I am not a VN reader but most of the people who read it hates UFO adaption of ubw
I don't know much about the V/N but the animation is flawless imo.
I liked it, and I can't really fault it because adapting the visual novel properly would crave immense amounts of internal monolouging so you can actually get the most out of all the characters, but it would destroy the pacing completely. Ultimately, any adaptation wont ever be able to do the VN proper justice, but regardless I thought it was good.
- Dumbing down a complex and interesting world by not even bothering to cover deep and interesting lore and explanations behind why things happen(ex: Shirou's powers never being explained thus making them complete random asspull, the setting never being explained, difference between magic and magecraft is never explained, magic circuits never being even explained, etc)
- Ruining, changing or dumbing down the characterization of both main characters(Rin and Shirou). Most of Rin's inner conflict and flaws are never apparent. Most of Shirou's tactical thinking, philosophy and sociopathy is never apparent.
- Taking away the tactical aspect of the fights and turning them into asspully powerbrawls of shit exploding. The fact that the said "shit exploding" happens to have a shitshow of shitty lacking choreography that does not even come close to Fate/Zero's fights also does not help.
- Outright skipping Caster's backstory and motivations for sake of a filler episode about her master.
- Taking away most of the romance, by removing the dynamic bickering between the two and making Shirou far more passive and dense(instead of him having intentionally tease Rin). Literally all that this epic romance amounts to in the adaptation is them...shaking hands -__-
- Adding needless anime original scenes that serve no purpose while at the same time failing to adapt crucial monologues and exposition. That includes a completely pointless final episode that should have been an OVA and only serves to make it the main work even more generic harem than adaptation already did, wasting time that could have spent on Shirou's character.
- Awfully uneven pacing that drags pointless sol scenes out and rushes important scenes that should be intense, thrilling and atmospheric.
I think that about covers the main points.
Shirou: I accept that I'll end up fucked in the future but I am going to do it anyway.
That's the stupidest thing I ever heard. I used to like Emiya in the first anime but now he is one of the worst characters I have ever seen.
Sounds like you'd enjoy Heaven's Feel
which means you're a complete pleb for not wanting to be a superhero
>implying "i'll destroy myself for a murderer" is not the most chuuni shit there is
UBW was the most mature outcome, realizing the ideal is unattainable but worth living by, accepting your flaws and imperfections.
>most of the people who read it hates UFO adaption of ubw
Those people would never be happy with anything. I've read the VN multiple times and UFOtable did the adaptation great justice.
>the most mature outcome
Who the fuck cares. It's your personal preference anyway.
I've read most of what he's written, the lore of his world has the depth of a puddle.
Basing all the heroic spirits on actual mythologies and legends means none of the lore surrounding them is his beyond the minor nasu-original stuff he adds to them. The Arthurian legend doesn't belong to Nasu, only the version where Arthur was actually a woman who was given a magic futa cock to sire Mordred is.
The majority of the original stuff he does create likely won't have any relevance outside of some of the FSN stuff because TM is set on milking Fate till the last drop. Just look through all the character material and so much of it is still just concept art if even that (half of the dead apostles don't even have that). If you actually try to read any of the background of what there is half of it is just ends up being powerlevel bullshit.
>I've read most of what he's written, the lore of his world has the depth of a puddle.
Stopped reading there.
Fate/stay night's intimate relationship with the legends it borrows is impressive, marking itself as a fascinating work of mythic revisionism. I honestly think Nasuverse lore is beyond your grasp.
It's a faithful adaption in my opinion. The core issues come from the source's writing. It's just not that good to begin with, so without curving the dialogue so it's not so long-winded there's not a lot that van be done in that department.
That's why I watched for the action. UFO did a great job there and with any incarnation of this series outside of the VN, the battles are always the most gratifying part.
What I don't get are complaints like this >>135588409 . I mean, Shirou isn't an amazing character on paper to begin with, but somehow he gets singled out as being particularly bad in this adaption. There's a massive amount of fan bias that goes into it - nothing can be as good as the source material even if the adaption does pretty well with what it's given.
They just hate that it isn't a 1:1 adaptation, and they'd hate it either way really. If these people had read Fate/Zero they'd hate the anime too, but very few people read the LNs.
>intimate relationship with the legends it borrows is impressive
There is literally nothing that Nasu takes from it that couldn't be found on the wikipedia page.
The dude isn't some historian specializing in legends and mythologies. He's a doujin eroge scenario writer who happened to make it big writing porn games.
>I mean, Shirou isn't an amazing character on paper to begin with
Everyone complains about Gilgamesh and Lancelot's backstories cut in the Zero anime, along with the shitty Kerry vs Kirei fight, how fucking new are you? Outside of a few hiccups it was a far greater adaptation
Wait, so you're otherwise okay with a world abundant in vampires, demons, nature spirits, magic, planet gods, time axes, the collective unconscious as an actual thing, and an extra-dimensional space where the spirits of all legends reside (all of which are abundant IN PRESENT DAY), but you're not okay with the idea of mythological or legendary figures being real in that world?
He majored in history and philosophy; if you weren't a secondary and had read a single interview (freely available over at Tsukikan) you would know this.
They complain about the backstories because they were told they are missing, and that fight is visibly bad. No one is complaining about Lancelot or Gilgamesh's characterization being changed. No one complains about Kirei and his relation to the grail being changed. I'm not complaining either, but there aren't complaints about unimportant shit because few people read the LN, whereas a lot of people read UBW and whine about every little unimportant detail they changed.
>He majored in history and philosophy
Anyone can major in history anon, there is a difference between an actual historian and someone who majored in history. The fact that none the lore he shamelessly pulls from world mythologies goes any deeper than what a lay person could find by searching the internet leads me to believe his historical background had little relevance on his work.
