilletto heels, right?
I don't like high heels and feminine clothes overall. I prefer baggy unisex clothes or even something more masculine. I wish I could wear some of those and still be perceived as a female in public.
> When I was a kid I wanted Barbie dolls and diaries.
> I would cry over nothing and form strong emotional connections.
> My parents beat it out of me though.
> Fast forward to teenage years.
> I thought I was solely attracted to girls.
> I would still buy perfumes, slimfit clothing etc.
> I knew more about makeup, guys and perfumes than most girls I knew.
> I was also addicted to porn, but it was different.
> I would watch porn in which the girls had the physical attributes that I desired.
> My porn fetishes got more extreme, but it was always something I could imagine myself doing.
> Discover transsexual porn; my whole world changes.
> "Can you be a girl but still keep your penis? Wow"
> Became fucking obsessed; that's how I wanted to be.
> Note; I never actually wanted to get rid of my penis. I wanted to be a girl with a penis.
> I like when I shoot cum.
> I like that I can both masturbate and bottom at the same time.
> Meanwhile; my personality traits became less and less masculine.
> Pluck eyebrows, wear girls shirts and collect perfumes.
> Parents beat me and verbally abuse me to get it out of me.
> Every time I was in a relationship the sex life would die after a few months.
> I just wanted to be the girl, not be the masculine top.
> Every relationship failed because of my clinginess, broken emotions and the dead sex life.
> Would only enjoy handjobs since it made me feel like I had my 'clitoris' rubbed.
> Would hide clothes, dildos and my webcam in a black box beneath my bed.
> Felt I was too ugly to transition, but at least I was skinny.
> Never did anything to help myself because of parents and appearance (other than body)
> Therapists brushed it off as nothing - every single fucking time.
> Now I'm fat thanks to depression binges and antipsychotics.
> And I'm 26 years old.
> I can only attract older guys with a chubby sissy fetish.
> I can never be who I wanted to be.
Nope, no prior indications at all. Girlfriend left her panties and skirt at my house, put them on, got hard and that was it. Also, yeah, never have gotten a hard-on for a man and am insanely attracted to the female form. I'd only had female crushes growing up. I'm just so attracted to emasculating myself, that i'd be willing to suck the cock to achieve that arousal. I don't really look at the guy in porn. I have no feelings for them looks-wise. I look at the woman the whole time and it especially helps if the woman is very attractive.
Theoretically speaking, depending on how attached to the fetish you are, you could take anti-androgens which will lower your sex drive substancially, to the point where you won't feel the need to jerk off like crazy anymore. Of course, if your emotional attachment to being a woman is too ingrained inside of you, this won't help you much. This is for the same reason that pedophiles who are on anti-androgens still commit offenses, even with low sex drives. Pedophilia and romantic attraction, without sex still exists within them.
Femgen shitposter here, care to tell me where I'd fall in your typology? Take estrogen and stuff to look feminine but I don't think I actually want to be a woman or 'identify' as one. I'm mostly just into guys but but get oddly happy about guys saying I look feminine or mistaking me for female.
I mean I don't want any trace of male secondary traits on my body, but I don't really care about having female sex traits like breasts or genitals if that clarifies anything.
>massive jealousy of girls
This to an unhealthy amount. I mean it's probablly just jealousy over the white picket fence marriage and stuff they can have. Also, girls aren't mistreated for being effeminate or liking boys.
So yea, just how AGP am I? What category would those wacky old psychologists put me in?
This is prescisely why AGP should be looked into as a more legitimate issue. The fantasies can be distressing, I know. There needs to be a proper coping therapy, in combination with or without hormones to see how the person can live the happiest life possible. For some, it isn't social pressures that cause the suicide but the distress of constant fantasies bombarded into one's mind.
The problem is that there really isn't a clinical definition of AGP (in the way it's being used in this thread, not the Blanchard version), and it might be controversial how disjoint or related it might be to the definitions of trans and other gender non-conforming conditions.
