Is there a particular reason why the EU isn't bending over backwards to make sure we stay when we vote this year? The impression I'm getting from most of the continent is that a vote isn't going to even happen even though it's already law will be held 20 weeks after negotiations are finished. If anything it seems like France and Germany MEPs are under the impression we won't leave and that opinion polls are 90% when they hover around the 40% area and the result remains completely unknown.
The EU is not a community of equal nations, the conduct of Germany towards Greece and eastern europe has made this crystal clear. We are better and more valuable than anything south of the pyrenees and Alps.
The impression is that that issue is probably considered top relevant and 24/7 discussion hot topic in the UK. Outside UK though, few know about it and of those who do know don't give a flying fuck about the UK's desperate attempts at attention whoring.
At a EU/guvernmental level, looks more like the attitude is "the deal is this. You like it take it, don't like it, you're welcome to fuck off".
>You lose the £70 billion we pay you and other southern european shitholes annually in development EU funds
sounds like a good deal to me senpai
Frogs are not for fucking, they are for hugging to keep warm in the winter
The vice-president of the European Commision is Dutch.
His job is to cut down on regulations and has a veto on everything to cut down on things that arent EU business.
He was appointed to please the UK (and the Netherlands).
The Netherlands also wanted to downsize the EU, but doesnt want countries to have a special exceptions. So we got a Commisioner against EU meddling with a veto to please our countries.
When the negotiations with the UK begin he'll probably be the guy to talk to.
>Is there a particular reason why the EU isn't bending over backwards to make sure we stay when we vote this year?
They are you mong. Read the fucking news for once instead of a Cambodian clay-moulding commenteriat
France wants to create an European superstate. And the UK is the biggest obstacle because you guys are against pretty much all EU centralization and always negotiate exceptions.
They were also talking about starting an European army without the UK. You guys stand in the way of their ambitions.
The Netherlands leans towards the UK. But our politicians dont mind going with the majority if they must, so they can just be pushed over by France.
Other countries arent a problem.
>no to any caps of any form of free movement or related benefits
>only offer was a temporary block in emergencies when said country's services are being overwhelming, but has to have agreement of all 27 countries, which eastern europe has already said they would never give, which is why the idea never took off before
>half the rest of the "sticking points" are irrelevant shit no one cares about just to make it look "tough"
"During the annual dinner of European MEPs and other dignitaries in Brussel's last month, I watched as David Cameron set out his intentions for reform, but was cut off after only 7 minutes due to "exceeding his speaking time." This is how seriously we can expect the European union to take this entire process." - Nigel Farage, MEP
20 weeks after negotiations are finished, but by law it has to be by 2017 at least. Cameron will likely hold it as soon as possible for two reasons: 1. He wants Eurosceptics in the conservative party to stop undermining the leadership once and for all 2. He wants to do it before the summer shit-tide starts so the blowback doesn't affect the chances of staying, which he wants since Tories are classic conservative business slaves (still better than Labour)
The negotiations began months ago and Donald Tusk is in charge on the EU side
France or Germany leaving the EU would kill the EU indeed. In fact, the French referendum NO to the EU Constitution killed the project.
But Britain? Lolno. In fact, quite the contrary.
>there will be no huge repercussions from the third biggest economy in Europe leaving
Just go back to siestaing, Carlos. I'm sure that will fix your massive unemployment and economic situation.
France wants to do a lot of things. I know their philosophy is entirely different in some big areas. But they need the UK to stay in the EU to 1) fund the EU budget and 2) support them on foreign policy areas, where the UK is their best friend (and Germany is an obstacle)
You seem completely unaware about what David Cameron's demands are. He doesn't oppose freedom of movement, he's not asking the EU to stop freedom of movement, so why would the EU offer that? You're an idiot.
And using a quote from Nigel bloody Farage to support your points is the final nail in the coffin to the idea that anyone should care about what you say.
That's not the official line, but senior German politicians are the biggest pushers of it and are frequently quoted talking about using backdoors to undermine sovereign governments to push through treaties and that people who oppose federalisation need to be destroyed.
A ban on in-work benefits for four years on European migrants is pretty relevant to the freedom of movement actually
"Nigel bloody Farage" was the only one to speak up out of 700 MEPs when a literal who tax-evasion professional former banker was "elected"(ie Germany said vote this guy) the president of the Union. More over, he's an MEP, he's more versed of the subject than either of us, on top of the fact nobody denied it.
If EU was so easy to extort and compromise its fundamental values like free movement of labour then it doesn't deserve to exist. I'd unironically prefer EU to dissolve than to cave to arrogant demands of any one of its members, be it Greece or UK.
Greece itself got what was coming to her, no more and no less. I wouldn't expect kinder treatment after overdrawing enormous amount of money and blowing it on hookers and drugs.
You know I never heard a non-British person talk about the British contributions to the EU.
I heard politicians say they want you guys in, but I never heard anyone say why.
I'm not even sure if the politicians know why besides keeping other countries in.
Greece did get what it deserved, but Germany behaved like a parent scolding a child. That is not a union of equals. Nor is threatening the economic futures of eastern european countries who don't want to compromise the demographic make-up of their countries with shitskins that Germany INVITED.
>A ban on in-work benefits for four years on European migrants is pretty relevant to the freedom of movement actually
Banning benefits for a while does NOT restrict freedom of movement you fucking moron. EU citizens are still free to come here, only their benefits change. I don't think you understand the concept of "movement". I recommend investing in a dictionary.
>More over, he's an MEP, he's more versed of the subject than either of us, on top of the fact nobody denied it.
He's one of the most biased people you could possibly quote on this subject. You really want to talk about your stupid little quote where he says Cameron had to stop speaking after 7 minutes? I know about that speech where Cameron set out his reforms.
