What exactly was wrong with the Japanese Army in WWII? I mean most occupying armies can be brutal, but the IJN in historical accounts comes off sounding like an army of Jeffrey Dahmers and Ted Bundys that had been let loose on civilians and POWs alike.
oh boy are you in for a special thread
>Vietcong were no better.
Napalm, bombing of civilian convoys, living in conditions that rats do and being fought like such.
They had a pretty reason to be brutal.
Japs did not aside from the delusional thought of making Hitler see they're on the same page about racial superiority and the need to get rid of the junk.
Take an island. Now, take everyone on that island, and make them tell each other that that island is the best, has the best everything, and that everyone else is inferior. Throw in a few conflicts in which the islanders won outlandishly, or storms sank the invading forces before they even got close. Now the islanders think they're descended from god and that no other culture is thusly blessed.
Now take that culture, have it isolate the hell out of itself for a few hundred years, to the point where they live very strict, rigid lives, are slaves to hierarchy and authority, and strive for perfection in literally everything they do.
Still here? Take that culture, introduce it to a similarly militaristic-minded gentleman of Austrian descent whose promises the islanders the world should they conquest their part of the globe.
You take incredibly racist, xenophobic, ethnocentric people, give them the industry and technology they've been desperately trying to catch up with since the late 1800's, and turn them loose on the surrounding people, most of whom aren't even considered people by the islanders.
Of fucking course they did awful shit. They'd been doing the same awful shit to each other for thousands of years. Hitler just edged them into doing the shit to surrounding nations, and that wind filled their sails like a fucking hurricane. I mean, their emperor said it was cool, and he was literally their god. If god told you it was cool to rape and murder and bayonet babies, you'd probably do it, to.
The great majority of the deaths of Allied military and civilian prisoners in Japanese captivity were the result of insufficient food and medical care, which left the prisoners extremely vulnerable to tropical diseases.
The deaths of Japanese personnel in the 1941-45 period showed the same pattern; at least two-thirds of them were due to starvation and disease rather than violence. The reason for that pattern of mortality was that many Japanese garrisons were cut off from supplies by the highly effective US Navy blockade.
You see the same thing in a lot of SS units. A lot of it is extreme indoctrination from an early age followed by intense peer pressure. Fellow soldiers would question the masculinity of any man who didn't have the stomach to carry out the mass executions, but actual punishments for refusing to partake in the slaughter were relatively light.
The IJA was noted for the humane way it treated its POWs during the Russo-Japanese War; so what caused this? Well, that's what happens when you get a bunch of squabbling generals and admirals with a hard-on for "the good old days" combined with a strong ethno-nationalistic mindset to run not only your military but also your country. Except rather than immediately imprisoning and killing anyone who disagreed with them, though they did that as well, they worked their hardest to get everyone else to drink the Kool-Aid too. That's about what happened slowly over the course of the thirty years preceding WWII.
You say so, but if you were raised from day one soaked in indoctrination and propaganda, in a strict and rigid environment in which free thought was suppressed and not respecting authority was considered unthinkable and punishable by death, you'd be bayonetting the shit out of some babies.
But you only say that because the real God doesn't want us bayoneting babies.
If God wanted us doing that, you'd be posting in a thread talking about how if God wanted us being nice to people you'd try to kill him.
>want to kill a god who brought you peace, independence, prosperity and literally holds the universe together as well as watching over the ancestral spirits of your ancestors
You dun goofed.
What Bible did you read?
"Then I heard the LORD say to the other men, "Follow him through the city and kill everyone whose forehead is not marked. Show no mercy; have no pity! Kill them all – old and young, girls and women and little children. But do not touch anyone with the mark. Begin your task right here at the Temple." So they began by killing the seventy leaders. "Defile the Temple!" the LORD commanded. "Fill its courtyards with the bodies of those you kill! Go!" So they went throughout the city and did as they were told." (Ezekiel 9:5-7 NLT)
God doesn't say anything either way about bayoneting babies, in fact I'd be surprised if at least one baby doesn't get speared to death in the bible. In the absence of guns, a spear is basically the closest you can get to a bayonet.
Sure, god might not necessarily like bayoneting babies, but he's certainly never spoken out against the practice. We figured out it was wrong on our own.
>killing the demiurge
Good luck. May the light-bringer protect you.