Well, what we have seen is that hypothetcally, if we can conclude that the fantasies are indeed what cause the physical dysphoria, there should be a kind of therapy that directly hits on this subject. Obviously it wouldn't be conversion therapy, but more of a coping therapy, to keep the fantasies controlled and at bay. We can't control our sexual fantasies, but we may be able to control how we perceive them. The thing is, I don't think many people will admit that sexual desire had anything to do with their female identity for fear of not being treated with hormones. This would leave those that are deeply distressed by their sexual desires alone in the dark, left to their own devices and being treated lightly by therapists. Truth is, AGP is quite a serious thing in its many forms.
probably partial anatomic AGP. lots of anatomic AGPers don't care about living a woman socially, but want a female body. although your mention of some preferences for the woman's social kind of conflicts here. but i wouldn't say you're terribly AGP if you don't have sexual fantasies of being a woman in some form
so what am I supposed to do in the meantime? I don't forsee it reaching the mainstream in time for it to actually be useful for me - too many people get way too angry over it for that. the problem is that it seems like anyone open to looking outside the mainstream will also advocate shit like "find Jesus"
>fantasies are indeed what cause the physical dysphoria
How could that be possible?
The body dysmorphia is an entirely distinct thing neurologically and biologically. It isn't impossible to believe that somebody could have both, but sex kinks can't cause the phenotype responsible for dysmorphia and I highly doubt any of those fifty year old late transitioning men ever experienced it in any sense of the word.
I guess you have a few options that come to mind. You could of course transition and see how much further the rabbit hole will take you down, as you won't lose your sexual arousal, so therefore more fantasies. You could work your ass off to try and find an amazing psychologist who is willing to work with you, but doesn't aim to convert and or rid you of your fantasies. You could try socially living as a woman without hormones, though in my case this just made me crave more and more feminity, but that may be where the rabbit hole ends for you. For now though, you should find someone you can vent everything out to. This really seemed to help me the most and keep me sane and grounded. Also, isolation will only make matters worse for you. Aim to talk to people, many people. Find hobbies. Pick up an instrument, a video game, anything. The more you distract yourself from your sexual irges the less attached to your psyche they'll become. Of course transitioning is reccomended and for good reason, I just believe that therapista don't understand th condition at all yet and aren't equipped to deal with sexual fantasies.
Of course fantasies can cause dysphoria. Sexual fantasies of any kind can cause dysphoria and trigger humans to do crazy things. According to Jung, one must live out all sexual fantasies to be whole, this seems like what we're seeing here in AGP. Also, about physical dysphoria. It is possible that in those more aware of their sexuality at a younger age, say 7 or 8, they were too young to realize how attached they were becoming to the thought of being female, so they will genuinely deny the existence of erotic fantasies, as they've had them for so long that they aren't abnormal or distressing at all to them. What they're left with is that feeling of incongruence between body and mind. For those less aware l, like myself, I discovered my AGP at 22 years old and had managed to love an almost asexual, gratifying life up until the point where I discovered it. As I indulged more into it, I associated the feelings of being female with pleasure, thus triggering an extreme social dysphoria inside of me that I hadn't previously had. Of course by the time I realized this, it was already too late for me. Those 50 year old transexuals that you mention were raised in a time where what they did was literally unnaceptable. They were not backed by social justice as they were now, so what most of them did was crossdress full-time at home, living in fear of their desires. Some joined the military, got married, etc, hoping it would all go away but of course, the imprint is permanent. Only now that it is semi-tolerable in society to be a transexual do we see them coming out of the woodwork.
Never heard of them causing the dysmorphia responsible for GID, and biologically they aren't the same thing in the least. If somone really was just driven by the sex and not the same sort of revulsion that people who have a problem with their body have, then they wouldn't clinically have GID.
If you were a 10/10, sexy, fit male in your fantasies, but in real life you were a nerdy, fat starcraft player, could you not see that triggering any sort of body dysmorphia within the person that fantasizes these things? Only thing is, here we're imaginimg ourselves as sexy females. Being that most of us cannot plausibly become female-looking, we're extremely self critical of ourselves and aim to eliminate anything male about ourselves. We want to get as close as possible to looking like what we fantasize ourselves to be, just as the fat nerd works his ass off to become that 10/10 male.
>probably partial anatomic AGP. lots of anatomic AGPers don't care about living a woman socially, but want a female body
There's just one problem with that, being slender and having a feminine face are not exclusively female traits, they're also neotenous traits. I starved myself when a kid to stop my body from growing too 'large' and the pills really are just a better and less painful way to do that now. So really, I think the anatomic stuff is the least suspect part about this.