That speech was actually **40 minutes long** and very well-recieved by the other EU leaders
>The 40-minute speech - described as highly persuasive, laced with elegant rhetoric and even emotionally moving – is now being billed as a pivotal moment of the renegotiation during which Mr Cameron won sympathy by positioning himself as a committed European.
Thank you for demonstrating exactly how stupid your lot are. This is precisely why you will lose. You live in your own little world where people like Farage are unquestioned founts of wisdom and the fabric of reality isn't quite the same as where the rest of us live. Oh yeah, and your inability to understand basic ideas like freedom of movement.
If the number is positive, the country receives more money from the EU than it contributes.
If the number is negative, the country contributes more money than it receives
WRONG again you stupid shill. If you want to talk about contributions, you need to show NET payments after things like the UK rebate
Yet another example of statistical masturbation to trick people. Anti-EU shills are pathetic
>Germany behaved like a parent scolding a child
How exactly would you imagine Germany should have acted when Greece demanded more free Euro money to not find it offensive?
>Threatening economic futures of...
Shitskin problem is not caused by Germany in the least. Their "invitation" was a marketing move in vain hopes that immigrants that will feel welcome will be more inclined to integrate and only came when the brown river was already pouring in. I absolutely detest how their politicians (and not only their) are calling for migrant distribution mechanism while frontex remains an impotent joke of an agency, but I have to admit that migration policy has been criminally neglected by ALL EU countries. And even now when the crisis is already underway, there is much more whining and accusing than there is actual proposals to get out of it. Even proposals that include guarding external border are falling under the table because "muh sovereignty".
I'm voting no and a member of the Liberal Youth which has gotten me in quite a lot of my fellow babby Lib Dems.
Don't understand how they are all for democracy and liberal values when it comes to surveilance, censorship and other shit like that. But they wholly support the EU even though it's undemocratic in nature and full of so much shady shit.
Anyone can post something from the EU website. Anti-EU people are ALWAYS posting the EU expenditure figures *before* the UK rebate. After the rebate we contribute less than France - well, we did a few years ago, nowadays with our larger GDP we probably support more
Anyways the only number you should care about is the net contribution
In or out of the EU, we would still get fucked over with all the surveillance and censorship
The EU just gives us the illusion that we have an organisation to go to if our government is doing something bad
>I heard politicians say they want you guys in, but I never heard anyone say why.
I just said why France wants us in. All the countries have different reasons. For example, Poland wants us in because we're far more anti-Russia than the Germans or French, and they're fairly "eurosceptic" (despite benefiting from the EU more than most).
The Germans want us in because without the UK, they would be paying a LOT more to fund countries like Poland, and also the Germans would be permanently out voted by the France-Italy-Spain bloc which generally advocates higher spending, which the Germans hate. The UK and Germany both prefer smaller budgets and less profligacy
>I'm not even sure if the politicians know why besides keeping other countries in.
The politicians - the government ministers - know. Of course they do. The majority of the European publics don't give a shit, why should they? But that doesn't matter. Their leaders understand the consequences and that's all that matters
There was a NOTICEABLE increase in migrant influx after Merkel announced they were welcome. She indirectly contributed to the death of thousands of people in the Mediterranean with her irresponsible unilateral declaration that affects us all. If Germany is the "leader" of Europe with this terrible decision making they're only compounding by forcing their decision on other nations who didn't invite them, then we shouldn't be part of it at all.
I dont think britbongs realize how much continental politicians value the EU project.
Britcucks have no backbone and the EU knows this. The EU could literally decide tomorrow that every 3rd British child must be sacrificed on a blood alter to Angela Merkel and they still wouldn't leave
>So why are you for a foreign body writing 75% of our laws, anyway?
You continue lying with every reply. Here's proof you're lying yet again:
As usual, everyone reading an EU thread on /int/ will just see the anti-EU posters telling lies. If you're trying to discredit your shitty cause, you're doing a bloody good job
It's not and won't happen.
The only thing the britshits will get is a cake smashed in their clown face and being the most popular kid in Yurop after trying to take advantage of the bad momentum of the EU and having pissed off for this or that literally everyone, from Germany and Eastern Europe to France and Southern Europe.
Unfortunatelly, because they obviously don't have the balls to be true and get the fuck out at once.
Why don't you two have the balls to cut your own arms off? That's exactly the logic you're losing
WHY would the UK do something harmful to itself like leaving the EU? UKIP might spend all day IRL shitposting with their little union jack flags at their desks in the EU parliament, but real patriotic British people won't want to diminish our influence by leaving, they want to stay in and impose our own values on the EU - just like we did with the Single Market and continue to do
>none of the opinion polls are remotely decided,
WRONG yet again. Please can you at least try to go ONE post without lying?
>This contrast starkly confirms the warning that we issued last week – that polls of EU referendum vote intention conducted by phone are securing markedly higher levels of support for remaining in the EU than those conducted via the internet.
On average, phone polls show Remain ~20 points in front and online polls show a dead heat.
Also you got the pollster inquiry wrong. The problem was that they were interviewing too many politically-engaged people (in that case Labour voters). It's not an inherent left-wing bias. For example, if the "Leave" people are more politically engaged then the polls will be overestimating them. That should worry you a lot, because the anti-EU brigade are certainly more outspoken than the Remains. Especially online.
>not realising the referendum cuts across party lines
Tory voters are approximately 50:50 on the issue. I'm the anon who's been myth-busting the anti-EU shill ITT and I'm a firm Tory. You have no idea do you?
The hard truth is you can't use election polling as a predictor for a referendum. The dynamics are utterly different