HOLY MOTHER OF GOD my ribcage was not prepared for this
>We figured out it was wrong on our own.
Is it 'wrong'? Is morality objective or subjective? Some of the most successful nations on the planet practiced infanticide if the children were deformed or sick.
There is no 'right' or 'wrong', just a huge spectrum of subjectivity. I think it's wrong to stab a man to death for the contents of his wallet, but a starving man or a drug addict does not.
I'm not arguing that the Japanese weren't shitbags during/before WWII. I'm arguing that any nation in those circumstances would be just as shitty. That doesn't excuse it, but don't demonize an entire culture seventy years later for shit their great-grandfathers did. If anything, Japan is just fucking weird and totally innocuous now. They're too busy killing themselves to kill anyone else.
I think most people who do wrong know they are doing wrong. An addict knows it's immoral to steal a wallet but chooses to anyways because he values drugs over human life and morals.
I think the golden rule pretty much gives a solid objective moral view.
I think it would be bad if someone had killed me when I was a baby, especially if their reason for doing so was because I was of a different nationality than them.
There are some more grey areas that require greater depth of analysis. Can someone kill one baby to save ten babies? Can you end a baby's life early if he is suffering intensely? etc.
>vietcong were no better
Well, there's truth to that in that the vietcong were brutal and truly vile to US soldiers and allies. There's a difference though;
We invaded their country, mucked about in their politics, and in general were giant dickbags. We were the bad guys, so we got what we deserved.
Compare this with Japan in China and we have a very different situation. Japan WERE the invaders, they were already the bad guys and the occupiers. They were just substantially bigger assholes about it than invaders commonly are.
Primary reason? Racism.
Japs were "superior" to all the "inferior races" in the other Asiatic countries. You can still see the echos of that in modern japanese culture, and even in modern (though controversial) japanese museums such as Yasakuni Jinjya. Look it up, as it happens I've been there...I've read the revisionism and bullshit on those walls. It was gross and disgusting.
But there again, it's subjective. I've read interviews of women who have been slaves in the sex industry since they were children, and to them, that was a normal life.
One of my co-workers is this worthless, ratchet piece of shit with two kids. Both kids were raised in a toxic, drug-addled, ghetto life. Her son was caught at school with a bag of weed and a pack of phillys. His friend had a .22 handgun. They're both under the age of 10. He tells his mother (my coworker) that he's going to 'get dat money', 'kill some nigga' and 'do some time before 16'. Her daughter says she's going to 'lay down for money'. This is the environment they're raised in. If they thought it was wrong, they wouldn't rush towards it. We both obviously know those are not ways to live your life, but to them, it's completely normal and a totally reasonable thing to do.
>We invaded vietnam! We're the bad guys!
there are a lot of things you can say about that war, but "the US invaded vietnam" has got to be the most outlandish nonsense I've read yet.
Same thing thats wrong with the USA, they romanticized their own nationality to the point that they believe, that they cannot do wrong.
Combine that with the general brutalizing effect that war has on people and you have the requirement for the worst of crimes.
If you would have been there and asked the japanese soldiers why he is bayoneting a baby, he probably would have given a similar justification, than the helicopter pilots in the Collateral Murder video or the faggot with his "Why nuking the Japs was right" jpg.
Yes, actually. The wonton brutality of the Japanese invasions was a cut above the usual brutality of most invasions.
They sure, sure will. It is in pretty ugly taste, because Japan has white washed it so badly that most of the shit they did isn't widely known in Japan. One thing I will speak to in favor of America is that we at least have common access and decently wide knowledge of the bad shit we did in WW2, and in some cases other wars too.
I miss WW2, when 'murica was the good guys...
Imperialism, proxy wars and puppet governments. The "good ol' days" of fightin' communism. Don't pretend like it was anything else.
Probably the result of grafting a near-feudal style of thinking onto what was a near-modern system. Combine that with an INSANE level of fanaticism for the emperor and a disregard for human life and this is what you get
There are still cases where the VC did really heinous shit to villagers that were non-affiliated with the US or ARVN.
If you really want to understand (you won't by just reading a few pages), you should read this book. It covers the history, the psychology, all of it.
>there are people who actually sympathize with the fucking chinese.
