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/boig/ - Binding of Isaac General

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Holy Mantle edition

Last thread: >>121475246

>109 Patch
Adds new content, breaks old content, buffs and nerfs items.
Patch notes never

Azazel nerf is BUGGED, supposedly.

>General Information
http://bindingofisaac.com/

FAQ:
>What does "item" do?
http://platinumgod.co.uk/rebirth
http://bindingofisaacrebirth.gamepedia.com/Binding_of_Isaac:_Rebirth_Wiki

>What's that HUD that people are using?
https://github.com/networkMe/missinghud2

>What is "thing" on the post-it note?
Top row: Mom's Heart/It Lives, Isaac, Boss Rush
Middle row: Satan, ???, The Lamb
Bottom row: Mega Satan, Greed Mode, Hush

>What is Hush/Blue Womb?
New boss in a new area that opens when you beat Mom's Heart before the 30th minute.

>How to unlock The Lost?
Please note that the seeds are from Rebirth, and don't work in Afterbirth anymore.
1. Isaac must die to a Mulliboom in one of the Basement floors. Mulliboom seed: FHRD S1N1 (Go into the large room above the starting room. You can easily die from full health in here to them.) Or if not: JTMD EZPF (one is directly below - Normal difficulty)

2. Magdalene must die to her own bomb in one of the Caves floors. (Pyro Seed: ALFA 0NTZ)

3. Judas must die to Mom's Foot as Judas in one of the Depths or Necropolis floors. Good Seed: 8LDE 8XDX (Wait on using the Joker till the 3rd floor and avoid the devil rooms and you'll get the sacred heart. You also get the Sad Onion on the first floor.

4. Azazel must die to Satan in Sheol (his blood/laser form or hooves, NOT leeches or The Fallen). You must NOT use a seed.
>>
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>>121540293
I want to sexualize Little Horn!
>>
Was there just another patch?
>>
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>all the new alt floors just have filters and recolors/reskins of existing enemies
>all the new enemies are just recolors/reskins that explode upon dying, shoot bullets upon dying or spawn something upon dying
>most of the new items feel half-baked and lazy
>Lilith is actually neat but now that she's been nerfed she's just another gimmick that requires Battery Items to be useful
>Greed Mode is ridiculously basic and typical despite being so hyped up
>synergies still revolve almost-exclusively around Brimstone, Mom's Knife and the Fetus Items
>new bosses range between bland rehashes like Dangle and "stalling for time to make your Speedrun to Boss Rush/Hush hell" like Rag Man and Little Horn
>Ultra Greed and Hush are HP Sponges since Edmund doesn't like players having fun and deserving the power from the combinations they acquired
>the challenges, being based on fucking Reddit Suggestions range between uninspired, moderately interesting and "Pray to RNG you can fucking beat this"
>Edmund trying to do some "ARG" Bullshit that prevents everyone from enjoying the full game because of a few dataminers who spoiled his precious "I die in 1 hit and am basically impossible to use now thanks to bullshit rooms" Lost Mystery in Rebirth by timegating everything all the while acting like a smug, pretentious fuck on Twitter with his buttbuddy Tyrone, which only happened because Edmund was acting like a smug, pretentious fuck on Twitter with his buttbuddy Tyrone about it while the community was putting the pieces together
>every patch just adds an incredibly small trickle of items, trinkets, etc and nerfs characters and other items based on what Reddit feels like complaining about and/or what Edmund deems to be "too fun" for the game
>>
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>Less than mediocre Lazarus run
>Made it to the womb 1 but don't have high hopes for beating the endgame bosses
>find red chest
>guppy's collar
>second red chest
>dead cat
>devil deal
>guppy's paw
>even found guppy's head on womb 2

I've got scum luck boys
>>
I love all this epic shit memery

Shit is funny, right guys? Guys?
>>
>>121541070
I wonder what Lilith's poop smells like haha
>>
>>121540293

>http://platinumgod.co.uk/rebirth

Yo update your shit, that page only has the rebirth items, use this instead http://platinumgod.co.uk/afterbirth
>>
>Dark Room
>Lost Run
>FUCKING DOUBLE MONSTRO II IN A REGULAR ROOM
>ONLY WAY TO LAMB IS THROUGH THEM
I REFUSE TO LET MY SPIRIT BE BROKEN!
>>
So Ragman now revives multiple trites

fuck off
>>
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>>121541276
WHY THE FUCK ISN'T THIS PIECE OF SHIT ON CAVES OR DEPTHS ALREADY?
WHY THE FUCK IS HE EVEN MORE TEDIOUS WHEN HE'S ALREADY BULKY ENOUGH FOR A BASEMENT 1 BOSS?
>>
So there is an update or some shit, did edmund give us more of the steak.
>>
>>121541276
He's always done taht
>>
Why the fuck is free item on first floor treasure room surrounded by fucking rock and only opening is blocked by spikes?
>>
>>121541537
Yes. More nerfs to things that are fun, more buffs to things that are unfun, and we're still waiting for the rest of the steak.
>>
>>121541537
>want to eat my steak well done with A1 and ketchup
>edmund wont let me even though I payed for it
>>
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Tsk.
>>
>>121540630
>>121541537
End of greed mode now displays, what is, most likely your chance to jam/explode
Ultra greed's coins now activate WAY faster
Supposedly Azazel's damage is increased.
>>
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Hey fuckos, this just in.
Mom's Box+Curved horn gives you almost as much damage as Book of Belial except constantly
>>
A patch (9.8 MB) just came out. I wonder what it does...
>>
>>121541979
Shh, don't let the Egg or his Redditors hear you.
As soon as they catch wind of anything fun or remotely powerful, they'll get it nerfed ASAP.
>>
>>121541895
>jams at 2%

thanks egg
>>
First for pregnant demons

>Your waifu is a baby factory
>>
>>121542106
>>121542070
why are you blaming northernlion for everything
>>
>>121542191
>First for
you're a bit slow mate
>>
>>121541895
>Ultra greed's coins now activate WAY faster
...gonna need more crowd-clearing weapons

>Supposedly Azazel's damage is increased.
But his charge time is still messed up huh
>>
>>121542191
>first
You're a tad late anon

But yeah Lilith's pretty good, don't get why people hate her so much
>>
>>121542047
Isaac no longer starts with the D6
Yum heart takes 6 charges
Guppy's Head costs 3 hearts
Angel rooms more common
Azazel lost his flight
>>
>>121542247
Not NL, Anon. Eggmund McSteak.
>>
>>121542191
wow just notice she actually gets prego

hot
>>
>>121542306
Ed took away the ability to enjoy playing as her because she made the easiest mode in the game even easier
>>
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>>121542360
>>
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Fuck off.
>>
>>121542360
>Angel rooms more common
tfw when I want to fight mega satan but angel rooms never come out
>>
>>121542296
>>121541895
>Azazel is still borked. Even the damage.
>>
>next update
>The Soul, Orbitals and Lost Contact no longer affect Hush and Ultra Greed's Bullets
>their damage also scales with how much total health you currently have and The Wafer doesn't negate it
I'm just waiting for this to happen.
>>
>>121542360
>Angel Rooms more common

This would be a good thing. People's issues are that they AREN'T common since the ones that do show up are shitty rooms with coins or hearts and the fact that they hold the key to Mega Satan

Not that Devil Rooms are that much better anymore. It's just their Room pool doesn't suck
>>
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IT'S TIME
FOR THE LAMB
AFTER ALL THESE ROOMS OF FUCKED UP SHIT
DOUBLE MONSTRO II
DOUBLE TERATOMA
THOSE BLACK GAPERS
THOSE QUADRUPLE RED HUSKS
FUCK THEM ALL

I'M HERE TO EARN THE SOUL, AND YOU AREN'T GONNA STOP ME
>>
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>>121542547
Legendary.
>>
>>121542296
Yep, charge is still slow as shit.
And apparently Ultra Greed was totally revamped
>Key coins now spawn in larger number, so in order to get rid of doors you need to destroy more than one
>Coin activation is dependent on his rage, not sure how it's calculated, but at max rage it's nearly impossible to destroy any coins

Overall I think new U. Greed is pretty fun and hard, might actually give me motivation to play greed mode from time to time.

