>>137446818 The original series is much darker in tone, if you're into that I'd give it a watch. Plus the story is completely different after they fight the 2 armors in the research lab so it won't be like watching the same thing all over again.
The soundtrack is just as good as Brotherhood's, too.
>2003 Had a tremendous first half and introduction to all the characters. As the scales were rising you were getting hyped.
Then in the second half everything started to fall apart and it was very easy to tell what was from the source and what was not. That said, once they figured out what they wanted to do, I think they somewhat redeemed themselves after the stagnant middle bit after Hughes' death.
>Brotherhood The begging was atrocious. It was doing it's best to get to where 2003 diverged, but it was a shoddy job. Up to that point, the characters felt like cardboard cutouts.
After that however, is when it really hits it's stride with all of the exciting new stuff non-manga readers have never seen before. It stays strong all the way to the end and doesn't slow down, sometimes to a fault.
Basically, do you prefer a strong first half or a strong second half?
>>137446818 The 2003 version has a few good things that make it worth watching; personally I view it as a weird fanfiction. Brotherhood is a far better story, but the 2003 version has a better creep factor I guess. It has less lovable characters (no chinamen) and has a strange ending.
Better pacing and no shounen shit dominating the latter half. And the villains in 03 are far fucking superior to Brotherhood. And before you nihongophiles say it; Dante was just as shallow as Father was but unlike the manga, it actually served a narrative point.
Music is superior.
Brotherhood/manga relied on too much "MUH NAKAMA" crap to actually be of any value to anyone older than 15.
Brotherhood is a very good and at times excellent shounen show. 03 is a merely good seinen.
Another thing in favor of 03: IT'S THE ONLY REASON FMA GOT ANOTHER ADAPTATION WITH AN INSANE BUDGET TO BOOT.
>>137446818 >Is there any point in watching the original series now? Did you like brotherhood? >if yes, don't watch the other series >if no, don't watch the other series FMA was babies first anime for a lot of people, they can't take their nostalgia glasses off for it and realize how crap it was. Brotherhood was in my opinion decent.
>>137447173 >inferior to Brotherhood music and animation-wise, so no. How fucking wrong can you be, it's the two strong points of 2003. Brotherhood is more detailed but the animation is not on par with the fluidity of 2003.
>>137454212 That makes zero sense. The manga was the primary motivation for Brotherhood to be made. That's why when remaking it they stuck to the manga's artwork and story like glue. 2003 took liberties with Arakawa's style and added fillers and eventually went anime-original once they caught up with the manga.
Brotherhood was planned specifically to mirror the manga as closely as possible, they even timed it so the last episode of Brotherhood premiered within days of the last manga chapter's publication.
>>137454141 FMA got popular enough for people to buy the dvd in japan and overseas in droves Bones sees this and decides to make another adaption and breaking the bank while doing so because they know for an outright FACT that they will make their money back guaranteed.
>>137454226 It was far more satisfying than "hurr let's beat up god with our animal friends and everyone gets everything they wanted and go home happy". The whole series set up a theme of sacrifice, and Brotherhood shat all over that while 03 stayed consistent. 03 > Brotherhood.
>>137454294 >The manga was the primary motivation for Brotherhood to be made And im sure the runaway success of the original adaptation had NOTHING to do with it. No correlation at all i'm sure. >Brotherhood was planned specifically to mirror the manga as closely as possible A full 6 fucking years after 03 was originally aired and became an international hit.
>>137454340 >Bones sees this and decides to make another adaption Okay so not only are you completely retarded you don't even know how anime is made. Bones is a fucking anime studio, not a publisher. They don't own FMA, it's not their IP, they don't get to decide to make another anime for it. That power falls squarely with Arakawa, who defers it to her publisher (Enix in this case) like basically all mangaka do.
Enix decided to Greenlight a new adaptation because the manga was ending within a year or so and there was still a lot of demand for an adaptation since it was one of the best selling monthly shounens out there.