The noses weren't that bad in motion and weren't Miura's fault. The CGI wasn't his fault either, and isn't shitty by any means, it's as good as TV anime CGI gets. The pacing was better than in the VN.
You based that whole statement on LACK of EVIDENCE, NOT on there being evidence proving otherwise.
>The fact that none the lore he shamelessly pulls from world mythologies goes any deeper than what a lay person could find by searching the internet
If you can't grasp how deep and elegant is Nasu's marked take on the legends of old, remove yourself from this thread.
pretty much hit the nail on the head.
I'm not even a fan of Fate in the slightest, but I enjoyed parts of UBW and HF in the VN. The anime just sucked completely and didn't have the few parts of the VN that made it enjoyable.
It's not about Fate being "deep" or "rich in lore" or whatever. People who read the VN will still call it shallow. The anime still completely lacked what the VN got me to think and consider about the characters and events.
>Taking away the tactical aspect of the fights and turning them into asspully powerbrawls of shit exploding.
This is especially an issue, because you hardly have a reason to care for most of the antagonists in either the VN or the anime, but the VN at least makes each fight feel more interesting. In the anime, it comes off as just showing off budget + monster of the week. In regards to people who watched Zero first: If people weren't familiar with Gilgamesh and Saber from Fate/Zero, there'd be even less people that would care about him. The UBW anime is certainly not compelling and interesting, and doesn't make the main cast enjoyable to follow and care about.
With the way that things get adapted to anime, with VN adaptations especially, making the show "interesting" seems to be the lowest priority of most studio projects.
Fucking ufo shit eaters
>It has flashy lights and long, drawn out episodes so it got attention put into it! Nevermind Shirou's entire character being dumbed down to generic-LN-level and skipping an important antagonist's backstory!
Ufoubw is a creatively dead, cynical, lifeless, mediocre attempt by aniplex to gather some cash from the fanbois. Nothing more. Everything in its production shouts "we don't have to try since it will sell anyway"
>- Adding needless anime original scenes that serve no purpose while at the same time failing to adapt crucial monologues and exposition. That includes a completely pointless final episode that should have been an OVA and only serves to make it the main work even more generic harem than adaptation already did, wasting time that could have spent on Shirou's character.
The flashback to Ilya's past was ten times better in the anime, we got a lot of good info and it made her more than quick fodder with barely any development.
>Wait, so you're otherwise okay with a world abundant in vampires, demons, nature spirits, magic, planet gods, time axes
Not really? Personally I dislike contemporary fantasy as a whole because the whole setting to me feels like a cop-out for authors who want to have magic and swords but don't want to deal with the rest of what comprises fantasy, like actual world building. The vanilla FSN game is longer than the entire LotR trilogy yet despite how often Fatefags will harp on about how great Nasu is at world building it doesn't even begin to compare in the sense it actually gives the reader about the world the characters live in.
The heroic spirits being actual legends is just the icing on the shit-cake. In addition to being a free rubric on how to write the lore for a good number of his characters it's not secret that Japan (and the target demographic for these games) has an obsession with these kind of legends. Even other videogames like RPGs will commonly choose to just name their weapons things like Excalibur or Balmung over trying to come up with original names even if the actual lore behind them is completely thrown out because they know players like that kind of thing.
Exposition is bad in anime. It would have fucked up the pacing and amounted to nothing, as it's magic after all, the explanations are based on the expanded universe.
Their characterization is inferior, but that's going to happen when you translate from being inside their heads to watching them on a screen. Rin's conflict is clearly apparent from the Prologue and Episode 13 alone, it's subtle yes, but it is there. Shirou is less tactical, but his philosophy is there, seen through the monologues and speeches when talking to Archer, and his sociopathy is seen when he talks about his ideals, and when he talks to Mitsuzuri and then to Rin outside the Einzbern Mansion.
The fights were flashier than in Zero, but they were just as tactical. In fact, the only fight with more tactics in Zero was Saber vs Lancer in episode 4.
All the important points from Caster motivations that are in FSN, and not in FHA were expressed in her backstory. I don't know what you are talking about here.
The romance in the VN was just as shitty to be honest. The bickering was still there, we saw Shirou teasing her about her flab and there was plenty of teasing, him appearing dense is part of his character, this isn't any different from the VN.You could blame Nasu for making RN the official version.
Monologues and exposition have no place in anime, do you know the phrase show don't tell? Shirou didn't need episodes worth of monologues to get his character across, the fight with Archer was enough for that. The anime original scenes are just pointless because you know they are original, there are scenes that are even more pointless that aren't original.
The pacing problems come from the VN, but it was never as slow as the VN. They also didn't rush any part other than the scene with Archer in the church.
Why do you guys critizise it so much? You act like this is the shittiest anime ever, the "flaws" you list aren't as bas as you think they are, the adaptation does have flaws, but they aren't ones that'd make this a shitty adaptation, or bad or anything near that. No one seems to talk about the brilliantly executed Prologue, the Berserker fight, Gilgamesh vs Berserker, Illya's story, Episode 19 and 20, and Episode 24.
>If you can't grasp how deep and elegant is Nasu's marked take on the legends of old
>wrote King arthur as a (fuckable) girl for the sole reason of "sex sells"
>appends shit like Arthur's son with "she was granted a magical penis"
>also Francis drake is a woman
>also Jack the ripper is a woman
>deep and elegant
>Gilgamesh vs Berserker
Oh you mean pacing killer interruption for zerobullshit flashback with no actual explanation from VN on why Winter Forest is even happening, with an undertstated Illya/Berserker bond due to BS like Illya calls to berserker MILIMETERS BEHIND HIM. Then the fight is yet again static camera sfxsfxsfx CGI fight... ending with a too-late scream from Shirou.
Way to miss the point, Ufo. I can't respond to the rest of kitschy post because you praised this atrociously handled fight.
Your opinion is truly shit. That fight was handled spectacularly, you just have an irrational hate for anything in the adaptation because it isn't exactly what you wanted. Stop being such a neckbeard.
