>windows proven to be a real security threat
>new application market leans towards web interfaces and multi-platform implementations
>Debian, Ubuntu fully supporting ARMv7
>VMs and virtualization technology is mature
>chromebooks, widespread now, have proven the market
>laptops are leaning towards low power consumption and low weight
What stops you from buying an ARM laptop, or even desktop, besides availability?
>>windows proven to be a real security threat
Yeah because you are fuckin dumb.
Do you even realize companys use microsofts service to store their emails?
Do you realize that microsoft employees can read those emails?
Do you realize that worrying about your local machines security if you have stored anything in the cloud anyway is fuckin stupid?
>What stops you from buying an ARM laptop
Three years ago I would say performance but right now I don't know what's the situation.
How does performance in typical desktop applications compare to lets say a budget intel i3 CPU?
What's the most powerful ARM chip you can get on a laptop?
No one will sell you ARM chips if you try to make an ARM laptop. Qualcomm is impossible to deal with. Samsung aren't too bad but demand huge volume. Mediatek or rockchip might but they never have anything powerful enough, they focus on budget SoCs.
You seem to have a mental disorder.
Obviously, some of my data are stored on cloud.
But SOME is very different from ALL.
Like, personally, I really care to know whether my every keystroke is automatically being send to Microsoft's servers.
But guess what.
Not every file hash or local search is send to microsoft's servers.
Because I'm not using windows.
So fuck off.
>chromebooks, widespread now, have proven the market
Only hipster faggots and college twats use Chrome OS, it doesn't do anything a full OS can't do and only has it's cheap hardware a marketing bullshit to tempt customers.
Its a very weird situation right now
Low end atom chips, and ARM chips are nearly on the same performance level. ARM chips are better on per watt performance but overall have lower performance. Both atom and ARM chips can handle stuff like hardware decoding H265 like a walk in the park, THATS just how powerful today's low end chips are.
In my opinion, atoms are still better because they offer better performance and x86 and AMD64 have a huge compatibility ecosystem, ARM does too, but its kinda limited to Linux based distros like Debian (which run remarkably well on ARM CPUs somehow)
>angry birds processor taking over x86 processors
>on fucking laptops
People who used PDPs, RISCs workstations, mainframes, servers, and supercomputers all said the same thing about Intel. x86 chips were 16-bit toy embedded CPUs and now they took over everything. ARM was originally a desktop CPU.
If you told someone back in the 70's that most supercomputers 30 years from then would be compatible with the 8086, they would think you were insane, and not because of the time travel. Intel wouldn't have believed that their 8086 successors could even run Angry Birds.
Thats like saying fish blown the fuck out because it cant fly
>making opinions on architectures on the basis of games that run on one of the OSes that run on the architecture
>anything used to get real work done
>recompiling dose not make programs just werk on other ISA's
>why the fuck would the entire industry move to another ISA for no good reason
It's not just that but ARM is shit in general. It can't run x86 software or x86 OSs without severe bottlenecks. ARM isn't taking over anything.
In fact x86 UMPCs are destined to brutally murder ARM based phones soon. We already have cherry trail atoms. Goldmont core atoms aren't that far away either.
As much as it pains me accept it, you're right
x86_64 atoms are more powerful than even the high end ARM chips. Though it would be nice to have another architecture that can prevent an x86 monopoly
>They must be able to hire programmers so they can recompile and make it work for you right?
But it already works, on a proven system to boot, why would they do unneeded work because a neckbeard on /g/ thinks ARM is better?
I heard all software is open source, maybe that's just a rumor too.
I heard software companies just code, compile and ship and don't do any testing or validation, maybe that' just a rumor as well.
Despite all the shitpotings, OP, I agree. However, give it another couple of years.
I like ARM computers. Especially the raspberry pis. They're good for training folks to become programmers in an environment where if something breaks they just need to burn a backup of the SD card. In fact, there should be protocols for that which I myself wish I would follow more considering how much I like to experement with these things, even if they performance isn't god tier.
The Gameboy wasn't god tier hardware yet it outlived the Sega Game Gear.
So to Shitposters, don't knock it until you rock it.
>What stops you from buying an ARM laptop, or even desktop, besides availability?
The fact that they would be based on some SOC that the manufacturers would more than likely not provide the source code for the drivers for, preventing people from compiling another OS to run on it and leaving you with the shitty Android toy OS that they would no doubt put on it.
>fish blown the fuck out because it cant fly
I see you fell for the fish can't fly meme.
Gimp...and inkscape...and scribus
Blender (sooner than you think.)