>although your mention of some preferences for the woman's social kind of conflicts here
Because in truth I'm unsure. I'm think I'm fine being an effeminate gay male, that's what I've always been. I mean sure people thinking I'm female is nice but I was an effeminate boy as a child, not a girl, and I utterly despise how traditional therapy would eliminate all nuance and individualism by forcing me to become some sick old man's idea of what femininity is. keeping my body from turning on itself shouldn't come at the cost of being turned into a caricature, maybe that's part the reason I want to continue saying male.
But, still, the social role women have, the white picket fence and kids lifestyles they can have without social disapproval and ostracism for being feminine or liking men is something I'd want. It contradicts what I just said but if I had a choice I'd rather have been born a girl.
> if you don't have sexual fantasies of being a woman in some form
Um, white picket thing and being attracted to straight men pushes dangerously close to this.
It's pretty suspect from that perspective. I'm really more confused than anything.
>You could of course transition and see how much further the rabbit hole will take you down, as you won't lose your sexual arousal, so therefore more fantasies.
yeah...I mean this is always there and I guess the problem is that if this is going to be the inevitable outcome I want to know that earlier than later
>You could work your ass off to try and find an amazing psychologist who is willing to work with you, but doesn't aim to convert and or rid you of your fantasies.
how would I go about this? mass email a bunch of psychs and ask them if they have any opinions on AGP or something? I can't really afford to go to one without insurance and my insurance wouldn't work well with not sticking with one for an extended time
>You could try socially living as a woman without hormones, though in my case this just made me crave more and more feminity, but that may be where the rabbit hole ends for you.
this is basically the opposite of what I'd want
>you should find someone you can vent everything out to. This really seemed to help me the most and keep me sane and grounded.
like in real life? I don't know if I could share this with anyone except people I don't really know.. how has it helped you?
Did anyone else buy a powerball ticket? If I win I'm flying to wherever does the best plastic surgery and I'm getting this body.
the fucckkk, you are me.....
I've really just come to terms with the dysphoria and channel it into music/art.
Although I've been on a week and a half long ket/lsd binge....ugh I'm so mentally fried right now
Just want to get on hrt...
My AGP is only getting worse. I just watched porn and the girl did absolutely nothing for me other than make me imagine I was her. Her curves, her hair, her being fucked and everything else.
I'm fucked, ain't I? I want to get out of this mess and just make love to my gf again ;-; The first frw months of our relationship we made love every day. Now we never do since I can't 'man' up because of my thoughts..
Hmmmm, mine is also getting awfully worse. I can feel the longings becomi g more powerful and gripping with each masturbation session. Now when I see a pretty girl, I picture myself transforming into her and getting fucked. I admire every curve on her body to the point of extreme envy. I always tell myself that I'm going to take a break from masturbating compulsively to clear my head, but when the feelings come back, giving in just feels so good. I just can't control myself.
Mine also becomes worse with every masturbation session. I believe it's because the act of masturbation in itself isn't enough and it only makes me crave more. I don't find it satisfying as long as I'm not a girl and the downfall after the orgasm is the worst. The whole; "I'm gonna stop, I'm a dirty fetishist etc." I mean, I even masturbate like a girl: rubbing, vibrators and buttplugs plus loud moans. I know all about the extreme envy. Whenever I see a modelesque girl - especially in high waisted jeans - it makes me wanna cry. I can't even get the figure even though I'm tall enough. Mental meds has made me fat due to the binges that follow along with them. Now I'm just a fat, disoriented, dirty fetishist scum and I'll never be a qt ;-;
If one of my biggest fantasies is being forced to attend an all girl's school wearing a cute feminine uniform and basically living full-time as a girl while being refered as one as well-- does that make me AGP; or just a gay-ass anime enthusiast?
i felt pretty alright today. do you think just being lonely can make agp unbearable and make me think i want to be a girl? part of me thinks i should just cut my hair to hide my disgusting facial features better and just put this all behind me.
Yeah. Being lonely definitely exaggerates the effects of AGP because your mind is constantly focused on arousal. I haven't had a job in like 4 months and my AGP is becoming unbearable.... again.
i figured. but how do i interact with people again? i was neet for 2 years and just...can't do it anymore.
if i am to get over it i'd definitely need a gf too. i wanted to try some of the online dating things but i realized i've become incredibly boring and ugly now and i'd have to be that autist who has pictures that scream "i am a loser who has no friends"
Can I cure my agp with this?