Dropped it in the first cour because Shirou was a lot more annoying in the anime than in the VN.
Most likely because you read what he's thinking in the VN so its a lot more understandable, but the anime makes it seem like he's a brain dead retard.
Super hyped for HF though.
If you disliked UBW there's no reason to be hyped for HF. It's the same team, so you'll just be disappointed. Let us, the non-brain dead part of this fanbase, enjoy the movie please.
CANT HAVE MONOLOGUES GUYSE. VISUAL MEDIUM YO
HUNDRED OF FLASHBACKS INTERRUPTING THE SCENE IS TOTALLY FINE THO.
Sasuga, Miura apologist. Back to watching your edgelordery fanservice filler
Fate/Stay Night is a gateway eroge of the worst kind. It's a bad game, a clusterfuck of story and characterization that isn't very well done by any aspect, but which attempts to compensate for its weaknesses by adding in excessive powerlevel faggotry and DARKNESS. The normal anon can see this as the shit it is, and may enjoy it, hate it or be indifferent to it, but all the while recognizing that the VN itself, regardless of their opinion, is plain bad.
However, these very aspects that try to smear over the shit of its core make it a breeding ground for aspie, unsociable underageb& faggots who engage in every kind of faggotry both online and in the real world. The superpowered characters all trying their hardest to look cool, the Noble Phantasms, ridiculous, color-coded clothes, the whole Servant faggotry and everything about the Fate/Stay Night world fuels their escapist fantasies, while the pity-party character backgrounds, emphasis on the NATURE of HEROISM, and overall chuuni tone of the VN makes it fit just right with the mary-sueish drives of your average preteen and his sense of unwarranted self-importance towards the world. Exactly the kind of shit that makes little kiddies and underageb& retards eat this shit right the fuck up.
Fate/Stay Night is basically THE franchise to attract the most hated fanbase known to /a/, which is why, regardless of individual opinions, it is the responsibility of every anon to troll the fuck out of this franchise and everyone who likes it, and ensure that no Fate/Stay Night threads ever encourage the newfriends to show their faces here.
Flashbacks are part of the visual medium you retard. Internal monologues are awful when you aren't reading them. On top of that, the flashbacks were part of the VN. Your argument makes no sense, and all caps make you look like a 12 year old. Have you read the rules, let alone the VN?
I wasn't a big fan of the UBW route in the VN in the first place, and I really enjoyed HF for Kotomine and Ilya anyway. I'll probably enjoy it regardless as long as they have the few scenes I'm looking forward to.
Different narratives. In the context of the anime, his actions were grating. In the context of the VN, they were mostly understandable and you have your imagination to fill in any questionable gaps.
Wrong. Shirou's development is about a “beta male” confronting various toxic images of idealized alpha masculinity (Archer, Gilgamesh, and Kirei) and rejecting them to become comfortable with himself as he truly is.
His actions are the same in the anime and the Vn.
The difference is that in VN you have his reasoning spelled out for you word by word, but in the anime you need to use your brain for a second and think for yourself to understand his reasoning.
>All these faggots who literally expect a 24-ish episode anime to cover a 25h+ VN
>Miura: For our part, we thought about making Unlimited Blade Works using one of the classic formulas, "the protagonist grows and matures and achieves catharsis." Speaking of which, from the early meeting stages, Mr. Nasu was telling us flat-out that Shirou was a character who doesn't grow or mature. Of course, that's Mr. Nasu's particular style of saying things, but, speaking for myself, that left a profound impression on me. To restate it in our terms, he was saying that Shirou is such an unwavering character that you think never grows or matures. That's proven to be a crucial stepping-off point as I draw the storyboards for this series. When we have meetings with Mr. Nasu like that, one or two pearls of wisdom that leave an impression sometimes come out of nowhere. Seeing how a creator's mind works up close was really stimulating.
From a booklet that was included with the first BD box set of UBW.
The whole booklet can be read in its entirety online.
Her personality and morality challenges the idea of heroism and reaffirms the theme of UBW and the futility of chasing or trying to fulfill broken ideals, while reaffirming the worth of the process and what we do with the choices we have.
Whose fate? What fate? Which Fate? Is destiny the central overarching theme of the story?
Why is there a solidus in there? Are we sure this isn't supposed to be a colon?
What does this even mean? Why aren't these words capitalized? Is it meant to be read in imperative mood, like a commanding statement to the "player" to make stay night? Is there supposed to be a comma in there, like "stay, night?" Is there supposed to be a 'the' in there, like "stay the night?" What stays night? Is it Fate that stays night? Is staying night another important theme? What is the night and how is it stayed?
Some of my criticisms:
Removal of Shirou's internal monologue, which obscures his mental state and makes it harder to pinpoint his motivations. Ufotable basically realized they fucked up on this part, which is why Shirou suddenly got a fuckload of internal narration in the second cour despite not having any in the first cour.
The fights are more style over substance. The VN goes into intricate detail about how the servants or Shirou counter each other with deliberate thoughts and actions. The biggest issue is in the Gil vs Shirou fight, where Shirou leaps around like superman and spams Rho Aias, essentially making UBW useless whereas in the VN it was pivotal to beating Gil and even then just barely.
Shirou's interactions with Rin are severely dumbed down. There's a lot less banter between the two and he comes across more like a generic MC around her, which hurts their dynamic and chemistry.
Other than that, it's a really good adaption. Easily 8/10.
>She is very important to the themes of UBW and a large part of the plot revolves around a conflict with her, but she isn't important
Did you read te VN? Title means "stay the night", a big part of F/SN's final route is the subjectivity and cultural perception of good and evil.
>most of the people who read it hates UFO adaption of ubw
This is false. Most people like Ufo's UBW, regardless of whether they read the VN or not. It's just a loud minority of complainers.