>>137454449 >the runaway success It didn't even break the best seller's list, not even the first volume. The 2003 anime did it's job though, which was to spike manga sales. Only the manga hype far outlived the 2003 anime's hype, so much so that Enix decided it was enough to sustain a second, more faithful adaptation. Which is what they went for.
>>137454513 >Bones is a fucking anime studio, not a publisher. They don't own FMA, it's not their IP, they don't get to decide to make another anime for it. That power falls squarely with Arakawa, who defers it to her publisher (Enix in this case) like basically all mangaka do. >Enix decided to Greenlight a new adaptation because the manga was ending within a year or so and there was still a lot of demand for an adaptation since it was one of the best selling monthly shounens out there. And again, the runaway success of 03 had NOTHING TO DO WITH THIS. No. Just ignore that gravy train and the untold amounts of money Arakawa is swimming in from both adaptations. >>137454687 >It didn't even break the best seller's list, not even the first volume. Bullshit it did. I demand a goddamn source for bullshit of that caliber. That shows popularity spread like wildfire. It was goddamn inescapable.
>>137457803 You forgot "I made chimeras out of my wife and a dog and then my daughter and a dog" and "I'm actually just a goldfish in a test tube". If we go by manga continuity as well, we have "I'll have my student in fire alchemy burn the secret of this one rare form of alchemy off your back and leave a horrible scar" or "My son and daughter are fucking up the house so let's go on vacation".
>>137458004 Not him, but you do realize Ed had to sacrifice his knowledge of alchemy in Brotherhood just to get Al back, right? Oh, and to give Edward his arm back, Al had to sacrifice himself. The brothers had to sacrifice something to be able to perform alchemy WITHOUT a transmutation circle. Roy's ambition caused Hughes' death and nearly killed Riza.
>>137458082 >"I'll have my student in fire alchemy burn the secret of this one rare form of alchemy off your back and leave a horrible scar" or "My son and daughter are fucking up the house so let's go on vacation" Holy shit I forgot about them! Doggystyle was chimaera dude, I thought it was more succinct. FMA was like a guide "On How Not to be a Father".
>>137458184 >Ed had to sacrifice his knowledge of alchemy in Brotherhood Nope. He didn't. He sacrificed his ability to perform alchemy, but his knowledge never went anywhere. You have no idea what you're talking about unfortunately.
>>137458377 I'll answer for you. You aren't quoting anyone. You've constructed a strawman to attack instead of addressing the actual points, and now you're getting angry because you're being called out for your bullshit.
>>137458320 Yeah, between dying, using family members for inter-species breeding, refusing to punish two unruly children, being a test tube thing, being a 1,000 year old deadbeat, Hitler 2.0, and using your own child for teaching others a pretty fucking dangerous art, I gotta say FMA shit on being a dad. >>137458344 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_5cga0x8Q9g >Sacrifice's his Portal of Truth >Basically a door to infinite knowledge and understanding Right
>>137459004 Saying something shat over the theme of sacrifice is not the same as saying that something is altogether not at all about sacrifice. One criticizes the execution of it, the other denies it exists. You're not very clever, are you.
Dante was just human, who wanted to be immortal. I don't even know why the '03 homunculi tried to take over the military.
Father was otherwordly being who was ready to sacriface the whole world in order to understand the said world. Reminded me of that stone mason from that daoist folk tale.
On the different note but speaking of the villain, I liked how there was kind of "ouroboros" thing going with the whole of the story. Homunculus was brought to this world with the blood of Hoenheim and in sense he was father of it. Homunculus started the trouble and it was sons of Hoenheim who needed to end it all. Gives to the story little feel of pottery.
I like Brotherhood more as a whole, but to be honest, Hughes death was much better handled and had more impact in 2003, because he was actually like a father for the boys, while in Brotherhood we barely know him, so his death has much less impact because of being too early in the series
I watched the orginal first. Then I watched brotherhood. Brother hood was just really boring at some parts, the original had faster transitioning character develpoment, story was more interesting. The original just never had me caring for the story.
>>137462599 This was probably the biggest flaw. I understand they wanted to get through the old stuff and into the new, and they were devoted to following the manga, but they really should have built up that stuff. It was still impactful, but wasn't Nina introduced and turned into a chimaera in the same episode in Brotherhood?
