Daily Japanese Thread DJT #1779

よつばと! 第13巻 on nyaa

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Forgive me if this a dumb question, but what does the period in the last reading in pic related mean?

>>16422802
The part after the period is okurigana.

>>16422810
Thanks.

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Please return to /int/ where you belong.

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What's the best romanization system and why is it 日本式?

>>16423260
The best romanization system is definitely not 日本式. Hepburn is better but diacritics are retarded and so is merging ぢ・じ and づ・ず.

>>16423269
>Hepburn is better
Hepburn is the romanization system for EOPs. Real men use 日本式. 訓令式 is also acceptable but not as good as the former.

>>16423277
>Hepburn is the romanization system for EOPs.
日本式 is the romanization system for JOPs. You're not really helping your case.

>>16423269
>>16423277
>日本式
>し si
>しょ syo
>ちゃ tya
>じゃ zya

Fucking terrible. I always feel upset when I see Japanese people typing that way. Just terrible.

>訓令式
>tyu
Dropped as well, into the trash.

>>16423278
>日本式 is the romanization system for JOPs.
Yes, your point being? That's exactly why 日本式 is the better one. You will rarely see a nip using Hepburn. If you know japanese, knowing 日本式 is 10x better, because you will actually see it in use.

>>16423298
>If you know japanese, knowing 日本式 is 10x better, because you will actually see it in use.
Except they don't use it. The only romanization you're likely to see is name romanization, which has no rules.

>>16423278
I wonder if 2ch is full of threads of people teaching themselves English, playing untranslated isometric RPGs and laughing at the JOPs.

>>16423305
I didn't know isometric RPGs still existed.

>>16423305
Do Japanese kids still have to take English?

This will be the second time I come for guidance here, though this time around I did try to compose my own shit and only need to check it with you guys. Mind you though I ain't studying Japanese, and this is only my weeb moon passed through a dictionary to add the characters in. So does this sound alright?

行成で失礼ですがBBK/BRNKのサントラのこと何かを知りませんですか？

Long story short, need to ask some shit on twitter.

Also one more thing but what bloody counter should I use for art posted there? Would've just used こ
but then remembered counters were a thing, though researching them got me even more confused. Should I use 三こ? 三まい? 三さつ maybe?

>>16423376
Need production help? Go ask the nihongo thread on /int/! >>>/int/

>>16423376
I've seen 葉 being used as a counter for photos but I'm not sure how common it is.

>>16423269
You can have perfect 1:1 romanization if you adopt these simple rules:

- Hepburn for most stuff;
- ou/oo for long vowels, no diacritic shit;
- dzu and dzi for ぢ and づ. "Tsudzukeru";
- apostrophe for isolating ん from vowels, like hon'ou.

Did I miss anything?

>>16423438
Oops, my bad, I meant to type "dji", not dzi.

>>16423378
Would rather keep it in a board I'm familiar with.

>>16423388
Thanks. Again, I wouldn't actually know as I don't study the language, picked what felt right by sound and description. For now I'll take that and try to check if it's used around there and what frequency it's used at .

>>16423438
>>16423444
>Did I miss anything?
Probably, but those are the important things to get right, yeah.

おはようおにいちゃん

さむいさむいさむい

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Currently at 170 examples in my manga vocab deck. It sped up when I started just reading manga and looking for words in the deck based on the manga instead of doing it the other way around.

Why'm I not using examples from another deck? Well, let's just say they aren't exactly the most authentic thing.

>>16423374
They are learning it even earlier these days, I think starting on 4th grade or something

>>16423486
何言ってんのよ
夏の真っ最中じゃねーか

WHERE ARE THE ENGLISH SUBS FOR ONIICHAN GACHAAAAA

>>16423557
まふゆだよ

にほんにきてごらんよ

>>16423486
>東京
>+２度
>寒い
寒くないよ

>>16423765
>２°Ｃ
寒いじゃないか

>>16423765
Remember that thermal insulation and central heating just aren't things in japanese building construction.

>>16423845
central heatingということばすらない

にほんの

ゆきのふらない

ちいきには

だんぼうはほとんどないから

外気温と、室内温度は

ほとんどおんなじ

>>16423864
That's not how the apostrophe works, though. It only applies when there's a vowel right next to ん.
恋愛 ＝　ren'ai
遠泳　＝　en'ei
etc.

>>16423889
What was hon'ou then? 本王？

I see, in that case I could get used to it I guess.

>>16423900
それは　ほん・おう　だよ
本能は　ほん’のう　だよ

>>16423900
You also see gen'ei for 幻影, etc. I configured my IME to support that, actually.

>>16423916
それ知ってる
僕の誤解だっただけ

>>16423917
Yeah forget what I said.

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Am I fluent yet?

>>16423959
No, you still need another 300 days.

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>>16423959
You still have quite a bit left

ほんとうだ

ほうとうのことだから

きいたらあのんはむねがいたいだろう

でも、きかなきゃいけない時がある

あたし余命わずかだって

>>16424050
どうしたの急に

Why is this thread called Daily Japanese Thread even though it's not Daily?

>>16424090
告白のことだろう

>>16424093
It was Daily until it got removed from /a/. This board has no traffic.

>>16424093
It means the thread has daily regulars. Or it can mean you have to study every day. Anything you want.

>>16424238
Ironic shitposting is still shitposting

>>16424217
Yes. They read the kanji for tooth and pain not how it would sound in a language with no connection to theirs except loanwords though.

>>16424217
I immediately read that as はつう.

>>16424217
They will use 歯が痛い 99% of the time. Only China loving shits use 歯痛

>>16424330
>Only China loving shits use 歯痛
I don't see how that is related

What's the difference between 冷える and 冷める?

Serious question: I'm not railing against the use of the word, but what's the reason in the culture of grammar study that the freestanding japanese grammar function terms are called particles and not postpositions? I don't think they should be called postpositions, but I'm legitimately curious as to the particular reasons history turned out this way.

>>16424700
I'm not 100% sure, but I believe it's
>冷える
Hot/normal -> cold
>冷める
Hot -> normal

Interesting reading about pre-war japanese grammar that itself is pre-war and therefore interesting instead of not.

https://www.jstor.org/stable/984097?seq=1#page_scan_tab_contents

>>16424742
ya you're right, 冷める is basically letting your food cool down before you eat it,
冷える is putting it in the refrigerator.