Did you read what I posted? I said that Shirou is a character who does not grow or mature and that Nasu said so himself. I never made any claim that Nasu's statement was to be taken at face-value or could not be interpreted in any way other than literally, I only conveyed his words.
Who's ready for the wave of zerofag secondaries claiming that HF was way better because it was darker and more "mature"?
>my face when a secondary says Shirou is shit or F/Z is better than F/SN
>where Shirou leaps around like superman
>spams Rho Aias
He uses it all of once.
>essentially making UBW useless whereas in the VN it was pivotal to beating Gil
He spends the whole fight controlling swords. Hell, the anime does a much better job than the VN ever did of conveying the fact that in UBW, Shirou's swords are MUCH faster than Gil's.
I read the visual novel and I enjoyed it. I even think it improved upon some things from Unlimited Blade Works. Most memorable of all was that during the scene where Caster steals Saber by using Fujimura as bait, the setting is within some kind of reality marble-esque location, rather than merely Shirou's house.
And of course, it was amazing getting to see all of the Noble Phantasms come to life. The only weakness was that they cut out the sex scene in favour of that "sharing magical energy" shit.
>all the VN readers hate this adaption
What? Who told you this? No one hate it except 0.5% of people who rate every episode as 1/5 on niconico and one shitposter without life.
Are... you being serious right now ?
Why the fuck do you disagreed with the guy saying you didn't get Shirou character then ?
Nasu said that, yes, but he meant something else, so if you knew the meaning behind those words, why not flat out saying it rather than expecting other people to interpret what you say ?
Caster kidnapping Taiga in Shirou's house built on the previous day's scene where Rin and Shirou discussed bounded fields. Ufo fucked up by changing location to random crappy CGI water area.
>there are secondaries right now lying about reading the VN while saying that they wouldn't gratefully lap up Nasu's dickcheese and don't even passionately hate the hacks that butchered his masterpiece
Let me elaborate: consider all three routes. In Fate, she shows up for one scene, shows RB for all of three seconds (fifteen in a bad end), then dies to Gil. In HF she doesn't even get to speak, as I recall. In UBW the only thing of note that she does is breaking Saber and Archer's contracts and gloating. The important thing about her is RB, not Caster herself. Her backstory does nothing for her character.
>waah, I've been betrayed by everyone I ever loved
>dunno, let's satisfy this guy I just fell in love with's dream
>Shirou wants to become a hero
>Shirou sees Archer, his dream realized albeit not the way he idealised it
>Shirou is forced to live with the fact that he can't save everybody and that saving people will not always bring the desired effect
>Shirou accepts the fact that the hero's path is an impossible one and one he shouldn't attempt to realize but he'll nevertheless live by his ideals
It's really not that hard to understand if you've actually read the VN or watched the anime, although the last episode kinda fucked up. It's only in HF where Shirou chooses to protect his loved ones over becoming a hero so that's a different development all on its own. So Shirou is a character that does get developed.
>20484 posts on mal
>nonstop shitposting in every fate threads
NEET master race
Your rudimentary understanding of Caster's character is about as bad as the average secondary. Even ANN's "toxic masculinity" reviewer had a better grasp than you do.
"Sensible reasoning" my ass, you can't follow the text at all.
>the greatest weapon against retarded secondaries
Then please, explain the link between her backstory and her actions in the HGW.
Hilariously enough, most of the times the ones posting bait images are actually secondaries.
I read the VN recently enough I like UBW just fine. The VN can be kind of mess at times. And, god damn, does Sakura being sick take way too much fucking time in HF. The HF movies might be better than the VN if they cut most of that shit out.
(Whats up with Nasu and fever dreams that go on forever?)
>In regards to people who watched Zero first: If people weren't familiar with Gilgamesh and Saber from Fate/Zero, there'd be even less people that would care about him. The UBW anime is certainly not compelling and interesting, and doesn't make the main cast enjoyable to follow and care about.
As a Zero secondaries, I definitely agree about this. While I certainly do enjoy UBW, I feel that my appreciation of it would have been lesser if I haven't watched Zero first.
UBW itself couldn't have made care about the characters whatsoever. It's compelling enough in term of action and its visual presentation, which is why I believe this anime is so well received, but the main aspects of it such as the characters, their backstories, or the universe itself* should seem shallow even for animeonlies. (guess flashy explosions is all that matters)
*Refers to what >>135588231 said about Ufo not explaining things.
>Shirou's powers never being explained thus making them complete random asspull, the setting never being explained, difference between magic and magecraft is never explained, magic circuits never being even explained, etc)
The lack of a proper Fate route adaption should have been one more reason for Ufo to cover all the aspects of the Fate universe.
I'm glad I read Fate route afterwards because I would love to see an animeonly explaining things such as magic circuits, the mana or crest transfer, every sentence of Archer to/about Artoria without it.
The Fate universe has a decidedly sympathetic take on the character. This part of the myth is eliminated in the Type-Moon version -- by scrubbing that out, Fate emphasizes Medea's victimhood. She's a pure maiden who was “corrupted” into a witch by Jason.
Fate/stay night plays up the tension between Medea's tragic past and her horrible actions. Disgusted by her Master's actions, Medea eventually betrays him and is left to die with no mana source. She then meets her second master, Souichirou Kuzuki. They fall in love, and Medea resolves to win the Grail and start a new life with him. We're first introduced to her as a monstrous figure who endangers bystanders and tortures Saber, but in the end, we learn that her motives come from a place of pain, and that she's genuinely in love with Souichirou. Although she loses the war (ironically due to an act of betrayal), the narrative rewards her with time spend happily alongside a decent man.
>let's bring irrelevant things in the discussion!
actually English is my second language, sorry.
Still gonna bite. So she gets betrayed by everyone everywhere, and in a stroke of pure genius she trusts a random guy. She then decides to win the war for him, despite not knowing what his wish is, or the fact that he has, you know, none.