Desu as someone that reads literatue 03 kind of had it good where the big bad wasn't some guy becoming super Satan or whatever, he was just some dude screwing others because he and his wife wanted to live forever. The ending is also bittersweet which is kind of a lot like 19th century russian literature. brotherhood was shounen good shounen, but shounen nonetheless
>>137454513 Bones isn't owned by Enix. Enix can't compel Bones to make an adaptation if they don't want to, and nothing forces Enix to chose Bones for the second adaptation, as many shows with multiple adaptations have been done by different studios. Pretty sure the success of the 03 anime influenced their decision on this matter though.
It's weird, having only read the manga 2003 ver. seems like an entirely different story.
Honestly, I was a bit disappointed with how it all ended, it felt like the mangaka just wasn't having it anymore and compromised on a lot of the themes that made the original volumes so tense.
Also manga sloth was shit outside of literally the last page where he smiles while dying. Really pissed me off that a homunculus role got strapped by such a non-character while they suddenly give such big roles to the 4 chimera soldiers.
>watch a collection of outtakes from FMA Brotherhood >only like 2 clips are actual bloopers where someone misspoke >everything else is the voice actors saying dumb bullshit instead of the line. >both of the bloopers are by Armstrong
>>137452228 Honestly, I don't fault Brotherhood for a weak start, because I get the impression it was intentionally glossed over so they could get to the 'new' (not previously animates) content faster. If 2003 hadn't already been made, the arcs it shares with brotherhood would have gotten more attention in brotherhood.
To be fair, that's basically how I watched it, anyhow. Watched 03 until shortly before Hughes died, then switched to brotherhood for the rest. Best of both worlds.
I cant watch Brotherhood because of how hard they rushed the intro. I understand its because they favor more story, i understand theres development going to happen later, but its so damn sloppy. Ive been told the only way to enjoy it is to pretend all the development of the original happened in brotherhood and start from episode 14, but fuck it I have other shit I can watch so Im not gonna bother.
>>137471642 This, I've tried watching Brotherhood, even skipping to a dozen episodes in, but I just don't find it as good as the manga. If you can't get into Brotherhood give the manga a shot (if you haven't).
>>137470376 I wish they had kept up the pace from the start of brotherhood. Whole thing starts to drag big-time once they hit the brakes. It could've been a three-cour show, and would have been the better for it.
Read the manga, loved it. Watched Brotherhood, thought it was a pretty good adaption. Watched the first 3 episodes of 03 and already it's off the rails with original characters, glacial pacing, and overly melodramatic everything. If it's so wrong this quickly, I can only imagine how much worse it gets.
>>137467025 >The Japanese version of the series is called Hagane no Renkinjutsushi: Fullmetal Alchemist (鋼の錬金術師 FULLMETAL ALCHEMIST Hagane no Renkinjutsushi: Furumetaru Arukemisuto?, abbreviated as 鋼の錬金術師FA) to differentiate it from the 2003 series.
I don't get why people say Brotherhood is shit at the beginning and then gets good. After Scar joins the "good guys" it just feels like Avatar. Childish philosophy from Scar was really embarassing. He was much more interesting as this chaotic evil guy. >let's all unite and beat the evil guy! >I can change this world!
Hohenheim turned out to be a really "empty" character as well, no depth whatsoever.
The first 30 episodes were great, then it turned to shit. Also hated that Edward doesn't have decisive victories until the final battle where his enemy is basically harmless. Haven't watched FMA, hope it's better.
>>137473479 >Hohenheim turned out to be a really "empty" character as well, no depth whatsoever. >He was much more interesting as this chaotic evil guy. This is what nostalgia goggles do to you, it cuts blood flow from your brain and kills your baincells and you can't accept when you're demonstrably wrong.
>>137473462 > muh edge BHfags like to shout out these "criticisms" ad nauseum but always seem to forget that the manga's tone was very much melancholy and bittersweet before it turned into a Shonen Jump series in the latter half.