Is there such a thing as an audio only Anki deck? Basically, I drive all day for work; 8 hours a day. So obviously, I can't read and look at shit since I'm, you know, concentrating on driving. So, I'm after an Audio Japanese vocabulary file, maybe the most common 2k/5k words. Ideally, It should be the English word.... pause of a few seconds.... Japanese word. Then maybe repeated a few times. Or vice versa, doesn't really make a difference. So I can then put it on shuffle and listen to it for 8hrs.

I did find this:
http://www.manythings.org/japanese/links/goethe.html
But it's not ideal since it's not separate files i.e one word/phrase per .mp3. so you have to listen to each 2/3min clip with multiple phrases/words per file. I want one word per mp3 file, does such a thing exist?

>>16424894
Take core 2k/6k with voice acting. Record the english meaning, pair up or splice the recordings one at a time. Profit.

>>16424894
Get an autodriving car and then you can spend all studying while it drives for you.

>>16424894
What do you mean by "the English word"? Do you imagine that Japanese words all have simple counterparts in English which correspond exactly?

>>16424742
>>16424851
かっちかちに凍ってたものが常温にもどるときにほんごは

>もどる/もどす

だよ。これもAnkiしてね

おにいちゃんならできるよ

>>16422715
Get the fuck out

Does anki have a reminder feature so you don't miss days?

What's the difference between そか and そだ when responding to someone?

Also why is my Rikaisama suddenly in Japanese?

>>16425357
You seem to assume I don't use both threads for maximum, premium DJT experience.
可哀相。。。

>>16425382
Soka is more of a "Oh, I see!" and soda is more of a "Yeah, exactly!"

>>16425382
そっか
Is that so?
そうだ
That's so.

Yes, that is soda.

>>16425414
きをつけてね

あいだに「う」を入れると

よくないことがおこるよ

とくに選挙前にうざいことになるよ

>>16425442
I drink souda every day.

Which plot-based VNs are you fellas currently reading to improve your listening comprehension and vocabulary?

>>16425458
まいにちソーダって

ふとるよ

あとくさくなるよ

>>16425565
Why plot-based VNs in particular? Nothing wrong with a quality moege and spending time with cute 2D girls.

>>16425594
I'm just not into moege and nukige. I like that I can practice both reading comprehension and listening comprehension with plot-based VNs.

>>16425565
Higurashi

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what is the function of the と　in the margin 南の国へと

>インターネットで申し込んだ人は、1月24日（火）からMyJLPTで2016年第2回試験の受験結果を見ることができます。
Good luck everyone.

>>16425681
秋は来て

春帰りゆく

雁の

羽がい休めぬ

函館の松

Any particular iOS app of preference to practice handwriting?

>>16425590
Translingual puns sure are something

>>16425681
None. Just get used to it.

>>16425681
it makes it less stiff

in English, you don't ”embark to” a place, but for one is fine

same shit

>>16425681
れんちょんがたべてるのは

「うまい棒」だけど

ほたるんが食べてるのはなんだろ

「ビッグカツ」かなあ？

もしかしたら「蒲焼さん太郎」かもしれないかなあとおもうよ

Finally getting around to studying radicals after putting them off for way too long.

>肉月
>立刀

Some things are starting to make more sense now. Most of the abbreviations are easy to infer without studying, but I've always wondered what the moon had to do with internal organs.

>>16425788
Also the radical in the top right of 祭 is (gasp) a hand!

>>16425832
けっこうでてくるんだけど

せつめいふかのうのかんじって

けっこうあるよ

>齋

とか

>>16425949
http://www.chineseetymology.org/CharacterEtymology.aspx?submitButton1=Etymology&characterInput=%E9%BD%8B

示 (meaning) + 齊 (meaning and phonetic)

I just realized how stupid learning this language is.
Maybe stupid is a bad word for it. Uneconomical?
You need a work visa in Japan to get a permanent residence, and you need a bachelor's degree/10yrs work experience + a company sponsoring you to get a work visa, there's also some shit to do with a CoE that I don't even know about.

It's a really cool language but it seems pointless if you're never going to be able to use it outside of 90 day tourist visits or reading manga or whatever.
Sry to shit up the thread. I'm sure a lot of people have had this thought already, but I'd be lying if I said it wasn't discouraging.

>>16426056
You can get japanese related work outside of japan.

>>16426056
I currently live in China and plan to stay in Asia for a long time so I continue to maintain my Japanese fluency for future job prospects but I definitely agree.

It isn't too difficult to live and work in Japan. Find an English teaching job that will get you a work visa and bring you over then immediately find a real job if you have other skills. This is assuming you actually have a 4-year degree.

友達、
I've started using the "Core 2k/6k" deck advertised in the OP's guide.
I notice that the cards are not immediately reversible, however - should I just be making my own deck for this?
It seems like my kanji reading will be lackluster otherwise, as I'm finding myself mostly memorizing the reading rather than the characters themselves (laziness, probably).

>>16426163
Take a picture of the front of your card. Pretty confident you're using the retardo default setting instead of reading the guide and changing the card formatting.

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>>16426167
Probably, I can't recall changing much.

>>16426179
You somehow managed to find the cloze deck. You should win a reward.

>>16426182
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
待されない

>>16426179
Question.

Did that come from the https://djtguide.neocities.org/anki.html page? I'm having trouble finding the pastebin for the good card formatting on the site. I'm assuming it was removed because the deck listed there had the formatting already applied?

>>16426179
Anyhow, here's the old pastebin for fixing the card format: http://pastebin.com/iJNvkSzr

Not sure if DJT has developed more optimised layouts in the past two years.

>>16426190
In retrospect, it seems not; probably from searching around on the AnkiWeb library.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
>>16426208
ありがとうお兄ちゃん

>>16426056
>>>/int/DJT

ちょっと問題がある

別にアニメを嫌いになって、日本のドラマも好きじゃないなら、一体どうやって聞き取りを練習するのか？確かにHello Talkとかでネイティブと電話できるけど、そのアプリで出会う人が１週間ぐらいあとでいきなり消えそうだ。

ということでどうすればいいの？

>>16426298
ニュウス
エロゲ
音楽
問題ない

>>16426298
ユーチューブとかは？

>>16426302
おんがく・・・

にほんにおんがくは求めないほうがいい

>>16426360
I really don't like jpop, but there's quite a lot of worthwhile japanese music in other genres.