Nope, I still fail to see how backstory and actions are connected.
>difference between magic and magecraft is never explained
I actually liked it more this way, the distinction is only important to world-building autists because it serves practically no purpose in-story.
This is also a pretty big problem with the Nasuverse as a whole in that it tries systematizing and categorizing magic and the supernatural in general and in doing so renders it pointless and mundane - it's just another technique that can be relied on and that you can predict the results of.
Ancient myths are supposed to be weird as fuck, with no clear power levels or rankings and generally disjointed and disturbing, like e.g. the Norse gods tearing apart a frost giant's corpse and building the world with it. I feel like if Nasu and other people in TM played RuneQuest and HeroQuest instead of DND that they'd produce much weirder and much more interesting stuff. You can clearly tell that the people who worked on, for example, post-Daggerfall TES lore clearly had an interest in philology and that it paid off enormously.
The distinction between Magic and Magecraft is pretty important in Heaven's Feel.
Hell, it's arguably important as soon as Saber starts spouting off shit about "multi-dimensional refraction phenomena" against Kojiro.
>it serves practically no purpose in-story
It's fucking integral to understanding how much a threat Caster is
She imitates Magic within her controlled areas, something that (surprise) wasn't explained in Ufoshittable anime
>I really don't get why the OST gets praise on /a/
>The contributions of Mr. Hideyuki Fukasawa, who did the music, were large, even in terms of calories. For the first time in TV Anime history (I believe), he made 400 compositions for the entire score of the film while referencing the drawings. And he was even present for the dubbing. I requested music at the end of the provisional cuts (shooting the drawings, and setting the timings in order). The voice actors' voices are also added at this stage. But drawings keep being added afterwards, and the cutting process is repeated in accordance with those additions, until I finally have them do the FX. The music is written and recorded live in between that provisional cutting and the actual cutting, so when we alter a place where music was added, the music has to be adjusted once more. Fukasawa does that adjusting, and also handles orders for the the final adjustments during dubbing. That is how much he has done for us. I am grateful.
TL;DR: amazing technical quality, and not much competition for the repetitive and gimicky F/Z ost.
Sure, but the whole baggage of how the distinction between the two changes as humans advance their worldviews and knowledge of mage(craft) is not the only possible explanation and a fairly stupid and vague one in my opinion. A simple "Magic in Medea's time was fundamentally different" would alone have been enough and it wouldn't really matter how.
>He spends the whole fight controlling swords. Hell, the anime does a much better job than the VN ever did of conveying the fact that in UBW, Shirou's swords are MUCH faster than Gil's.
Wrong. Ufotable almost misunderstood the concept of UBW as its interest and importance were poorly shown during this fight. Shirou deflected most of the swords with Kanshou and Bakuya whereas UBW should have been the main and only viable option for him to win against the GoB. Surfing on Aias while doing Naruto shit is cool to see but that ruins the concept of UBW which of course negate the last bit of believability this fight had. (not surprising that the overall battle felt like an asspul for many)
Not to mention that Gil couldn't aim for some reason.
>wanting a boring ass fight where they both stand still throwing swords at each other until Shirou closes the gap and slices Gil's arm.
>Shirou deflected most of the swords with Kanshou and Bakuya
This is wrong, he grabbed copies of Gil's swords from the ground, which give him Gil's stats.
>not surprising that the overall battle felt like an asspul for many
Your imaginary friends don't count.
>This is wrong, he grabbed copies of Gil's swords from the ground, which give him Gil's stats.
>Your imaginary friends don't count.
Tell that to those who haven't read the VN.
>giving Saber bigger tits
That's something they should leave to doujins.
And how does the newest Saber make you feel, anon?
>he doesn't know about Nasu reaction on UBW and his cooperation with Ufotable
>he can't read Nasu's tweets because EOP
You're fuckin zealot
This is about the exacty point where the series gave me an out and I knew I could stop trying to take it as seriously as it seemingly wanted me too up to that point. Thanks Aniplex/ufoTABLE
>Read some good VNs you faggots
Like what? /a/ doesn't know shit about good VNs, don't pretend you do.
>inb4 Umineko, Clannad, SnU, Muv Luv, Tsukihime, Steins;Gate, Little Busters, Rewrite, Ever 17, Grisaia, GSnM, Uguu, Nice Boat or Crapawa Shitjo are good and totally not entry level.
Ah yes the classic /jp/ retard argument that if it's translated in English then it's entry level and not good
It has nothing to do with the language, I could actually read most of them in Japanese nowadays.
But can you honestly claim and justify that a single one of them is really good or not entry-level?
Regardless of that, my question was clear, what do you think is a good VN that can't be considered entry-level?
You first justify why all of those are bad and entry-level. I'll wait.
The funniest part here is that a lot of what you listed have really high scores on EGS and are considered kamige by the nips.
>Most of VNs you listed are good including F/SN
kek. I even included Saya no Uta, Tsukihime, Kanon, School Days and Katawa Shoujo on that list and you dare tell me that? my fucking sides man.
>Sakura no Uta
>Liking passive eroge shit
>why all of those are bad
Find out for yourself, I'm not writing a wall of text for each one. If you want, you can tell me why they're not bad, but no pressure.
They are obviously entry-level. The fact that that most of /a/ knows every single one of them
and I have read them all despite not being a hardcore VNfag is proof enough. They're also massively popular, translated and really easy to find and download.
So no argument. Not surprised shitposter.
>The fact that that most of /a/ knows every single one of them
You're a fucking retard if that's what you think entry level means. Go back to /jp/ and parrot whatever they say since you seem to be incapable of forming your own opinion.
Zerofag secondaries would fucking rage even more than UBW.
>Zerofag favourite Gilgamesh getting BTFO by a high school girl so quickly in the story.