Also, I forgot, it seems like Monstro is no longer the pre ultra greed boss, now it's Greed or 2 super greeds from what I've seen. This is leading me to believe that Monstro was put there as a placeholder and Nicalis forgot to swap him out.

Also, the greed donation machine jam chance increases 1% every 5 coins, and resets when playing a different character. I'm assuming 1125 people need to reach 999 coins before we get the Keeper because >muh ARG

I'd prefer if Edmund did this shit the way that the Surgeon Sim devs did, by having the content available in the first place and having elaborate unlock conditions, but instead of gating the how to unlock shit away, hide it better instead.
>>
This phrase gets thrown around a lot but damage mitigation on Hush and Ultra Greed is the definition of artificial difficulty
>>
>>121542834
1125 doesn't mean how many people need 999.
It means we're getting the new content regardless on November 25th since there's probably no way for them to actually track how many people reach 999 with their level of competence.
>>
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I guess the Dunce hat is cool sometimes.
>>
dude dank depths lmao
>>
>>121542834
>Hide it better
McEggerson couldn't hide The Lost, his ultra secret month-long character. No way the fuckers at Nicalis are smart enough to hide content

Also I'm not surprised about the Monstro, but it really ruins the mode now because Nicalis are shit programmers

>Ultra Greed?
>You fight some Greeds
>That wasn't hard!
>Ultra Greed in the next room

Would've been genius
>>
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>>121543128
What's that at the bottom
>>
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Just got a pretty bitchin run with The Lost, should I do Hush or Mega Satan?

I mean I can't do both since it stops at blue womb right?
>>
Wow Azazel is just completely unfun now.

Guess I'll just cheat engine Lilith, fuck this.

Oh and how are there fires in the flooded caves?
>>
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>Eden run
>starts off with the nail and blood of the martyr
>think it's going to be a great run
>curse of the blind
>soy milk
>>
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>>121543394
Embarrassing
>>
>>121543376
You can do both assuming you already had Ending 17 beforehand.
>>
>savescumming a Lost run
>gets Guppy's Collar without knowing what it does
>game forces 1up effects after a forced reset
>gets wrecked by the 50% revive chance

Guess I deserved it, huh.
>>
>>121543575
Yeah. Few people know that happens.
Also up against the Lamb, see >>121542653
Both Pyromaniac AND Host Hat. If he keeps up the Ipecac shots, I'm good.
>>
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Wew lad
>>
>>121543687

The fuck does Host Hat even do?
>>
>>121543810
Dark Bum literally prints free wins
He will never be balanced
>>
>>121542070

it's already on the wiki
>>
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help, I can't kill him
>>
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>>121543865
Occasionally lifts up to deflect shots. Makes you immune to explosions a la Pyromaniac.

Also couldn't screenshot it in time, but

>THE SOUL HAS APPEARED IN THE BASEMENT

Now I can go to sleep, after 5-6 fucking hours of Isaac. Job well done. One of the hardest shit I've had to do in my life, honestly.

The feeling you get, when you win as the Lost, after hours of effort paying off. It's exhilarating.
>>
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>>121543491
goin on him now, wish me luck

should I save the devil card for Large Lucifer? I dont think its gonna do shit against the Hush's damage cap thing
>>
I just beat Hush with Soy Milk + Poison Tears
I never got hit thanks to getting a Stopwatch in the ??? floor store, but holy hell that took 10 minutes to kill him
>>
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>Make greed even more of a bullet sponge
>Increase machine jam rate

BRAVO EDMUND. EVAN ARG
>>
why are lazarus unlocks so shit
>>
Does the hourglass exploit still work for filling up the greed machine?
>>
>>121544406
Because Lazarus is shit
>>
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>>121543448
>get Libra and Guppy
nevermind
>>
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>tfw being XBOX HUEG saved your life

Thanks pills.
>>
>>121544406

Because Lazarus is a shitty selection padding character that doesn't need to exist.

Why he doesn't start with Suicide King instead of some shitty ass pill is beyond me.
>>
>>121543875
too bad red hearts never ever show up
>>
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>>121542191
>>
>>121544639
>Magdalene starts with Immaculate Conception
>Judas starts with Judas Shadow
>Samson starts with Lusty Blood
>Lazarus starts with Suicide King

All this would be dope
>>
>>121544071
Where's Godhead?
>>
>>121544487
S-source?
>>
>>121545005

Exactly why it won't exist.
>>
I wonder how people are beating Guardian. I only get nonsensically unwinnable runs...
>>
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New Lost strat
Become a blackhole edition
>>
>>121545063
Which sucks. Samson is at least better than WotL, but Maggy hasn't been touched since fucking Vanilla before even the Halloween Update

Would be perfect unlocks from the Greed Machine
>>
>>121545039
Not unlocked yet. I've yet to beat Isaac / ??? / BossRush / MegaStan / UltraGreed
>>
>>121545091
About that, did anyone else see this really shitty glitch in which the Punching Bag stumbles on spikes and loses like FOUR OR FIVE HP AT ONCE?!

Dude even flashes red for like 6 seconds whenever this happens.
>>
>>121545157
what's attacking him?
>>
>marked + ipecac
welp
>>
>>121545325
Attack fly.
Demon baby
>>
>>121545349
I've seen this post before
>>
>>121545287
It's not a glitch, it's a delicious steak that you're trying to eat too fast.
>>
>>121545349
marked is so dogshit
it's made d4 and d100 so much less appealing for me
>>
>>121545287
>Glitch
Allow me to explain:
When YOU touch spikes, you take damage once, then gain Mercy Invincibility because you're the player.
When the Punching Bag touches spikes, he takes several damage, because he has no Mercy Invincibility.
>>
S T E A K
T
E
A
K
>>
>>121545005
This shit should be the reward for Greed Machine donations.
It already took Cain from high tier to top tier, why can't it bring the others up as well?
Maybe even make Greed Mode some sort of special mode where you need to at least down one of the 2 final bosses with each character, sans lost before unlocking.

Unlocks could include shit like
>Dice Shard for Isaac
>Petrified Poop for Blue Baby
>Guaranteed Eden's Blessing for Eden
>Curved Horn for Azazel

After unlocking each item, of course.
It would make the Greed machine useful for more than just ARG purposes, and would give motivation to play greed mode to the end.
>>
>>121545549
I want to stop eating my steak now please.
>>
>car battery
>sack boy
>crystal ball
[soul hearts intensify]
>>
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>>121545578
>dice shard for isaac when he already has the D6
>>
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>>121545516
...
...
...
Have a picture of two skull dudes forever walking on each other until I put a wake up call on their messy pathfinding.
>>
So the only time I have beaten the game was when I beat greed with the blood bag cheese
how to get gud
>>
>>121545578
>It already took Cain from high tier to top tier

You mean it took Cain from 'utter garbage' tier with every single other non Azazel/Isaac/Pre-Afterbrith Judas character, and brought him to 'better than everybody except Azazel/Isaac but still shit' tier
>>
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>>121545578
Too fun. Too overpowered. You're not trying to choke on Egg's steak, are you?

God, even NL seems fed up with what's going on.
>>
>>121544639
Well, from a design standpoint, starting with a pill is fitting because Lazarus was sick in his story.
>>
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>>121545927
You're getting your memes backwards, you fuck
Egg =/= Egg McMuffin
>>
>>121545774
I can't think of any other item to give Isaac that would fit in his theme, honestly.

>>121545843
>damage modifier higher than everyone except for Judas
>guaranteed second floor item room no matter what
>highest base luck stat, increasing chances of finding lucky pennies, and gets better payouts from the bloodbank.