>>16426365
カラオケボックス以外で歌ったら

逮捕されるほど

歌うことは悪です

国歌でさえ歌ったらダメです

>>16426298
niconico使おう

>>16426378
わぁ、素晴らしい！こんないい国があるか？

>>16426360
何じゃそりゃっ
日本の音楽は世界一じゃないか
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ckD4Ex3og8E

>>16426417
おにいちゃんは

ひにくが

じょうずだな

Anyone has Japanese from zero 1 PDF? Can't find it anywhere

>>16426447
>>>/int/

Post fun Japanese videos.

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm30344362

ロウきゅーぶって

にほん以外だと発禁？

>>16426479
多分。

I don't know why but I mix up 紛れる and 免れる a lot.

I like how 汽車 is supposedly steam train but when you google image it it only gives you some car and zero trains.

>>16426630
are you using Japanese Google

>>16426645
Oh wow. Didn't know it makes that much of a difference.
橙 is another funny one to compare in com/jp googles.

>>16426658
Wait I actually have a question about 橙
When it's by itself it's bitter orange but when it's with coupled with other stuff like 橙色 or 橙黄色 it becomes "orange" color? What am I supposed to imagine when I read it, normal orange color or the slighter more yellow bitter orange color?

Is anyone here doing vocab reps with Anki and how often do you skip a day?

>>16426690
虹の色をAnkiしてみてね

そとから

せきとうおうりょくせいらんし

だよ

そらがあおいのは

れいりーさんらんだよ

>>16426719
Read the guide.
You never skip, it defeats the purpose of the program.

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>>16426690

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>>16426728
全然わかりません
>>16426735
Yeah but what if you remove the 色 ? Does it revert back to the normal bitter orange color? Like what do you think when it was 橙の瞳

>>16426745
みかん色
http://irocore.com/read-list/

>>16426745
If you remove 色, it becomes the fruit.

>>16426745
だいだいってなんだいっていうと

だいだいっていうだいだいのいろだよ

だいたいね

>「達成の暁には、私が言いにくいことを口にできる程度にはな」
The 達成の暁には at the beginning throws me off, what's it mean? The second part I think is "To the extent it is hard for me to say"

>「です」 is NOT the same as 「だ」
http://www.guidetojapanese.org/learn/grammar/polite

Is this a real thing, or just some stupid autism rant?

>>16427178
Why don't you read the explanation right there dumbass?

>>16427184
I read it and it looked like dumb shit to me.

>>16427215
I read it and it looked perfectly reasonable, what's your problem? It's not even that significant, just bare in mind that there are nuances in their usage.

>>16427178
It reads like someone annoyed at people using だ wrong. Personally I'd never write a guide explaining grammar and cite "due to stuff I haven't told you, don't do this." Kind of gets in to how speaking and listening are two different skills. It's important to know some people will use だ as an informal です, or at least understand it's implies the same thing in certain situations.

"Don't use だ as です" seems like something they should tie in to the concept of polite speech in Japanese, which is another concept that hardly gets covered when you begin. Like "We're going to teach you how to form a sentence, and we're going to teach you the polite form. Don't try using using the casual form, because that's a cultural nuance you're not going to be able to make the proper call on for a long time. Yes, in the US lots of people think casually speaking is better. Not in Japan. Don't do it."

>>16427215
If you're still at Tae Kim level, you probably shouldn't have that attitude towards it. You need to be able to trust your teacher/learning material and believe in it if you're going to properly learn it.

That guide is recommended for a reason, there are syntactical differences between だ and です such as it's usage with adjectives as he explains somewhere in the guide.

>>16427215
Then just ditch TK and read DOBJG

What are some good kanji to know for Tokyo? Other than 電車.

>>16427375
援交

>>16427375
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_j%C5%8Dy%C5%8D_kanji

What level of comprehension would the original Shin Megami Tensei and its sequel be placed at? N2? ~250 points on the J-CAT?

>>16427494
Japanese/10
If you have to ask, it, and probably everything else, is too hard for you. Shouldn't stop you from trying though.

>>16427494
SMTIV requires intermediate-level grammar (DoBJG and most of DoIJG, I guess that would be N3) and willingness to look up unknown words. I would imagine the first games are mostly same, except slightly more difficult due to hardware limitations.

>>16427497
Simply not true.
What are you doing in a learning thread if you reject the idea of difficulty levels and believe both あずまんが大王 and 夏目漱石 are "Japanese/10"?

>>16426304
何のユーチューばーをみればいいの？今まではじめしゃちょをみてたけど、あいつは普段よりかなり早口だなって思ってた。面白いからそれをやる事に気づいたけど外人として聞き取りを難しくなるだけだよね。

面白い日本人のユーチューバーを探すのは無理だろうw

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Was looking at this. Wouldn't it be をたべられません instead of は?

>>16427539
In SMT 4, how do all the Mikado samurai talk in the JP version?

In English they have this olden-English twist to their speech, but I always wondered what the Japanese counterpart of that is.

>>16427344
Since the DoJG anki deck is now a thing, is doing stuff like Tae Kim still needed?

>>16427622
It could be, but the wa makes it a more general topic, instead of just-in-this-occasion thing.

>>16427663
No because DoJG is massive and can't be done quickly especially if you're a beginner. Considering it's a dictionary by nature having already previous general knowledge like the one Tae Kim offers you helps greatly.

I personally recommend this route :
Tae Kim -> Visualizing Japanese Grammar -> DoJG, all while starting to read when doing Tae Kim or at the very least once you've cleared all chapters aside from last one.

Japanese the Manga Way isn't bad (I read half of it back then) but I'm not sure it's really needed. If one wishes to include it then reading it more or less at the same time as Tae Kim would fit.