Friendly reminder that autogynephillia doesn't exist and you're all trans trying to funnel your desire to change your gender into your sexual life. Crush your balls today and become a eunich, no sexual desire and no testosterone.
Friendly reminder that you're an autogynephilic transexual trying to deny your roots and making up random dichotomy's like "funneling your desire into your sex life". See how this works? The biggest AGP's bark the loudest.
>autogynephilia doesn't exist
>somehow you know that I don't get aroused every time I fantasize about being a woman even though this is the case
>I and everybody else ITT must be creating an elaborate plot just to troll you
Not them but if you're just some creep who wanks to this, then you're just a creep.
Anorexia, dysphasia and other medical conditions sure aren't the same thing as masculine cross dressers and pedophiles
>happy at thought of being a woman
>thinking about sex as a woman turns you on
>somehow this means you aren't transsexual because women don't think about themselves having sex or somthing?
>acknowledges that autogynephilia exists
>claims that autogynephillia doesn't exist
No they aren't, but I think it's a fallacy to believe that one can't derive dysphoria from something that is just a fetish. If you can only get off on being a woman, and you look nothing like your sexual fantasies, dysphoria between reality and fantasy is bound to happen.
I shouldn't have to reply to this but I'm an AGP transexual, furry. I get off on humans transforming into female animals. Do you mean to tell me that because I get off on turning into an animal, that I'm actually an animal? This argument is pretty poor.
Do you get off to the thought of transforming into the animal or doing sexualized acts as an animalized woman?
Furry shit has been around 100000 years, humans tend to feel deep connections with animals. Wanting to revert to an animalistic state and have sex as a women does't make you an autogynophile, it makes you a thirsty, attention deprived tranny.
>thought I was trans
>now TERF/recovering autogynephile
going to come clean to my therapist that I was never trans then kill myself desu
Ive seen the light, friend
Gender doesn't real
trannies are either women with internalized misogyny or men with fetishes
TERFs tend to be academics who are seriously into gender theory while, well.. take a look at the tranny crowd... stephonknee, caitlyn jenner, chris-chan
if it looks like a cow, smells like a cow, and moos like a cow....
Pedophiles don't get anorexia from their pedophilia. No amount of Lamarckian wishing can induce a physical condition that only arrises from a biological mechanism you weren't involved in.
Bruce and stephonknee's fetishes didn't magically go back in time and pickle them with estrogen in the womb
Uh a apart from a polemisist or two with a sociology degree they're all just lunatics in tumblr and Twitter.
Not just that but radfems are full of crossdressing old men like Yardley, Hellen and other perverted men who creep on girls in the bathroom while looking like that.
You said it yourself, you're one of them so why is a perv like you fit to lecture on morality?
>Implying Tumblr > Biomedical consensus
>Gender doesn't real
It's just a developmental defect regarding sex. What doctors say is a 'disorder of sex development'. But yeah, go ahead and tell everyone why your experience in being some crossdressing pedophile makes you fit to meddle in the medicine people with conditions need.
Oh lord, the estrogen in the womb thing. Sure it's POSSIBLE that this is true, but unlikely considering the millions of other theories out there.
Truth is, we don't know shit about human psychology yet, or how the brain works for that matter. We won't understand homosexuality or paraphilias in our lifetime.
So either technology will increase enough to be able to give transexual individuals flawless surgeries, to where they'll easily pass as the opposite sex, OR/and we'll try to understand what causes sexual imprints and how we can erase or re-wire those imprints, the former being much more likely to happen in the next 30 years.
We've known about this since those experiments with rats decades ago. The mounds of molecular data found by all the Cohen influenced researchers just made it conclusive.
Hormones make a dramatic difference gene expression and phenotype in prenatal and early development. Most of these phenotypic effects on grey matter are irreversible at that too. Even cannula and retro viruses in grown mammals won't give you much control in the macro phenotype.
Maybe if you stuck to what's been found over poppsych you'd make more sense.
>don't know human psychology
Also, psychology might be highly speculative but neurology and genetics aren't. And nuclear steroid crap does directly change transcription in long term for developmental neuro genes like rora
I'd like you to take a look at this article by J. Michael Bailey. The article describes several different Erotic Identity Disorders, but goes more into detail about Autopedophilia, where the person who is attracted to children gets off to imagining themselves a child themselves, Michael Jackson being the poster child for this disorder.