>>121545927
NL is Egg, Edmund is Eggmound/Eggmund/Egg mcmuffin.
>>
>>121545983
At the very least, could that starting pill be coded to be positive or neutral? I'm getting real fucking sick of having to R just because my starting pill was a Health Down or Bad Trip.
Especially since I have no idea if that "Revived Lazarus can't get Lazarus' Unlocks" Thing is true or not, knowing fucking Edmund lately.
>>
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Someone tell Edmund there's still fun to root out
>>
>>121546019
It's easy to keep track of who is who, one is a scumlord who understands nothing about the binding of isaac despite dedicating years of his life to it, and the other is northernlion.
>>
>>121545927

Does he? He pads his speech with apologies so often I can't tell.

What'd he say?
>>
>Bloody Penny in Greed Mode
thx for the free win
>>
>>121546170
Just use it after you've killed yourself on the first floor. It turns health down into health up and bad trip into full health. It only sucks if it's tears or speed down because of the wasted time but oh well.
>>
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>>121546274
The immense amount of sighing and tone show that he would just like to play the game without bullshit. This latest patch shows that the devs and edmund give zero fucks about their consumer base and just like fucking with people. I'm kinda getting tired of all this bullshit and its become worse than the WOTL release.
>>
>>121546186
>48 Hour Energy no longer recharges your current item and only spawns One Battery
>Pickups can only be duplicated and/or rerolled once
>Goodie Bags no longer contain Batteries and are far, FAR rarer even with the sack
>Blank Card + ? Card no longer spawns 2 random items and instead spawns a particularly powerful enemy/group of enemies like ??? or Quadruple Pink Champion Cage
>>
>>121546019
I want to hug Fem Adversary
>>
>>121546274
He said something like "I'm not too sure about these patch changes, but Edmund and Tyrone know what they're doing and it's their game so they probably understand better than I do, so let's give them a shot, I'll probably end up loving them"

That's the canadian equivalent of a death threat.
>>
>>121546274
iirc in his latest Daily video he recognized that it was dumb to nerf a character after a year and he said he's not sure if he believes things aren't in the game because of bugs instead of a timegate.
>>
>>121546420

SUSH ANON...SHIT!

Goddamn man....
>>
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>picking up items lowers my stats
hello?
>>
>>121546727
Gotta nerf your stats in exchange for spiders no longer trying to hurt you, Anon!
Don't want to eat that steak too quickly now, do you?
>>
>Book of belial didn't get nerfed to 25%
>It got nerfed to 12%

Edmund, why.
>>
I wonder if NL browses this general. Seems like the kind of guy that would consider browsing 4chan a dirty secret.
>>
>>121546727
>all items in the game now lower any stat that they do not raise
>the better the item, the more stats get lowered
That's a brilliant idea if I do say so myself.
>>
Is there a more useless item than the lost fly

who thought that item would be fun
>>
>>121546727
Pretty minor. But it's interesting how most of these small stat ups and downs aren't on the wiki.
>>
patch notes anywhere?
>>
>>121547028
Maybe not for new afterbirth items but ones from before like Small Rock that give further speed downs when you take a speed down pill etc are documentedl
>>
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>Just beat Chest, Dark Room, and Boss Rush as the Lost
>No Godhead
Excuse me Eggman. It seems you fucked up again
>>
>>121547053
Adjustments have also been made to balance the game and make for a more pleasant gaming experience.
>>
>>121546985
go fix SPEED! first egghead
>>
>>121547127
was it all on Hard mode?
>>
>>121547127
You have to do them on hard mode
>>
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>>121540293
Ok so is the reason they didn't buff azazel again was because he would've been easy to rush through on greed mode and hence people would get to the "secret" too quickly? I'm not sure but this seems like a cluster fuck right now.

>>121546968
I really doubt it. I think he barely browses anything because of the amount of shit he records. That and his latent magic addiction is enough to keep him busy.
>>
>>121547124
Ah, nice.

>>121547127
They changed it in Afterbirth.
Need the whole Lost post-it blood red from Hard Mode and your tears to earn Godhead.
Yes, even Hush, Ultra Greed, Mega Stan.
>>
>>121547053
Added ultra greed health
Removed fun
>>121547183
Fix your buggy game edmund.
>>
>>121546695
Holy shit I remember the shitstorm after Krampus' Head was nerfed in Rebirth. Even NL said it seemed like a bad idea and that there would be no reason to pick it up most of the time, to which Tyrone replied something like "all i hear is waah waah". Needless to say, NL apologised and admitted he should wait before jumping to conclusions. I swear, this guy makes me mad sometimes.
>>
>>121547053
They're just greed mode changes. Move along.

>>121547127
Gotta do Mega Satan, Hush and Greed Mode now :^)
>>
>>121547127
Nope!
You gotta beat Hush, Ultra Greed and Mega Satan now!
ALL on Hard Mode!
>>
>>121547127
You need to fill out the ENTIRE post-it note as the Lost to unlock godhead.
You know what that means for afterbirth right?
HUSH, MEGA SATAN AND GREED MODE AS THE LOST
DON'T EAT YOUR STEAK TOO QUICKLY MOTHERFUCKER :^)
>>
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>>121547192
You're doing it again.
Egghead is NL, cause he has an egghead
>>
>>121547127
No he didn't. You unlock godhead by clearing the lost's post-it note. That's how it always worked.

You've still got three things on that post-it buddy.
>>
>>121547028
>Pretty minor
well yeah but it happened every time, I started the floor with 23 damage and ended at about 16

At first I thought it was just Libra balancing out my stats, but then I realized it was happening with items that don't even affect stats. All the changes were reverted when I changed floors though
>>
>>121547254

And t o this day no one has ever picked up Krampus' Head again.
>>
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>>121547227
>>121547212
I DID

>>121547248
>>121547264
Yeah fuck no. Not doing Mega Satan as the lost ever
At least until he makes it easier to unlock the fuckers door
>>
Am I going crazy or does the starting floor seem much longer?
>>
>>121547284
>>121547280
>>121547264
>>121547248
>>121547338
FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK
>>
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>>121547314
They're both pretty eggish to be fair
>>
>Playing Azazel cause daily
>Get technology
>"heh, I wonder if this means I'll have a constant brimstone"
>Literally nothing changes

YUP. THIS CHARACTER NEEDED A NERF ALRIGHT. THE DUDE WITH NEXT TO NO SYNERGIES NEEDED TO BE NERFED INSTEAD OF USELESS SHITS LIKE LAZARUS AND MAGGY GETTING BUFFED.

ALL IN ONE FUCKING BITE RIGHT ED?!
>>
>>121547517
Needs Dead Dove and Spirit of the Night now, among several other new items.
>>
>>121547382
>Not doing Mega Satan as the lost ever
Just get Mom's Knife and a lot of damage boosts, it literally one-shots each of Satan's phases with just a few decent bonuses. The only hard part is the Horsemen/Sins/Angel spam
>>
>>121547382
It's not that hard, you just have to skip the first devil deal, hope you get an angel room on floor 3 (50% base chance, can be increased by certain things like donating 10 coins to the donation machine)
You can exploit a single angel room for multiple key pieces by exiting and reloading the game after killing the angel
>>
>>121547382
If you can get past the caves as the lost you can beat mega satan as the lost
>>
Since ultra greed has shown bosses can have fluid animations, I think we could use some super horsemen
>>
Alright, tired of getting my shit kicked in with Issac. Who do I play to just grind Mom's Heart unlocks out?
>>
>>121547530
>>121547235
LIterally nerfed because of this, you're all being lied to by eggmuffin.
>>
>>121547772
I'd say Azazel but then I'd choke on my steak :^)
>>
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>>121547614
>>121547690
I'm fine with fighting him. Hell I already beat Hush as him on my Boss Rush run
Not fine with trying to get the piece of shit key pieces

>>121547678
Can you make the Angel's start spawning items after that?
Either way I just got all the other parts of his note done today so I'll wait on that
>>
>>121547772
anon
come on
i mean
come
on
>>
>>121547772
Cain
>>
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>>121547235
so cute
>>
>>121547772
I don't know how you are getting pooped on, but Judas will carry you.
>>
>>121547878
>Can you make the Angel's start spawning items after that?
No, they'll only drop key pieces. You can reroll them into angel items with the D6/D100/Dice shard/Perthro though
>>
Kinda miffed the angel laser isn't an item. You could even have killed enemies leave fires.