なにボ～ッとしてやがんだ！？
その文がわからない、意味と文房は英語で何と言うか。
ありがとう～

>>16428303
>文房

>>16428322
ごめん。もう一度書く。
>なにボ～ッとしてやがんだ！？
その文がわからない、意味と文房は英語で何と言うか。
ありがとう～

>>16428326
FFS I don't know why I keep writing 文房 instead of 文法.

>>16428326
>その文
この文

>>16428345
>なにボ～ッとしてやがんだ！？
この文がわからない、意味と文法は英語で何と言うか。
ありがとう～

>>16423533
Should be 2nd in my opinion

>>16428303
what a small chinchin you are!?

>>16428446
Well it's better than what it was before which was I think 7th grade. I believe 4th grade is the same as most of Europe

What is difference between 礼儀 and 作法 ?

>>16428473
https://hinative.com/ja/questions/8162

>>16428469
It's not like anyone actually learns English from them. You talk to a random Japanese person who went through all those English classes in school, they can barely speak the language.

>>16428493
You can't really learn a language just from high school classes, you need to put the effort and exposure outside of it.

>>16428493
Starting earlier should help. They just need to try to get more English into their daily lives if they want to actually get good

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>>16422715
Im new to these threads i usually go to /int/'s japanese threads. could you write in japanese here and how do you guys watch your anime and/or get your mangos imported

>王が信用できない人物だと知っていただかねばならないな」
>だかね
What word is this?

>>16428586
>王が信用できない人物だと知っていた　だ　か　ねばならないな

>>16428596
Huh? What does だ and か do here? Feels like the first time I've seen a sentence like this

>>16428605
Actually have no idea what the だ and か are doing here to be fair. But ねばならない it is.
https://www.google.co.jp/#q=%22%E3%81%A0%E3%81%8B%E3%81%AD%E3%81%B0%E3%81%AA%E3%82%89%E3%81%AA%E3%81%84%22
Looking through that at the moment.

>>16427306
It's perfectly normal to use です on its own as a random gobi, but not だ.

>>16428586
You/they probably misspelled だが.

>>16424105
Djt is dead

>>16428635
No, have you even read any of the example sentences I linked? It's definitely not a typo, this is an expression, but it doesn't seem to be covered in many dictionaries.

>>16428605
http://dictionary.goo.ne.jp/srch/all/%E3%81%A0%E3%81%8B%E3%81%AD%E3%81%B0%E3%81%AA%E3%82%89%E3%81%AA%E3%81%84/m0u/
I'm still confused about it but better than nothing.

>>16428559
Normally your local supermarket will import mangos for you, you should just be able to buy them from there.

>>16428646
>No, have you even read any of the example sentences I linked?
I didn't respond to any such posts, so no, I have not, anon.

>>16428607
>>16428646
In case you didn't notice that goo.ne link doesn't have results.

Anyhow I think it is だ + かねばならない actually, not だか + ねばらない. Maybe. Not sure. I don't know what makes up the かねばならない still though

>>16428657
Then why would you partake in a conversation you have not read in its entirety? Might want to fix that posting style or kill yourself, too.
>, so no, I have not, anon.

>>16428669
>Then why would you partake in a conversation you have not read in its entirety?
I didn't. I responded to a post. Don't put your heart where your mouth is.

I'm trying to type the word まつたく　
in kanji but it won't let me for some reason

go to the store

>>16428326
>>16428303
What are you spacing out for?!
ボーっとする
する + て + やがる

>>16428714
Just keep pressing space.

>>16428714
Because it's not まつたく but まったく.

>>16428733
oh wow you just blew my mind, thanks. I really need to start on grammar.

Anyone know to type "っ" on mac? I'm actually having tons of problems using their Japanese keyboard language settings.

>>16428742
xtu

>>16428742
Also if you just write a double consonant it will insert it
mattaku

>>16428586
>>16428664

>王が信用できない人物だと知っていただかねばならないな
>知って・頂かねば・ならない

>>16428586
It is 知って+いただかねば+ならない
ねば is a shortened form of なければ
So you could rewrite it as いただかなければ
So the base verb is いただく
いただく is the humble form of もらう
So to put it all together: We need to have them know/understand

おはようおにいちゃん

>>16427599
あたしはプロユーチューバーは

民主主義的すぎてみないかな

むしろプロの技がみられるのがすきだよ

たとえば、ジェイソンさん
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-rXtvHmDbCg

>>16428784
>民主主義的すぎて
どういう意味？

Does anyone who has used Shin Kanzen Master N1 or N2 have anything to comment on them? I'm thinking of taking the N1 in July so I was thinking of taking a look at them. But I am not sure if I should start with the N2 books or just go right into N1, since if I am eventually going to do the N1 books anyway I might end up retreading the same material.

>>16428835
再生数だけが目的でつくられたものだよ

アフィ収入と民主選挙の当選は手段が似てる

>>16427663
My post was a subtle reference of >>16427334
If TK is not rigorous enough for you, then go to DOJG.

>>16428837
I passed N2 and N1 with those books. Definitely get the N2 grammar one. You can probably skip the rest and go right to N1

There are a few duplicated grammar points, but most of it is different enough, and you should know all of it.
For reading/listening the strategies it teaches are basically the same, the material is just appropriate for the JLPT level. The kanji and vocab ones aren't very useful, you probably don't really need any of those if you have some of the bigger anki decks (or mined a bunch of your own cards).

If you can't get into anything else I recommend the Japanese Particles and Grammar Abridged anki deck in the CoR as a last resort.

Why would someone say something like よろしくね instead of just よろしく as a greeting? How does including ね here even add anything?

>>16428892
Go back to studying particles
You probably don't know what よろしく means, so that too

What anime will you be watching this season for listening practice?

>>16428892
Have you never watched anime in your life? You should know this before even having learned your first kana symbol.

>>16428892
Why is 帰国 pronounced with a chi instead of ki?

>>16428892
https://ja.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E5%BD%B9%E5%89%B2%E8%AA%9E

https://blog.skritter.com/2016/05/yakuwarigo/

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>memorize the meaning almost instantly
>always forget the pronunciation

>>16428921
That never happened

>>16428906
I do know, but it seems you don't since you chose to avoid answering.

>>16428910
Yes, and that still doesn't answer the question.