>Zerofag favourite Kirei losing to Shirou because of time(asspull !! whoahh)
>Its the least battle royale of all F/SN where most of the servants got BTFO like trash.
>Unlimited Senpai Works from Wormslut
>Cooking Scenes and SOL on the first half
And where exactly is your argument?
You claim they're not entry-level and that they are good yet you don't back it up with anything.
You clearly haven't read any of them, probably not even F/SN. But don't worry, you'll do it soon enough, since they are entry-level after all.
Regardless of what any retard here thinks, FSN is widely considered a kamige by nips.
>And where exactly is your argument?
>You claim they're not entry-level and that they are good yet you don't back it up with anything.
That's not how it works, anon. You claimed first that they're all shit, so now you have to actually support that claim if you want anybody to take it seriously.
Didn't zerofags love Kiritsugu?
I'm sure they'll love Shirou because muh dark choices. Not as much as Kiritsugu, but way more than UBW Shirou.
Nothing will trump Zero for them, mostly because its not a "high school setting" and all the masters are adults. But I expect to see a lot of shitty opinions on how HF is superior to UBW just because its darker.
Personally I'm excited for all the shitflinging.
You're arguing about nothing, bakas.
Zerofags secondaries got promised by a lot of people that HF is the ''true sequel'',''closest thing to F/Z''and ''Mature''.
A lot of secondaries are literally expecting F/Z 2 from HF.
>I-I totally have a rock-solid argument, but y-you first, because there is a sacred rule that compels you to do so, yeah, that's it!
I've already gave you my reasons, you just tried to skip your turn by claiming those don't constitute an argument. Burden of proof is on your side, why do you claim I'm wrong?
And now you know why it's getting ported to PC
I now have two wishes
1.For the VN to be translated
2. Since until a VN translation comes around, the anime is going to be how many of us first experience the story, please be in good hands and NOT Madhouse (I don't trust them after CH)
Because muh special tailored OST, retards actually think there is merit in making shit remixes of something already good.
At least not all studios are inept at adapting VN, LIDEN is using the original composer/music in the Shwarzermarken anime.
Can you read?
>the fact that that most of /a/ knows every single one of them and I have read them all despite not being a hardcore VNfag is proof enough. They're also massively popular, translated and really easy to find and download.
This is by no means wrong. And just take a look at those sale numbers/downloads. This is the shit that normies read when they don't know any better, it screams entry-level.
>they make an anime after the remake is out
>they use the shit designs
Normies do read VNs, or technically "play" them. I read my first VN when I was a teenager with an actual social life and little knowledge about anime. I first went in thinking of it as a videogame more than a CYOA book.
But enough of that, where's your counter argument?
About that. One of the few good points of Danganronpa the Rushjob Animation was that they used the game's OST most of the time IIRC (I hope you'll understand why after the TV airing, I have no desire to rewatch that)
Seriously, if you already have good music, use it
I'm afraid they'll prolong them a là Archer vs Shirou.
Some of them kinda deserve it though.And being movies instead of episodes, they'll be even more action packed.
Was it ever confirmed wheter we get a single movie or multiple?
Multiple movies. Pretty sure they said that if it was a single movie, it would have to be insanely long (like 8 hours), so they'll go for multiple because nobody can watch a movie for that long and it fucks up the schedules for cinemas
Name some VNs you think are good and completely translated to english
Well most translators are retards with big ego. For example look at KnK translation critique. If you ask commie about "hey I can complete Mahoyo translation alone" they 100% will say FUCK OFF IT'S OUR TRANSLATION, go makes your own from the begining. But meanwhile we have god tier guys like Overlord LN translators. 9 volumes translated. 9 fuckin volumes.
I'm not >>135597813 but removing (you)s is pathetically easy
>tracing a blanket
It's pretty good, but not as good as UBW's Prologue or even ep.24. Episode 20 was also a great "adaptation" but not in terms of faithfulness, it just got everything across without being full internal monologue.
I read the VN years ago and I enjoyed the adaptation. I didn't watch it whiled it aired though, I waited for it to be finished and watched it all at once completely free from an /a/ influence though.
>implying you can't change your IP
Not the other guy, but this >>135597464
and this >>135597542 are only 2 mins apart. You can't change your IP and reply in that brief amount of time.
>Hell, the anime does a much better job than the VN ever did of conveying the fact that in UBW, Shirou's swords are MUCH faster than Gil's.
The anime actually did a poorer job at this. In the VN, Shirou was basically grabbing a new sword after each swing and his internal narration was about him swinging furiously just to keep Gil locked down. It highlighted that UBW is just *barely* faster than GoB that allowed Shirou to do what he did and even then, he needed the element of surprise. It really showcased just how smart Shirou was to use Gil's pride against him.
In the anime, Shirou spends a bit of the fight using his own swords to deflect Gil's, but then forgets about them and starts to just use K&B. Towards the end he only pulls out like 3 swords and instead relies heavily on Rho Aias to counter GoB. There was never a sense that UBW was the deciding factor in that fight.
I mean yeah, it was more cool to watch, but in the end it didn't really convey the same message as in the VN. ufotable seemed to realize this too, which is why they added that line for Gil at the end.
Not him, but again, he uses K&B only during the final leap with RA protection and outside of UBW for obvious reasons. Every other time he already has random swords in hand or picks them up from UBW.
And we should never forget The Hero who really saved HA translation. The troll among trolls. The MAN among men. The savior who stands on his own legs like a colossus
Right, my bad.
Either way, he doesn't rely on UBW that much and largely uses each sword for a very long time. The only segment where I felt he actually utilized UBW, like at all, was during the end before he flew into the air.
I wish I could be, but the art doesn't look that good and it won't be the same with the different OST. If it ends up being amazing and makes people fall in love with it all over again, I'd be really happy regardless though.