>>137461857 Dante was a woman who willing to sacrifice millions and millions of souls just to stay with her one true love. Sadly her one true love betray her with a normal human being. This put her on the edge due to losing her lover and source of eternal life, that's why she needed the Homunculus to gather all known philosopher Stone and finally infiltrate the military to find these alchemist who can create Philosopher Stone and eventually became her new lover.
>>137461857 >Dante was just human, who wanted to be immortal. Exactly. She was just a human who thought she was above humanity and put on pretensions about guiding civilization and protecting it from itself, but in the end her motivations boiled down to the most base and petty of human desires. She named the homunculi after the seven deadly sins because she believed they were emblematic of human sinfulness, and yet she herself exhibited every one of those sins more than they did.
That's called dramatic irony. To each his own, but I'd say that's a lot more interesting than a literal monster who wants to literally become God.
>>137475388 >Injured Ishvallans that are treated end up going back to fight the military >For some reason nobody thinks to just detain them as POW's >Nah let's have Mustang kill these valuable medical personnel for doing their jobs instead
I like 2003 anon, but let's not pretend it wasn't melodramatic and poorly written at times.
shits more fucked in 03. they handle some things much better. you see why ed is a man of the people. Deaths hit much harder,
BUT the villains kinda suck or well the end game ones. Didnt care for wrath and sloth in it. ending it with a movie cliffhanger they can eat a dick.
Brotherhood skipped binding time with some characters that you should feel for. Also Hughes death & tuckers girl didnt hurt as much. felt skipped. Brotherhood has a crop of great characters we never see in 03 . Armstrongs sis, ling and the others, the northern wall troops. Dwarf in the flask was pretty cool and eds dad didnt just have some fucked up old lover that switched bodies. things got resolved in brotherhood with no movie needed. great ending.
>>137446818 Not really, 03 had some huge flaws for me >Build Winry as love interest to return to after their journey, but leave her for other dimension >Fucking nazis >Philosopher stones become heavily underwhelming. Maybe some more, but it's been years since I've watched it. Overall Brotherhood was a good adaption of a great manga.
Even if you are in the wrong thread, I will still say the same thing I always do. I appreciate 2011 for continuing the series up to the current arc but vastly prefer the artistic direction and animation of 99.
>>137465267 Surprised by how deep kimbly turns out to be in the manga. He's not a random murderhobo, has a weak sense of morality and rules he sets for himself, and even gets to come back one final time to fuck over pride
So what exactly happened that so radically changed the themes and mood of the story halfway through in brotherhood/manga? Did the mangaka switch magazines or get married or something else that would justify the changes?
If I remember right, the first few volumes of the manga have a lot of dark themes and the execution is equally morbid. But somewhere near the end of the first half the entire thing does a 180 and starts pushing for shonen morals and the power of friendship and that's pretty much where it stays outside of a few saddening moments like grandad ninja and mohawk crocodile arm dying.
kimbly vs al fight really pissed me off where Al basically states that he isn't gonna sacrifice shit and get everything he wants because that's what it means to be nakama or some other weak justification even after the first line of dialogue in the series is about how humans can't obtain anything without giving something in return.
It's clear that Arakawa has studied both western and chinese alchemies and her story follows stages of making philosophers stone.
In the first part of the story they are looking cure for themselves, only point of their journey is to find how to get their bodies back. Later on they learn the truth behind the truth and they want to put end to it not for themselves but for others. They strat from nigredo, the darkening and work all the way to rubiedo. From selfishness to understand that they are part of the all.
>>137475670 >only show up at the 11th hour for muhdrama >mute baby factory >character development No you autistic son of a fucking bitch that's not how drama works. Drama isn't fucking fireworks you can set off, it's a jenga tower you have to keep pulling at.
>>137446818 03 sold better and is actually a lot more well known than Brotherhood. Personally I thought regardless of which one was "correct", 03 was a better show, and "correct" didn't exist when 03 was made since the manga wasn't even close to finished. In fact, now that I think about it, 03 really IS the original FMA story.