Woulda been a cool "holy brimstone"
>>
>>121548039
What if you reroll them with the D4
Cant you just farm their room until you have gone through every item then?
>>
So i bought rebirth for ps4 and i'm having a pretty good time

never played this game before and ended up unlocking all the characters except judas in the first 5 or so runs

I checked the patch notes for this game and wow does the dev just nerf things constantly? like that's a common theme i'm seeing, just nerf after nerf, which i personally don't get since it's a single player game
what's up with this shit?
>>
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>Mom's Knife first floor
>The Soul
>Serpent's Kiss
>Bloody Penny
>Two of Diamonds
literally impossible to lose
>>
>>121548432
>9%
you best start rolling other characters to expediate your steak consumption process.
>>
>>121548432

>9%

Eating kinda fast there anon, you might wanna slow down
>>
>>121548432
slow the fuck down :^)
>>
>>121548235
>just nerf after nerf, which i personally don't get since it's a single player game
I don't get why people think a single player game doesn't still need to be balanced
>>
>>121548719
Eggsalad is doing a shit job of it.
Just nerfing everything over and over. Never buffing the garbage items or the garbage anything
>>
>>121548719
BoI is a game where ALL items are optional to pick. If you think an item or combo is too OP, just avoid it. To make it worse so that nobody can enjoy it is just petty.
>>
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This should not be allowed.
>>
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>>121548216
Yes, you can
You need a bomb to wake him up each time, unless you make a key pedestal spawn on top of the angel, at which point he'll wake up as soon as you reload into the game because it destroys his "block"
However, if you accidentally pick up a key piece while doing so, the angel will stop dropping them, so you have to avoid picking up any while farming him
>>
>>121548719
Edmund's method gives the player less options and control over how they play the game.
>>
>>121548719

>implying that nerfing things will balance anything

if everything gets nerfed to shit then yeah you have balance

what about 90% of the items that a pure shit that aren't getting buffed? is that balance?
>>
>>121548996
You know, the Angel Room pool is actually quite good. It's a huge shame you only rarely get items from them.
>>
>>121548996
ANON NO WAIT DON'T LET EDMUND SEE THIS
DON'T LET HIM KNOW THAT WE FIGURED OUT HOW TO HAVE FUN
>>
>>121548996
is there a transformation or something when you pick body+mind+soul?
>>
>>121548815
>>121549003
Oh yeah sure, I should've specified im not defending edmunds shitty changes, but I keep seeing here that a single player game doesn't need to have changes to it purely because it's single player. I don't know whether it's the same guy over and over though.

>>121548867
That's true, I just thinks it's silly to have to intentionally gimp yourself in order to compensate for bad design choices

>>121549125
There are times when things need to be nerfed/buffed but edmunds just doing a poor job of it
>>
>>121549330
No
You do get flight if you pick up three angel items, though.
>>
>>121548996
Uh oh
that actually sounds kinda...
kinda... f-f-fun
>>
>>121547982
Cutest in the game
>>
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No seriously why
What kind of substance does this add to the game
>>
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>killing Ragman's spiders doesn't proc Lusty Blood
>>
>>121549609
>HERE'S YOUR UPGRADED SACRIFICE ROOMS. ONE BITE AT A TIME
>>
>>121549609
it makes the steak more delicious by making sure it sticks in your throat.
>>
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Just finished a glorious run.
>Shit damage throughout, only damage ups are Halo and Chemical Peel
>Use Diplopia on Small Rock because I was just that desperate.
>Everything turns around suddenly
>Get Cricket's Head and Steven on the same floor.
>Get D7 on the Chest.
>I have Battery Baby so lots of battery drops
>Redo tiny room with one Little Horn in it over and over until strong as fuck.
>mfw
>>
>>121549817
But wouldnt that make you choke?
>>
>>121550069
That's the point.
>>
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>tech x + continuum + lump of coal
>>
>>121542547
bait them then move slowly with them
>>
How do you dodge the Mega Fatty's insta-butt slam?
>>
>>121550992
don't stand still, first of all
second, if he moves slightly in your direction when he's jumping, that means it's a fast one, so you should move as fast as possible
fortunately, you don't have to move as much as his other jump, because the shockwave pushes you a bit out of the way
if you're never standing still you should be fine though
>>
>>121550992
You don't.
I hope you enjoy it, and I hope you get ready to fight double cage :^)
>>
>>121550992
Keep moving.

Also, I just got a patch. What is in it before I update?
>>
>>121551208
If it's the same patch that happened earlier today, greed mode changes. Ultra greed is harder now, Greed/Super greed instead of Monstro, and it now shows your percentage chance of the greed machine jamming
>>
>>121550158
Wait, would tech 2+continuum just create an infinite laser?
>>
>>121551208
I think they buffed Azazel.
>>
>>121551378
No, beam items stop at the walls of a room.
>>
>>121544668
Even on Hard Mode, they're too many red hearts.
Edmunch should fix that.
>>
Which mod is it that gives you all the stats on the left?
>>
>>121551730
MissingHud2 senpai
>>
>>121551769

thx bby
>>
Surprise

Azazel is still completely fucking useless
>>
>>121552621
but that's not a surprise
>>
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>>121552621
Thanks Edmund.
>>
>Have a good Lost run on Greed Mode going
>Curse of the Maze into the cursed room

Hahaha, well meme'd! Seriously why is this allowed.
>>
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>>121552621
>Azazel is still completely fucking useless
I can still win with him just fine :^)
>>
Is there anyway to unlock ending 17 if you fucked up the first time? I had everything unlocked prior to Afterbirth and apparently to help people unlock ending 17 in the last patch they made the next time you encountered hush give you the chest for the ending. But I accidentally killed myself on a bomb before touching the chest. Is there anything I can do to unlock it? Any CE magic?
>>
>>121552621
>boring character that's boring attack doesn't synergize for shit
>only thing of note is he is moderately powerful early on
>"Hey lets making this boring character even more shit by removing the only reason he is okay!"

>>121553034
only good thing he has going for him
>>
>>121553493
Try it in the most recent patch. If you don't get the chest, report back.

There should really be patch notes for this shit.
>>
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>>121553525
I rarely play Azazel but his only redeeming quality is you can shit out a sub 20 minute run every time and have fun. This nerf makes no sense apart from Ed preventing people from farming money for Greed Mode and ruining their steak.
>>
>>121553875

Why doesn't he nerf particular characters FOR Greed Mode? League and DOTA 2 do that fine for their official custom modes, if the concern that Azazel can burn through Greed Mode too fast then nerf him for Greed Mode.
>>
So what the fuck did this patch actually do?
>>
>>121553828
Just did a run as ??? to beat hush for the unlock but no dice. Hopefully a future patch gives me something or eventually someone can find something I can do in cheat engine.
>>
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>>121553875
Literally could be the only reason they did this. Also ties in with the fact that Lilith was nerfed as well. I mean there is ARG shit and then there is just obnoxious fucking bullshit like what they're pulling at the moment. I would like to just play the game without having to deal with this buggy piece of shit just because they want to feel special. Everyone knows about the fucking character anyway.
>>
>>121554145
Keep throwing that shit at Edmund then. Email, twitter, whatever.
>>
what's a good strategy for family man?

i've tried restarting until i get guppy's head in a sacrifice room first floor but then i never end up getting other guppy pieces for the transformation

the damage simply isnt there for later levels, takes too long to kill anything
>>
>>121554067
The thing i don't understand is why nerf the character in the first place, it's a single player game. There is no competition, no need to balance.