>>16428925
>I do know
You don't. If you did, you wouldn't be making this question. In fact, you could have chosen to find out what it actually means, but instead decided to throw out a witty reply.

>>16428924
itsuki really said that

>>16428918
So if a woman said this, it would just be to appear girly? I suppose that could be it, seems like it's just filler though. I've heard people say that women who say ね constantly are very annoying.

>>16428915
It's not?

>>16428934
It seems you have neither wit or reading comprehension. You must've forgotten that you claimed I didn't know what よろしく means. This must be an embarrassing mistake. Better luck next time!

>>16428944
>le passive agressive answer
So you're just a retard. You better make it more obvious next time so I don't waste my time replying.

>>16428959
I see you still haven't shown that you know the answer to my question. You're dismissed.

>>16428892
By inviting agreement it comes off as more casual, I believe.

I used "The Japanese Sentence-Final Particles in Talk-in-Interaction" when I need to fall back on what exactly よ and ね are doing although in this case it's such a stock phrase I'm not sure it's applicable.

>>16428991
That's the conclusion I came to as well. Translating it literally as "please take care of me, huh" doesn't make much sense since it's a greeting that you wouldn't expect the listener to actually respond to like a command.

>>16429010
>"please take care of me, huh"
More like "please take care of me, okay?"

>>16429010
>huh
lol wtf
back 2 taekim loser

>>16429017
That's true. My problem was I thought people wouldn't take よろしく as a literal command, and instead as just a greeting. So it would be like saying "nice to meet you, right?" which would come off almost like brown nosing.

>>16429010
You should probably read up more on what ね means. Even a basic source like the DoJG would have given you sufficient context (although I still do recommend my brick of a book, which is mostly available on Google for free and offers some interesting perspective.)

>>16429033
>My problem was I thought people wouldn't take よろしく as a literal command
You do know that よろしく is just 宜しく, right? Technically an adverb. Not a command.

>>16428876

Thanks for the advice. I downloaded the N2 and N1 grammar pdfs from the CoR just now. Just from looking at the table of contents, the N1 one looks as if it could be useful as it does have some grammar I haven't seen before. But I don't know about the N2 one; I have read all of the DoJG so I feel it would be doing a lot of rereading of the same stuff, albeit more in-depth.

Where were you grammar-wise when you picked up the N2 book? I can definitely see it being useful if you didn't know the majority of it already but as I am now I'm not sure.

>>16429067
I do know that. I guess I just don't know exactly what it means, so how it would be modified made it even more confusing. Again, seeking agreement on something like nice to meet you just sounds extremely submissive to me.

>>16429085
>nice to meet you
why would you mix and match this translation with, like, anything

i'm starting to think that >>16428906 had the right of it

>>16429085
>Again, seeking agreement on something like nice to meet you just sounds extremely submissive to me.
And why exactly is that bad? You're talking about the same culture that thinks that calling yourself a manservant is moderatedly polite.

>>16429100
Eh, maybe for a woman it might be appropriate. But I would never do it, and I would be annoyed by anyone trying to suck up to me like that.

>>16429079
I'd still say that you should go through the N2 one. The grammar questions on the JLPT aren't "what does X mean", for which studying the DOJG would be enough, they're "which of these grammar patters that roughly mean the same thing is the best one for this sentence".
The Shin Kanzen Master books don't teach you a lot about what the grammar points mean (the DOJG entries are a lot more detailed), but they teach you how the grammar patters are different from similiar ones, which the DOJG doesn't really focus on a lot if the time.

If someone says よろしく to you then you typically say よろしく back, don't you? You are both agreeing to get along.

>>16429033
It sounds strange because you're taking the nuance from an English phrase and transplanting it wholesale to the Japanese side. When learning words, phrases and idioms you should take as little as possible from any given translation and assume nothing.
Personally I like to imagine "よろしくね" sounds like "well I guess we're supposed to say よろしく at this point, right?" But I'm not really experienced enough to be confident in that interpretation so I'll keep looking to each context for more clues.

"treat me well, okay?"

you culturally imperialistic autistic fucks

>>16429173
Seconding this. You have to be really autistic to not realize that it literally means "well".

>>16429190
"Treat me well" and "well" aren't literally the same thing.

>>16429237
That's not what I literally implied.

>>16429269

>>16429173
>"treat me well, okay?"
>>16429190
>Seconding this.

>>16429294
hmmm I see

Please treat me kindly.

should i read infinite stratos?

>>16429542
No

>>16429010
Just insert a canadian accent.
Please take care of me, eh?

Does the JLPT increase in difficulty from N1 to N5 or does it go the other way?

>>16429775
Please don't ask questions you could Google the answer to in less than thirty seconds.

>>16429775
It's the other way, N5 is the easiest and N1 is the hardest.

>>16429783
Please don't answer questions someone could Google the answer to in less than thirty seconds.

>>16429782
>>16429789
>>>/int/

>>16429010
How about don't fucking translate everything

Should I reread Genki again? I feel like I know everything in the book but I still can't understand them if someone said it to me.

>>16429940
No you should start reading real Japanese

>>16429825
/jp/ is not a containment board for retarded questions.

>>16429940
Just start reading Yotsuba

稀な漢字ゲット
「依怙贔屓」

>>16430060
Try the Japanese thread in /int/. Not the DJT one, the Japanese people one.

How do I get good at names?

I only have so many hours in the day to spend on Japanese. Which media do you recommend grinding to prepare for N1? LNs? VNs? Dramas?

I was thinking LNs/Novels and Dramas. Many VNs have voice acting but I don't want to bother dealing with kanji/language that's too chuuni or obscure.

>>16430107
Read a lot.

>>16430123
If you really want to do something useless like studying for N1 then you should really just be reading business emails and reports all day, as JLPT uses that stuff a lot

>>16430170
I don't think there are too many business emails and reports floating around the internet. I thought there was a different test for business Japanese?

>>16430137
so download another Anki deck. Thanks

>>16430123
>I don't want to bother dealing with kanji/language that's too chuuni or obscure.
It's still Japanese and you will end up seeing it

>>16430123
>but I don't want to bother dealing with kanji ... that's too chuuni or obscure.
Have fun not passing N1 I guess

>>16425832

その手があったか

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>>16430318
そうよ

>>16430309
N1 isn't chuuni or obscure, though. Chuuni VNs are chuuni.