>there are people who actually say a "feudal style" and "medieval society" in a negative connotation.
I'm not sure if a small number of samefags or whole lot of chinese shills.
Step 1: allow some people (the perpetrators) to use force as necessary to keep another group (our victims to be) in check.
Step 2: dehumanize and demonize group 2. Criminals, terrorists, chinks, sandniggers, untermenschen. Add in uniforms sunglasses, hood, prison coveralls and so on to help the brain sort us from them.
Step 3: whenever someone does use a bit too much force, don't punish him for it. There's no need to encourage it, you can simply just not care.
It worked with the Japanese, it worked with Gestapo, it worked at Abu Ghraib, it's probably at work behind a lot of the US police brutality stories, and as the Stanford Prison experiment shows things can go to hell very quickly even if we don't perfectly match all three and we start with a group of people specifically chosen to be free of sociopaths and sadistic bastards.
everything you said is correct, except that thing about the austrian. Japan would have done shit without being allied to germany. Hell, they did in 1938.
Also, i'm impressed by their navy. Just a shame they didn't use their brains in training new pilots, like the US did.
>If you would have been there and asked the japanese soldiers why he is bayoneting a baby, he probably would have given a similar justification, than the helicopter pilots in the Collateral Murder video or the faggot with his "Why nuking the Japs was right" jpg.
morality of altitude
from what i understand it wasn't as black and white as US helicopter pilots deliberately murder civilians because LOL
The old testament is pretty fucking metal.
They didn't. They correctly identified weapons, followed the ROE, and opened fire. Then Wikileaks doctored the video and left that detail out. I like the mission behind Wikileaks, but Assange is a piece of shit. The pilots had no way of knowing that there were other civilians in the van. All they saw was a guy helping enemy wounded.
Ground report from the scene.
Japanese are extremely racist against Asians. And other Asians are the most vocal about Japanese war time atrocities because they were the ones that were most atrocitized. Which is a new word I just made up.
i think feudal is the term you were looking for but yes
Fun fact, that bloke about to get his head chopped off was Australian.
I lived in Japan for 20 years.
In my stupid opinion, the reason that the Japanese were such atavistic savages was due to the invention of "Bushido",which is not an actual thing, despite what your faggot animu queers ninja masters "katana" masters would have you believe.
Ah, man, it's too complicated to get into detail here, but basically you took a bunch of ignorant cunts and brainwashed them with this line of bullshit and they came out the other side believing that anybody not "in the club" didn't deserve even basic human consideration because, at the end of the day, they weren't human.
The Japanese were some of the move savage, brutal, cowardly and despicable cunts to have ever sullied human history.
He should have turned his guns on his government. First worlders all have blood on there hands.
>muh similar architecture
because its not like thats the easiest way to build a multi storied building with ancient ass tech
or that exaggerated facial features are easier to carve than the intricate subtleties of more lifelike creatures
>He should have turned his guns on his government. First worlders all have blood on there hands.
Yes, because everyone wants to live in a third world shithole with dirty water and old Qurans shoved on their face
explain then why all of these "tombs" are built over water aquifers?
check and mate materialistic-fags
i see nothing wrong with these things. In war you are not supposed to be nice. The days of good soldiering ended in ww2. I would never expect to be treated with dignity by my enemy. It makes you fight harder knowing they are going to mutilate you and post pictures on the internet.
It's my theory that after god scattered humanity at Babel, they kept building. That's why pyramids have similar architecture and features despite being so far apart.
Speak for yourself. Sure, nobody wants to end up like that.
I ain't no fucking warrior, but were I ever drafted to that role, you can be damn sure I wouldn't be abiding that kind of shit.
you would have no choice.
i have no desire to do that to other people. But you cant control what they will do to you if you get captured. The only thing you can do is not get captured by fighting so hard they have to kill you.
Obviously, nobody can control his enemy.
We can only hope that, whoever it ends up being, that he is an honorable foe. I'd like to think that when that final resource war comes, we'll have the decency to offer breaks on christmas, or some shit like that.
Nothing's certain though.
You've got a rather strict definition of rules.
Look at some of this shit >>23186615. Doesn't matter who ends up carrying it out, you do some fucked up shit, it has a way of coming to find you.