You first, faggot!
>g-guys, ARM isnt powerful enough and doesn't have the software!
>inb4 I pretend work in a field that requires niche specialist proprietary software
Your own fault for choosing a field that requires the use of proprietary software.
>windows proven to be a real security threat
I think you mean Android.
Windows is as secure as ever, but the only reason why we haven't had a malware with infection rate as high as the Blaster Worm for Android is because no one was bored enough to make one yet.
>Implying normies actually use workload applications on a laptop.
If they own a laptop they're likely browsing the web or playing games in it. While there are a few exceptions, laptops are widely considered consumption devices.
Now, as for the people who want to do some light document work, just use the ARM Abiword port or (not sure if it exists yet) get a LibreOffice port.
Then there's also the oppurtunity to build a compatibility layer for android apps and.
Not sure if Remix OS is also going to be ARM-compatible as all I've heard and read is "The x86 Android OS" but that may be a viable alternative to a distro running on an ARM.
alpha (unofficial port)
hppa (unofficial port)
ppc64 (unofficial port)
I don't know why proprietary fags are so in love with x86
enterprisequality* software built back in 2003 on xp and hacked through out the years to keep it "updated" that barely run on windows 7 that somes enterprise rely on like there's no tommorow
Arrogance about bullshit does not make your bullshit into non bullshit. It's just makes you full of bullshit and willfully ignorant of it.
For anything other than limited professional use the command line is over and done. Day to day users will not put up with that bullshit, and they have every damned right no to tolerate it.
This is the one and only true reason gnu/Linux has and will continue to fail. There is no point on overcomplicating what should be a relatively simple task. You're not clever for wasting valuable time on bullshit for the sake of feeling clever...you're just a dipshit who wastes time.
Don't use either. No software center and no command line...the challenge is to download software from the internet and get it installed via the mouse like a goddamned normal person. In most cases with GNU/Linux you cannot perform this simple and basic task.
I have a PC that's solely for gaming and another PC that's solely a Linux box. If someone comes out with an ARM desktop platform that can rival even a Haswell i3 chip, I'd buy one and make it my Linux box even if that means the inconvenience of forcing me to do my video encodes on my gaming PC. But ARM chips aren't that powerful yet, and I have doubts that their performance can scale that well. Until then I just have my RaspPi 2.
>Windows runs on ARM.
Eh, just shitty Windows RT and whatever that specialized IoT thing is for the Raspberry Pi 2. No full desktop Windows 10 to my knowledge, but I could be wrong.
Even then, though, there's the obvious problem that you can't run Win32/64 binaries on ARM even if a Windows 10 port did exist. That kind of defeats the purpose of using Windows in the first place. Might as well just use Debian.
No Flash on ARM Windows or ARM Linux. No Wine on ARM Linux or backwards compatibility for Intel Windows Desktop applications on ARM, or even a compatibility layer (like Rosetta on Mac).
ARM Chromebooks don't sell well. Surface tablets using ARM chips did not sell well.
What makes you think that an ARM laptop would sell well?
>No Flash on ARM Windows or ARM Linux.
>That is a bad thing.
It means zero compatibility with a lot of existing software, and a number of video streaming sites. And while Flash did have a lot of vulnerabilities last year, iOS had more, yet people still use it.
I've used them, they all suck. All are basically crippled versions of x86 programs. On top of this ARM cpu performance is dogshit. God help you if you wanna encode 480p h264 at greater than 10fps.
>But ARM chips aren't that powerful yet
I found a place that lists benchmarks on different platforms based on a common standard.
Intel Core i3-4130T 2900 MHz: 6003
Intel Core i3-4370 3800 MHz: 7818
Samsung Exynos 7420 1500 MHz: 4238-4511 (depending on the phone it's in)
Keep in mind that the Samsung Exynos 7420 is crammed into a phone and is being cooled passively. With some sort of actually decent cooling that SOC could probably at least match the I3-4130T which is clocked almost twice as fast while only performing about 33% better on the benchmark.
>I've used them, they all suck. All are basically crippled versions of x86 programs.
They are exactly the same. What are you talking about?
>Skype, Steam, and Wine
Botnet, Botnet, compatibility program for Botnets
>It means zero compatibility with a lot of existing software, and a number of video streaming site
What software requires Flash of all things?