The other Erotic Identity Disorders described in this article are Autogynephiles(One who is attracted to women and of themselves as a woman) and Apotemnophiles(One who is attracted to amputees and of themselves as amputees). If his hypothesis is correct, these folks also experience dysphoria, though not to the amount an autogynephile feels and this because surgery is MUCH less socially acceptable for these conditions.
Anyway, Autogynephilia is more than real. How? It's literally the act of being attracted to yourself as a woman. If you find that in your fantasies you're masturbating to yourself looking like your ideal female, having sex as a female(but not necessarily having any attraction to the partner), attracting attention to yourself as a female, etc, etc, you're an autogynephile by psychiatric definition. Blanchard didn't just pull the term out of his ass.
I'm pretty sure you're referring to a bunch of stuff that gets referred to as proving this, and doesn't at all. Like not even, is disputable, just is about something else entirely and people quote the names of the studies without reading them.
Your "average" female sexuality is clearly different from the Autogynephiles. Where the Autogynephile is aroused by picturing themselves as an attractive, desirable female and not necessarily their partner. This is why you see what can only be described as Pseudo-bi-sexuality in Autogynephiles, where they describe not being attracted to the aesthetic beauty of their partner, but how their partner can make them feel more like their object of attraction(women). The Autogynephilic individual is essentially aroused not by men themselves, but by the idea itself of being attracted to men.
The "normal" heterosexual female is Androphilic(Androphilia describes sexual attraction to men or masculinity). The "normal" female will also describe the intense desire to be with a man, as a woman, but is not sexually attracted to the thought of herself as a woman, but by the male himself. The gynephilic male would be the opposite of this.
So yes, there does exist every orientation under the sun Autoandrophilic males(object of attraction is masculinity/men and the thought of themselves as men), these are usually your gays with six packs desiring "masc4masc" only. Androphilic men or hyperfeminine, flamboyant gays, those of who are so feminine that many(not all) desire to become women themselves, but are not attracted to the thought of themselves as women, this is the closest you'll get to the female sexuality in a man.
You've got the Gynephilic man, or your average, straight, heterosexual male sexually attraction to women or femininity as a man, but is not aroused by the thought of himself as a man.
Then you have the Autogynephilic female. These are usually your "lipstick" Lesbians, who are attracted to femaleness and the thought of themselves as the "ideal" female.
Proceeding that, you have the gynephilic females(or butch Lesbians), many of these females are so masculine that they don't really feel right in the feminine gender role, so they seek to become men themselves, but are not attracted to the very thought of themselves as men(most comparable to heterosexual men).
Next we have the Autoandrophilic woman, the seemingly straight female who is so attracted to masculinity and the thought of herself as male, that she will seek to become male herself.
So there you have it. Transbians are much like Lipstick Lesbians ,or Autogynephilic Lesbians. Gay trans men have much the same sexuality as Autoandrophilic gay men. Hyperfeminine gays are most comparable to straight-women in their attraction and Hypermasculine Lesbians are most comparable to straight men.
Now another question is, why is it that the autogynephilic and the autoandrophilic female are more likely to fit their assigned sexes personality traits, yet are still attracted to the thought of themselves as men/women? Also, why is it that most Autoandrophilic gay men and Autogynephilic gay women are so attracted to the traits of their same sex, yet the masculine-looking gay is usually feminine in nature and the feminine-looking lesbian is more so masculine in nature?
I've never said it isn't real, if anything it has been soundly proven that fetishists are out there.
What hasn't been proven is idea that paraphilias can cause unrelated medical conditions. The psychologists, surveys of fetishists notwithstanding have never been able to refute the model Cohen and other neurologists, molecular geneticist and hard sciences have built with everything from pickled directed rats and neuro patients to in vitro biochemical and expression tests.
Simply documenting that there are paraphilias out there doesn't negate the dominant theories in neurology and genetics, nor does it construct a viable model for how a paraphilias could retro causally cause hormone induced developmental malformations.
More likely you simply have middle aged fetishists who do not have the phenotype associated with gid.
Old news, we've know for forever that genes responsible for neurological development and pruning are sex steroid sensitive.
Steroids are a main way for ensuring what from the genome makes it to product so of course they are responsible for creating phenotype in everything from neurology to the immune
You simply need to google rora and prenatal hormones and take your pick of papers so don't start.
you're using words that i'm sure you must not know the meaning of. Do you have any formal training in any branch of science?