>>16430330
N1 is "real fluency", and if you don't understand chuuni writing then you're not fluent. N1 isn't that hard to pass if you have good comprehension, but it's exactly with regards to studying in a vacuum that N1 is hyped up to be hard.

How should I read Yotsuba?

I took an hour to read 13 pages but that's because I'm translating a word every now and then. Am I reading it wrong? Should I not worry about the meaning and just read it or should I take my time and try to understand everything?

>>16430331
I took N1 2 years ago and barely failed it

There are just a lot of essays and excerpts from classic literature. Those things are boring to read, though.

>>16430340
You can't and won't understand everything and even if you translate it you're going to get it wrong more than half the time. Just look up words and if you don't understand a grammatical pattern try to figure out what it means based on what's going on.

Don't think, feel. Then think about what you feel.

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>>16430345
>Don't think, feel. Then think about what you feel.

>>16430340

Yotsuba is fun, you should have fun reading it. If translating everything is sapping the fun out of it I'd say study some more and come back to it when you're able to have fun while reading it.

>>16430361
what's the problem?

>>16430388
He is likely going to shitpost about you encouraging subjectivity to >>16430340

Translation Aggregator won't copy the text from clipboard properly. It doesn't for like 70% of the time. I'm using windows 10. Has this happened to anyone else?
I remember once before dropbox would mess with it but it isn't the culprit this time.

>>16430576
Do you have the text set to come up instantly in the VN? That's all I can think of.

>>16430585
It used to work fine with the exact same settings I had on a different install of windows. Even copying text from notepad manually doesn't work. It's weird. I guess I'll have to close stuff until it works

ふざけんな！
人を化物みたいに言うんじゃねー
俺は人間だ

>>16430607
Messed with your keyboard layout/language (and thus hitting the wrong keys)?

>>16430648
君はここにかたら人間なんてじゃない

ただのクズだ

K, here's an interesting one. Would appreciate any opinions on this one way or another. I was browsing VNDB forums and found this: https://vndb.org/t8679

The guy is asking about a line from this link (https://i.imgur.com/yPvSBeO.jpg) (just below エピローグ) that reads:
>ufotableが書き上げた脚本を、奈須きのこが原作者としてリライトしたのが本稿である。

The OP used some sort of OCR program to transcribe the text over to VNDB for some reason, and it had some errors in the other lines, but this line got copied over completely accurately. I'll here accurately transcribe the other lines that came before it for context.

>アニメ「Unlimited Blade Works」の締め括りとしてufotableが希望したのは、
>アニメオリジナルの新たなエピソードの制作であった。
>#00から#24までの聖杯戦争は、士郎にとって何だったのか、その闘いの向こう側を描くことで作品は完成する、
>その思いから、ロンドンから始まる今内容をufotableが提案。
>ufotableが書き上げた脚本を、奈須きのこが原作者としてリライトしたのが本稿である。

Now, how I would interpret this is:

>What Ufotable wanted for the conclusion of the Unlimited Blade Works anime was an anime original episode.
>Ufotable wanted to make a reflection on what the Holy Grail War from episodes 0 to 24 meant to Shirou, and thought that drawing a picture of what lay ahead of that strife would really complete the work.
>So, Ufotable submitted the idea for this episode starting from the events in London.
>Nasu Kinoko, the original author, took this scenario from Ufotable and rewrote it up. The result is this text. (本稿)

Then said text follows, as you'll see if you click on the image.

I probably wouldn't have questioned my interpretation but VNDB user Harleyquin seems to think otherwise, and according to his VNDB list he's read Dies Irae, so he likely is fairly skilled in the language. It's actually rather difficult to tell from his posts, but as far as I can tell, his interpretation of the line is that the order of events is reversed. Instead of the order of events being Ufotable submitting the scenario to Nasu, who rewrites it, Harleyquin proposes that the Ufotable script is based on a rough draft provided by Nasu. From him:

>Ufotable script = comes from rough draft provided by Kinoko Nasu
>Rough draft = rewrite of the original UBW route with new additions based on what the director of the animation asked for.

I don't claim to be an expert in Japanese, so I normally would have just accepted Harleyquin's interpretation and figure the OP and I had interpreted it wrong somehow. But there was something that Harleyquin posted that gave me pause. From him:

>For some reason, the text reversed 稿本 into 本稿. The former is easily found in any reputable Japanese dictionary, the latter less so. In English, "working draft" or "draft copy" is a good enough translation of the term.

Now, this is clearly incorrect and shows he didn't even read the original article, as the OP then points out:

>The thing is that the original text says 本稿, not the other way around

Harley then replies with:

>In Japanese, it's common for the word order for nouns to be swapped around yet retain the same meaning. As far as the fan material editors are concerned, the sentence retains the same meaning regardless of 稿本 or 本稿, both of which I can type out on a standard Japanese IME keyboard. I might disagree with their choice, but they're paid to do what they're doing and I'm not.

At this point I started questioning my own sanity. I can only think of three possibilities:

1. Harleyquin has interpreted the order of events wrong.

2. Harleyquin did not know 本稿 was a word, and also does not know the difference between the words 稿本 (a "rough draft", as he keeps referencing) and 本稿 ("this text"). He tries to pass off his own error as a strange choice of diction by the people who wrote the original article. He in actuality thinks the same thing as me and the OP, but I misinterpreted his efforts to disguise his error as disagreement.

3. I am wildly wrong somewhere.

Can someone chime in here? I know this turned into somewhat of a wall of text but I would appreciate some input.

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>>16430651
No it just won't pull from clipboard

>>16430679
I'm not reading all of that.

おはようおにいちゃん

こないだみはじめたDarker than black

かなりいいかんじなんだけど

サイコパスと同路線なのに

なんかちょっとものたりない

効果音とか音楽がよくないのが残念

>>16430709
Then don't reply
>>16430679
Pretty sure it's 2, kanji can NOT be swapped around in words, I mean sometimes it's okay but definitely not as a normal thing. Easy example, switching the kanji in 本日 vs 日本 is a huge frigging deal.

>>16430700
Try running it as admin.