After a while of playing the game it gets easy and it's up to the player to make it challenging for themselves
>>
>>121554306
Honestly, I found Azzy pretty tricky with Greed Mode. No red hearts sucks, his flying is just about useless, and his low range really makes itself noticeable.
>>
>>121554515
Go to shops. Red Candle, Blue Candle, and Stopwatch pretty much guarantee a victory.
>>
>>121554139
>Edmund
>Patch notes
>Nice joke

Every day I'm hating this game more, because of the particular way he wants us to eat our fucking steak.

>>121554527
He probably thinks it just makes the game too easy, despite having to get unlocks on every character INCLUDING THE FUCKING LOST (and Lazarus/??? who I despise) to unlock everything. The game already has a skill cap, why nerf the character more?
>>
Do you have to hold three guppy items to get the transformation or only pick up three?
>>
>>121554527
>After a while of playing the game it gets easy and it's up to the player to make it challenging for themselves

That's who he's balancing it for. So that the people who've played it for a million hours can't win every time, no matter how good they are.
>>
>>121554785
Pick up 3, you don't have to hold them.
>>
>>121554785
You only need to touch them. Paw and Head can be dropped. You can even re-roll your build with the D4/D100/MissingNo and it still counts the touch.
>>
>>121554848
Only pick up 3. Any items that count towards a transformation can be dropped/rerolled and still be counted.
>>
>>121554515
That's probably the hardest of the rebirth challenges. I would just hope for a bob's brain and hopefully another follower or too, getting guppy seems like a stretch.

When I did it I had the issac head trinket, abel, bob's brain and got lucky with soul hearts.
>>
>>121546246
I'll admit I laughed
>>
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>>121554848
>Tie a character to a certain, other character to unlock
>Pick one of the easiest characters to play
>Be surprised when people are rushing through the easiest mode with the easiest character to play as to unlock the best character for said mode

Honestly, they just look retarded in retrospect
>>
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I have too much time on my hands. Too bad you can't hear game music though, since I replaced that too.

frisk is very bald i need to give him hair
>>
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What is the 10% thing on the side?

Chance of blowing up?
>>
>>121555413
Chance of jamming. Slow down friend :^)

You can reduce that chance by playing other characters.
>>
>>121555393
Nice, anon.
>>
>>121554848
>so people who've played it for a million hours can't win every time

So balance a game for the few thousand you have actually poured that much time into this game and screw over the other million?

... actually that seems like something retarded they would actually do
>>
>>121555413
Woah buddy, 10%, slow down with that steak little man.
>>
>>121555597
I'm not making this shit up, I'm fucking quoting. Edmund has explicitly said that he wants NOBODY to be able to win consistently, no matter how good they are.
>>
>% counter in greed mode

literally why, what is the justification? was fun too much to ask?
>>
>>121555696
What a massive tool, no game designer should ever make a game solely where even winning is RNG

This last week has never made me go from zero to hate of a game since Smash
>>
>>121555806
Remember when he said this dlc was "for da playahs?" What a crock of shit.
>>
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>just lost a perfect guardian run because a walking host wouldn't pop his head up for me to kill him and just walked into my heart until it died

I'm starting to get really fucking fed up with this game
>>
>>121556049
At least there's now mercy invincibility, although spikes still fuck you over for 4 hearts worth of damage.
>>
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>>121556049
>punching bag walking over spikes or into red poop
>take 4 hearts of damage
Fucking HOW
>>
>Start an Eve Greed run
>Latch Key and Tech 2
This has nowhere to go but up!
>>
>>121555696
>he wants NOBODY to be able to win consistently, no matter how good they are

My god, what a cunt. Just looked at his twitter for the first time and it's him ranting about a retail worker.
>>
>>121556353
inb4 soy milk and skinny odd mushroom
>>
>Daily run
>Azazel
>Bomberman Bombs
>Mr Mega
Jesus christ
>>
Easiest way to fill the greed machine?
>>
>tfw beat greed mode with lost an hour before it got buffed

wew
>>
>>121556898
Chew slowly
>>
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hey guys i fixed the guardian challenge
punching bag has a leash like gemini
>>
So who is the shithead pushing all those nerfs? Is it Tyrone? Edmund is not the programmer here, just an artist and game designer, right?
>>
Cool new secret room
Better thatn that one with just a black poop and spikes
Better than the fucking pills ones too
>>
>>121556668
Loads of health and money.
Also quad shot.
>>
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>>121557190
I would forget the pic
>>
>>121557136
Ed is the one who comes up with the item concepts/gameplay mechanics and how things should look, he has no say in how it's implemented into gameplay.
>>
I hate everything about this expansion except for the items which I never fucking get
>>
Wasn't there supposed to be some kind of chain lightning attack?

Also I really don't care for these puzzle rooms. At all.
>>
>>121557190
>implying the secret room with the black poop isn't objectively the worst one
>>
>>121557491
>Literally just the idea guy
>Gets all the praised

Something's not right here.
>>
>>121557864
Have you fucking played Afterbirth?
Have you fucking played the Cave Story remake?
Nicalis is incompetent as all fuck, it was a miracle that Rebirth came out in a nearly perfect state.
He's also the art director, and he also handles the story himself, and in vanilla he was the only artist. He's not just an ideas guy.
>>
Man this Daily run is fucking weird
>>121557194
SOOO MUCH FUCKING HEALTH
>>
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anyone miss the old health system?
>>
>>121557864
Ed is the fucking reason ANYBODY plays Isaac. If it were just Nicalis working on the game nobody would fucking play it

>>121558004
This teaches me not to touch their stuff ever. I can't believe Ed went to them to work on his game

What's more unbelievable is how near-perfect Rebirth is
>>
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>>121558225
>>
>>121558004
as someonewho hasn't played Cave Story+, what's wrong with Cave Story+?
>>
Do Greed Mode Angel rooms EVER give you Pedestal items? This makes 20 in a row across all runs that it's just hearts/Eternal heart.
>>
>>121558471
Yes, but not nearly often enough.
>>
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>retro vision

RREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
>>
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My queen!
>>
>>121556353
This guy here. That Eve run with Tech 2 has been fucking awful. 25 minutes to hit Sheol, faced double Mr. Fred for the Womb bonus round.

I am now Guppy from Tail, Paw, and Collar. Grabbed Dead Cat for fun. This is getting good, finally.
>>
>>121558635
I stand corrected. Guppy has a Fly spawn chance reduction with Tech 2.
>>
>ipecac, 30 coins, 7 keys and 3 bombs on the first floor
I love when runs start like this
>>
>>121557529

Guess not
>>
>>121558617
Needs to get smacked around a bit so her Cambion Conception grows
>>
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>>121557854
Clearly you just don't GET it man
It's probably some stupid secret that Edmund thinks is great
>>
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>>121558881

Do not impregnate the Lilith
>>
>>121558881
SMACK MY BITCH UP
>>
>>121559021
I want to gently help her birth a demon baby then immediately impregnate her again.
>>
>>121558881
>>121559021

Does this imply the enemies fuck her when they hit her?
Sex mod when
>>
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>>121558862
I already have Ipecac. Should I do it bros?
>>
OH BOY, I SURE FUCKING LOVE THE CURSE OF THE MAZE
IT'S LITERALLY THE GREATEST THING IN THE GAME, EVEN MORE FUN THAN PRE-NERF AZAZEL RUNS
I SURE FUCKING HOPE NOBODY REMOVES IT FROM THE GAME
>>
>>121559436
Pick it up

Ipecac+Monstro's lung = carpet bomb
>>
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>>121559021
>Replying to me with my own artwork
Oohoo

>>121559436
Do it, faggot
>>
>>121559471
>Curse of the Maze
Nigga
I'll take Maze over Darkness or Blind any fucking day
>>
>>121559502
>>121559531
I'M GOING IN
nice drawing anon, have you ever done Eve?
>>
>>121559502
I once had Monstro's Lung, Ipecac, Quad Shot, and Tiny Planet (Curse of the Lost or whichever one hides items.) I lived in a storm of death and destruction.
>>
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Who the FUCK came up with the Speed! challenge?
GOD DAMMIT
>>
>>121559541
Darkness is fucking nothing m8
Base 120 gamma is more than enough, 150 makes things clear as day.
>>
>>121559531
Draw Lillith getting fucked by Adversary and Dark One
>>
>>121554306
DRY BABY
>>
>>121559637

me
>>
>>121559584
Haven't done Eve yet, did a couple Maggies in the last thread

Kind of just relaxing doing some artwork of my own characters after the frustration that was restarting a million great runs as Lilith due to BS RNG

Fuck Hush's time limit
>>
>>121559637
Plebbit.