No shit genes are responsible for neurological development, just like every other kind of development, but you then go on to say that that proves all actions are purely genetic and environmental factors cannot influence the brain, which is about as true as saying the sun is green. There is no science even slightly close to the insanity you are spouting.
I forget the name of the fallacy, but you're saying something correct, and then acting like that thing proves a point which is unrelated to the correct thing. Which proves you're either ignorant, intentionally lying, or insane.
Interesting. I too have read so many accounts online of gay men and women who were indeed turned on by themselves. I think it's definitely true that the gay men who are more attracted to themselves are more likely to be in good shape and well groomed, as they're turning the object of desire onto themselves(men) and vice versa for gay women.
Also, I think this makes sense as to why more masculine-seeming gay men and more feminine-seeming gay women are more likely to have bi-sexual tendencies but are not likely to actually be attracted the the partner, instead they are using them as objects to feel more like the object of desire they wish to be(the feminine -woman, or the masculine-man). So, one could say that they're so gay that they have straight-tendencies.
I also agree that the autogynephilic male bears much similarity to the (Lipstick Lesbian) female, and the autoandrophilic female bears much resemblance to the (masculine-seeming) gay male. Maybe it really is a case of erotic target location error, where some of the gay- female sexuality is implanted upon a male and vice versa for females.
Very interesting stuff.
This would also make sense as to why the gynephilic gay male would desire to become female, as nature is almost calling them to present in a more feminine manner being that the more masculine gays don't desire feminine gays, so the feminine gays will then(almost by nature) desire to take on a more female-esque style of dress and mannerism set to attract men.
In an essence, they quite literally have the sexuality of your average everyday female, inside of a male body.
Human nature is fucking crazy.
Yes of course, but is it a crime to attempt to rationalize why things are the way they are? That is of course how progress is made. Human sexuality is fascinating. I'm not saying I'm 100% correct on anything, but from what I've observed, this seems to be the way things are.
As to how human sexuality manifests itself, and what your sexuality has to do with your personality is anyone's guess.
This thread is giving me a panic attack right now, because I started thinking, what if I'm not gay but just have Autogynephilia, and if I have gay sex it will trigger feelings of wanting to become a woman, shit now I'm too afraid to have gay sex because of irrational fear that I might be developing something or becoming something bad. Because when I hear about this dysphoria it reminds me of the time I had a nervious breakdown and I had the worst panic attack in my life, I thought that I had developed schizophrenia ecause of drug use and thinks would only go downhills from there and I would end up slowly loosing my mind. Turned out I was just having a severe panic attack and generalized anxiety.
I'm afraid to own a gun because I'm afraid that I might be feeling low one day and decide to blow my brains out just because I was depressed in the moment.
Why do I have to over think everything? It took me some time to accept that I was gay and not some "straight person who thought he was gay".
I don't get an erection from thinking of myself as a girl, but somehow I'm afraid I might start thinking that way if I start sucking dick.
I don't think I'm ready for gay sex... why must I be so neurotic?
>why is it that most Autoandrophilic gay men and Autogynephilic gay women are so attracted to the traits of their same sex, yet the masculine-looking gay is usually feminine in nature
inb4 femboys who swallow hormones and do a lot of stuff that makes them look an awful lot like women. Catty as fuck too.
I wouldn't say that femminie acting gays are masculine looking.
Sounds like obsessive-compulsive disorder friend. I know how it feels to have an autogynephilic sexuality andhave obsessive-compulsive disorder at the same time(not saying you're agp), but I regularly have panic attacks because of overthinking things. Things like forgetting how to breathe, developing schizophrenia, being forced to transition into a woman(which is terrifying and arousing at the same time).
I was hospitalized at one point because I was avoiding all sharp objects for the irrational fear of accidentally stabbing myself in the throat with them, or compulsively hurting one of my family members. Then there was the time I would only eat liquid foods because I was afraif of choking, etc.
Anyways, what kind of porn do you regularly enjoy? Are you in any way aroused by women? Do you look at the woman first or the man first in a crowd and find them attractive? Have you ever crossdressed? How did it make you feel?