If you can't get it to work, you can use the Firefox+Clipboard Inserter setup from http://pastebin.com/raw/DgZ84qwk instead.

>>16430679
You can see how he made the mistake given how shittily transcribed the original text was. But that doesn't excuse
>In Japanese, it's common for the word order for nouns to be swapped around yet retain the same meaning. As far as the fan material editors are concerned, the sentence retains the same meaning regardless of 稿本 or 本稿, both of which I can type out on a standard Japanese IME keyboard. I might disagree with their choice, but they're paid to do what they're doing and I'm not.
Which is patently untrue

>>16430679
Japanese is fucked sometimes.

There's a sentence on the second or third page of Bakemonogatari (sorry, no Japanese IME at the moment) that completely mind fucked me. When I asked /djt/ about a year ago it turned into a whole debate. I asked a few Japanese people and /djt/ ended up interpreting it incorrectly.

If anyone is interested look for the sentence with "...no ikooru da".

>>16430855

Dude, I was there. Bunch of people replied, someone posted a link to someone who had asked the same question on reddit, etc. That incident taught me not to trust that loan words necessarily mean the exact same thing as their original counterparts.

>>16430855
>戦場ヶ原の声といえば、授業中に教師に当てられて、決まり文句のように発する、か細かい「わかりません」が、僕にっとてのイコールだ（明らかに分かっている問題であろうがどうだろうが、戦場ヶ原は「わかりません」としか答えないのだ）。
That was longer than I expected.

>>16430878
>にっとて
I meant にとって

>>16430864
I think maybe one person got it right but there were a few that were sure it was a certain interpretation that wasn't correct. I really don't remember.

Anyway, interpretation of Japanese can generate some fun discussions. I wish there was more of that in these threads. To be honest I haven't been frequenting lately and I was happily surprised to see that /djt/ is on /jp/ now. I always wished the general would move here.

>>16430878
>>16430890
わかりにくい、イライラするだべり（駄弁り）よりかは

せいぜんとしているぶんだけ、わかりやすいとおもうよ

ながいから、はいってくるそばから

こぼれてゆくかんじもわかるよ

>>16430931
>interpretation of Japanese can generate some fun discussions. I wish there was more of that in these threads.
I guess it can be kind of fun trying to figure things out together, is that what you mean? But ultimately it's faster/better just to ask someone who actually knows the answer...

The Tae Kim guide to Japanese grammar book came into the mail today, I know it's free on the internet but I love physical things, it's as good as people say it's easy to read and gets to the point.

I'm at a bit of a roadblock with trying to talk to people in Japanese, how do people get around this?

>>16431135
>I'm at a bit of a roadblock with trying to talk to people in Japanese, how do people get around this?
By getting good at Japanese. (aka read more (also finish tyler kim))

>>16431141
I should have clarified but I mean where I live there's no Japanese people around and the town I'm in is very low population. Figured I couldn't be the only one in this situation.

>>16431148
>Hellotalk
>http://skypech.com/
>http://chatpad.jp/
>lang-8

Isn't this stuff in the guide

>>16431148
I heard there's this useful thing called internet the kids these days use. Maybe they have some kind of phone lines to Japan with it

ちょうちょうとHänschen kleinを聞いて比べたら
やっぱりドイツ語のほうがいいなー
ジークハイル！

>>16430977
Hard to be friends with Japanese people though.

>>16431394
I know the feeling. I was friends with one on the net for a while. He was much more sensitive about what I'd say and do then pretty much most everybody else I knew. He wouldn't ever say it directly, but it was pretty obvious when I said or did something that he didn't approve of, even though in my eyes it typically wasn't a big deal. Such comes from being in such a formal, polite society, I guess. High standards.

>>16431394
I haven't had the same experience senpai

It's impossible to make friends with foreigners
I can not even make Japanese friends(´・ω・｀)

>>16431541
Making real Japanese friends is difficult. It's easy to go on skypech and shoot the shit with them for a few hours but actually becoming close friends with them isn't easy. They treat relationships differently than in many other cultures.

>>16431932
Idk but I have a decent amount of Japanese friends and 3 or 4 I talk to basically every day

>>16431943
Cool man.

I have a circle of friends that I've been talking to for a few years now on Skype. It took a while before I really felt included in everything.

Japanese people just feel much less open than people in other countries. Koreans and Chinese people are much more friendly, for example.

>>>/int/

what's the difference between this thread and the /int/ thread
you guys seem pretty hostile against certain questions and topics but i can't figure out why

>>16431965
I guess you just have to find the right kind of people

>>16432024
One accepts translations requests, questions that are answered by reading the guide and non-Japanese media discussion, and the other doesn't. If the former sounds good to you feel free to close this thread and go there.

>>16432078
そうですか。ここでテレビゲームのろんぎは大丈夫ですか？

>>16432024
>but i can't figure out why
Because you're normal and don't belong here, quite frankly.

>>16432102
i'm just new faggot

基督が降臨するように
垢だらけのこのスレの皆に罰を与えるように
世界中の罪人を滅ぼすように

>>16432168
あなたのお尻を穢れますように

>>16432174
いじめはダメ

絶対

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is there any list of works featuring dialects?
tv programs/movies would be preferable, but I imagine a list like that is even less likely to exist.

>>16432748
Dunno but if anyone knows a VN with Osaka / Kansai ben main heroines I'd like to hear it. Especially if multiple people speak it and not just one.
I've been searching forever.

>>16432757
https://vndb.org/g983

is it a bad idea to learn radicals and vocabulary before grammar? I'm talking like finishing the core2k before starting grammar. I can't seem to find time to do vocab and grammar at the same time.

>>16432785
>only 6 titles have 3.0
>all nukige/shit
>out of thousands of VNs
Why don't many big commercial eroge employ the art of Osaka ben? Do Japanese people dislike it and thus not buy it or something?

Can someone help me with this one sentence?
>いつもイグナイ事だとかなんとかほざいてっけどこれ見てもそんな事言ってられっか

I thought it's
>Although you ignore me every single time, can you still ignore me after seeing this?

But I'm really not sure about the イグナイ here

>>16432806
the worst part is that they're all probably just joke heroines who switch from standard to Kansai from time to time

>>16432806
Even real people who live in Osaka don't speak in the kind of exaggerated なんでやねん Osaka-ben you see in anime.