>>121559712
And this fag.
>>
>>121559637
R until Epic Fetus/Ipecac/Knife
>>
Well, I now know what Trinket I'll be going for with Azazel every time I can get it.
>>
>>121559820
What does the squiggly black sperm number mean?
>>
>2+ Steam Sales makes everything free
Legitimately good job, Ebin McMemeMan.
>>
>>121559882
Evil, Anon. It defines how EVIL you are.
>>
>>121559964
How come evil is an actual stat but not faith?
>>
>>121559882
>>121559964
Actually it denotes your chance for a deal with the devil/angel. You'll notice it goes down when you take red heart damage.
>>
>>121559820
Devil Dead % chance. I have Goat Head so it's always 100% on applicable floors.

>>121559936
I wish I could try that at least once, and maybe with a Refresher for maximum fun.
>>
>>121560015
How come there's no stat for slow if there's a stat for speed?
>>
>>121559936
I hope one day I'll get 2 steam sales, restock and chaos
>>
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Damn, this is what Azzy's range looks like with the Flat Worm + My Reflection tears. Taking out Hush should be absurdly easy (being Guppy will help, too).
>>
>>121560225
i already know what's getting nerfed next patch :^)
>>
When do you guys usually activate Diplopia? I've been hanging on to it for a while and I'm not sure when I'll pop it, maybe if I see a "all stats up" item
>>
>>121560364
What, literally everything but the D6?
>>
>>121559541
Darkness is an inconvenience, as is Blind unless you pick up a shit-tier item or get a devil room.
Maze can actively ruin all chances to get Boss Rush and Hush.
>>
HOW MANY FUCKING DEVIL ROOMS DO I HAVE TO GO IN BEFORE I ACTUALLY GET A FUCKING DEVIL DEAL

THIS SHIT IS FUCKING RETARDED
>>
>>121560437
D6 too
it'll have a 50% chance to whiff
>>
>>121560530
>D6 has a 75% Chance to roll successfully
>10% Chance to roll into a garbage item like The Bean
>5% Chance to roll into a Troll Bomb
>5% Chance to roll into a Boss relevant to that floor
>4% Chance to roll into portal that sucks you into I AM ERROR
>1% Chance to roll something actually useful when you want it to
>>
>>121560449
The only curse that isn't an outright detriment to your run is Darkness. That shit barely means anything compared to how Godawful the rest are

>Unknown
>Never sure how much health you have

>Maze
>Fuck you over as The Lost or waste your time because muh timed missions

>Blind
>Soy Milk, Bob's Brain, shitty items the curse

>Labyrinth
>Fuck around for ages and lose out on several items like Shop and Devil

I legitimately think the curses are artificial difficulty now
>>
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next patch notes
>game crashes every time you're having fun
>>
>new greed mode changes
>didn't get enough damage ups? have fun not being able to stop Greed from summoning and healing
noice
>>
>>121559731
please anon, as this thread's resident gothfag, don't touch eve unless it's WoB eve

you're not a bad artist but please don't fuck around with that subgenre
>>
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Picking up this lil' nigga and Succubus brought me down to 3 and a half hearts but it was worth it. Time to obliterate Isaac and Blue Baby.
>>
>mfw ipecac kills turret faggots before they even get out of their shell
>>
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>>121554527
>there is no need to make a game balanced
>>
Will MissingHud2 prevent me from getting achievements?
>>
>>121560836
I'm partial to both, but depends on my mood

I'm attempting another Maggy at the moment, though it depends because I'm switching between two things right now
>>
fastest way to fill up greed machine?
>>
>be ready to tackle boss rush and megasatan
>don't lose any red hearts from Basement 1 to Womb 2
>don't take any devil deals
>0 angel rooms
>shitty curse makes me miss boss rush by 15 seconds
>>
>>121561278
Play different characters, consuming the steak slowly.
>>
>>121561278
cheat engine
>>
>>121561347
Welp, scratch that, I was being pessimistic, I got one angel room in Womb 2. That just makes it worse.
>>
>>121556359
To be fair that transaction is complete bullshit. I hate that they have to make a big deal out of "nuh uh no sealed games you probably stole it from somewhere but if you open it it's okay"
>>
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>full hp
>lil battery
>tons of damage
>trinity shield
>glowing hour glass
>i start to kill moms heart over and over
>after like 6-7 times i notice i havent gotten any chieves and think it doesnt count
>go in chest
>unlock like 20 things
>FUCK I WANTED BLUE BABY FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF
>>
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>>121561493
>get one angel room in Womb 2
>get Joker card
>devil room in Cathedral
>get Joker card
>devil room in Chest

grand
>>
>>121561674
Shit, I was too late to see but I was going to tell you that if you kill an Angel, don't pick up the keypiece and just restart the game using save and quit, and if you have more bombs you can keep blowing up the statue for the other piece. This also works if you have the D6 to reroll lots of key pieces into angel room items.
>>
>>121561674
Just leave and continue, angel statue reappears. You can use this to get 2 key pieces in one room, or even more key pieces to reroll them into angel items.
>>
>>121560836

You sound like a huge tool with no idea what you're talking about.
>>
>Trying Suicide King Challenge
>Be in the womb
>Get Marked
RIP run nice knowing you
>>
>>121561838
>>121561772
shit I wish I would have known this last year
>>
DO NOT, I REPEAT, DO NOT TRY REMOTE TEAR DETONATION WITH IPECAC
>>
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>Beat Ultra Greed with soy milk and virtually nothing else

That was the most unthrilling 15 minutes ever.
>>
>>121561929
W-why not?
>>
>>121561929
What were you thinking was going to happen
>>
>>121562029
>beat Ultra Greed with Soy Milk and Explosivo
It wasn't fun but it worked.
>>
Quick idea for an item:
>Adopted Soul
>Gotten from Devil Deals
>When purchased, gives you a random sin transformation. This transformation doesn't change for the rest of the run.
>>
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>>121562102
>>
>take over an hour to reach Mega Stan due to shit damage
>die

fug
>>
GUYS
I THINK I BROKE SOMETHING
>>
>>121562102
I thought the tear would just blow up before touching the ground
>>
>>121562257
>Ever trying Mega Satan without top tier damage
>>
>>121542614
What happened to devil rooms that make them not much better than angel rooms?

Angel rooms still have a godawful shitty item pool made up of either items you could get from regular treasure rooms (usually also bad) or unique items that suck dick anyways. Assuming you even get a pedestal item anyways and not just something like 6 pennies.

Devil rooms have an amazing item pool and the unique devil room items are generally high quality. Not to mention taking a devil deal means never getting a shitty angel room ever.