>comparing different CPU architectures with synthetic benchmarks
Because Linux still has shit support for most games and a fairly large group of gpus unless you are installing tar blobs and drivers manually. Also most basic Linux distros still lack inbuilt features for customization and control (ie things like the control panels are sorely lacking in ability/something doesn't work very little to be done gui wise)
These are little things to be honest, but remember most people are total fucking retards when it comes to this stuff. Linux developers need to pay more attention to these user/idiot proof details otherwise it will never start displacing windows in a significant way.
That is why. But yea Microsoft is such shit now it wouldn't take much to cause people to flee en masses. Somebody within the Linux community just needs to make a push somewhere to make/edit a distro to have more user land shit so the commoners can run their shit games and crap easily.
Since he didn't help you out with this I would be more than happy to. Just name a piece of software that I NEED that I can't replace with a cross-platform/cross-arch alternative (my AMD64, x86, and ARM devices all run similar software currently).
>flash doesn't run on ARM
Damn, you sure fooled me. Oh well, i'll go back to watching this silky smooth flash video stream.
NVIDIA Shield Android TV, cost about $200 USD. Currently the ARM graphics performance king.
Takes a bit of work to set up but it's a good tech demo and development platform for the future of computing.
If I had to pay for sub-par software then, yes. Luckily, I live in the modern world where open-source software is almost always comparable or superior to the proprietary alternative.
>g-g-guys ARM performance is shit
Intel shills blown the fuck out YET AGAIN
>muh proprietary software
>gotta boot in real mode and run DOS 1.0 natively in 2016
>the competition doesn't have instructions that were deprecated since 1990
>the competition doesn't have 2 decades of obsolete SIMD baggage
>b-but programs with the same source code are crippled on ARM
Why are Intel fans/shills so afraid of "slow" RISC CPUs?
Can't produce proof myself as I don't have one, ask >>52333110 instead. My HTPC is x86_64
Here's some pictures of a Shield TV's CPU usage under playback of some 1080p Hi10p encode:
Stockholm syndrome, or capture-bonding, is a psychological phenomenon in which hostages express empathy and sympathy and have positive feelings toward their captors, sometimes to the point of defending and identifying with the captors. These feelings are generally considered irrational in light of the danger or risk endured by the victims, who essentially mistake a lack of abuse from their captors for an act of kindness.
>Thank you Microsoft for Windows 10
>The Gameboy wasn't god tier hardware yet it outlived the Sega Game Gear.
The Gameboy could run for weeks on two AA batteries, while the Game Gear died after 2-3 hours with 3.
Basically, the Game Boy was a portable gaming console while the Game Gear was just... not.
Low performance doesn't mean shitty performance. ARM is more than plenty for a facebook machine.
Emulating x86 on ARM would not be ok though. It would be very slow and power hungry, and Microsoft made the right choice in not including it.
Sorry but toaster CPUs do not belong on desktops/laptops.
People only bought them because of the google name. Everyone regrets not being able to use real (windows) software.
Doesn't throttle at all with 2 cores at 2.3GHz on passive cooling from a phablet. This thing would actually work really well in low end fanless laptops, since there's not really many processing-heavy programs for ARM.
You mean "try downloading, compiling and installing a package from scratch".
Yes, this can be tricky the first few times on Linux, but it's so much worse on Windows.
If this is something you evaluate laptops based on then Linux is definitely for you.
how am I supposed to compile everything on such a weak chipset?
on a per time basis
but in terms of calculational power over time intel's got some x86 chips that win. Sure the arm chip might use less power to run but when it takes several times longer to complete the task it doesn't always really help.
Yeah but it can't run x86 software so it's immediately garbage for laptops.
I'm not saying ARM in an of itself is a bad architecture. However nobody developed enough useful software for it so the only reason to ever use ARM is for cheap phones and tablets. That's about it.
Normies only use internet browsing and word processing on their $300 shittops either ways, and W10 and GNU/Linux all have good enough programs that will run on ARM for those tasks. Considering ARM chips are cheap even compared to i3 chips, there's no reason low end laptops couldn't just use ARM instead.
No, ARM altogether has less software than x86. It's an inescapable fact of life.
Nobody ever took ARM seriously and now it's playing catch up with desktop software and things don't look good.
I think the main problem is ARM focused solely on low power devices instead of desktop grade chips. That means ARM is not what you want to use for things like ray tracing or video encoding.
ARM could have been amazing had samshit and qualcum developed ARM chips for desktops. But they didn't and now they're paying the price.
>ARM could have been amazing had samshit and qualcum developed ARM chips for desktops. But they didn't and now they're paying the price.
You make it seem like intel would sit still and let them come onto the scene with no competition?