In the VN it never even talked about what he was doing with UBW. It was assumed that there was some big GoB vs UBW battle going on above Shirou and Gil, but it only really talked about their little swordfight.
Not to sound like a complete bormie but the closest thing i've ever played to a VN is Katawa Shojo and even then I barely played it. I feel with Fate I crave more content as I intend to try playthrough both the Fate and UBW routes, watch the HF movies and then play through the HF route. Then maybe go onto HA, I 've been watching anime and reading manga for 2-3 years now and I finally gave into watching Fate after trying to piss my friend off bu not watching it.
>In the VN it never even talked about what he was doing with UBW.
As I stated, he was pulling swords from UBW constantly, a fact that the anime chooses to ignore. I believe the clashing of the flying swords was only implied, what with the CG at the beginning of the fight (it's arguable either way).
Well they toned down the physical swordfight in the anime and had him flipping around deflecting stuff instead, although they did show him picking a lot of swords out of the ground throughout the whole segment. I guess they just didn't feel the need to explain how the swords he was grabbing were the same ones that he was deflecting.
No. None of the adaptions so far have really been acceptable replacements for the VN. At best, they're complementary.
What I would do is finish UBW in the VN, then watch the epilogue of the anime for better closure.
Jack wanted to delete some paragraphs that he felt made Seibah look less pure before releasing the 100% patch, but this brave soul opposed his rule of faggotry and released the unadulterated patch on his own.
He didn't really grab that many swords at all throughout the fun. In fact, there was only one segment where I felt like he needed UBW to grab the swords - everywhere else he could've just projected it normally and still have time to deflect. This isn't even mentioning they kind of forgot about using UBW as an automatic counter to GoB's sword spam like 1/4 way through the fight and just went
>Fuck it, use Rho Aias instead
Like I said, it doesn't convey the same message as in the VN at all.
I understand why they changes that scene, though.
They had to make it more visually appealing for the audience.
The unedited scripts for the translation were available, but not put into a patch yet. The team wanted to fully edit the thing before releasing a patch. That guy made his own patch using the unedited scripts and posted it to the forums. Jack got super butthurt because that patch, being the first one released, would likely be the one most people used, instead of the edited version he was going to release.
Episode 24 should have been longer, G-dizzel v Shirou felt compressed for time.
Still pretty good though.
If you enjoyed the anime and want more, you read the VN to see that the anime is shit and you're a dumb fucker for having enjoyed it in the first place. If you disliked the anime, you should read the VN to see how the anime should have been and then you can join the rest of those who have been to the mountain top in calling the anime shit with your esoteric knowledge of Nasu's prose to validate your objectively correct opinions.
Caster used a bounded field in the anime, though.
I liked how it showed that a good Caster can have the advantage of attacking during the day too, it made Medea look more threatening.
I dont hate it, I cant say I like it like i do the VN route...
It could have been better, meaning, it could have been more like the VN in several ways, without adding smex scenes
>Let me put it this way. You seem to be aware of the fact that I have been sitting on my own 100% patch for a while (hell mine is even better than the one you put out or the official ones because it supports English locale)
Jack was actually butthurt that our Hero stole his moment of glory. What an asshole.
They're deliberately emulating Takeuchi's style. He can't draw noses, so now they won't draw noses. I have no idea who gave the thumbs up on that idea, I mean it's a well known fact that Takeuchi is a terrible artist, and he probably isn't drawing noses simply because he's literally incapable of doing so, but they still thought the way to go was to emulate Takeuchi's artistic shortcomings.
>"When I reread that old material, I thought, "Ah, I'm looking the users straight in the eye. Look at how frankly I'm laying out what I want to say through this story," and I got this weird feeling of, "So that's the sort of person Old Me was." It's embarrassing, but it's like I"m admitting defeat, that i'ts something that Current-day Me can't do."
Son of a bitch, he really is rewriting the entirety of Tsukihime complete from scratch, isn't he?
No the character designer responsible for the rhinoface does it for every show he works on, not just Type-Moon.
Takeuchi isn't the problem in this case, at least I don't think so, since the director for art has rhino faces everywhere.
They should just call back in whoever did F/Z.
I was gonna write reply in quotation marks with something along the lines of "That's just, like, your opinion, man," but then I realized Shirou it would be more appropriate if it were, "This is, like, my opinion, man."
"While I will base my reasoning on the assumption that all the facts are as you have described them in your expository monologue, I disagree with your assessment of what should be my course of action based on this knowledge you have imbued in me."
Rightness is the quality or state of being right.
Righteousness is the quality or state of being righteous.
Right =/= Righteous
Ergo: Rightness =/= Righteousness.
Righteousness sounds better, but doesn't mean the same.
He establishes a contradiction because they are synonyms.
>they mean the same thing
They CAN mean the same thing.
But the connotations they carry are clearly different (pic related).
Archer's way of being a hero can't be questioned from a logical point of view. Sacrificing a few lives to prevent a massive amount of people from dying, is a correct choice no matter how you do the math, but it's not a morally acceptable choice for Shirou, who doesn't think it's right to let anyone die.
Miura a hack and a shit.
And more than anything.
>Most of Rin's inner conflict and flaws are never apparent. Most of Shirou's tactical thinking, philosophy and sociopathy is never apparent.
Fucking this. Rin's issue about hiding her true persona is NEVER FUCKING SHOWN in UBW anime. What a fucking waste of potential this was.
The VN is not a masterpiece, but damn I love it and ufo just fucked up. Have some Rin.
I can't believe I visit /a/ again after months and the first thing I post is what I quoted. Fuck me, I'm still salty about this bad adaptation. It was Fate but it wasn't at the same time, it's so fucking weird and it triggers me to no end.
>Rin's issue about hiding her true persona is NEVER FUCKING SHOWN in UBW anime
First, you clearly didn't pay enough attention while watching the anime.
Second, we actually learn a great deal about that from bad endings like the one where she wipes Shirou's memory. Those can't be animated for obvious reasons.