Yeah, you can get a shitty devil room item and you can get a good angel room item (Godhead, Sacred Heart, Body, Mind, Soul, Trinity Shield...), but it's generally less likely than the inverse.
>>
>9.8mb update
what is this families?
>>
>>121562490

I mean

I consider Angel Haylo and Dead Dove good Angel Room items
>>
>>121562497
buffed ultra greed, coins hp now buffed, heart coins buffed to give greed more hp, enjoy your 20 minute bossfight
>>
>>121562497
death touch looks borked
>>
>>121562497
a tiny piece of steak that you should chew on until november 25th
>>
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>>121562490
>Devil rooms have an amazing item pool and the unique devil room items are generally high quality
Not anymore I feel like
I think a good Angel Room item is better than the best Devil Room Item, ie Brimstone or Abaddon
But you are right though that you'll probably never consistently get those
Just earlier today, I had 3 devil rooms in a fucking row give me chests and that's it
>>
>>121562684
thanks Ed
>>
QUICK /boig/

YOU HAVE 5 SECONDS TO NAME THE BEST STATUS EFFECT

if you don't, you will be cursed to forever receive the dunce cap on your runs
>>
List the characters from best to worst in your opinion.
>>
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>>121562208
>Comedy Skull
>"You're gonna have a bad time"
>Shoot Boney bones that lower your damage, but not to Soy Milk levels, at extreme speeds that poison like Scorpio
>>
>>121562789
REtro vision
>>
>>121562789
Slowing is the best.
>>
>>121562789
Petrification.
>>
>>121562804
Isaac
Eve
Judas
Lillith
Cain
Samson
Maggy
Lazarus
Eden
Lost
???
Azazel
>>
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>>121562885
Guess I'll leave this here for you, Anon.
>>
>>121562804
isaac > cain = eve = samson = lilith > judas (rip 100% devil deals) > maggy = lazurus > blue baby = azazel (Zzzzzzzz) > the lost

eden can be anywhere in there since the randomness
>>
>mom's wig + hivemind
Literally F R E E greed run. first time fighting super greed.
>>
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So how long is this going to take
>>
>>121554306
DRY BABY

>>121563084
>Azazel
>last
>nice joke

In my opinion:
Isaac
Judas
Lillith
Cain
Azazel
Eve
Samson
Maggy
???
Lazarus

Removed Lost (haven't played yet) and Eden (random)
>>
>>121562804
Eden tier
Eden

Top tier
Isaac, Cain

Mid tier
Judas, Samson, Eve

Low tier
Maggy

Shit tier
Lazarus, Azazel, ???

Artificial difficulty tier
The lost
>>
>active item that gives you Pride's "X" attack
>passive item that gives you the Angel's beam attack
>active item that acts like Krampus' Head, but for said Angel beam weapon
>bony tears
Edmund pls
>>
>>121563165
REKT
>>
>>121562779
Yeah no.

The best Angel Room items do beat out anything from Devil Rooms (Sacred Heart and Godhead can carry runs by themselves)

>>121562804
Azrael >>> Issac > Judas > Samson > Lazarus > Maggy > Eve > ??? > Cain > the Lost

Eden is random.
>>
>>121563215
>>121563250
>??? that low
Opinions discarded.
>>
>>121562804
Isaac
Eden
Eve
Samson
Judas
Maggy
Cain
Lilith
Azazel
???
Lazarus
my left nut
The Lost
>>
>>121563336
Oh, forgot Lilith.

I haven't actually played Afterbirth yet; how inaccurate is what I say now
>>
>>121563361
Blue Baby is fucking trash dude.
I don't even care about him only having Soul Hearts, that doesn't bother me
He's just straight fucking trash.
>>
>>121562804
In terms of fun:

Isaac>Eden>Cain>Eve>Judas>Lilith>Samson>Lazarus>Azazel>Blue Baby>Maggy>The Lost

In terms of usefulness:
Isaac>Azazel pre-nerf>Cain>Judas>Lilith>Samson=Eve>Lazarus>Maggy>Blue Baby>Azazel post-nerf>The Lost
Eden can't be put here because of pure randomness
>>
>>121562804
The D6 > Judas > Samson > Lilith > Eve > Magdalene > Azazel > ??? > Cain > Lazarus > Ultra Greed's Ass > The Lost

Eden exists
>>
>>121562789
Petrification
>>
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>>121550158
Nope, egg thought of that fun
>>
>>121563468
Azazel is now shit tier.
Cain now starts with the paper clip, and that vaulted him immediately into top tier. Also dat damage.
Judas lost the guaranteed devil/angel rooms, but he's still top tier.

Also
>eve
>below maggy
>below lazarus
Sounds like someone's shit at this game, boyo
>>
>>121563250
These are some shit opinions m8
>>
>>121563493
>same stats as base Isaac
>guaranteed base chance for Devil/Angel Rooms
>instant activation of all half-heart bonus items
>underrated active item
>4th highest damage multiplier
Unless you're complete garbage at the game, he's great.
>>
>>121563752
Technically damage done by lump of coal depends on distance from Isaac, not distance travelled
>>
So the patch did shit? Okay back to gamecenter cx for me.
>>
>>121563816
With Petrified Poop, ??? goes from joke character to walking nightmare

I still kind of wished he had a D-item to work with, though
>>
>>121563893
Tiny Planet.
>>
>>121563893
wrong, had coal and tiny planet the other day and it was disgusting
>>
>>121562804
Judas > Isaac > Eve > ??? > Azazel > Samson > Cain > Lilith > Maggy > Lazarus > The Lost
>>
Now list all the characters from best to worst in Greed Mode.
>>
>>121556049
On my first Guardian run I made it all the way to It Lives, beat it, then lost with the trophy on the ground because of bullets hitting my heart. I was salty
>>
>>121564089
Lillith > Cain > the rest
>>
>>121564089
>Isaac
>Lilith
>Cain
>Samson
>???
>Eve
>Judas
>Azazel
>Maggy
>Lazarus
>The Lost

It blurrs near the middle, though
>>
>>121563816
He actually has slightly higher damage and speed from isaac iirc.
>>
>>121563775
>Azazel
>shit

How the fuck do you make the guy who starts with innate flight, 3 black hearts, the highest innate damage multiplier of anyone you can start with, and a fucking short-range BRIMSTONE shit?

I've managed to beat the Lamb with Azazel without any damage upgrades before (and thus also Satan, It Lives, and Mom; it was godawful)

Without damage upgrades you melt everything early game in a single beam and with damage upgrades you just melt everything outside of Mega Satan. And sometimes even him if you get a nuts build.
>>
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>>121563964
>>121564036
I stand corrected, have some good level design as a reward
>>
>>121564264
Sounds like you haven't played him since the patch
>>
>>121562804
Isaac > Cain > Eve > ??? > Lilith > Judas > Samson > Azazel > Lazarus > Maggy > Lost

>>121564089
Lilith > Isaac > Maggy > Cain > Samson > Lazarus > Judas > Azazel > ??? > Lost
>>
>>121564264
>1/3 damage after his boost
>highest innate damage multiplier
l
m
a
o
>>
>>121564367
Forgot Eve on the second, she would be just around equal to Lazarus though.
>>
>>121564264
chew slowly
>>
>>121564337
He said he hasn't played Afterbirth in general yet.

He doesn't know just how nerfed devil rooms or Azazel are.
>>
>>121564264
>Azazel "I can't even kill a spider in one hit"
>anything but garbage
>>
>>121564530
>>121564480
What.
>>
>>121564089
Lilith > Cain > Judas > Isaac > Samson > Maggy > Eve > Lazarus > Azazel > The Lost
>>
>>121564747
Eat your steak, professor.

Slowly.
>>
>>121564747
Azazel is a fukboi now, m8. Lowest in base DPS, too. Only thing he has going for him is flight.
>>
>>121564747
They cut Azazel's damage in by 1/3 and his brimstone charge time by 1/2
>>
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help
>>
>>121564893
>>121564890
Note that the former part is a bug and isn't intended. And that before the nerfs he was still completely fucked against Hush and Ultra Greed anyways

If you haven't fought them yet, they are impossible to kill quickly.
>>
>>121564935
DODGE
>>
>>121564993
How much HP do they have? They said that about Mega Satan and I still had a run in which he was dead after about a minute.
>>
>mom's knife
>boss drop
>no chaos

Since when??
>>
>>121564993
I just did it a little while ago (>>121560920), and it wasn't too bad (I've killed Hush with Azazel once before this, too). I've also killed Ultra Greed before the nerf but I imagine he's a nightmare now.