There is a reason Core-M is exists
>No, ARM altogether has less software than x86. It's an inescapable fact of life.
Virtually all libre software is available for ARM.
So everything will be fine as long as you don't hate freedom.
>W10 and GNU/Linux all have good enough programs that will run on ARM for those tasks.
These crippled versions of x86 programs are not something a normie would use, trust me.
>Considering ARM chips are cheap even compared to i3 chips, there's no reason low end laptops couldn't just use ARM instead.
Again software support and raw CPU performance is the problem here. Both of which ARM is dogshit at.
Look I have a raspberry pie and tinker with it often but let's not kid ourselves, ARM isn't going to be replacing x86 anytime soon. It simply has wayyyy too much normie support at this point ever since normies found out they can play vydias on their laptops/desktops.
>It simply has wayyyy too much normie support at this point ever since normies found out they can play vydias on their laptops/desktops.
Normies don't play PC games anymore, anon. They read facebook and watch netflix.
We are talking about pc illiterates.i don't expect my parents to even know how to open the terminal. They'd never be able to install something on Linux if it's not in the software center,on Windows however they have no problems
Well not anymore. Seems like they grew tired of playing angry birds over and over again.
To make things even worse, Sony AND microsoft are using x86 processors. Dark times are ahead for ARM, maybe even the end.
Here's the thing lad, most normies use consoles. And almost all consoles use x86 processors now. This isn't good for ARM at all.
Yeah normies play mobile games but the fact is they get bored of them really quickly. Give a normie killzone shadow fall, gta v, and uncharted and he will rot in his room for a year.
>it doesn't do anything a full OS can't do
You mean "it doesn't do anything that a full OS can't be programmed to do".
It does plenty of things that a no OS does. This includes booting in two seconds, separating user data from the OS data so you can encrypt only one, synchronizing all your settings so well that you can toss the machine and get a new one without noticing a change. I could go on.
You do realize you can't compare different architectures with synthetic benchmarks right?
Also that A9X will only ever be used for apple products thus negating ARM's low cost benefit.
How's ARM "worse"?
From a software development perspective (writing an OS), it's god-like, due to the simplicity of it's assembly language and not relying on fuck-old interfaces for things like booting or getting keyboard input or fucking not having gaps in available memory. I'm sure there's better architectures, but it's definitely an improvement.
And I guess with ARM not being so power-hungry, it's also nice for hardware engineers.
>migrate to ARM
kek, if nobody buys their phones what are they going to migrate?
>migrate to ARM
How can you project further gains on something impossible?
Do these stupid people think that the MacBook line would suddenly go ARM?
The biggest issue is raw performance. Yeah ARM is power efficient but when you need to encode 1080p video you turn to x86, when you want to render 3d animations you turn to x86, when you need to run a website server you turn to x86, when you need to run a super computer you turn to x86.
ARM literally has 0 desktop AND laptop processors.
Don't most commercial software distributes Linux versions in binary. Go download a's visual novel. Linux version is given in binary. It's obvious from your answer that you only used Linux for a short time. As many people have said it if it's not distributed in binary it's not worth using it.
because we believe in a useful and simple work environment and we dont mind paying for it? if obscure operating systems and hardware somehow magicly become easier to use than windows ill switch.
Huawei has a quad core A72 4gb chip already shipping in their latest phone.
I have no idea what they are like to deal with, I should ask them if they're interested in a SBC project.
Not him but this has been explained countless times in countless threads. If you really want an explanation, I suggest you check the archives.
Needless to say, it's not as simple as you make it out to be and geekbench in particular is an example of truly terrible benchmarking software with a clear bias.
No it isn't. It's a long time since I've seen an anon be so wrong.
>Wintards literally begging to be cucked by Intel
>not mentioning Intel backdoors
I wish someone started looking into OpenSPARC/LEON platforms and updating them into low-power desktop/laptop CPUs of the next decade.
>elegant instruction set
>wealth of pre-existing software and compilers
>GPL (suboptimal, but even better than ARM's licensing scheme)
I like. Unfortunately the market doesn't seem to be there. Intel keeps waving their dicks because we let them.
Maintream consumers are already switching from wintel to Android/iOS tablets and phones for their day-to-day work. Turns out email and facebook work just fine on anything and not quite everybody needs to be married to MS for their work and leisure.
Businesses with important monoplatform software and vidya players are obviously another category.
So are we gonna get some actual discussion about RISC on desktop besides Winshills whining how they can't live without Photoshop like it's going to magically disappear if Intel's stranglehold on the market loosens?