Why Father is a great and thematically coerent villain:
The show's theme is alchemy. The Original Homunculus, in his search for humanity actually does the opposite of what an Alchemist would do. Instead of working out his problems, and lapidating his soul, he throws aways the parts of his personality he considers bad, the "Seven Deadly Sins". However, in Alchemy, each sin is associated with positive characteristics that can be developed and by throwing those parts aways, the Father did the opposite of what he was trying to. That also explains why some of the homunculi actually learn from their mistakes, and become better people. The father then, goes on with his plan to "become a god" by sacrificing others once again. He fails, and when faced by the truth of Alchemy behind the Gate,( which happens to be a reflection of himself, just as the Inner Deity or Sacred Guardian Angel is represented in Alchemy) goes into his own living hell.
>That devastated look on Ed's face when Mustang demands answers over his alchemy, and begs forgiveness >Nina >Hughes's daughter at his funeral >"It's starting to rain." >Ed's breakdown when he thinks his brother hates him for the situation he put them in.
>>137446818 03 is literally plebbit >muh shocking value moments >shitstorm of fillers >complex characters like mustang,kimblee,bradley becoming one-dimensional goofs >no world expansion whatsoever >original anime ending even a kindergarden student could come up with >main villain has no purpose except LIVE FOREVAH
>>137481619 >outside of a few saddening moments like grandad ninja and mohawk crocodile arm dying. The fact that these were meant to be the most impactful (and only) sympathetic character deaths in the entire second half still makes me mad.
>>137484977 Rose's arc was built up continuously from the very beginning, and merges into Ed's arc about realizing his actions have consequences and he's part of something greater. She goes from being weak and needing Ed to tell her to keep moving forward to eventually turning the tables and giving the same lecture to him. Her arc also ties in with the Liore plotline, which is built up throughout the entirety of 03 but irrelevant in the manga past the pilot chapter.
Being a BHfag of course, it's understandable that you can't follow themes and subtext unless they're explicitly spelled out for you in lengthy "I learned something today" monologues.
>>137489002 I have a hard time choosing since I love most of the characters. I'd probably go with Winry for best girl, though Riza and Izumi are great too. For guys it's a tie between Al and Greed, with Roy or Armstrong in 2nd.
>>137489947 bro, they were clearly together through the entire series. It's also confirmed in the third artbook that the only reason they aren't married is because of the fraternization laws, which won't matter when Roy becomes Fuhrer (which Arakawa also confirmed will happen)
>it's 15 years after the end of brotherhood >Roy Mustang is Fuhrer >Nu-pride babby Selim is now in his late teens early 20s >Ed and Winry's children are in their mid to late teens >possibility of Al having chink babies
what's the next big evil that would happen and need to be stopped?
FMA (the original) was the first anime I ever watched. I remember because I got to episode 30, then it was licensed by an English company so all the anime sites took the downloads down and stopped subbing any more.
This thread has gotten me interested in rewatching 03 now. Don't think I ever watched it all the way through, but I do remember the sound direction being really fucking good, and the show in general just having a great atmosphere and tone to it. https://youtu.be/BXQLrkW33f0
>>137485806 Honestly Brotherhood didn't do as much with Ishval as they should have. They took an entire volume worth of quality backstory and crammed it into one episode. They didn't even put the scene where Armstrong saves the two Ishvalan women.
>>137500358 I'm not sure, but I think that all of the souls besides Selim's if he even has an original , which would contradict the following point were dispelled by Ed. This means that he shouldn't be able to use his power anymore, or at least it would be very weakened (instead of being able to summon giant black tentacle shadows, he would only be able to summon one the size of a thumbtack or so). So he should be in a perpetually weakened state, unless if he figures out to absorb souls like Father did after he had swallowed god. So I'd say Kimblee's soul is gone, or still there but severely nulled somehow.
>>137446818 FMA felt more Emotionally and Dark driven To discover the truth. As FMAB feels more Action Paced and Emphasizes the personal achievements of the characters and the progression of their maturity with time. Each is good in what it does,if you like one better then the other that's your preference.
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