>>121565136
Their HP scales with how much damage you do.
>>
>>121565136
Their health is scaled to the damage you do
Seriously, stop acting like you're tough shit and play the game
>>
>>121565136
Both Hush and Ultra Greed have a type of super armor that increases based on damage received in a period of time.

Also killing mega satan in a minute isn't that impressive, faggot.
>>
>>121565192
>>121565210
Speaking of, they finally found out the specifics behind that. Taken as a quote from SA:

"The way Ultra Greed's and Hush's damage scaling works is that they have a damage cap so you can't nuke them in one shot, but they also gain armor when you damage them. (Spider Mod will not display the fact that you're actually dealing less damage to them.) In fact, if your DPS is too high, they stop taking damage altogether. (Spider Mod still does not display that and claims you are still dealing damage.) Which means that you actually have to wait around to wait for their armor to wear off before you can start damaging them again. If your DPS isn't like super high, that's not something you have to worry about."

Basically fuck you enjoy your eternal fight
>>
>>121565150
If the boss was the Fallen, then his drops aren't from the Boss pool but the Devil pool instead.

>>121565309
Fucking christ. So the best way to beat these bosses is to quite literally enjoy your steak slowly?
>>
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Has cursed eye always been in the angel room item pool, or did they make angel rooms worse again?
>>
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>Trying to beat megasatan as the lost
>Spamming D4 since batteries keep dropping and if I get something shit I can just die and alt+f4
>One of them ends up with Epic Fetus, Poly, Mom's Knife, Host hat, something that makes Epic fetus strike 3 times and a shit ton of orbitals.
>It was my last possible reroll.
>>
>>121565424
Don't forget how Hush has obscene amounts of HP to begin with (6666; the last phase of Mega Satan is 2000 for reference) or how Ultra Greed can heal himself significantly by stealing your coins or with the heart coins and gets stronger as he does so and still has lots of HP ignoring that (3500 before factoring in damage scaling shenanigans)

>>121565658
You might have picked up Chaos, but Afterbirth did fuck over item pools a lot.
>>
>>121565658
That's mom's pearl, pick it up.
>>
>>121565857
I picked up chaos, that's what it was.
>>
>Want to play Video game I enjoy
>Creator actively ruining it to fit his vision
>Creator arbitrarily locking things behind muh arg
>Creator sucking fun out of the game

For fucks sake Afterbirth is absolute garbage, I have heard nothing but complaints since this steaming pile of shit was released
>>
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The steak train has no brakes
>>
>>121541630
what, do you say you donĀ“t enjoy your 100 dollar steak? :^)
>>
>>121565424
>If the boss was the Fallen, then his drops aren't from the Boss pool but the Devil pool instead.

ahhh thanks
>>
>>121566024
Who is that
>>
>>121566174
the keeper, future gated DLC
>>
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>>121566024
>>121565976
>Edmund cannot update the game without breaking shit
>"Muh cryptic gaem, get bent silly dataminers"
>Meanwhile Nicalis can't make "my reflection" fucking relevant or useful

how accurate is this image?
>>
>>121566317
Needs more Little Horn.
>>
>>121566317
talking with my brother, we agreed that

WOTL = Full Expansion; it was worth every single dollar

Afterbirth = DLC; It fixed what Rebirth had to make, only gave us more items and thats it

i would say that Nicalis are the ones that corrupted edmund into being a jew, Afterbirth has been kind of a dissapointment and Nicalis cant fucking fix shit
>>
>>121566317
Actually, "my reflection" nearly doubles the range of Azazels Brim.
>>
>>121566174
The Keeper.

He's a gimmick character with a maximum of 2 hearts rather than 12 and no access to red hearts for healing (they become blue flies instead), but he has an innate triple shot and heals from picking up pennies. Note that he can't get soul hearts or black hearts EVER.

Note that a maximum of 2 hearts means that he has as much endurance in the Womb and beyond as the fucking Lost has with the Holy Mantle (and if you aren't starting a Lost run with that or Dead Cat, I pity you), lacks the synergies the Lost has with stuff like Whore of Babylon and Glass Cannon, doesn't get innate flight or spectral tears (or a starting D4), doesn't get free devil room deals and can't ever take those that cost 2 hearts...

Let that sink in: He's WORSE THAN THE FUCKING LOST.
>>
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>>121566381
Better?
Just meme my shit up
>>
>making lil gurdy kill mama gurdy
>isaac has to kill his mom

It's like poetry
>>
>>121565658
It's also a red chest item, so it might just be another bug :^)
>>
>>121566753
>The Lost wasn't shitty enough!
>>
>>121566753
How likley is that:
A) Ed and Tyrone are fucking with dataminers
B) That there will be more items added to the game later to support them

I am pretty darn disappointed with the amount of items in the game thus far, most are gimmicky, as fuck.
>>
>>121567054
There's actually an unused trinket that the Keeper is supposed to unlock, which makes unlocking shop doors not take any keys.

There's also data for the Holy Mantle as a starting item, which might well be an unlock for the Lost.

So yeah, Ed's new super-secret character is going to make the Lost look GOOD in comparison.
>>
>>121562194
>Explosivo on Greed Mode
>Aww yeah this is fucking great
>Explosivo during normal runs
>Everything fucking jumps

Never noticed how many enemies teleported or jumped before. A lot of them do this.
>>
>>121553034
thats unintended buddy, expect balance patch soon :^)
>>
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>>121562490
For some reason I have found Holy Shot on normal treasure rooms and in the dark room / chest. Can't recall if I used Chaos in all of them, most certainly I only did a few times, but I still remember floor II Holy Shot which is objectively a great item.

Ok Rosary saved my run ONE TIME but I agree that the angel room pool is terrible.
Dead Sea Scrolls should never be part of the item pool for any special room other than the library and should at least add a 50% chance of seeing an angel room the very least.

There should be a dual option on Angel Rooms, one thing I liked about Eternal Mode on the previous game was the Eternal Gauntlet, it did not actually feel like Bullshit despite the premise of the mode, which is essentially facing unfair bullshit. Maybe Eternal Gauntlets should be brought back into the game.
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Seriously, Am I missing something here?
Why does Egg man keep taking Chaos in Greed Mode?
Aren't the item pools in Greed Mode already fucked up?
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>>121566753
Healing from pennies does mean his shallow HP pool can be refilled really easily, and one of his unlocks is starting with the Wooden Nickel to make that drastically easier. And a starting triple shot is nothing to complain about, that's up there with Azazel's starting Brimstone.
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>>121567262
So he starts with the pay to play item, which is now a trinket too? Whoopiediefuckingdoo!

How about fixing the combo system. It feels there is only synergy for only the OP items.

Legacy items are worthless, there should be a way to win with shitty items working together.

Speaking of which, was a horseman transformation too hard to ask for?

>Conquest / Horseman Horse
>Ipecac
>Any Devil "Contract" Item like the the pact or contract from below
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>mfw i finally beat family man to unlock epic fetus

guess i should unlock the lost now, this should be equally as frustrating
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>>121567753
do glass canon first and see how hilariously easy it is
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>time to fight Satan as Azazel
>One heart left
Welp, I tried.
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>>121567885
i actually dont have lokii's horns, the only time ive ever seen him was on that final family man run, so they probably didnt unlock due to it being a challenge. now i have to find him again, god damn it man seeing him once in like 40 hours of play makes me think he is really rare
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Did they remove the time rewinding hourglass from greed mode?
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>>121568425
Yes. Slow the fuck down.
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>Life gives you lemons challenge
>gets Brimstone and Guppy's Paw Floor 2
>was that meant to be a challenge
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New item: Steak
Makes all pickups and items on the floor the exact same item/pickup
On the start of each new floor, the item pools increase slightly
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