My advice is to first see a therapist about OCD. Don't tell them you have it. Let them come to that conclusion themselves. Then analyze your fears and how they make you feel. Normal anxiety would b to have the knowledge that you're an AGP transexual, but you're scared of how your family and friends would react. Obsessive-compulsive fears would be more along the lines of "What if I'm actually turning into a transexual?". Then again, AGP can trigger an obsessive-compulsive episode as it did with myself, but you have to beat the irrational fears first to come to the "real" fears you have.
Right, what I'm saying though is that you read everywhere that masculine-idolizing gays(the guys with fucking ripped bodies, big beards, etc), usually have personalities that are feminine, yet they're turned on by picturing themselves as the ideal male in personality/looks.
Could it be that one who is attracted to males is more likely feminine in nature and one who is attracted to women is moreso masculine, even if they're attracted to the thought of themselves as men/women themselves?
I honestly don't think it's possible to suppress masculinity/femininity. This is why I think transbians have a hard time trying to mock femininity, because it just isn't in their nature.
I think I got really anxious because I was jerking off, a guy on grindr wanted to meet me today(but I ain't feeling horny enough today) then I got this relazation, "fuck I'm agreeing to meet a guy and let him fuck me in the ass when I've never even tried anything with a guy before". I'm also scared to have sex because I had a panic attack after I had sex with a woman in her 40ish 50ish(I had had sex with her when I was drunk but she lied about her age), but when I met her sober(we had agreed to hook up again) I froze(this was not how I remembered she looked), so I fucked her for 50 minutes, couldn't even cum. After she left I started crying and went straight to the shower and changed the sheds of my bad, then I started to drink to forget about it.
That's the reason I'm scared to have a sex with a guy, because that feeling might come again but worse since I´m the one doing the blowing and getting fucked in the ass.
I don´t get hard thinking about myself as a woman but I do get hard thinking about myself on the knees sucking cocks and getting fucked in the ass by hot guys.
Also, I've been drinking a lot of coffine today and hitting the gym hard this month, that might explain why I'm so neurotic right now.
One thing I do know is that I feel like I´m not ready for sex with a complete stranger(again), but I don't know any gay people.
I am seeing a psychiatrist, should I bring these thoughts up? I really don't like the idea of upping my dosage because I feel fine most of the time and I don´t want to become uninterested in sex again.
>hat masculine-idolizing gays(the guys with fucking ripped bodies, big beards, etc), usually have personalities that are feminine,
They don't though. Gaygen or any man would tell you that's a urban legend and that they despise effeminacy.
The effeminate gays also look like women, other gay guys don't like that and they act quite masculine.the board is a good enough microcosm of this.
2bh lad you just sound gay, not AGP. i mean, i don't want to put shit on you but that's my impression. it's probably a good idea to tell your therapist about those things so they can help you.
what meds are you on?
I'm currently living in trapmode part time, and I can't decide whether I should HRT it up in fear of diminishing my sex drive. Any advice? Are there specific hormone treatments that don't affect your sex drive? Should i just get ffs and vocal cord surgery without HRT to stay passable?
Does anyone else never fantasies about having a vagina but still looking like a woman in every other way? I love the female body but I love dick too much to ever even imagine losing mine
Legitimately made me cry.
I'm in the same boat as your teenage self.
I have no chance of transitioning since my parents will never provide me with access to a therapist to at least fucking talk it out.
I always thought I was closet trans until I became familiar with AGP. I wouldn't ever be able to transition because I'm a 6'6" overweight guy, but the idea that I'll never be a woman breaks my heart. Every time I masturbate I end up getting sad because that won't ever be me.
Can we stop this shit? There's a difference between being a natal female and masturbating to situations that involve yourself as a natal female without being female as the central focus, and being male and the central focus of your arousal involving being female.
This sounds very much like me too (except I'm bi). I was paralyzingly envious - would cry and cut myself because I thought no one could love me or want to have sex with me.
I wanted to be fucked as a woman, sex with "two guys" seemed gross (internalized homophobia?) and I thought anal was icky (maybe that's why i thought it was gross). I just felt so sexually suppressed I was really dysphoric and uncomfortable with my own body I didn't think I'd ever be. I clung to my bitter-sweet fantasies.
Then i crushed on a guy and he liked me too (was presenting female at the time) and we dated. He saw me and fucked me as a woman, and i felt a lot better about myself. Still don't like my dick, but way more comfortable than before and my extreme envy subsided mostly.