>taken from all you've ever known
>thrown in with strange men
>they put you in training specially designed to break you as a person
>Exhaustion, hunger, fear, the works
>once broken, they rebuild you as they see fit
>shipped to Shitstain, God-Knows-Where to kill people for good ol' Government
>the only bits of familiarity are the boys you got sent over with
>you cling to them as a weird mix of friend and brother
>they begin to die in awful ways
>you watch them drown in their own blood after being shot by a sniper, or get blown to pieces by landmines
>you never see them
>then one day, you capture one of the dirty fucks
>you're a little rough with them
>some of your brothers in arms kick him around a bit, punch him
>after all this is one of those son of a bitches that killed your friends
>it's his damn fault you're here
>and even if you feel bad, if you say anything you'll be betraying your bros
>the only things you got in this godforsaken place
>Congrats, you're now a war criminal
>breaks on Christmas
>from the Chinese
we wont ever have a resource war if we don't wipe out the middle east. we are going to be stuck fighting radicalized religious groups until the end of time.
You're blind. Obviously the reptillians told us to make our buildings in the same layout as some of the most prominent objects in the night sky. Which happens to be a mostly straight line.
Don't get me wrong, I'll beat the ever loving shit out of someone. I'll break things. Probably end up doing worse. But I'm not raping, I'm not chopping up or fucking corpses, I'm not butchering non-combatants, and I'll try my damnedest not to torture, and I'll not tolerate it around me, not if I can help it.
> The pilots had no way of knowing that there were other civilians in the van.
Assange may be a asshole, but la fucking di da if they didn't know there were civilians in the car they shouldn't have shoot.
Oh "he just followed "ROE(orders)" is a fucking pathetic excuse for killing civilians, they ruled that shit out at the Nuremberg Trials after 1945, so why shouldn't it count for US Pilots in 2007?
Same logic the USA used on the Vietcong and Insurgents today, so whats the problem?
Some farm boy from a third world shithole gets force into a militia and to hold an ak47, which somehow gives the US the right to come with a A10 and BRRRRRT him into swiss cheese
But woe poor USA, if they get their hands on a US Trooper and turn the favor, then that farm boy is suddenly a inhuman monster that deserve to be purged from the world.
>it's his damn fault you're here
No. It is your imperialist government's fault you are there. This is his home and you are the ones attacking him.
Take your anger out on your commanders.
You don't have to do that. You just don't have to interfere when it happens. Lord knows every unit has some psycho who'll do it. The question is if anyone will betray the unit and report it.
>or if the authorities care that it will happen, a la IJA
It is not the same logic. That poor farmboy is fighting in his territory. YOU are an invader. NOTHING gives you the rite " to come with a A10 and BRRRRRT him into swiss cheese"
See, if we were just allowed to send drones in to do precision assassinations, none of this drafting nonsense would ever have to be done, and the only people getting hurt would be commanders and politicians.
Careful with satanic imagery.
Like, if you notice you start thinking differently or symbols start affecting your mind.
He was a giant. He's holding a lion like a housecat lol
Adam and Eve might have been giants, too.... not sure.
What are you going to do, frag him when you get the opportunity? Even if you could do it and manage to not get killed by your buddies or thrown in jail for forever, that's a moral quandary. Killing one of the only things you can rely on in the middle of a warzone because of something that happened to some stranger who probably had it coming. After all, that's why the soldiers are here
This totally has nothing to do with capitalist being fascist. IT MUST BE THE REPTILIANS.
I'm not about to try and read the future. Just saying that someone has to be conscious of what's war and what's plain inhuman.
There's no sense in surviving. I still wanna be able to live with myself.
It is the same logic of "My enemy is inhuman, so I have the right to be inhuman against them", but you are right that it is even more despicable when it comes from a outside force.
>they ruled that shit out at the Nuremberg Trials after 1945, so why shouldn't it count for US Pilots in 2007?
German soldiers were convicted at the Nuremberg Trials because they lost the war. The US, UK and USSR got away with the same kinds of atrocities because there was no one to hold them accountable for their actions, just as there is no one to hold US war criminals accountable for their actions today.
Don't make assumptions dipshit. I was replying to some faggot that said that captured soldiers deserve what happened to them. Neither side deserves to be tortured so how about you get that stick out of you ass faggot.