>>16432815
んだわすがあがったなんまんだ

>>16432917
she lifts her shirt so

>>16422715
So I found this Hiragana-Course and it got me thinking.

I've heard to avoid using Transliterations when learning Japanese (for some reason).

I get that.

So would it be useful to learn the two Syllaberi (mostly by ear) and then go from there?

And how do I bootstrap Japanese learning then?

Learn vocabulary in Hiragana paired with the appropriate language?
Use Rosetta Stone / visual Dictionaries / Ressources to teach new Words to Japanese children?

The problem seems to be mostly to get a useable level that I can stand on, which is hindered by the fact that I cannot lean on my mother tongue when encountering new words.

And up to that point I have not even thought about Kanji.

(Side-note a automated tool to check correct pronounciation would be nice.
Software assisted Hiragana/Katakana/Kanji drills with sufficient responsivness and resolution would be nice too. Checking a scanned page against correct form... or writing them neatly with a time-limit is also an intesting aspect.
The DS game from Ubisoft seems nice.)

>>16432932
The course video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6p9Il_j0zjc

>>16432787
No. Actually, it's a good idea.

I went the same route as you, finishing 2k before getting to Tae Kim. But sadly I am addicted to flashcards and have been through 8000 already and still haven't finished Tae Kim.

I also feel like I can't do both simultaneously (due time constraints), so I will dive into grammar once I finish Core10k and not mine new cards for a while.

>>16432964
>sadly I am addicted to flashcards
that can't be bad man, be proud.
And thanks, I'm following a similar route too then

>>16432932
Side-note:
Is there a good image corpus of signs in-daily-use.

>>16432932
Read the fucking guide jesus christ I swear to god

>>16432932
read the guide patiently and calmly. all you need to know to get started is there. lastly, avoid wanting to be spoonfed and you're set.

>>16432815
If I had to guess I'd say イグナイ is a 訛った form of いけない
>You're always saying things like "it's not right," but can you still say that after seeing this?
ほざく rude form of say

私は下品な輩とは交わらぬ

>>16433053
>訛った form of いけない
Ah that fits the bill better. You're right, thank you.

>>16433113
why is this every thread

>>16433129
Fuck off, newfag

だーかーざんぶらっく

なんかどっかでみたことがあるとおもったら

AKIRAにもモチーフがあったのね

>>16433136
New fag say 新参(しんざん) in Japanese.
Old fag is 古参（こさん）.
使ってね

>>16433322
それは語彙力だけじゃないか
あんたの文法力はもっとひどいわ

>どうやら、つまんねーとこ見られちまったみたいだな。
この分がわからない、誰か簡単な説明を教えてください。

>>16433391
すっっごく簡単じゃないか
あんた、バカなの？

>>16433391
Oh well seems like you caught me (lit. : saw me) at a boring (lit. : annoying, embarrassing, not deserving me well) moment.

>>16433397
子供の役割娯があまり読まないから、理解できなかった。
Thanks for being a dick though.

>>16433398
ありがとう～

Sorry for the offtopic but where the fuck do I get raws? I have been learning japanese like an autist but now I realize it's really hard to find anything beyond visual novels and anime.

>>16433432
What kind of raws? Manga, LNs, Drama?

>>16433432
For videos you press the S button on your keyboard when watching stuff.

>>16433432
nyaa

>>16433439
LNs mostly. On nyaa a shitload of torrents are dead and series are incomplete.

Context, person is talking about how long said person will not recover from her illness etc then :

もってあと数年だろう

What's the もってあと here, exactly? Over google there are a lot of similar sentences, with もってあと+ｘ年.

>>16433452
Amazon has pretty much everything in ebook format.

>>16433457
An additional.

>>16433457
Context means posting the sentences before and after the line as well.

>>16433463
I knew that already I just meant what those words were exactly, i.e. in kanji. But anyway I found answer so nevermind.

>>16433468
There was no need for those here.

>>16433458
So this is the true power of the japanese pirating scene.

>>16433452
Try perfect dark.

>>16433457
数年生き、死ぬ

>>16433017
>>16433027
>http://djtguide.neocities.org/

So basically "git good" (enough somehow) and then ask again?

I was more thinking about getting a good foothold (somehow).

Kind of learning Japanese with Japanese (with as little external Language inclusion as possible).

If that makes sense.

And I have not even thought about Kanji at that point.

Would you say that ひぐらしのなく頃に requires an upper-intermediate/lower-advanced grasp of the language?

>>16433452
There's also the cornucopia and the dead parts of goddess.
And the loads of raw manga sites which sometimes also upload novels
(to premium uploaders though)

>>16433513
Addendum: Regarding Kanji. The radical approach seems interesting.

Is every Kanjii in Japanese covered by those 218 radicals.

How far is that knowledge distributed amongst Japans population?

(Did the way Japanese is taught change after WW2 (or before)?)

Is there a good Idiomatic Dictionary / List or a store of the cultural core of Japan literary-wise?

>>16433517
No, but R07 is bad and he writes like a 5 year old. A lot of his grammar is straight up wrong and might teach you bad habits if you can't identify it.

>>16433513
Think about kanji at that point. Think about kanji now. You're doing yourself no favors pushing them off. Learn kanji as you learn everything else.

Here's what I recommend:

1. Drill the kana into your skull with RealKana/KanaTeacher.
2. Start the 2k core deck in anki as you read through Tae Kim.
3. When finished with the above, read compelling content of your choice, referencing the Dictionary of Japanese Grammar series as needed.
4. Move to Japan for a year.

This is how you learn Japanese.

>>16433517
Nah, it's easy. Although if >>16433552 is right, I might be fucked.

>>16433552
Well that's a shame. I adore the world and characters.

>>16433552
>straight up wrong
I smell exaggeration.

>>16433577
Higurashi is also like 5MB long if you didn't know, which makes it like 150+ hours long for a beginner.
If you want a Denpa / horror game play さよならを教えて. It's the best at what it does, fairly simple and short (0.6MB).

>>16433602
True, but you can read each Higurashi arc separately. That's how the people who played it upon release did it, after all.

>>16433564
What about radicals?