Third, HF is the route that digs the deepest into her cold magus / kind person conflict, not UBW. You're mixing stuff up.
>Starts the review with a single-sentence perfect summary of his personal opinion, that makes reading the rest of the review pointless.
Way to go MyAnimeFag, you'll be a great critic some day!
- Irrelevant. Anime isn't suited as a medium for text dumps.
- They did a great job with Shirou but you're right that they completely flanderized Rin in the second cour. Every drawn-out tsundere moment made me puke.
- F/Z's choreography was not better than F/SN's. What tactical aspect? It was pretty faithful.
- But F/SN fans wanted to know more about Caster's master. This was a give-and-take decision.
- Nothing wrong with shaking hands, not everything needs to end with a Hollywood kiss. Nonetheless I was hoping for a kiss too.
- The final episode redeemed the 2nd cour partly.
- The pacing is indeed all over the place but that's the VN's fault.
>Rin's issue about hiding her true persona is NEVER FUCKING SHOWN in UBW anime
Yeah, it's not like she acts totally different with Shirou than she does at school in the first day or anything.
Just because you're denser than Shirou and the show doesn't shove it in your face doesn't mean that it isn't there.
I watched this expecting not a whole lot. I just wanted to see my favorite route animated that wasn't Deen. I am satisfied. I don't give much of a damn about what other people think.
Someone explain to me why do people feel such a close attachment to how a series is viewed in the public eye? (Like how Zerofags will whine or how random anime viewer XYZ will be like "what") Shouldn't your own personal enjoyment take precedent over everyone else?
>Shouldn't your own personal enjoyment take precedent over everyone else?
Since my personal enjoyment takes precedent over yours, your argument is invalid and UBW is shit and Zero is slowly paced shit.
Oh, and Prisma is pedo shit.
i liked it, sure some stuff could have been better, but it was a mostly solid adaptation
i kinda wish they would readapt the fate route as well, with all the proper scenes adapted, as well as putting that extra material from HA, like what happened to fake assassin and shit, as well as last episode, just to round out all the routes by ufotable
>this ignorant fuck's review got that many "helpful"s
Truly, MAL is good for nothing besides the lists, and checking seyuus/directors. The whole community part (forums/reviews/ratings) is completely cancer.
You know, I'm giving them a view just by doing this. But I guess it'll prevent more from having to watch it.
10. Tiger Colosseum (2nd, I think?)
9. DEEN OP2
8. Grand Order
7. PS2 OPs
6. Hollow World
5. Ideal White
4. Oath Sign
3. Hollow (HA original OP2)
2. Extra CCC
1. Another Heaven
>Brave Shine isn't good
Animation wise is objectively better than To the Beginning, and Aimer has nailed every single OP and ED she has participated in, unlike Kalafina. At this point if I hear them chanting once more I think I might kill someone.
It's all downhill from Magia IMO.
The ED style visuals were unfitting and I didn't like the laser beam showcases, and the song is Aimer's weakest
>Animation wise is objectively better than To the Beginning
I could never rank it #1 because of the massive spoilers. I cringe every time, and I'm not even a secondary.
That is just fundamentally wrong, openings simply should NEVER do that.
Just rewatched both of them, you're right, To The Beginning still felt far better directed though. Brave Shine was mostly boring shots of each character (with barely any Shirou or Archer) while To The Beginning was more varied and fit the show.
Really. To The Beginning shows lot of backgrounds and still shots, has a long-ish fade to black at the beginning, and most animated actions are just simple movements. Not to mention there is plenty of CGI.
Brave Shine has some nice pottery going on though. Opening and ending shots are good, the F/Z reference with lancer, the RN HF OP throwback when the servants are shown, and it also syncs perfectly with the music (like when Illya is running or when BRAVE SHINE comes in).
I think what To the Beginning did best was symbolism and imagery. Because from my experience browsing videos on Nicovideo, you don't necessarily needs lots of crazy animation for an OP to look good. I've seen people make some very nice MADs using nothing more than still images from manga and light novels. The important thing is what you do with it and how you piece it all together.
I felt like it was good, but it lacked something.
It was too good maybe, but without any surprises.
Maybe I'm still waiting the hidden Illya route that I've foreseen, that would make it the masterpiece of the masterpieces.
Can we talk about the good stuff in Ideal White?
I feel some things in that one are criminally underrated.
The time lapses and the servants being mixed into the city's daily life were genius. It has a pretty nice buildup.
The succession of shots of the fire, the True Grail and Kiritsugu's hand as he saves Shirou was nice too.
Zero's first OP is annoying as fuck IMO, and completely goes against the mood of the series.
It sounds too childish or too "girly" for an anime that clearly wants us to think it's dark and mature.
Since UBW has a lighter mood, Ideal White, while still annoying, doesn't completely clash with the feel of the show.
>- Outright skipping Caster's backstory and motivations for sake of a filler episode about her master.
That was literally made to make medea even more into a dindu.
Nasu also killed Jason in GO. He's literally Shinji
>song is called Ideal White
>white in Japanese is 'shiro'
>story is about Shirou's ideals
If I were to make a list, I think it'd be something like
>hollow (Fate/hollow ataraxia OP2)
>ataraxia (Fate/hollow ataraxia OP1)
>LAST STARDUST (Fate/stay night Unlimited Blade Worlds insert)
>holLow woRlD (Fate/hollow ataraxia Vita OP1)
>broKen NIGHT (Fate/hollow ataraxia Vita OP2)
>Colors (Fate/Grand Order OP)
>Sakura Labyrinth (Fate/EXTRA CCC OP)
>This Illusion (Fate/stay night OP)
>End of a Dream (Fate/stay night Realta Nua track)
>code (Fate/Unlimited Codes OP)
Maybe not entirely in that order, but somewhere along those lines.