>he just followed "ROE(orders)" is a fucking pathetic excuse for killing civilians, they ruled that shit out at the Nuremberg Trials after 1945, so why shouldn't it count for US Pilots in 2007?
"Orders are orders" or "befehl ist befehl" is recognized as a viable plea. Not enough to escape punishment, but enough to lessen it
I ain't "bitching about" humanity. I am "bitching about" countless capitalist wars of imperialism and there incredible body counts.
>countless capitalist wars of imperialism
Man, fucking monkeys in their natural environment go to war, and you're blaming it on politics? I got news for you- no matter what ideology is followed, as long as there are people there will continue to be war.
FARC personnel are STRICTLY prohibited from using drugs.
No buddy, I'M a moralfag, bitchin' about humanity.
And you're traitorous scum, who deserves nothing but the very worst this world has to offer. It's one thing to try and enforce some kind of morality in an immoral, awful situation. It's another thing entirely to be a treacherous piece of shit, betraying men who trust you implicitly, because they have no other choice.
I am currently in a first world country. I will however be making a trip to India in the coming months.
>because they have no other choice.
There is always a choice.
Fuck you, you anti human peice of garbage. With your line of thinking we would still be monkeys banging rocks together and fucking tree stumps you permafag. With your asinine views Columbus would have never sailed, rome would not have conqured the known world, bringing intellectualism to the wild tribes. I bet you are a fucking species tratior too you worthless fuck. I bet you would side with the blue fucking worthless shitstains on pandora, you would go native as fuck. Good. Let you go, I want my fucking unobtainium and I WILL get it. I wish to burn your hippy fucking tree down and rape the souls out of it. I wish to drop a fucking rock on your shit-tier moon, not because its economical, just because i fucking can. I wish to take the blue females and make them submit to my rule. No, not as slaves, as willing participants, bought by bobles and trinkets, so that they may assist me in conquering other worlds. Then, as a final punishment, I want to breed them out of existence and blow the core of the moon, then wipe all mention of pandora from the history books so NOBODY will remember them.
cus you know your side is good and righteous when you torture to death prisoners of war for having the audacity to bare arms against you, don't pay any attention to the fact that those prisoners were allowed to do that under both international law and the customary laws of war, just be a vindictive evil bast...i mean force for national liberation.
Depend. Do you love it when a plan comes together?
>Same logic the USA used on the Vietcong and Insurgents today, so whats the problem?
the problem being you are using a blatant tu quoque fallacy. Hey weren't you just complaining about something you thought was a war crime just a sec ago?
>Assange may be a asshole, but la fucking di da if they didn't know there were civilians in the car they shouldn't have shoot.
>Oh "he just followed "ROE(orders)" is a fucking pathetic excuse for killing civilians, they ruled that shit out at the Nuremberg Trials after 1945, so why shouldn't it count for US Pilots in 2007?
oh yeah there it is. I guess you are really selective about what war crimes you care about.
What makes them worth more than the families of the countless victims of imperialism?
Those who support capitalist are not my friends.
My loved ones?
Why would i love someone who murders for profit?
The men I'd be stuck in hell with?
Nothing is stopping them from joining you. If anything seeing the terror firsthand makes them more responsible.
Depends on what and if it was in my capability to do so.
I am in eastern Europe so it is not like i am rich.
>napalm carpet bombing and agent orange are justifiable and are totally not war crimes because the US did it
What the fuck are you then? I've got no allegiance to capitalism, but mine are exactly that. Mine. I fight for them because I want to.
If I'm stuck in some foxhole somewhere, you can be damn fucking sure I won't be fighting for you. Fucking ridiculous. Whoever pulls your strings is just as evil as the most corrupt political structures in the western world.
When did i ever claim to be a pacifist?
No-one's saying that, though.
But that's okay. Simply because one side is clearly in the wrong, the other must be right and therefore has a moral licence to do whatever he wants.
It runs both ways.
You simplistic pricks.
one is invading
one is not
"following orders" is not valid a exscuse
Wow so they knew for a fact that guy dropped napalm on civilians? Jesus that is some CSI level communist detective work, strangely with camo paint on him i doubt that guy ever saw the inside of a fixed wing attack aircraft...but who gives a shit about details? So i guess if they had tried and executed him according some legal standard they would be morally sound...unfortunately they cut his dick off instead.